Heat Pump - Complete Yearly Running & Install Costs!

[@al3xdragos01]

This guy deserves more credit for what he is doing,

[@nxsynjs]

Thanks. Food for thought., One thing, the electricity standing charge you would incur anyway, heat pump or not. So in my mind you wouldn't count it as a heat pump cost, though the gas standing charge counts as a gas boiler cost because without gas you wouldn't incur it., So really standing charge for HP would be 0, as it's a whole house cost. . Hope that makes sense.

[@JohnR31415]

Or add in the Electric SC to the boiler for its 200kWh…

[@charlesamery-behr3153]

Yes, the electricity standing charge should be deducted from the heat pump costs i.e. £222.65 less.

[@GARDENER42]

Can I just say how much I appreciate this video, as you're making this a _lot_ easier to understand. I'm in the planning stage of building a new bungalow & looking at ground source heat pump, underfloor heating, 13kw solar panels & 13.5kw battery (yes, I do need the power - woodworking & year round horticulture guzzle kilowatts). I'm still toying with a well, as the plot will be on septic for drainage & if I do, I'll go vertical for the ground source too, as the rig will be on site.

[@andrewdennis8404]

If you're building a new property, is it cheaper to install solar pannels than to install a normal roof tiles

[@GARDENER42]

@@andrewdennis8404 That's another factor I'm considering but I've not found much in the way of clear information so far.

[@downwind_david]

I think one of the most important reasons for doing this is what you mention at the end about protecting yourself from external shocks, whatever they may be. I live in semi-rural Western Australia and so every time there's a power outage ( 5 times in the past year alone ), my solar, battery and heat pump hot water mean that we don't even notice. Financially, I haven't paid an electricity bill in over two years since it was all installed.

[@ErwindeWit-v9u]

I live in rural the Netherlands, and we're also experiencing more issues outages.. Good point! Thanks!

[@bellshooter]

I think there is a primary error in your calcs for the heat pump, the standing charge should be zero as it is not increased from general electricity s/c. So £222.65 reduction there.

[@maryb-h980]

I agree m

[@Trifusion1]

Definitely. If you get rid of the gas boiler you can get rid of the gas standing charge. If you don’t have a heat pump you still need an electricity supply.

[@NeilLewin]

Yes, I was thinking the same. You’d need to pay the electric standing charge either way, so the savings are actually greater.

[@zarni-dude]

Yep, picked up the same thing straight away.

[@benholroyd5221]

@@Trifusion1 yes so, unless youre keeping gas for a hob, you can save another £137 by going to a heat pump. So based on these figures, youd be spending £815 a year for the electricity on a heat pump v £1068 for the gas boiler, including standing charge. So youre saving £253 a year. I've just got a quote from octopus, and thats £3000 for the heat pump plus any needed radiator upgrades, and a hot water tank. So thats a 12 year pay back. But, I've just checked with british gas to replace the boiler, and thats £2600. So basically, at worst, go with a heat pump when it comes time to replace your boiler.

[@connclissmann6514]

Many thanks for this in-depth look behind the curtain of your costs. In this neck of the woods, we just don't get the same low night-time tariffs you mention and grants vary, of course. I'll share this video with others when it becomes more widely available, later in the week.

[@salibaba]

Great seeing the stats to back everything up. I’ve not even bothered calculating mine. By the time I factor in the car, the PV&storage and the heat pump, I know I’m saving a fortune compared to what I could have been. A new(ish) petrol & all it entails, switching supplier to get the cheapest (price cap) and replacing our old broke boiler with a new one. I know friends who have actively been turning the heating right off to save on the heating cost. Like you I prefer the protection of no nasty surprises. It’s gone past game like, collecting all the collectibles and unlockables as much as possible before starting even the first campaign mission.

[@rbdogwood]

Also, if you invest in the equipment you are bypassing inflation. £10,000 if not spent 10 years ago and just saved would be a lot smaller now. Essentially it means your money is working for you rather than the bank.

[@mersh318]

-6 in Lancashire last week and my house was still toasty warm. After your advise at fully charged last year we have ripped out gass and wirh heat pump fully electric

[@bibliotek42]

We have had our heat pump (air to water) since 2009. It's fine. It has had a service every year, but that has just been a 5 minute visit to conclude that it's working fine. No leaks, no outages, nothing. A valve connected to the boiler stopped working, but this was not due to the heat pump. So I think a 10 year life span is very conservative.

[@GeoffWilliams1]

My Dimplex heat pump has just failed after 8 years and 1 month. It is irreparable and the whole system has been replaced for a 14kw Mitsubishi system. Huge bill to pay and NO grant to help us as we already had a heat pump. The video does not include the high annual costs of depreciation and loss of interest on the huge outlay of pump + panels + battery storage so I reject the calculations as erroneous.

[@adus123]

why have you included the standing charge Would you include the standing charger for working out the cost of running your kettle or TV, Charging your car, The only standing charge that is relevant here is the gas since You could eliminate it all together.

[@JonathanPriceUK]

Many thanks for this ... I have been trying to gauge what I should expect to pay for a 10-12kW ASHP install. I have seen fully installed prices on top of the grant, between £1700 and £15000! £6k - £7k plus grant seems common but wonder if I can do better ...

