Fossil fuel companies spending billions hoping that hydrogen beats EVs

Fossil fuel companies spending billions hoping that hydrogen beats EVs
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#fossilfuels #hydrogen #renewableenergy #evs #evnews
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[@eish3291]

These oil companies are wasting that money on hydrogen stations instead of ploughing it into battery development.

[@peterjohnwatson4340]

I’m

[@rozonoemi9374]

or BEV charging station.

[@user-jk3ht5hn3m]

They own battery development.

[@davidnika446]

Maybe they secretly are doing that, while shorting the stocks of companies creating the energy transition. I mean, they aren't dumb, are they?

[@sparkysho-ze7nm]

……….. admission of guilt an defeat

[@antoniopalmero4063]

We can make our own electricity at home , they don’t like that .

[@nfzeta128]

Yea hydrogen is something the average person can't easily set up at home and use themselves. Renewables you can become independent of the grid and not need anything from them but to take your extra and store it.

[@HablaCarnage63]

@@nfzeta128In theory you could do electrolysis at home, but you would only do that to store the energy for either your HVAC, Water Heater, or Hydrogen ICE or Hydrogen Fuel Cell vehicle.

[@Withnail1969]

Well no, not really. You cant make your own solar panels.

[@nfzeta128]

@@Withnail1969 but that's a purchase. The equipment to extract gas/oil or create/extract hydrogen would all be a purchase of tools. After that though it's just maintenance, you don't have to be continually supplied with sun from a company.

[@John-FourteenSix]

@@Withnail1969 But we don’t have to keep digging Solar panels up out of the ground every time we want to use them. I expect 25years life from mine, not 25 seconds (from the tank to the exhaust. AND they are recyclable too. Oil products are burned and then we breathe that end product in - All of us!

[@BMWHP2]

Fossil fuel companies are losing their insane revenue model, the addiction to the fuel hose. They cant make money from the electricity, that is coming from the solar panels on your roof.

[@Withnail1969]

Solar panels are just repackaged fossil fuels.

[@justinr9753]

So EVs are only for people with solar?

[@Withnail1969]

if the industrial system collapses, which it would do if the 100 million barrels of oil a day could not be sold, there will be no more solar panels, in fact no more anything except items you make yourself from scratch if you have the tools.

[@sparkysho-ze7nm]

…….. they tryin

[@KP-xi4bj]

Keep coping.

[@asajelfs8170]

Hydrogen is really poor as a fuel for vehicles, it has multiple issues.

[@jogana6909]

No one can beat EV with TALKING. Continued lying about hydrogen energy can't stop people from buying EV.

[@Jaw0lf]

Agreed, this is fossil fuel and engine companies wanting to keep selling, rather than innovate and move with the times.

[@danharold3087]

The future of transportation is anything that keeps you putting money in somebody else's pockets. Home solar and an EV for the win ! The freedom combo.

[@johnnyjet3.1412]

Which amounts to Free Gas - and if you refuse that you cannot call yourself a conservative

[@kiae-nirodiariesencore4270]

Well said! I've had this kind of argument with the MAGA cap wearing, conspiracy theory, right-wing populist crowd who believe that EVs are part of an evil scheme to control us! When I point out that real freedom comes from owning an EV and producing your own power at home, they refuse to see it. As Viking says, you are challenging their religion.

[@JSmith73]

Yeah I've had an EV for two years now and only partially paid for charging in the 3 winter months where solar output tends to fall. Even then I'm still covering some with my PV. I'm a moderate who the left would put on the right for some views, and the right would put to the left for others. 😅 I effing love my LR3 - it drives sharply, hard - or soft and smooth - whatever my heart desires. Whilst at the same time always raising a big middle finger to the fossil fuel industry.

[@diamondpolish]

@@JSmith73I strongly agree. I have a MYLR and absolutely love it. Sometimes the naysayers can be creative but it’s hard to convince me cause it simply works.. I always say if u don’t have it and u haven’t owned it for mounths u don’t have the right to critize it based on foolish Social media hearsay. I’ve had the Tesla for 8 mounths now, spent $170 on first quarter bill, $360 on second quarter bill, and waiting for current bill, but wait for it that’s HOUSE + car combined cost, which means car hardly $200-250 for 8 mounths! I mean if that alone doesn’t convince anyone I don’t know what will ever does! At this rate I’m saving well over $4-5k in petrol and servicing per year, etc compared to my previous 4cyl turbo, not to mention v8s etc. The sad thing is the biased media is getting to these naive souls, how wouldn’t it when it’s backed by oil companies, convincing them that electric is gay and , dangerous, evil, not environmentally friendly etc. How dumb And people believe that shit cause they’re stuck in their “petrol/diesel religion”. I also agree on the driving front, I have never driven something so responsive and so quick from A to B. You would need something like a Porsche to compete but I would say it’s still sharper

[@caljeff2427]

@@johnnyjet3.1412 lol..ok city boy

[@christopheredginton6242]

Incredibly dangerous too. Look on you tube at explosions at stations and with vehicles. An Ev or ice fire explosion is bad but you don’t want to be within a kilometre of a hydrogen explosion at the very least!!!!

