98,000 German workers furious after the truth about VW's ownership exposed

[@electricviking]

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[@philippebackprotips]

Rack up debt, move money to shareholders before the fall. What else to expect?

[@recreationalplutonium]

don't worry - there will be bailouts. german government is heavily invested in VW and there's a lot of shady shit going on. the german taxpayer is going to pay for the fuckups of VW's leadership

[@Martin-ut3ew]

@@oldmansailor I started to read but you lost me on the way, text is just too long

[@BAmalakas]

Dont forget goverenment to bail out bad debt

[@xcalibertrekker6693]

Then blame the workers for no one wanting to buy the overpriced trash they put out.

[@puppets.and.muppets]

yep. flee with the loot and put it into more property.

[@douginorlando6260]

$40,000 a day CEO demands workers take a serious pay cut. Meanwhile without cheap Russian energy, VW is going bankrupt

[@user-JM1337]

Yes, and push EVs on everyone while gutting nuclear power. What's the point having EV to save the environment if you're still using fossil?

[@scottersandman6408]

can you say money laundering?????

[@captainwin6333]

If they don't they could see the company bankrupted if they prefer.

[@avgjoe5969]

51million /year in dividends at this scale is nothing.... so suspend the dividend. Cut 15% for upper management and suspend bonuses... CEO should take 50% pay cut. Its the right thing to do and it won't change anything. They will still need to lay off 10% to make the 17 billion in savings. So just do it and let the unions come out with the next round of excuses... then sell off production equipment and put in EV equipment while production is stalled by the unions. Perfect the EV outside EU so you can hire and fire as needed (US?). Reopen plants one by one as they are converted. Open a new smaller VW... anyone caught out when the music stops... finds jobs in real estate.

[@Cidanandas108]

$40,000??????

[@davidoldboy5425]

Make them simple, make them affordable, make running costs and repairs low i.e. make a peoples car, did you forget VW? We don't want Android/Apple, electric handbrakes, systems that cost thousands to maintain, we want to get from A to B reliably, that is what you were founded on.

[@danielwarton5343]

Exactly. We don’t need loads of unnecessary tech. Just solid cars

[@stephenw2992]

Its why Toyota stole their market. Overly complicated expensive to maintain German cars are just a money pit.

[@danielwarton5343]

@@stephenw2992 I agree. Had an X3 and just kept spending on it and more problems were always there.

[@svendtveskg5719]

Yep! When I was a kid in the 60'ies, we had a Beetle 1200, our neighbours - two adults and three kids - had a Fiat 600, one Uncle/Aunt pair had a Prinz 4, another pair had a Lloyd. We all went where we wanted, when we wanted. We didn't need a 2 tonnes, airconditioned, 300 HP behemoth for that.

[@davidlindburg1921]

The bosses never take a haircut, RIP VW, great while it lasted.

[@konradcomrade4845]

Get the VW-Hierarchy from the Bosses down to +1_step above entry Level Engineers to the German Minimum wages salary level. Then ask the others for a 10% pay cut!

[@xcalibertrekker6693]

Why should they, they did so well leading the company into this great disaster, they should get bonuses is what they are no doubt asking for.

[@wisenber]

@@konradcomrade4845 "Get the VW-Hierarchy from the Bosses down to +1_step above entry Level Engineers to the German Minimum wages salary level. Then"....ewatch the company collapse inside a year because the 'Hierarchy' left for better paying jobs.

[@rcajavus8141]

from nazi concentration camps labour to dieselgate murdering 100 000 people with their emissions, yeah we really have nothing to miss or regret in vw failure. greed, profit and corruption, in only two letters, VW And lets not forget China tech transfer, its not China stealing tech, its western companies selling tech under its market value just to be "friendly" to CCP

[@4evertrue830]

The German govt should be blamed for this as well. Why give $billions financially to VW over decades and not own a considerable large equity stake in the company as leverage in case of situations like this happening? All that money has gone into the pockets of rich, wealthy shareholders and not for R&D, to solve over production of its vehicles and opening new markets especially in developing economies. For example, most countries in africa don't have a VW plant but people drive a lot of VW cars.

[@mikofi]

Well - there was a very famouls man who was the creator of the VW company. He was the chancellor of Germany and his goal was to create a company, which would produce simple cars, that would be affordable to an average German. Turns out - the company changed the direction and forgot why it was created in the first place.

[@I_fuck_moms_of_CIA_trolls.]

Was it "famous" or notorious?

[@EdWimble]

I don't think Volkswagen ever made a 'peoples car' for the people all the time Hitler was in charge during WW2 even though the people were making their payments. VW made Kubelwagens and Schwimwagens for the German military instead while Ferdinand Porsche was off on his flights of fancy building 'war winning' tanks such as the Porsche Tiger, and Maus. It was only after the war, when the British got the Wolfsburg factory up and running that it began producing actual cars and only then to give military officers a convenient and reasonably comfortable means of transport while occupying the country. In typical British fashion regarding lack of foresight, the powers that be decided VW wasn't a good bet so gave it back to the Germans to run.

[@klausadrift7568]

Sounds all too familiar, There was once a famous PM in Singapore, who in the country's earlier years provided affordable housing for everyone. Now the cost of a flat runs in the multiple hundreds of thousand and it takes two generations to pay it off.

[@roberturbanowicz4688]

Now they are making way-overpriced shitboxes that brake all the time. I wonder why people don't buy them?

[@mikofi]

@@EdWimble It's true that actually mass production started after the war. The idea however was really good and the company was a major success.

[@johntonge9818]

It's not just VW. All car companies have gone through their car designs and replaced many metal components with plastic. None of them want cars and trucks to last 200,000 miles. They want to sell you a new one.

[@pdx27]

Exactly. They used to make great cars. I have a 1993 Passat with some 300.000 km on the clock. The engine runs very smoothly and won't fail anytime soon. Now think how big the environmental savings from not building a new car are... of course this is not factored in when the EU zealots tell us to get rid of combustion engines...

[@WithmeVerissimusWhostoned]

greed just greed

[@kerriwilson7732]

And too stupid to grasp that after their customers are disappointed by the vw, they will buy a Toyota.

[@MrHaggyy]

A lot of the platic parts are for recycling regulations. Recycling of metal is very expensive as you need to boil the old alloy to make new alloy for smelting.

[@tragiclife9760]

I agree that they want to sell you a new one, that’s why they are in business, but the fact is just about any car being produced now will make is past 200000 with regular maintenance people hate on Kia’s , but my 09 spectra has 330000 and runs like the day I drove it off the lot , I will say though VWs are among the ones that won’t ,

[@davidlewis4399]

Expensive cars and the green EV mandate = poor car sales simple.

[@FakeSchrodingersCat]

Sure but it was the executives choice to only make expensive EVs. A decent percentage of the cost of a available EVs are luxury gadgets to make the car feel futuristic if they had an actual basic version they would be selling like hotcakes why do you think all the automakers are so panicked about even the idea of Chinese EVs entering the NA or EU markets. Peoples wages have been stagnant for decades they can't afford 60k for a car when they can get a basic ICE vehicle for 25k. EVs need 4 things only, a decent range, fast charging, air conditioning and power windows miss any of those and yes sales will probably suffer but they don't need a navigational system/game console, back up cameras, self opening doors, autopilot or RGB lighting on the base model, and they certainly don't need anything that requires a monthly subscription to use. Sure Chinese labour costs are lower but if you do the math it only saves around $10,000 per car so why is the average Chinese EV $20,000 (which are what the Chinese companies are were trying to import, and would pass NA and EU safety standards) but the cheapest available EV in the west $40,000, if it was just labour cost shouldn't they be at most $30,000.