[@M0j0]

Solar and off peak tarrifs saves loads on motoring fuel costs for the EV... Which I like to include in my savings calculations👍

[@pmac6584]

I have solar/battery and EV with intelligent octopus go add to that shares in ripple energy so I get 6.3p per unit generated. So I only pay 0.7p per unit. I am retired so as far as I am concerned my electric bill is pretty much zero and I might be in credit if this 15p export lasts. Happy days 😁

[@johnrush3596]

Good video. Doing the sums on the heat pump, solar and home battery is always difficult due to the number of moving figures. As one of the comments below mentions, inflation makes.a difference as well. I look at the upgrade in equipment as does it answer the question, does it improve our standard of living. We are now 7 years in and our variable running costs have not gone up, if anything they have gone down but we are actually doing more. There are a lot of people in the country with what is called fuel povity with massive bills. Videos like yours help people understand how they could mitigate against the costs.

[@Eduard.Popa.]

Excellent video ❤

[@timoliver8940]

Interesting breakdown Andrew. 2 points: 1) yesterday we had record breaking high winds here in central Scotland - the village where I live has a large number of council owned houses all with solar and 1 or 2 Tesla Powerwalls - 11 hours of power cuts yesterday and after dark you could which house had battery power from their normal house lights on……… 2) I had a 39 small solar panel 3.9kW array installed in 2012, no batteries but I do have an EV charger and a solar diverter (Eddi) that were added in 2021. I’ve been looking to add solar to the other side of my roof and the cost WITHOUT the cost of the battery is more than double what I paid in 2012 and I keep being told that the price of solar panels has dropped through the floor! In 2012 I paid £5750 for a system sold by IKEA using Hanergy components that price included scaffolding, 3 surveys, connection to FITs and MCS certification as well as all the labour and components. 13 years in and there is degradation but even new I rarely saw 3.5kW generation from the panels and now it max’s out at 3.1 on a summers day on my South West facing array

[@jacktissington]

Whoever is quoting you for solar only is really ripping you off then. A lot of reputable companies, including one I worked for, are offering 5kw solar and 3 or 5kw battery for £6000 and that's without any grants and all the paperwork etc done

[@richsmart321]

top left of the table - the standing charge for electricity - surely the fact that you have to pay for the standing charge for electricity anyway, why not simply remove that cost for using heat pump? So effectively, there is a zero cost for the heat pump as you're already paying the standing charge for electricity. That would make it more cost effective no? I make it that the cost for Heat Pump top left table would work out as £815.724 & £226.80 for heat pump with solar

[@SardiPax]

I think the standing charges should be left out. While you save by removing gas so the argument is fair for that, you can't use gas without electricity and you will need electricity even without it so the electricity standing charge may as well be left out or you need to add a weighted version of it to both HP and Gas side (which rises to 100% on the HP side for the no-gas version). Probably simpler to just leave the SCs out of the calc. Rather than looking at pay-back period, I just look at how much each change will reduce my overall costs. Solar and Battery is working well for me (despite UK Mordor-mode weather for the last half year) and HP will be added to the equation at some point. I'm looking at Air-to-Air and will hopefully be able to do it in two stages (half the house before ripping out the entire radiator based system).

[@clarkfinlay78]

The one worry I have (our heat pump is being installed next month) is the cost of installing a heat pump without the bus grant. Assuming the heat pump has a similar life span to a gas boiler but is significantly more expensive to install. From your video it sounds like 3300 plus the grant of 7500 higher than a gas boiler so 11k MORE expensive to install without the grant. Even if they cost roughly the same as a gas boiler when the grant is included the government only gives each home one grant so in 10 - 15 years we will have a massive bill to replace a heat pump if they don't drop massively in cost.

[@johnb7644]

The radiators and pipe work wouldn’t need installing again

[@MacCraig8]

The actual heat pump unit being swapped outside is much, much more comparable to replacing a gas boiler. With enough economies of scale in the industry, it could easily be so. Remember those kind of costs are for a full redesign of a heating SYSTEM, not a heat pump on its own.

[@clarkfinlay78]

​@@johnb7644 all the quotes we have received have simply been for heat pumps and hot water tank plus controls etc with no new radiators little change of pipe work apart from a few meters to the outdoor unit. The total cost before grants have ranged from 10k to 15k.

[@ZicoTheMysticalWarrior]

​@@clarkfinlay78 That is mental our quote was just over 14k and we paid just over 9k as the grant was only £5k we got a 210l tank, a 8kw heat pump, a full repipe and all new radiators (10 plus 2 towel rails) in a 4 bed semi which was a lot of work as it's nearly 25m long front to back. Having said that I've just checked the cost of 6-8kw heatpumps and when we got ours nearly just over 2 years ago they were £1-2k and now they are nearly double, curse you inflation!!

[@dubpressure]

I’d like to ask about hard water and getting hot water for baths showers etc and overall insulation. So 1) does hard water affect a heat pump? 2) Do I need to get all my radiators replaced and thicker pipes installed 3) we have. Limited space so I’m not sure how we would get enough hot water to run a couple of baths back to back, does the heap pump also work for hot water? 4) installers, I’ve tried a few times to get an appointment with our energy supplier Octopus but it quite tricky to get one as I’d like to get solar battery and heat pump installed, We live in the south of the Uk so any recommendations would be great.

[@barryhaeger4284]

I totally agree and only wish I'd thought I might fit a ASHP when I fitted my Solar and Battery and I would have put another 3 kW of PV and extra 5 kWh of battery storage. But hey I have it and it is only for a couple of months in winter I need to sip electrons from the grid at full price. With PV and Time of Day Tariff, my average cost is around 8p/kWh 9 months of the year and in coldest moth this winter after the Jan 1st price rise it's still only 16p/kWh.

