How Should Conservatives Be Talking About Race?: A Discussion with Glenn Loury and Coleman Hughes

[@valencia4215]

My goodness, I began to tear up after listening to Glenn speak about departing from his conservative roots in order to be accepted by his tribe only to discover his initial instincts were right all along. It is a lonely road if you are black and (moderately) conservative. I know this very well and can only hope one day to find my own tribe.

[@just_another32]

(-':

[@timffoster]

Hang in there. We're out here. Me, personally, I don't want to belong to a tribe. I want to be evaluated on my own thoughts, actions and opinions, and based on these, belong to a team. That's the difference between a tribe (involuntary affiliation based on immutable characteristics such as race) and a team (affiliations based on free choices such as character, values and positions).

[@valencia4215]

@@timffoster Certainly that is true but clearly or, perhaps, not so clearly that is what I meant.

[@tedmom3029]

Not black but I understand your situation. You are not alone in the feeling. For some of us our “tribe” is small and not easy to find.

[@kham6006]

We are so lucky to listen to these 2 men for free ,,, thank you

[@jonathanwegner1194]

alexsheremet.com/coleman-hughes-cannot-be-trusted/

[@willardaustria]

Two of my favorite public thinkers. Thanks for having them on!

[@just_another32]

Ditto!

[@jonathanwegner1194]

alexsheremet.com/coleman-hughes-cannot-be-trusted/

[@jacobbritton7359]

Finally got Coleman on! Yes!

[@migthirtyfive8799]

Fantastic! Name a better tag team duo when it comes to 'tip of the spear' current race and culture topics than Dr. Loury and Coleman. (Besides John Mc). Great content.

[@KM-po5kk]

I love Glen Loury! I’m a total whitey but he reminds me of the men in my family. He could be my uncle. I think his attitude is the only productive one moving forward. Bitterness and resentment will hold you back. Gratitude will move your forward.

[@Grequierecafe]

Thank you to BLC: Barnes, Loury, and Coleman. No better way for me to fold my laundry than to listen to three good people exploring the lovely, dark and deep woods of what matters today.

[@jonathanwegner1194]

alexsheremet.com/coleman-hughes-cannot-be-trusted/

[@nancytesta-meyer5408]

I'm here to see both Glenn and Coleman. They bring up good talking points about the hypocrisy and negativity of these movements/organizations. The focus and old ideas about immutable traits have made it more difficult to use critical thinking about the underlying causes that impede fairness and opportunities. Oversimplification and disrespect have stopped and prevented conversations.

[@jonathanwegner1194]

alexsheremet.com/coleman-hughes-cannot-be-trusted/

[@webkinz333]

the way glenn said "i can't go home again" w his whole chest i felt that

[@DHFrank]

Great discussion. Very thoughtful and educational. I love listening to Glenn and Coleman because I always learn something.

[@jonathanwegner1194]

alexsheremet.com/coleman-hughes-cannot-be-trusted/

[@DHFrank]

@@jonathanwegner1194 Okay. So what’s your point?

[@jonathanwegner1194]

@@DHFrank These two guys are intellectual frauds. The essay utterly exposes Hughes.

[@JohnWilmot1179]

In a recent tweet Kamala Harris talked about the "the systemic racism in our laws, policies, and institutions" that has to be addressed, so from what I can understand from here the blm narrative about the “foundational myth” of “systemic racism “ is nowadays promoted and supported at the highest levels, at least by the Democratic Party.

[@jonathanwegner1194]

alexsheremet.com/coleman-hughes-cannot-be-trusted/

[@HumanDignity10]

Also, the question about slavery being an "open wound" was a good one. It reminds me of one of my friends who feels trauma and loads of guilt because she knows that some of her relatives committed cruel acts towards Native Americans. When she told me about it, I thought it was quite extreme, especially since I have some Potowatamie blood and it would never occur to me to feel traumatized because of what happened to the Native Americans, and I would never hold modern day people responsible for what happened in the past. However, I have some friends who work in the area of trauma therapy and they have been talking about the book, "My Grandmother's Hands", which might be useful for anyone who feels a sense of racial trauma.

[@jonathanwegner1194]

alexsheremet.com/coleman-hughes-cannot-be-trusted/

[@BeldnerFilms]

Amazing conversation! Thanks.

[@DavidThackerMusic]

The moment when Glenn is talking about not being able to "go back home" is such an interesting thought. Came back to comment 6 hours after listening cause its still on my mind

[@amorfati4927]

It’s a sad thought. Very sad that we live in a world where many can’t stay in a place where there’s disagreements because it is not welcomed there.

