EV vs Hybrid: Which Cost MORE to OWN?

[@thedukeofmiddleville]

What are your thoughts on the result of the comparison? Let me know your thoughts in the comments! Also, are there some other issues you would like for me to cover? Please LIKE and SUBCRIBE!

[@rpproductions844]

Tesla drivers tires go fast because we always flooring it 😂😅

[@samatwesu]

As a Lexus Hybrid owner, a Toyota and Chevy BEV owner. Your analysis is spot on. If you can charge at home or free/cheap at work local driving is no comparison for cost. On road trips It is dismal when needing multiple charges (leveraging the peak of charge curve). There is so much time added because I am keeping speeds at 60/65 to maximize range and minimize how often I need to pull off highway to get to a charger. Then 30 min+ charging adds up. Time is money. Hybrid for road trips and BEV for daily commute.

[@dvader3263]

Time is money? It doesn't sound like clear thinking if one is taking many long road trips and you're in a hurry. If in such a hurry for such a long distance road trip and not wanting to spend 20 to 25 minutes charging, than U are wasting time, money, hotel stays, days off and wear and tear on your vehicle. Take a jet and get to a destination in a few hours. Rent a car upon arrival. No wonder so many people struggle and are poor. They can't do math and they have no critical thinking skills. How many 2,000 mile road trips do most people take every year? For most people, none.

[@michaelwitkiewicz7052]

@@dvader3263there you go with that clear, rational thinking…

[@michaelwitkiewicz7052]

Time is not money. Until it is. Then why are you driving thousand mile road trips when you can fly to most location in this country much faster then driving. Plus factor in total cost in routine maintenance and recalculate.

[@melvinholland9656]

Solar and Powerwalls. I drive both EVs for free most of the year (when it's not snowing). I don't understand those folks that claim EVs require more maintenance. There is no service beyond washer fluid and tire rotation. Home charging is an under-appreciated blessing.

[@diydrivenGA]

Not for free: just shifted cost. How much are you paying monthly (if financed ) or out of pocket for that setup? I was quoted $30-40k which was competitive for the Powerwall. I know some people that have this setup and have lowered their power bills but are still paying a flat $300/month for 20 years.

[@OpinionatedOG184]

With a hybrid vehicle you’ll also need to factor in all of that maintenance and repairs in comparison to electric cars. I owned a hybrid. And all of the maintenance when I compared it to an electric car is why I got rid of it and went with electric. Not ever going back!

[@季东特]

I believe there are other variables you are missing like insurance cost, using heater/Ac which kills the kilowatt hr, upfront cost and repair cost if something hing does happen.

[@RoverIAC]

good one Duke. the rest of us new this for years.

[@thedukeofmiddleville]

Thanks! Yes, EV owners understand this.

[@Hawkc07]

St.Louis native here. Just discovered your channel. I love seeing more and more black youtubers in this space. One small suggestion would be to consider using background music in your videos to elevate the watch experience. Keep up the great work!

[@thedukeofmiddleville]

Hello fellow St. Louis native. Thanks for the suggestion. I have added music to earlier videos and it resulted in a copywrite strike from KZbin, so I want to avoid that. Thanks for commenting!

[@User.Joshua]

I am a huge EV enthusiast and I actually owned an EV for a while (ID4), but the winter range and charging experience were simply not worth the hassle. I now own the new Prius Prime and get about 45-55 miles per charge, which is good enough for 95% of EV use. The other 5% is spent in hybrid mode during lengthy road trips (3-4 times per year). When EV batteries aren't as susceptible to efficiency losses or performance issues in the hottest and coldest months, I'll probably buy another one. Then again, I am heavily eyeing the R2/R3(x).

[@diydrivenGA]

The best setup is a hybrid and a BEV, becaues the EV is the best for daily driving and the hybrid for road trips. However most hyrbids aren't fun, and that matters. Porsche makes some amazing hybrids, and BMW is doing the same but that is in the $150k+ demo. EVs are accessbile (albeit quiet) fun and the instant torque never gets tiring! One thing to consider is the regular hybrid vs plug in hybrid. The later gets the best and worst of both worlds including policy, where some states give it a higher registration fee, you' still need to get a home charger setup, and deal with maintaining a gas engine that really gets abused more than normal (despite claims of 10k oil changed- don't do that).