[@ericaugust1501]

that doesn't even matter. if you are paying such massive dividends out, whilst losing money.... thats a ponzi scheme, not a business.

[@lattelandlatteland]

if they made good smaller EVs like say tesla, VW would be doing fine. They way overfocused on huge gas and ev cars - it's easier to make money on big expensive cars, if you can find enough customers. much harder to make money on cheaper cars, requires efficiency. Notice that vw's Gas & Diesel cars are also not selling well! It's not evs. It's bad vehicle market model choices.

[@TurdFergusen]

@@FakeSchrodingersCatevery EV they sell is a loss of a sale of a profitable ICE car… self cannibalisation

[@teekay_1]

Yes, Europe is committing suicide trying to stop the climate from changing. There is no force on earth that can stop the climate from changing.

[@turriffterror3881]

Shareholders lining their pockets while the company collapses. Seen it happen so many times.

[@teekay_1]

The shareholders are the owners of the business. That is their right to do that.

[@Pestbringer89]

@@teekay_1 We should change that. Make the workers the owners, one share for everyone, in an election you can elect a ceo for 4 years, like you know, a democracy.

[@VilleWitt]

@@Pestbringer89Tried before. Doesn’t work like one would expect.

[@turriffterror3881]

@@teekay_1 They also have the right to forgo their dividend. But no, when the company that has rewarded them generously for decades is in trouble, they continue to line their pockets while expecting the workforce to take a pay cut. Disgusting.

[@williamgordon2919]

Owning shares is supposed to come with risk. Take the bad times along with the good. Unfortunately the top guys don't see it that way. They work on the premise they always have it good. Germany is a slave nation of low pay, the reason it's gdp is high is because of the enormous amounts the elite steal for themselves.

[@AJ-qn6gd]

If VW are billions in debt why have they been paying dividends ? They’re basically borrowing money to pay dividends, I thought dividends were to reward for making a profit 🤔🇬🇧

[@larsnystrom6698]

Because they don't want to loose all stock holders and make their value plunge, I would assume. It's not unusual to maintain dividends at a reasonable level to bridge a temporary drop in profits. Sometimes it isn't temporary, though, and the stock owners regret not selling with a loss 🙂

[@tomfahey2823]

The ability of a company to raise capital through the sale of shares is linked to its stock price twofold: firstly, a higher share price will mean that they raise more money for a given number of shares sold. Secondly, a rising share price will normally incentivise more investors to invest, raising income from share sales. Conversely, a falling share price will normally incentivise less investors to invest, reducing income. Reducing the dividend rate will cause their current shareholders to sell, causing the share price to go down and thus their income from sales of additional shares. If you're the CEO of a failing business looking at your balance sheet, where you're $200Bn in debt, you're receiving $20Bn a year in sales of shares and paying out $4.5Bn in dividends and * $47Bn * a year in wages and salaries, what do you think makes more sense in terms of keeping the business afloat? Continuing to pay out the $4.5Bn in dividends, in the hope that you continue to maintain that $20Bn income, or dropping it so that you can spend the extra $4.7Bn a year on wages (using debt, of course - at probably 3-4% interest). The fact that the workers don't get that they're actually destroying the company with their demands is simply bizarre.

[@BOC-s3t]

@@larsnystrom6698 The problem is they have been paying them for 10 years which means over 500 million, whilst VW have been accumulating more and more debt!

[@mikenielsen3971]

Effectively dividends are bribes for shareholders to retain the stock as these companies are typically no longer growth companies. Companies that get very large can’t grow in the percentage that small companies could so the possible percentage rise in stock price just can’t be matched so the only reason to hold a big company stock would be that dividend incentive.

[@tomfahey2823]

​​​​​@@BOC-s3tThey spend 10% in dividends ($4.5Bn) of what they do on wages ($47Bn) each year, which helps them to bring in $20Bn in income through sale of shares. Maintaining a net $15.5Bn annual income when you're $200Bn in debt seems financially smart to meet, as opposed to borrowing even more money (at increasingly higher interest rates) to spend more on wages.

[@RicTheAzorean]

It is carefully crafted Class Warfare. Once you understand that, it all makes sense. Poor people pay, and rich people do not pay.

[@jamesbrundret1726]

Beautifully put. 100 percent correct!

[@JoeyBlogs007]

Rubbish. Union rubbish. Replace them with robots.

[@JoeyBlogs007]

Private companies are not a sheltered workshop social service.

[@JoeyBlogs007]

Private companies are not a sheltered workshop social service.

[@NabPunk]

@@JoeyBlogs007 I am sure it's far easier to replace you with robots, I mean keyboard-warrior bots already exist.

[@Corsa15DT]

just one thing, if vw storing thousands of unsold vehicles, why the golf is twice the price of 2019? bring back the precorona prices!

[@billdavenport8228]

I looked at a Tiguan when I traded last month and understand why VW is in trouble. $40k for a half plastic engine with questionable longevity and $10k more than its competitors at that trim level. Nice, smooth ride though but not for the price.

[@Species-lj8wh]

And the ID-Buzz 60k starting for a minivan with less than 200 mile range @ 70mph.

[@SimonLloydGuitar]

Same as Mercedes. Have you seen their 'leather' seats? The bolsers, swabs, backs and sides are made from plastic. Only the seat cushion is leather...Pure junk. then the metal trim that is actually plastic wrapped in foil

[@bradwick212]

Then you did not not look closer, the engine is made with cast iron, and if you want plastic just open the hood on any Japanese car, my Mazda is the epitome of plastic and the engine is all aluminum won’t last anywhere near as long as cast iron. But hey there is. Thing called maintenance.

[@xcalibertrekker6693]

@@bradwick212 I would rather have aluminum then cast iron anyway. ALL cars are loaded with plastics now anyways, not sure why you are targeting japan.

[@NormanStansfield1]

Germans and others are using all this plastic crap in engines like valve covers that crack. Stupid. All EV's are even dumber. Like driving around in a microwave.

[@EdWong-p8m]

VW can't simply blame Chinese competition; its cars are not selling well in the US either, with no Chinese cars being sold in the US.

[@FrankiePo89]

They'll simply spit nonsense to deflect responsibilities.

[@midcenturymodern9330]

Buicks sold in the US are made in China.

[@midcenturymodern9330]

@@FrankiePo89 What responsibilities and for what?

[@thetruth7633]

Quality of the cars to blame, would not even trust Japanese car anymore

[@FrankiePo89]

@@midcenturymodern9330 Did you read the op?

[@RussInGA]

10% cut for all workers at VW, 50% for the executives until that 10% plus 10% is restored. This is what I think the workers should demand.

[@RussInGA]

also NO EXECUTIVE BONUSES

[@HJPorschen]

"You have to work harder" the animals were told, so that the pigs could live in extreme comfort (Animal Farm by George Orwell, 1945). A 'bonus' of a million Euros (which is not unusual) means that this person gets almost two Euros (exactly 1.90, or more than 1.89 in a leap year) every single minute of the year, day and night! Nobody, exactly nobody in this world can work so much and so hard that he deserves this amount of money. But many get even more...

[@wisenber]

"You have to work harder" the animals were told," VW employees were told they would need to work less or have more layoffs. There isn't enough work for the number of German made VWs they're selling.

[@stevewhitmill2037]

Excellent.

[@MrTrda]

🎯

[@hungrysurfer9471]

@@wisenber Would orders for 5 million cars per year from Russia help to solve the 60% utilisation problem ? Germany used to produce and sell 6 million cars until 2022. Then they halved production to 3 million and a further 1 million cut in subsidiary EU country factories hence the 60% utilisation. Allow cars exports to Russia again and German EU factories will be at over 90% near full production.

