ELO HELL is actually REAL | Overwatch News

[@coach_mills]

Skin DROPS are LIVE now on STREAM ⬇ Twitch.tv/Coach_Mills

[@ForceOfWill100]

In OW1 I played support, I'm genuinely considering switching to maining Tank for these reasons. I can absolutely still improve, and of course there are things I could be doing better, but I tracked my wins and losses and over the span of 30 games I had 11 games where a teammate quit, and many where the tank insisted on 1v5ing without regard for whether the team was ready to engage. My options as support were to either follow my team into an already lost team fight and die, or sit back and do my best to heal/mitigate from afar. It used to be that low ranked play was more indicative of poor mechanical skill, but the complete lack of game sense and awareness below plat makes it very difficult to climb in non-carry roles

[@mantas9827]

To climb to plat just pick moira and kill their backline they literally don’t know how to shoot you so you can 1v1 everyone.

[@ForceOfWill100]

@@mantas9827 I've tried this, but what I've found is people in gold really don't know how to keep themselves alive through positioning, they rely on heal pockets too much. So if I leave and pick 2 supports, by the time I get back half my team is dead and we wind up losing the fight anyways. (for reference I was a Diamond support in OW1, currently struggling to get out of gold)

[@feedingfrenzy4961]

@Mantas Everyone says this, but as a new player, I've only found this to work sometimes. It seems like a lot of experienced players were placed into bronze and have to climb back to their original ranks. A lot of supports have decent aim and will immediately respond to Moira flanks.

[@ForceOfWill100]

@@feedingfrenzy4961 Yup. I've been playing OW since the beta of OW1, and am a career mid-diamond player and it took me all of season 1 to get out of silver. Glad there's so many new players in the game, but when they're given the same rank as veteran players there's bound to be problems

[@Mimic_QQ]

Maybe try ana or Kiriko. Ana since at low ranks you can just kill and anti the enemy or Kiriko since you can never die and fix team mistakes. Returning player too (left when brig was released) and mained Kiriko from silver 5 to mid plat in 1 season.

[@asimplewizard]

My buddy was just gold 1, been getting better and better as he plays. He needed 3 wins for plat, and after a massive winning streak, he had 4 games in a row with leavers, throwers, or and people who unironically went 1-11/ 2-16 It's not a long term thing for sure, but elo hell exists in bursts that can last a few weeks at a time.

[@SILK97]

How do you know he needed 3 wins to make Platinum?

[@asimplewizard]

@@SILK97 he's my friend and I was in the same room as him watching him play. I watched the tragedy unfold before my very eyes. It was a tilting evening xD He got the same awful tank on his team 3 times in a row. And I genuinely try to support all players but the tank went 2-16 😭😂

[@asimplewizard]

@@SILK97 oh I see now, because yeah he could have technically stayed the same rank or whatever. I don't *know* he was gonna make plat, but it was a week of solid progression and he was gold 1/ playing very well. He even did well in the throw/DC games, which was part of the tragedy lol He'll probably be plat by next week lol. He just needed to chill after some nasty games.

[@box2231]

Same thing happened in OW1. I was placed silver and every time I was 1 or 2 games away from ranking up to gold, I would get potato teammates and leavers. I finally got to gold and after that, it was smooth sailing and I was able to rank up to high gold. The ranked system in OW2 is even worse and it's why 95% of players, including myself, have left

[@VIPAH]

I'm currently 6 wins and 11 losses as a Tank for role quoe. Not even going to bother trying to get the last win because I already know the outcome! Elo HELL!! 🤬 So for that reason, I ain't going to put myself through that torture of climbing.

[@imperiumVII]

One big thing that has helped me climb from silver to high plat, was just to have a lot of confidence in yourself and be willing to work with someone who's probably a little worse than yourself. That sense of optimism will definitely help move you forward up the ranks, it is also important to just accept the fact that, not every single game can be won even if everyone tried their best. Loses happen, and it's a big part of learning and thinking of new ways to play

[@ForceOfWill100]

You're 100% right, but it really does make it difficult for people who play non-carry roles. I can deal with poor mechanical skill, but with the increased importance of the tank role (since there's only 1) it can feel very discouraging as a support when you lose games because your tank dives recklessly the whole game. I try to analyze and optimize my own play the best I can and stay positive, but it doesn't feel like there's much you can do in those situations

[@imperiumVII]

As a support main, I completely agree that things can be out of your control. But remember, there's only so much we can do as support players. So the next time someone says something like, "Where's my heals?" Just say that you can't outheal bad decision making. Focusing on the amount I've healed per game helped me feel like I legit did everything I could to help out the team

[@ForceOfWill100]

@@imperiumVII Yeah, I usually just (politely) remind them that I cannot heal them through walls. As satisfying as it is to get a huge stat line and endorsements, I think it just reinforces the idea that too often it feels like as supports our team is consistently in positions where they're taking too much damage in the first place (i.e. no blocking, DPS giving up flanking routes, etc.)

[@VIPAH]

The problem with solo queing as a Tank is that, you know you performed X10 better than the other tank on the opposing team. Stats show you were 25 and 3 K/D ratio. Yet somehow you gotta "carry" your team mates till the end. I find jumping in a group or 2 or 3 is much better, communication is on point. You got healers who know how to actually HEAL. When you solo quoe, no one is talking, random ults at the wrong time. No coordination. It's basically a coin toss, 50/50 chance if that.