[@TB-up4xi]

At 47mpg and $3.00 a gallon = 6.4c per mile - that's at the low end for ICE cars though. The break even point for a Tesla model 3 at 0.25kwh per mile (mine uses 0.175 lifetime) is 25.6c per kwh, obviously the higher the gasoline price the higher the break even point for electricity. I pay 5.1c per kwh and get 5.7miles per kwh = 0.89c per mile. I would need to get 337mpg at $3 a gallon to break even. There are overnight rates even lower at 2.5c per kwh in some places that would translate to 684mpg. If you use domestic supply charges for example in PA they are 17.5c/kwh on average and gasoline is $3.30 a gallon so if you're paying full domestice rates (not overnight discount) then it's 80% more expensive per mile in a 47mpg car and the break-even point is an average of 28c per kwh. When I do the 1200 mile round trip from Sydney to Melbourne the first 300 miles and the last 250 miles only cost me 1 cent per mile becuase I leave home with 100% charge and get back home with 15% so it's only the middle 650miles that cost me around 40c per kwh / 8c per mile which averages out at 4.8c per mile still cheaper than a hybrid at 47mpg and $3 gas.

[@junehanzawa5165]

How many ICE vehicles get 47mpg at 70 or 80mph? Forget those EPA estimates/ratings. Those are based on 5 cycle tests that basically average 55mph at the end. Not realistic to how most Americans drive. And keep in mind that most Americans drive heavy pickups, SUV's or minivans. Ford stopped making sedans altogether for that very reason. They're not selling.

[@diydrivenGA]

@@junehanzawa5165 Exactly! In reality the 23-30mpg range covers the majority of what's on the road.

[@cackerson10]

Great video, I figure I get about 30 miles of range for every $1.00 of electricity here in Michigan with our rates which are around 0.11 KWH. This is for a 2020 Chevy Bolt Premier.

[@Futurase1]

It is $.07 here in Northwest Arkansas. $.05 from 10PM-6AM.

[@thedukeofmiddleville]

That's a great rate!

[@jeffmcclendon3835]

A plug in hybrid with 20 to 40 miles of range could level the field versus a comparable EV. However, at the moment the only widely available and affordable plug in hybrid in the USA that qualifies for the Federal and some state tax credits is the Ford Escape if you can find one. Otherwise, you are paying full price for the other plug in hybrids being sold in the US while Tesla, GM, VW and some Ford EVs are qualifying for up to $15,000 off the top in Federal and some state tax rebates. My 2025 Equinox LT with the comfort/convenience package ended up costing me $26,000 after taxes for a $41,000 EV.

[@douglee2438]

Please look up insurance rates. I was looking at getting a low mileage 3 year old used Tesla. I also looked at several new cars, that are about the same price. The Tesla was $2400/year, the others $1600/year. That extra insurance would kill any other advantages.

[@thedukeofmiddleville]

What cars did you compare to the Tesla? Because that make a big difference. I already did a video comparing insurance with real data. You should check it out.

[@BangkokPaul]

Is it possible to put a few solar panels in your backyard and recharge the car that way?

[@joebullwinkle5099]

I have a buddy with a Honda CRV hybrid and he claimed that his CRV gets 35Mpg on the Hwy, 40 Mpg around town, real Mpg was 33 around town. We did ~250 mile road trip at 75-80Mph, he got 27 Mpg. Advertised Hybrid Mpg ratings are way over optimistic in my view.

[@junehanzawa5165]

EPA ratings/estimates are based on an unrealistic 5 cycle test. It basically equals to driving at 55mph on the highway. Totally unrealistic to how most people drive. Hybrids get nowhere near what they claim unless you're driving at 55 on under on the highway. Most Americans drive at 70 to 80mph or higher. And in city driving, they're never going to beat an EV, since an EV regains much of the energy it's using when slowing down or coming to a stop through regening. And keep in mind that most Americans drive heavy pickup, SUV's or minivans.

