FAKE 2nd Century Gospel: It Changed Catholic and Orthodox Theology

[@tliw2]

Surprising that the angel felt the need to tell Mary not to be afraid, since she was used to getting food from an angel every day... 😒

[@toomanymarys7355]

Epic 😂

[@miracles_metanoia]

Not really. Mary was “greatly troubled at his words,” and in response, the angel said, “Do not be afraid." She saw the angel, and wasn't afraid of him. She was still coherent and in self-control, speaking to the angel even after the message. She never fell flat on the floor, terrified. But AFTER the angel spoke God's message to her, then she was troubled by the message. The message was troubling, since it didn't make sense since she was bethrowed to Joseph but still a virgin, and she asked how can this be, since she didn't understand how in the future could be with child, she didn't expect children in the future.

[@toomanymarys7355]

@miracles_metanoia It could not be a death sentence in Roman Galilee

[@jrconway3]

​@@miracles_metanoiaShe wasn't "married" to Joseph, she was betrothed. What that means is Joseph paid the bride price for Mary to be his wife, but she had not yet come into his house and consummated the marriage. Betrothal however is not modern engagement. She couldn't just break off the betrothal and become another man's wife. It would require a divorce (which Joseph even considered doing) and he wouldn't get back his dowry either. That's assuming they were still following the law of course. At some point the dowry shifts to the father of the bride rather than the groom.

[@Berean_with_a_BTh]

​@@toomanymarys7355Jews weren't always compliant (Luke 20:6). Haven't you read about the times they tried or wanted to kill Jesus before his crucifixion (Luke 4:29; John 8:58; 10:31), or about Stephen being stoned (Acts 7:58), or Paul being stoned (Acts 14:19)?

[@nathanezekial928]

Thought you were a snake handler for a second there… 😂 I only saw the cat tail…

[@josiahpimperl3569]

It'd be hilarious if he actually did that one day now just to troll us 🤣

[@ChristFollower1981]

Me too!😅😅😅 Lol!

[@libbypacula9352]

Yep, me too!😅

[@whatweretheythinking3274]

Same. 😮 😂😂😂

[@nathanezekial928]

@@josiahpimperl3569 yeah 😂

[@han-bonan]

God has a long history of using ordinary people to do His extraordinary work. I think it is a much more beautiful story of God’s grace and power that Mary was an ordinary person who loved and feared God and was chosen to give birth to and care for the Savior of the world. It was a hard task that only God could bring her through. ♥️

[@foodforthought8308]

But we're talking about the Incarnation

[@danielespitia1776]

I still won’t pray to her. She can’t hear me.

[@han-bonan]

@@danielespitia1776 Yes! Just like I won’t pray to Moses who talked with God or David who was a man after God’s own heart or any other person who was used by God in an extraordinary way. God is the only One worthy of prayer and worship. He is the One who gives power to the ordinary so that His will will be done.

[@MarkHorton-n3t]

​@foodforthought8308 Mary did what no other woman has ever done or will ever do: give birth to God. But in every other way, she was an ordinary woman. More pius than most but human, and a sinner like everyone else. She called her Son, my Savior. If Mary has to be sinless in order to give birth to Jesus who was sinless her mother had to be sinless in order to give birth to Mary who was sinless. Logically that extends all the way back to Eve who was the first person to sin. For God to be incarnated fully human except without sin, His mother had to be fully human. Mary was a woman, she was born, sinned, and gave birth to Jesus while a virgin. Then she had sex with her husband and had other children and died like everyone else except Enoch and Elijah. She is NOT holy, ONLY God is holy. She is blessed. Everything I have said is from Scripture. Read it.

[@Eaudino23]

That’s beautiful and absolutely true but Mary is actually written of differently by the physician Luke.

[@tracyeilers678]

I know I am not the only one that within hearing the first sentence, you can just feel the absence of the Spirit in this writing. It makes me so appreciate the true scripture even more, that although written through 40 difference authors, the voice is the same from Gensis to Revelation. "The sheep hear MY voice, and they know ME."

[@katherinec2759]

I think part of it is the translation. It reads a lot more like the Message than the NIV or the ESV, but given how old it is, it must flow more like the books of the actual Bible.

[@goshipeters7664]

Ditto!!

[@AndreaWhoGoesByAndrea]

@katherinec2759 I agree that's part of it, at least. You don't get too many casual contractions like "I'll do this," or "Let's go," in most of the Bible translations.

[@sivad1025]

This is always a hilarious claim that Protestants make. It would be awesome to have a blind "taste test" where different passages are extracted from the Bible and early Christian literature to see if you can actually tell the difference

[@cputeq007]

Exactly what I was thinking

[@kaylashryock2743]

I think these studies on Catholicism and Catholic teachings are exactly what the church needs right now!

[@colin1818]

It's always worth studying bad teachings and where they come from. It's a great defense against bad teaching.

[@biosparkdreamer8356]

Catholics don't use the protoevangelium of James in their Mariology.

[@sivad1025]

Mike is incredibly untrustworthy on Catholicism tho. He routinely resorts to straw man accusations

[@jimkennedy9242]

​@@sivad1025 Mike Winger accepts the Scripture as the final authority on matters of faith and theology, whereas Catholicism accepts church councils and tradition on the same level as scripture. I would imagine that this is where your problem lies. Jude 3 says: Beloved, although I was very eager to write to you about our common salvation, I found it necessary to write appealing to you to contend for the faith that was once for all delivered to the saints. God gave us the final word and picture of faith with the establishment of the Canon of scripture. Prayers that you can grow in this direction and think biblically about everything!

[@mcgilldi]

​@sivad1025 this is not that, though. This is truth. Through this false gospel, the hyperdulia of Mary became supercharged to the point of blasphemy.

[@Maverick-rz7io]

In the immortal words of Wendigoon: "It's bad biblical fanfiction".

[@OGA103]

Never thought I'd see Wendi mentioned in a Winger video 😂

[@sethtrey]

​@@OGA103never? c'mon...

[@JeremyMarcum1]

Aaaaye! Wendigang!

[@cooperchappell8310]

Wendigoon viewer!

[@kingnothing2161]

A fellow goon- Wait a minute

[@iknowmy3tables]

imagine Mary trying to explain these details to James to write down. "so this angel told me I was going to have a super natural virgin birth, but then I totally forgot about it later and lamented being baren specifically when I visited my sister, then an angel visited me and totally startled me even though angels have been visiting me my whole life and told me I was pregnant."

[@sivad1025]

Couldn't you levy this exact same criticism at the book of Genesis and the story of Abraham?

[@mleyNukas]

​@@sivad1025 I dont see any great similarity

[@oldplace2844]

@@sivad1025 In what way? There is no similarity in Genesis, nor with Abraham.

[@sivad1025]

@@oldplace2844 The fact that Abraham had many supernatural revelations telling him he would have a son with Sarah and he still didn't believe it

[@jennysurfer6516]

⁠@@sivad1025and then he visited his brother and he saw 2 people in his eyes… and he totally forgot 😅

[@devontesands986]

I personally enjoy these kinds of videos. Helps to learn about the spooky "banned books that Christians don't want us to know about." Love your work Mr. Winger.

[@sivad1025]

You should read Ignatius' epistles and Ireneaus' "Against Heresies." Protestants really don't like those ones

[@billythe_kid5999]

@@sivad1025💯 he is like paul want all the smoke

[@raphaelfeneje486]

​@@sivad1025 I'm a Protestant and I've read these church fathers. What's your point?? I can bet that you've not read them, if you have, you don't understand them

[@raphaelfeneje486]

​@@billythe_kid5999 Who were they writing to??

[@han-bonan]

This reeks of Joseph Smith, or actually Joseph Smith’s fantasy book resembles this one. It breaks my heart that since the beginning, people have chosen to worship falsehoods rather than the One True God, who is far better than any human can even conceive. It grieves me so much as a child of Jesus. I cannot imagine how it feels to Him. I keep hearing “ blessed are those who mourn because they will be comforted”. Jesus is enough!! I pray we will soon see the day, when our world has a great awakening and millions will come to know the Truth that is Jesus. Jesus IS enough!!

[@NathanAmiel]

@han-bonan Don't hate on Book of Mormon, it wasn't even written by Smith it was stolen, Smith was a mason (look into Tartaria) they are evil

[@jmorr1780]

@@han-bonan I agree with the reference to Smith wanting to write himself into history. However, I think you can see, even if it's falsified, what early Christians believed and taught regarding Mary.