[@vittoriopozza5217]

The only horrible thing is that in Europe several hydrogen companies get huge founds by govern. Our money !!

[@OTPulse]

So it's OK for EVs but not Hydrogen? Double standard much

[@vittoriopozza5217]

@@OTPulse Simply because hydrogen is stupid. It is much more expensive than electricity, it requires fossil energy to be produced, and it is much less efficient in the production cycle than electricity. All car companies have electric models, while there are only two ridiculous hydrogen cars. And finally: electricity is everywhere. Hydrogen nowhere. Hydrogen is only needed by oil companies to save their "dirty" business.

[@rico4229]

Oil companies get huge amounts of state aid , in the UK that comes in the form of massive tax breaks.

[@OTPulse]

@@rico4229 I know.

[@jogana6909]

It's just money laundering

[@bcreason]

You need to do the math. Every step in the hydrogen cycle has inefficiencies compared to pure electric. If you’re extracting hydrogen from fossil fuels you’ve only moved the CO2 production from the car to the refinery. If you’re getting hydrogen from water using electricity it’s less 50% efficient. Then it takes energy to compress, cool, cryogenically store and transport. You then have to convert it back into electricity in fuel cells. There’s also leakage and venting excess pressure as it warms. Then there’s safety. Hydrogen is much more explosive than gasoline. It burns with a clear flame so you won’t even you’re in danger. The storage tanks are a literal bomb with high pressure hydrogen in them. You’ll get two explosions. One from the ruptured tank, then a big one when the escaped hydrogen mixes with air and any kind of spark sets it off.

[@leroyharder4491]

It is hard to understand. We have solar panels, we have an ev which we love. Electrons flow, no mass transferred from one location to another. Its very elegant.

[@waywardgeologist2520]

Batteries?

[@leroyharder4491]

@@waywardgeologist2520 Not yet. Not so useful with our utility. We may eventually get one as our business may need a backup system at some point.

[@vwasson6725]

"Resistance to change" and profits are the 2 main factors. Deny deny deny until it's shoved up their asses. Been that way for generations.

[@djt8518]

Do you mean down their throat?

[@AORD72]

People that think hydrogen is better than batteries can't do basic maths and economics.

[@sparkysho-ze7nm]

Nor can governments

[@deltoncbaker]

I think that hydrogen is the worst idea ever! Every time you recharge your vehicle a tiny amount of hydrogen released directly into the atmosphere. Now multiply that tiny amount by the number of vehicles on the planet. Hydrogen itself is not a greenhouse gas, but it doesn’t stay pure. Hydrogen will very readily combine the gases already in our atmosphere. These new gases are multiple times more harmful to our greenhouse problems. We would better off sticking with the gasoline we are currently using than switching to hydrogen. The new Chevrolet RS pickups have a range of over 400 miles and recharges in about 10 minutes.

[@paulstubbs7678]

Even if it does not leak as you described, there is the problem of keeping it in tanks, Hydrogen seeps through almost everything

[@John-FourteenSix]

One word that should strike fear into everyone… “ZEPPELIN”

[@OTPulse]

Hydrogen is probably the best solution for semis, road-trains and other logistics uses. Kinda pointless for cars.

[@erktrek]

@@OTPulse kinda pointless for those too.. the infrastructure is terrible and storage and equipment onboard or at distribution points problematic and expensive requiring lots of maintenance.

[@OTPulse]

@erktrek Freight vehicles tend to have far fewer points of refuelling. Slap a heap on the main highways and call it a day. I don't think it's the best solution but the only sector I can see to make it work.

[@JoeyBlogs007]

Fossil fuel companies stand to loose massively, unless the invest heavily in renewables. The thing is, there will always be money to be made in any market, because once people have cheap energy, they will want to spend their money saved on other consumables. It would make far more sense for these fossil fuel luddites, to invest in the technology and consumables of tomorrow and not of yesteryear and being a stick in the mud.

[@markmiller8903]

We dont need or want your renewables. There is no future for non renewable batteries killing the miners, mostly children. Wake up and return your disgusting EV for a full refund.

[@imjustlikebud]

Please don't get your energy from your house for free with renewables, please come get our refined hydrogen so we have something to sell you

[@JoePolaris]

Is there enough indium, palladium , platinum for every h2 cars on earth ? Wait , H2 cars need a NMC battery too ? Spending money on battery research is smarter than energy intensive H2 production , unless we figure out production of green H2 at scale.