[@reneebiddy2065]

Thank you Glen for having a level head.

[@GeekOwtLowd]

The banning of CRT is COMPLETELY justified by the president. Critical race theory is a religious ideology masked as an academic field of study. Everything that would apply to religious indoctrination and religious preaching in a government context, applies to CRT also.

[@michaelweber5702]

Dave. - You are so correct , sir ... Coleman's comments at 29 mins in , seem odd and mushy about Pres. Trump in him banning Critical Race Theory in the Feds. Good for Trump !

[@radicallefty7069]

People can study and believe what they want

[@GeekOwtLowd]

@@radicallefty7069 Yes. But they can't force employees or students at public schools to believe their indoctrination.

[@radicallefty7069]

@@GeekOwtLowd it's called the free flow of ideas, nobody is "forced" to believe anything

[@GeekOwtLowd]

@@radicallefty7069 yes. If it's in the form of policy that must be adhered to, or mandatory reeducation by employers or the government, then it's forced on you. Hence the separation of church and state.

[@DavidThackerMusic]

I enjoyed this and listened to the full thing, but please fix the audio! It's pretty brutal

[@just_another32]

Yeh me too... I never know if it is the host or each individual. It can't be GL as his podcast with JMW doesn't sound like this. :-/

[@DavidThackerMusic]

@@just_another32 i think its the host, I'm only hearing echos of Coleman and Glenn

[@jonathanwegner1194]

alexsheremet.com/coleman-hughes-cannot-be-trusted/

[@larrygallagher6525]

Love what Coleman does with his eyes at 24:48

[@just_another32]

I didn't notice!

[@beaucannington8616]

Ephesians 6:12 Modern English Version 12 For our fight is not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, and against spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly places. It is a great Bible verse...Thank you all for these discussions!

[@HonestMan247]

The audio issues really detract from an otherwise excellent conversation. (When you're not speaking, mute yourself!)

[@HumanDignity10]

I'm currently reading "How to Have Impossible Conversations." This is a good resource for anyone who wants to engage with people who have different views on sensitive and potentially divisive topics like racism.

[@just_another32]

Thanks - is that the one by Peter Boghossian? I just find myself getting angry that certain people have taken it on themselves to redefine racism (even though often it doesn't even apply to them). It's so maddening! I guess I need to deal with that (my anger) before I can even start to have a difficult conversation!

[@jumbo4billion]

@@just_another32 Yes it was written by Peter Boghossian and James Lindsay. I've found even the introduction and first two chapters to be very helpful in recognising and correcting my awfully preachy, belligerent and unconstructive approach to conversation. It's all so simple that I find it mystifying as to why we were not taught this in school. It might be just the book you need at the moment.

[@just_another32]

@@jumbo4billion cool, thanks for the review :-) :-)

[@just_another32]

These guys must get so tired of talking about race and racism!

[@toddw3nzel639]

M C hahaha pretty sure he has a lot more he could talk about but chooses to talk about race. Chomsky many times was known for his political ideas vs his linguistics studies. (I would imagine Coleman would also enjoy discussing trombone)

[@just_another32]

@M C he always sounds so weary!

[@TerryStewart32]

@M C he is very precocious and it will be quite something to see what he matures into when he grows into a man of s mature age. I admire how data driven he is and the emphasis he places on the evidence

[@TerryStewart32]

@Stephen Carter Coleman Hughes is cogent, rational and immensely well read for a man who just graduated from university. The fact that he is able to be viewed on parity with established ivy league professors who are old enough to be his father is impressive. Coleman Hughes unlike Lewis Hamilton and all the aforementioned men you name lives a life of the mind. He's an intellectual athlete or sports man and to be able to synthesize what he has read and absorbed into his own coherent perspective on race and American society as a 23 year old is more than impressive

[@just_another32]

@Owen Marble By the way, I wasn't making a criticism, but simply pointing it out! Incidentally, here in the UK (where I am), we too now have this strong racial narrative coming from BLM (through mainstream media, corporations etc). I am not the least bit interested in the race/racism myself in normal times. But these aren't normal times! So respect to CH and GL for speaking out! Greetings all.

[@MsChitterchat]

Thanks for removing all the ads :)

[@shannonbencomomcfall1136]

Ephesians 6:12 For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of [a]the darkness of this age, against spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places.

