Ellen vs Zhu Yuan : Who Offers Better Investment Value in Zenless Zone Zero

Timestamps:
00:00 Current Value
05:00 Future Value
07:18 Alternatives
10:30 Potential
12:54 F2P Comparison
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[@farhaandomun1298]

Zhu Yuan offers better value as you can use her with Nicole = more time of Nicole being onscreen.

[@DefinitelyNotAFerret]

But then you can only play with one hand

[@iDGameTournament]

Exactly my thought process lol

[@lemonzest8650]

@@DefinitelyNotAFerret git gud

[@blueveil3277]

That decreased her value for me.

[@AkbarIpulcoolCh]

Facts

[@N0XEL]

im simply gonna wait until i get my character off of standard banner, if i get lycaon i'll try and get ellen, if i dont i will wait untill near the end of zhu yuan's banner to see whats coming and if i wanna pull her or not, not gonna reroll though.

[@nobodynose6722]

My thoughts exactly

[@HiHi-pl3hc]

fr

[@user-hw1uz1ly4j]

Reroll is hell not worth it. I just finished getting Ellen and lycaon and it took me 3 days. 16 account with 3 server each. Got it on Europe server.

[@Alfonsopro14]

Honestly I have 14 hours now, and reroll seems like super boring, I lost 50/50😢.

[@AkbarIpulcoolCh]

What a strong resolution, i almost buy cheap acc reroll for ellen lmao

[@scyi.3665]

That mono ice team with Ellen, Lycaon and Soukaku is very strong and I can't imagine it falling off soon + Miyabi is unlikely to release soon. On the HSR comparison, Seele actually aged well for a first limited character, she performs well in all three gamemodes and can still 0 cycle MoC. So I agree that the best choice is to go for Ellen Joe right now for smoother progression. Her mobility is great too with Roaming State edit: nvm Miyabi potentially coming in 1.3 it's ellen joever

[@FrostySnow1000]

Venti was a great first limited too

[@Bao598]

Miyabi could appear even faster than that, i mean in the CBT she was an A rank unit, so its probably comming in 1.1 or 1.2... At least if they dont change her to S rank

[@ozumitsu]

yeah venti was good even until the day I quit, imo saying first banner characters fall off ain't really accurate

[@scyi.3665]

@@Bao598 With that one cutscene, I think she's intended to be S rank. Harumasa and Yanagi are rumored to be S rank and they did not stand out as much

[@guiltylegion7037]

​@@ozumitsu well it's never the caharcter that falls off it's the enemy that got buffed. That usually can be solved with supports though.

[@TheNrat]

This the video I need . Ellen hype video got me more interest in her . But I wanna use Nicole on teams

[@junojuno666]

thank you for the vid!

[@Helsenberg268]

11:33 "The second banner tends to be good" .... ? In HSR we had Jing Yuan, who wasn't even god at release and in Genshin we had Klee, who was also power-creeped pretty fast In the end it's a hoyo game and it won'T have that high of a ceiling. Just pull the chars you like (aesthetics, gameplay,...)

[@RavenUwU605]

Meanwhile in Honkai:

[@grumpy_1]

​@@RavenUwU605But these past 2 games, you can actually clear the content with just a 4 stars. Idk about ZZZ though

[@TsukatsukiRio]

​​@@grumpy_1zzz all 4 stars are good as well

[@guiltylegion7037]

​@@TsukatsukiRio Aye Billy does god pp dmg can confirm

[@DancerVeiled]

Doesn't matter. They're not going to fool me into using exclusive pulls before Miyabi comes out. I will be strong. The fox-girl needs me. Genuinely want Neko more even if she's in the common pool. Meta is meta, sure, and mechanically some characters may be optimal, but if you're going to enjoy the game, use the characters you enjoy. These characters have great personality, voicelines and animations, and I'd like to spend my time with the ones that appeal to me rather than those who are mechanically optimal. I'll still build viable teams with the ones I like, but not going out of my way for people I'm not interested in.

[@enrique9773]

Remember ladies and gentlemen he said this is his personal opinion which mean the final choice is yours (in case people skip the last part)

[@Dandy4ask]

11:30 Seele and Venti were both first banners while klee and jing yuan were on the other half, i dont think theres a trend here

[@danusorn8655]

Genshin’s first limited banner literallly being an archon 😭

[@NARUTOnemesis]

It kinda really depends on who my first 5 star is. I want Miyabi, plain and simple. But I wouldn't be surprised if shes around 1.5 or further, maybe into 2.0. So if I get Lycano then I may push for Ellen but if not I'll go for Zhu Yen.

