FALSE GODS | Warhammer 40k Book Review & Discussion

[@Adeptusridiculous]

Bricky dumb dumb head speaking here: I was thinking of the “warrior lodges” having a ton of people, but said mournival. 40 lashes to me immediately

[@iamthereddemon20]

Well I mean entertainment over accuracy right?

[@devilmaycry265]

Hahaha this is 40K your getting taken to be made a archoflagallant

[@Yoboymilk588]

Too late you’re getting flayed alive on twitter how dare you make a mistake on this 100% lore accurate podcast

[@H_Hold]

Torgaddon has a name like abaddon. Sounds better when pronounced "Tor Ga Don" like "A Ba Don"

[@CuriousLumenwood]

Born too late to explore the world, born too early to explore the stars, born just in time to binge watch AdRic episodes while I paint plastic men.

[@len9505]

Wait, did AdRic autocorrect to AdMech?

[@TheDeceptiveMoss]

What a time to be alive

[@CuriousLumenwood]

@@len9505 ...no...

[@LeftHandEats]

Not at all born too late to explore the world. 70% of the world is Oceans & over 80% of those Oceans is yet to be explored.

[@comlitbeta7532]

​@@LeftHandEatswater is boring, fight me

[@matiasyannuzzi9655]

If DK thinks False Gods had a culling of remembrancers, he isn't ready for Galaxy in Flames.

[@PobortzaPl]

Abaddon: Dad, can we have Maraviglia? Horus: We have Maraviglia at home At home: Horus rebels executing nearly all remembrancers Abaddon: 😢

[@FoxHound-ut1hu]

The Mornival is just Abbadon, Loken, Tarik and lil' Horus

[@andrewlaedtke1720]

Don't worry bricky a fake fan

[@kennethcunningham2572]

@@FoxHound-ut1hu he was getting it confused with the normal lodge

[@krankarvolund7771]

@@andrewlaedtke1720 Oh no, Bricky made one mistake about a book, he's obviously a fake fan 🙄

[@andrewlaedtke1720]

@@krankarvolund7771 obviously

[@bernardrfrederic]

idk how you read the book and get this wrong. wtf Bricky?? lol

[@DatSamThen]

The mournival doesn't have 30 people, it's just Gavriel, Torgaddon, Abaddon and Horus Aximand.

[@cyprus1005]

bricky meant the warriors lodge from which the mournival is "descended", he is stupid its ok

[@bernardrfrederic]

idk how you read the book and get this wrong. wtf Bricky?? lol

[@micahdouglas2982]

Came here to say this

[@user-jl2ev9el8c]

The keeler and sinderman side plot continues throughout the Horus heresy and ends up being one of the most important subplots in the entirety of 40k .

[@Lindwurm_Nx]

Two firsts, marking the way for many important people

[@devilmaycry265]

It’s sooo good too!

[@coldcyan6933]

Fun fact: Dies Irae the titan in false gods It appears also in storm of iron with the iron warriors.

[@FromTheAshes0762]

Also, the End and the Death its there

[@CousinOfCurze]

@@FromTheAshes0762 And one of the biggest threats in Mortis.

[@coldcyan6933]

I like how you announce the next book for the book club, i read it in a week or two then have two wait 3 months for the bookclub to happen. I finished false god, galaxy in flames, flight of the eisenstein, legion, the silent war and scars since the last book club and I didn't even start right away. I know a 12-15 hour audio book is long but it isn't 3 MONTHS long.

[@hampusnilsson6950]

Id recommend Fulgrim for ya. Its a nice follow for or in between the first books

[@grayw00f]

I've done much the same lol. Once I heard they were reading the first 3 books of the heresy I decided to get through as many as I could before they moved on to a different series. I've done rising - false - flames - eisenstein - fulgrim so far.

[@KILLSMASH]

Fulgrim is a great book. I also recommend Battle of The Abyss, or as I like to call it, The Word Bearers commit war crimes.

[@cassidywoodliff]

Same, in the time between book clubs I finished false gods, galaxy in flames, flight of the esinstein, fulgrim, and just finished Helsreach last night. Trying to read these books at their pace is hard.