[@jocloud31]

I think I realized a part of what makes the rank system in OW2 to feel so bad sometimes - because you don't get updated on your rank after every match, it's possible to win a handful of matches, lose a BUNCH, then win and get an update, at which point you don't move at all or even move DOWN in rank, which takes the joy and satisfaction from your last win and shatters it.

[@SadMatte]

Just bring back the sr number

[@jocloud31]

@@datnamedoh4877 it doesn't help that there's NO indication of how many games you've lost since your last rank update. You could lose 19 straight, then win 7 straight and get an update that shows you losing a bunch of ranking, but all it shows you is "you won 7 games! Great job!"

[@iTeHee]

Anyone that says elo hell is not real, probably pours milk before the cereal in the bowl

[@ZarelidT]

Or takes a dump after showering. SAME PERSON.

[@Htiy]

Or theyre just convinced they are better than everyone else but not

[@Pascalovic]

Elo hell is not real. You are just bad.. Ahhh my milk

[@calebtheholyman545]

My wife does this. She sucks ASS at video games

[@joeghormley5460]

Oh God

[@user-cf3qo9tu8v]

I know I'm not in elo hell I just suck

[@ashyslashy3636]

same

[@pokeriscool]

My friend was hardstuck gold in overwatch 1 because of horrid teammates and now he's getting matched with top 500 / gm lobbies after elo reset in ow 2

[@donovan4222]

The part about randomly getting punished in low Elos is so true. Its very frustrating for new players because it feels pointless to just be randomly punished (sometimes by mistake) and you never get a chance to feel like you are actually battling and playing the game. Sometimes people can try strategies so dumb that you would never expect anyone to try them and they work.

[@das-9962]

I’ve been playing for 4 years off and on and I’ve had more steamroll wins/losses in the past month or so than I can ever remember.

[@laovazquez927]

I'm a gold support main, I always end up with better stats than most other supports in my games, but there is nothing I can do if the enemy widow or junk is one shooting everyone in my team

[@TheBigSlugger]

I mean, if you’re gold it’s highly unlikely that’s happening in most of your matches.

[@iSuckAtGamesGG]

@@TheBigSlugger no dude u don't get it. i used to be gold a couple days ago and i finally went up to plat 5 and the game became easier. as soon as i hit plat i got a 6 game win streak with super high stats in each game. i feel like there is something in gold 2 and especially gold 1 that causes u to get rolled more often by people who are just gods on dps

[@isoaodyssey4800]

@@iSuckAtGamesGG sorry to break it to you buddy but plat ain't any better, good luck with your climb.

[@iSuckAtGamesGG]

@@isoaodyssey4800 it has been a way more enjoyable experience so far. maybe its because i play support and our team is more coordinated. back in gold if i wasn't directly behind the tank i would get no peel at all which is why i mained kiriko, because i could just kill the enemy and if not tp away. but in plat i can actually play ana now, because not only do i get some peel but when i ping a slept target my teammates actually do something about it

[@laovazquez927]

@@isoaodyssey4800 op here, this season I got to diamond 2, it literally took me 10 games to get over plat

[@tf6shawnn]

Tell that to my team mates who think they are playing call of duty instead of a team game it’s frustrating as a tank main when you put confidence in your team mates and they just leave you out to dry

[@spicycasualx]

This

[@donovan4222]

I’m diamond rn, but climbing through bronze-plat the biggest problem I see is players always push at the wrong times…during team fights when you need to make a play to win, the team sits backs and pokes conservatively. After you lose a team fight when you need to wait and group up, people run into the enemy and feed. Basically people want to play call of duty and just camp in a corner somewhere and do poke dmg, then they get mad when they die and run in too aggressively.

[@williamgrand9724]

It's the matchmaker putting me with bad players and nothing will change my mind.

[@miltaire3235]

My support games have been zigzagging so much in terms of quality recently. I've had games where people coordinated and responded to every ping and callout I made, and then I've had games where people are falling off the map by accident multiple times and the occasional player so tilted things aren't going their way that they choose to afk and feed.

[@DaDaPieGaming]

Elo Hell definitely is real, the matchmaker is terrible. It rounds your mmr and the teams mmr leading to heavily unfair games, especially if your mmr is high and your sr is low. I’m master but gold on dps- yet when I play as DPS I don’t get gold lobbies I get master lobbies making it much harder to rank up. To get rid of elo hell they need to make mmr and sr the same

[@donovan4222]

It would be nice if they were actually transparent about your sr/mmr and you could get updates on it after every game

[@wolfwizard487]

honestly this is so true whenever i lose a game i never know if its because of myself my teamates or bcus of my opponents which makes it very hard for me to learn from it.

[@noahmansland3301]

in 2 season i climbed from bronze 5 to plat 3, (admitedly, the b5 was thanks to the bug that many people got on ow2) and i think that in this game the matchmaking can truly prevent you from climbing: one the first season i had to grind my ass off just to get to gold. but as soon as season 2 rolled out, i got plat in 2 sets of game... so i really think that the game is giving you the rank it want.

[@slimemonster0381]

Any chance you could make an echo guide?