[@jermainerankine8094]

I can't believe it: Coleman says the woman in Central Park " arguably" shouldn't have called the police. Wtf. She had no justification for threatening to call the police at all.

[@csapienza001]

God bless you all.

[@sanmigueltv]

Hey great discussion. Subscribed!

[@TerryAnnOnline]

Why is this video titled "Conservative Conversations"........Coleman and Glen are pretty open that they're not conservative.

[@knowledgeandpleasure]

I was wondering the same thing.

[@follow-jade]

Totally agree! They can reach so many viewers if they drop the word “conservative”.

[@Salty_Boogers]

Glenn seems to focus (fairly) on the individual sessions of critical race theory being appropriate or not. It’s not just about the sessions tho, the ideology is ROTTEN TO THE CORE

[@sam-cn8tu]

how so? genuine question. If you had to give three reasons why it's rotten

[@marshallwilliams6306]

For Stanley, My perspective. Racism does exist. It always will as long people walk this earth. My sons are grown and they are forging a life for themselves. I would tell younger children grow in the knowledge and understanding of Jesus, live life, love life, enjoy life. Posture yourself for success, health, love, victory, identity, confidence and eternity. Pray, stay healthy, stay employed and stay out of trouble. Marshall

[@grahamjoss4643]

Thanks for sharing

[@jonathanwegner1194]

alexsheremet.com/coleman-hughes-cannot-be-trusted/

[@kathleankeesler1639]

Thank you.

[@dennislee7312]

The recent "anti-racist" movement is just marketing. It is "Re-Branding". You can only grift with the same scheme for so long. The product, or the con, gets stale and less effective and what you need to do is rebrand yourself to entice new people and prolong the con on the people who are already hooked.

[@knsummers]

We forget that the individual or the group suffering the disparity as an outcome of systemic racism/ a racist system is a participant in that system with agency so they are both impacted by and complicit in the creation of that inequity. That's a hard conversation to have but with a relatively simple conclusion: yes, life does not deal a fair hand to everyone but in order to improve the outcomes for everyone you have to work hard despite that inequity.

[@judleym5877]

Concerning the points Coleman made about “closing the wound”, and Glen’s follow up more direct summation, I am reminded of the book “Psycho Cybernetics”. The author was a plastic surgeon who observed that even after successful surgery which improved their appearance, certain patients were still not happy. Also reminds me of this from Carlos Castaneda: “ We either make ourselves miserable, or we make ourselves happy. The amount of work is the same”. May be applicable to some who continue to dwell on the past.

[@jonathanwegner1194]

alexsheremet.com/coleman-hughes-cannot-be-trusted/

[@judleym5877]

@@jonathanwegner1194 Appreciate you taking the time to send me the link. As the article is quite lengthy, I've bookmarked it for possible reading later. My own views on race are mostly in the gray zone but maybe my remarks suggested a more binary view. Anyway, I'm bowing out of further discussion - I'm old and just too discouraged about the future of the country to engage anymore. I leave it to younger people to fix or fuck up further. Cheers.

[@jonathanwegner1194]

@@judleym5877 No problem. I'm just trying to spread the word on these two "intellectual" frauds who are deceiving the willing masses. Cheers

[@BrianDonato]

I appreciate the video & the diverse perspective on racism! I tie in racism in the last video on my channel - There are multiple complexities surrounding racism & the discussions around it that I go into. I hope we inspire people to reflect on racism, and use our reflection to empower & not disempower going forward was well. I just subscribed to your channel also - Keep it up!

[@michaelweber5702]

This is NOW , right now , oh my oh ( my Aunt Ruth , born 1909 ? often said 'oh my oh' } Coleman and Glenn = fun while thinking ...

[@jonathanwegner1194]

alexsheremet.com/coleman-hughes-cannot-be-trusted/

[@TheMonkeymonkeyking]

So Coleman's paternal however many times grandfather was a slave of Jefferson, that IS interesting.

[@joebowbeer]

1:21:36 "You know I think probably more people than you might expect would agree about the world that they want to see if they could wave a magic wand." - Coleman Hughes

[@Bmindful1161]

Our struggle - Eph 6:12

[@jones2277]

every time i hear Coleman Hughes speak, i'm reminded of the fact that he's never really experienced direct racism so it's difficult for him to comprehend. he's read lots of articles and seen lots of movies on it. and he's smart so he can rigorously analyze those charts and tables, but he doesn't know how it feels. in his personal examples, his only point of reference is the parents who didn't want him to date their YT daughter. if that's your main point of reference, then i can see how you might gravitate toward a position that is about proving yourself to be the same as them.