[@akialter]

Same boat here. I just the most minimal pull to clear content and would save for her

[@NARUTOnemesis]

Might have to reassess this. They kinda nerfed Zhu Yuan's weapon and it sort of changes things. Changed Ether damage to crit rate which I believe is a bad move since we have a lot of sources to get crit but limited sources to get Ether damage which is her primary damage source. It could be fine but we'll see.

[@Cbb88dragonborn]

Going for Ellen personally and hey if I get her W-Engine that can go right on Miyabi too

[@Maxcie]

7:20 the Nike shade is craaaaaazy. checks over stripes! Great video though, very informative.

[@mugenhikage]

I thought Soukaku was given for free in game for one of the game modes?

[@xj975]

She is

[@spookyskeleton3820]

Shiyu defense floor 3

[@Zerodarkwolf01]

I think I might go with Ellen since I’m also planning on getting Lycaon AKA wolf Sanji to have synergy and ice attacks are heck op from what I’ve seen so far

[@SyntheticaYT]

Unless you’re going to be dropping hundreds of dollars to get the guaranteed five star off the standard banner (300 pulls) There is no such thing as “planning” to get Lycoan.

[@Zerodarkwolf01]

@@SyntheticaYT ahhh gotcha sadly to this day i wasn’t able to play the game do to my phone not keeping up but thanks for the info

[@spookyskeleton3820]

I was lucky enough to get lycaon and Ellen on ellens banner in like 50 pulls and her w-engine in 20 pulls

[@jookykooky]

I was planning to get Zhu Yuan then save for Miyabi… until I saw the guy in Section 6 and the cat guy(?) in Zhu Yuan’s squad (I forgot the name). Thank god the devs are catering to husbando enjoyers a little too 😭

[@floofy1]

Pog new vid

[@k-BlazeWuthringwaves30]

FYI nicole fits on any team she is ER battery

[@akaiyoru2681]

Imo Zhu Yuan has a higher F2P value, as was mentioned Nicole is her best support...that also means you can put in Anby as a Stun character. Literally you only need to pull for Zhu Yuan, that's it. If anything it also opens up her W-Engine as an option if you really wanna invest. Ellen can get the Crit value from Frostbite but Nicole gives enemies the Def% debuff which might overall be better

[@Nikorasu737]

I just want the pink haired lady from Miyabis faction 😭

[@edselw9293]

W vid as always

[@LumicchiStream]

both between Zhu Yuan and Ellen was worth 😊

[@rjuwuxd3012]

Wild I was just curious about Ellen vs ZhuYuan about a few minutes ago. It's like you read my mind 😅 Anyway I'm most likely skipping both banners knowing how Hoyo loves powercreeping their launch limiteds right away. I'll wait for Miyabi, and/or another Raiden expy? XD

[@ciencerec]

SAME

[@itriyum]

Genshin first banners didn't get powercreep tho, at least not Venti, only Klee, the we got Zhongli which is still the best at what he does

[@rjuwuxd3012]

​@@itriyum fair enough. Venti took a while before getting powercrept but man is he really a good character even when I quit around inazuma and when kazuha came. But yeah. I might wait for Miyabi or if any 1.1 or 1.2 characters pique my interest :)

[@DefinitelyNotAFerret]

The way I SCREAMED how fast Kafka powercrept Jing Yuan

[@Ixs4i]

@@rjuwuxd3012 venti technically isnt even powercreeped in the traditional sense, he still is the absolute best grouper in the game, they just made abyss immune to his grouping/not necessary lol.

[@idmss2663]

I'm pulling for Zhu Yuan because of PEW PEW PEW

[@jet30yblack47]

You clearly need to pull for whichever character you want, heck you can pull for both if you want. I'm actually going to skip both, but I would recommend you to go for Zhu Yuan, alongside Nicole (and 2 Bangboos) shes the only Ether Character so far, and there are no Ether S-Rank Character from the Permanent Banner

[@dexter_548]

Me also skipping both early games are easy with A ranks and free s rank and we all no they will get power crept

[@lightmarerbx5217]

why can’t my character banner luck be as good as my bangboo luck

[@GGONZ25]

ellen reminds me of when seele first came out. Look where she is now.

[@H2SO4pyro]

My standard banner first S-agent is Koleda. Right now i'm playing Koleda/Ben/Corin, so i'm looking to replace Corin for a better DPS before i get stuck on lategame stuff. What's the call going forward? Do i pull on any of this patch's banners or do i wait for the next patch?

