Fanatec Podium DD EP3: Does it flex? 100% FFB challenge

Fanatec Podium DD flex test. 20 NM 100% FFB challenge flex test, can u handle the TRUTH!
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Game PC:
i9900k
RTX 2080 MSI ventus OC
MSI MEG z390 ace MOBO
16 GB g Skill ram @4433 mhZ @ 16 CL
Media PC:
i8700
GTX 1070
16gb 2666 mhz ram
VR:
oculus rift
Input devices:
Fanatec DD1 wheel base
Fanatec Formula Carbon rim
Fanatec P1 rim
Fanatec V3i pedals
Fanatec V1.5 shifter
Fanatec V1.5 handbrake
4 Play Racing Heavy Duty Rig

[@Spinelli__]

I have a Fana flat 1 and classic rim, both with the uni hub, and a BMW GT2 rim hooked up to basically a replica of the Fanatec base-side quick release from simracing bay. Been using it for around 3 years on a Simucube 1 large Mige and never noticed any flex. What I did notice though with my old Fanatec CSW v2.0 was that using the quick release bolt definitely made the FFB a touch tighter. I recommend using it if you have the option. P.S. The group C drivers were beasts as you pointed out but it's not as simple as raising a DD FFB wheel to 20 Nm and beyond. Nm for Nm, DD FFB wheels are generally much more difficult and harsher than real-life. Most racecar drivers who have tried sims with Nm levels apparently set to the same levels as real life say the FFB is way too strong and harsh and therefore unrealistic. Videogame FFB operates totally differently than real life FFB right down to the fundamentals. 1. real-life FFB is a reactive/passive system whereas game FFB is active, 2. real-life FFB is torque-based whereas game FFB is speed/position based, 3. game FFB is still based on Microsoft's direct input which is very old Microsoft tech from the 1990s. The insane power, speed, precision, acceleration, etc. of DD motors highlights the flawed FFB system all videogames and their hardware use. This is why filters (damping, friction, inertia, and others like Granity's torque reconstruction, non-linear force saturation, torque slew-rate limit, etc.) and motor-tuning (motor settings in the firmware that we'll never see) are so important - to help "hide" or limit some of the fundamental shortcomings of modern FFB tech.

[@2Old4Forza]

agreed! I have a vintage race car and the DD definitely needs some damping to feel even close to reality.

[@Spinelli__]

@@2Old4Forza No way? What kind?

[@2Old4Forza]

@@Spinelli__ 1965 Mustang Fastback. its very much like a GT350 R model. manual steering and brakes, leaf springs, 4 speed H pattern 2900 lbs 350 hp. good times!

[@Spinelli__]

@@2Old4Forza That's awesome!

[@bmwM3M5M6]

That’s some informative educated info you wrote here 🏁💯

[@Panurg81]

The issue is that inner and outer diameter of shaft and QR mismatch. The fact that the rim is "tight" simply stems from the rubber, which is tight but acts as a pivot. You see the play when you attach the rim, without moving it onto the rubber. Have the same issue with both formula carbon and BMW GT2.

[@2Old4Forza]

mine seems very tight even before it hits the rubber. but i agree the tolerances variance is probably too much to pass the QA process I think this could be fixed with a conical piece of delrin ect rather than the rubber bit.

[@sethfrancissimracing7558]

There is absolutely a securing pin with threads that should be installed in the QR. If installed there is near zero flex. It is a funky screw/pin with threads and a tapered shoulder that fits into the countersink on the QR. They include it with the DD1/2 bases and with the rims that use the Clubsport QR. It is not the travel pin, it is the one with threads at end. Also, the reason you have trouble pulling the rim off is because the rubber grips the inside of the QR. It gets expanded and bunched up when you tighten the collar, then when you release the collar the rubber stays pinched against the rim side of the QR. If you wiggle the rim a little bit (with the same lateral forces you used when testing flex) the rubber will relax/release and the rim will slide off more easily.