[@yorkshirejags7410]

I think getting genuine figures out there is very important. The battery would also run the gas central heating so to be fair those figures should be reflected in the running cost, as you won’t be using peak energy to run the boiler.

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

@@yorkshirejags7410 I did. The estimate for usage was 200-400kWh a year. I used 200, the lowest.

[@devinspaul]

Should you not include the cost of the batteries as you can only charge on the cheap tarrif because you have them.

[@kevinhartle4494]

Thanks for another great video. Were you using your gas cental heating in the same way as a heat pump i.e. had you turned down the flow temperature and had a more continuous low level background heat, or were you using it in the more traditional way with a high flow temperature and a thermostat letting the boiler click in and out? We are on a journey to reduce our energy costs. We had solar and battery installed a couple of years ago and added external wall insulation last year. We currently have an oil fired boiler, but have not experimented with the flow temperature. I don't think we will transition to a heat pump until the boiler needs replacing, but may be convinced otherwise.

[@danuk2005]

For a house thats only occupied from 5pm to 6am would it still be as good. Do you need the heat pump constantly running in the day for 11 hours in an empty house to maintain a level temperature. If so wouldnt this cost more than a boiler that is off for 11 hours

[@terryjimfletcher]

You would put it to a set back temp of around 18C from 4am (2 hours before you left for the day) to 2pm (3 hours before you return), and then monitor how the temp changes and see if you can lengthen that set-back temp period.

[@BlackCountryLad]

Hi, what size is your air source heat pump? Our gas bill was £250, 2019 build very well insulated. Makes the change over a difficult choice. Have EV, Givenergy 5kW inverter and 9.5kW battery. Paying Octopus £2 a month.

[@andrewmullen4003]

Just a point, at 2:45, in the gas costs you should also include the elec standing charge, as you would need both to run it. Big fan, thanks, just spotted a previous comment about this, apologies.

[@elliottquinton2084]

No because people would be having to pay the electric sc anyway regardless

[@terryjimfletcher]

@@elliottquinton2084 Andrew Mullen is correct, mathematically, the boiler install would have to include the electric standing charge as it would then cancel out the error that others on here have already pointed out with Andy (EVM)'s calculations - he shouldn't have included the Elec standing charge in the Heat Pump side because it's not the sole reason for the charge - he's got lighting, TVs, Radios etc.

[@constructioneerful]

Should we be looking at costs and savings based on gross income before tax and equivalent gross income?

[@mnorma12]

Yikes! How was that 3 years ago? I remember when you put in the heat pump. Nice work! You don’t have cooling needs. When you add that to the mix (in hotter climates) its a wonderful additional benefit of the heat pump. EVs, heat pumps, solar, batteries, etc. save our household upwards of $5K (USD)/year in gasoline, NG, and electricity.

[@usaverageguy]

Alice didn't want to present this video? 😊

[@JesperD87]

Interesting to see that the heat pump costs approximately the same (without solar panels and battery) even when the insulation of the house has not been improved! Nice. I'm curious, how modern is the house in terms of insulation?

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

@@JesperD87 2007

[@JesperD87]

@ElectricVehicleMan Nice result! 👌

[@Jaw0lf]

STanding charge is definately a saving by cutting gas use from the home. Electricity standing tcharge will stay whatever happens. My ASHP has been using around 2500kWh per year and pricing is difficult as with the ASHP, my battery is empty earlier. Overall with my EV, Solar, Battery and ASHP I am saving massively on my energy costs less than £100 per month including 10,000 miles in the EV. Other thing is that my home is now always warm!

[@Steve-co1ic]

What heat emitters does your system have or is it underfloor? because you cannot connect a heat pump to an existing heating system and expect it to heat the house as the gas boiler did and if it did it would cost more than gas as the hotter the less efficient, heat pumps are great working at 30 deg C not so great at 75 deg C

[@MrDAVIDATKIN]

Great insight, it would seem to me that the priority would be to get a home battery first. Without the home battery the heat pump would never make finacial sense to a low usage household like mine.

[@larsmenken2679]

Electricity isn’t free from solar. I ‘charge myself’ the export rate in any calculation. Basically, any electricity used takes away from the 15p export opportunity. Still much cheaper than standard rates

[@alibro7512]

Agreed, I do the same.

[@PropertyAtAuction]

Me too!

[@tarbat]

What was the difference in heating degree days (HDD) between the two years you're comparing. For us, 2024 HDDs was 8% lower than 2023, so you'd expect an 8% reduction in heating demand.

[@edwyncorteen1527]

Solar and a big battery is the key to really saving cash with a heat pump, we run two EVs, and a heat pump on 24/7 during the winter and export all we can in the summer, last year my electricity bill for the lot was very near zero.

[@JonathanPriceUK]

Q: how big is your battery in kWh capacity and which tariff do you use?

[@richardlewis5316]

Lucky you to be able to afford 2 EVs, solar and batteries. Proves that the wealthy can save whilst pensioners go cold or hungry and Reeves does not care or understand (accounts clerk )

[@Gelp]

Great video thanks!

[@eurimcoplimsoll1117]

Quite a drop in energy use from the old gas boiler to the heat pump assuming your COP for the HP is about 3 on average. Have you kept you house at the same sort of temperature ? What sort of temperature? And your HP what is it's maximum heat output ? ( model of the Valient ) - thanks.

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

@@eurimcoplimsoll1117 SCoP is about 4. House is the same. Heat Pump is 5kW.