[@User.Joshua]

What he claims could certainly be true for his daily commutes. I'd imagine you're not getting the rated EV range at 75-80 mph either.

[@junehanzawa5165]

@@User.Joshua No, but most modern EV's of the last 2 or 3 years come very close, or exceed it at a constant 70mph. EV's like the 2024 Tesla Model 3 RWD long range exceeded its 363 EPA range, going 372 miles down to 0%, (and 384 miles if you use the buffer below 0%, which no one will ever use unless in an emergency). And the Lucid Air went over 520 miles on the same test, which is above it's EPA rating. These tests have been done on the same stretch of highway at a constant 70mph, and recorded on videos for all to see the full test. While no gas or Hybrids ever matches their EPA at a constant 70mph because their EPA rating is based on their 5 cycle tests that equates to 55mph on the highway. And of course, you can't compare ICE or ICE hybrids to a pure modern EV in city driving because an EV recoups a good amount of the energy used when slowing down or coming to a stop, so it will always beat ICE or ICE hybrids. Which is why that CRV hybrid doesn't get it's advertised EPA rating in real world driving. You're only going to get it if you go to extremes, such as driving at 55mpg on 70mpg speed highways and the such, or sticking to only driving on 55mph roads/turnpikes etc. But that's not the real world.

[@User.Joshua]

@@junehanzawa5165 I am well aware of the tests that Kyle and crew have put together, but they're always in ideal EV conditions, which is why they rushed the last few tests before the incoming winter season (as told by Out of Spec). The 70 mph range test itself is a fair assessment given they compare specs between vehicles, so they need to match conditions. However, their tests aren't representative of year-round efficiency for EVs. I've owned an ID4 and the summer/winter range is unbelievably different. I will also challenge the idea that "no gas or hybrids ever match their EPA rating". I own a 2022 Prius that I purchased new and I have 41k miles on it and I've averaged 58 miles per gallon over the course of all of those miles and it's only rated for 52 mpg combined in the AWD variant. The same is true for my new Prius Prime. It exceeds the EV range and city-rated range. I will concede that the new Prius Prime appears to be less efficient than the EPA-rated numbers at faster highway speeds and it doesn't always meet the rated range, but because it over performs on those other efficiency metrics, it kind of makes up for it. I love EVs just as much as the next EV enthusiast having owned them myself, but the notion that hybrids aren't meeting their EPA ratings is just untrue.

[@junehanzawa5165]

@@User.Joshua My cousin has owned 2 Prius in the last 20 years. He's told me he has never gotten close to getting it's EPA when driving on the highway at 70mph, which he sticks to most times instead of the 75 to 80mph in order to get better mileage. That's the only personal experience that I can speak about with Prius, so I can't contradict or confirm what you're saying other than relating my cousins' experience with them. But I will add that you have to keep in mind the very little power that a Prius has vs a Tesla Model 3, for example. Even the long range RWD only does 0-60 mph in 4.9 seconds. I have been in a Prius a few times as a passenger throughout the years, and none of those felt as though they could do 0-60 in under 10 seconds. So that's a night and day difference in power. So to compare a Prius to a Model 3, that's not even apples to oranges. That's more like apples to grapes. You have to compare vehicles of similar size and power. I'm not sure what your ID4 did 0-60, but I know it's not the most efficient EV out there. And of course, it's a midsized SUV, so larger and heavier than the Prius. So I would say not a proper comparison either. To relate an EV to the Prius, a German team was doing long distant tests on an a super efficient EV concept, and they went well over 600 miles with it. I complained to them that they only went that far because it had very little power and they were hype-miling it going only 55mph and the like. Of course, they got very angry at me when I pointed it out. But I stuck to my point. That was not a proper EV. And I don't think it went anywhere in the end.

[@ElMistroFeroz]

Supercharging eliminates one of those the best advantages of owning an EV. Which is critical because all of the sudden everyone who watches TV religiously goes on road trips every day.

[@normand30]

You forgot to factor the hybrid will get you there faster on the road trip. Less stops to fuel.