[@2Old4Forza]

It's not much of a quick release if I need an Alan wrench to get the wheel of and on. Luckily the 3d printed solution is in the mail. In the fanatec manual it says nothing about using that "securing pin" but I agree that is clearly what it is.

[@sethfrancissimracing7558]

@@2Old4Forza That 3D printed piece seems to be a viable solution. I would still use the screw even with that piece though, even though it takes the "quick" out of the process haha. The main reason I use the screw isn't because of lateral flex, it's because I am always peronoid about breaking a pin should some rotational play start to develop. I don't have any rotational play without the pin but I use it just to be extra safe. Since I have both the DD2 and a Simucube that works plug and play with Fanatec rims and utilizes the stock fanatec connectors inside the QR it makes sense for me to stick with the Fanatec QR system.

[@baj993]

It looks like you are having a little trouble removing the rim. After you undo the locking nut wiggle the rim a little bit so the rubber has a chance to relax before you pull the rim off 👍

[@2Old4Forza]

Thanks I will give that a try. "Its stressful" lol

[@akupsys]

My technique is not to wiggle. But when I unscrew the nut, I pull gently the wheel, not fast but steady. With the mid force. I keep the pulling force, but do not try to yank the wheel. Just keep this steady force for few seconds till the wheel starts to come off. After it moves 1-2 mm. I relax the pull completely and pull again. This time with much less force and slowly. The wheel comes off gently. The secret is not to yank, but rather apply the steady force. If you yank, the rubber grips and “locks” the wheel.

[@pharohbender]

had flex on v1 it can break pins but if you use the screw it will stop it, happened on my bmw wheel from then on i still use the screw till this day no issues, still using v1 all wheels ok. recommend using the screw provided... your mission if you choose to accept it, is to pretend to be a wheel mechanic when needed. its just a screw people use it! 50c screw may save your $350.00 wheel

[@2Old4Forza]

That makes sense. Hopefully going to get the 3d printed fix on there soon. Bending a pin would suck

[@pharohbender]

@@2Old4Forza it did suck, but not for long, i had to take the wheel apart and use 1 dummy pin and solder it to the faulty one... it wasn't too hard for me, i have the tools the knowledge i was prepared to risk it. still good after my fix. so always use the screw.

[@essa28_fsr]

Not having one myself I can only guess at this, but the flex doesn't look like it is anything to do with the machining of the quick release. It looks to me like its pivoting on the ball locking system and due to the position of the rubber it allows movement.

[@2ndLastJedi]

0:58 Barry was using the same rim as you when testing for flex mate ;) Yours looks to be flexing about the same amount ! I dont really see it being much of an issue as the FFB doesn't apply force in that direction anyway :)

[@reviewforthetube6485]

You got a really good one doesn't seem to have any play which is nice the most impressive thing here imo is how little it was clipping like wtf? Lol

[@2Old4Forza]

i did the Z ring mod (after this video) and it was a big improvement for sure.

[@2ndLastJedi]

5:16 My Formula V2 came the the travel pin (plastic) and the locking screw! It doesnt say you need to use it but there is a hole in both the QR and the base so why not use it ? I do ;)

[@2Old4Forza]

interesting, would you be able to measure the length of the threads on the locking screw for me?

[@Weed4Gamers]

@@2Old4Forza The screw should be included with the podium base, at least in my case.

[@2Old4Forza]

@@Weed4Gamers was it a storage pin (the chrome finish one that is not threaded all the way, or a standard M6?

[@Weed4Gamers]

@@2Old4Forza the chromed one, i have very very few flex , probably nothing compared to barry without it, but when attached with the chrome finish one then 0 flex. i think the QR on barrys rim is probably bad. My wheel is new maybe thats why it doesnt flex.

[@valdipietro]

Why do you look so high? Are your monitors 6ft off the ground?

