Everyone Hates Palworld - Inside Gamescast

[@QDJW]

Why is Pokemon the only IP where people can't make a game without being called a copy. Everything gets a name, boomer shooter, souls like, Metroid vania. But let it be a monster catcher it's just a copy

[@charles62752]

I would argue, like Bruce did, there have been plenty of monster catching pokemon like games that aren't called a copy. Digimon, monster rancher, monster hunter stories...etc...etc... The biggest problem most "haters" have with this particular game is that it is almost exactly a 1-1 recreation of pokemon's art style and game loop. I personally don't see a problem with it but it's not my art to defend and in terms of pokemon they've been too comfortable with just copy paste slop for far too long. That being said I blame us as consumers more than TPC as we are monetarily supporting slop and in most cases asking for seconds.

[@kg-zj2lq]

The front suffered from this

[@nestormartinez1593]

Mon genre is a thing that hasn't been explored fully because of the monopoly that Pokemon has (had anyone coined Mon genre yet lol)

[@LuvMachine707]

I think it comes down to Pokémon fans. They can't accept that their favorite IP isn't that original to begin with, which makes it easily copied. I heard the same thing about Digimon despite the story being better.

[@gabeskai]

Actually, it took about 20 years for people to stop calling digimon a Pokemon ripoff. And that's mostly people outside the Pokemon fanbase. Ask someone within it, and there's a 25% chance they still think of digimon as a Pokemon knockoff 😒

[@yoboots1]

I like this casual discussion format.

[@smeauxk]

Palworld blew up because Pokemon has been handled poorly for years. Palworld needed to exist.

[@Gamer_Man_Bathwater]

Also, Palworld doesn't just barely clear the low bar set by Pokemon, it's far ahead of it in many ways. The graphics, the pacing of the gameplay, the combat, the multiplayer are all vastly improved. It would be one thing if it just copied Pokemon and barely improved on it but it's way ahead of it in many ways.

[@Kyle-yn5hy]

What, no. There have been way better, way less derivative takes on the Pokemon formula. Palworld is such a blatant mismash of early access tropes, which is incidentally, probably why it blew up. *Cassette Beasts* from just last year is an incredible monster battler which evolves the Pokemon formula in a lot of really interesting and original ways. Palworld is just Ark/Conan Exiles but NPCs are barely altered Pokemon models.

[@smeauxk]

@Kyle-yn5hy So if Palworld takes things from Ark that work really well with the monster battler formula, they're unoriginal. But when any other game adds features from other titles, it's an evolution of the Pokemon formula. Pokemon cost $60 every year. $120 for super nerds who want both versions. And last year, they couldn't even give us a working game. Palworld cost $25 dollars. For that price you get a huge map. A really solid crafting system. 111 pals all with their own abilities, passive, and animation sets. Also the combat is very passable. You don't have to like it. You don't even have to play it. But the fact that it exist will make future Pokémon titles less dog shit.

[@sushi_wolf]

I agree just like BG3, don’t let the game companies get to cozy then they start lacking.

[@sushi_wolf]

@@Kyle-yn5hyokay who cares, they sold how many copies? I think your opinion is rather irrelevant.

[@hammy5126]

Competition is always great ESPECIALLY wen the biggest franchise in the world has to acknowledge something of this stature that is blowing up like it is. Wild that people are sending DEATH THREATS to a developer that might actually help them get the product they want

[@awsomeman350]

I feel like Lawrence really doesn’t understand this. It’s not successful because it’s Pokémon with guns, it’s popular because it’s Ark with pokrmon. If this was a turn based Pokémon knock off, no one would be playing

[@mezkoo4259]

Temtem being a perfect example of this.

[@awsomeman350]

@@mezkoo4259 exactly. temtem isnt filling a niche, its just another pokemon game.

[@TheBlargMarg]

kind of interesting situation how Palworld is kind of in the same boat as The Day Before, except the developers actually delivered an actual game.

[@aliquidgaming1068]

​@@TrojanGamer10we really are in an interesting era of gaming I love it So many good and just fun games I got lost in parlworld like I haven't in game since I was a kid

[@TheEdenSapling]

not sure that's entirely true - the early palworld trailers were pretty accurate in terms of the product they were advertising, whereas the day before advertised a completely different product, ripped off other trailers, and then delivered a product absolutely nothing like what was advertised, nevermind one that works. some of the criticisms can be shared between them, but for all palworld's faults its a functional, fun game by most accounts

[@mrthewhite2620]

I think a lot of the hate for this game comes from the fact that this was supposed to be a junk pokemon clone but it turned out to be an actually fun Ark/Pokemon clone. The game actually introduces new mechanics into the survival/crafting part of the game that makes it WAY WAY more accessible to the average gamer by having your pals collect and craft materials for you. It removes a lot of the tedium that most Survival/Crafting games suffer from and then has real time pokemon battles on top of that.