[@eloaris3355]

I mean, the point of the book club was to incentivise people to read the books, since they're usually massive and pretty daunting, so mission successful, I know it's kinda annoying they're not holding to their own schedule, but like,, you don't have to engage with the book club if you don't want to, there's still plenty of podcast left to watch without it

[@ryantice1186]

Mornival was just Abbadon, Loken, Tarik, and Horus Aximand(Little Horus). Nero and the rest were in the Lodges.

[@t3k7]

i think one of the bigger and more often missed reasons for Horus's fall are two things: during his visit to the shrine world, not only was seeing the emperor worshipped as a god across an entire world a revolting sight, he also felt hurt in his massive ego because of there not being any statues of the traitor primarchs, including him, which resulted in Horus practically having a panic attack which let Erebus manipulate him when they visited the Primarch project and The Emperor stood infront of Horus and let the scattering happen, which then sowed the seeds of resentment and stoked the flames of his ambition for humanity, in which he fell

[@kennethcunningham2572]

This is so true.

[@ganibal25]

Horus fell after being shown consequences of his own actions, after what he committed actions that caused the consequences he witnessed that caused him to fall, that just so crazy

[@jamesfirecat6652]

@@ganibal25Well I mean Oedipus was told “you’re gonna grow up to kill your father and have sex with your mother”, so he decided to move far away from his parents… not realizing that they had adopted so he ended killing this “random” old guy when they got into a quarrel during his journey, and sure enough….

[@myonlyfriendtheend4958]

Also GW thought this was going ti be a quick book series like legit 6-8 books

[@CannibalShinobi]

Last week: "They don't know about Loken." This week: "They don't know about Sinderman."

[@matthewstoutenburg9519]

They still don’t know about Loken haha

[@Hawquin]

I agree horus turns pretty quickly in this book but it is more explained throughout the heresy. Horus wasn't used to failure and since turning war master he failed multiple times. He was afraid of what his father could do if he was considered a big enough failure. He also learned that his father kept a vital truth of the universe from him and was now hiding back home keeping more secrets. Horus almost dies and realizes he can only really count on himself and that means turning against his father and gathering as much to his side as possible as quickly as possible and burning the rest. Very to his nature of cut of the head of the snake then deal with what's left.

[@singtothesilence]

It's one of those things like Anakin's fall that just happens for too quick. That said, I have far more sympathy here because the fall wasn't written for the 50-60 book Heresy series as written, it was written for the 10-12 book cycle they had planned.

[@TyrusR3chs]

"I was there, when horus fell." 😢

[@Beano_Mate]

The rememberancer culling was brutal but I'm sure we will never see that again *looks into camera*

[@kennethcunningham2572]

This constant disregard for Sinderman is terrible, and its time to read The End and Death boys.

[@FromTheAshes0762]

The OG inquisitor.

[@ttothedtotheog8877]

Yes!!! thjs exactly!!! Poor fn Sinderman!

[@jordinagel1184]

“This has a sort of Order 66 feel to it” Oh, we ain’t quite there yet. If I had to pick another prequel analogy, I’d say this is more the point where Anakin betrays Mace Windu and submits to Palpatine. Order 66 will be… soon.

[@MyKingoflol]

The war against the Aurelian Technocracy is actually interesting to me. Not only was Horus raiding them for the STCs and as a cover to assassinate Varvarus. He used it as a dry run for the Heresy itself. He’s desensitizing his men to the idea of fighting other Astartes. They use bolters and power armor that is described as being very similar to that of Space Marines. Just to make what they’re planning to do in the near future just that little bit easer. Just a little something to desensitize his own men against the feeling of wrongness that most loyalist are still struggling with 20+ books later

[@luckiller019]

Honestly, 'Horus motivation to fall to Chaos' was always the weakes part of HH. Especially once it escalated into almost 100 books series. It's rush and forced. Once you finished the 3rd book maybe you should do epizode 'fixing the Horus' but you would need a some hoste who is HH scolar

[@pongwong5463]

I would HIGHLY recommend reading fulgrim as well. It’s the fifth book, just after flight of the eisenstien, and it’s fantastic.