[@davidkreim6544]

Also, your efficiency in an electric car is better than a hybrid with commuter miles.

[@aikafuwa7177]

If gas is 1.44 a gallon you can bet electricity will also be cheaper.

[@kevinmcneill1074]

Don’t forget depreciation. EV depreciation is insane. Most hybrids will hold their value much better.

[@diydrivenGA]

Yeah, the paradigm for now is to lease an EV when new, and if buying- look to the used market.

[@aikafuwa7177]

BTW not everyone wants to drive a boring Camry hybrid. Any fun to drive car will easily be doing worse than 25 mpg if not more like 20 mpg. And for road trips hybrids also get worse fuel economy.

[@junehanzawa5165]

A Toyota Camry, hybrid or otherwise, will never get 47mpg going at a constant 70mph. That EPA rating/estimate is based on a 5 cycle test that equates to going at 55mph on the highway. While a 2024 Model 3 long range has been proven to go over 360 miles (383 total counting the buffer, which I'm not) at a constant 70mph to match their great efficiency. These tests have all been done on online videos under the same stretch of highway and published for all to see.

[@TwinForce-e3m]

I found I drive different than my wife , My consumption is less than my wife , both cars - electric or Diesel my wife has a heavy foot , so its hard to gauge consumptions when we both drive about , when I drive I get better fuel consumption why its the way I drive , I speed up slower to highway speed where my wife likes to get up to the bumper quicker then brake gas brake gas . It was terrible with her towing the airstream when I took a break , my breaks where shorter at times.

[@coldtesla6212]

3.20 a Gallon, that is cheap how do you get that? In Canada it is 1.49/ liter X 3.78 = 5.63/ gallon is more like it. That is the cheapest it has been in years!!

[@ziploc2000]

You have to compare like with like, so if you want an EV that compares to a base model Toyota Camry, why not the Toyota bZ4X? Similar dimensions and power ratings, the bZ has estimated 119 mpge for the base model, while the base Camry is 47/48 mpg. mpge is only there to make this specific comparison, but the bZ is approximately 2.5 times more efficient to run. I hate mpge, but it works out as 3.5mile/kWh. The elephant in the room is the extra $13,000 you need to buy the bZ4X over the Camry (new base models in both case), but over the long run the bZ4X will be cheaper, assuming you do most of your charging at home at a good tariff. That's before we factor in maintenance costs, which as others have said is practically zero on the EV.

[@junehanzawa5165]

Because the BZ4X is a horrible EV, with terrible charging speeds, a relatively short driving range, and poor effciency for a modern EV. You can't compare that to a proper modern EV like a Model 3 or Ioniq 6 long range, with their modern high charging rates, efficiency, and long driving ranges of over 360 miles at a constant 70mph. These tests have all been done on online videos under the same stretch of highway and published for all to see. And a Toyota Camry will never get 47mpg going at a constant 70mph. That EPA rating/estimate is based on a 5 cycle test that equates to going at 55mph on the highway.

[@thedukeofmiddleville]

This👆 The Toyota cared so little they didn't bother giving it a real name😄

[@ziploc2000]

@@thedukeofmiddleville It is a stupid name, I think Toyota don't actually want to sell any. I watched the Thursday night game on Amazon Prime and while there were Toyota ads, they didn't mention this. It's like they're deliberately hiding it.

[@ziploc2000]

@@junehanzawa5165 Agreed, if I were buying another EV it wouldn't be a bZ4X, but the point was even that is more efficient than a Camry and will save you money in the long run.

[@OasisAmps]

2 things you have zero control of gas prices and you can never be independent from gas. If you set-up your home correctly you can now be completely off the grid and earn income frome several sources. Can never do that with gas.

[@AntLive29]

good topic my guy

[@thedukeofmiddleville]

Thanks!

[@lashlarue59]

So in other words if you drive an electric car like its a gas car it's going to perform worse than the gas car; but if you drive the electric car like it's an electric car it's going to perform better that the gas car. There are so many things that could makes the gap even bigger like I play the super off-peak electric price game where I pay 5 cents in winter and 8 cents in summer per kwh. I drive everywhere I need to go in 350-400 miles a month, not 1200. This proves the point being if you're going to treat an electric car like a gas car then what is the point of driving a EV at all? Just buy a gas car and save some money.