[@MrWright14]

I'm kind of glad that Lawrence and Bruce are on different sides because hearing their experiences are important to the news of the game. Like Lawrence, I don't like survival games and I've watched Bruce's streams of Palworld quite a bit, and just don't understand the fun with it. I think it's kind of baffling that a lot of "hate" is circling this game. I also haven't played it, so I can't determine if it's good or not, but I'm pretty confident I wouldn't enjoy it. That's one of the great things about streaming too. I can tune in for a huge, taking-over-the-internet game, determine if it'll be for me or not, and make my decision from there whether to seek it out. Just because you "know" you may not like it doesn't mean it deserves to get hate. Thanks guys for all that you do this was a really interesting conversation.

[@TheGreatMilksteak]

It looked completely off putting to me as well but I have it a try and now can't pull the needle out of my arm without withdrawals. Highly recommend trying it before passing judgement, if it sucks just get it refunded through steam.

[@bobbob679]

I think the big difference between Bruce's and Lawrence's experience is that Lawrence started from the beginning with no multiplayer, Bruce started on someone else's world with most basic things built. Then when Bruce needed three things he would grab one and the other players would grab the rest. There are settings that you can decrease a lot of the grind, I recommend this if you are playing alone and want to free yourself up to do other things in the game. Like if you want to focus on capturing pals, decrease the grinding mechanics.

[@blackstarninja6785]

I honestly feel the same way about pokemon though. I just don’t get the fun, and they seem like the laziest slapped together IP placement games. this game seems, I guess, slightly more interesting in that there is more to it than just catching and fighting. This must just not be my type of game!

[@nntflow7058]

There are people who made tons of money from Pokémon related products and contents. They probably wants Palworld to fail to make sure that their card collections valuation stays high.

[@dgnightwing95]

I initially ignored this game on steam, but then friends wanted to try it and now I can't stop playing.

[@biannualstabbing2375]

The guy that put out the series of tweets comparing the meshes confessed that he altered the Palworld meshes to scale them closer to the Pokemon ones. He said was just being "silly" but doesn't think he did anything wrong because of "animal cruelty" in the game.

[@jacobwansleeben3364]

Any video game with fantastical creatures in it that you can capture and use for battle: *exists* Pokemon sheeple: *confused screaming*

[@timholstad2723]

Honestly, I also think that what yall covered right at the end with Suicide Squad encapsulates why people love Palworld. No microtransactions. No pals locked behind packs or passes. No prohibitive cost to entry. Just playing the game gets you all you will ever need to have fun and to “win”. And it’s not like Pokémon where you have to manage the different types and level teams to exploit weaknesses. It’s not RNG-based combat. Everything frustrating about modern games is more or less absent or minimized in this game. And it’s multi-player, and it’s co-op, and it’s free through Gamepass, or $30 at most. Just my thoughts! Love your content, I enjoy the practicality and objectivity you strive to provide without completely removing emotion from the equation.

[@chaosXP3RT]

7:09 I'm trying to respect and understand Lawrence's opinion, but if you pay attention, the game is not hard at all. There is actually zero reason to punch any trees. You can get everything you need in the beginning by simply picking wood and stone up off the ground. I personally don't understand the struggle at all. But I've also seen several streamers struggle, including complaining that their starving Pals are dying quickly in battles. Maybe the survival aspect is not knowing how to read the tutorial? Or maybe more people expected it to be on rails like Pokemon? I'm not sure. I don't understand some of the criticism

[@snarfbomber298]

When Lawrence is running talkin bout getting bored I think what I enjoyed right away was being efficient. Like I’m gonna go catch a bunch of stuff and level, I’m gonna get some ore, get some pal fluid and explore and uncover the map in that direction. That was kind of the decision making loop for me

[@Salaundre]

Innovations isn’t coming up with something new, that’s invention, it’s taking something into a new direction or improving upon the idea. What they did was very innovative.

[@CallumLovekin]

Loved the back and forth between you both here - really interesting watching two people with different tastes have a constructive and honest conversation, could watch episodes of this every day… thanks for the vid!

[@cultofcringthulhu]

Palworld is a great example of the game aka Pokémon not meeting consumer wants, the consumers will go to anything else that's similar with a twist. There is a huge market for Pokémon games away from Nintendo consoles and it's stupid that Nintendo probably realizes that yet they don't do anything about cause they think it will effect console sales.

[@Kyle-yn5hy]

Except that there's way better Pokemon style games out there already which are way more original. If fans of the franchise feel short changed by recent Pokemon games, they could play a game like Cassette Beasts or Temtem or Monster Hunter Stories. Cassette Beasts in particular is a stand out RPG, which evolves the Pokemon formula substantially. Palworld isn't a Pokemon clone, it's an Ark or Conan Exiles clone with Pokemon in it.