[@Seba_gilsa]

seeing you have koleda, one good team with her is koleda+lucy+anton all of them will have the faction bonus, besides you get a good balance of stun (koleda), off field suport and sub dps (lucy) and main dps (anton), if you happen to have gotten lucy, you could try wishing 20-30 times on ellens banner, if you get ellen then good luck for you, and if you get anton you have a good team to play

[@rayraynathanielreyt1187]

S11 is good do monofire

[@CroixKaslana]

Zhu Yuan team because her VA is Maria Inoue (Elysia HI3)

[@Nihilore]

i just witnessed Miyabi's cutscene in the hollow zero and i know who i'm saving for now instead

[@ratspew932]

wait miyabi is a 5*?? awesome, saving for her now.

[@komodojango3889]

Zhu yuan all the way! because i love characters with tactical suits. Like my all time fave character Leon kennedy and Big Boss Snake.

[@Tigrulken]

6:23 Jing Yuan value was increased only once - with Sparkle release, but instantly got powercrept by Acheron in next patch.

[@andrinaleong4079]

Acheron powercreeps literally every character with her damage ceiling as she is the anniversary character. In the flip side, her team is expensive and not easy to build.

[@Tigrulken]

@@andrinaleong4079 what team is expensive? You only need like 1 event nihility character(SW/BS/new fox boy). 2 other slots are Pela and literally any preservation char with fire dot cone/gallagher. And originally in the first comment I was saying about damage element. Both Acheron and Jing Yuan do aoe electro damage. What I meant is not only damage, but the role.

[@naufalsyauqifillah6388]

​@@andrinaleong4079what expensive lol follow up are the expensive one not acheron team

[@marshscarf7467]

Yeah but Aventurine is the best sustain rn for alot of teams, including Acheron team​@@naufalsyauqifillah6388

[@Dustycat]

bro forgot about fu xuan ig

[@yukurin6653]

My only question is where did miyabi go 😢

[@zawiyar8790]

She is probably gonna release in later patches just like ayaka who was also in the beta for genshin but disappeared till inazuma.

[@mio9728]

​@@zawiyar8790i think its more like kafka/blade

[@supernieva2419]

I think 2.0 if she's a raiden equivalent of zzz.

[@darko6115]

@@supernieva2419she isn’t lmao

[@rikuclad1264]

The answer is Grace

[@everydaymorning2888]

Skipped for miyabi and cow girl

[@eldenjim]

I got Grace instead of Lycaon, so what’s your opinion on replacing him with Anby for your example Ellen team? Also, what’s the most efficient rotation for generating and spending Ellen’s stacks?

[@chisha8415]

What comes to mind is how much venti fell off. It’s scares me to pull on Ellen but idk she might age well

[@CakSindox]

Skipping Ellen Joe, Miyabi + Lycaon = Vergil? Good enough for me

[@Cheseballmagician]

in my opinion the trend for mihoyo's first characters are usually better than second ones even in the long run. i mean venti is definitely better than klee still and i think seele is still better than jingyuan

[@timo-zoro]

why does onga bonga remind me of aku aku from crash bandicoot

[@StimuluusChecks]

(Didnt watch the video just wanted to comment my opinion so if he said any of this mb) As of right now Ellen is the better character to pull for since her team ranges more with one of her best team comps already being in game. Although Zhu still solos by herself but not at ehr best potential since Nicole is really the only GOOD character paired with her that could do her good, so yes rn Ellen is better but later on Zhu will be better than Ellen. But this is what I would do: pull on the discounted banner I think its discounted and see if you get Lycaon, if you do I would pull for Ellen since your pretty much set with just them 2 even better fi you get the blue A rank girl. If you dont I would personally wait and see the next upcoming characters is after Zhu Yuan and if you like them skip both banners if you dont like them pull for Zhu Yuan or skip the banners and save up. Ima go for Zhu Yuan though because I like Nicole

[@user-eo2db5il3x]

If i get wolfboy from beginner bunner - i go for sharkgirl. If not - other girl. And no, sharkgirl can't be long term investment, when you later on get guaranteed wolf from 300 pulls. After 6 months all 1.0 characters will be powercrept to the ground, who cares.

[@Benjiro9571]

Is Zhu Yuan with Nicole and Grace a good team? I like Ellen's design but i'll pull her in her rerun.