[@mountaindrew4311]

That painting though

[@pongwong5463]

@@mountaindrew4311 Hey now, no spoilers

[@krankarvolund7771]

Mournival is just four people, it can only be four people. The twenty people you're thinking about is the Lodge.

[@nateinky01]

I gotta say Legion is probably my favorite 40k book, that I've read so far. I really really hope they give it an episode, or the Unremembered Empire trilogy.

[@nieja6238]

Legion is awesome. Made me fall in love with Alpha legion

[@ShadowGhost0117]

Legion is definitely one of those books that uses Space Marines in a nice fashion by using them sparingly and letting the regular humans take most of the spotlight for a change.

[@ShadowGhost0117]

I really enjoy a lot of the Shadow Crusade and Imperium Secundus books (Know No Fear, Unremembered Empire, Angels of Caliban, and Betrayer).

[@Therealmanticorejones]

If you give a damn, I would recommend adding fulgrim , which is book 5 to the list before finishing with the heresy. Eisenstein is the last in chronological progression but Fulgrim takes place during false gods/galaxy in flames and it REALLY finishes the fleshing out of the story’s beginning. The “story” being the overall heresy.

[@StygianSkunk]

Yeah, I don't think it's very controversial to say Horus' turn was too quick. "I can't trust you, Magnus, you broke the edict!" Bro, how do you think Eresus was there? 😆 I liked the VA's take on Ignace, I can't unhear that specific drawl.

[@dylangalloway9541]

Horus turned super quick. One reason was the Heresy series was supposed to be like 10 books and it just spun out of control. With 50 books it is like he speedran hating Daddy E

[@ramblingratling5212]

I liked the way McNeil wrote Horus' visions in the Delphos turning from a serene image of old Terra to nightmarish warp shenanigans in brief flashes.

[@mountaindrew4311]

My favorite Torgaddon moment is by far back in Horus Rising on planet murder where he absolutely puts Eidolon in his place.

[@gokbay3057]

24:28 The name Kharn is Arabic (for Betrayer lmao. He is Betrayer the Betrayer).

[@slackeratlarge575]

Flight of the Eisenstein. Paul Revere’s ride in space. Chaos is coming, Chaos is coming

[@Gigasius]

Horus's fall was so fast mostly because this was suppose to be just a trilogy. It just didn't stay as one.

[@jasonburke1671]

6:40 honestly i felt the 4 first books as a whole were rushed. Istvaan 3 and 5 whould have been trilogies in their own right, and the events of the Book Fulgrim needed 3 books as well to give us time with non corrupted fulgrim, and for time with Ferrus before his extreme weight loss program

[@petrasbirthdaygoblinhoney4565]

Horus fall being really rushed is a common complaint tbh At the time they didn’t really know the horus heresy series would be as gargantuan as it ended up being so they kinda just started out with his fall and turn really early. I think if they could go back and do it again they’d build it up a little more

[@andarchy1386]

I was on the toilet when Horus slew the emporer

[@timconner7693]

Been a long ass time since I read the book but from what I remember (in either the 1st or 2nd book) what Horus's main thing was his ambition. So there was a good portion of himself that he was suppressing that actually WANTED to fall. Which was why he fell so swiftly and easily.

[@ronantheronin3521]

Ignace Karkasy was easily the coolest character and his dynamic with the astartes and Loken was really well written and explored. He wasn't a great person on the morality scale, but then again most philosophers aren't/weren't. He wanted truth and he payed the consequences of fighting for truth.

[@grimmnekrokvlt]

Totally disagree with bricky thinking his fall was too rushed. Horus and other already had doubts and believed the emperor is lying keeping something from them. So when he is hit with the visions it's not too far of a stretch for Horus to fall when he has his doubts and half beliefs validated.

[@Cracktopus.]