[@2Old4Forza]

i race almost exclusively in VR except when making videos. TV is for the shop not the rig!

[@arjankremer8229]

It is because of the rubber.... that makes the little flex possible. But maybe the only possible solution for fanatec.

[@arjankremer8229]

There seems to be a 3d printing solution, see sim racing garage on this

[@2Old4Forza]

Yup gonna go try and get it printed today

[@mrlost117]

@@2Old4Forza Was there any update to that?

[@mrlost117]

Also, I'm your 666th sub... feels relevant

[@2Old4Forza]

@@mrlost117 the 3d printed solution is in the mail hope to try it this week.

[@TheBlazingRiver]

2Old4Forza hey, any updates on this?

[@rrschmid]

I think ur desk shakes more... thanks for doing this test, I'm happy with my DD2

[@2Old4Forza]

if by desk you mean heavy duty 8020 rig then yes, even with the castors taken off and it mounted on feet it moves more than the QR flexes.

[@geddstock]

Has anyone tried taking the rubber off altogether and just using the 6mm bolt?

[@2ndLastJedi]

1:25 its not the machine tolerance creating that hold , its the rubber gasket!

[@seattletyler]

5:08 Thomas Jackermeier from fanatec confirmed that you can remove flex by inserting the screw. He's in Barry's comments on the video, describing such edit: he also stated that they're working on a new QR solution

[@hotworm22]

Need to snug the ring up first then lock a wheel on them tight nut!

[@2Old4Forza]

that's exactly how I do it in the video! stay tuned for the z ring 3d printed flex reducer video coming soon.

[@hotworm22]

Another guy has a video of the podium DD ps4 one and works fine. Wonder if it’s just the dd1 or a different wheel. Weird!

[@2Old4Forza]

@@hotworm22 the whole point of this video is "its fine" but it does flex a little when you apply lateral force that is not typical of driving

[@tHoM0r]

i think that's quite unacceptable for the money

[@2Old4Forza]

That's a fair opinion, good that there is strong competition in the direct drive wheel market in 2019 so we have choices

[@tHoM0r]

@@2Old4Forza i would like so see someone with the ps4 podium wheel set try this too. Maybe since that wheel was designed with the DD, it won't be as bad?

[@2Old4Forza]

@@tHoM0r i believe they all the formula rims use the same QR. Gamer Muscle has that set up....

[@seattletyler]

@@2Old4ForzaI have the podium PS4 & put an m6 screw in the slotted hole of the wheel release (notched out on bottom side). No more flex

[@robertosantoro9685]

I can't get any flex at all even pulling as much as I can my gt3 wheel mounted on the CSW 2.5. I think the flex is due to the rubber thing as someone else here has already said

[@OhItsThat]

The problem will get worse I think...with use. The flex you have is even less then mine buts it not acceptable for something that’s supposed to be a serious piece of kit. $1500 is what I payed for my DD2. I don’t care if they fix the flex at this point. I don’t wanna use this system at all anymore. I want what Barry suggested. An adapter to replace the whole thing with a QR of my choosing. I’ve stopped changing my wheel cause it’s so hard to get off. My QR nut comes loose and I have it cranked down. The noise the QR makes on my Mclaren wheel is ridiculous when I run over curbs or bumps. That just gets annoying.

[@BlindByChoice00]

so many fanboys here ..mine got no flex lolllllllll yeah right ,they are all made of cheap plastic and crappy china component ... normal that their stuff suck :)

[@ADAKAR83]

you wanna test it ? Use RF2, not ARCADO corsa for the love of god.

[@2Old4Forza]

what difference would that make in testing the flex on the quick release?

[@jacooosthuizen3593]

i cant get my Rf2 to feel as good as asetto corsa.

[@2Old4Forza]

@@jacooosthuizen3593 thats the thing about FFB and even tire models. they are subjective and everyone has different preferences. I for one, am glad we have so much competition and choices as consumers right now. Golden Age of sim racing.