How to Upgrade your Cold Case fans to Twin SPAL 14's for better cooling.

[@heatxfer3662]

Hey Monty, thank you. I watched both electric fan videos, and your real-world testing is spot on! Demonstrating the loss of air volume through the radiator for each fan really points out the differences in fan design. In one of your comments in the first video, you said that "static pressure is not a fan spec", well it's actually the most important fan spec. Free-air cfm numbers mean nothing if you don't know how a fan will perform within a range of pressure drops (air flow restrictions through the radiator). Fan performance curves show the relationship between cfm and static pressure and are used when designing every kind of system that requires powered airflow. Ideally, you want a fan that delivers the greatest cfm at high static pressure drops. The Cold Case fans were clearly not designed with high static losses in mind. The SPAL fans out perform the Cold Case fans because they are designed for a higher static pressure loss. Anyway, I love the videos because they show a real-world application, but remember, cfm does not determine fan efficiency: cfm at a given static pressure does. Thanks again!

[@FastMonty]

Thanks! Totally agree with you. I think I said the Pressure is not a spec because not all fans list it as a spec, so you can't do a side to side comparison on paper. Luckily it's a simple test to do in real life, eh? Anyway, thanks for taking the time to leave a comment. See ya!

[@g3garage]

Very detailed analysis and very helpful to those of us looking to upgrade our fans. Thanks for sharing Mike!

[@FastMonty]

Welcome! Thanks for the comment!

[@hogueraleksander5868]

Im pretty sure you DONT need a brushless motor to ramp up fan speed. You use a pwm fan controller with a solid state relay and win

[@FastMonty]

Not sure I follow... a fan controller is used when you have a brushless motor. My understanding is brushless motors are better and can operate at higher RPM, hence the popularity, and cost. The point of this video is the SPAL fans are are huge improvement over what came with the Cold Case kit. Thanks!

[@bobeaseshop9389]

Howdy! It's been awhile. I could not resist watching this as I have come to learn over the years SPAL is the only way to go. I have used other brands and they are nothing next to SPAL. I fitted one on my 1964 Bonneville and on the 1957 GMC and it makes all the difference. Nice work and you did get mighty lucky! The more you try, practice & persevere the luckier you get. Nice Work Sir.

[@FastMonty]

Ha! Thanks Bob! Better lucky, than good. Ha, ha... thanks for the comment!

[@bobeaseshop9389]

@@FastMonty You made me think of "It's not what you know... It's who you know!". Sadly today I have a 1997 Lexus LS400 coming in... Yuck! No Pontiac or Jag stuff for me today.

[@FastMonty]

@@bobeaseshop9389 Ha! For sure... have fun with that Lexus.

[@davidwhitman9609]

Thanks for this. I haven’t been happy with my cold case cooling except when cruising at speed. I’ll order two of these fans.

[@FastMonty]

Right on David! Keep us posted on the improvement. Thanks for the comment!

[@davidwhitman9609]

Update, finally got some hot weather. The fans work great! Huge difference. Took away the stress I used to have when driving it in the summer. I can now beat on it as much as I like and it stays happy below 180F. Thanks for the video!

[@LoggerheadsBBQ]

Thanks for the hard work. I have cold case fans also and upgraded from 12 inch to 14 inch thinking it would cool better. Boy was I wrong there fans are trash. I’ve ordered the spal fans and will be installing soon. Thanks again.

[@FastMonty]

Ha! Yeah, they're terrible. You're gonna love those Spals!

[@carlosjimenez-ss2ck]

i have a vw bug with a rotary engine that was overheating a bit at hwy speeds! saw this video got a 1850 cpm spal of ebay and works like a champ👌

[@FastMonty]

Veee Dubb in the house! Love it! Thanks for sharing that story!

[@djsutice0]

Did almost the same 2 years ago, had 2x 12" no name fans that came bundled with a champion 2-row radiator, made my own shroud that fit snugly with enough standoff from the core to not create a dead spot for the fans. The new 12" spal fans had more fanblade area, then the other no-name fans so i had to butcher the openings in my shroud :D . But bench testing the two different fans where no contest. the noname fan blew some dirty in my face , the spal fan flew in the wall when i connected the leads to a battery lol. in the car the inrush current of the spal fan had me change fuse from 15 amp to 30 amp. and fan nr.2 has never turned on, yet.

