Do Fuel Saving Gadgets Actually Work? - Fifth Gear

[@fazalroshansingh871]

That you very much, I almost purchase one of these devices but after looking at you test I am convinced they are all junk. We need more people like you to make awareness to these scammers. Thanks again.

[@mynameisphil401]

Want to save fuel? Minimize the use of your brakes and keep your speed steady. It's as simple as that.

[@chillilegend1199]

that's bollocks

[@TheBehm08]

I’m American and even I’m saying “that’s bollocks!”

[@epender]

And why is everyone saying it's bollocks?

[@SuperAlbino1]

And remove any unnecessary luggage/weight from the car

[@epender]

@@chillilegend1199 Accelerating - uses more fuel for more power Braking - slows car down, wasting energy you used to accelerate

[@dwaynegreen1786]

A lot of these statements were about three years ago. However, I just heard about this product. Evidently, there starting another push to try and con more unsuspecting consumers. This why I love watching informative shows like yours. Excellent video, thank you for sharing.

[@usingThaForce]

That's why I'm here they keep pushing it

[@cndbrn7975]

Lol that's why i'm here as well. I just seen the "fuel saver" supposedly invented by Magnus Kristoff. I was hoping it would be tested here, which it kind of was with the plug in cigarette lighter gadget.

[@s_for_short2400]

@@cndbrn7975 came for the exact same reason. seemed super sketchy.

[@cndbrn7975]

@@s_for_short2400 Like they say, if it sounds too good to be true, it usually is.

[@chrisbigheadarellanoigfbtk2380]

i just saw this advertised on youtube. why is google taking scammer money?

[@krlcuevas]

Sold my car. Most gas efficient move i have ever did.

[@horstmuller76]

👍😊

[@angiec4116]

What U Walk Now...

[@krlcuevas]

@@angiec4116 uber milady.

[@SD4philly]

Me Too

[@jacobmcbride9794]

Here's to your health & finances walking or riding a bike when possible!👍

[@wsc31]

The most efficient,, least costly and easy to use fuel saver is the driver and how s/he operates the vehicle.

[@rockday701]

Dan Troop you mean how a human drives their car? he/she is nolonger an acceptable term in 2017 lol

[@NegativeNumbers427]

What about Shim? Covers the lot.

[@giorgostzavaras5686]

Dan Troop I agree!!

[@mathaaushle]

what a stupid comment honestly.

[@karimalameddine5092]

What about throttle controllers?

[@stephenkelly119]

That was probably the best most straightforward honest video I've seen in a while Good job you didn't Hedge around you tested it and told us the results

[@soldierstudio3087]

I got dummy fuel saver. no improvement , ther garbage.

[@KevinSmith-os5yz]

Uh oh, he is using science to test theses magical devices, that'll never work,haha. Pretty sure if I use all these at once, my car actually makes fuel:)

[@quasimodo5405]

Want higher MPG in your car(s)? Use COMMON SENSE. Use Synthetic Oils in your Crankcase. Amsoil is the best and only choice. Keep your tires at 35 psi. Use your car's ECO button (if you have one) all the time. The ECO (Economy) button in newer cars gets you about 3-5 MPG highway mileage. Don't speed uphill, but coast downhill. Use your Cruise Control all the time on highways and in the city. Using these methods, I got 81 MPG on the Highway in my Honda Civic VX, and 48 MPG with my Civic EX. Every single one (5 of them) of the so-called "Gas Saving" Devices that I have ever used in the last 40 years of driving HAS NEVER WORKED. Save your money, and don't buy them.

[@topbone]

so true

[@ryvoltz]

The best fuel saving device I know (and it's the best by far) is a light right foot. I could get over 51mpg out of a bone stock 1.3-litre Honda Jazz (manual transmission) using that.

[@hollybug-76542]

Learned a long time ago to go easy on the pedal when accelerating, keep a steady speed and you'll save on gas. It works

[@juchetony1910]

I used to get 50mpg+ out of my 1.3 litre VW Polo in the 1980s. Not much has changed in the laws of physics, it would seem.

[@mac3490]

How? Can you share your methodology? In detail!!

[@charleschoo9398]

OMG, my stupid family member just bought freaking 4 Minicon, it work by plugging to your car socket and will save 30% of fuel economy. I say it was 🐂💩, 1 minicon cost 1 Million Indonesia Rupiah (65 USD). The name apply by itself, mini-CON.