[@rainafortini5797]

Out did yourselves everyone. Thx Very healing, helpful and hopeful listening to this...like the end of Fahrenheit 451”We are Pride and Prejudice by Jane Austen. Its very nice to meet you” (Now Im sad again)

[@shawnhill3482]

The word is now completely expanded to anything someone doesnt like that another person says or does or wears etc etc! Because in reality they are unhappy with they're own lives!

[@watsufizzi]

My employer suggested staff and students read “how to be an anti-racist”. As a white person, how am i supposed to respond to that?

[@swcordovaf]

Read it with a pencil and mark it up with questions and then listen/read Glen Loury, John McWhorter, Kmele Foster, Coleman Hughes, Thomas Chatterton Williams, Shelby Steele, Carol Swain, Jason Riley, Clarence Thomas, Thomas Sowell, Walt Williams and watch how they carefully unravel the twisted mess of logic that is in that book.

[@highneedforcognition9660]

I hope this helps newdiscourses.com/2020/07/how-talk-your-employers-about-anti-racism/ And/or this newdiscourses.com/2020/06/template-resisting-white-fragility-workplace/

[@johnstewart7025]

It is difficult to put yourself in another person's shoes. I would think that novels would be the best thing to read to know what it is to be a member of a different race in a majority white society. After all, in the not too distant future, many Americans are going to live in a society without a majority racial group. Of course, it seems many Spanish speakers identify as white.

[@watsufizzi]

John Stewart yes, but not novels written by self-proclaimed racists...

[@Grequierecafe]

-First keep records of all interactions in this regard. It may well be only a suggestion. (Only, he said hopefully.)

[@benwincelberg9684]

24:30 Any Vandy students here 👀

[@yvy6269]

What did the Eastern European intellectuals do in "The Power of the Powerless"?

[@playnejayne5550]

Glenn wants Ephesians 6. It's a good reminder that our enemies or those who oppose us are not the problem. it's a spiritual war we fight. Ideas are bad and people are followers.

[@davidtrujillo993]

The velvet revolution wow I sincerely wonder how many "educated" leftists even know that reference unless they are above 40. With regard to Glen's comment on in-vitro fertilization, I would bet Asians are less desirable even by Asian women and that is based on the Pew Research on sex appeal. But regardless, great point by Glen.

[@jonathanwegner1194]

alexsheremet.com/coleman-hughes-cannot-be-trusted/

[@marshallwilliams6306]

No one can explain away racism. The challenge is to overcome racism. Grow spiritually, financially, relationally, emotionally, intellectually, relationally, physically (stay healthy). Love covers a multitude of sins. Marshall

[@just_another32]

Something I don't understand about the systemic racism idea... So is the injustice that poverty exists or that more people of one racial category suffer from it? Or both? And if the former (as the greater or at least the first injustice of the two), then why isn't the emphasis on addressing poverty/disparities in general? I should add: In the UK at least we have many families who are white and not well off, not just black ones. Thanks and please excuse my naivety if this is a very naive question. I'm tired.

[@just_another32]

@Rebecca Mattis How frustrating. Yes, that was the sense I was starting to get the more I heard / read. It seems illogical and unhelpful - no, actually - worse than that - it is potentially very damaging. To label everything as racism and not to examine what the mechanisms behind a given relationship might be is totally missing the point. :-/// Wokeness only really became mainstream in the UK this year (after the BLM protests came here)... and after a few months of it, and trying to speak up about it and help friends to see that if isn't what it seems, I'm utterly in despair. If mainstream media and academia are going to keep pushing this narrative, then how on earth can it be overcome / challenged?

[@just_another32]

@Rebecca Mattis What an encouraging reply. I just don't feel very hopeful today. It feels like the whole world is speaking lies, and there's just an individual here and there telling something like the truth. Yes, I'm familiar with some of the names you mentioned. Their voices are VERY encouraging in these strange and backward times. What I would really like to hear / read about are some examples of other times when the world (or at least a small country!) nearly descended into madness, but people spoke out and there was a more positive outcome than there might have otherwise been. If I could see some examples from history, I'd feel like there were more of a reason to hope. Know what I mean?