[@FastMonty]

Nice! Love the story... where there's a will, there's a way, right? Thanks for sharing!

[@stevelangworthy9553]

Great stuff as usual. I'm also shopping for a radiator/fan solution. Unfortunately when I contacted Cold Case they advised that they could not sell the shroud without the fans. It's too bad they don't have more fan options.

[@FastMonty]

Thanks Steve... yeah, my apologies, I thought for sure you could order the shroud on it's own. Apparently not. You could order their fans, then ebay them. I think they go for around $70 each. Have fun!

[@SidewaysTA]

Wow, that's a big difference Mike. I have been contemplating doing a Spal swap to my Cold Case setup for a couple years now. You video's on this just confirmed that for me.

[@FastMonty]

Awesome! Yeah man, you can hear the difference from the last video to this one. Worth it!

[@JMAGG]

Nice! I'm Going to be upgrading to Delta pag fans next month.

[@FastMonty]

Awesome, might want to bench test those before install. :) Have fun!

[@sgvrodmuscle3679]

Awesome videos! Where did you get your valve covers? And what did you use to cover the firewall a/c area looks clean (behind the engine)

[@FastMonty]

Thanks. Valve covers are from TinIndianperformance.com and the smoothie plate is ;abcperformance.net/product/firewall-smoothie-panel-abc-0072/ Have fun!

[@AeroSS87]

Lucky you. I had to plug the existing nuts and screw through the fan holes directly on my g-body. Still, turned out great

[@FastMonty]

Yeah, I never get lucky. :) Great to hear you made it work! Thanks for the comment.

[@rlamas67]

Great video! I have the cold case radiator with their fan shroud as well.. its installed on my 87 Grand National with a front mount intercooler.. apparently causes a big over heating issue during the summer with the intercooler in the way.. i want to install the spal fans and see how it performs.

[@FastMonty]

Thanks Brother... yeah, when you get a chance, check out the prior video about how to measure CFM. That should give you a good starting point with your fans. It's here for quick reference; kzbin.info/www/bejne/porOpoGGZrehpa8 Good luck, and keep us posted as to what fan you ended up switching to.

[@nachomax1639]

I'm running a Mercedes-Benz S430 fan (650 watt) with an aftermarket PWM controller in my Firebird.

[@FastMonty]

Nice! Perfect example of a Brushless Motor. Thanks for the comment!

[@FastMonty]

Subscribe for more, click here; kzbin.info Get your FMG hat, three color combos to choose from, check em out here; www.etsy.com/shop/fastmontysgarage, LIKE MY SHIRTS? Save the Stick, Racer Things, Save the Manuals, etc... Go here; swee.ps/ceTsro_YesDohby

[@brianmartin1133]

Sounds like a good upgrade for me glad you did not have to modify the shroud will make it easy

[@FastMonty]

Yeah Brian, Even I get lucky every now and then. It's working great! Thanks for the comment.

[@pontiacontap]

This is really great information. I have a Black Magic 180 behind the cold case on my bird and while I don't overheat, it certainly still runs hotter than I'd like and it never pulls the temp down to the point where the fan turns off. The F-body radiators are not quite as large, but I may look into getting the cold case shroud and picking up the smaller SPAL fans that fit. Appreciate the video!

[@FastMonty]

Glad I could provide some insight... yeah, I wouldn't want my fans running too long either. FYI, after this video, and the 200 mile Quarantine Cruise I did... the fans were turning on and off like a new car. It was awesome!

[@MichaelChamberlain-t1w]

Can you tell me the overall size of your radiator. Apparently the 68 Camaro radiator even for a big block is smaller. Someone is recommending I put in a G body radiator. What do you recommend?

[@FastMonty]

Sure... The "Core" or finned area is 29" x 18.5" Hope that helps!

[@rodneyberube1699]

She blinded me with science!

[@FastMonty]

Ha! Good one. Thanks!

[@omnivacationrentals7572]

I just called a few days ago to ask about the shroud only. They said they did not have the shroud by itself. Anyone had any success getting the part number?

[@FastMonty]

Sorry Brother... no luck on a shroud only. I've been telling people to suck it up and order the shround and fan kit... ditch the fans, and get the Spal fans. Maybe ebay the old fans... don't feel bad, I stlll have mine. Maybe I should design something with them? Not car related... lol. Thanks for the comment, and good luck!