I think Horus in general is a pretty poorly fleshed out character in the series, ironically enough. I agree with Bricky and his fall does come across as pretty contrived "guess I'm evil now". Him and Ferrus Manus both aren't particularly interesting characters, though Sanguinius escapes this despite having the same fate as those two.

[@grimmnekrokvlt]

@@Cracktopus. It s a lot more than "im just evil now" I can see why you would think the way you do if you see it as "well i'm just evil" He thinks the emperor is evil and that he is the righteous hand.

[@neruan5109]

Horus is upset that "normal" administrators are taking over from the Legions he thinks hes not worthy of the Title of Warmaster and is cinfirmed in it with his dealings with the Interex he is annoyed that the Emperor is not telling him important stuff and only after all that Erebus playes on his Vanity in shoing him hes going to be "forgotten" and Magnus delivering the Coup de Grace by trying to help and thus showing the Emperor is fully capable of amking mistakes cuz Magnus is here openly defying his Edicts id say its a very good way of showing his fall

[@TheDeceptiveMoss]

It's not that he got suddenly convinced to turn on the Emperor. From the second he woke up he never had a truly independent thought again until the very end.

[@Jon-yn4pq]

The best part about these characters that are introduced in the first three books get really fleshed out and have some interesting character development as you go into the siege of terra series.

[@slackeratlarge575]

The first 5 books of the heresy are something special

[@gravedanc3r317]

I really liked this book. It never stopped cooking after Davin. The first real taste of Chaos, the atrocity at the landing bay, the investigation into the dagger, the tension within the Mournival. I agree that I thought Horus’ turning was abrupt, but I don’t really think it mattered what “choice” he made with Erebus and Magnus. The reality is, he died, and his soul was in the Warp for days(weeks/months?). Horus was corrupted no matter what..

[@AAblade7]

I used to think the same as Bricky when it came to horus’s fall, but after reading it a second time I picked up on some of the nuance I missed the first time. I’m telling you reread Horus rising and the portions before he get’s stabbed in False Gods. The fever dream makes a lot more sense after that.

[@goldenweegee007]

I agree that Horus's fall was quick, but my biggest complain with this is that Garviel was SO CLOSE to figuring out Erebus's scheme, like, when Erebus slipped and told the name of the Interex weapon that was stolen when no one else knew what was stolen, let alone the name of it, he then realizes that Erebus wasn't on the planet when negotiations died with the Interex nor is anyone vouching for him on the Vengeful Spirit, he's also very suspicios about Erebus since he is spending a lot of time with Horus and NOW Horus is acting wierd (he was spending less time with the Mournival and more time with Erebus, which is a weird thing if you have read Horus Rising). Instead of going with all this info to his Mournival brothers (at this point they were still friends) so they could've used this to oust Erebs and stop everything that's about to happen, he goes "must have been the wind" and completely ignores all this coincidences to then continue with his day like nothing happened, that was the part that really got on my nerves.

[@HappyDuude]

100% agree with the take. When I first read had to go back and see if i missed something - almost like he was never really loyal and was just waiting for am excuse to turn. But no, it was just really really fast

[@freeravenfox]

So, since they know what happened to Abadan, does that mean he’s been de-spoilered?

[@lincolnsnow6166]

Bricky I GOTTA Recommend The High Kahl's Oath, I am incredibly biased but I think it is a great intro book to the faction's lore. It's no Infinite & The Divine but it leaves me so excited for the future of the faction. I may be huffing copium because lack of LOV lore

[@mat5977]

I absolutely love that trilogy, and Graham mcNeil also wrote "A thousand sons" which is also a banger if you're curious about the fall of Magnus ... and Prospero 😓

[@sorrywealreadygo]

Great episode 👏. But as a guard fan, I would recommend the other guant's ghosts books, at the moment I'm reading norcoplis.

[@thegreatpumpkin4564]

I've since changed my mind on False Gods. I didn't like the cinematic first half, but the second half won me over. I actually liked the rememberencers, there's so much Space Marine and while the 30k version have more depth, I really needed a break from all the demigods.