[@wisenber]

@@hungrysurfer9471 "Would orders for 5 million cars per year from Russia help to solve the 60% utilisation problem ?" Russia never bought that many German cars. "Germany used to produce and sell 6 million cars until 2022." Actually, it was 2020. COVID killed production more than the war in Ukraine.

[@JasonLowderTheRanga]

Why is the board still there? Every single one of them should be dismissed, along with the C level. There is no way this was a surprise.

How can that be? They are paid the big bucks to attract the best talent. Surely, they can't be crap at their jobs!

[@ZelenoJabko]

The government needs to get out of the stock.

[@urimtefiki226]

I was naive beleiving the the West appriciates the wisdom, when I encoutered them I understood with kind of highest criminality I had to deal, they even steal inventions like my algorithm which they are making trillions now with Nvidia. Now our politicians here I see like nothing with their criminality, they are only small rats in comparison with biggest mafia in the world stealing inventions.

[@stratman9449]

the door of directors and management at VWs is a revolving door in the last 10 to 15 years....

[@sierraecho884]

The board is 40% gov. apointed, the giv holds most stocks.

[@mitebcool]

So all the profits they made in the last 100 years are completely gone and all they have is 200b debt? It's completely insane.

[@adamiskandar5107]

What they took out is gone forever. They will never reinvest into a failing company. That the beauty of Capitalism for the Capitalists.

[@tigading2177]

Not completely gone dear, just in different pockets and off shore accounts. LMAO! Welcome to capitalism!

[@eish3291]

It,s called asset stripping in which almost all the cash has been paid out to shareholders while then loading up the company with debt.

[@mikemalone9678]

The Capitalists have sucked the wealth out of the company. The state will pay to try to clean up the mess.

[@stratman9449]

typical government socialist project "gravy train"...cheers from.....germany.

[@IO-zz2xy]

VW have forgotten what the name of the company means. Peoples car. It was conceived as an affordable car for the ordinary folk but it has become a very expensive vehicle full of (like many others) electronic gizmos and unrepairable by the owner. Spares are expensive as well. Who cares if they collapse. Greed will always get them in the end. Long live Japanese, Chinese and Indian vehicle manufacturers. Observations from South Africa

[@waynerussell6401]

People over look that the People's car was a scam. Hitler laid the foundation stone of Wolfsburg and took money in a 'savings scheme' for a cheap car which was spent on military production. VW property had four concentration camps and eight forced-labor camps for its 'work force'. The demise of the VW empire that has always made its own rules, will be greatly welcomed by many nationalities. The Germans have a word for it - schadenfreude, followed by weltschmerz.

[@alanwann9318]

@@IO-zz2xy if a basic car is presented to the market like the beatle was?

[@alexprach]

@@alanwann9318 That's why VW also own Skoda and Seat for the more basic cars and share chassis and engines. But rules around safety means there will always be a bare minimum.

[@strangersound]

I was going to comment the same thing, but you said it better by quoting the original intent of the brand. It also needs to a small displacement combustion engine built to last 500k miles. Basically, bring back the Bug. Reduce the whole lineup to variants of the Bug and bring back a retro styled version of the VW Bus. That would save the company and possibly see them regain the title of most cars sold. And what a lot of people need to realize, what's killing the automobile industry is not just poor management, it's the crushing weight of the bureaucracy. Basic safety: Yes. The rest? No.

[@markevans5892]

Problem is they almost went bust years ago making people’s cars!

[@Mybwain]

Governments forcing electric car sales targets to manufacturers, increasing tariffs on Chinese cars and China owning majority of the global cobalt mining capability all add up to problems

[@phillipanderson9925]

Executive salaries have been a problem for years Same as politicians They get paid millions for underperforming and there answers are always the same the biggest cost is people get rid of them it’s a mba training problem Where as instead of having people work up the chain to understand the business But no it’s a diversity or a job for the mates situation

[@bootneck401664]

They’ll be in even more debt once these PCP scams have to be payed out in the UK too 😂😂😂

[@bilbodeke1]

Why does this remind me so much of what happened to the British car industry

[@Bow-to-the-absurd]

Everything gets a return

[@chesshooligan1282]

And motorcycle industry as well.

[@jacquelinebrunder2384]

Because the same bankers are at the top making money out of the destruction.

[@ZelenoJabko]

But British really are incompetent, so that does not make me surprised

[@lg_believe333]

That’s what I was thinking. It’s surreal.

[@timshort9692]

I actually think the crisis brings clarity to the standoffs: everyone needs to concede or the whole organization goes down. Full stop.

[@stefandjordjevic9]

When European car makers started making lower-quality, cheaper cars, people realized they could get the same quality for less money from China. The problem is that by cutting quality, European brands lost their edge, making Chinese cars a more attractive option. End

[@christofferbrandel6491]

Not really. Chinese cars are just better. They used to suck, but not anymore.

[@glpilpi6209]

As soon as they've put everyone else out of business the quality will drop like a stone and the prices will increase.

[@rolandkel7696]

If you don’t have the orders to keep manufacturing plants going, you have to shut these down.

[@stratman9449]

it's as simple as that

[@GH-te1no]

Who is the second biggest shareholder with 20 % of the shares? Yes, the state - with all the implications that come with it, like above average wages, politicians in boards who are equally responsible etc. Funny how this never gets mentioned.

[@mikemalone9678]

But the state is not the biggest shareholder, right? And the state do not make the design decisions that have led to this crisis. Quite simply, their has long been a mismatch between the types and reliability of VW cars and the marketplace Due to management decisions.

[@ISuperTed]

Porsche family have majority voting rights, they can override anyone else’s decisions.

[@GH-te1no]

@@mikemalone9678 The state has a massive influence, that is undeniable. And the example VW shows that it makes companies worse, not better. And yes, the politicians do influence the strategy because they claim to know better what the customers want and put a lot of constraints on companies. Instead of being invested in a private company the state should fund technology open research, and not prescribe that electric cars are the only solution. The free market ecenomy with ample competition provides the best results for a society. The socialistic notions that are so very popular produce so much more harm on a langer scale. But it of course provides politicians more oppurtunities to meddle.

[@wisenber]

@@mikemalone9678 "But the state is not the biggest shareholder, right?" Lower Saxony has more than just voting rights. It also has taxing and zoning authority over VW. "And the state do not make the design decisions" Boards do make decisions that shape those. "Quite simply, their has long been a mismatch between the types and reliability of VW" If you call two years "long", sure.

[@wishteria234]

@@GH-te1no Absolutely correct.

[@brokeboy87]

Why are they surprised Stellantis CEO ran the company into the group and still got a golden parachute.

[@calorus]

*ground but, yep!

[@Longtack55]

The golden handshake was agreed before the demise.

[@mikemalone9678]

Which is one of the things wrong. Suceed or fail, corporate bosses will benefit.

[@mb-3faze]

@@Longtack55 I.E. he had no incentive to succeed at all.

[@ISuperTed]

⁠@@Longtack55Exactly the issue - the contracts they give CEO’s are ridiculous, there’s no risk to them other than not getting huge bonuses/share options on top of huge packages. One day companies will wise up.

[@KenSiebring]

lol the top end will never take a cut let alone the owners helping to bail out the group . If the workers end up taking a cut the management will get bonuses for it happening ……,

[@SP-ts1ig]

One dead CEO in the US made a huge change in this week in Health sector

[@serdiefgotreb]

@@SP-ts1ig which huge change may I ask? Nothing changed

[@DustinHoward-xh9sl]

Shareholders don't care about the success or failure of a company. They will milk it to death and move on.