[@AccountFromGoogle]

anjing mahal banget

[@cowboygeologist7772]

Great video; thanks for posting. I would have like to have seen another baseline, after the tests, to see it it was still 49.

[@jdm2563]

Thanks for doing this! and for making it quick and entertaining

[@Conditi0n_Zer0]

"in it's defence the makers claim you need to cover 2000 miles before seeing any benefit". um i'm pretty sure that's just to stop people returning this shit after they realize they've been had. not to mention any device that intercepts the fuel before it hits the engine would have immediate effect, you know, considering any fuel that goes in is gone forever.

[@aleksandarpetrovic6613]

No, that is because need a time to clean up carbon buildups. But not everyone device works, for example, I tested many magnets and many HHO generators, and most of them have no effect.

[@lewis72]

If the Viabtor thing was "just a green light", why did it worsen the fuel consumption by around 2mpg ? They should have tested the car again with no add-ons to be sure there wasn't a drift etc.

[@michaelward402]

i agree

[@bradf.3054]

Exactly

[@lewis72]

I think that a baseline run should have been performed between each test because it seems as though the baseline has dropped a bit; may be due to higher inlet temperatures once the engine/room is warned up.

[@cedriclynch]

​@@lewis72How precisely can the fuel flow rate be measured? How accurately and how consistently does the rolling road dynamometer represent air drag? I think the odd 2mpg (about 4%) is quite likely to be within measurement error. It would have been good to see two or three runs on each device, and a further run or two with no device.

[@officialgood-boy8946]

"That is just a green light"

[@go-ultra3052]

Yes but somehow a simple green light reduced the mpg....

[@isaiahsmith8379]

@@go-ultra3052 robs electrical signal, however small, and i feel they should have done an additional control test after they had tried them all.

[@Riva2025]

I was about to buy two of these on Ebay. The blue light in the cigarette lighter or the magnet. You saved me trouble and aggravation. I'm even surprised these gadgets were years old. Guess nothing beats just getting regular oil changes and keeping your car serviced, and using good gas.

[@sidneyeaston6927]

The best thing that I did to save fuel was to fit two electric de misters on the dash beats wasting fuel waiting for the engine to heat up. demisting with the heater is counter productive as it removes the heat from the engine that you are trying to warm up to its most efficient operating temperature. The two fans also come in useful for extra air flow in hot weather.

[@AndreaStevens2012]

I'm not familiar with a "de mister", is this related to locations with a cold climate where you might start your vehicle and let it run for a bit before driving?

[@kjamison5951]

Save yourself 6 minutes and 40 odd seconds… No. They are designed to get you to part with money.

[@user-jr1cs6ob3m]

Best fuel saving device out there, it's called a bicycle

[@jjewell8764]

My experience- I had a 1972 Ford Escort Mk 1 which failed the mot on emissions when testing first came out. I put a Broquet type unit on and took it back and they asked what i had done as the car now passed. I explained. They were amazed. I had this car for a few more years and it ran better and better even using the now only unleaded petrol. I dont have the car now but it is still on the road. When others were getting hardened valves fitted etc, i used this. Yes- it was developed during ww2 to run Rolls Royce engines on aeroplanes using inferior Russian fuel. It worked then and it works now. The unit has magnets and tin which is what works on the old engines to replace lead.. I also used one on a Reliant regal with the same effects. The old time Classic car guys now about these. The other products i cant speak for but they do seem dubious to say the least. New cars- well you cant improve on them much to be honest .

[@g.choppa4448]

The owners of the companies selling these gadgets should be arrested.

[@larrydixon4553]

Thank you. Your research is greatly appreciated.

[@charlescoon577]

How about low rolling resistance tires and light weight rims with a cold air intake that runs the engine air through a heat exchanger that cools the air using evaporating liquid nitrogen?

[@dementedweasel1]

Nitrogen corrodes the engine which saves fuel by sitting in a junkyard.

[@JoostShino]

They've already done a video on these.

[@minxlabrada]

More to the point, where did Johnny get that Evel Knieval shirt?

[@adediranbada7750]

Johhny probably got it from Amazon. 😀

[@Jay-vr9ir]

The oil companies , can still dances for joy , the oil companies can continue to party.