[@unironicallydel7527]

as someone who had absolutely burnt out of pokemon/pokemonlikes, Palworld hooked me instantly. pokemon likes are usually boring as hell bc all you can ever do is catch and battle with your creatures. Palworld is alot different than that same pokemon gameplay loop.

[@MrCompenso]

Nintendo doesn't care about the fans, releasing games with minimal effort and never listening. They hate that this game is what people want and it's succeeding.

[@thentil]

There wasn't much tree punching. Literally ten minutes, then some tree axing, then my base had a tree farm and my pals were farming it.

[@fluidthought42]

Ah, I dunno if having a tree punching farm with tree punching automation mechanics makes it less of a tree puncher in the end.

[@fieldy409]

Yeah it sounds like Bruce rushed automation and Lawrence didn't.

[@dgnightwing95]

They are talking about not doing the punching themselves and instead automate it so they can do other things.

[@JBPVFL]

@@fluidthought42outside of needing fiber, you can get away from ever needing to farm trees within the first 20-30 minutes. Same with the stone. You do need to farm sulfur and the blue stones that can be found while out adventuring.

[@halcyon6098]

So quick. So easy. So fun..

[@minisithunknown5568]

Honestly watching the YoutTube videos on Palworld did not get me excited and still had me questioning if it really could be fun, unlike most of the survivor crafting games that has came out since Minecraft. But the $30 plus it being on sale I decided to buy it figuring I could at least get my money in play time before I got bored of it. Yet after playing it for over 15 hours already I am enjoying it way more than I thought I would. I am hooked on the gameplay and about to read the lore notes that I collected in the game. All the mechanics in the game add up to a more rich game than I expected. Which is crafting, which is amplified by Pals. Building, which is amplified by Pals. Combat, which is amplified by Pals. Collecting and gathering of resources, which is amplified by Pals. They made everything about Pals, like Pokemon does in it's world. Pokemon is used as labor, entertainment, to survival and abuse. The fact that you can breed and have traits on the Pals to modify them is like in a looter game when the equipment is random that you find so you go and try to find the ones you want. And the traits can be for combat, traveling or building. I would like to see the traits also affect the looks of the Pals in the future which can happen since it is Early Access. Crossbreeding species might not be doable for the game's system but would be awesome to see. I think if they used AI it would be possible. But the traits do add a lot more to the game IMO.

[@sinisin2000]

I bought Palworld out of curiosity and I've been enjoying it so far. I know I'll bounce off it eventually because I'm not a fan of survival games and I don't care for Pokemon but Pocket Pair has something here. I like the systems at play and I like the pacing.

[@dug1115]

My Pal world expireance. Hunted for sexy lizards, got my ass beat because they were 10 levels higher than me. Finaly got one of them in a ball but they killed me just before the ball hit them. Still got the capture while I was face first on the ground, felt like an epic gamer. 10/10, going to do it all over again with Anubis.

[@Jekyllfiction]

Lawrence and Bruce are peak gaming journalism, and this kind of two-sided discussion is super valuable to any game designer out there. Love the "gamer of the people" vs "the refined gamer" comparison 😂

[@Mcdigits]

People seem to forget that inspiration is a thing, like the head of the company has said they love Nintendo games and it is very clear they were inspired by them with the games they make so of course there are some similarities but to outright claim plagiarism or theft is absolutely nonsense especially considering how most all game mechanics these days are just a rehash of mechanics from other popular games eg. BOTW. I've played a ton of survival crafting games just like Bruce and most of them are real janky and simple especially in EA but this has a level of polish across the board and thoughtful design that sets it in a class above the rest. I Also highly disagree about the combat being bad, this game has a dodge roll with I-frames ffs meaning that you can solo most creatures and enemies with Dark Souls style finesse while launching volleys of arrows or bullets at your enemies then pull out a pal and use their powers which is all really fun and satisfying to do and makes you feel in control more so than any other crafting game out there. Just for some context I'm someone who unironically Loved Pokemon S/V and still play it from time to time and like Bruce I couldn't get into RDR2 despite being someone who adores a great story but acquiring new mechanics by playing is important too. In Palworld as I progress I get new things I can do all the time (like flying) where as with RDR2 you effectively do the same thing from beginning to end with little variation other than the narrative

[@AlbertoMartinez765]

pretty much every Videogame, SONG, Movie and Books are all Copied or "Inspired" from previous works ...there hasn't been anything truly "Original" in Decades..its all been Done.