[@sierraecho884]

Milking it to death means shareholders lose money....How does that make any sense ? For me to make money on something it was to gain in wealth not fall.

[@patrickcannell2258]

Why I hate the stock exchange! Greed.

[@sierraecho884]

@@patrickcannell2258 It was one of the best inventions ever .All humans can participate equally in a business opportunity. No one pay more for stocks than the other man, it´s perfectly democratic and it creates jobs.

[@DustinHoward-xh9sl]

@@sierraecho884 When you are being paid dividends all you really care about is the profit margins from which you get a share. This is not like like buying shares to sell at a later date in the hopes that they will be worth more than you paid for them.

[@ImMrEm]

Factory workers have little to no bargaining power based on the value of their input. That does not excuse management’s low quality decisions. Also, what about deception? We’re all self interested and the management-shareholder interest conflict has always been.

[@richardwong2950]

There is a recent British newspaper headline that China controls 74% of the world's EV market. That's true, but it does not tell you that most EVs are driven in China.

[@XenonJohnD]

For now. Once they are cheaper than ICE cars, which actually they already are if you remove import tariffs, money will do the talking.

[@ItShouldBeFun]

On world level, 76.67 million cars were sold 2023, of which only 13.8 million were electric (INCLUDING HYBRIDS). EU=11.14M cars / 2.45M electric/hybrid cars (In 2023, BYD sold 15,644 electric vehicles in the region making it 0.14% market share in EU) China=21.32M cars / 8.1M electric/hybrid cars USA= 14.63M cars / 1.39M electric/hybrid cars

[@glowwurm9365]

@@ItShouldBeFunApparently nobody buying EVs, yet the numbers for EV sales as a percentage of overall sales just keeps rising…

[@ItShouldBeFun]

@@glowwurm9365 Of course, most manifacturers have to go towards ev or other green alternatives due to political policies, hence it will go up.

[@schwags1969]

@@ItShouldBeFun Go look where the stockpile of CCP EV's are sitting, SerpentZA did a VERY informative video about that bs scam. Follow the money, not the numbers/units.

[@sonnylatchstring]

Volkswagen has $190 billion in debt in 2024 and the main shareholders have received $520 million in dividends in 10 years, says the union. If they had not received that dividend, the debt would be "only" $189.5 billion. It is forgotten that those same shareholders have seen the price of each share drop by $100 in the past 10 years from $186 to $86 now. In short, everyone has lost out to Volkswagen!

[@larrygerfen2801]

Management makes those decisions for dividends to shareholders. I’m sure mgmt continues dividends as shareholders would sell and stock price tank. If business is tanking top management needs to be replaced and new executives pay based mostly on performance.

[@halitosis75]

The workers always lose out. The executives never do, regardless of the financial climate

[@CB-ob5fr]

@@halitosis75 The "workes" have been paid above market salaries and now that the party is over, they actually demand a 7% increase while to company is in crisis. The fact that unions and the government are so strong at VW will kill this company midterm sadly

[@halitosis75]

@CB-ob5fr I take it, you work for that revolting company. Spoken like a true executive

[@lightweight1974]

​@halitosis75 The wealthy, politicians, CEO's, and Executive classes never miss a meal during hard times. It's the working class, a guy with 3 kids, mortgage, and auto loan who's family goes hungry when the economy takes a stxt. Same shxt, different century. Anyone who knows their history knows how bankers and ultra wealthy solve these economic crisis.

[@scoobyflew]

This is what happens when you governments get involved in commerce and companies ignore their customers.

[@mikemalone9678]

Government are always involved in commerce. Your latter point is the cause of VW's problems. Incompetent management resting on the laurels of previous company success, while sucking wealth out of the company.

[@darthkek1953]

The government ownership and seats don't help, nor does siding with Ukraine, but this all ultimately stems from the diesel emissions rigging. That cost them $50b directly and shrank their sales.

[@mikemalone9678]

@@darthkek1953 State ownership is irrelevant, because they are not responsible for the poor design decisions made by VW management. Not the diesel emissions scandal, also due to management, not state decisions. The state of Saxony did not make the decision to support Ukraine either. The German Federal government did. Which was, and remains, the correct decision.

[@mikemalone9678]

@@darthkek1953 State ownership is irrelevant, because they are not responsible for the poor design decisions made by VW management. Not the diesel emissions scandal, also due to management, not state decisions. The state of Saxony did not make the decision to support Ukraine either. The German Federal government did. Which was, and remains, the correct decision.

[@darthkek1953]

@@mikemalone9678 it was an insane decision that will see the German people impoverished. And the last time that happed 300 thousand Jews were slaughtered.

[@hariseldon3786]

Yeah - I am generally speaking a capitalist - but I am not a NEO-Capitalist - which is seems the management of VW is. It is disgusting that the management and shareholders "Over-Earn" - what does that mean? Despite my Doctorate in Business Administration I really don't know but I do know that it doesn't mean that you bleed the very people who actually make the business work. If it means that BOTH - and I repeat that - BOTH - need to take the hit then that's life... but the board and major shareholders need to share the pain.

[@martinhovorka69]

You think they're is any kind of fairness, it is all profits for me, all costs for thee.

[@teekay_1]

Everybody at heart is a capitalist. It's actually the normal order of things.

[@darthkek1953]

VW is relatively socialist, the state owns 20% and the state has multiple politicians sitting on the board.

[@HNedel]

The workers also „over earn“, their tariff is the best in germany, way above the average.

[@oov55]

You know this - but I will say it. As long as you TRADE the shares ...you can leave with no responsibility. Yes , there are different "types" of shares...some of which cannot be thrown into a market quickly so you can exit without too much damage. However, the end result is the same thing, for the majority of shareholders... they can get market value immediately...and disappear, or they can resign from the board and get a % of their "share's values" within reasonable time using 'buy back' by the existing Board etc etc .= or any other condition on how the shares are "exercised". The final result is the same... either immediately, or with some delay, or with some reduction in value...the 'Management Shares' can be turned into money for a 'Manager' who can then run away... maybe with less than expected...but with plenty of cash, in general. The Workers, when the collapse comes...get minimal reward, if any...and if the collapse is dramatic, then the Workers only get Government Redundancy pay, which is a token amount to stop your personal household imploding within a few months. The people that take the maximum Rewards ..of a successful, or failing Company take incredible value OUT of the Company...through to its death. That is the reality of unfairness, instability, weak Law, self-interest and ... greed.

[@andrewturner6642]

I remember years ago in America when the board of some company persuaded their staff to take a pay cut then soon after awarded themselves big bonuses.

[@johndoyle4723]

Many pension providers are shareholders and rely on dividends, they will rapidly disinvest if they do not get adequate returns. Hope they get it resolved for everyone involved,look what happened to the UK car industry.

[@Perra1901]

Happened just after the beerflu in the Swedish power business. Electricity go so expensive that we could not pay for it. then we got a pay back from the govermment. Next year we get to pay for the wires going from sweden down to brussel and back. as all OUR electricity is sold to eu then bought back for a higher price (EU are just extorting us and everybody else and we cant do anything) It is what it is.

[@joem0088]

Has to do with the legacies of VW. They have too much non-future proof assets and HR. Sailing straight into obsolence.

[@Thebuilder-v7q]

Start at the top,that’s who takes all the money, the workers are getting the scraps that fall off the table

[@Steve-co1ic]

The whole financial system is out of wack, how can it be right for individuals to accumulate $50'000'000'000 while people who work cannot afford to pay rent and feed their family

[@ISuperTed]

I’m afraid it’s a Ponzi scheme - the top become billionaires while the rest suffer.