[@eurimcoplimsoll1117]

@@ElectricVehicleMan Thank you

[@bordersw1239]

I don’t understand how people are using so much gas. Gas combi boiler, 4 bed detached with separate garage so probably similar area to heat and completely detached rather than your semi. Total predicted use 8300kwh , we’ve used more this year - last year was 7300kw. House occupied 24/7 built 2003 - just a standard mass built house. I use 3 heating periods a day with set back temps, so it’s never cold. Genuinely interested! Oh and 4-5 people occupied.

[@NickFoster]

Everyone's house is different...

[@nickhickson8738]

@@NickFoster And more importantly their perception of what is coldness and warmth. I'm in my eighties now and both me and my partner feel cold all the time unless the outside temperature in in excess of 12C to 15C. My gas and electricity cost about £10+ per day and that is with the heating left on 24/7.

[@paulglass6134]

Good video. Thank you. Is your battery capable or running the heat pump for short periods in the event of a grid outage? I’m exploring a GivEnergy system at the moment, I’m just waiting for a reply from their support to a question I’ve asked - might give up tbh, been over two weeks and not even had an acknowledgment to my email.. anyway problem for another day.

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

Depends on the heat pump and which battery/inverter. A Giv AIO is 6kW, so as long as you don't go over that, it will power anything.

[@davidmuir2546]

How long would you get from batteries before depleted should there be a power cut if everything is running as normal ?

[@martinsims35]

Excellent info, What tariff are you on? With an EV?

[@MrCyberstitch]

Take a look at Tomato Energy.

[@ori2089]

Thanks for sharing the data! After went through the numbers unfortunately I think it looks very bad investment considering you will need a proper sized battery to benefit from the extremely low electricity price. Unless you already have extra capacity however it's unlikely for many households If including the battery the whole cost would easily go above 10k, which means at least 12 years for getting back the investment. And at that time you'll probably need a new battery within a couple of years. I'm a believer of clean energy but currently the technology just isn't good enough and probably need another decade to make it a sensible choice for ordinary people.

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

@@ori2089 Batteries should last past 20 years. Not 10!

[@ori2089]

​@@ElectricVehicleManto be clear I think it's generally good idea to get a battery with couple of years of 0% finance. But with a heat pump plus the extra capacity needed it's not being too sensible,even assuming the battery lasts 20 years since heat pumps and batteries are still extremely expensive. If in a decade technology advances to a point that everything is much cheaper than they are now, and that would be a better time to invest instead of right now

[@andycampbell193]

@@ori2089Id suggest doing the maths. You might change your opinion? £6k for battery for 15kwh, £3k for heat pump after grant

[@ori2089]

​@@andycampbell193 I actually did the math. You'll probably need £8k including installation for the battery. Say to put £8k in a 5% cash ISA vs take a 5 year 0% mortgage from Nationwide for battery. The battery needs 9.4 years to catch up, and at 15 years mark it has 6.7% ROI. Which seems fine but those are the best case scenarios. You'll almost certainly going to need bigger battery when adding a heatpump. As heatpump by itself doesn't save you money those increases costs significantly and further reduces ROI. Good news is, you can probably sell the property for a couple thousands more to those who don't do the math, which doubles/triples ROI.

[@ori2089]

@@andycampbell193 heat pump doesnt save you money but other parts of the system do, simple math. Then why would you need a heat pump if it's more expensive, takes more room and you're effectively losing money by purchasing one?

[@georgejohnson1498]

I live in an electric only flat, and my annual consumption is at slightly less than 1200 KWh per year. That is for cooking light, and heating including water heating plus washing clothes. I am on the Standard Variable Tariff that is generally considered the least economical in price terms. So you will see that the immersion heater goes on once a week and I do not heat at all. I boil water in the kettle for everything else ... I cannot afford to spend any more on electric as food is more important. In my early sixties, I am not quite retirement age, sadly. There is no way it would make sense to buy a heat pump as I definitely cannot afford the cost of running it. I cannot have solar panels, because it is for a flat, and I don't control the roof. So ... The only saving option is to get a 5KWh battery and harvest cheap night rate electric, at roughly a third of the price of the day rate, and heat the water [currently cold six days a week] on the cheap rate. I would need a 3 KWh inverter, as I make a rule of never using more than 3KW at any any time. More or less one thirteen amp plug at any time. I do not use a large oven, but a small mains plug portable one ... I would love to be able to partake in the Green Revolution, but could neither afford it nor live long enough to justify borrowing the money to do it. When I retire, I'll get one of those Danish "Christiania" E-cargo bikes, and get rid of my van, which I need for my work as a gardener and handyman. So one day I will have a very simple electric transport for the evening of my days. Love your videos. Best wishes from George

[@markrainford1219]

Why do you limit yourself to 3kw maximum?

[@Lewis_Standing]

George your heating bill would be 4x lower with a heat pump vs electric radiators. Consider getting an A2A mini split that essentially looks like aircon. It can heat it can cool, it uses 3-5x less electricity to heat you than a basic electric radiator or electric boiler would.

[@georgejohnson1498]

@ Part of the self-discipline in being thrifty. Similarly, I never leave more than one LED light running except when going to the bathroom!

[@georgejohnson1498]

@ I am looking at all the options, and thank you for the suggestion.

[@Sidtheslappysealion]

What kind of impact is there for heating water? One of my most significant reservations in making the switch is the convenience of "on demand" hot water. As i understand things, with a heat pump you need a hot water tank and as such i believe a less efficient process than a combination boiler. It would be interesting to understand the scale of this.