[@eurovisionwtf]

You only have Mike Winger's word on that Orthodox/Catholic is wrong. And other people that want Protestantism to be right, so they attack other Christians in order to be so. But we are not wrong in having communion with Saints etc, we are not idolaters, we drink liquer but it does not make us drunks. Some of us are cussing, but it does not mean we are cursing. Would you trust the source of Christianity, or would you trust New Age Christianity, cause Protestantism is from 1500's, Orthodox/Catholic is from the beginning. The problem Protestantism has today, is that they are far too gentle.. they let people control them, turn your cheek and be slapped again, what a joke. Fight back. Christians aren't tibetan monks.

[@saramesfin6511]

The devil is very deceptive and uses clever tactics to pull people away from Jesus Christ. In my country, there are many false teachings and fictitious books about Mary, angels, and even saints, which distract people and lead them away from the truth of the Gospel. It’s truly heartbreaking to see how these distractions keep people from coming to a personal relationship with Jesus. As believers, it’s important to stay rooted in Scripture and help others recognize the truth, so they can experience the fullness of life in Christ. Thank you Mike for sharing this.❤

[@planteruines5619]

scripture says mary is full of Grace, scripture says Mary is the mother of God

[@mrsTreadnaught]

​@planteruines5619 would you mind sharing where the bible says "mother of God"?

[@planteruines5619]

@@mrsTreadnaught Jesus is God (biblical ) Mary Birthed Jesus (biblical ) Mary is therefore the mother of God

[@planteruines5619]

@@Kathleen253 what ?

[@juanbonito9150]

I was raised in the Roman Catholic Church … alter boy and 8 years of Catholic grade school. After rebelling against all authorities in HS and doing drugs, a neighbor gave me a Bible. I started reading the Gospel of John secretly because, well, Catholics were not taught to read the Bible without a priest to explain it to you. To my surprise, there was not a lot to interpret about salvation (John 3). In a moment of despair a few months later I cried out to Jesus, declaring you are my Lord. I was instantly made sober, lost all desire for drugs, and my life miraculously transformed - instantly! God brought brothers in Christ into my life the very next day, and I was blessed with examples of how to follow Christ, not men. That was nearly 49 years ago. I encourage all Catholics to read the Bible and prayerfully seek Jesus as their personal savior. God the Father sent his son, Jesus, to be the only way to the Father. Not Mary, not a parish priest, not believers who have long been asleep. Mary was blessed, as anyone who fully surrenders to the will of God, but that does not raise those who surrender to a higher position than anyone else, especially not on par with Jesus.

[@johnwilliamson6294]

Thanks Mike for sharing your finds and also your knowledge of the scripture. You are truly walking in your call for The Lord. May God Bless you and your family

[@DerMelodist]

This reads like a proto-Book of Mormon. And please do read more source documents like this. It would be a great way to be introduced to these sources while getting live commentary on them.

[@micahprice2807]

Seconded

[@AndreaWhoGoesByAndrea]

@DerMelodist I agree, with the caveat that this felt a little light on the homework side for me. People love Mike for his dedication to going deep in study and for relying on the Bible. I'd hate to see his channel devolve into a series of "Mike Winger Reacts" videos.

[@sivad1025]

The irony, of course, is that this is only a century after Christ and some of the teachings in it were accepted by the early church. So Protestants end up agreeing with Mormons that extreme corruption polluted the church in the first century

[@ComedianBobFarrell]

I agree

[@Brityf]

Yes! Please. Id also like a 2nd video focusing on the historical aspect. Perhaps join with Wes. This is needed!

[@georgecrosthwaite]

So Christianity (ALL Nicene Christians (Catholic, Orthodox, Oriental, Assyrian COE)) has been wrong about Mary since the EARLY 100's??? That's like 1,400 years! Yet none of them consider this book Canonical?? Maybe the Church just already knew what was the accurate and non-accurate traditions contained is this text.... That makes more sense then say Christianity has been wrong 200 years even before the Council of Nicaea ever took place.

[@leenieledejo6849]

Firstly, when you say "Christianity", you mean the official religion back then. You are ignoring all the individual Bible believing regenerate Christians (the only kind: John 1:12-13, Romans 8:9) living a humble, practically anonymous life imitating Christ (1 and 11:1). And have you not read what's written? "WIDE is the gate and BROAD is the way that leads to destruction and MANY enter in there. NARROW is the way that leads to life and FEW find it" (Matthew 7:13-14).

[@georgecrosthwaite]

@leenieledejo6849 I'm talking about all Christians from the early 100's till the protestant reformation. I thought I was clear about that. I'm confused what your point is... Remember, these are some of the traditions of the Christians that suffered Roman persecution.

[@rexlion4510]

The Protevangelium of James was late 2nd Century. It's the first document we know of that elevates Mary to any significant degree, and it shows Gnostic influences & was declared heretical. This document had enormous influence on the church. It was soon followed by other Gnostic-influenced writings such as the Book of Mary's Repose, the Six Books Dormition Apocryphon, and the so-called Gospel of Bartholomew. These writings characterized Mary as the holder of sacred cosmic mysteries and of secret passwords which one needs in order to enter heaven. They claim that she was the wise counselor and boss-lady to the Apostles. In the Gospel of Bartholomew, Mary fields questions from the disciples and explains “the sacred mysteries” to them; when asked how she bore such greatness in bearing the Christ-child in her womb, Mary purportedly warns them that if she were to tell them the answer, “fire will come out of my mouth and consume the whole earth.” 🤪 We need to remember the early 4th Century declaration by Constantine of Christianity as the state religion, because when that happened many pagans began flocking into the church because it suddenly became stylish to do so. These people did not drop their pagan beliefs and desires at the church door; they were accustomed to worshiping a female figure and they wanted to continue doing so (Aphrodite was one of the names of this false deity). It did not take long for their ideas to percolate throughout the church and help turn it toward ever-increasing Marian piety (similar to how rapidly we've seen LGB ideas and 'modern' theologies influence the present-day church).

[@georgecrosthwaite]

@@rexlion4510 So do you think that if Christianity did not become legalized by Constantine (he didn't make it the state religion, that happened 43 yrs after he died), then Christians would never have believed in Mary's perpetual virginity?

[@theeternalsbeliever1779]

Yes, traditional Christianity has been absolutely wrong about Mary and many other doctrines for centuries.

[@TheRockofGod21]

When I say it's about time a proper explanation of this is done by a reputable Protestant Christian, that would be an understatement.... NO ONE touches on this book at all, yet it seems to be a the root of some of the most egregious blasphemies when it comes to the Marian Dogmas. Like, not even Gavin Ortlund has done a proper, full length exegesis on this book, and of all people I would have expected him to do so. thanks Mike for going through this, this has been at the heart of a major pet peeve of mine that this is accepted literature by both the Eastern Orthodox and Roman Catholic churches.

[@vtaylor21]

The gospel of James is not the root of Marian Dogma. For instance, the belief of Mary being sinless (immaculate conception) comes from Genesis 3:15 where God said he would put enmity between the woman and her seed. Christians agree the seed is Jesus. The woman must be Mary. You don't hear many Catholic apologists use the gospel of James. If they do, they use it to show the Marian beliefs existed in the early Christian period. It also coincides with other early Christian writings.

[@TheRockofGod21]

@@vtaylor21 Wrong, the Immaculate Conception came, not from Jewish beliefs, but from beliefs influenced by Gnosticism and certain Greek philosophies that say the flesh is irredeemably sinful, and therefore if Jesus took on flesh he would have been tainted by sin, specifically through the "sinful" seed of man. So as a result, they needed to "solve" the problem of Mary having Sinful flesh. Enter "the Immaculate conception", if Mary was immaculately conceived, she would not have "stained" sinful flesh that could be passed to Jesus. As an Ad Hoc to this belief they associated Genesis 3:15 to Mary (rather then it being directly associated with Eve) in order to bolster their opinion that she was sinless. thus solving 2 birds with one stone: Mary being sinless, and her being "the new Eve". While the Protoevangelium doesn't expressly state she was immaculately conceived, it does show that Mary was conceived BEFORE Joachim came back to his wife. But it does make it very clear she was perpetually a virgin. Which is necessary on a system that believes that childbirth and sex (even between a husband and wife) are horrible and sinful acts. These same gnostic beliefs about the transmission of sin through the sexual act, by the way, are the same that influenced Augustine in his belief about Concupiscence, which specifically qualifies the man's seed as the carrier for sin. In case you aren't following, This means that in Ezekiel 18 God OUTRIGHT LIES when he said "the son shall not die for the sins of the father" since, according to concupiscence, we very SPECIFICALLY die for our fathers' Heinous sin of impregnating our mothers. yet time and time again, especially in places Genesis 1:28 (pre-fall) and reiterated in 8:17 (post-fall) that bringing forth children is a good thing, not a sinful thing. the immaculate conception of Mary, and the Perpetual Virginity of Mary are predicated on the exact opposite belief; that bringing forth from your seed is a sinful act and makes you impure.