[@entrippyZ]

This just gave me the horrid realization that i barely remember that book, and that i should probably re-listen to my old library...but as much as i love 40k, thats A LOT of re listens, like too many to even do considering all the stuff i still haven't heard.

[@TheHappiestMeal]

Bricky's take on this book neatly mirrors my own. The book was great, except for Horus just suddenly having the quickest reversal of personality. It's so abrupt.

[@williansnobre]

That one scene with Kharn was really cool and I'm pretty sure his accent is because a lot of the Terran World Eaters came from Russia.

[@OmegaLittleBob]

I believe the reason Horus' fall feels so rushed is because initially the series was going to be MUCH shorter. But then those first couple books were SO POPULAR it became the inane 50+ book series it is now.

[@erbgorre]

"and now, brothers, we are going to istvan." is kinda like the traitor astartes version of "we're on to cincinnati."

[@Backalleywizard]

Another good book club. Another time of me asking for the Arhiman books

[@Gent742]

I got a drinking game for the next book club. Everytime the book says "rampart" just sip a drink and see if you can survive

[@Koalafications.]

Horus going down to the moon of davin can be summarized as "dude this guys said you a little bitch" and Horus got up and went "oh hell nah"

[@bbailey1027]

The Warrior Lodge =/= The Mournival. The lodge expands to add Magard/become a proto-cult from within the legion. The Mournival is just Horus' inner circle of the four bois

[@kaleb2643]

Kharn is from somewhere between Germany and Russia, and with his whole "never back down" deal, some people say he's Polish

[@gabrielfestini]

The worst part of the book for me is the very last page when Horus mentions that he'll betray Sanguinius. In Horus Rising they are described as the closest brothers, second to maybe Fulgrim. Yet in False Gods, betraying Sanguinius is a 1 sentence deal on the very last page of the book. Horus should have felt worse about that.

[@Akimbo411]

"You're right, Shy. I'm sorry. Please don't hurt me." Is probably the smartest thing DK has ever said.

[@art-o-cart5166]

Idea. Gotrek and felix. Its pretty good. Try it. Trollslayer

[@parkerbonneau1762]

Good book club, see y'all in three months for the next one!

[@ZeOldGamer]

I don't think the change is that fast. You need to consider that lots of time has passed. He was doubtful and resentful towards the Emperor at the end of Horus Rising. To reflect that, in book 2, he had already change his legion name to Sons of Horus, then he already takes, Maybe subconsciously, the role of the Emperor. Also, all those months where he grew closer to Herebus, seeking his counsel more and more, setting aside the mournival. You can see he was already close to change. All he needed was that last little push, wich was the ritual. Well that's my opinion on that matter

[@rump438]

"torgaddons days are numbered" oh sweet child.

[@rump438]

"if anything happens to him ill burn this whole place down" Oh bricky.....bricky my boy he has many things happen to him you'll love.

[@jacobstrain1666]

Please do the entire Horus heresy. No one besides arbiter Ian is talking about them and I’m catching up to where they at in the series

[@dagleason99]

Love flight of the eisenstein. Will totally listen to it again if the book club gets to it.

[@PobortzaPl]

Euphrati is the one touched by Emperor, Mercadi is the one with a crush on Gavriel, Karkasy is a douchebag who is suddenly right about something. Mercadi was more present in previous book, she was the person asking Gavriel questions that let him tell us his story. And Sinderman was more present previously, as cool old guy wise mentor to jock Gavriel.

[@tambordford3939]

Tbh I don’t feel like Horus’s turn was rushed as I feel like everything we was shown and everything he was told minus emperor wanting to become a god is true. And tbh we still don’t really know what the emperors end goal is

[@sanguinius_yt]

Horus Heresy is by far the best introduction into this universe.

[@jeffk3801]

I believe Horus fell so early and quickly because they weren't planning on having a 60 book series. I'm sure the original plan was MAYBE ten.

[@averywyatt-luth1642]

I can’t wait for when they run out of ideas so I can get weekly book reports :3

[@EXM0RT1S]

>Bricky still doesn't know about Loken

[@obisvanainobis9950]

galaxy in flames was a favorite of mine, since it was literraly the third warhammer book I ever read

[@machinegunblues7]

"Both of these writers have written many books before..." Bricky sounds like he's trying to pad an essay he hasn't hit the word count on yet.