[@douglaswatt1582]

And even if we do it's roughly one quarter as efficient

[@linuxman7777]

Put the H2 at the power plants as backup for electricity . That is the way to go.

[@user-jk3ht5hn3m]

They own battery research

[@ctuna2011]

Hydrogen more expensive and more dangerous than gas . Unless the Oil and some car company's can have a constant pipeline to your pocket book they won't be happy.

[@diamondpolish]

absolutely! These fossil fuels / hydrogen money hungry people seem to simply ignore the hydrogen explosion that killed 6 people in Norway (or Sweden forgot exactly where). It’s definitely more dangerous than petrol and electric

[@stevemarquardt3217]

The only difference between a hydrogen vehicle and the Hindenburg? TIRES! [but the fires will be spectacular!]

[@user-yh6xf3wl1h]

Sam, in Aust truck drivers can drive 12 hours per day and only have a 15 min break every 5.5 hours. That means over 1000 km per day but most east west long haul use 2 drivers to go non stop. The charging needed across the nullabor would be impossible as there is no grid connection. Even the chargers there now are powered by diesel generators.

[@martinsmallwood9605]

No the chargers being installed across the nullabar are powered by solar and battery's. The generator's are for back up if the sun does not shine for more than a few days. Something that rarely happens in a desert ..

[@user-yh6xf3wl1h]

That may work for the moment with the very few ev,s that cross the nullabor now. Just imagine the size of the solar array that would be needed to power the multiple Mw chargers that would be needed to recharge every truck that crosses the nullabor every single day!

[@hwirtwirt4500]

Hydrogen is a non starter, making it is energy intensive (electricity), it's very difficult and lossy to store or transport, and it has much less energy density than petroleum distillates. Battery storage of is more practical and in many ways a superior energy source for powering automobiles.

[@Caniac76]

Yes, and what you said is really funny because step one of making hydrogen is making electricity. They are trying to create a middleman (hydrogen) between us and electricity.

[@rboz4637]

Santa Cruz Transit bought into it with a grant to purchase 57 hydrogen buses. Unanimous approval of Metro board. Wait until they start paying for the hydrogen.

[@sparkysho-ze7nm]

Ouch

[@shaonian]

I don't think the hydrogen thing is working out for big oil and the legacy auto makers. It must be very expensive to bribe governments etc and most people just ignore it. The anti ev propaganda has been much more successful and probably cost less (see MGUY). I also think they might be paying Electrify America etc to cripple their charging network as well. In NZ I've used fast chargers 100s of times and they always work here. So if the American charging network is unreliable then it's intentional.

[@Steve-co1ic]

Anyone remember Betamax? that was supposedly better than VHS when video players were introduced, the public soon made up there mind about that, I never want to go back to pumping fuel and then emptying my wallet to pay for it, if you haven't already buy an EV

[@swanvictor887]

Betamax Was better than VHS in quality, but Sony were greedy and refused to licence the technology. JVC allowed anyone to utilise the VHS system!

[@davidrandall2742]

I can charge my home and ev with home solar (while giving back to the grid during the summer), and the corporate cartel are terrified of that.

[@USA2Brazil]

Long Haul truck drivers often drive in teams, one drives while the other one sleeps.

[@donblythe3766]

Sam ,the reason I watch your channel more than any other is that you have such a wide variety of topics about energy and I think you're doing the world a great service by enlightening people to the advances in wind power and solar power. electric cars ,electric buses and electric trucks and home power stations. I share many of your videos with my science teacher sister And she thinks you have a remarkable knowledge of all these things!

[@unclefatbloke]

Sorry boys, the genie is out of the bottle! Nothing can beat the ease of electric charging. The vast majority of car owners live in HOUSES, = can charge overnight at home. After being able to have this convenience, and cost saving compared to gas stations; why the F would they want to return to having to go to stations again to fill up with Hydrogen?!! In the NEAR future, there will also be under-road wireless charging possibilities at traffic lights, and motorways, and within the next 5-7 years, robotaxis will be everywhere and the lower cost will convert all the city-dweller car owners = private car sales will start to go down. There is ZERO future for hydrogen powered cars, OR trucks!

[@sparkysho-ze7nm]

109%

[@johnhedge1429]

Why would anyone that has broken free of needing to go to a petrol station, using their own solar generated power to drive their car, go back to having to do the same thing only now it's hydrogen?

[@Agoncor]

I think we can have a diverse portafolio of renewables. Different sources is a good idea. But oil companies need to stop.

[@gregkelly2145]

Oh yeah, I really want a 10,000 psi / 69,000 kpa tank full of explosive gas in my car...

[@sparkysho-ze7nm]

PASS

[@neildolan7177]

You will know that in Australia there are lots of outback roads where trucks cannot stop to charge.