[@just_another32]

@Rebecca Mattis thank you for the encouragement :-) I have had a bit of success (I think) - in helping a few people realise that things are not exactly as presented, and encouraging them to think critically about issues. It's just when I look at the media and at academia - literally pedalling lies... how can we as individuals counter that? I am not usually so negative. I think I'm tired! Thanks again so much for the encouraging words. I will keep on trying. And I'll look into some of those strategies you mentioned too. Greetings from the UK

[@just_another32]

@Rebecca Mattis Ah, what's that book called? I intend to look up the book Glenn mentioned too.

[@scottmitchell1974]

@Rebecca Mattis I appreciate and AGREE with your positivity. I also believe we WILL get through this, but it may (probably) hurt first.

[@johnstewart7025]

Capitalism as it relates to the history of slavery. Hmmmm. I just read that by the Compromise of 1790, the Southern States agreed to pick up more than their share of the Revolutionary War debt in exchange for building Washington in the South. Who would have been working in the South back then? I imagine a lot of tobacco profits went to pay interest on the debt to French, Dutch bankers.

[@newcomer3674]

I don't understand how this conversation is still going on. “Systemic racism” is anything that, in the view of black people, hurt their interests or offended them or, indeed, anything they do not approve of. In recent years, this limitless definition has come to include the entire structure of our predominantly white society, as well as all white people. What we have here is an Orwellian version of Original Sin-complete with a new class of racism-awareness “priests” who will absolve us of the sin of racism if we show a penitent attitude, utter the required formulae, and-last but not least-give in to all their demands. America, whose whole past is racist, can only become “good” to the extent it overcomes the evil of racism. But since America is inherently racist, it can never succeed in doing that. It follows that America can only become a good country when it ceases to exist, i.e., when its European-rooted civilization is dismantled

[@paigemccormick6519]

You said, "I don't understand how this conversation is still going on." Remain vigilant, New.

[@newcomer3674]

@@paigemccormick6519 The censored my reply. Which was unimpeachably moral and politely worded.

[@paigemccormick6519]

@@newcomer3674 Oh wow! I did see it pop into my notification basket, then I couldn't find it!. Bastards. My reply "Remain vigilant" was aimed at, if CRT have their way, the convo will always be ON. I didn't believe at first the BLM had taken down their What We Believe page, but it's apparently true. Far from backing off it, they're insinuating a more palatable argument. Hope I'm coherent. Thanks, New.

[@newcomer3674]

​@@paigemccormick6519 The conversation, however expressed, comes down to the idea that black failure is caused by white racism, and there is only one position to take on the matter. If whites could see the truth that blacks failure is not whites’ fault, it could literally save the country, by freeing whites from their suicidal guilt.

[@jonathanwegner1194]

alexsheremet.com/coleman-hughes-cannot-be-trusted/

[@martin6548]

lol - you mentioned vaclav havel - as a person that live in czech republic i think that it is correct - this days and ways of thinking reminds me communism... its sad...

[@newcomer3674]

All you have to do in order to make a claim of systematic anything is to take the outlier and say it's representative of the whole.

[@jonathanwegner1194]

alexsheremet.com/coleman-hughes-cannot-be-trusted/

[@shawnhill3482]

In America you can say whatever you feel like saying! Freedom of Speech is the 1st Amendment so!

[@cmeeki4]

Income has nothing to do with racism.

[@johnstewart7025]

I understand Saudis still use slurs for blacks.

[@davidferrer5709]

Coleman talks around everything and throws around names of other people’s great thought

[@walkernolanj567439]

Empathy and reform is what citizens are looking for and it would solve a lot.

[@timffoster]

Empathy with what? (Most of my black American friends are grieved over imagined injuries. I kid you not.) Reform to what? (Most people, black or white Americans, cannot articulate a path to the utopia they long for) I don't know what empathy and reform would solve since it's an ephemeral and ethereal target at best. (BTW, if it matters to you, I am not white, and was born in Nigeria)

[@ChiquiTuni]

Coleman: I want you to marry my daughter! She’s White though, would your parents be ok with that? 😂

[@cowabungadude7408]

The audio quality is poor and the questions are not interesting or even well phrased. Conservatives need to do better than this.

[@grahamjoss4643]

I agree with the audio, but please suggest a question/topic

[@just_another32]

It seemed like the interviewer could have followed up on some of their responses a little - to dig deeper and also so it was more like a conversation and flowed better. But still, it was interesting to listen to on a Monday night :-)

[@Grequierecafe]

Victoria Ward -Seemed pretty deep to me. Thanks.