[@Pat.hibuleire]

You re not qualified to be your own pope

[@robertdelisle7309]

@ what does Genesis 3:15 have to do with the Immaculate Conception/sinlessness of Mary? I don’t see how this verse gets you to this Marian dogma.

[@4xdblack]

@Pat.hibuleire bro the Pope isn't qualified to be your Pope. He literally just declared all paths lead to God but you still fail to see the heretical teachings?

[@deadmanwalkin180]

The first red flag for me was that Mary lived in the temple. In the Holy of Holies to be exact. This place was only reserved for the High Priest and only for one day in the year. The problem with this book is that it makes her out to be a supernatural woman, when she was just another ordinary sin prone human being used for the glory of God. She was a servant just like all the other people had used for great work in the past and in the future. Based on this book, she even surpasses Jesus himself who was such an average Joe that it was the miracles and the teachings that made him stand out. Even when he stood in front of the priests who were supposed to be experts in recognising God, they said he blasphemed when he acknowledged that he is God. Even Jesus himself put her in her place when she tried to call him away and he said my mother and my family are those who do the will of God!

[@christophertaylor9100]

Well one of the many red flags, for sure. I mean... the magi visit Jesus in his cradle? Jesus is born in the wilderness, not Bethlehem? There's more holes in this story than a yard of lace.

[@danimal118]

The reason only males are allowed in the temple is because Jesus is the high priest. The church doesn't go into the holy of holies for herself. Violating Temple law and then having the image of the woman serving salvation unto herself, aka humanism, is blasphemy.

[@antillious]

Video starts: Good evening Mr. Bond, I’ve been expecting you.

[@kedb621]

😂😂😂

[@int.ryansmind-night941]

Really enjoying this! Any chance for a full read-through of the Gospel of Thomas?

[@MikeWinger]

That s a good idea

[@SockieTheSockPuppet]

​@MikeWinger That'll be quite a read, seeing a child/teenage Jesus zapping people like Zeus. 🤦‍♂️

[@sethtrey]

​@@MikeWingerDo the Acts of Thomas. The Gospel is a bunch of detached quips. The Acts starts with Jesus appearing post-ascention and selling Thomas into slavery. It's better TV.

[@JarodScarborough-x7g]

We need more of these ​@@MikeWinger

[@GenericYoutubeGuy]

@@MikeWingerwhat’s wrong with the left side of your neck?

[@CarterTheAmerican]

CAT DETECTED Also thanks for what you do, it’s a blessing

[@galactic_sarcastic9950]

This was a great video. As a student in a Christian university, I think it's important for Christians to know the history of the church, including the historic heretical documents. I would love to see you read more of these. They're very educational.

[@travelsouthafrica5048]

what are you studying ?

[@MeganWalton-r4m]

It's common for relationships to encounter obstacles, but there is always a solution. My own marriage faced considerable issues, but with appropriate guidance, my husband and I worked through them and deepened our connection. Solutions are achievable if you're ready to work together. Stay hopeful-there's always a way forward.

[@user-yn9wk5cx3w]

I'm facing significant relationship problems and can't stand the idea of losing him. My love and longing for my partner are profound, and I'm ready to do anything to restore our connection. I would greatly appreciate any advice or help you could give.

[@MeganWalton-r4m]

Parting with someone you love is always a challenging process, but in my experience, I had the guidance of a spiritual guide who prevented my marriage from collapsing. His name is Father Akunna.

[@user-yn9wk5cx3w]

I'II quickly search for him online. Thank you. I'm optimistic that taking this approach will yield results for me as well; his absence is keenly felt.

[@MeganWalton-r4m]

I promise you will not regret it.

[@user-yn9wk5cx3w]

I just searched for Father Akunna online indeed he is a very generous man and the most powerful spell caster that I have ever seen he brought my husband back to me with so much love ❤

[@katherinecornette5315]

As a recovering Catholic, now washed by the blood of Jesus and can celebrate God’s blessings by His amazing grace, I am thankful that you work thru these writings that somehow become accepted by the church. When we elevate Mary we take away God’s goodness working in us. While I’m sure there’s more to each story in scripture we have to be careful with adding to it.

[@CougarPerkins]

@@katherinecornette5315 What brought you to Christ? Was it a particular verse? A person?

[@katherinecornette5315]

@ The Gospel & Grace! When you realize His love and willingness to come to us, live among us and then die a horrible death to take on our sin, you realize that my salvation is by Jesus Christ alone! I cannot do enough to save myself. He did it all! What a Savior!

[@anthonyburke2353]

@katherinecornette5315 Who did you receive the Gospel from?

[@Pat.hibuleire]

What à joke No one can steal god s glory

[@jonathon_durno]

​​@@katherinecornette5315Amen! We call Mary blessed because she is the mother of Jesus. We exalt Him as fully God and fully Man. In His sinless flesh, which He inherited from His mother Mary, He suffered for our sins and bore them in His body on the cross. I'm not Catholic by the way. May God continue to bless you. I'm so joyful at the news that you are a child of God! Glory to God, hallelujah! Jesus is alive forevermore.

[@MrWoaaaaah]

How do we know that beliefs about Mary came from the protoevangelium? Perhaps the protoevangelium drew on prior beliefs about her?

[@skiamach6208]

We have evidence of the beliefs prior to the protoevangelium. It is the collected works in the New Testament. It includes four gospels that speak of Mary, Joseph, and Jesus' birth. These all predate (and are the earliest Christian writings that we have) the protoevangelium.

[@MrWoaaaaah]

@skiamach6208 indeed

[@danielletracyann]

Yep!!!! Mike is assuming that the church stole it from those books but let’s be real, even the Quran is right about a few things. These ppl steal what they want from the Christian’s to bring about their own religions. He has no proof and we are fully aware the Catholic Church also goes by tradition.

[@andrewmartin9182]

It sort of doesn't matter, what is more clear is that Mary has no role in the moment of salvation, or in its on going work. If it did, Paul would have told us. Perhaps those who knew Jesus saw the special connection there, and that was part of the family and friends knowledge that she was a very special person, Godly in a very unusual way, but it isn't included in the mission of the gospel because it results in error as people keep going down that path in a way that they shouldn't. Whatever grace she had, she recieved, from God, and Jesus is that God.

[@bpete48]

@@andrewmartin9182Your point is well taken, but that matters outside of the context of this Fake Scripture

[@isabeltrosin2099]

God bless you and your wife Mike. That was truly a good exposure of the enemy’s lies to bring confusion to those who don’t know the scriptures or understand them. The book totally borrows from the old testament and new testament but omitting the patriarchal society that supposedly comes from. So sad that many still rather believe the word of man than God’s word.

[@isabeltrosin2099]

May your celebration of Jesus coming as a babe to the earth be filled with Love and God’s joy😊!

[@NoxnoctisSicarius]

The Catholic Church doesn't believe the Protoevangelium of James as scripture. In fact, it was not added to the canon because it is not inspired. The belief in the perpetual virginity of the Blessed Virgin was tradition based as taught by the early Church and not based on non-canonical scripture

[@johnsteila411]

Finally, an intelligent comment.