[@ngarci8040]

What I take away from this is that it appears the vehicle used in the testing gets worse mpg as it warmed up, then slightly balanced out at the end…..

[@bri961]

Idk about other device but i know a thing or two about that broquet device. It is not for fuel saving BUT it gives your car the ability to use lower octane rating fuel than the book recommend. It's useless in developed country cause there's a lot of fuel option around the country but not in developing country

[@aliceimhof1082]

Any chance you can do an updated check on the “Eco” fuel savers. There is EcoTune, Eco-dbo2?, EcoChip, EcoMode or other.

[@censusgary]

I didn’t expect any of these gizmos to improve fuel efficiency, but it surprises me that the mpg with the gadgets on was actually slightly worse than without them. It seems the mpg should be the same, since the add-ons aren’t doing anything. Maybe the differences are within the statistical margin of error?

[@sebfox2194]

The gizmos are either drawing a small amount of power, or slightly reducing fuel flow. So the car has to work slightly harder whilst they are connected. In most cases, these differences are very small, so the devices don't do much, but they do increase the energy required to run your car by a very small margin.

[@viciousocean]

Is amazing how many people fall for this crap!!!

[@marpot100]

One of the best ways to improve everyone's mpg is to use your indicators to keep traffic flowing

[@hollybug-76542]

Ain't that the damn truth

[@Tatbadat]

HI. Have you ever test the Greentech fuel saver from Moletech, a company from Taiwan?

[@SuperAlbino1]

I can get 75+mpg from my car (1.6 diesel) on a long journey just by driving smoothly (not necessarily slowly)

[@punker4Real]

the Viabtor sounds some sorta sex toy

[@isaks3243]

I have one fuel saving tip. Drive carefully and avoid high speeds, hard acceleration and breaking. This will save fuel

[@rubiconne]

Don't think those devices will do anything but..... how a green led connected to the carplug can decrease the mpg? It won't make any better but how does it make any worse?

[@rustynuggets]

at the very least it is more draw on the electrical system increasing engine load. this is a stretch by any means. but really the difference is simply a testing variance across all devices. the fact is they do nothing and all the results are different show this to be true. ambient temp, intake temp, humidity there are many variables that can introduce this acceptable fluctuation in output.

[@mashudahmed6405]

Jorge Rubio LEDs don't consume that much power it would hardly make a difference. If there was a led or not

[@dominickefrim3088]

I did a simple Google search after seeing one of these devices advertised on youtube. Ironically enough Google suggested this video on youtube. These devices are pretty much what i expected. A scam.

[@michaelmckinley9550]

Myth buster myths…. Conclusions drawn before results on the magnets. The test done on the fuel magnet was not done as directed by the manufacturer. When I first purchased a fuel magnet, the mpg went down slightly and then increased. My instructions mentioned 200-500 miles. That’s what happened in my case and has on 6 different vehicles. Guess you’ve got enough patience or willing to follow the instructions.

[@michaelcollins1899]

He posted video with thousands of dollars in equip to test, and the best case scenario drive test indoors on a roller, u have it on 6 vehicles. Let's see your video and the b4 and after proof. I'd definitely be interested in it. You will be hard pressed to cover the bases as much as this video has it covered. Every vid I've seen drives in real traffic which I've always thought was not a good test for science as it depends on accidents, ac on or off, hills, traffic stops, etc, and was happy to see someone finally got it right by driving inside a shop on a roller with ecu live data hooked to it, and then u come at him with u have 6 cars with this device...show the vid with this same setup and it would change the world😂 I love his first statement "why aren't world leaders aware of this"😂😂😂😂 smart man

[@ToyMarston]

How about those air flow stationary intake fan whirlpool devices or flex fuel modification kit ,if more spark needed just jump sparkplug with capacitor ?

[@m3ntalist]

what about the 'fuelsavepro'. I saw an ad for it on youtube. I imagine it doesn't work, but the advert was pretty good! haha. Surely you need to do something to the ecu to change things like fuel consumption though, but prob different per car / model and would affect performance

[@cleverkitsune4302]

The numbers kept dropping from baseline did you give the engine and tires time to cool?

[@hollybug-76542]

Already doing quite well at 47mpg.. I haven't ever owned a car that got that kind of gas mileage. Even my small compact Ford Fiesta only gets at best 32mpg on the highway.