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

The hot water is in a tank and filled at 3-4x efficiency compared to gas already. You can set to fill on a timer or just constantly top up. Once set correctly you won’t notice any difference.

[@harcovanhees394]

It's about the same as far as I can calculate (over here in the Netherlands), but you also have to count the maintenance and depreciation of the solar-installation (lifespan of a Solar inverter is 10 years and solar-panels about 20 years) and the home-battery system. It's complex but it's the overall energy and overall installation (purchase, maintenance and depreciation) before and after.

[@andymccabe6712]

No.... The WARRANTY for the solar inverter is ten years.... It could, of course, last much longer.......our system is 14 years old - no faults of any kind, so far.....!!

[@dogbreath6974]

Manufacturers are making out that HSP are a new invention, when we all know they have been around for decades. If they want the masses to adopt this technology, then they need to drop their inflated prices. I'm not anti HSP, I'm anti price gouging.

[@axelc8611]

Had a HP fitted and removed my gas meter at same time but starting to worry I made the wrong decision on getting the meter removed. Will it devalue my property am thinking of asking for one putting back in got my HP for free more or less

[@salibaba]

Why bother, if you ever sell the house it can be reconnected again easily. It’s not like you’d be selling a house with no roof. In fact many houses are starting to attract higher prices if they’re more efficient, have solar etc. I’d pay a premium to move in without upgrades or retrofits looming

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

@@axelc8611 They can re-add at anytime. I really wouldn’t bother. Especially if you’re not selling anytime soon.

[@johniooi3954]

@@salibaba Why do you plan to take the heat pump with you if you move?

[@axelc8611]

@@johniooi3954 no lol but what if someone wants a gas oven or to put a boiler back in

[@jacktissington]

Then why should you pay a standing charge for gas if your not using it. No gas will never devalue a property

[@TrevorHa]

For boiler price which needs electric shouldn't you have added standing charge for electric too? Another £200 annual cost

[@daviddavies2742]

It would be interesting to see if it's increased the value of your home compared to how much the system cost.

[@peterryan7340]

Does the heat pump provide heating and cooling? Our AC units in Australia are Heat Pumps and do both heating and cooling

[@garysmith5025]

The air to water systems used in the UK don't usually provide cooling, for me that is totally irrelevant, for some parts of the UK it may be a bonus on a few days of the year, and it some areas it could be seen as becoming a "must have"

[@simoneisgod]

depends on the house most UK houses have water fed radiators my UK house we have fan coils so can heat and cool

[@Dreador.]

No different system there is no fan on a A2W system - UK does have klike you A2A but its not included in the government grant so many dont look at it - even though without the grant it can be the cheaper option.

[@AnonYmous-rw6un]

Subsidized UK systems have not allowed cooling since they don't want to increase load. However, I believe that's under review and they may allow it in the future.

[@simoneisgod]

@AnonYmous-rw6un they can we have it and mini splits are getting more popular but they have to cover your hot water and heating to qualify for the BUS grant

[@robertosfield]

The initial comparison of Heat Pump vs Gas is a bit wrong, adding the elec. standing charge for the heat-pump when you'd need elec for other devices, but not add it to the gas when it's just as essential to running a Gas boiler. Would be better to just remove the elec. standing charge for the heat-pump and leave the gas standing charge. Doing so would give you £808 vs £1068, even with the price cap. Of course the as you go on to point out with your own costs the real value comes in being able to run it off low overnight rates, this is where we've been able to massively reduce costs of heating and hot water since installing heat-pump. It'd still be good to start off with a more sensible initial cost comparison.

[@ram64man]

Err you forgot to include converting cost. Before grant I was quoted 16k include 20 rads from k1 to 8 k3 and 12 K2+ also the he average cost is 9k now for A 5bed 11kwh unit

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

@@ram64man The what cost? My price was for everything. Anyone that replaces all radiators when the majority are fine don’t know what they’re doing IMO.

[@Eduard.Popa.]

If the gas is closed from national grid you can't heat your house with gas heating boiler But if the electricity is closed from national grid you can heat partially or full with your heat pump backed up by solar panels, battery

[@Scouser22]

You need to mention that you don't need solar and battery to get cheap rate electricity. Several suppliers provide off peak rates for heat pump owners - eg Cosy Octopus : 8 hours off peak (currently 13p/kWh), 13 hours at day rate (currently 27p/kWh), 4 hours at peak rate ( 4pm-7pm currently 42p/kWh). Eon-Next also do a Next Pumped tariff (not sure about prices) These are similar to the old Economy 7 tariff for storage radiators,

[@Scouser22]

oops. 3 hours peak rate 4-7pm. Only 24 hours in a day !

[@rinnin]

What about the hot water system? 🤔

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

@@rinnin This is a hot water system. 🤔

[@stephenlee5929]

Why is the standing charge on the Heat pump side higher than on the gas boiler side, Are you paying more for your electric standing charge without gas than your gas standing charge and electric with gas?

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

Gas SC is cheaper than electric. They’re not the same cost.

[@stephenlee5929]

@@ElectricVehicleMan But didn't you need the electric standing charge to run the gas boiler system? So it should have been on that side too?

[@phil9361]

So you got your electricity bill down to £324 but you have had to spend £30,000+ to achieve this

[@alangordon3283]

Exactly.

[@Etacovda63]

and eliminated his gas bill as well...

[@jamesdaw131]

Not convinced you should have had the standing charge. You need elec for other things

[@michaelparker-m6s]

Watch the vid below it might provide very important information for your future energy requirements/ expectations/ solutions .