[@rexlion4510]

You wrote: "The belief in the perpetual virginity of the Blessed Virgin was tradition based as taught by the early Church and not based on non-canonical scripture." Sorry, but "non-canonical writings" are the very definition of "tradition"! Or do you suppose that ten or twenty (or more) generations can accurately pass on oral information? Did you ever play the "telephone" game when you were a kid?? Any verbal message becomes distorted beyond recognition after a handful of re-tellings. I would like to see what evidence of Mary's perpetual virginity that you have from the first two centuries of the early church. Name sources. The Orthodox professor Stephen J. Shoemaker wrote in his book, _Mary in Early Christian Faith and Devotion,_ that in his research he had found “little if any evidence of emergent Marian piety" prior to the circulation of the Protevangelium of James. He admits that the document reveals “the first visible shoots of early Christian devotion to Mary.” Shoemaker characterizes the influence of this document on the later church as “vast” and “enormously influential;” yet, because of his Orthodox bias, he failed to recognize the significance of these facts. The Protevangelium of James was the first of several Gnostic-influenced writings promoting Mary which, in the aggregate, turned the early church in a harmful direction. It was soon followed by other Gnostic-influenced writings such as the Book of Mary's Repose, the Six Books Dormition Apocryphon, and the so-called Gospel of Bartholomew. These writings characterized Mary as the holder of sacred cosmic mysteries and of secret passwords which one needs in order to enter heaven. They claim that she was the wise counselor and boss-lady to the Apostles. In the Gospel of Bartholomew, Mary fields questions from the disciples and explains “the sacred mysteries” to them; when asked how she bore such greatness in bearing the Christ-child in her womb, Mary purportedly warns them that if she were to tell them the answer, “fire will come out of my mouth and consume the whole earth.” 🤪 We need to remember, too, the early 4th Century declaration by Constantine of Christianity as the state religion, because when that happened many pagans began flocking into the church because it suddenly became stylish to do so. These people did not drop their pagan beliefs and desires at the church door; they were accustomed to worshiping a female figure and they wanted to continue doing so (Aphrodite was one of the names of this false deity). It did not take long for their ideas to percolate throughout the church and help turn it toward ever-increasing Marian piety (similar to how rapidly we've seen LGB ideas and 'modern' theologies influence the present-day church).

[@Berean_with_a_BTh]

​@@rexlion4510Constantine did not declare Christianity to be the State religion. The Edict of Milan, issued by Constantine in 313, only declared religious tolerance for Christianity (in effect giving Christianity the same right of existence and support as Judaism and a host of pagan religions) and directed that all confiscated churches be returned. Constantine's successor, Julian (the Apostate), promoted paganism over Christianity and revoked many of the benefits the church had gained under Constantine. It was Theodosius, in 380AD, who made Christianity the State religion.

[@sarahtar]

Does the tradition predate this writing, or was it possibly influenced by this writing?

[@NoxnoctisSicarius]

@@sarahtar the Tradition predates this writing

[@moomin8251]

The real Mary would be horrified at all the stories that have been made up about her.

[@patrickhenry236]

I have had confrontations with some in the Catholic church who make the false claim that Mary is the one who defeats the devil in Revelations, and I quote their own words "because Jesus is not able to." It is unfortunate that this type of idolatry continues to exist today. It also highlights the problem with keeping tradition for tradition's sake, a practice Christ himself condemned when confronting the Pharisees for doing so.

[@petros-petra]

_I will put enmities between thee and the woman, and thy seed and her seed: she shall crush thy head, and thou shalt lie in wait for her heel._ Gen 3:15

[@kelslo74]

Oh that's a new one, and I know many Catholics...if I had,I'd come out of my skin. My Lord and my God is above ALL!

[@Brityf]

I stumbled on Catholics on Twitter. It was so shocking. Like Mary being incorruptible like the ark of the covenant. It was list of ways Mary was the ark. My heart so much I stopped going on twittee.

[@petros-petra]

@@Brityf Mary is the Ark of the New Covenant. She's Theotokos, the God-Bearer, Mother of God.

[@patrickhenry236]

@@petros-petra Yet when the Israelites began worshipping the ark and the temple, the created rather than the Creator, it invoked God's anger because such action is sin. Mary was born into sin. Your statement might carry more weight if you treated it that Mary represents the ark. Conflating the terms of vessel doesn't help you.

[@hessin187]

Yes please do many more of these, as a visual thinker I have difficulty learning through written words. But to have someone read the ancient texts aloud while my brain plays the infographics would be a huge help.

[@toomanymarys7355]

I did a deep dive into this and discovered it was written as a direct refutation of Celsus. This gives it a firm date and explains some of the goofier elements really well.

[@carmiprieto2326]

But didn’t Celsus deny that she was a virgin tho?

[@toomanymarys7355]

@carmiprieto2326 This text is a RESPONSE to Celsus. A refutation.

[@dustinpeking2977]

Mike winger petting his cat is the best thing on the internet.

[@TruthfromBibleMinistry]

Is it really tho?

[@lesliematyas1921]

you have a truly sad life ....

[@k.popper2620]

​@TruthfromBibleMinistry I mean it's nice, but no, it's not the best thing on the internet 😅

[@rebeccahuber8286]

Thanks for reading it, I am an inquirer to the Orthodox Church and had not yet read the entirety of the Protoevangelium. It has not been presented (to me) within the church as canonical, it's been represented as containing some truths that had been widely known and passed down. So at least in the Orthodox church as far as I know, the entirety of the Protoevangelium is not taken as fact. (I say this only because this is what was told me at church!) The dogma of the ever-virginity of Mary has not been taken only from this source. I always enjoy your channel, thanks for your work.

[@randomguy1453]

I'm an Orthodox Christian and what you say is true, the book is not part of our canon, but is instead viewed as a repository of earlier held Christian traditions, kind of how protestants view the Deuterocanon (not inspired, but historically valuable), im saddened by the allegation that this "changed the Orthodox and Catholic" theology as alleged in the title

[@insertnamehere1103]

This is also what I have experienced, as an Orthodox inquirer myself

[@blazingruin2975]

I appreciate you sharing this, and knowing that our fears came true about the Mary movie is lamenting.

[@kayfiset2818]

I always wondered where those weird teachings came from. Thank you for doing this. When you are steeped in the scriptures, non scriptural works are obviously either fake or not inspired. They lack the particular tang of the Biblical books.

[@christophertaylor9100]

Yeah every one of these I have read clearly are not scripture, they just lack the spirit's touch.

[@littlemeadowpress]

These teachings don't come from this book, which has been rejected by the Catholic Church.

[@kayfiset2818]

@@littlemeadowpress Then where do they come from?

[@jpc9923]

This isn’t where Marian doctrines come from.

[@littlemeadowpress]

@@jpc9923 Have you researched this subject? Or are you rejecting my explanation without having looked into it?

[@MammaTroll]

Thanks Mike! This was very interesting. As an ex-Catholic from a mostly Catholic country, I never knew this book or how many of these beliefs came to be. I'm sure this new knowledge might turn out to be helpful in some conversations with Catholic friends. Always a pleasure to watch you. God bless you richly.

[@littlemeadowpress]

You're always welcome back. As the video description says this book has been rejected by the Catholic Church.

[@SylviaAdam-he4bq]

I'm favoured only God knows how much I praise Him, $230k every 4weeks! I now have a big mansion and can now afford anything and also support God’s work and the church.

[@SylviaAdam-he4bq]

Only God knows how much grateful i am. After so much struggles I now own a new house and my family is happy once again everything is finally falling into place!!

[@IsaacFlanders-uh2ud]

Wow that's huge, how do you make that much monthly?

[@JosephAlexander-im1sl]

I'm 37 and have been looking for ways to be successful, please how??

[@PeterMorotta]

I earn from investing in the digital market with the guidance of (Ms. Evelyn Vera) Brokerage services. I'm happy to talk about it!!

[@ChrisBunks]

I remember giving her my first saved up $20000 and she opened a brokerage account with it for me, it turned out to be the best thing that ever happened to me.

[@LittleBuckWV]

Would like to see your opinion on the book of Enoch, Jasher, and the book of Jubilee’s, I believe that’s the names of all the books. My friend likes to read from these books and put them with the Bible and I’m not sure how I feel about it or if they’re Biblically accurate and correct or if they’re forged as well. Just have a lot of questions and thought about these books and that whole subject. Love your videos! You’re helping me grow in my Christian walk, I thank God to find someone teaching and preaching truth on the internet, as it is hard to find that these days. Thank you!

[@KH-uv5ph]

Yes! Yes! Yes! I would LOVE to hear Mike's take on these books, especially the Book of Enoch!

[@dakotasmith1344]

I’ve read some of them. The book of Enoch in particular is interesting. I think Christians should read them and be familiar with them (especially the book of Enoch), but we should not elevate them to scripture. If they contradict scripture we can safely ignore them. Don’t concern yourself too much with them either way. These books are helpful in that you are getting an idea of what first century Jews would have been exposed to and maybe even what they would have believed. For example, who are the sons of God and the Nephilim in Genesis 6? Clearly the author of the book of Enoch believes that they are fallen angels and giants respectively. The Greek translation of Genesis supports this idea from what I remember. One of the angels mentioned here is Azazel I think, who a goat is probably offered to in Leviticus 16 (day of atonement). TLDR: nice to read for context but not all that important.