[@inquisitorgarza312]

Horus falls makes more sense if you read that he has a massive ego that rivals even the Emperor himself.

[@IlyaKokoev]

Kharn, Konrad - GW, are you projecting?

[@necrospoon]

If it seems rushed, it’s only because the original authors intended the horror heresy series to only be 6 to 9 episode episodes

[@SimonMester]

Bricky, listen to me: You need to cover Trench Crusade! It's fun, taking over all the people I know who used to love 40k, and there is very little covering of the lore in a good entertaining way atm.

[@battlefuta9953]

He said on stream that he will check it out later, when he have a bit more time

[@SimonMester]

@battlefuta9953 Huzzah!

[@emmawrites4533]

Rgarding Kharn's accent: he's actually a terran-borne, and hails from the area now known as eastern europe. The Russian accent is, a little off imo, but it's understandable.

[@Tucker0603]

*considering an 11hr audiobook long* *Laughs in 31 hr audiobook* Then again i live far from work and audiobooks are now the greatest portion of media i consume now.

[@Italian_Polar_Bear]

Bricky is drunk again. The mournival is just Abbadon, Little Horus, Loken, and Turgadon.

[@asasn8or]

The boys need to read Shroud of Night it's my new #1 40k book

[@LCliffhanger]

you should really go until the 5th book, the 5th book is where it actually wraps up the Istvaan bit. Book 1-5 is the way to go.

[@angelofsteel1717]

Day 11/Week 11 of asking the crew to read the Wraithbone Phoenix. Peak Warhammer crime novel with an ogryn and a ratling

[@j1gsaw]

I read that BL writers didn't anticipate a 60 book series so that was why the fall of Horus felt a bit rushed.

[@deankilpatrick4910]

They did my boi karkace dirty!!

[@frantisekkvapil2061]

Galaxy in flames is masterpiece IMHO freaking love that book. Looking forward to hearing about it here guys.

[@CinderblockFrog]

Wait till they learn about Chad Tarvits…

[@rustinnorton9946]

Mournival is literally only 4 guys. Only ever was 4 guys. Not a big group

[@tomashema4823]

the fall of horus was rushed because it was only gonna be three books originally. Fun fact ;)

[@BrutalisDKGaming]

Please do fulgrim before you jump of the horus heresy, u need to read it in order to see and understand the perspective and reasoning of the emperor's children and fulgrim...

[@LJSLarssonX1]

Dan Abnett isn't my cup of tea, so I liked this book a little more than the last. But I'm looking forward to when we return to books not part of the Heresy. 🙂 Wish list for future books: * Deathworlder, by Victoria Harward * Dead men walking, by Steve Lyons * Fire Caste, by Peter Fehervari

[@birkegholm9864]

You should try Genefarther

[@ishmeilmathis2218]

Here to remind everyone of another common Word Bearer W...

[@KILLSMASH]

God I hope you guys read Battle of The Abyss or as I love to call it, The Word Bearers commit war crimes.

[@davroshalfbeard8368]

Really enjoying Graham mcneill books in heresy wait till you read fulgrim some great little Scottish lines in his books .

[@Jon-yn4pq]

Why do they keep saying that Loken and Karkasay are gone?

[@micaeleteixeira5319]

Day 111 of asking the gang to do a Malice and sons of Malice episode 🫡🫡🫡

[@fuyuelultimodragon268]

Hi from Spain!!

[@mr..pleasant9298]

I loved Horus Rising, one of the best 40K books I’ve read. Alternatively… I hate this book so much, the fall of Horus is one of the dumbest things I’ve read. “I know you’re trying to trick me! Tell me more!”

[@richroll9894]

Shy how could you allow Bricky to mislead DK about the number in the Mournival

[@andrejjelcic3675]

Does Bricky really not know who Euphrati Keeler and Kyril Sindermann are? ... Maybe he shouldn't read the rest of HH books.