[@otaku-chan4888]

It'll be an all-ranged unit type of team. It's an okay setup, but having a melee unit for dodges is really helpful. Also Zhu Yuan needs stun and neither Nicole nor Grace do that. So... I'd probably put Grace and Zhu Yuan in different teams

[@kiefermcray1649]

Zhu Yuan gang rise up

[@nanonano4043]

I love zhu yuan design, but ellen joe is my type 👍

[@voii0777]

Ellen Joe because Zhu Yuan is a boring human cop and Ellen Joe is a shark maid with a big tail.

[@sakuma2558]

i’ve lost the 50/50 in ellen’s banner with soldier 11, i’ve lycaon and koleda who should i pull😭

[@muricuri]

Well, if you have Soldier and Koleda, you can add Ben to make a solid team and save your rolls for future

[@candi_appel]

got Lycaon but fucking missed my 50/50......

[@Ray-pq4di]

Lost 50/50 to rina. I have lycaon T_T. Should i still pull or just stick with lycaon rina anton

[@JustFuN-mv2yp]

thats a pretty good team if you wanr to wait for miyabi

[@user-tv4rb6ry4k]

idc, I pick my fav and she's Ellen

[@Kunoy.]

same

[@Nixonau]

REAL🗣️🗣️

[@bryanreyes6851]

Same!!!

[@moonscorn8141]

then why are you in this video's comments lmao

[@bepo1702]

@@moonscorn8141 yeah it's a bit weird how people do that. Why watch a video like this if you already know who you're pulling for, especially after claiming to not care about who offers more value, which is the entire point of the video 💀

[@ottersaurus]

The game also only has 3 character on a banner. This makes saving pulls even more important since it seems like we are going to get less character and less pulls than compared to a game like HSR.

[@Anilomu]

Why to pull Zhu Yan over Ellen? Cop girl has crazy cake.

[@JustFuN-mv2yp]

if you have ellen you dont even need a team you can just solo everything i m at lvl37 and i have her team with lycaon but most of time i fell like she doesnt need a team well it depends on your skill to i played pgs from day 1 so i am enjoying this game now not the eary game though too much tv

[@1vanDrago]

Both EZ SKIPS. All in for Miyabi 🦊

[@iamkurogane]

It’s wild that folks think Seele is shit now. Having played HSR without Seele and recently having played WuWa Jiyan that initial curve is so smooth when you have the 5-Star from the start. They get their reruns the fastest so your account actually keeps getting stronger with additional investment minus farming all over again for a new unit. Seele is still one of the DPS units if not the best and still clears content comfortably when built right. Zhu Yuan is hot af but if I’m looking to push vertically Ellen is the much better bet

[@sarettodn5708]

Tbf low invest seele in pretty shit, i think mono quantum seele is probably bottom 3 dps, only better than blade and yj. But sustainless seele is still insane (especially with robin e1 and sparkle e2), but not many people play sustainless and most still think that vertical invest sucks which is why the majority of hsr players think that seele is bad now.

[@SomaStory]

@@sarettodn5708 Mhmm. I don’t blame people for shelving seele and not choosing to invest dupes into her. Meta in HSR evolves fast and will always value building new archetypes (e.g., break, DoT) that cater to new gamemodes (PF & AS) over building older characters. Of course, that doesn’t mean they’re completely obsolete, but you will have a harder time clearing content.

[@sarettodn5708]

@@SomaStory you wouldnt invest into seele dupes anyway as seele has the worst eidolons in the game, the actual way to vertical seele is to get e1 robin and e2 sparkle and then get robin and seele sig. Vertical invest is king in this game, once you have a bunch of eidolons and sigs you can bruteforce any moc/pf very easily, much more easily than using an on element dps. Vertical invest sucks in AS though (which is one of the reasons why the mode sucks), as that mode was literally made to shill horizontal invest, that is true. I dont blame people at all for prefering horizontal over vertical though, ultimately horizontal is more fun and will still get you max rewards, for the average player there is no reason to vertical invest.

[@mleong75]

​​​@@sarettodn5708Thing is if I want to whale out a char, Acheron and FF exist. Both are much better than Seele, in terms of dps and versatility. You essentially get 2 rainbow units, that deal with single target and AoE content easily.

[@abdurehmanmalik2980]

@@sarettodn5708 Jing Yuan is significantly better than Seele in MOC.

[@wmedo59]

Wasn’t Miyabi a A Rank character the last time she was playable?

[@Cytryz]

Gee idk. The big tiddy shark goth maid girl or the other one. Gosh i just don’t know. If only there was something about one or the other that could tip the scales.