[@GenericYoutubeGuy]

Enoch, Jasher, and Jubilees ESPECIALLY contradict biblical teachings and are full of a load of nonsense which are not chronologically, historically, or linguistically accurate. For instance: Enoch is full of a load of mythology, Jubilees contradicts Jesus’ teachings, while Jasher alters biblical stories.

[@GenericYoutubeGuy]

⁠​⁠@@dakotasmith1344the Bible already shows that nephilim are giants. The Book of Enoch was a Greek mythological book uninspired, and made two hundred years after the last of the prophets gave their accounts.

[@theeternalsbeliever1779]

There is a legitimate book of Jasher, but the one being widely circulated today is a fraud. The real one has been lost to history. That being said, the book of Enoch is definitely a fraud. Not only was it NOT written by the real Enoch, it contradicts the Bible in at least 6 different ways. One of the heresies it promotes is angel worship.

[@evanbasnaw]

So, taking notes: 1. Jesus just appears outside of her womb without the need for the normal birthing process, showing he didn't need to come into the world the way a child does. 2. The "perpetual virgin" needn't be so since the traditional birth wasn't necessary 3. Joseph already had children, so had no need of a second wife. 4. Mary was already so protected by the priesthood that she didn't need to leave, only to be outside the gates as was normal for women during their ritual uncleanness 5. Mary was possibly already effectively immaculate conception birth if the timeline checks out with her father gone when her mother conceived Bonus 6. If Mary was granted a sinless nature as some would day due to her birth and perpetual virginity, there was no reason for Jesus to suffer and die because Mary already fulfilled the law in the way we could not and then could have been the sacrifice in our place.

[@jrconway3]

The #3 argument only works if Joseph's first wife died and his children weren't fully grown up yet, so he needed a mother to take care of them. This causes a big problem for Mary traveling around with "Joseph's" sons, though. Mary travels with "Joseph's" sons and daughters, not hers. Why? They are all grown adults now, why is this necessary? It makes WAY more sense if these WERE Mary's children, meaning they were YOUNGER than Jesus. Not all of them may have been fully grown adults yet. And if Joseph died young (likely due to illness or an accident) the older ones would need to be around to care for her after Jesus left as well. The only argument they actually have at this point is why Jesus gave Mary to John instead, but this is very easy to solve. Jesus had the rights of the firstborn, and he gave Mary to a man who was closer to a brother to him (John) than his "actual" brothers, because most of them rejected Jesus at least until the resurrection. (James and Jude at least seem to have become believers later, and they distanced themselves as being identified as Jesus' brothers. Probablt because they didn't want to be placed on equal terms with him. However, others like Paul still address them as "the brothers of the lord".)

[@jannlusk9397]

#6.That's my go-to response to the absolutely fabricated account of Mary's birth. In fact, if she were sinless, then Jesus could not have died for the sins of the whole world because Mary proved it was possible to live a sinless life without a Savior. Redonkulous theology all the way around and condemns everyone except Mary to hell.

[@Maverick-rz7io]

Your sixth point falls a bit short. Even given a perfect life, Mary wouldn't have been an appropriate sacrifice. She lacked the divinity that Christ did, which was necessay for proper substitutionary atonement. Given a perfect life, Mary would have been justified on her own merits, and if she'd been sacrificed, would have been sufficient for the sins of one other (likely), but would not have been sufficient for all sinners for all time. It's one of the reasons that not believing in the hypostatic union is considered heretical. Both parts of Jesus were absolutely necessary for His role. Catholic views of Mary are still wrong though.

[@JD-eb7ek]

@@evanbasnaw wait a second, so Jesus didn’t have to be god in your world view to die on the cross and save the world?

[@Sonicmax8728]

Your sixth point shows you have zero clue about Christian traditions in regards to Mary. Mary was granted free of sin to be a fitting vessel BY CHRIST. If someone saves someone before they fall in a hole and saves everyone else in the hole then they both were still saved. It was only through Christs future death on the cross she could be free of sin. All of your points have been answered that anyone would the smallest understanding of Mary could answer them

[@ZachFrost]

This "book" is so fake that the author had to use literally the most over-used, cliché plot device in writing: amnesia. 😭 Great job covering this, Mike, I thoroughly enjoyed listening to this while taking my lunch break. I had never even heard of this till today. I knew the new Netflix movie was giving more red flags than a bullfight, but wow. This is so fraudulent.

[@Scottiepups]

This was excellent Mike, thank you. God bless.

[@PastorChris87]

Wow, Mike I am really impressed. Most people dont know where to find the protoevangelion of James and here you are giving it to people for free. Good form, my friend.

[@chrisazure1624]

David Wood calls you a nerd, but nothing is nerdier than philosophy.

[@kelslo74]

David Wood is a tease,don't take that seriously

[@chrisazure1624]

@@kelslo74 I know. I am playing along.

[@aericabison23]

@@kelslo74 I’m glad the word “tease” doesn’t have a qualifier 💀

[@4xdblack]

Jesus was born in a manger, to a carpenter as a father, rode a donkey into Jerusalem, gathered no armies, declared himself king of no lands, subjected himself to the ridicule and punishment of men, died a slow and public death, and only ever glorified his father who glorified him. If the story of Jesus was this rooted in humility, why the hell do people think they need to add these grandiose legends and myths surrounding him? Its so obvious that these scriptures are not from God, yet there are millions who are devoted to them. I pray the truth gets revealed to all who seek it.

[@papyrusted]

EXACTLY 😅

[@ThePetrafan1]

I hit this video by accident (I plan to listen to it on my drive home from school on Friday), but I just saw the first 11 sec and I love the fact you're stroking your cat like a stereotypical movie bad-guy:p.

[@littleboots9800]

"in your awkwardness." 😂 best description of being heavily pregnant!

[@mrsTreadnaught]

If a book, writing or opinion of a church father, teacher or anyone else contradicts what was given to us in scripture. It's probably safe to disregard it...

[@bitesizeenglish3716]

@@mrsTreadnaught probably? you mean DEFINITELY.

[@jpc9923]

I have 5 non-Catholic churches in my town who all claim the bible says different things on matters as important as salvation, marriage, communion, worship, etc. “Contradicts what is in Scripture” isn’t a standard because people interpret differently. Just your opinion, just like this is all this preacher’s opinion. And, he’s not commenting on anything Catholics see as inspired nor the basis of Marian doctrines.

[@danielmalinen6337]

Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox Mariology, when it comes to Mary's childhood and youth, is based a lot on the Protoevangelium of James (the other is the Gospel of Pseudo-Matthew). For example, according to their doctrine, Mary was born to Joachim and Anne by a miraculous virgin birth because she is divine and sinless lady so that Mary could be the ever virgin vessel to give birth to the God Himself. Martin Luther and many reformers after him rejected this doctrine because it is not based on any canonical or deuterocanonical book but on church tradition and apocrypha. Modern scholars regard the Protoevangelium of James and the Gospel of Pseudo-Matthew as typical examples of medieval Christian fan fiction and tradition gap-filling.

[@JesusWillRescue]

Also because the Bible records Mary and Joseph having more children after Jesus. After his Birth the marriage was consummated and Jesus’ siblings are mentioned in the gospels.

[@jrconway3]

​@JesusWillRescueThey come up with clever excuses get around this argument. Another big point against this is Paul's teaching on marriage, which is also a reflection of the Law's discussion on marriage. Paul tells husbands and wives not to defraud one another. And while he recommends singleness for the sake of the Kingdom of God he also clearly indicated this would be a rare exception, as "if you cannot contain you should marry". In the Law, a wife could be freed of her husband if he refused sexual relations. Paul addresses this to the Gentiles by saying husbands and wives should not defraud one another, and only temporarily stop sexual relations by mutual consent "for a time" if for the purpose of fasting. The idea of committing to celibacy for the kingdom of God absolutely is a Biblical concept... but in such cases you don't marry. Marriage is for those NOT committed to celibacy (which is the majority of people). The idea of Mary being married and still celibate is 100% nonbiblical. Its a nonsensical idea.