[@baitbait65]

I also don't like survival games, but with PalWorld, there are enough other gameplay hooks (fighting, exploring, dungeon crawling) that make want to engage with the crafting to make progress in.

[@halcyon6098]

Dungeon crawls .. 👌

[@P0ngers]

There's definitely more to Palworld then just being a pokemon clone. There's other games like Temtem, Monster Sanctuary, Nexomon that are more similar in terms of gameplay loop, but neither game saw the same success as palworld. I picked up Pokemon Legends after playing Palworld and honestly, I prefer Palworld's gameplay loop. In Legends, you have to battle and capture the same pokemon over and over to fill up research and then the Pokemon just sit in the ranch so you can use them for side quests. It's super repetitive and honestly gets pretty boring when you try and fill an entire page. In Palworld you catch multiples of the same Pal and it allows you to expand production and resource management. They also level up doing tasks and you have to manage their health. It may look like Pokemon on the surface, but it plays more like "Cult of the Lamb" (kinda closer thematically too). At the end of the day, if Palworld is the game that makes Game Freak/Nintendo take Pokemon off the back burner, then that's better for the consumer.

[@trentkuzman5528]

Even if the developer takes this game and runs, the modding community is going to be playing with this game for years.

[@musickman619]

I think the biggest reason we haven't seen other open world style pocket monster like games is because Nintendo/Game Freak/Niantic are the most legal ready game company in the world. Few have dared push up against the line of what is considered infringement. In cases like Pokemon Uranium, it makes sense they would get into legal trouble. For Palworld, are there similarities, absolutely. But I think there is so much different here that they shouldn't be subject to legal ramifications. Or if they are, it's to the extent of having to change some Pal models around and not just a complete game shut down. If you compare any war time FPS game to another war time FPS game you're going to find similarities. No matter how original these Pals are, or any other monster in another similar game, you're going to see similarities to other Pokemon. Pokemon has like a million +1 different monsters, it would be harder to not find similarities at all. For fuck sake they have a literal trash bag Pokemon. It's the same problem like what we have in the music industry, there's only so many notes in our hearing spectrum, so of course over time certain artists are going to sound like another, or a chord progression from one band is the same another band is using. It's not the chords themselves, but how you use them and everything else around it. The problem I have with the discourse around Palworld is that Pokemon die hards are always going to claim this as a clone, even though the devs for all Pokemon games have repeatedly failed at doing an open world style Pokemon game. And for me at least, I don't want specifically a Pokemon open world game, I like the old school format. However, I DO want an open world multiplayer like game where you can travel to different areas, biomes, worlds, and collect, craft and use that worlds monsters/pets/pals to your advantage. Personally I find the introduction of guns in the game to be a bit of a reach, but also funny and awesome. I do somewhat wish that the Pal weapons were a bit more thematic to the world and not just guns, but I do see how they tried to make them make sense, like turning your fiery fox Pal into a flamethrower. Palworld so far, hits that mark and if they manage themselves properly, I can see this game turning into something much bigger. OR on the flipside, it could absolutely go the route Craftopia has and just be a mish mosh of a bunch of different game mechanics and ultimately never define what you are or want to be as a game. I'm hoping the former is what comes true as I've sincerely gotten hooked on this game. A timely release during the winter months when I'm inside more wanting to scratch that open world survival craft itch.

[@stuartthomson4563]

There is a tweet floating around stating that the original mesh comparison was faked and scaled to make it match because the person didn't like the cruelty towards animals portrayed. Not sure if it's a real thing or twitter being twitter so take that with a grain of salt

[@umbeon]

It's not copying, it's inspirational in the style it has been created. Nintendo has done this in the past as well as other companies and art forms to create their worlds. This happens in music, art and various other fields. "There is nothing new under the Sun."

[@justicerainz]

Man, I'm the complete opposite of Bruce when he was talking about not thinking in games. I don't really connect with movies and TV anymore, but there's so much great stuff in games that tackles philosophical issues. One thing that makes games so much better for that is that you're a part of the actions happening, not just a passive observer like in TV/movies.

[@biagioruggiero4571]

I think the idea of intrinsic vs. extrinsic motivation really drives what you do and dont find interesting in games- survival games are so intrinsically motivated that I get why they can be polarising/divisive.