[@wisenber]

" how can it be right for individuals to accumulate $50'000'000'000" It's called a bell curve. In more capitalist countries, private investors tend to make that. In authoritarian regimes, the ruling party gets it.

[@davidbeppler3032]

You are talking about Elon? Easily. He was told to take a bankrupt company that was closing and turn it into the biggest car company in the world. If he failed he gets nothing. If he succeeded he gets 303 million shares. Then Tesla bought $5.2 billion dollars in shares. Now 7 years later those shares are worth $56 billion. Those are his 303 million shares, he earned them. Now they are arguing about paying him because the shares are worth more than when Tesla bought them.

[@Nick-io9uk]

@@wisenber uhuh, so whats in the middle of the bell

[@wishteria234]

@@Nick-io9uk In socialism and communism you have the rich and poor even more than in capitalism, our governments have become corrupt and have cu out the middle class which would have been the middle of the bell curve.

[@TheresaCelik]

*Excellent analysis, I have never seen an analysis as well structured as yours. Look, I have been investing in Bitcoin ETFs and other dividend income since 2020, I have a total of 734 thousand dollars, with my 83 thousand I am very grateful for all the knowledge and information you have given me.*

[@Rickcole6]

6 months, $17k invested and almost there too!! Next year, I'll reach $185k.

[@jonbonjovi115]

And what have you been doing during this time? Trading or maintaining?

[@IscoAlacaon]

Buy and hold is risky because no one knows what the market will be like in the future, so it is better to trade rather than buy and hold, because in the process of buying and holding you can lose everything when the price falls against your expectations.

[@DonnaGrznowski]

How did you do this please? I am new to investing in cryptocurrencies, can you please guide me on how to do this?

[@Colleencox804]

It is advisable to seek professional guidance when creating a solid financial portfolio due to its complexity.

[@PeterBuckingham-s2j]

Governments forcing EV mandates followed by customers not buying ev's is the reason for this.

[@mikemalone9678]

94% of new car sales in Norway are EVs. People want EVs. VW has not been able to design an EV that people want.

[@travsmac]

@@mikemalone9678Norway buys EVs because of enormous government subsidies… which are covered by their enormous oil reserves, of which the government is the biggest shareholder.

[@sickgit66]

That's a big part of it for sure, but energy costs have gone up, poor management lining their pockets, government subsidy changes, cheap chinese imports, plus more green laws looming, the list goes on.

[@roch145]

@@travsmacExactly. Norway is wealthy totally due to their vast riches of evil and filthy hydrocarbons. They also have very strict immigration regulations thus preventing the exploitation of their very lucrative government sponsored social and economic programs. The Norwegian government wants EV’s on the roads and they are paying for over half the cost of the purchase price of an EV. They have also funded a massive buildout of the charging network. It’s oil wealth, government programs and subsidies that lead to EV success in Norway. Take those away and EV sales in Norway would collapse.

[@teekay_1]

@@mikemalone9678 Maybe in Norway, but it's an insular little country that takes money from people who work and gives it to people who want an EV. Plus, they heavily tax non-EVs.

[@Iconoclastik-g2g]

No dividends for shareholders for five years,locked shares to prevent sale of shares over that period.

[@wolfgangpreier9160]

I do not trust ANY company giving dividends. They do not trust themselves. Why should i?

[@george11419]

VW has become a lame duck. Just like British car manufacturers of 50 years ago. VW needs to shrink its balance sheet by disposing factories that oversupply the market.

[@Malcky-f7l]

It does not work that way, sorry to say.

[@markjonz]

@@wolfgangpreier9160 because there's no real chance for significant future growth but they're still very profitable. Mature industries like oil, mining etc.

[@ZelenoJabko]

No dividends, I agree. Pay debt first. But prevention of sales of shares, get out of the kitchen, you closet commie! 😂

[@mikecawthorn7806]

Big changes coming ppl, this will effect many things like when the car came and horses n carts were replaced . Tesla makes a car in around 10 man hours VW in 30 man hrs. Why less parts , new whole moulded sections less factory space and factory diect sales. EG Theres over 1000 parts to make a 4 cylinder ice , probably about 10 in EV. To stay in business they will have to let go 60% of their workers. Think about that as a flow through in an economy. BIG CHANGES COMING.

[@georgeszilva1223]

Cheating with emissions for diesel cars was the nail in the coffin for me.

[@stratman9449]

just one of many nails in lots of coffins.....

[@teekay_1]

I thought it was brilliant because the diesel emission standards were made artificially low. Those standards ironically made these cars use *more* fuel because their mileage went down. So while the tailpipe emissions went down the emissions overall went up because more fuel was being burned.

[@doodlegassum6959]

On the plus side, my coal shares went up today

[@keyzervega]

Car companies have been maximizing profits for years

[@marcusjenkins]

Don't mess with German works councils! I've worked in Germany and loved it. Shame about the few months of cloud and rain every year.

[@wolfgangpreier9160]

Yes, those 13 months every year will go by and then sunshine and happy smiles everywhere in Schlaraffenland.

[@HNedel]

You mean like the german workers councils saved the coal and steel industry? Oh that’s right, they didn’t! They protracted layoffs and cost optimization for too long and then the collapse was inevitable. Same is happening now in the auto industry. Overcapacity has been an issue for years, yet the workers council has ignored it and demanded 7-10% increase in salaries for years, reducing work hours at the same time.

[@wolfgangpreier9160]

@@HNedel They soon will have the ultimate reduction in working hours if they do not reduce their demands.

[@radeksparowski7174]

private profits, solidarly shared losses.....the first one for the right people, the second for all the suckers...

[@jimrusch22]

Not just VW but most large companies.

[@JZsBFF]

Most largest companies? ALL companies cheat on their staff AND the customers. That's how capitalism works.

[@lighthousesaunders7242]

70% of VW's debt (roughly $280 billion out of $400 billion total debt) could be attributed to financial services, particularly auto loans and leases. This debt generates interest income, supports sales by making vehicles more accessible through financing, and has assets (the loans themselves) backing it. Mentioning VW's total debt without mentioning this is misleading.

[@hsonday]

How come nobody realises that cutting off cheap energy from Russia is at the core of VW collapse?

[@mikemalone9678]

No, it is not. VW simply cannot sell the vehicles they produce, because the market for the vehicles they manufacture is shrinking. They stuck with overpriced, over-engineere, ICE vehicles for too long, and the World is passing them by.

[@deviantan021]

They are pretending it is not the case.

[@jogana6909]

Ursula said “why Europe doesn't import CHEAPER natural gas from the US?"

[@jackboychuk1281]

@@jogana6909 absolutely polititions allow the country to be destroyed, energy is key to manufacturing

[@avarga99]

because it is only part of the problem? It doesn't really explain why their cars don't sell in China.

[@BarthoDeGroot-jx4tm]

This EV "revolution" is just Fantastic!

[@dougm659]

Inevitable is what it is but the old guard were fast asleep while Elon took charge (pardon the pun)

[@shredhead67]

@@dougm659 The idea of electric vehicles is still fundamentally flawed until we have sustainable clean energy. It's for gullible people who have no idea where our energy comes from and comes with a hefty price tag to reap as much as they can from those stupid enough to buy into the lie. That and the kind of people telling you all about it typically do so from a foreign nation that they flew into along with 40 plus other representatives. Imagine that.... dumping so much carbon into the atmosphere to get some good PR all the while having the gaul of telling everyone else not to. In short it's a fucking circus and way too many of the crowd have started participation.

[@wolfgangpreier9160]

@@dougm659 Not fast asleep. In German we call it "Vogel Strauß Politik". Stick your head in the sand and pretend that the predator will not eat you. If you do not see him, he does not see you.