[@OneEyedMonkey9000]

That could be fixed with investment. The state built the roads the trucks run over, which was harder than adding charging points to truck stops

[@serpserpserp]

There are lots of outback roads where you can't stop for petrol either.

[@erroneouscode]

@@serpserpserp You can stop anywhere you like and use a jerry can of fuel

[@makosharksimmo8124]

The winner between these different forms of propulsion will be decided based on cost and convenience.

[@davesy6969]

I came across a post on reddit detailing just how bad hydrogen is as a fuel to work with. It's horrendous because of its very nature as the smallest atom known to man.

[@Secondwind2010]

Those trucks are huge bombs

[@glennmartin6492]

Hydrogen will be great for steel making. For vehicles it's best use through a hydrogen fuel cell to make electricity to move a car. In that case use batteries because more of the electricity that would make hydrogen that's made into electricity would best be directly shunted to motors.

[@billjohnson9221]

What do we expect them to say? They are desperately trying to hold onto their steering wheels and rudders as they hit the RE ICEberg.

[@stephencullum8255]

Correct me if I am wrong. I got the impression the hydrogen was used in an internal combustion engine. If you had a fuel cell running an electric motor getting the hydrogen in some green power source it might be more viable. My understanding is, hydrogen is one of the things being looked at as a way to store green power.

[@kng128]

It's just too inefficient to even use for storing green energy. It takes 50kWh to make a kg of hydrogen. And then the conversion of a fuel cell back to electricity is 35-45%? There's losses in each step. The losses in going battery direct are much less. Engineering Explained channel has several good YT videos on this topic.

[@rvo8915]

Hydrogen uses 3 times more energy per km in a car. How the hell we are going to produce so much green hydrogen with green energy? Hydrogen for cars is dumb. Use green hydrogen to green the heavy industry like steel factories, much more effective for CO2 reduction.

[@cbcdesign001]

Over 34,000 public charging points in the UK and a handful of hydrogen filling stations that are open to the public. That's a sign right there of the future of domestic transportation and it isn't Hydrogen.

[@user-br9oi2sh7o]

Hydrogen is mainly used in Heavy Duty Truck and the hydrogen mainly come from Renewable energy. The longer the resistance to change to EV the quicker the death will come for legacy Auto groups.

[@petersimms4982]

Steam Died, Coal Died, Oil will die,its only a matter of time now 😊 Everything's comes to an end in the end 😮

[@serpserpserp]

I get your point. But people said the same thing about Tesla's: They were incredibly expensive, had low range, charging was not cheap to set up initially, had no idea how long they would last. So I guess we just need to wait to see if hydrogen gets off the ground. I doubt it will given all the investment the fast technology advancement in batteries, but they'll try. Might be like VHS vs Betamax, sure Hydrogen vehicles will be excellent at certain things, but by the time it gets here everyone will be using EVs anyway.

[@charlesmarsh9608]

From what I've heard it takes 6 units of electricity to get hydrogen from manufacture to the pump not viable .

[@antonio_fosnjar]

They know that hydrogen won't be feasible for average consumers for another 10 years if even ever, so they can keep selling their oil as long as possible and even after when they switch to hydrogen making with gas

[@larryc1616]

Ignorance is bliss. Kodak! Blockbuster!

[@johnmoulton9728]

Madness, I can charge my wonderful EV at home overnight for very little money or I could drive an 80 round trip journey to possibly refill my Hydrogen car and pay a lot of money for the privilege. The UK has 15 such filling stations almost all around London. What total madness

[@michaelmcnally2331]

Best way to use hydrogen for fuel is as synth fuels, extract carbon dioxide and make efuel. Clean out fuel tank and put efuel in and already have the infrastructure in place to use. Remember not everyone can charge at home, and public charging is expensive compared to home charging and always will remain that way. Here in uk on an EV tarriff then people can actually get paid to take electricity from the grid when high output. Others paying 4p a kW. Supermarket with 3 hours limit parking is 44p a unit or 10 times the price. Supercharger up the road is 85p a unit. If you can home charge EV make sense. For people that cannot then they don’t. 80% of EV charging in UK is done at home. Yet only 70% of uk can home charge with suitable off-road parking. So for people that cannot home charge it isn’t range anxiety or charge time that the issue but that cannot home charge. That is the part that needs sorting out.

[@markhartung1190]

Discourse and debate have left the scene 😢

[@lkrnpk]

Maybe there is future for hydrogen in manufacturing, long term energy storage to use less batteries, maybe for planes again to use less batteries… but I fail to see it in cars and Germans do not see it at least for passenger trains too, maybe for heavy freight trains?

[@HenrikSvensson-is4mq]

It is a too much energy loss to make and use hydrogen

[@Madonsteamrailways]

What a thought!! How many hydrogen cells would be required to run a truck, for Heaven’s sake?!!