[@FineUser]

I'll just make my account the narc account and only pull for the cops military and TOPS people :p

[@Mz-qo1xt]

how about weapon? if i may ask

[@Bao598]

The w-engine? If you plan to build an ice DPS then pull for it, you can use it for miyabi too since is an ice dps, and in the CBT she was an A rank so her signature could work way worse than the Ellen

[@facebookuser1653]

Both's hot

[@AsthmaQueen]

Imma resist pulling even tho i have lycaon and go for team that synergizes with lucy i think when more of her group are released

[@LilRussDawg]

nah, saving for miyabi

[@nofunz]

Shark > Human , easy pick

[@cutcorners6005]

Ellen is basically Seele. She is great but need good relics to do anything and you will probably have better easier to use units very soon.

[@SainInaban]

I mean its a Gatcha Game and Im a Day1 Genshin player with No login Miss and with all these years I have seen the pattern i.e. Deluc, Xiao, Hu tao, Ayaka, Alhaitham, Arlecchino, Neuvillette. So it better to get Ellen Joe Now and then when time comes... move onn to next because they will follow the trend above.

[@idonotmakevidsyet]

And somehow you forgot the most broken ice character to support your point Ganyu. She powercrept everyone when she came out.

[@Kittyclysm]

@@idonotmakevidsyet National was always better than Ganyu teams. The only time it wasn't was when they had leyline disorders catered to freeze and like slowing water to make Ganyu look better than she was. Taser performed worse, but still better than Ganyu, who had to move on to a cope melt team that absorbed two of the best characters in the game at the time. That's despite the addition of rosaria and diona to support freeze teams. And yet reverse melt rosaria was able to clear the hardest content in the game, so it didn't matter if you pulled Ganyu or not. She was never broken, and is a weak character except when hoyo forces her into meta. Venti was the one who carried Morgana teams and is honestly the best example of forced power creep because he only works when Hoyo permits him to. The difference is that he actually adds incredible value when he works, unlike Ganyu who was just baiting you to use better characters in teams they work worse in.

[@nikosleonidas1650]

When are we getting zhu yuan?

[@bahdarnovian]

2 weeks

[@ShineMusc47]

Seconddd

[@soniusGI]

you say Klee had a better long term value than Venti? :O

[@justjuniorjaw]

Shame there's no characters that's like : I want them, so for now I'll just get whoever and build them, and save up for someone I care about in the future. I know HoYo can do fun characters, it's just a matter of time.

[@haziee3108]

It is always a magter of time. I'm not sure how it was for you, but early hoyogame banners have never been very interesting for me. Venti and klee for genshin, and seele and jing yuan for hsr. Subsequent banners brought out bangers though with zhongli and kafka. I'm sure this game will be the same with interesting characters introduced and hyped in the actual story.

[@Surge7-hs63k]

In the future, Ellen Joe could end up becoming the Seelee from hsr, but in ZZZ

[@zephyrion8240]

The answer is to wait and see for 1.1 characters... It's plain and simple.

[@Evan-ru6ro]

no no no wait for 1.2 characters

[@Marimo0010]

@@Evan-ru6ro and wait for 1.3 characters

[@nicky4092]

​@@Marimo00101.4 it is

[@CroixKaslana]

Gacha player be lyke: i dojt care im pulling dps 🤪🤪

[@rein5114]

If f2p just play your free 5star and enjoy the game. Summon limited on 1.2 or 1.3 cause powercreep is real.

[@IngridKen]

i just hope hoyo wont go the same path hsr does, i was really disappointed spending money on hsr since every patch, older 5 stars gets overshadowed and kind of useless to use.

[@RavenUwU605]

It’s been over a year since Seele’s release and she can still comfortably clear MoC. Is she the best? Absolutely not, but she can still do end game comfortably

[@Blockhead2]

Money can't fix lack of skill

[@Inttallity]

@@Blockhead2 b-bu-but THATS THE ENTIRE REASON TO PLAY GACHA NO!?!?! ;(((

[@HomieFran]

Both are waifus so I C6 R5 both ez answer

[@IshizakiYasu]

why fight for them when you can get both of them and put them in the same team

[@sempiterno3243]

That shark tail is disgusting

[@JazzMyOpinion]

maid designed character cringes me, its already 2024 yet this maid outfits is still a thing?

[@enrique9773]

In that case you will have an brain dmg when that faction appear in main story lel

[@JazzMyOpinion]

@@enrique9773 reading your comment gives me brain damage

[@enrique9773]

@@JazzMyOpiniontypical answer from someone who already got permanent brain dmg xD