[@ianbowden4165]

hi, you need to deduct £222 from the heatpump running cost as you pay the standing charge already, and deduct £115 from the heatpump cost if you are getting rid of gas as you will no longer be paying it, unless you are keeping the gas hob/cooker for some reason, so cost for heatpump no solar, no battery is £693 for year not £1039 , but good video on the whole

[@timblackburn2017]

The question I ask is how much would it cost to convert from existing combi boiler to a heat pump setup of pump, solar panels, battery, new cylinder etc. My guesstimate would be in the region of £20,000. This is money I do not have and at my age (76) it would not make sense to spend.

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

@@timblackburn2017 This is all in the video.

[@timblackburn2017]

@@ElectricVehicleMan I agree but that doesn't change the fact I cannot afford to change/upgrade. If I I were in my 30's or 40's it would be a whole different ball game.

[@neilbridgeman7768]

Cannot keep spending the solar and battery saving on everything. Once spent to off set the solar and/or battery storage then that is gone. You cannot then reapply it to the HP costs.

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

@@neilbridgeman7768 I haven’t. The cost of all 3 is said here as is the yearly saving of them all combined. They all contribute.

[@hooksforestchin]

Cost of the heat pump doesn't include for having a new hot water tank fitted, assuming you've got space to have a hot water tank fitted. And that makes them an impractical option for many (ignoring the additional cost), plus the requirement for suitable outside space. Would be great to not have gas but the current heat pumps feel like EVs from 10-15 years ago - not the right technology yet for most people. Needs to be a direct replacement for the gas combi boilers installed in the majority of property.

[@jacktissington]

A heat pump installation always needs a cylinder so will never be priced without one so there is no extra cost. Yes it may not be practical for some installs but very few, as you can also get horizontal cylinders to fit in lofts and the like

[@vassoscostas473]

Once vehicle to grid technology gets standardised, then a lot of people could use the EV battery to run the heat pump further increasing the benefit. EV manufacturers need to get a move on with vehicle to grid.

[@RedBatteryHead]

They can easily cut cost on electrics. Is still an artificial price to keep gas up. Due to the price coupling.

[@tomsdaddy]

I think Heatpump installations will also be cheaper in the future, because there will be far more people in the industry who know what they're doing, - and for everyone else, there will be AI ! In fact, a decent AI system, that could take account of all the variables in all our different ages of houses, would be an ideal solution to this industry's need for qualified staff ...

[@michaelmooney9695]

The cost of running the gas boiler isn't right it doesn't include the standing charge of electricity which it needs to run.

[@andymccabe6712]

Er.......what about all the other appliances which use electricity..... Like the TV....!?!?

[@davidmuir2546]

How have you found the consumption in December & January so far?

[@Aeserham]

The biggest issue of heat pump is by itself it doesn't save you money. Therefore any investment you put on the heat pump only makes the payback period of the whole system a couple of years longer. For a brand new project it might makes some sense but if you have a boiler in good working order there's really no reason to switch. The whole heat pump business is built upon government grants and not sustainable IMO.

[@Luke-J]

Your calculations were overly favourable to gas, you are paying the electric standing charge anyway, the heat pump doesn't add to that, but yeh a £200 difference isn't material enough factoring that in for most people if no solar or battery. I've also got the 'holy trinity', I don't quite have as much battery as you but my input costs are still sub 10p/kwh in January, I have more solar so my annual bill £0 inc. powering the car. Solar will be fully paid back in under 8 years, heat pump paid back in 0 years as it was cheaper than replacing our 20 year old system. I'm not sure I agree that installing heat pumps will get cheaper, the heat pump itself is already mass produced at scale - it is the labour cost that is expensive and that is only going one way. When I had mine installed, I had 3 people here for a week plus an electrician for the best part of 2 days, I'd go as far as saying 50% of the cost was labour.

[@ecoterrorist1402]

Time of use is the biggest saving

[@Eduard.Popa.]

You can put electricity from your own solar panels in your own heat pump But you can't put in the gas heater boiler

[@rm-kx8et]

am i missing something here, were is the price of solar panels and battery pack in the calculations.

[@richardcorns8553]

You obviously didn't watch the whole video.

[@Gdoggy1239]

Hi I'm Barrie Crompton and I'm struggling for content in my daily anti EV campaign so all I could do was this tripe.

[@ecoterrorist1402]

Just off the cuff, in 4 minutes, how did you achieve 200kWh for the electric boiler? That doesn't quite add up to me. And before that hate in the chat, i have the same setup as you. i would say the gas use is less than i would expect on a 5 bedroom home, a 5 bedroom home avg uk is about 17K thou the video is a fare assessment. But no one will do a service for 40 quid.

[@garysmith5025]

That's the electricity to run the gas boiler

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

I said the service was £40 more for the HP than gas, not that it’s £40 for a service. The average is 200-400kWh a year for a gas boiler electric consumption.

[@andymccabe6712]

​@@ElectricVehicleManha!...... does ANYONE actually listen to what you say, dude.....!?!? .... I don't know why you bother.......!!!