[@markjonz]

So we're supposed to cling on to dinosaur tech to try maintain employment? Never worked in the past for very long before the whole thing collapsed.

[@ISuperTed]

It’s the lack off decent EV’s that was and still is the problem for VW. China is 50% plus EV, the world’s biggest auto market. VW can’t sell their EV’s there.

[@johnwilson5743]

Both VW and Toyota are in the same situation re the future viability of their business. They both have high numbers of factories that are grossly overvalued on their balance sheets. They both have finance debts of close to $200 BILLION USD. They both have dealerships that will be a Millstone around their necks, representing their method of selling to the public. They both are not vertically integrated in manufactering and rely on contracted out parts suppliers. They both have failed miserably in software integration into their vehicles and are desperately attempting to buy such expertise from mainly Chinese NEV Companies. (Via "partnerships") The German Auto Companies are greatly hamstrung by laws regarding Unions and what they can and can't do regarding divesting employees. Remember, BMW and Daimler/Mercedes, Porsche and Audi etc will all have the same problems. Sadly, in the words of that great philosopher, Maxwell Smart, "It don't look good, Chief".

[@AlJay0032]

There is a huge difference between Toyota and VW. While VW made EVs, Toyota is only building hybrids, they are in a very different position. Toyota's hybrids are know to work and are good and have a good resale value, EVs, including those from VW are shit and no one wants them. Toyota did not blow 100s of billions in the wind with nonsense woke EV climate B*s*.

[@sierraecho884]

And yet Toyota is much better off....

[@KARR-dv9xb]

Mismanagement and hubris at the top got them in this position. Now they want the workers to pay for it whilst giving themselves huge salaries and bonuses.

[@urimtefiki226]

Is not mismangament is mafia work.

[@HNedel]

Yes, management should have never accepted the ridiculous demands for wage increases and reduced hours from the unions and works council. They are absurdly generous. The whole management level should be fired for bending the knee to them

[@lesbendo6363]

What I do not understand is the Union make up part of the VW board. So the Union Heads were aware of what was going on, probably participating in reaping extra Euros. Sounds like there may be some corruption involved. Does not make sense. These guys are one of the top brains in the Auto industry. 🇨🇦

[@TheCebulon]

Whoever thinks that they will pay off that debt is very deliciously. As the people who did allow them to amass that debt. In the end, the German taxpayers will have to pay. And no one will be held accountable for it. They will get bonuses and walk away.

[@Porkcylinder]

Thank fuck we left the poxy eu because you can bet your bottom euro we’d be bailing these assholes out too

[@alanwann9318]

Across all it's about defrauding public funds. I agree

[@johndoe-qg7jp]

Delusional 😮

[@teekay_1]

Well, if VW goes under, the banks and bondholders eat that debt, not the government. The government will lose their equity in VW, but that's essentially a paper loss (i.e. the government could no longer show that value on their balance sheet.

[@urimtefiki226]

Why paying debt when all this is trap organized by mafia.

[@johnrdadrian]

The Porsche family gets dividends every week. Well so does everyone else who owns Volkswagen shares. Just because the Porsche Family made wise decisions to invest in their factories 70 years ago, doesn't mean they should be penalized today. -But if they are smart today, they will sell all their VW shared, and invest in TESLA...

[@FrunkensteinVonZipperneck]

Family has diversified - their great-grandchildren will nEVer work - long after VW dies.

[@mikemalone9678]

The Porsche family were gifted VW by the Brits, who rescued it after the war.

[@darthkek1953]

Tesla will crash under the next Democratic spell in office. Lawfare against enemies.

[@tonybennett638]

What happens when you make rubbish that doesn't last a couple years out of warranty before costing big money repairs...

[@EditioCastigata]

52M €/a translate to about 346 to 500 FTE positions per year. Two orders of magnitude below the purpoted reduction in headcount.

[@glowwurm9365]

When we bought our EV we looked at the VW ID range, and given the price (+£40k) why would you buy an ID4, it was drab, uninspiring and lacked any stand out features which made me want to test drive it let alone buy it. Sad because I had considered buying the ID3 as a second car, doubt I’d bother looking at them again when we next look to purchase.

[@tucker9162]

Being poor, I don't understand, but - after say £100million in the bank - why do you need more money?

[@darthkek1953]

Almost nobody has $100m in a bank. It is is guilds and shares. And shares go down. If you put $100m into VW in 2021 you'd have $30m today.

[@monkey555500]

greed at the top as usual..disgusting

[@WillieFungo]

No, greed at the bottom. Assuming Volkswagen has a dividend yield of 5%, an investor would have to risk $1,000,000 on the stock to get just $50,000 in annual income from their shares. Meanwhile, that stock would have declined in value by over 50% in the last 5 years.

[@mikemalone9678]

Yes, the owners will be the ones worrying if they can make rent, and put food on the table.

[@HNedel]

VW workers are the most overpaid bunch in Europe. Cost over 68 bucks an hour. Meanwhile, in Poland the same workers get 16 bucks. You think german workers are 4 times more productive? Or that the cars they make are worth 4 times more? Why should the polish and chinese worker work to subsidize the unrealistically cushy jobs of the german workers? Because that’s what was happening. German plants have been too expensive and running below capacity for years, but profits from China allowed them to stay open. The workers council has rejected even discussing the possibility of optimizing their cost structure for years. Now the money from china has dried up

[@girtss457]

Wage reality and car price reality is not in sync. Wages have became the same for decade while cars are 2 times more expensive. Just reduce price of car, sell more.

[@chrishar110]

They make the same profit selling a car double the price with less cost

[@HNedel]

Wage growth at Vw has outpaced inflation for years. You can’t make cheaper cars in germany because energy and labor costs are too high. That’s why all cheap models by all brands are made in eastern europe. The VW Polo is made in Spain. While profits from china were cross subsidizing expensive german plants, everyone was happy. Now the profits from china are gone. Either those expensive plants are closed or the whole company is closed

[@bigbubba4314]

Stock owners bear the risk of the value of their investment being diminished. Workers don’t share that risk. If only 80,000 cars get sold, they don’t need to be staffed to manufacture 100,000 cars. Sometimes it sucks to be a worker. But each and every worker has the ability to decide to work for a different company.

[@johncampbell9216]

The time to "act urgently" was ten years ago. If VW can survive beyond 2026 it'll only be through minor miracle or takeover.

[@MR_THINQ]

Well unless the shareholders stop paying themselves millions a week VW will go bankrupt - so it’s down to them, stop being greedy to save the company or carry on and go bankrupt. Which will they choose? We will know very very soon.

[@darthkek1953]

VW's shares were $250 in 2021. They are currently on $80 on a long steep decline. The debt (1/4 trillion) is the same as the total current valuation. (Back in 2021 that same debt would be about 30% of market value). So the dividend is $9 per share is needed to retain ANY investors and stave-off a full-on run and collapse of the share price to zero & total collapse.

[@HNedel]

Lol, the divided will barely make a splash in the ocean 😅. When VW starts making losses next year and there is no dividend anyway, then what?

[@Calvin5150VH]

The decisions made by management are what lead to this crisis, not the workers on the floor. The workers take the pain while management are getting Christmas bonuses and dividends.

[@markjonz]

I think the management had a much larger pay cut.

[@ISuperTed]

‘Twas ever thus

[@teekay_1]

@@ISuperTed and always will be.

[@MetaView7]

i can tell you earnestly, VW's China problem is in part due to Baerbock's behaviour toward the Chinese people. The Chinese netizens do not take offences lightly. Take a look at the 2017 Korean missile issue. The netizens were not happy and they turned away from all the Korean products. Samsung phones fell off the chart. Hyundai cars sales are practically non-existent. The same is true with American cars. No sooner than Blinken finished his visit, the American car sales dropped like a rock.