[@simonreeves2017]

Hi Sam, I’ve been on holiday and not used my BEV for 10 days, I left with the traction battery at 60%, then I got back it was 54%, some loss. If it was a hydrogen car, almost all the hydrogen would vent off in that time. I left my BMW i3 on the driveway, I can charge it without going to a fuel station. If it was hydrogen powered, and the hydrogen had vented off, what would I do? The vehicle would need recovery to a hydrogen station.

[@diamondpolish]

Can I suggest something (not sure if bmw is different to Tesla) but in Tesla if u disable all background processes like sentry/ auto heat/cool etc the battery will hardly drop, I have even seen someone leave their car at airport and did not check it over the air etc, and came back with 1% more battery 😂 or it could be a battery chemistry thing. My Tesla to this day have not lost or “leaked” any power for any length of time less than 2 weeks

[@nfzeta128]

Yea but then they'd happily sell you hydrogen tanks to fuel your vehicle. Of course these tanks are much more expensive than solar charging or simply having a small container with gas or diesel.

[@pucky900]

Maybe the would have a compelling message if they started pushing hydrogen... maybe.... 40 yrs ago! But NO... they were too busy making sure of our addiction to oil.

[@fast-trackhack6637]

1/ Hydrogen tanks take up precious space in the vehicle 2/ After all these years, where are the hydrogen fueling stations? 3/ What is the end-to-end efficiency of the hydrogen production, transportation and use 4/ Which vehicles have the hydrogen tank in the same location as EV batteries, lowering the center of mass and improving safety?

[@EnriqueThiele]

Yes the public made that desition ten years ago in favor of the EV. H2 Fuel Cells have been around since the 60's. It is a dead end road.

[@stevencole7331]

Years ago I thought hydrogen would be the next step after gas and diesel . I thought EVs could be a bridge to that transition. I don't think that anymore . The number one thing is transportation. EVs get their energy from the electric distribution system or locally from a electrical production center . Hydrogen mostly needs to be transported by fuel trucks to fueling stations . Now I thought natural gas was a good choice also as there already has line infrastructure in place in many locations . Not sure why that did not replace Petro . Tesla was so smart building their charging network . That was key to Teslas success . It wasn't that difficult . It used the existing electrical infrastructure. No fuel trucks . No gas lines . It surprised me as it did with legacy auto . My young grandkids say they want a EV when they are able to drive

[@glike2]

Big truck battery swapping or trailer batteries will be much cheaper than super expensive H2 fuel + fuel cell system

[@glike2]

Long range aviation will need H2 fuel, with SAF not scaling

[@TheEvilmooseofdoom]

@@glike2 batteries in trailers would be a big help but it will be many years coming. Hydrogen for aviation is crazy,

[@bxclent]

JCB has the right idea..... hydrogen for construction vehicles..... not so much for passenger vehicles

[@EnriqueThiele]

Even for that use it is too expensive.

[@mconnah1]

When I discuss this, I find most people do not realise hydrogen cars are electric cars… very inefficient electric cars…

[@apsmith1635]

Hydrogen is a good alternative for heavy duty equipment

[@captainjayc9217]

I believe a countries need to hedge their bets on energy storage. This makes sense for them to bet on both battery and hydrogen as energy storage -- just in case. We don't want to bet on one thing exclusively, and then a different thing turns out to be ahead, like what happened to Japan when they bet too much on hydrogen and ignored battery technology. A small country may only be able to bet on one thing because they don't have the resource to bet on too many things. But a large country should hedge their bet.

[@user-bd6cr4ni8t]

Why would anyone leave home to refuel the car?

[@FrancisFjordCupola]

Always been skeptical of hydrogen since at first I heard about how fossil fuel companies generated it. I wouldn't mind if we lived in an ideal world where hydrogen was created through renewables at supercheap prices, I just don't see it happening. Everything electric would be my preference at any rate since then everything could be connected up and be interchangeable. The main thing that fossil fuel companies have against electric is that one could theoretically put solar on the roof, wind in the garden or a plot land nearby and so on and be independent. Addiction is a two-way street. They cannot exist without us.

[@williamgraham6917]

The thing about hydrogen is it is up against EV + renewables. Even if some how they could in ten years reach the cost targets of EV, range and charge time targets of North American long haul that EVs are accomplishing today, EVs will have vastly improved their tech to even better performance and higher standards, while renewables will saturate the power grid with even cheaper, more reliable, energy. They can’t even come close to gasoline powered vehicles. I have asked several Hydrogen proponents about cost to consumer, and they are dead silent. Any business case for a consumer to adapt Hydrogen, chrickets, or “Oh that’s coming.” Try and find a Hydrogen powered bus project that is still operating beyond the special tax payer financing those projects get. I have not found one. Except one, hydrogen steel. That looks good, especially with the cost of solar dropping.