[@ErwindeWit-v9u]

Ah, interesting. Securing the future of you get ill is a good point. Funny though. Your gas compared to the Netherlands is dirt cheap 😂 Our price peeked at 5 euros per m3 gas. For me now, gas is 1.33 euro per m3 and electricity 0.25 euro per kWh... Then again, nobody seems to want to service heat pumps here either, so hmm.. Still, thanks for all the tips over the years. I can make due with 35C water temp, making a heat pump very efficient. So once the gas heater breaks, welcome heat pump 😀

[@RichPober]

Why not heat the house from solar panels direct to storage heaters (via an inverter) and no batteries? That type of system would be far cheaper than paying for a heat pump and the electricity needed to power it and the waste incurred in energy transformation from motive energy for the pump to heating energy for the home. If you eliminate the energy transformation step of the heat pump and just use the solar energy to heat storage heaters, then that would be even more efficient and cheaper to implement.

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

@@RichPober Storage heaters are 99% efficient. My heat pump is over 400%. I need a quarter of the energy for the same heat. Even with conversion losses the heat pump is light years ahead in consumption.

[@RichPober]

@ElectricVehicleMan Heat pumps are not 400% efficient in the depths of winter when ambient temperatures are low. Heat pumps become very costly to run on higher daytime and especially evening tariffs. It would be better to use a cheap nighttime tariff to charge storage heaters and supplement that charge with 'free' solar energy during the day. There are many examples of heat pump systems costing £15 to £20 per day to heat new-build homes, which is financially unsustainable, especially for people in social housing.

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

@@RichPober Fella, mines running at 4.2 right now. My SCoP is 4.1! That’s for the year. And even at 200%, it’s still nearly doubling what you’d get with storage heaters even after losses. What you’re saying makes no sense. Do the maths. You get 10kWh of sun which a storage heater would give you, at best, 10kWh of heat. A heat pump would give you between 30-40kWh of heat with the same solar generation! 🤦‍♂️

[@robin5215]

great video... everybody should do it👍

[@steverichmond7142]

There is another benefit in removing gas. I have a brain injury that makes me sensitive to the level of oxygen in the house so I have introduced sensors. Without co2 pollution there is a noticeable reduction in oxygen levels when gas is in use. A US Parkinsons Disease study equates symptoms to lower oxygen levels - e.g. dry mouths and dry throats. The cost of your heat pump is expensive...

[@wrutherfordx3x]

Technically Solar Panel electricity is not free and at no cost, unless you had it installed free of charge. But I take the point.

[@triggsymalone9820]

What about the £30,000 cost of the install🤔🤔🤔

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

I told you the install costs and it's nowhere near that. At least watch a video you're commenting on!

[@80y3r9]

Maybe just say Monday not Friday?

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

@@80y3r9 Oh it was ready. I just forgot again! 😄 Can schedule public videos but not members.

[@russellurwin7396]

All your calculations for heat pump, solar and battery are based on cash purchase and no loans ? To get more nerdy have you calculated efficiency loss when you charge from AC into your battery and back from DC to AC when your battery powers the heat pump.Is it 10 to 15% loss at each conversion? I think your efforts are paying off but for a lot of people solar, battery and heat installation capital cost and work to convert a house, scaffolding, cowboy salesmen , electricians ripping walls apart puts people off. I am at an age where I could afford to do this but , the cost to get it all in a decent isa will offset some of the potential savings. Do like your channel

[@salibaba]

It’s already skewed heavily towards the boiler, I think that’ll do. On loans, I’ve got loans for all of my kit. EV, solar and ASHP all paid for using 0% loans from Home Energy Scotland and the Energy Saving Trust were offering. Some banks are now offering favourable loans for such projects too now.

[@JohnR31415]

It’s no way 10-15% each way… just based on measured input and output it’s nowhere near that discrepancy…

[@johnnodge4327]

Charging and discharging a home battery is less than a 5% loss either way. Nothing like 15% each way. You're better off installing solar and a home battery than putting the equivalent money in an ISA, or other savings scheme. The payback will be faster, often less than 7 years. I doubt there are many savings schemes on the planet will double your money in 7 years.

[@davidsmonkeyroost]

By my logic, you can't say that heat pumps will only come down in price as more and more manufacturers are churning them out AND provide the argument that heat pumps work well in Scandinavian countries. As they are being installed en masse in scandi countries, surely there isn't much more cost savings to be made on the ones being sold in the UK, unless we're being charged an inflated price, of course. Or the HPs in Scandi are somehow different to UK ones, in which case they aren't comparable to what we have. A HP is a far more complex thing, and for many homes which have a combi boiler, they don't have a hot water storage tank and all the pipes running from a boiler to it, so the install cost is greater for a HP as it requires more supporting equipment. On new builds, however, a HP starts to look cheaper in comparison - no expensive gas hook up cost, no gas piping, only one meter, no CO meter etc. I wonder if it makes household insurance costs cheaper. Gas is a pretty mature heating system and so is very reliable now, but when it goes wrong, it really goes wrong. I'm all for HPs in the UK, I just wish the government(s) pulled their fingers out and really incentivised it. If you're serious about reducing CO2 emissions, then actually do it. Sorry, very rambling and ranty.

[@Eduard.Popa.]

If UK wasn't a gas producer all these methane gas was imported from Norway, Russia or Arab world so more money go from UK to outside UK, but when you electrify everything you get a big chance to import zero energy from outside UK

[@BeingD2023]

I think its not right the gas standing charge is the same as the Electric one which on current tariffs is 70p a day. on gas as well as Electricity so if you have both your daily standing charge is £1.40 we get screwed out of. But we have the problem that you include full standing charge. when your house will be using lights and cooking etc. solar easy last 20 yrs no problem. no real servicing. and really earn money from day 1. what ever you produce you can use and it is cheaper than buying

[@MacCraig8]

The number of people who think gas alone magically makes water flow through their radiators is mind boggling. Nevermind ignition and logic.