[@WeakestAvenger]

@JesusWillRescue Can you point me to anyone in Church history before the Reformation who believed Mary gave birth to other children than Jesus? Even Luther, Calvin, and Zwingli didn't believe that, right? The word ἕως ("until") doesn't always imply anything about what is the case after that point in time (2 Samuel 6:23 is a good example). Jesus having siblings doesn't imply Mary was their biological mother if Joseph had children from a previous marriage, or if the siblings were called such according to the broader familial categories than our English words "brother" and "sister" entail (e.g., Lot as Abram's nephew in Gen 12:5 and 14:12 but his "brother" in 13:8, 11, 14, 16). In fact, I'm not aware of any verse in the NT calling anyone other than Jesus the child of Mary, except the clearly metaphorical use to John during the crucifixion.

[@aluna1234]

​@@WeakestAvengerMatthew 12:46-50 "While he was still speaking to the people, behold, his mother and his brothers stood outside, asking to speak to him. But he replied to the man who told him, “Who is my mother, and who are my brothers?”And stretching out his hand toward his disciples, he said, “Here are my mother and my brothers! For whoever does the will of my Father in heaven is my brother and sister and mother.”

[@aluna1234]

​@@WeakestAvenger Matthew 13:55-56 Is not this the carpenter’s son? Is not his mother called Mary? And are not his brothers James and Joseph and Simon and Judas? And are not all his sisters with us? Where then did this man get all these things?”

[@MarkHorton-n3t]

Another contradiction is that only ONE priest entered the Holy of Holies ONCE a year.

[@Koki-qe7vz]

Not if you’re catholic and believe she is the new ark of the covenant.

[@kelslo74]

​@@Koki-qe7vz are you serious?! Oh boy 😵‍💫

[@sarasho6098]

@@kelslo74 I think its pretty clear Mary fills the role of the arc of the covenant in the new testamentet if you look into it.

[@theeternalsbeliever1779]

@@kelslo74 Seriously, there are Catholics who genuinely believe this.

[@Akhgy]

@@theeternalsbeliever1779 your lying you do know that right? - why are you lying to push your false presupposition on the Catholic church? Have you even thought of even that Author of the book l, know that tradition of Mary and add details to it to support his sect? I bet you didn’t because your just Gullible to believe everything that is against any church.. except your own beliefs

[@randomguy1453]

The issue with this is that the video (as it is alleged in the title) assumes the Protoevangelium is the origin point and accepted as such for these traditions, instead the document is viewed as a repository for previously held beliefs, along with some likely embellishments designed to combat certain beliefs emerging in this period. In neither the Roman Catholic Church, nor the Eastern Orthodox Church, is the book considered holy scripture as part of the Canon. Instead, its best place is in a similar way to how protestants view the Deuterocanon (Apocrypha), a collection of historical writings documenting certain traditions about the early life of the Virgin Mary, some we take to be true, and others to not be so. This is incredibly dishonest work, and id like to see more effort put in when it comes to this. If it changed our theology, then why was it not accepted into the canon by the evil changed church?

[@derickrisner2601]

Sounds like the Gospel of James turned Mary into a "Mary Sue" ;)

[@sarahtar]

Lol. I was thinking the same thing.

[@sarahfaith316]

I have a hard time focusing on books on my own. I enjoyed this format.

[@kurtweiand7086]

Thanks for the time you spent reading this to us! Now l understand where these beliefs about Mary come from!

[@jpc9923]

This isn’t where the Marian doctrines come from. Best to learn about Catholicism from educated Catholics.

[@mable552]

Throughly enjoyed this. Yes, please do more in the future.

[@valenciawallace1726]

Scared me with the SNAKE on your lap! LOL 😃😊

[@laurenkwarren]

@@valenciawallace1726 that’s what I thought at first too!! 😄

[@CiscoKasha]

I started watching that movie the other day.While I was making christmas cookies, not knowing what I was starting. I stopped it within the first five minutes because I was realizing immediately it was not biblical. I'm not willing to watch fake stories like that...

[@jjb9571]

This would be a very interesting conversation between Mike and a Catholic scholar to hear from both sides. I think Mike is very bright and graceful if you had a Catholics scholar with the same temperament would very educational. Great work enjoy your channel

[@thaddeusblack7694]

I agree, but Mike has a standing refusal to talk to any Catholics, much to everyone's disappointment

[@jpc9923]

It’s best to look up Catholic beliefs from educated Catholic sources. This document is not where Marian doctrines come from and it is not inspired.

[@anycyclopedia]

Saint Jerome who was a strong defender of Mary's Perpetual Virginity, also rejected all the apocryphal books, including James's Protoevangelium. He only used the canonical books of the Bible to prove Mary's perpetual virginity to Heldivius in his letter Adversus Helvidium (4th century).

[@HoldToChrist]

31:41 I wonder if the author was trying to get around the fact that Mary doesn’t seem aware in the gospels of her “actual” status that was supposedly revealed to her beforehand, so, “she forgot”

[@peterku9022]

Hi Mike, as a former Protestant/new Catholic, we should all honor the Blessed (Luke 1:48) Virgin Mary. Please have conversations with Catholic interlocutors if you are going to publicly present a less honorable picture of the mother of our Lord. I get not wanting to debate - I wouldn't either. It could just be a discussion. What's the worst that can happen - you get convinced to honor the mother of our Lord more? Peace bro

[@stephenwilson0386]

If it were important to "honor the mother of our Lord", you'd think the Bible would mention that. Weird. ...and no, Luke 1:48 is not telling anyone to "honor" or pray to Mary like Catholics do.

[@legodavid9260]

Hey Mike, could you please do more videos responding to Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox teachings? There is a huge trend right now among young people where the dissatisfaction with Evangelical churches has led them to convert to those traditional Churches, however many of those young people seem to be ignorant about what those churches actually are and teach and what beliefs they are actually committing themselves to. More Protestant apologetics are desperately needed right now!

[@Sonicmax8728]

We aren’t ignorant. We realized the falsehood and lack of historical Christian views evangelicals have. Where do you find any evangelical view in the early church? You don’t

[@davidwilkins5932]

@Sonic … what do you mean by “lack of historical Christian views”? The Word is the Word, and the Gospel is the Gospel.

[@Sonicmax8728]

@@davidwilkins5932 that is correct, now look further and understand theological positions held. The word isn’t always self explanatory. Good luck finding evangelical theological positions in the early church.

[@raphaelfeneje486]

​@@Sonicmax8728 Evangelical theological positions held in the early church?? Let me list them. 1. Salvation by Faith alone(marius victorianus being one proponent). 2. The trinity. 3. Evangelism. 4. Repentance. 5. Baptism. I can go on. Now I can list what the orthodox and Roman Catholic church hold to that aren't in the early church.

[@raphaelfeneje486]

​@@Sonicmax8728Evangelical theological positions held in the early church?? Let me list them. 1. Salvation by Faith alone(marius victorianus being one proponent). 2. The trinity. 3. Evangelism. 4. Repentance. 5. Baptism. I can go on.

[@davidmelton3704]

I liked this video and support you doing more like this, to examine extra biblical but commonly accepted works in the light of scripture.

[@joelpierce1453]

19:01 the twelve bells might be a reference to this tradition I've heard about: The high priest would supposedly wear bells and a rope when he went into the Holy of Holies so that if he died, they would know because the bells would stop ringing and they would use the rope to pull him out.

[@littleboots9800]

I never heard anything about a rope but the High Priest did have bells on the fringes of his garment didn't he? In the OT it describes them and the pomegranates on the bottom.

[@joelpierce1453]

@@Strongtower That's why I said it's something I heard and didn't present it as though I'm certain it's true.

[@ceegee777]

Exodus 28: 33-35 Talks about the bells only.

[@calebmarquart]

@@littleboots9800You’re right. Read Exodus 28:33-35

[@littleboots9800]

@@calebmarquart the funny thing is I just remembered where I remembered it from and it was from a video Mike himself did on "garments of the high priest" and he forgot!! Thanks for the verses, going to look it up now.

[@OldProphet61]

I'm writing a series of classes on biblical discernment that I will soon teach at our church. The classes will probably upset a few people, although that isn't the intent. I'm constantly amazed at the lack of discernment among professing Christians. I attribute it mainly to biblical ignorance, but also to a misguided desire to just get along no matter what. Even in our bible believing Baptist church there are several who think the catholics are fine.

[@rexlion4510]

The Catholic Church doesn't even teach the means of salvation and justification properly. When a church can't accurately teach its people how to be saved, it is salt that has lost its saltiness and is worthless. I hope you can edify your church members.