[@richwilson7017]

Caulk em up Monty. Nice JOb.

[@FastMonty]

Ha! Thanks!

[@mikelangieri6602]

Great video Mike... as was the one you did before this with the Cold Case fans. If you are considering doing a Spal Brushless comparison, you might want to look at Vintage Air's "Monster" fan/shroud package. I'm about to try and adapt this to my '69 Camaro with its Cold Case radiator and 461 big block. The Monster is a single 19" high velocity brushless fan made by Spal with a special VA-designed integral ABS shroud. Supposedly it will pull over 4000 CFM but I'll leave the testing to you and your anemometer. Cold Case's radiator is very well made, and the shroud looks nice, but everyone I know who has tried their dual fan setup has complained that the fans are very overrated and they wind up overheating in traffic because they just can't cut it. I am currently running a custom aluminum shroud with dual 12" Ford/Bosch fans out of a 2000 Ford Contour SVT. If you want to try some backyard fixes, take a look at the dual 12" Brushless Spal fans used in the Chevy Volt fans from 2011-2015 models, they are rated at 300 watts each, and pull around 25 amps at full power. GM apparently doesn't like to use a CFM spec, they prefer the Watt spec... don't know how to calculate that.

[@FastMonty]

Thanks Mike! I had no idea Vintage Air made a fan/shroud package. I'll definitely check it out... especially if it has a simple controller that goes with it. Thanks for the tip!

[@nursecuenca]

Awesome video. Can I keep my existing radiator and replace my single fan with dual fans from your video? I have 65 c10 truck. Thanks for all your information. I learn so much from you videos

[@FastMonty]

Thanks brother... the short answer? Yes. ha, ha... you know me, I make everything fit. I'm sure you could convert to dual fans, it'll just take a lot of work. Remember, measure once, cut four times. ha, ha... (Or order the full Radiator and Dual 14's from ColdCase, throw out their 14's and get these) Keep me posted.

[@nursecuenca]

@FastMonty could you recommend a fan sensor for edelbrock manifold? Would greatly appreciate 🙏. I have relay and wires already. Just need sensor. Thanks

[@FastMonty]

Go to Summit Racing and Search "Electric Fan Sending Unit" They come in different temp ranges... have fun!@@nursecuenca

[@NateG3678]

What’s your thoughts on the Ron Davis radiators? I found a 24” with dual 16” SPAL fans. 3350cfm combined. For my 66 mustang 289

[@FastMonty]

Ron Davis is LEGIT! Gonna cost more than Cold Case, but it's worth having a full system set up perfectly from a well known company, like Ron Davis. Good question!

[@NateG3678]

@@FastMonty Thank you for response. I’ve been trying to convince myself for a few weeks now of a direction to go with this. The research and data out there is mind blowing because there’s so much of it. Just trying to keep my old gal cool in this Georgia heat. Thanks brother

[@FastMonty]

@@NateG3678 No Worries! We've all been there... trying to make sense of "stuff" can get overwhelming. You're on the right path! Let me know how it goes!

[@streetk14]

Hopefully that Cold Case radiator works out for you. I got one for my ‘68 Bird, and it started leaking within a year. They’re definitely made “overseas” ; China I believe. I wasn’t too impressed with their quality.

[@FastMonty]

Thanks Brother, sorry to hear about the leak. What do you have now?

[@streetk14]

@@FastMonty Well, I ended up doing an LS7 swap on the car. So I got a DeWitts LS swap radiator to replace it. It’s amazing how much easier to cool this engine is vs my Pontiac 400. Two little Spal fans keep the engine cooler than a Mark VIII at full blast with the other engine. That said, Cold Case did replace my radiator for free. So I give them credit for that.

[@CameronDC-Grimes]

Just stumbled on your channel and love it. Im not completely sure on how to calculate CFM or the Area of the fan. In the other video you said to subtract hub size from fan blade size and then multiply that by Ft/m on Anemometer Can you easily explain the calculations to find area of a fan blade and how to calculate that with Ft/minute reading on anemometer Are there affordable Anemometers that do the CFM as a direct reading?

[@FastMonty]

Welcome to FMG... Great question. Not sure I can explain it any better than I did, in this video; kzbin.info/www/bejne/porOpoGGZrehpa8 Pay special attention to the section where I run through the formula. My Anemometer outputs CFM, part numbers are in the description of that video. Have fun!