[@dezmundogaming8780]

One of my biggest frustrations with elo hell is leavers. I once had a player leave mid match 4 games in a row. It was completely demoralizing. I wish leavers would be punished more harshly and just get filtered out of the game. They ruin the competitive greatly

[@zeldaplayer3207]

Imo (and maybe my opinion does not count here) leavers are punished too harshly. Sure, if someone does it often it sucks, but I don't see why I should lose the equivalent to 50 sr just for disconnecting because my cat tripped over the LAN cable. That being said, you also have to consider that mathimatically, the enemy team is more likely to have a leaver as it contains 5 randoes while your team only has 4. You just need to play more to the point where the math works for you. And yes it is frustrating, for sure but at some point in mid plat it completely changes. I used to get a lot of leavers. I am now ranked d1 and in the last 20 hours of ingame time encountered zero leavers.

[@donovan4222]

If someone leaves the game midway through the rest of the team shouldn’t be penalized for losing

[@conkcreet1344]

I understand the "dumbing your play down" or "changing how you play" more or less. In rainbow six i was a plat and i did well but in casual id often die because lower skill people would often do things so dumb that they actually worked because i would think no one would actually do that.

[@charleshaines9715]

In OW 1, you could win 50 / 50, or even a slightly highter win rate, and lose SR. Which only nets you increaseingly worse team mates. And when I say bad team mates, I don't mean people who aren't good at the game, I mean people who don't care to play comp as a competitive format. They just mess around, or throw, or DC. So it doesn't matter how good you are, once you have too many games under your belt, you have to be many ranks better to move up at all. I also believe that there are plenty of people who are sitting in higher ranks who have far less impact on their teams, but because they have enough games under their belt, they won't fall far ever, as long as they aren't straight up throwing.

[@peterholmes2364]

I don't really understand how it determines how you rank up that's mu main issue. I am high silver support and will win 7 out of 8/10 games and will stay in rank or maybe go up one. But then as soon as I lose more than 4 games in stretch of 7 wins I get deranked even when I am dropping double the heals of the opposition supports and I feel like I can't do any more to save a tank that will just w key forward without thinking all game

[@peterholmes2364]

And in addition to that even as a silver 1/2 player I will get matched with low bronze teammates who aren't interested in playing the game competitively and will constantly be afk or playing characters that they've clearly never used before

[@mariannapapikyan4123]

Coach Mills is literally only Coach that I heard finally saying the truth You won't win every game, but you can win more games than you lose if you improve

[@ChickenFC12]

Bro I really don’t understand why this happens, I go on a winning streak for like 3 or 4 games and I’m feeling good, but then in my next few games I literally get the worst teammates I could possibly get and I feel like I have no control over these matches because of my teammates and this happens for the same amount of games thag I’ve won and I end up losing 3 or 4 games in a row. It’s also not like I do bad in these games either I actually do much better then most of my teammates but still end up losing. (I’m supp btw)

[@uwuitsblue5979]

I mean yeah I'm losing games where I'm doing 18k healing or 30+ elims or over 20k mitigation I think the main thing is lack of communication sure bad teammates are also a factor but they could perform better if they knew how to communicate I think another thing Is if your qued with a team you have more of an advantage than a team full of random ques

[@TheDb11235]

One thing the ELO hell discussions all leave out is STDEV. Statistically, a bunch of people who might win 60% of games at their rank might be stuck in their rank for months due to being on the left side of the probability curve

[@ch0wned]

That is correct, it's a statistical fact. Do not listen to the pearl clutching influencers who have signed contracts with bliz or those who believe that line. I read the paper "EOMM: An Engagement Optimized Matchmaking Framework" it s available under the creative commons license, it was published in 2017. It was sponsored by EA, who somehow got this research to be paid for with a grant from the National Science Foundation. Makes sense, since we all know EA has money problems. Oh, wait... but I digress. Long story short, the systems do not use Elo, they use SOME skill based match making but what the matchmaker now is programmed to do is drive engagement and reduce churn. In short, the matches are managed by an AI that analyzes each players play style (and other variable/vectors/metrics) and then creates a lobby that is most likely to cause the players in that lobby, to play another game after this one is done. You getting better at the game is purely incidental. Modern matchmaking is nothing more than a Skinner Box. It is sick and it wasn't always this way and we should demand change by REFUSING to participate and calling regulators. Yeah, it's that bad.

[@devdog7409]

It’s extremely hard to learn when you play with different people each game. It’s not always easy to tell if something didn’t work because it was a bad idea or if it was messed up in execution. Sometimes things will work that shouldn’t just because you got a cracked team that will succeed no matter what. Sometimes no matter how good the plan is your team won’t be able to carry it out. Makes it even harder when people glorify things that don’t matter as much.

[@Acolyte_501st]

I’ve never seen the concept of Elo Hell as inherently inescapable

[@yippeeyip4764]

i mean, it’s ‘hell’, the point of it is you are stuck there.

[@kennysmith5001]

honestly it’s one thing or another… a healer that doesn’t heal or even both, not tank or tank who only tries to get dmg no kills(wrecking balls),or dps who are braindead. i try to make a suggestion or call out and race gets thrown in so i don’t use mic

[@briancross2561]

Omg! So well said. What you say about the feedback for improvement is so true. I’ve said that supports attempting to be better like (positioning and doing a lil dmg) get punished hard and don’t get rewarded for such in lower ranks. Whereas tanks or dps playing like a top 500 will be able to carry. I think supports aren’t rewarded for playing “correctly”

[@antonbuur4790]

Great analogy with the mountain man, good job

[@the_hiroman]

"Elo hell is a myth", say GMs and Top500 playing in diamond or less. Not so easy to say for diamonds and plats who play with gold and silvers in their teams against plats and diamonds, and even masters on the other team, so Blizzard enforces their 50% winrate or less.