[@MrGhosty0091]

Just wanted to mention to Lawrence or anyone who might feel similarly about survival games. Part of that "consequential decisions" thing is self driven. For example, I get a lot of pleasure out of figuring out the most efficient way to collect/gather resources so that it doesn't feel like a chore. The game isn't forcing me to make those decisions but I feel rewarded for figuring them out in as timely a manner as possible. The example I would give with Palworld is that the first thing I do in a survival game is lockdown a steady source of basic resources within a short distance from wherever I setup my base. With Palworld I was able to to focus on getting the mining/lumbering nodes unlocked pretty quickly and I then set about getting the pals that would work those nodes while I was off exploring (with some duplicates to swap them out when they needed a rest). With that steady source of material coming in, I don't need to worry about harvesting rock and wood as I'm out exploring which leaves my bag space open for collecting more eggs I find in the environment, the stuff in chest and more specific drops from the pals that I know I'll be needing. I can absolutely see how many people would find that open ended gameplay tedious or dull, just as I think fighting games or turn based strategy are tedious or dull. It's all about whatever flicks your switch and that is why I celebrate when games I have no interest in do well. The more variable games are, the more chances we get for cross pollination and just general health of the industry. With this game and enshrouded I am really feeling positively about survival games again as so many that have come out since Ark tend to emphasis elements of the genre I don't enjoy. Really loved hearing both points of view from you both.

[@akbmfm]

Somebody on Dunkey's video correctly summarized it as "if every early access game on steam was put together."

[@aliquidgaming1068]

"this game makes you feel like you're playing every early access game on steam at once"

[@akbmfm]

@@aliquidgaming1068 That's the one!

[@albaniancowboy2767]

The main thing is u can make this game super easy or super hard and that’s what I love about it and u can change the setting whenever u want

[@PolygonAlley]

We need to rep "cassette beasts" as well, because if you want that other story-based, brilliant monster design, interesting "shtick", top-down monster catcher, in a Pokemon style, it does it better than Pokemon too. There's no need for Pokemon anymore...

[@CarlosRodela]

it's basically Craftopia (same devs) but with creature collecting. people are focusing on the wrong part (pokemon). Craftopia was weird and super addictive. That's this game.

[@relax4905]

100% on board with Bruce. I have little interest in survival games because of the grind, and Palworld takes all of that and makes it actually fun. Palworld is going to redefine survival games, in a good way.

[@kornoth9339]

As they said about the bar being low to succeed in this genre the real interesting thing is how they decide to develop this game further, sky's the limit

[@Scribbles69]

I think the future of this game can pretty easily follow the ark model where they just sell new map dlc with a couple new pals and mechanics and just do that forever

[@kellbomb331]

It's kinda ironic that Lawrence finds Palworld boring but does Final Fantasy raids every week, literally the most boring thing I could think of.

[@D3adCl0wn]

Damn, what if people are hating on Palworld because their beloved game isn't getting the success they wanted it to get? I also expected hate the least from pokemon fans but they just D riding nintendo for some reason.

[@HappyPantz]

To anyone who thinks that they some of the Pals are just ripoffs of similar pokemon, I pose to you that they're both just ripoffs of ACTUAL ANIMALS!!!

[@JulioSillet]

I honestly believe that the game deserve the success, coping something popular doesn't make it good. They had a vision of a surviving/crafting game on a dark pokemon universe, and executed the idea surprisingly well. Coping is part of game development and art in general, specially when is a successful IP, everyone was coping pokemon when the first games released on the gameboy, everyone copy god of war when that game came out, everyone copy phasmo when that came out, is part of industry.

[@KyleCollective]

I just love that the excitement of a new pal for me isn’t from them being able to fight, it’s whether they are gonna be a good worker for me 😂

[@JasonwithaJay]

Kill the Justice League lives up to expectations as long you expect it to be terrible.

[@raneynewman8315]

Am I wrong to say it’s a more refined Ark survival? It just looks so much cleaner and actual gameplay looks fun itself (ie the shooting looks fun where Ark was clunky)

[@MVNIMALTTV]

Lawrences biggest gripe sounds like its the basic grind of mundane tasks like wood and stone but what palworld does great is it gives you the similar early grind we are use to and then easy you into the automation side.. im level 26, dont have the conveyor yet but my pals are making thousands of wood and stone while i go catch new pals and do caves and bosses. Even after the automation its not guarnteed to be easy right away either. There are still steps that keep you at your base and working but give you the freedom to run out and do what you want when you want.

[@AlbertoMartinez765]

Right? its so easy to just automate all that stuff you don't want to do. Then go out and explore caves the Huge map and Boss Battles plus new interesting Pals.