[@FrankiePo89]

Most analyze outside of China got it wrong. China is way past those not up to date legacy auto. It is competing among itself now.

[@darthkek1953]

2017 is not 2024. The Chinese people are broke as fuck and their economy is in freefall. And it isn't coming back. The entire Chinese economy has already peaked. Things are going to get very, very bad out there. But never any better.

[@valerievankerckhove9325]

To be fair, Samsung did an incredibly crap job handling the Chinese market. 1. Distribution. It ignored the lower-tier cities, which are actually an important part of the market. 2. Software. Since Google apps are blocked in China, most phone providers offer alternative software. Samsung didn't bother. 3. Battery. When Samsung phones started exploding, it issued a global recall.... except for China (ouch). When asked why, it said because the phones in China use a different battery (ouchx2). Then the phones sold in China started exploding too (ouchx3).

[@hathaway.1166]

@@valerievankerckhove9325 your third point gave me flashbacks to the note 7😂

[@chrvids5846]

That’s why Tesla pays their employees extra in shares. The share value will go up (or down ) as Tesla goes. Same is true for workers and executives.

[@jamesh318]

Consider this as a question of scale. The legacy auto industry is big enough that it can do crazy things like staying in the ICE business. Imagine if there was a buggy whip union 125 years ago, and imagine how stupid it would look in the light of history if they were insisting on immunity from the laws of natural economics.

[@georgobergfell]

Building cars, that nobody wants anymore and they wonder, why they aren't selling any? What a joke 😂

[@onastick2411]

I hear the EVs are flying of the shelves?

[@TuonoV4F]

i will have a german car...for free...until warranty ends

[@bradwick212]

@@onastick2411I would rather drive a Jetta or Golf then an EV. The EV part is the reason VW is in trouble.

[@JZsBFF]

Capitalism works best when sales go up, then any fool with a tie and a three piece suit can become a genius.

[@russellbogg5270]

People want the cars, they just can't afford them. The middle class, once the customer are getting poorer. VWs market is disappearing. VW is not alone on this though

[@rickducharme7429]

this economic system is 100% whack

[@WillieFungo]

Yea. Shareholders sacrifice so much for the overpaid workers. Assuming Volkswagen has a dividend yield of 5%, an investor would have to risk $1,000,000 on the stock to get just $50,000 in annual income from their shares. Meanwhile, that $1,000,000 in stock would have declined in value by over 50% in the last 5 years.

[@sergeyd2199]

For sure! Oligarchy for rich, socialism for poor. Pretend it’s capitalism and rip everyone off again and again.

[@JZsBFF]

Greed only works for one person at any give time: oneself.

[@crxdelsolsir]

No responsibility and no consequences for management. All the consequences rightly and/or wrongly to non management staff.

[@wisenber]

"No responsibility and no consequences for management." Shareholders are taking a 40% haircut, and management may be getting kicked out. Not sure how you think that's no consequence.

[@Rene-uz3eb]

Vw is rich! They effectively have no debt to speak of, tons of retained earnings. So no they totally have the means to turn this around if they stop stalling the transition. Meaning, close factories.

[@musk-eteer9898]

battle of the GREEDs, i could careless for neither sides, they are both greedy and they are out for themselves NOT about the customers, it's the customers that feed the business

[@glennaltpeter8917]

Sounds like the death of the British Car industry all over again!

[@laker6943]

$1 Million Euros divided by 100,000 workers is $10 Euros per week, per worker . So giving up the dividend will not save Volkswagen. They SHOULD give it up, but it is not going to do much.

[@adamiskandar5107]

It's not the dollar amount that is important, it's the fairness of any deal. Those who control Capital is just unwilling to share when sacrifice is called for.

[@teekay_1]

@@adamiskandar5107 If you expect life to be fair, then you're living in a fairy land with unicorns and rainbows. And certainly in communist/socialists countries, things are even more unfair as party members are wealthy and live in their dachas and the proles get to work in the mines and asbestos factories.

[@HNedel]

@@adamiskandar5107the capitalist only makes profit if the company makes a profit. The workers always get their paycheck, regardless. You think the workers would be happier if they only got paid in shares and dividends? And when an economic crisis hits, ask them to pour in money into the company? Everyone talks big, but at the end of the day people want a paycheck with no risks. The result of your dreams of „fairness“ will be that the share price collapsed even further and VW can’t finance its operations. Then the workers will get a 100% pay cut instead of 10%, but at least it will be „fair“ because the capitalists also „suffered“

[@bigrobsydney]

The dividend discussion is crazy. Investors and / or shareholders need to get a return, otherwise they wouldnt put their money into a company. If the discussion is trying to say that VW shareholders should get nothing, then why would they put money into VW, when they could put it into a different company and get a return there? There is a basic point here that investors are entitled to returns. Trying to somehow shame them for this, is a dagger into the heart of all investment, and is a ridiculous point.

[@WillieFungo]

The shareholders arne't even getting returns. Assuming Volkswagen has a dividend yield of 5%, an investor would have to risk $1,000,000 on the stock to get just $50,000 in annual income from their shares. Meanwhile, that stock would have declined in resale value by over 50% in the last 5 years.

[@adamiskandar5107]

If the basic point here is that investors are entitled to returns, what is the basic point here for the workers? Aren't they entitled to fair living wages? If the investors are unwilling to lose some capital, why should employees be willing to lose some workers?

[@WillieFungo]

@@adamiskandar5107 Your mentality is disgraceful. No one is entitled to anything. The investors put their money into the company. It's theirs. If workers aren't satisfied with their wages, they can leave.

[@bigrobsydney]

@@adamiskandar5107 At some point, workers need to understand that companies dont always do well. They have momentary issues, and sometimes they have systemic issues that require major corrections. Thinking that everything will be alright forever is just plain wrong. And yes, investors may have received money 10 years ago, 9 years ago, 8 years ago, etc, but if there has been a fundamental shift in the economy, supply chain disruptions, or competitors being particularly fierce in the market place, then thats just the way it is, and things need to be addressed. You cant bury your head in the sand and simply say, "hey, I'm an employee, pay me regardless of whats going on".

[@adamiskandar5107]

@@WillieFungo If you truly believe that no one is entitled to anything, how did the rich got rich? I mean the really rich, the billionaires. Any discussion on this subject should start right here!

[@AndreasPenninger-oc8sw]

EV mandate plus no Russian energy equals current problems.

[@bananacabbage7402]

People criticise Jaguar but at least they are looking to the future. VW, along with most of the other legacy OEMs are just aiming for short-term profits that ensure big payouts for executives while dooming the company to bankruptcy by the end of the decade. VW fired Deiss because he wanted a strategy that would give the company a long-term future, but it would have required investing profits rather than dishing out to shareholders. I am not sure the unions understand this but they can see that something is up.

[@MossMini]

If Unions don't invest in the company, no dividends.

[@kalebdaark100]

Are you seriously suggesting that the people the Unions represent are not investing in the company?

[@WillieFungo]

@@kalebdaark100 They are employees, not investors. They didn't finance the company. Please learn how basic common sense business works.

[@kalebdaark100]

@@WillieFungo Your just playing with words because you think it makes you sound clever. A business requires three "investments". Resource (used to just mean land but these days can be a lot of things, such as intellectual property) Capital (basically the power coupons to get people to work together) ...and Labour (without which nothing is done). Please learn how basic common sense business works.

[@martinhovorka69]

Where do you think the profits come from if not from the people's work?

[@WillieFungo]

@@martinhovorka69 Profit comes from capital. The workers were paid for their labor, they are actually an expense.