[@SariennMusic73]

I assume your usa given the use of "gallons". I'm also usa. Which car do you own that gives that much mpg? I'd love to look into buying one. Tysm!

[@alexnyaga6775]

Great Test. Could you test Xtreme Fuel Treatment (XFT) of Syntek Global. Kindlygive us feedback on it. Thanks

[@jtuttah]

Where did you purchase these products from?

[@mikehunt8012]

“It is... just a green light. That’s all there is to it”

[@ZaZaMZZ]

Thanks for the tests and video. Well done!

[@theumer5058]

Don't rev hard.don't brake hard.

[@eurosonly]

Your car is already as fuel efficient as can be at the time of when it was developed with the latest technology. None of these gadgets will do anything to it and might, instead, ruin your mileage. They're nothing more than placebo. The best way to get the best mpg out of your car is to be smoother on braking and accelerating and instead of stopping at a red light, let off the gas way before you get to it and coast through when the light turns green just in time.

[@ek8710]

Not true, many cars were detuned to improve emissions or to keep performance below that of other cars on the manufacturers production line.

[@michaelward402]

Given the different fuel figures I would guess that there many contributing variables that may have something to do with the variance. Even so, a base line test after each gadget test, would have been a good thing. Good trial

[@Nighthawk539]

The first text you got 49. No one's setting in the car. All the other text still 2 people in the car. So yes you will got less gas MPH.

[@bigrobj1980]

On a rolling road it would have very little difference, if the devices worked as claimed, they would all have produced the base line still at least

[@cwclifford]

@@bigrobj1980 But, it's NOT on a rolling road but a very sensitive roller that is designed to detect changes in traction and friction coefficients.

[@tumiemat]

Hey!! Have you done one on B Eco???

[@babaabi3900]

I use broquet more than 10 years very happy my car save fuel and very smooth engine....cannot dyno 1 time and claim the product is useless but need to run for long time to get the benefit...

[@jjewell8764]

I agree as per my comment

[@aleksandarpetrovic6613]

Yes, they don't know how to test.

[@jaysagrayum7448]

Hope you'll have a testing with growing business "HHO". On conputerized engine. Thank you in advance. They claim to explain the additional combustion by popping the bubble from HHO generator but I can't see any scientific approach to prove they are worth

[@nathamner1525]

I am so pleased that Fifth Gear has devoted time and energy to this study of 5 new "fuel saving" devices, to debunk their myths, AND to save consumers from being robbed of capital that could go to: education, charity, churches, feeding programs for the poor.... if it is not wasted on "field research" by innocent consumers. I am convinced that there is no ulterior motive for the Fifth Gear to want fuel consumption to be higher, and money wasted THERE, so the odds are high that they are telling us the truth.

[@francoisroberge5882]

There's a sucker born every minute. Con artists love you.

[@samhouston1673]

While I didn't invent the wallet, I have found that is does save me a ton of fuel when it has no money in it.

[@umarbaske]

Just wanted to buy one of these but I decided to make findings and this is the result. Thank you.

[@haeylmasnavi]

i think the baseline score is wrong as the parameters in the car's pre programmed ECU is constantly remapped for best driving experience... u cant loose MPG by plugging anything to the cigarette lighter or any electrical device... looks misleading

[@zdrux]

The car was in a controlled environment where the "driving experience" conditions did not change.

[@cmuller1441]

zdrux except the car is heavier because of passager. Also maybe the atmospheric pressure, the air humidity and temperature has changed? I believe all those devices do nothing so why such bad score? The only explanation is something big changed between base test and other tests.

[@27Hedonist]

@@cmuller1441 The base test should have been run again at the end to verify the original figure.

[@christophermamian7168]

Great video! Informative, entertaining, concise. We’ll done!

[@RLBJR1666]

Put a hollow metal ball between carb and intake manifold, atomizes and vaporizes gas doubles gas mileage and cleans up emissions this is possibly how Poque did it please try this it works I know I made one for a 85 chevy truck one for 65 dodge truck one for a 74 honda cb360 .look under ( motorcycle hollow ball gasoline vaporizer)

[@paulgilraine3127]

Take all the junk out of your car lose weight out of the car ,make sure your tyres are filled up right ,drive slow and steady, don't rev hard too pick up speed , break less by keeping back from other cars and gear down when going down hills so you don't have to hit the breaks hard at the bottom and then rev hard to pull away again. services the car regularly that's the only ways I know to save a bit ot fuel or drive less by planning routes and get all your shopping in one hit or oder on line .