[@patrickshippy555]

Just the fact that the game made it to game pass tells me it’s here to stay. I don’t think Microsoft would want to step on Nintendos toes

[@PieterSandwalker]

Pokemon/Digimon facts: Pokemon ('96) is older than Digimon ('97), but they were both made in a small enough window that it was probably two guys with similar ideas. Additionally, Digimon was created to be "Tamagotchi ('96) for boys" so they weren't really comparable until they both started branching off (i.e. Digimon video games & both made an anime). As for why we don't see more Pokemon-likes, we actually see quite a few, some of which are arguably better than Pokemon, but none have been as successful as Palworld: Nexomon Coromon Cassette Beasts Tem-tem (Came close with the hype, but kind of face-planted on release with the Battle Pass) Monster Rancher Monster Sanctuary Monster Hunter Stories Digimon Cyber Sleuth But like you said, I think Palworld is more successful because it's the first one in the survival crafting genre, which tends to reach a wider audience than JRPGs

[@horseface31]

You get pets, and you get to make them fight. What's not to love

[@smithynoir9980]

"everyone" is a massive stretch. A few twits on X are mad, nobody that actually matters is haha

[@Moonraven72]

I really dislike survival games, the only time I could tolerate survival mechanics being in Bethesda games since I can mod them to my tastes. Palworld is really fun for myself and this surprises me

[@NGEvangeliman]

I dont think there is any legal standing for pokemon to do anything about this game.

[@MadJustin7]

Don't care, had fun. What about the art? Don't care, had fun. It's just bits and pieces of other games. There's nothing new. Don't care, had fun. It's totally ripping off Pokemon. Don't care, had fun.

[@Finchsicle]

“you must of been at least a little excited when your saw that my giant panda had grenade launchers” 😂😂

[@foxmind2490]

18:27 You can certainly try. The author of The Witcher novels, Andrzej Sapkowski, sued CDPR after the blow up success of The Witcher 3. His reasoning was he thought video games were stupid and it wouldn’t do well. After The Witcher 3 did in fact do amazingly well, Andrzej sued because of the success he didn’t predict despite his original contract with CDPR.

[@SavagingFlash]

One thing that people forget to mention is that there are a lot of monster catcher games, but they never make it to the West. The fact that this one is popular in the west is an achievement itself.

[@cassiusmishima9052]

Thank you for not being another video-game tabloid, I really appreciate getting both reasonable informational, News, and opinion pieces from calm, and chill individuals.

[@minyaw1234]

28:10 I didn't hold F since I had pals doing the job. Just queue it up and leave do something else, come back and get it. Holding F is something you pretty much only do the first 30min of the game.

[@xdan0x]

Interesting that the last Pokemon game didn't even run well on Nintendo's' own system

[@FlabbyMcJigs]

I think Lawrence confuses grind with minor objectives in this game. This game is relatively open ended in terms of what you need to do in it. I find that the crafting and building are just mini objectives for you to complete in order to expand your exploration of the world. It's not a requirement but an incentive in order to experience more of the game.

[@Kyle-yn5hy]

"It's not a requirement but an incentive in order to experience more of the game." So, if you don't do it, you don't get to experience more of the game? It's a survival game, an Ark clone, it's gonna be grindy. Some people hate that, some people love it, but let's not pretend it isn't what it is.

[@D3adCl0wn]

@@Kyle-yn5hy The thing is, there are mechanics in the game that makes the early grind non-existent later on. And that's on default setting, you can tweak the game settings anytime!

[@Kyle-yn5hy]

@@D3adCl0wn Yeah I've seen, you can automate the grind with Pals. It reminds me of those idle games or auto battlers that come out on phones, where it just plays itself. Like, why. If the game is going to automate the grind, why not just cut the chaff and polish the game mechanics that players are actually going to engage with. I can at least appreciate server side settings for things like crafting speed and resource collection, but so much of the game is built around this grind that when you do that you're left with hardly anything else to do. Like I said, if you're into survival games and grinding, that's fine. Just don't call it "mini-objectives". There's nothing inherently wrong with grinding, it's what most MMOs are built on after all. I have fond memories grinding crushbone belts in EverQuest, but these days the idea of punching trees just to build more effective tools for punching trees, etc, just isn't for me.

[@karn1129]

That question… “Does Palworld deserve its success, since it’s copying a popular franchise”. Like I said in my other comment, Pokemon copied Dragon Quest’s monsters almost exactly. So does Pokemon deserve it’s success since it copied another game?

[@Imsosappy]

I feel Lawrence is drawn to min/max in games more often, where as Bruce will choose the more chill "it's good enough path" most of the time. So if min/maxing in a game equals a lot of grinding, and Lawrence find the grinding dull or boring, he's not going to have a good time. Nothing wrong with that btw, I generally sit between them on which games I like.

[@justinsanegaming9724]

If your punching alot of trees your not using ur pals to cut wood lmao

[@kornoth9339]

I think a small part of Lawrence experience was the 4~ player count in that its fun to play with friends but there is the resource competition with 4 people that Max and Bruce discussed previously when being all starters. The sweet spot is probably 2~3 people.

[@logan_sunday]

I will also say that I find a lot of survival games claustrophobic. Its small caves and dense forests. Palworld taking inspiration from Zeldas open world guves it a nice airy open feeling, which for me, instantly gives it a relaxing feeling. 11:18 Design. For whatever weird reason. Pokemon connected with people. Digimon had similar success. I played temtem a bit, cant remember a single one.