[@scarlettkins1615]

Im a silver 2 support, i average about 15k+ heals a game with a good team but lately I've been getting games where my teammates are miles apart, i get dived, the other support is ending with 4k heals and is trying to dps and my tank charges into the middle or back of the enemy team. Ive even had multiple games where someone on my team has said in chat that they are purposely throwing and back to back games where my team just leaves after the losing the first team fight. I feel like there is nothing i can do as support and that I am just perpetually stuck at silver and it's frustrating.

[@liathedoll]

Do you do individual Heroes tips/guide videos?

[@EmpereurNapoleonex]

For me, it really just feels discouraging sometimes. It makes me not think it's worth it. What would really help is if I knew where I stand. I didn't play OW1 so idk where rank expectations are like... not that it matters in matchmaking i guess. I wish I can distinguish between " hey yea maybe I just had a bad game" and "holy fuck am I playing with a smurf/this dude is not my rank" If I can determine that my enemy is just higher rank, that is easier to accept. Also too many games where I felt like I had to carry and that is just exhausting at some point

[@bihazards]

One thing I really wished you zeroed in on about your mental is people who think that the mechanical skill is everything. You can have the best mechanics in the match, but when things go slightly awry, and your first reaction is to start flaming your teammates and get tilted, you're gonna lose. This is a part of what helped me to climb. I watch the enemy team do this all the time. I'll tell my teammates specifically to focus down the enemies that are getting tilted to tilt them more. I stay positive and communicate. I open every match with "good luck, have fun, stay positive :)" and sometimes get a negative response from an enemy that tells me off the bat that that guys on a losing streak he thinks is others' fault. People don't understand how big your mental is in this. It's prob half the battle. Because when you're tilted halfway through and the enemy team is laughing together, you are not just hurting yourself but your whole team.

[@lightningmtaylor]

Learn widow and become a beast insta killing anyone out of position constistantly. It wont matter how bad your team is. You'll just always be at advantage

[@donovan4222]

Widow is probably a decent hero to carry but I’ve had games where the enemy widow is popping off and they still lose because Widow can’t really hold a point by herself

[@tragedy8365]

I feel like players mentality in low elo gets crushed easily right now when they get into games they cant win which leads to them playing worse in the games after those. Might be one of the biggest reasons especially right now why people get stuck in a rank.

[@bs5am]

You said blizzard will inc matched roles in the future. I’m very excited to hear this because I believe it will fix a lot of things. How far in the future are we talking? Do you know roughly? What made me take a break was this exact problem. When you start to slowly climb on support you are matched with worse and worse team mates expected to hard carry your team. Same goes for the other team but that player expected to carry is a tank or dps, he will wipe out ur team with ease while ur struggling to keep teammates alive who can’t even hit a wall from inside a small room. I know this to be the case in lower ranks because I can climb on dps much higher than on support. I just don’t like playing it.

[@sucellos8621]

It's always the people who are already in high ranks who claim elo hell isn't real, or that it isn't that bad. It's always the people who have stacks to fall back on when elo hell starts getting too real for them that claim that elo hell can be overcome if you're just persistent enough. I just finished a game where I had to watch, on multiple occasions, my teammates bot walk through and around chokes, and there was nothing I could do to change what they were doing. As a support main I can't heal the stupid out of other players. Despite getting the most out of my utility possible, despite keeping myself alive no matter what, and despite getting the best possible balance between healing and dps'ing there's only so much that can be done. I can deal with losing if I'm on a team of players who are actually putting in a sincere effort, but losing because teammates just don't care. Why would anyone want to tolerate that? Of all the issues with the game mechanically involving balancing, reworks, etc. The only thing that makes me not want to play this game is the community itself. I've never been reluctant to play ranked because of rank anxiety, or because certain heroes are op, or because of a shotty ranking system. I'm reluctant to play another ranked game because I'll just get out of a game where I had to deal with another support playing Mercy (for example), and after multiple fights only having only 96 healing, and I really don't want to risk getting into another game like that (true story). I don't want to queue for another game just to get another dps who can't get more than one elim after multiple fights. I don't want to deal with a tank who keeps flailing into the other team while spamming 'I need healing'. I don't even care about so called 'toxic' behavior because at least you have to be smart enough to make the choice to be toxic. Most of these people are not smart enough to have that kind of autonomy. They're just annoying, and most of the games with these people feel like I'm babysitting underdeveloped idiots. The arrogance of anyone to sit here in this environment and basically say "git gud" is fascinating, and shows how detached you are from the average player experience.

[@africansoldier9312]

Couldn't have put it better myself.

[@AlterAce]

real or not all I know is delete Junkrat

[@drewsanchez69420]

fax

[@Danglebot]

True hell is making us watching a push map VOD while you explain this

[@kingsgold]

Anyone who has the mindset of Elo hell wants to blame anyone but themselves for their position and is only dooming themselves to make elo hell a reality.