[@dv8ug]

Not a "disconnect" but just a pure capitalism.

[@richardv9648]

15 years ago, I had an argument with my German engineering classmate about how his country would go back to burning coal and his car industry would be destroyed by the climate agenda. He simply laughed at me. Wish today, if he could look me in the eye, I would tell him that in another 15 years, his country and people will be back flaunting bent cross once again.

[@AlJay0032]

It would be great if we all went back to coal, but Germany isn't going to coal for a while still. Everyone, the USA too has to go back to coal. We should all be building 100 coal power plants a year like Chin does.

[@glowwurm9365]

@@AlJay0032Which country roles out the most Solar, Wind and EVs per year?

[@user-xy1dw1pe1d]

In 15 years the indigenous people of Germany will be in a minority in their own country (same for Britain) , fighting the replacement population while The Oligarchy still rule and fly around in private jets.

[@HNedel]

@@AlJay0032except germany DID go back to coal after shutting down all the nuclear plants and losing russian natural gas deliveries. Or where do you think the electricity came from last winter? Solar? German coal imports from Columbia and South Africa have skyrocketed.

[@AlJay0032]

@@HNedel The electricity was imported from other countries, mainly Poland and France. Before they shut down the last remaining nuclear power plants they did shut down 8 coal plants. One I know of was demolished in record time but a new one has been built in it's place, idiotic. Poland is definitely mainly coal power, I would assume.

[@powerpointpaladin6911]

Well, Deiss tried to change things, but the Union worked with the investors to get him fired. The investors didnt want to take a dividend hit, and the Union didnt want to transition to EVs ( which dont require as many line workers to make). The Union is as much responsible for the current situation as anyone else.

[@Richardo-c8i]

It’s great that workers are standing up for themselves even in hard times, when big bosses on massive salaries, well done workers 👏👏👏👏👏

[@M3LTUP]

Manufacturing in Germany sounds impossible. 1000 Laws and Green Regulations plus the insane cost of energy.

[@mikemalone9678]

Which laws have not been a problem while VW grew into a powerhouse. The transition to RE *should* provide the possibilities of cheap energy.

[@MalcolmEngledew]

Knock knock. Who’s there? Not Herbert Diess 🧐

[@reggosse3901]

You are right, executive pay themselves unconscionable amounts of money.

[@bryancarlson3673]

My brother purchased a brand new 1966 VW Beetle 1300 with the Saffire IV AM radio! It was his last VW!!!

[@markevans5892]

These changes should have started years ago and should have gradually been phased in. It’s impossible to fathom how supposedly intelligent people running a business couldn’t see what was coming. Naive at best, institutionally corrupt at worst!

[@alanlight7740]

People are often blind and cannot see the best path forward, so they do not make the course corrections in time that could save them. This is why change seldom comes from within a big corporation, and almost always comes from outside disruptors. It is similar to the trend in which science advances one funeral at a time.

[@JoeyBlogs007]

Better to scrap the company and start a new company with 90% robots.

[@JoeyBlogs007]

Private companies are not a sheltered workshop social service.

[@HNedel]

Any measure of automation that would cut a human job has been and will be rejected by the unions and works council. Even starting a new company from scratch with just robots, wouldn’t change the fact that demand is low, energy is extremely expensive, and the regulatory environment is extremely hostile to businesses.

[@JoeyBlogs007]

The role of private business is to operate at a profit, not to provide a social service. Let the unions destroy the company. They will have zero jobs in the end if they resist change.

[@JoeyBlogs007]

Demand is low becuase input costs are high, compared to slave labour China. Either automate or blanket ban Chinese car imports.

[@JoeyBlogs007]

Demand for cheap Chinese cars is not low. It's growing.

[@alanwoollett2628]

The senior management know the company is doomed and like the Porsche family they are going to milk the business for all it’s worth. And guess what they have a strike and the workers to blame for their incompetence.

[@Zach-jt5zr]

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[@RasadnikRasadnik]

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[@Zach-jt5zr]

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[@cam3ltow]

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[@ZegaOfficial-us5po]

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[@crystalsword16]

Wow, that’s very nice. Please how can i be able to reach out to your broker. My income is in a mess please

[@davidsmith8728]

On the other side of the coin, without the shareholders, the investors, there would be no company which means no jobs. The shareholders are risking their money by putting it into VW. If the company goes bust, they lose all their investment. If the workers demand a pay rise whilst there are no profits, the company goes bust. This needs viewing from both sides.

[@mikemalone9678]

The best is a socialist company, where the workers own and control the company. Note: Socialism is not state ownrrship, as many Americans seem to believe.

[@MehdiS-music]

" If the workers demand a pay rise whilst there are no profits, the company goes bust." But this still does not address the fact that the incompetent management just keeps on getting lucrative salaries and bonuses in different forms while their decisions are killing the business. I´v been in both sides of the isle and can confirm that the top management in big companies are tooooooo well rewarded for mediocre results while the average workers are treated like rats.

[@rinconchuck]

I remember when Lee Iacocca became President of Chrysler. He came on board when it was doubtful that Chrysler would be an ongoing firm. He took the Presidency of Chrysler at a salary of $1 a year, with deferred stock options. He asked the UAW for concessions to save the company. If he turned Chrysler around, he would make a small fortune (although small by today's standards) and save the jobs of all Chrysler workers. His answer was the "K" car. Which, with a loan from the government, saved the company and all jobs. Chrysler paid back the loan. How different today's CEOs and company Presidents are. They feel if I mess up, you need to pay me millions more! If Lee Iacocca had not turned Chrysler around at the time, he basically would have received nothing. VW needs leadership like that now. VW bet big on China, which for a while paid for inefficiency in manufacturing plants in Germany. Now everyone at VW needs to sacrifice to save VW. The question is, will the union, will the management, will the stockholders be willing to make those sacrifices like Chrysler did under Iacocca, or will they all just kill the golden goose and all lose everything?

[@therovingrobin5938]

Oh, look! The commies are back! Btw: VW is in crisis because they invested heavily in EVs 😂😂

[@timlowe3081]

Keep the content coming Sam, great content

[@electricviking]

Thanks, will do!

[@alaakela]

Why should management and owners care whether the company survives. They are multi millionaires and billionaires. What is their incentives? If the entire VW group disappears they will still be multi-millionaires and billionaires. Only the workers need VW to survive.

[@WillieFungo]

Then let the "workers" run the company. See how long it lasts.

[@Malcky-f7l]

The chinese government will buy V.W, like they bought M.G, then move it all to China where ythey will use cheap labour, then we won`t know if it is Capitalist or Communist??

[@mikemalone9678]

Such companies tend to be very successful. Particularly if their are no vampires sucking wealth out.

[@darthkek1953]

Managment want to keep their jobs and earn more millions. The investors want to retain their money. If you put $100m into VW in 2021 you'd have $30m today. Why would you want that to move to zero? You'd want that to go back UP if anything.

[@mikemalone9678]

@@darthkek1953 Which mean that you would want management held accountable for their failures as well as their successes. Otherwise you are just rewarding bad behaviour. But that not the way it works. Management wants to walk away with rewards even when they fail, and put the burden on others, particularly the worker, who loses everything.

[@JoeyBlogs007]

Whatever. They need to automate. They need to be using robots. They can blame everyone, but that wont save them. They need massive labour cuts, massive retraining and and massive automation. Failing that they are finished. Plain and Simple.

[@paulobembe7742]

Hold on! The real problem is car sales. Its not like the Owners of VW suddenly started being rich and spoilt Yesterday. If you want to blame somebody then blame the executives who actually run VW, or Blame the EV mandates.