[@boduke2522]

what is the car model and yr

[@edwiangel1]

Hey I would like you to try fuel Maximizer from optec and performed this test

[@bichi110]

Thanks for sharing that. Really clear.

[@no-damn-alias]

In a real scientific test, they should have re-done the baseline test at the end, to proove their results, as the other devices may have worked worse, due to a higher intake temperature, as the whole system warms up pretty much after several runs, with only a fan cooling the system

[@thordehr]

MAGNETS! ELECTRICAL DOOHICKIES! (For those who don't understand magnetism. Or electricity) Now off to watch the video..... Edit: fuel saving device used on world war two planes....Do tell, which planes in particular..... Yea, thought not.

[@karimalameddine5092]

What about throttle controllers? Anybody have any experience?

[@user-wangyu]

my theory is control temperature of air intake and then you save 50%in the coldest winter in canada, summer save 25 in the warming up period when you drive only short distance

[@tribdrawsnear]

Should have ran a baseline at the end. Made sure still 49. Nice video though. Gadget man groove does work. My 99 Ford 4.6 4x4 gets 22 mpg highway 17 city. But it’s not cheap. Custom made from new part. U can google it

[@nhyirabajohn7867]

I wanna know that does the quantum energy fuel saver really works? Cus its supply is becoming enormous in my country.

[@ktm640lc4BGD]

Can you test HHO generator which is added to petrol or diesel engine. So generated hydrogen is used as an additive to existing fuel system, not as a replacement as they did in MythBusters and proved it wrong.

[@andrewpietrzykowski]

those work really great in tesla’s, you never have to fill up gas in it anymore

[@bentonrodeheaver2596]

Test with pure acetone in the tank. Don't use hardware quality and add about four ounces per tankful. I've had some success depending on brand of gas.

[@cliveyboy44]

My best fuel-saver was a Kia Niro Hybrid, nothing to charge, almost 1000 km for a tank, quiet refined motoring, what a difference from the old and lovely Skoda... 520 km per refuel (same cost)

[@ankitdoshi3915]

Hi could you try supertech euro fuel saver?

[@99ron30]

Keep your tyres at the correct pressure, don't carry extra weight such as parcel shelf, drive steady in correct gear, have oil at correct level and clean air filter, don't use radio and heater if you don't need it, keep windows closed.

[@chupacabra4897]

I want that shirt where did you get it ???

[@David167projects]

I have just built a fuel saving device that works. I put a bar out the front of my car with a hook that grabs onto the back of semi trailers. I just put it on youtube. It is titled Semi trailer fuel saving invention

[@jerzh9366]

A fuel saving device: Bicycle...

[@descentmvm]

If u wanna save fuel judt buy a standalone ECU and get your car tuned. Re doing the fuel mapping I've seen a few customers come to our buddys shop just for this on a civic SI. They managed to make it hold another 50 kms to a full tank

[@davidanton6356]

This episode brought to you by shell, chevron, and bp oil 😈

[@scottb3637]

Did the fuel ratio change, richer or leaner, with any of these devices? Granted that any changes made to the fuel or electrical system would take some driving time for the ecm to adjust so I would think that your very short term test would be flawed. Not saying that any of the devices are going to help, but the ultimate goal is to get the correct air fuel ratio, to lean and you may get mileage improvements but at the cost of burning up your engine. To rich and the mileage will go down and because of the excess fuel injected into the cylinder, you will foul plugs and even end up with fuel passing by the rings and into the crankcase. Again not good.

[@tjmyers7851]

Thank you very much!!! Great job and very helpful.

[@robertdoan499]

Where did you get the evil knevil shirt?

[@sealand000]

I installed all of them in my car, and saved 85% on fuel!

[@ezeobigerald331]

Lolzzzzz

[@russellbaston974]

I installed all of them, put 2 gallons of fuel in, a week later the tank was full.

[@ChrisTheGregory]

You know you're getting the straight scoop when your engineer is named Gareth.

[@clogen]

Can you test the odb gadget as well pls. Thanks

[@bonifacethattil9567]

It's OBD. On board diagnostics

[@seprishere]

How come the baseline was 49 and most of the others were about 47?