[@SomaliDibJir]

Nobody buys their car solely for road trips, and Nobody likes to drive for 1500 miles. Road trips are side order and happen once or twice a year. I own a Tesla and charge at home, however I do one major road trip to Toronto Canada once a year where a gallon of gas is $8.00 Canadian. I like toyota products but once it comes to daily driver Electric is a way to go.

[@carycoplon5681]

The math is what it is. But if you live in an apartment, condo with no access to home charging. And you live in a climate that has winter? And bitter cold that effects batteries and not gasoline. What then?

[@danharold3087]

It is amazing how now that we have electric cars bitter cold no longer effects ICE cars. Tell me that when the stores no longer sell jumper cables and jumper packs.

[@junehanzawa5165]

Norway has the highest rate of EV adoption in the world. Over 93% of all light duty vehicles purchased in Norway are fully electric. And many buses and Semi trucks are also fully electric. Are you going to compare the freezing cold of Norway in winter, where the sun never rises in its northern section, to America? Only if you live in Alaska.

[@trstrean]

Great comparison! Hybrids are a distraction. Automakers would love for those to be the future because they get all of the repairs of an ICE AND all of the repairs for the battery components. I'm still scratching my head why charging networks are priced so much higher than local electric rates. I wonder how they justify the 300% markup other than because most EV owners can afford to pay it. If I was a gas station, I'd be jumping at the potential for those high margin profits. Superchargers around me are 0.47 while electric is 0.07 to 0.12

[@junehanzawa5165]

Do you own a Tesla? If not, that rate is more like 0.35 cents. None Teslas can get that same low price with a membership. It pays for itself after one full charge per month and you can cancel at any time. Which all providers have to get lower rates.

[@trstrean]

@junehanzawa5165 I don't have a Tesla and don't road trip enough to get a membership. I was thinking more of the apartment folks like my kids. Membership is one of my complaints about Tesla. What gas station requires a membership? Policies like those turn people away from EVs. People already complain that it costs more to fill up an EV and if you think about it, people in apartments are often the people that can't afford high priced gas or eggs so they are the ones paying excessively higher charging rates or these membership fees. For my kids that live in apartments and have low paying jobs, why would they ever get an EV if they are cost conscious? I wouldn't have at that age. I got the $9k Nissan Sentra brand new for its low cost, good range, and high reliability.

[@dianewallace6064]

Great video. Great math. To further your point, I propose that the Tesla Supercharger price per kwh is $0.27 instead of $0.35 for a model3 non-member in the Tesla charging app. A Tesla owner could confirm or deny. I own non-Teslas: an R1T and Ioniq6. My friend who owns a model S says he pays $0.27 per kwh and no $13 monthly membership.

[@junehanzawa5165]

That is correct. Tesla owners pay the original lower price. The reason being is that the purchasing of those Teslas partly paid for the network, which cost many, many billions to build all on their own. And they don't want to piss off Tesla owners by simply opening to all without the others paying anything, so they charge none Tesla drivers the extra price unless they have a membership. We'll worth the price if you don't have charging at home or go on road trips often. You save about 25%. One full charge usually pays for it and you can cancel at any time. Also keep in mind that other providers also have a membership to get lower pricing. So it's no different. And even with memberships on other providers, superchargers are still cheaper most of the times. And most locations have time of day charging, so it's cheaper at less busy times of the day. The app has all the pricing details and times per location.

[@thomasrutledge1052]

@@junehanzawa5165Totally agree. I charge my Tesla at home in Texas. 15c per kWh. No overnight discounts. Some locations around the Houston area suburbs charge 14c per kWh at late night or wee hours in the morning. 1-2 road trips per year. I bet for most retirees like us, charging at home and driving around 30 miles or less per day EV is the way to go. I do recall adding washer fluid one time in the past 2 years.

[@OasisAmps]

Hi Duke, I would like to sponsor your channel. With our App. Let me know.