[@craigannettewallace4653]

Looks like another FMG upgrade coming to my GTO I need to replace mine for clearance and still have the CFM that I need on the supercharged Pontiac 😁

[@FastMonty]

Yeah you do! Ha, ha... Thanks for the comment!

[@Evl_67]

What size fuses are you running? I have a dual 30amp not sure if it’ll be enough

[@FastMonty]

Great question... I had to go look, it's been too long since I installed the wire harness. Anyway, the wire harness was from Painless, but I believe was included with my original BeCool twin 11" Spals. That said, it looks like one 70 amp fuse running two 40Amp relays. Yeah, that confuses me too. That said, you're probably on the hairy edge and might be ok. I say that because when I turn these new fans on, it takes a couple seconds to get up to speed, versus the old Spal set up seemed instantaneous. Maybe the newer Spals have a lower start up amp draw. If that doesn't work, can you upgrade to 40 amp fuses? Let us know!

[@johnkennedy8452]

Great job on the acting and another great video

[@FastMonty]

Thanks John!

[@billhillstrom3511]

How do I wire my cold case fans to FiTech wiring. I have dual fans. They both supply a temp sensor. Does the wire from the FiTech marked fan 1 go to the wire on the relay that would of gone to the water temp sensor? I’m sure this question is confusing as I an confuse by the two different wiring diagrams

[@FastMonty]

Hey Brother, I know what you mean... the answer is yes, the fitech wire would connect to the wire that goes to the temp probe from the relay. You don't need the temp probe as the fitech unit has one already. Have fun!

[@billhillstrom3511]

@@FastMonty thanks Monty. Love your channel. I Already have a hat. How about a shirt?

[@FastMonty]

@@billhillstrom3511 Ha! Yeah, need to get some of those designed, don't I? Always glad to help!

[@michaeljohnson404]

Have you ever looked into blocking off the by pass port between the front of the intake and the back of the water pump housing?

[@FastMonty]

I don't recommend doing that, as that port is used by the water pump when the thermostat is closed. When the thermostat opens, the water pump then pulls most of its water from the radiator. Hope that makes sense.

[@dsrgarage]

So in the other video you said the paddle style fan actually pull air through the radiator better than the S blade style. What made you decide to go with the S blade?

[@FastMonty]

Good point.. I picked this SPAL based on specs, size, and name. The fan blade design wasn't critical for me. Thanks for the comment!

[@dsrgarage]

@@FastMonty thanks for the reply. I was just curious as I think I am going to try the paddle design myself. I am going to try the Mishimoto instead of spal but definitely appreciate the content. That’s the best comparison video I’ve seen for fans.

[@FastMonty]

@@dsrgarage Thanks Brother... yeah, if you can, let us know how the Mishimoto performs. I've heard good things about it, just never tested one. Have fun!

[@andrer3854]

Great Video Again! I wonder if a champion radiator shroud could be used since they use the Spal fans. I know auto trans radiators have an internal trans cooler, so sometimes those radiators are not as efficient because of the extra heat. Could you use one for a manual trans with a trans cooler to allow radiator to cool efficiently, but solely dedicated to engine cooling.

[@FastMonty]

Good question... I have no idea about what size SPAL fans Champion uses, anyway, yes to your idea. You could plumb a separate trans cooler and dedicate the radiator to the engine. Thanks for the comment!

[@Drekoushranada]

Good day! I called Cold Case today to see if they would sell me the radiator with just the shroud (no fans), and they told me "NO!" Is it another shroud you recommend that will fit?

[@FastMonty]

Sorry to hear that Donny... I noticed it a few months ago and suspected that might be the case moving forward. I will reach out to them to see if I can work some magic. Unfortunately, Plan B is to buy the shroud with their fans. If I figure out plan C, I'll let you know. Thanks for the heads up!

[@Drekoushranada]

Thank you for the reply. The worst-case scenario is finding if jegs or generic distributors will work. But if not, I might look into the Ford Windstar fans.

[@genehansen4244]

Do you use the variable speed controller or is it just on and off? Thank you. Great work as always. Love your channel.

[@FastMonty]

Good question. Just on off based on temp.

[@whataboutbobcarmichael1808]

What are the part numbers for the spal fans and the extender brackets for the cold case radiator, will order from summit.

[@FastMonty]

Should be in the description.