[@DodgeCity111]

Funny that they have an Indian expert examining the gadgets.

[@PJFelice]

Hi great video! Have you covered hydrogen fuel cell kits? The ones that produce hydrogen on demand rather than being stored in a cylinder?

[@aleksandarpetrovic6613]

Those tests have no sense, because they don't know how to test, and they must test all brands from the market, to see real results.

[@thomaspc0]

In consideration of the findings, running a baseline test (no gadgets) at the end of the day would have been a prudent test. What if your car actually dropped mileage throughout the day? Stranger things have happened. Otherwise, nice video.

[@cwclifford]

Exactly. I'm not a believer but could a return to the control setup result in matching the baseline AFTER the gadgets were removed?? Meaning, did the engine run less efficiently while the gadgets were in place or did the initial run benefit from external factors like a colder engine, cooler oil, change in ambient temperature, etc.?

[@Petrolheadd-u2u]

My Head Has Just Fell Off.

[@Larry-ct5mg]

Are these gadget makers telling us they are smarter then the collective wisdom, education and experience of tens of thousands of engineers working for vehicle manufacturers?

[@kstan1257]

Larry 21603 the people that are watching these videos are completely blind ignorant and oblivious to understanding what big oil and big car manufacturers can do to manipulate the masses. I don't know why it's so hard to figure out and I've been saying this for years your vehicles are not designed to get fuel economy their engineer to get a "certain" amount a fuel economy. You can strap on as many devices as you want but the computer will always correct the fuel air ratios back to where the factory settings were... wow people are that stupid to actually believe that car manufacturers and the EPA don't work together. The secret lies in the biggest scam ever perpetrated upon the human race and that is the catalytic converter... the catalytic converter and the O2 sensors were 100% design not for emissions but to restrict the engine from getting the economy it was designed to manipulate the way the engine burns the fuel. it was their way of manipulating how much fuel we burn. Do you actually think it's a coincidence that every car manufacturer and a specific vehicle class get the exact or around the same kind of fuel economy duh! Everybody can read this and think who is this jackass I think he is claiming he knows more.... well I know this because I have gotten some of the best fuel economy out of vehicles from people who know how to fool the system personal an experience and I have videos to prove it. We have been lied to people and I personally know people who have been shut down for this knowledge. Photo of a computer get better fuel economy and realized that the same crappy spark plugs and throttle bodies that you're running having changed over 50 years that should be the first giveaway to the corruption.

[@NobleGamer0117]

I mean one could consider getting a Diesel. Last time I checked, if you drive those carefully, you will only need to fill up every 2 weeks minimum. The maximum could possibly be around a month. Of course it also depends on the size of the engine. But the bottom line is, Diesel's are very economic.

[@AndreaStevens2012]

And in 2022, diesel is very expensive. But I guess all the types and grades are, eh? 🙂

[@EdnovStormbrewer]

the only fuel savings you'll get is by how you operate your car or you reduce your engine displacement by doing cylinder deactivation in which GM does so anyway. (though cylinder deactivation is proven to be only a temp solution and is not recommended because of ghost problems associated with it)

[@Jcombetta]

Thank you for saving people from these scammers. Why isn’t the authorities arresting these people for fraud?

[@kamranmalik1707]

Have you tried racechip?

[@SantaClaw]

If they worked, they would come factory fitted.

[@marfrandema1884]

satanclaw nah, even if it works wouldn't. Remember car manufacturers are related in a way or another with the petrolium industry, and if it wasnt thank to tesla we wouldnt even have an electric car for at least another 20 years.

[@dahorn100011]

@@marfrandema1884 it's an uneasy truce. Car manufacturers want efficiency so their model sells over the competitions.

[@tardeliesmagic]

No they wouldn't lol

[@lewis72]

Marfran Dema This is bollocks. I’ve worked for 3 car companies and each one spends millions trying to get fuel consumption down.

[@sithieu9009]

Will it help 20mpg baseline vehicles?

[@tonyp2632]

Sad that these companies get away with selling this crap!

[@jimspry7433]

What about using a vapour system putting the lines directly into your airfilter

[@lloydclaussen3925]

My buddies dad was a vapor injector pioneer in the early 70s. Was getting over 20 mpg in a Cadillac Fleetwood, don't know what happened to this idea