[@sabrinacady7917]

It’s amazing to me that Paul warned the church THREE TIMES, in THREE different epistles to not listen to “Jewish myths” and the Catholic Church was like meh, what’s the harm? 🤦‍♀️

[@user-nu8hd1vb5c]

What makes you protestants think that this fake influenced the church thinking of Mary, and not the other way around, in an age when oral tradition were more authoritative than writings?

[@mcchubbz2975]

Not just more authoritative but technically the only authority. There was no official canon for several centuries. Of course they don’t care they just wanna act like the Bible fell out of the sky into Luther’s hands.

[@user-nu8hd1vb5c]

@mcchubbz2975 thank you. I realized that the modern atheists and the protestants have the same problem: They think they are geniuses, formed by a superior society, and everyone in the past was mortally stupid.

[@rexlion4510]

There is zero evidence of it being "the other way around." The Protevangelium was a late 2nd Century document. How can you Catholics think that "oral tradition" could be dependably & accurately passed down through multiple generations? Didn't you ever play the "telephone" game when you were a kid? A teacher did this in my school classroom to show us kids how distorted a verbal message becomes after only 4 or 5 re-tellings.

[@AlyoshaBosha]

What makes them think that? Their own predispositions, which they dare not touch upon.

[@AlyoshaBosha]

@@rexlion4510 Let's, for the sake of the argument, assume that oral tradition (which in my opinion is true) has been passed down unto generations (Like saint Paul mentioned). Is the Holy Spirit not able to work through that? Or does God have limits depending on the form of passing down information? How was the canon of the New and Old testaments even formed? Surely, there was no full book on the day of Pentecost, and neither was there within the first 200 years a full collection. Was the Truth hidden until Luther came? Or Calvin? Or Zwingli?

[@melaniekeating9015]

Thank you for reading the text. I hope you do more of these types of videos. It was very interesting, and I know I would not have found that text and read it myself. Now I have some excellent talking points when people question the Mary movie. Keep up the good work. God bless you and your family.

[@21joerice]

Did Gabriel not tell Mary in Luke that they'll call him Jesus?

[@aaronvienot]

Nothing like a quiet evening with Mike Winger supplying an audiobook reading of a second-century fan-fic epic, featuring twenty-five percent more blasphemy. I hope this doesn't replace too much of your regular content -- see also: the usual sermon story of training bank tellers with real banknotes -- but once in a while it's helpful to have an actual counterfeit run under the microscope for contrast.

[@DOMNICA78]

Mike, my husband and I are very grateful for your ministry and especially for this video! Just a few days ago, my brother sent me a sermon of an ortodox priest about this very topic, which, as I can see now, was inspired by this book . I was raised eastern ortodox, but by the grace of God I've been saved almost four years ago, and it's difficult even to listen to something that resembles the teaching of this religion. Nevertheless, because all my family is still deeply involved in this religion, I try to get pass my aversion against it, so I can better evangelize my family. Many blessings to you and your family! May the Lord bless you and keep you!

[@AZmom60]

Bless you, that’s a hard place to be.

[@DOMNICA78]

@@AZmom60 thanks! God bless you too!

[@LisaSilipo]

That is difficult. May God give you the knowledge and boldness of faith to minister to them.

[@DOMNICA78]

@@LisaSilipo Amen! 🙏

[@elbron7595]

You made one of the worst decisions you can make.

[@1983aw]

When I first started getting into the apocryphal text, I read this one in what they called the super gospel the whole story of Mary and Jesus Christ. And it made me feel so sickened. I can’t explain it. It’s the same feeling I get when I have read like the books of Adam and Eve , Enoch, the ones that were removed from the Bible. Through studying the Bible and studying the apocrypha texts there are real reasons why they are not in the Bible. Big doctrinal problems. Why are Christians so obsessed with these books?

[@merrygrammarian1591]

Because the Enemy uses them to mislead people who don't know. We need to be like Paul: unafraid to study and engage lies so as to expose them.

[@rebeham]

As a high school teacher who lately taught about the Christmas traditions that we get from this book (borrowing from Ken Bailey), I really appreciate this reading and reaction. Thanks for all you do!

[@danielletracyann]

Mary is told to call Jesus “Jesus” that’s in luke. It’s also told to Joseph in Matthew

[@Believer_of_christ-e5v]

Amen and amen! Reading Randy Alcorn's book"The Treasure Principle" completely transformed my faith and deepened my relationship with God In 2019, I felt called to donate nearly all I had, a total of $50,000, despite people thinking I had lost my mind. Fast forward to today, and I receive over $100,000 every three months. I own properties I once only dreamed of and have the freedom to travel the world. God has been faithful, opening unimaginable doors and blessing me beyond what I could have ever asked for. Truly, He honors these who trust in His promises!❤️🙏

[@ProsperGodin]

Congratulations!! The scriptures clearly states there's going a transference of the riches of the heathen to the righteous. God keep blessings you

[@ProsperGodin]

But then, how do you get all that in such period of time? What is it you do please, mind sharing?

[@Believer_of_christ-e5v]

It is simply the digital market. That's been the secret to my success. A lot of folks in the US and abroad are getting so much from the program.

[@Believer_of_christ-e5v]

Big thanks to Mrs Teresa Alice Brenda.

[@Believer_of_christ-e5v]

Her top notch guidance and expertise on digital market changed the game for me.

[@the_guitarcade]

Methinks the nerd has been watching Gavin Ortlund videos lately, what with the use of the word accretion. Before anybody gets mad about me calling Mike "the nerd," it's a joke in the fake feud between the Wingalings and the Woodies, and I'm also a nerd.

[@StrandedClone]

Nerd is practically a compliment nowadays

[@raphaelfeneje486]

LOL. I love Gavin Ortlund as well

[@DrakonPhD]

Well there was the apologist avengers meeting a few weeks ago lol, I forget if Gavin was there as well.

[@raphaelfeneje486]

@@DrakonPhD He was there. LOL

[@Scottiepups]

Actually the Roman Catholics believe Mary was immaculately conceived and that is why she was pregnant before her husband came home. Hence “the Immaculate heart of Mary” also they believe she ascended like Jesus to heaven. I was RC but was saved out of it . 🙌🏻

[@newmoon0928]

Wouldn't it be the immaculate WOMB of Mary? Different organ entirely.

[@elained7006]

Amen me too

[@KDC123-Yh]

Me too! Grateful every second to Out Father for saving me and my family.

[@Scottiepups]

@@newmoon0928they believe she was conceived just as Jesus was. They believe she was sinless as He was. 😑

[@jacobtnp4906]

Praise God, my mom was RC but was baptized last year

[@jeke122]

Dear Mike, Thank you so much for this video! It was super interesting! I would love it if you turned this into a series! Also, thank you for your ministry! It has greatly blessed me and helped me deepen my walk with God! God bless you and have a wonderful holiday season!

[@darleneeckman]

I'm a huge fan of your channel, Pastor Mike. I very much enjoy listening to you.

[@a.t.ministries5376]

Love this. In 29:30 one quick correction: Luke 1:31 has Gabriel telling Mary to name her son Jesus.

[@micheletisdale_HHWF]

Good catch 👍

[@Jeff-q6s]

All the Anti Catholic and orthodox talk makes zero sense to me. I’m a Protestant leaning towards orthodoxy, how am I suppose to trust the man mad traditions of Protestantism but not trust the traditions that have been held since the time of Christ. I go to a non denominational charismatic church and if you say that is what the early church looked like I just don’t understand.

[@mcchubbz2975]

The irony of this video pointing out things about non canonical texts is the fact that Winger here has no actual method of coming to the conclusion of the canon other than appealing to the Orthodox Church. So any attempt at saying “Well you can’t use this text because blah” is completely bunk and worthless. The Church recognized plenty of teachings from non canonical books and even Apostles reference books that didn’t make it into the canon. So the entire video doesn’t refute anything at all.