[@fettbub92]

Elo hell is a part of climbing. I would say the metal ranks are the true elo hell. They are the highest population of poor players. What is required to climb out, is to perform at a higher level. This is easier on some roles over others. As a tank, play your life and kill the squishies, dont be afraid of the enemy team, play around cover and health packs. For dps, see tank, but spend time warming up your aim. For support, play your life, position smartly, and look/think about opportunities to add value to a play. This can be explained further on this channel. Coach Mills has so many vids on various heroes and roles, which will help you do better. Does it suck when teammates play stupid, sure, but what do you expect in the metal ranks? Learn to punish and exploit the enemy, and play smart. You will have your throwing teammates get rewarded for bad plays, and they will trash talk you; but let it roll off you. Look at great players like KarQ, Emmong, Flats, Seagull; really good attitudes while playing.

[@lasercts257]

the fact that high level players have never witnessed low level play themselves, outside of watching replays, and say that elo hell doesn't exist is ignorant

[@RealEpicGamers]

Point blank if you’re bad you’re bad get good Your mechanics, fundamentals, game sense, team awareness all contribute to your win or loss in each game I was bronze something and in season 1 I went to diamond 3 but I used to play Csgo way back when and most of these basic game techs I already knew and really only had to learn the ults and play styles of OW itself from ults to cooldown control and timing with your team I solo q’d from silver to global in Csgo everyone will always complain about Elo hell in every game the truth is you’re not good enough and once you’re at a certain level a friend or two could make your experience even better But they can’t make up for your lack of team play, aim, cd usage or positioning/movement

[@Vjklv-ty7mn]

there is an unranked to gm on REINHARTH NO SHIELD,so elo hell if its real is still something you can escape no matter what you play...as long as you are a secret smurf GM LOL

[@donovan4222]

Yeah you can escape ELO hell for sure, but it’s frustrating because there’s a lot of stuff in the game you can’t control that you get penalized for which they could make more fair

[@LegendaryThoughts301]

Counter: explain when you do improve drastically but your team still loses alot and you go down in ranked. And previous season you was a whole tier higher?

[@VIPAH]

Still the same outcome in regards to OW1 and 2. You'd think that players would have learnt something right during comp years ago but moving forward in 2023, the reality is, some things will NEVER change!! Elo hell forever!! 😡😫

[@gazza25-r8y]

What if elo hell is just your actual rank

[@patrickstar1164]

Elo hell is real. They create elo hell by themselves. You need to pick a hero that can solo carry and maintain like 55-60% winrate. You may be great at junkrat, but you won't climb with him easier than soldier or sojourn. I got from bronze to plat in one week just by playing heroes that can create huge advantage, like hog. But again, these people create elo hell by themselves by picking brig and moira as a support duo and blaming the team for not performing. They will duel hog all the time and die and never learn. You have to be better than this and tolerate such teammates.

[@Priinsu]

I started playing overwatch 2 a few months ago I made it to platinum but, no matter how far I go up it feels like people all do the exact same things as in lower levels. I dont see what the hype is tbh. People still dont communicate or have mics, people still do the same old things that make teams fail, it just feels the same as when I started in bronze.😑

[@lucaskonglu4533]

theoretical question: if you reach a point where you can have very little impact in your games, maybe that is your true rank and you have peaked??

[@barklord6106]

Its cold down here in ELO hell. Please send help

[@texdoc89]

I was told once that if your team is always bad, you yourself might also be bad since the system is only trying to rank you within your level lol. This also assumes the system is working correctly, but it kinda made sense in a way, ugh I just deranked from Silver 1 to Bronze 2 after hitting a bad string of losses last week. For me I know I keep making dumb mistakes even after watching replays and working on mechanics as a support main lol. PC us definitely harder than console ever was, I was high gold low plat on console back in the day... didn't quite carry over to PC lol

[@SeveruSniper]

Elo hell is dropping back to the rank you started at and playing +20 games just to be back at your rank. Thats just frustrating and unrewarding.

[@chocolatemilkreal]

I would switch between getting 0 kill games and 50 kill gamez

[@oreomilk9912]

I work 12 hours on steel I come home tired af no time to get good and escape elo hell. Just skipped it with parah

[@londonduszynski3518]

In my experience (plat 4 climbed from bronze 2 on dps this season), as a dps your impact is so low its almost impossible to consistently single queue climb from bronze to gold. Your rank is based on W/L, and the inconsistencies on each team in this rank at tank and support makes it so you can't have enough impact unless those more impactful roles are equal. Climbing is possible if you play enough games, but unless you queue with people you know are decent, every game is a crapshoot. I'm masters 3 on tank and diamond 1 support so I think my dps will continue to rise but there's no reason why it got placed so low or why there are so many inconsistencies with blizzards matchmaker. For the casual player who can only play an hour or so a day, that's only 2 to 3 comp games so I think for them elo hell is very real because it can take dozens of hours to climb even a couple ranks when your that low even if you are diffing the other teams players in your role (until gold/plat, then most players are good enough to play their role pretty consistently).

[@texdoc89]

Same can be said for trying to solo queue as a support main, I can do everything I can to keep my DPS/Tank up and their deaths low. But the game still relies on them hitting their shots when I keep them healed and not feeding the enemy team, I get now I have to be self sufficient and can't always rely on peals or whatever. But if I'm going to keep you heal, please hit your shots and take cover once and awhile lol.