[@litestuffllc7249]

Your own video noted that the USGS has identified enough "white" gaseous hydrogen in the USA alone to provide all the energy needs of the world for hundreds of years. Consider the implications. If that is a reasourse that is cheaper to obtain than natural gas or oil; then; you will see a major gold rush to get these resources. Price and possibly ecological considerations may well move it into the drivers seat as the cheapest clean source of energy. Hydrogen can be used to generate electricity or distributed like natural gas; (possibly in natural gases lines) for heat or power in compressed tanks for ICE vehicles. An IF, a very plausible if.

[@randyjohnson3405]

I have to admit that I was sold on the fuel cell idea and hydrogen as the next automotive fuel. but, in the past decade there have been very few advancements in fuel cell technology. Whereas battery technology over the past decade is moving at a very fast rate. I now can't wait to be able to afford a Tesla and no longer have a desire for a Hydrogen car.

[@franciscoshi1968]

What they need to do is install enough hydrogen filling stations to make it viable to drive a hydrogen car. Once they have enough filling stations people can decide if they want to use hydrogen or charge at home. Until then they are wasting everyone's time.

[@AllDogsAreGoodDogs]

Hydrogen users (Toyota Mirai) have found that the cost of fuel equals or exceeds their car payment. So fossil fuel companies want you to buy the car twice.

[@travisjazzbo3490]

I wonder about the argument for hydrogen for things like long haul semis and the like vs electric given the weight of semis for electric and charge times etc

[@kng128]

There is already a concrete truck company in Australia that's doing battery swapping. It could be made similar to NIO where your nav system can see batteries available for swapping at the station and reserve them. Then fork lifts come and swap them in 10 minutes. And how large and heavy do the tanks need to be to store H2 at 750 bar (10,000 psi)?

[@travisjazzbo3490]

@@kng128 Hmmm.... I don't know what the long haul potential vs weight of hydrogen vs batteries are for long haul shipping via semis, but hydrogen can fill up like Diesel I would imagine. Are you suggesting switching out massive batteries in semis for long-haul trucking?

[@st4849]

HEV could be a good fit for apartment dwellers, but for ppl with their own driveways/chargers BEV can't be beaten. I haven't been to a gas station since 2020 and I can't see how could I have a hydrogen pump at my own house.

[@erktrek]

Maybe in 40 years when there are enough local hydrogen filling stations + infrastructure to support them AND the cost has come down to the stated $2 kg (US Hydrogen "Roadmap" goal) AND assuming battery tech never advances, EV prices remain high AND charging stations stop being built.. so no, not really a good fit at all.

[@joelado]

If you understand how crude oil is made into gasoline it would be obvious to you why oil companies want hydrogen to be the fuel of the future (and always will be). Oil companies in the process of bringing gasoline to the octane levels that are marketed to the public produce a lot of hydrogen. Hydrogen is also a byproduct of the refinement process in general. At most refineries hydrogen is either flared off (burnt) at their exhaust pipes or just vented into the air. Because it is the lightest gas, it quickly rises in the atmosphere and gets disbursed in the air. Because it is not considered harmful if breathed and isn't dangerous unless it is highly concentrated and mixed with the oxygen in the air, it is not considered a pollutant in most places. The reason that I know that hydrogen is a byproduct of oil refining is because in Richmond, California the refinery there sells its hydrogen to a company that repackages it for industrial uses. This discovery helped me connect the dots as to the reason oil companies put so much effort behind hydrogen. If they were to capture and package all the hydrogen produced at all their refineries they would be the biggest suppliers of hydrogen by a mile, therefore control the market. They can kill off natural gas steam reforming, which is the biggest way that hydrogen is produced today, with their oversupply. Green hydrogen could never truly compete with something that they previously thought of as a waste product and not a profit center. Having control over the hydrogen marketplace they could dictate prices so that it couldn't really compete with their primary products like gasoline. When governments would push for greener fuels they could push more hydrogen out the door, never allowing it to become the dominant fuel. In this way, they would make money from gasoline as well as from hydrogen. Right now I'm seeing a bunch of ads by oil companies pushing for carbon capture and sequestration (CCS). Something that we all know will never contribute significantly to solving the carbon crisis. Its impact is only tiny and its costs are ridiculously expensive. Oil companies are never an honest player in this space.

[@brandonhunter3036]

I was a bit confused at first by the comparison, but I still don’t see this as a THIS OR type discussion. 10 years ago, EV’s were still largely mythical in their claims. 10 years from now, I suspect (green) hydrogen will be one of our core fuel sources for many applications , along with EV. So I believe fossil fuels will be losing out either way.