[@whataboutbobcarmichael1808]

Thank you for the fast reply, I didn’t see the drop down arrow for the description. Very very detailed video

[@jmartinez5200]

have you considered brushless fans

[@FastMonty]

Yes, but not until I find a decent system with easy to use controllers, etc... Thanks!

[@jeanettebenziger]

Thank you sir. Well done

[@FastMonty]

Welcome! Thanks Chris!

[@davidbisnette7673]

Ok for folks like myself who aren’t versed in higher math, although yours is impressive, does an electric fan move more air across a condenser and radiator than a 7 blade clutch fan with a good shroud. I haven’t seen any test for this. Is an electric fan or fans essential to keep a Pontiac cool in high humidity 90 to 100 degree heat ?

[@FastMonty]

Thanks David, love the loaded question. :) It depends. Ha, how's that? Kidding of course... I don't have a mechanical fan car to measure, but It's safe to say a proper electric fan set up will pull more air than a mechanical fan, at idle. Which is the overheating fear we all have, sitting in traffic, or at a stop light. That said, my engine is double the torque the factory motor was, so I'm creating more heat. A bone stock or mildly bored motor should be fine in any condition, with a mechanical fan. Does that help?

[@davidbisnette7673]

@@FastMonty Thank you it is helpful, and thanks for shaking down the fan brands, I’m beginning to believe most of the aftermarket parts that are touted to be the best have way more marketing budget than research and development, with that said Pontiacs or Pontiac powered Pontiacs it’s hard to determine the best most reliable bang for the buck parts. Thanks for the tests of the fan units , makes it much simpler to decide on what’s best. I would say thanks for the math lesson but I was never a fan of math when it involves letters and funny looking lines , but hey Thanks for trying ha

[@FastMonty]

@@davidbisnette7673 Yeah, I'd agree there's too much marketing of wrong information. That's why I have trust problems. Ha, ha... glad I could help, and don't worry about the math, that's why calculators were invented. :) Have fun!

[@mkmernebear4949]

Monty' Love the channel but I just spend $800 on the cold case .....I feel like I'm at work, halfway through the engineer changes the plan !

[@FastMonty]

Ha! I felt the same way... well, actually, I didn't trust the engineer, and changed it myself. Ha, ha... Upgrade to SPAL's you won't regret it.

[@genehansen4244]

Can you get just the shroud from Cold Case without the fans? Does not look like they list just the shroud :/

[@FastMonty]

Unfortunately, no... I thought you could just buy the shroud. But, in theory, you could be their fans and shroud, and ebay the fans. They're around $75 each, brand new.

[@morlandbroussard]

Monty get a Ron Davis radiator with the spal fans that he sets up. My motor dosent touch 190 in brutal Texas heat. By once cry once and never worry about heat again

[@FastMonty]

Good tip. So far this new set up is running great, but will monitor it for the next few months. If I need to go the Ron Davis route, I will. Thanks for the comment!

[@steverode7589]

To be accurate you should have corrected for the ambient temperature difference between all the tests which it looks like you recorded. That will obviously change the average delta T between liquid and air side. The twin spal fan 14's were at the lowest ambient 74 vs the cold case 78 which is about a 4% delta T difference while the spal 14s were significantly better, subtract 4% from your improvement for more representative assessment.

[@FastMonty]

Good point Steve... now you're digging up way too many of my Fluid Dynamics and Heat Transfer class memories, ha, ha... thanks for the comment!

[@steverode7589]

Engineers everywhere! 😂. Thanks for your work and video, very nice

[@FastMonty]

@@steverode7589 Ha! That should be the name of my channel. Thanks Steve!

[@johnburbich607]

Note: you can't buy the shroud only from Cold Case they only sell the shroud with the fan combination.

[@FastMonty]

Yeah, that's my fault... good news is you can ebay the coldcase fans for about $70 each. Sorry for the mix up, maybe enough of us calling in will get them to add that part number.

[@63grandsport11]

🏆

[@FastMonty]

Thanks!

[@genehansen4244]

Cold Case will not sell just the shroud lol, they say no other fan will fit their shroud correctly :) What a joke (cold case) :(

[@FastMonty]

I hear you... I warned them this would happen. I called them to, and suggested they create a part number for the shroud only. Oh well, I can't convince everyone. But, as you know the Spals will fit with some minor modification. Thanks for the comments!