[@Hooch_Love]

Bruh I’m in gold but have random diamonds and masters on my team? What’s going on with matchmaking? Help (I was in plat season 1 but it dropped me down once season 2 started and my healer was plat 1) does this game force you to lose?

[@zachtalkssmack4470]

Elo he’ll definitely exist on OV2. You can be plat playing masters MMR level people.

[@arqueon]

How can i Win 7, no loses, and no climb?

[@ayanhclihtsh]

Its also based on your performance

[@aez282]

It’s would be so much better if we got lost forgiveness like in apex if someone leaves unexpectedly. How is that not normal in ranked ?

[@narcodixyadigg781]

I am glad you addressed the learning aspect of Elo Hell. I go back and forth with its existence, but the game does not tell you what to improve on. I finally got some coaching and can see improvements, but I shouldn't have too.

[@noahodum9737]

Elo hell does exist - but its as you explained it- a lack of a good learning environment. You can't improve because your mistakes are not being corrected. I swore up and down elo hell exists until I got coached and from then on it's been more or less smooth sailing. Lately though the matchmaking and ranked system has been making me feel lots and lots of pain. Playing in plat and getting fresh accounts who are playing their first ranked update does NOT feel good. Blizzard said they put them in Bronze 5, but I don't believe them. That and the fact that I could go on a 20 game losing streak before finding out I dropped in rank sucks. I think I played 3 days on stream in DPS que to drop from Gold 1 (after a 65% winrate) to gold 3 (53% winrate average). I definitely fall in the doing just above average in my rank though, and so it takes me a long time grind up on DPS. For tank and support it's quite the opposite, for them the problem for me is the grind. It sucks to have to grind up to a rank where it feels challenging, and since it's not challenging the game feels boring. In all honesty, nothing has killed my drive more than the soft reset though. It's hard to stay motivated after spending 100 games won to get into plat, just to have to grind 60 games to get back after alreadya chieving that rank. Now I'm grinding back but MAN is this a drag. Those 60 games could've been a good indicator as to whether or not I was climbing and indicated to me I needed to look at my gameplay differently instead of just 'hur dur' you went 7-7 but still ranked up! Congrats! only 5 more ranked updates till you're back at your original rank!

[@UrumaJr]

I feel like i am in elo hell because one of my teammates died 20 times with 26 kills💀💀

[@heckincat1406]

I'm not even gonna blame it on Elo hell, straight up unfair matchmaking. Got matched against a lot of Masters and GM's, on their main roles of course IN QUICK PLAY. FUCK. THAT.

[@dragskope1431]

Thats the enoying Part, sometimes you have to adept to a bad play with ure team and Play with them stupid. Even more stupid is that the Qualitäty of games often very diffrent. So U have do find out if ure team is smart or Not. Best example in Bronce : do U spowncamp with ure team so its 5v5 at a bad Position or do U Play out of a good Position, but let ure Team die 4v5

[@rundas2141]

Elo hell is a thing. People just get the definition wrong. It's not a specific rank that all players get stuck on. It's specific to each person. Elo hell is the rank one is at where they are not able to carry a game by their own skill. Let's say a GM player plays Tracer in a bronze lobby. That Tracer is easily going to carry their team with their mechanical skill and game sense. However, if you have a Masters Tracer that has decent game sense, but built up bad habits, as well as average mechanical skill for their current rank but not a rank above, then that player's elo hell is Master's. They have their own personal elo hell they need to sit through and endure, reflect on their own shortcomings to improve their gameplay, and eventually make it to GM. It's not a hell because you can't leave it. It's a hell because you have to endure the fact that while your teammates are making huge mistakes game after game, at the end of the day the fact remains that if you were better than you currently are, you could probably carry the game without needing to worry about your team's mistakes. Because so many people have ego's and love blaming their teammates, they turned the definition of elo hell around and began to believe elo hell just means ranks where teammates are bad and are impossible to carry.

[@NKN82]

Matchmaker not doing balanced teams at all. The more games you won the worst your team and better opponents becomes and reverse if you losing this is really matchmaker doing.

[@liathedoll]

What I would have liked is small explanation of what Elo means. I did google it but kinda wish it was in the video. 😊

[@rundas2141]

It's not an acronym, it's just a method that compares your skill by your stats compared to other players.

[@liathedoll]

@@rundas2141 i know. Like I said, I googled it.

[@iSuckAtGamesGG]

im plat 5, i won 6 games in a row, lost only once, than won my last.... still plat 5.... love the ranking system blizzard

[@ch0wned]

It is designed for player engagement (keeping online) not skill advancement.

[@marc-andreblais5818]

there definitely is elo hell in the game, they are not here to make the game fair, they are here to keep you playing so once you get a win streak, you will right after get a terrible lose streak, its been happening to me every season, at the start you gain a high rank and then you lose at least 3 ranks in a lose streak so you have to grind a ton to get back your rank. player retention is what they want, the game is 100% not fair

[@ZarelidT]

I mean high silver to plat is like being a teenager you think you know how life(ow) works when you really don’t but you’ll argue and fight as if you do.

[@meat.]

And then diamond is like a young adult who is beginning to figure things out. Masters is a confident adult. Gm is a rich successful person. And then top 500 you become a chupacabra

[@ZarelidT]

@@meat. prolly I wouldn’t know I’m Diamond 🤣. Wait I DO KNOW!!!