[@leerizer]

Hydrogen transportation is too costly and difficult But hydrogen could be a great energy storage modal for unstanle RE generation

[@user-ni6le7hk9y]

Two up mate.

[@willeisinga2089]

Sam is Superman of Renewable Information.❤ Thank You Sam. Only thing. You never Talk about your own Rooftop Solar. How Many Panels do you have and how Much Money You make with your Rooftop Solar. I have 50 Panels in Groningen Nederland. Make a lot of Money with 11.000 kWh Production Every Year. Since 2012.

[@John-FourteenSix]

SuperSam the Viking Man… Wow! 50 panels is a lot. I think the limit in the UK is around 15, they don’t want you making money…

[@willeisinga2089]

@@John-FourteenSix why 50 Panels? In 2012 Wp was 200 Wp a Panel. Now it is 400 Wp. So I have 20 on the House in 2012. 4000 Wp. 3600 kWh per Year. In 2015 10 on the Garage. 250 Wp per Panel. 2400 kWh per Year. 6000 kWh per Year Total Production. 6000 kWh consume. No Gas. I let a House For the Tenant 10 panels Rooftop Solar in 2017. 300 Wp. 3000 kWh per Year. And in 2020 for the Tenant 10 panels 350 Wp. 3500 kWh per Year. Total 6500 kWh Every Year. Makes 50 Solar Panels for 2 Houses. In Groningen Nederland. In 2024 Wp is 400 Wp per Panel. Price in 2012 was 2 dollar per Wp. Now in 2024 the Price is 10 cent Wp. Check Alibaba Prices for Solar Panels. From 2 dollar Wp to 10 cent Wp. In 2012, I was one and only with Solar Rooftop. Now in 2024 we have 3 Million houses with Rooftop Solar. More to Come. 👍❤️🌹🌹🌹 Rooftop Solar has become Standard here. With 20 Panels Rooftop Solar You produce now 8000 kWh. Every Year. Cheap Clean Energy from the Sun on the Roof. The Tenant Pays me an Monthly Energy Bill. Thank you for respons.👍🌹🌹🌹

[@willeisinga2089]

@@John-FourteenSix Solar is Power to the People.👍☀️☀️☀️☀️☀️

[@willeisinga2089]

@@John-FourteenSix Solar Rooftop Power is also Political Power. Power to the People. 3 Million houses with Rooftop Solar is 6 Million votes for Net Metering. The Political Party for Net Metering, Salderen, has become the Greatest Party in Nederland. 6 Million votes for Salderen Rooftop Solar. 👍👍👍. The Laws will Change in favor of Rooftop Solar and Salderen. The profit of Solar stays in da House. Times they are achanging.🎶🎶🎶🎶☀️☀️☀️☀️☀️

[@AndyJHiscock]

How about this for an idea. Get local governance on the side of oil companies by converting from oil to Hydrogen production, distribution and sale - to regain control of the market preventing these pesky people charging at home How? By offering back handers to put maximum tariffs on all BEV import and the home market to convert to HEV production. So Legacy oil companies can get a captive demand for fuel demand and legacy car companies can say they are Zero Emissions.

[@FlipBoxStudio]

Many of those who fell for Toyota’s hydrogen fuel cell marketing and leased/bought one are now suing the company for it. Funny how it’s not being mentioned by mainstream media and auto enthusiast media like they do when there’s an EV or Tesla lawsuit.

[@jackden10]

What the end product when you burn hydrogen?

[@jaaklucas1329]

water....

[@linuxman7777]

The biggest problem with hydrogen is that to distribute it, we have to build new infrastructure. Whereas the power grid is already built. Hydrogen does have a place in power backup, although less efficient than Batteries and Pumped hydro, hydrogen is cheaper per kwh of energy storage. Hydrogen will still be viable as spacecraft fuel

[@mrmawson2438]

Morning mate

[@donschilling1066]

Who is going to buy a fuel that is 2 to 3times more expensive than petrol diesel plus have to service these motors eg oil changes timing etc.plus To add to all ofthis time to find a hydrogen stations

[@heavenlyReza]

I would say the same if i am an oil company lol The horse owners and dealers said the same when cars came about

[@Onlyme.n.u]

The only possible use of hydrogen in the future is in aviation industry, not automotive industry in my opinion.

[@hwirtwirt4500]

Like in the Hindenburg, Oh the humanity!

[@TheEvilmooseofdoom]

Aviation? That's just what it needs the most flammable substance out there stored at super high pressures. Only fools would get on those planes.

[@scoty_does]

Legacy auto wants hydrogen to succeed because it means continued maintenance income or half of their current business.

[@davidblah-7215]

9:11 In the United States, commercial vehicle drivers are regulated by the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration (FMCSA) under the Department of Transportation (DOT). According to the FMCSA hours-of-service (HOS) regulations, property-carrying commercial drivers are required to take a 30-minute break after driving for 8 consecutive hours. This rule is applied uniformly across all states in the U.S.