[@adus123]

Recalculated Heat Pump £815.724 Gas heating £952.2356

[@GdaySport]

You forgot to add getting an EV into your equation!

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

Why? Nothing to do with heating. They’re independent

[@GdaySport]

@ElectricVehicleMan But it's an electric add on like solar, battery and HP, and negates need for wasted journeys to a retailer of your favourite combustible fluid, and capitalises on your off peak electricity 😀

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

@@GdaySport It’s not required anymore than adding the cost of a petrol car to a gas boiler install.

[@GdaySport]

@ElectricVehicleMan Petrol is possibly a 3rd less efficient energy source and you explained the value of getting rid of gas in favour of a single more efficient electric energy source. I was reasoning by analogy that an EV would be an extension of that benefit, but it appears I may be digressing...

[@Traumahawk007]

One solution, every new house by law HP, Battery, Solar.

[@DollyPocket]

As far as the solar installation is concerned you need to work out what return you get on £16k in an isa holding zero risk uk gilts to maturity = 750+ pa so it’s actually more efficient not to get solar and just go hassle free holding money (that does not degrade over time, does not need to be maintained and won’t blow off the roof in a storm) so total cost is £1039 - £750 for interest income) = £289 per annum if you have heat pump plus no solar. Stop making your life complicated for no reason.

[@sargfowler9603]

All the quotes I get are much more than £3.3K. Where's the best place to get quotes? A heat pump can just go on the outside of the wall where my boiler is.

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

That’s £3.3k more than the gas boiler was, not in total.

[@sargfowler9603]

@@ElectricVehicleMan Ah, thanks for that. Sorry, just saw the + on the video! I think I'll just get another boiler while I can. Can't justify the extra cost as I have no solar or battery. The prices of these things really needs to come down ALOT!

[@eliotmansfield]

gas boiler here and won’t change until forced to - because clearly little benefit still. I have solar and batts - i use that to keep my average unit price at 9.5p before you say im a hater.

[@leftcoaster67]

Rather get paid for what I'm accused of.... Brilliant.

[@GARDENER42]

You should add the electric standing charge to the gas boiler side, as, as you noted, the gas boiler _must_ have electricity.

[@alanl1268]

You need electricity regardless of whether or not you have gas heating but you only pay the standing charge once.

[@michaelparker-m6s]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/gZvPkHugerFmicUsi=R-Thv6zmFeeDtfaB

[@denniscarvell1828]

For a person with an average income , heat pump, Solar ,batteries ,makes no financial sense,the capital expenditure would be borrowed money with monthly interest payments,on capital. Ordinary working people are too poor to purchase such things environmentally the manufacturing batteries,solar panels etc needs to be taken into account . You would be better with wood pellet boiler, for co2 emissions calculations.

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

I have an average income. This didn’t happen overnight. Ordinary working people! 🤦‍♂️

[@davidmuir2546]

Did you borrow money to pay for installations or save up ?

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

@@davidmuir2546 Saved up over 7/8 years with 2 jobs.

[@keithdenton8386]

Don't be conned by heat pumps. Someone I know has had there house fitted out with a heat pump at a huge cost. Upgrading everything that was needed for the heat pump to be effective including underfloor heating and insulation. Running costs are cheap but in the cold spell it had to be subsidised with extra electric heaters. They will break even on the outlay in about 30 years. They wished they had not bothered. If they had put the money into an investment account, it thirty years it would have made them minimum of 50,000 pound. To replace a gas boiler would be about 1.000 pounds. Fitting would be minimal as it is like for like.

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

I know many people who have the opposite experience. So what does that tell you?

[@keithdenton8386]

@@ElectricVehicleMan It's human nature to try to justify a big outlay. I save money driving my Tesla around 100 pounds a month. But it cost me 50,000 so it will take me 41 years to recoup my outlay. I love telling people how it only costs me 4 quid a week in fuel to run my car.

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

@@keithdenton8386 I’m getting ‘paid back’ in about 4 years. Not 40. Just because you know someone, doesn’t make it default.

[@keithdenton8386]

@@ElectricVehicleMan Most houses in the UK do not come up to the spec needed, for insulation and draft proofing. The average occupancy of a home owned is 10 years. 4.5 for rented. I am selling after 40 years and moving. I am not the default ether. I would worry if the house I am buying has all the stuff that can go wrong, and could cost an arm and a leg to fix. Gas or oil I can budget for repairs or replacement easily.

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

@ Do you actually know how much a repair is? I do. I have the full list. You’re essentially worrying about something you have zero experience of.

[@seaplaneguy1]

First, your solar and battery are NOT free. You must include them in the analysis for this to make any sense. A battery from Tesla is $688/kwh. A 13.5 kwh wall is $9300. 5000 cycles. 688/5000 = 13.76 cents/kwh. The solar panel is likely at least as much as the battery. 13.76 x 2 = 27.5 cents/kwh for battery and solar. New combustion tech will be a heat pump at COP4. That would cut the cost by 4x using NG. You would also have electricity at 5 cents/kwh from fuel and 1.5 cents/kwh from solar. The future is with combustion heat pumps, not from electricity.

[@ElectricVehicleMan]

I have included them, you just haven’t watched before posting.

[@andymccabe6712]

​@@ElectricVehicleManha.....! WHAT a shocker.... somebody wrong in the comments.........!!?

[@seaplaneguy1]

@@ElectricVehicleMan Link?