[@themoderndaygamer637]

Honestly OW 1 elo hell was like okay let me just grab a duo or trio and I’ll climb but now it don’t matter because the ranked system is just so bad that I played one game against a top 500 player and he played well but my team was better and I out tanked him

[@Shakeyspeares]

This was a nice video I'm totally new to Overwatch but good level in other fps. I'm winning more than losing putting up 42-5 dps games (average 20 kills per 10 mins good kd) or its even going distance to a draws multiple times stupid kills and damage in low elo. I'm now having to put up 30+ kills good kd to guarantee or confident of a win. I've been playing gold lobbies with a team or 2/3 stack and winning more, it seems more stable and balanced. it's night and day compared to bronze/silver. Still competitive but not like over the top competitive in bonze/silver... I don't get it.

[@spicycasualx]

Same! It’s like what more can we do lol

[@toogud7918]

In ranked, your kills per 10 should be closer to 25(if ur a dps)

[@Shakeyspeares]

@@toogud7918 Something to work on then but 20 now. That means you've roughly got to be putting up 50+ kill every game or the game ends early all the time and finish 25+. I don't see diamond or grand master games regularly get that amount of kills always as doesn't always go the distance so can't be right. Also we taking pc or console big big difference. I have friends in plat that don't average those figures not sure where you've got your stats from as at any rank level regular 30-60 kills games with good KD is fine you just won't hold that at higher ranks it's not viable all the time with length of match etc.

[@Shakeyspeares]

Yeah Jay3 in top 500 has 30 for 12 and other similar games I'm sure he's not hitting 25+ DPS kills every game. I don't think that's a realistic stat to hold at higher elo.

[@toogud7918]

@@Shakeyspeares are you higher elo though? In the metal ranks, you should be putting up 25 per 10 If you think you deserve a higher rank

[@heyitswesty]

yeah elo hell is real I've been in it since 2018 I can't get out of bronze 5 I don't even try anymore. I log in to do my dalies in quickplay and then log off now. Comp wins are a dream I gave up on a long time ago. Videos like this exist and pretty much just gaslight. I play support and there's no hope left.

[@alexcypriano9985]

you have to actually be insane to believe it’s not your own fault you’ve been bronze 5 for 5 years, sorry

[@heyitswesty]

@@alexcypriano9985 I am a potato

[@penpenpenpenpen]

Support mains know ELO hell is real. It does not matter if you have most damage, eliminations, point capture time, healing and least deaths you will still lose and get de-ranked regardless.

[@0hBee0ne]

The problem is not everyone can make overwatch their job. That's the problem with overwatch MMR. "You'll eventually rise" no. No I won't. Because I play an hour a day.

[@greenecarlos93]

It’s the matchmaking everybody I’m literally getting games with people who just started playing and have no idea what to do and it’s stupid 😂😂😂😂 they prioritize me queue times over match quality

[@johnsonspark171]

got hardstuck diamond on support, but my stack all quit to go back to Valorant since it looked like we were done climbing and getting terrible matches. SAD.

[@toogud7918]

Imagine leaving a dynamic game like ow to go shoot people while standing still on a game that looks like a ps2 title

[@johnsonspark171]

@@toogud7918 that's also infinitely more popular than OW for a reason. And BOTH games have $20 skins, but only the cosplay fags in OW bitch about it. Really sad.

[@ivogeorgiev9277]

I love your vids man. So much good info. I didnt knew that this thing i am atm is called elo hell 😁. Im circling between gold and plat and just cant get out. Last night i lost 10 games in a row and i couldnt even get out of the base. Just couldnt find an angle. As soon as i poke my nose out bam headshot. Ofc i dont blame anyone cause its ridiculous to blame someone in scenarios like this 😁 but the toxicity... maaan people do want to blame somene that aint them and rage on...

[@cadencoleman9441]

I’m in masters…while climbing I won only 45% of my games because u get placed on performance up until masters my best advice is just keep playing and as u rank up it get easier

[@Vjklv-ty7mn]

1 big tip,i placed gold as junkrat,bad pc,fully high and drunk,not caring at all bout my placing,and i play mcree in quick play but junkrat is just easy carry,BUT BUT BUT,if you take soujurn and have a friend to mercy pocket you will not notice elo hell,you will just climb stupid easy rn,half of my games in gold had one of these duos just raping the lobby,sometimes its mercy ashe,or even mercy widow,mercy soldier...they just diff the other dps and then bully the tank,there isnt realy anything to do vs that as a solo q player,so the easyest way to rank up is have a mercy pocket a dps,In My OPINION

[@Icipher353]

Everyone who isn't in OWL is in elo hell.

[@cmg7960]

Keep everyone alive and you win widow''s you are bad doesnt matter if you 20--1 iff you cant push or stop Sick of losing push maps when my team has an Ashe and a widow.

[@leebrown1049]

The worst mistakes I see in the lower ranks are positioning and feeing oh and picking widow when you have no aim whatsoever....why you would want to hold your team back because it makes you feel better until you lose, I just don't get it but there seems to be at least 1 in every 3 games

[@donovan4222]

I’m diamond rn, but climbing through bronze-plat the biggest problem I see is players always push at the wrong times…during team fights when you need to make a play to win, the team sits backs and pokes conservatively. After you lose a team fight when you need to wait and group up, people run into the enemy and feed.