[@drivingforcebehindu]

Fueling or anything else on duty for 30 min counts as a break from driving . Definitely not 1 hr though

[@mariuskavaliauskas6649]

So driving a heavy truck for 8 hours straight, taking a 30 min break and driving again is safe? Really? What's the point of these regulations?

[@drivingforcebehindu]

​@@mariuskavaliauskas6649welcome to long haul trucking. Used to be worse. In Canada they can drive 13 hours per day not 11

[@Komorur]

Freight also includes ships, where you can't just stop and charge. In that regard, they're maybe right.

[@ObiePaddles]

Bit of a stretch from what they were saying.

[@nfzeta128]

If wave energy ever becomes efficient you'd be able to sail just using the elements, like we used to be able to at the smaller scale.

[@erktrek]

It's a good thing that ocean water doesn't degrade equipment on ships or anything. Also nice having storage tanks with liquid hydrogen and high maintenance support equipment because thats the only way to store amounts needed for months long voyages. Probably need some big batteries on board as well. For even more transport fun maybe ammonia is the way to go.. then you get the benefit of storing a toxic chemical with even less efficiency.

[@rogerfroud300]

You can't argue with them. They tell you it's a 'no brainer', green hydrogen is cheap and there are no emissions. They can't hear any arguments about end to end efficiency, or the convenience to refilling at home.

[@bepscamr152]

I wonder if governments around the world started mandating,subsidizing and offering rebates for hydrogen cars if they might grow in popularity ? If you replaced the word electric every time you said hydrogen if would make just as much sense.

[@kng128]

It doesn't make sense for hydrogen. Americans are already complaining about the electric charging infrastructure being built out from public money. hydrogen distribution is even more wasteful and costly.

[@petersimms4982]

Ohhhh it has an advantage, be beholden to oil companies, held ransom to buy hydrogen 😮 😢😢😢

[@mrmawson2438]

Cheers mate we all know the score

[@ren2704]

Anyone knows what would happen if we start to tap on all these white hydrogen deposits that are popping up every few months all over the world after prospection work?

[@mortenvollaug6530]

Takk!

[@sony5244]

Hydrogen will make us dependent on big oil Cos like it is now , hydrogen, petrol or diesel cars needs a fuel station and the supply chain that comes with that, but battery electricity will give us independence and freedom and they don't like that coz electricity can be generate from home solar, wind etc which is flexible.

[@paulmcgraw9284]

When the energy crises of the 1970s hit, I was a huge fan of hydrogen. After all, the supply is nearly infinite, right? Sure. However, trying to get the fuel from water is incredibly difficult and expensive. Now that EVs are more mainstream. It is undeniably the BEST way of getting away from fossil fuels. Hydrogen powered vehicles were a pipe dream in the 1970s. Given the complexity of producing hydrogen, they still are and it’ll probably be years before hydrogen is a viable alternative to EVs and iCE vehicles.😊

[@davidpickard9393]

Least Dollars will win

[@ilollipop100]

Excess energy... like in Australia where you have blackouts? Hmmm?

[@nfzeta128]

How do blackouts that happen for a plethora of reasons have anything to do with production levels of renewables?

[@nfzeta128]

A blackout is almost never because of energy deficiency.

[@johanjohansson2053]

Electrification and hydrogen are the same. H2 brings the energy tu us without sun and wind, and keeps wind and solar producing when no one wants the power H2 does not pass the lackmus test for vehicles either though (would you use it in a MBT for defence of your freedom?). Only diesel will do that

[@aduckquackquack5783]

Humanity is a Blight. Constantly finding new forms of chicanery.

[@michaelketley1252]

Quelle surprise! Hydrogen worked so well with Zeppelins…….

[@enriquegurria3947]

Green hydrogen makes sense for maritime & aerial transportation in the medium term. For terrestrial -cars, trucks, trains- electricity is the clear answer with many actual advantages in energy generation, storage and consumption. ICE companies are run for immediate profits and lack long term vision without state industrial policies. That’s the reason China is leading the green energy transition and the US oil_dollar_empire addiction makes its decline inevitable.

[@index6738]

Fuel cells make sense. Quick refill, long range, and generate electricity on demand. Still electric vehicle with all benefits ICE.

[@TheEvilmooseofdoom]

Long range? Quick fill is the ONLY thing offered.

[@index6738]

@@TheEvilmooseofdoom Toyota Miria HY EV can travel 1369 kilometres, 845 miles on single quick fill. Also no weight penalty in comparison to power point battery EV which excessively heavy prematurely scrub tyres creating elevated airborne particulate pollution.

[@rohankilby4499]

Well they would wouldn’t they 🤣