[@BricksInAJar]

I love Pal World, I dont care, it's a fun game.

[@EduardoAntunes]

This is why I come to these guys and Inside Games! A brilliant and nuanced conversation and debate, respectful of each other's opinion, and with reasonable arguments and counter-arguments! Keep up the good work!

[@coreymeh8335]

im sure Nintendo and pokemon company are going through Palworld and the law on the books with a fine tooth combo to see if there is anything they can use against them to get if off the market. but yeah i think this shows there is market for a different game style than what game freak is willing to bring us since they keep wanting to play it safe.

[@gergerflarg]

I think a lot of the hate for Palworld comes from burned out Pokemon fans wanting to deny they don't enjoy modern Pokemon games the way they are, and see this doing numbers and think "but why cant official pokemon do this!??" If Nintendo or Gamefreak thought this was a risk for their IP, they would sue. They ALREADY sent a C&D to a modder who added Pokemon to Palworld.

[@JohnRBlade]

I hope Palworld becomes one of the biggest games of 2024. I don't even like Pokémon. If a game that is a rip off of another game is a better game, then it deserves the success it gets. Clearly the developer is giving their consumers something they want that the original property isn't giving them.

[@kolossarthas]

Look at anyone who hates palworld for any reason other than gameplay or gameloop, and remember their names. You don't need their opinion in the future.

[@andrewknight2495]

Lawrence perpetually living in da club

[@AKDot98]

Re: the game dying in a month, this is only early access. I think even if their first series of updates come slowly, they still have the chance to pop again for the full 1.0 release.

[@OoblasSteakhouse]

That is not the norm though. BG3 is an outlier in that “1.0 blowup” scenario; most games have 1 launch and maybe a small bump with certain updates but that’s how most people treat a 1.0 release; an update.

[@AKDot98]

@christophermugno4593 a blowup in notoriety and a game that was briefly popular becoming popular again after the full release update are two completely different things.

[@AKDot98]

@@R17759 I'm explicitly talking about the case where that doesn't happen, like Lawrence and Bruce were speculating on.

[@rewpertcone8243]

Honestly the only people hating on palworld are either typical twitter users or salty pokemon fans

[@Devil935]

I love how this conversation has become "what makes a game fun?" at one point in the video lol

[@UnosRecens]

Was searching for Inside Gaming Podcast to see how new channel is going, found something better!

[@grozakko2007]

Isn't this also very similar to Ark?

[@aceofaces0007]

I see the viral interest in Palworld as two-fold: (1) frustration within the Pokemon fandom as to the poor quality of recent Pokemon games from not just a visual/performance sense, but also a sense of creative bankruptcy (see BDSP); and (2) curiosity as to any potential legal drama stemming from Palworld "poking the bear," especially when Nintendo and the Pokemon Company have been historically very litigious when it comes to Pokemon. (Nintendo is litigious in general, but Pokemon is definitely among the properties they defend heavily). People have been making fan games of Pokemon for years in an attempt to add the kind of creativity and innovation missing from recent entries (such as Infinite Fusion being the most recent darling), and such fan games have always existed in a gray area of legality, with some projects being shut down via cease and desist letters. Now you have an actual game studio trying to do what fans have attempted to do in the past, but for profit, and in a way that almost dares the Pokemon Company to sue them with how extremely similar many of the Pals are to existing Pokemon, taking what Game Freak made and shoving it back in their faces. There's an almost taboo-like nature to playing this game because of the yet to be proven infringements, which engineers a sense of urgency to hop on and play before the game is potentially shut down or fundamentally altered. There exists the same kind of tension that exists before two sides go to war, and I wouldn't be surprised at all if Nintendo was marshaling its army of lawyers at this very moment to claim that Palworld's successes constitute "unjust enrichment." So much of the discourse surrounding this game seems to be centered on how fans are hoping this game forces a wake-up call at Game Freak to do better. I don't think much will change because Pokemon games still keep selling like hot cakes, and will continue to do so, while Palworld will be just a flash in the pan. Nevertheless, the fan frustration is very much there, and if Pokemon games were better, this game would be dismissed as a pretender at best, and a plagiarist at worst. The fact that they aren't better is what is giving this game life to breathe and inject some kind of competition into this corner of the industry.

[@TheActualCarlCofield]

This game is Conan Exiles but with better thrall mechanics and animations

[@xRostro]

What Bruce said at 34:30 …made me realize Bruce and I have a similar taste in video games. I had to mention it because I always thought I was more like Lawrence, since I appreciate his takes so much. I also found RDR2 extremely slow and couldn’t get into it

[@karn1129]

It sounds to me like the guy (cant remember hes name) who doesn’t like Palworld just doesn’t understand how survival / building games work and is just bad at it. Seems like a skill issue to me. He’s explaination of he’s experience screams lack of knowledge of how to play a survival game. Especial with the automation side of Palworld. Saying he was punching and “axing” trees basically the whole time he played.