[@leebrown1049]

@@donovan4222 I'm in gold and you're totally correct. Even yesterday in a game I was holding back after a lost team fight only to see one of the DPS run out to solo a team. I did see it in Overwatch one but I think because 2 is for free people think they can just pick it up and play like COD or Fortnite. Cheers for the feedback Donovan, all the best for the New Year

[@lucasgalen3101]

TLDR the reasons people complain elo hell exists are real, but just get better 5 head and you will climb. Fam the reason people complain elo hell is a problem because it is and is real. Of course you will climb if you keep just throwing yourself at the wall. Should we really be deciding if people can climb by war of attrition? Whoever has the higher mental and fortitude to keep hitting the queue button in a day can pass the lofty gates. No we shouldn't we should be paired up with people who are actually at the skill level we are at. The sooner devs and players acknowledge that elo hell is real major changes could be made to the match making system. Sweeping the inherent issues under the rug as a growth or skill issues doesn't change the fact match making is putting you in a situation where it is unlikely to win let alone improve as a player.

[@cmdrTremyss]

How about Blizzard not placing me back to Bronz 5 every season?! (yeah I see that after my 7 wins) And forcing me to slow climb, since another 7 wins + 3 losses means I rank up only to B4? So 100 games to Gold 5 if I keep this win percentage. Most likely I won't, so it will take 150-200 games at least. And it's only one role. I don't even play 200 games total in a season, and it's includes arcade and QP. Meaningful climbing is impossible, the seasons are too short for that. Elo hell is real. And it's intentional and arbitrary.

[@toogud7918]

That just means your mmr is close to bronze and you aren’t greatly outperforming in the lobby. To claim fast you have to obliterate the low tier lobbies

[@cmdrTremyss]

​@@toogud7918 I think I play at gold level AT LEAST. Yet in game I feel like I get plat / diamond smurfs on the enemy team very often. These super talented players often outperform me in bronz 5. I refuse to believe they are genuinely bronz 5 players. They are either smurfs or cheating in some way. (disclaimer: I've never been higher than low silver in OW1, but I think I deserve gold or better.)

[@JAOResnik]

I got from gold 5 to diamond this season as support, playing exclusively solo, and I never played the game before OW2. There's no elo hell. You can do it!

[@janwens5046]

The current ranking system and the state of OW2 is Elo hell!!! Every match is a coin flip. You either win hard or lose hard. There is rarely something in between. In OW1 this was different. Had a lot of (good) losing matches where losing didn't fell odd. Maybe this will change with time just like ow1. In the end of ow1 the matchmaking was way better then before. Imo because it was mostly people playing who knew what to do etc. Now in ow2 you have a lot of new players. On top you have a lot of no skill heroes who are really strong (Bastion, Symmetra, Orisa). Offcourse you can counter them but people need to work together and pick counterpicks. Time will tell if things will change. Right now overwatch is in the worst state ever imo...

[@donovan4222]

No getting rolled was a major problem in OW1, that’s something they tried to address in OW2. Also balancing issues are always a problem in OW, but balancing is really not that bad right now. Pretty much every character is at least playable for 95% of matches.

[@janwens5046]

@@donovan4222 Maybe you play a different game then me ;) but enjoy your experience.

[@rioriorio17]

The biggest thing is not displaying the whole lobby’s ranks and the average rank of each team. Like most people have their profiles hidden so I have no idea what rank I’m playing with. Like I was gold 3 after the reset but when I check some of the people I was playing with they were masters and diamond.

[@linxismenow5804]

All my stats go up my rank goes down. Gg blizzard

[@lasagnaboy4075]

I don't really play comp I feel it ruins the fun

[@pugloverpuglover517]

fr

[@orangemv]

I feel like the title is a little clickbaity. I love these videos and I want Mills to succeed... But I'd hate if Coach Mills turned into the average OW clickbait youtuber

[@ryanperrault8174]

It's not fun to play 30 game only to move from Bronze 5 to 4....Or from Silver 2 to 1. They all feel the same and it makes me not want to play. NO GAME out there takes this long to rank up ever. It's just a poor design. It takes too many games and I just don't have free time it takes to get there when there are other games I want to play as well. * The main problem with games like this and modern "games as a service" type games, is that the developers act Entitled to your time. They seriously think people will be here all day every day ONLY playing their game. Too many other options in life and it sucks because OW2 is a lot of fun, I just don't have 40+ hours a week to play JUST Overwatch.

[@josephbogart6604]

Yerp, and I'm in it

[@BloodRain222]

if you are anything below diamond,it’s all entirely on you to be real. i haven’t in ow2 but i can easily make another account and climb to master in a day. you gotta be the one outshining the enemy AND your own team. Ya’ll got this 😊

[@ch0wned]

The game was rigged from the start. They don't use Elo. It's called Engagement Optimized Matchmaking. Enragement, is engagement. An engaged player is an online player. A company with a large online pool at all times, is a money maker for investors. Why make new games when maintaining them as a service and maintaining player engagement is cheaper and more profitable? We've been duped. It's not Elo Hell. It's much worse. Your sweaties and rage fits are generating big bucks for CEOs, who've been duping shareholders regarding product quality with inflated or outright fabricated online numbers. That is fraud. ATVI PUTS #WallStreetBets

[@scproinc]

You definitely never played support in comp while in bronze.