[@Berean_with_a_BTh]

Suffice to say, Pope Innocent I condemned the _Protoevangelium of James_ as a heretical forgery in 405. By then, though, the cult of Mary had become firmly entrenched. The doctrine of Mary's perpetual virginity is contrary to the plain meaning of: Matthew 1:24-25; 12:46; 13:55-56; Mark 3:31; 6:3; Luke 8:19; John 2:12; 7:3-10; Acts 1:14; 1 Corinthians 5:9; Galatians 1:1, etc. No church father before Clement of Alexandria (c.150-c.215) made mention of the idea of Mary's supposed perpetual virginity. It is not acknowledged by: • Clement of Rome (?-c.100) • Ignatius of Antioch (c.35-c.110) • Polycarp of Smyrna (c.69-c.155) • Papias of Hierapolis • Justin Martyr (c.100-c.165) • Irenaeus of Lyons (130-212) • Tertullian (c.155-c.220) Although Tertullian, Irenaeus and Justin Martyr all mentioned the virgin birth, none of them said anything about Mary being a perpetual virgin. Tertullian even went so far as to describe Mary as imperfect, thus denying her sinlessness. To defend the heresy, Jerome (c.345-420) falsely claimed in _On the Perpetual Virginity of Blessed Mary Against Helvidius_ (c.383) that Ignatius, Polycarp, Irenaeus, and Justin Martyr all wrote that Mary remained a virgin all her life. Yet no trace of any such writings has ever been found. And even Jerome doesn’t provide any supporting references or quotations. How gullible does one have to be to believe that Ignatius, Polycarp, Irenaeus, and Justin Martyr all claimed Mary remained a virgin all her life yet left no trace of the claim in either their own writings or as quotes in the writings of others before Jerome came along?

[@theeternalsbeliever1779]

You don't understand because you don't study the Bible. You declare it yourself by blindly assuming that any traditions you assume to be biblical are indeed biblical. There are a lot of false traditions that have been adhered to since the time of Christ, _but that doesn't make them biblical_ .

[@AlyoshaBosha]

@@mcchubbz2975 Very well-phrased! Protestants have no idea of the differences in theological language between Catholics and Orthodox.

[@nicolethompson8613]

Prove that the 1st century church and apostles believed in these non-Biblical "traditions".

[@spiritandflesh8477]

You and Wes Huff need to do a collaboration! I think it would be fruitful.

[@ThatGuy-TheEngineer]

Would love to see more videos like this! I know there's a lot of wisdom in reading false accounts or other religions' texts so that we know how to address them, but it's not something I have yet personally felt safe in reading with a discerning lens. Your video was a wonderful way for me to read a document that may lead others astray while focusing on how to address it and better understand the people who hold to it. Thanks for all you do!

[@sophiamonroe5828]

You should definitely do more videos like this! I would love to hear you go through each of the apocryphal books.

[@sharonviksen788]

1. Love the cat 2. Interesting video 3. “Poof” change of clothes

[@davidwilkins5932]

I think all of us cat folk were pleased. 🐾😶🐾

[@4christ207]

Mike: "Poof change of clothes" Me: 😳He's a wizard

[@SorenVictoria]

“Many” church fathers supported this? Could we get these “many” names?

[@Berean_with_a_BTh]

The first to mention it was Clement of Alexandria (c.150-c.215), apparently unwittingly drawing on the _Protoevangelium of James._ Soon after, as the the _Protoevangelium of James_ started gaining traction, it became an urban myth that lots of people just assumed to be historical fact. Jerome (c.345-420) claimed in _On the Perpetual Virginity of Blessed Mary Against Helvidius_ (c.383) that Ignatius, Polycarp, Irenaeus, and Justin Martyr all wrote that Mary remained a virgin all her life. Yet no trace of any such writings has ever been found. The _Protoevangelium of James_ was condemned as a heretical forgery by Pope Innocent I in 405 but, by then, the myth of Mary's perpetual virginity had become entrenched despite the biblical evidence to the contrary.

[@SorenVictoria]

⁠@@Berean_with_a_BTh Thank you. I can’t say this is conclusive evidence that any of these people supported the false gospel however. This evidence only supports that they affirmed Mary’s perpetual virginity, not that they affirmed the false gospel.

[@sivad1025]

​@Berean_with_a_BTh Arguments from silence are not arguments for non-existence. It's not like Ignatius only wrote 7 letters in his whole life. It's always amazing to me how Protestants go to the atheist well of arguments when discussing Catholic/EO dogma People weren't making radical theological decisions simply because a guy pretending to be James said so

[@kelslo74]

The whole "church fathers" thing,the Roman church AND also the reformed denominations quote them more than the Apostles,it's bizarre

[@sivad1025]

@kelslo74 They are men who, in many cases, died for the faith and spent their whole lives dedicated to expanding the small church with close proximity to the disciples. They're quoted because they address questions the apostles didn't in writing which are often the types of questions that divide Christians. The apostles weren't interested in Trinitarian theology. The church fathers were because Arius made it a problem

[@irritated888]

" Now there stood by the cross of Jesus His mother, and His mother’s sister, Mary the wife of Clopas, and Mary Magdalene. 26 When Jesus therefore saw His mother, and the disciple whom He loved standing by, He said to His mother, “Woman, behold your son!” 27 Then He said to the disciple, “Behold your mother!” And from that hour that disciple took her to his own home." John 19:25-27. If Mary had additional children, there is no need for Christ to do this.

[@paisleylvr7]

This is an awesome video! Would love a deep dive into first Enoch since it’s slightly referenced in the New Testament but not canonical. After the head covering video, I feel like your the man for the job! Thank you for what you do!!!

[@jameswelsh3433]

The High Priest could only enter the Holy of Holies once a year!

[@johnperekopsky3271]

Regarding the Magi - Mathew clearly states that they entered a house - not a cave. Can discredit and invalidate this "gospel" on this alone.

[@tammyl7301]

Thank you, Mike, very insightful on the Catholic and Orthodox view of Mary.

[@Robert-r4s4c]

He has absolutely no knowledge about Mary and her role in the economy of salvation.

[@ForeverMe217]

@@Robert-r4s4cShe doesn’t do anything for salvation 🤦🏾‍♀️

[@midimusicforever]

@@Robert-r4s4c Sound like you have no knoweldge if you think Mary takes part in salvation. You might even lack it. Jesus finished work on the cross, never add to it!

[@Robert-r4s4c]

@@midimusicforever You obviously lack knowledge of the transmission of divine revelation.

[@Robert-r4s4c]

@ForeverMe217 I that case, you are calling God a liar.

[@insertnamehere1103]

Who's to say your interpretation of this book is the correct one? We need to look at the church fathers in addition to reading books like these, because you may be completely divorced from the truth solely on account that you are missing the fundamental perspective you need to fully understand it

[@5agentalex5]

Im so glad you covered this! I recently started hearing people saying things about Joseph having been old and on his second marriage, or stuff bout the perpetual virginity and it was crazy to me because obviously none of that is in the Bible so its good to at least know where its all coming from.

[@nathanielroffel4304]

I've been hoping for a video on this! Thanks

[@dominicpizano887]

I’ve been doing my term paper on this one!! Really less of a fake gospel and almost entirely focuses on Mary

[@jndvs95]

It comes from the same time period that the cult of isis was big. The cult of isis had a big role in converting their statues and practices into Mary and representations of mary. They saw Mary and Jesus as another form of Isis. Adds an interesting level of understanding

[@dominicpizano887]

@ any sources for this? Haven’t heard anything about this cult of isis in my research

[@dominicpizano887]

@@jndvs95 source?

[@maureensawe]

This book reminds me of another book from another religion, from Arabia. Seems like inspired by the same spirit.

[@RJ-vq1iv]

Have to say …. You are very gracious bro, thanks for what you do

[@__rezin__7819]

@mike your ability to teach on youtube is incredible. Not because of your knowledge but because of your endurance with stinging vipers. I read the comments and close the app lol.

[@coffeeandword]

It always amazes me how the Roman Catholics come out in force to defend their view of Mary. I wonder if they defend Christology or the trinity with the same volume and passion?

[@danb3378]

Who do you think defended Christianity for the first 1500 years

[@coffeeandword]

@@danb3378 Adding to the Gospel and the work of Christ is hardly defending it.

[@davidwilkins5932]

Exactly, systemic distortion and devaluation began no later than the 3rd century.

[@danb3378]

@@coffeeandword they fought heresy after heresy and determined it wasn’t a book to add to the Bible so it wasn’t gospel

[@grizzly_8917]

​@danb3378 The EO, before rome decided to fill itself with pride.

I'd love to hear a deep dive into Enoch

[@kelslo74]

1st Enoch

[@carlspackler1431]

When we getting Mike Winger and Wes Huff conversation?!?! Are you familiar with his works Mike?

[@sarahfaith316]

He is! They’ve interviewed together before!

[@arthurbrugge2457]

Doing good apologetics works together, regarding the canon🙂

[@Ruby-wise]

TY Mike…for giving voice to this obscure literature… that we may never have heard otherwise. . More please!

[@laurah.1985]

Wow, this was new to me. Crazy stuff. Thanks for reading it.