[@The_Dreadbug]

I'm glad this game is doing so well. It breeds competition, and hopefully, it will force Gamefreak into making a better product that its fans are obviously thirsting for, myself included. Competition is good for the consumer, always 👍

[@jackoflames]

There's plenty of good monster tamers to pick up. Persona, Cassette Beasts, Monster Crown(had some bugs last I played it, but still a charming title), just to name some I've played. Competition is good, and so is inspiration. It's thanks to the amount of "Doomclones" we don't call them that anymore but "FPSes". But the issue with Palworld is the evidence of them just ripping off pokémon assets, when they clearly should have what it takes to make their own models. So the issue isn't that they could be competition to Pokémon, but at the very least seemingly "3d traced" several models from pokémon.

[@TheRustyShackleford]

loved that they could have a civil conversation with differing opinions

[@danwichgames]

non of the designs break any trademarks, the game play does enough different to count as additive, and none of the music or text uses elements of the tm Pokémon stuff. there is no case here. if Nintendo and game freak dont have a case against cassette beast, caramon, or the 100s of other pet fighting games and systems in other games like wow than there is no case here. you can not copy right a game loop. You can trade mark convention inside that loop that can be show to be wholly ordinal and vital to the game but even Pokémon took their systems from other rpgs. So no there is nothing here for Nintendo to go after.

[@vogueisdeath2176]

Wasn’t the person who did the mesh overlay outed at have modified the models to make them look similar.

[@eatcrab9565]

The true tragedy of Palworld is that it preempted and overshadowed the launch of enshrouded which is like a really well thought out game in comparison. The building mechanics is a step above, the fighting is slick and it's got more of a cohesiveness in term of game play and story. From a game design perspective, it is just a better executed game. The very unfortunate thing is that it just lacks some personality, and Palworld kind of just pummeled it

[@AbsoluteKhan.]

Palworld is pretty fun! Have played like 30 hours in two days lol

[@xSupajesusX]

You're not my GUY, PAL!

[@SammySlammerB]

You’re not my PAL, FRIEND!

[@xSupajesusX]

​@@SammySlammerB You're not my FWEND, GUY!

[@dappertree9016]

@@SpideyfanX YOU'RE NOT MY BUDDY, GUY!!

[@jacobshroyer537]

Love you guys

[@CyberVikingGaming]

I had a lot of fun playing palworld. I don't think it's a fantastic game, but it scratched an itch I thought to be un scratchable. My favorite part of the game is that it proves AAA companies have no clue what they are doing anymore. It's not hard to make a game people will love, you just have to listen to them.

[@byronsnads]

Palworld also scratches that Warcraft 3 moded pokemon world lobby itch. Lots of successful properties were a warcraft 3 mod first.

[@minisithunknown5568]

"Taking the most popular genres and putting it together in a way that it is like throwing a dart at a dartboard to make a run away success." That quote is a bit off but that statement reminds me of commentaries from game creators. I do not remember specifically which ones as I love listening how game creators make their games and I have heard some of them compare how they make a game that people will like to throwing a dart at a dartboard.

[@MuzgontarAco]

Palworld scratches a similar itch that Factorio did. What work I need to do to do as little work as possible. It also scartches some other like ARPGs do in gathering more power with better gear to do higher level content. Basebuilding, efficiency and exploration. Palworld does a lot of things, not great but, good enough to scratch a lot of itches and seems to be focused on just making the things more fun than making sense. If you dislike survival games, Palworld has the option to be played as less of a survival game, but can still be played as a hard survival.

[@cementbox4430]

I’m still waiting on the PlayStation release, and I can wait

[@telprydain1]

I feel like people who feel the game is grindy aren't using the Pals properly. They should be mining the trees and stone for you - within 30min you should never hit a stone again. Pro-tip: Make sure the base circle includes an iron-node so they start getting that ore from the get-go.

[@TheStrandrew]

If pokemon now makes a game like Palworld, will that be a ripoff?

[@davidh3205]

This conversation is really about what it is that makes something a fake, I think. It's a question of whether or not it matters should be considered the same as Pokémon, or if they are their own separate thing.

[@Fyurae]

Did Lawrence a great disservice by starting off where they did. Started in an unfinished part of the map instead of the starting area that actually has resources and interest.

[@ibapreppie]

Now Nintendo released a statement about Palworld, and is looking into the matter. Glad I got a pirated copy of Palworld