Film Theory: Okay Marvel, It’s Time to PANIC! (Ant Man Quantumania)

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If you watched Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania recently, then you likely have the EXACT same question we do: what the heck was that?! After the CGI fest, cringe story beats, and swapped ending, we have to ask what Marvel is doing at this point. What went wrong and can they recover?
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Credits:
Writers: Matthew Patrick, Forrest Lee, and Bob Chipman
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#AntMan #AntMan3 #AntManAndTheWaspQuantumania #AntManTrailer #Modok #KangTheConquerer #Marvel #MarvelStudios #MCU #Superhero #PaulRudd #Theory #FilmTheory #Matpat

[@myStitch11]

I remember there was a pretty popular theory floating around when trailers dropped about Kang initially offering Scott the ability to go back in time, didn’t miss 5 years with his daughter. But then that plot ended up being Janet’s and no such offer was given to Scott which felt off to me. Like, you could have had a good parallel between Janet and Scott of both lost out on years with their daughters and Kang offering the same deal of giving those lost years back. I almost wonder if this was initially a plan, even more generational parallels

[@DanielGoldhorn]

That makes sense actually. Because in their climactic fist-fight in front of the portal, Kang says that he made that offer to Scott, which... he didn't. He made it to Janet. I think this theory of the story getting cut up in post-production makes a LOT of sense.

[@dosomestuff1949]

BRO EXACLRT

[@danielhofmans4564]

This is what I went into theaters expecting, a deal to get him back what he’s missed from with cassie. If you include prison and house arrest(he was able to have fun inside but still) on top of the 5 years of the blip, he missed 10 whole years of her life. And Janet who has experienced this lost time would be able to talk him out of it and towards experiencing this present and the future he has currently.

[@somethinghilarious6299]

I heard this rumour at that point and I am glad they didn't do it. I dont think this makes sense to risk such a big thing just to get those 5 years. He is not the only one lost his 5 years. And also scott has lived years in prison. He missed her daughter's whole childhood. Missing 5 years of teenage isn't that much of a big deal.

[@HanmaHeiro]

100% this. The trailers had Kang offer something to Scott and it had to have been time. It even ties into the aspect of him trying to be there with Cassie so she wouldn't have strayed too far into the jail stuff

[@RVRocksOfficial]

I love this new arc of Matpat being incredibly skeptical and critical of the things he’s talking about, it’s refreshing to know he feels the same way as the rest of us.

[@DarkSolidity]

@Blended Circuit right, it’s no “theory” a movie that suffered TONS of reshoots was a butchered mess. They used a lesser MCU property as an info dump to jump start phase 5.

[@zachryder3150]

MovieBob is pulling the strings in the background (in a good way!)

[@KateCat420]

​@DarkSolidity Thank you!! I couldn't put into words why I was so mad at this movies ant man, and it's because they used him to info dump for phase 5 😭

[@TheyWantMeGone69]

At this point he's like us, fed up with trash films.

[@MasterOfYoda]

Pandering! The man sold out. We want softball theories and treating the industry with kid gloves!

[@zariasafonova7220]

You know a movie must have been rough when there's no "SPOILER!" warning at the beginning of a theory about an MCU movie

[@sethkeown5965]

With how crystal clear each "new" plot has become, spoilers is an oximoron.

[@rhyswilliams4893]

​@@sethkeown5965 the problem they can't go to far from what people are expecting. These day people absolutely love to complain. Something they didn't have to deal with for the infinity saga. They had a plan and they followed it. Now they make a plan and some group of people find it offensive or disagree with it so they change it.

[@blank-vj1mc]

@@rhyswilliams4893 That’s wrong in multiple ways. People complained just as much before the infirm saga as they do afterwards. That’s historical revision. And phase 4 & 5 literally don’t have a plan. That’s the biggest problem. After Endgame, Feige left the story running position and was going to put Gunn in his place, until his pedo jokes got outed. At that point marvel just started free styling and that’s why they’ve had 3 movies that all were advertised under the guise of fighting the multiverse just to be boring marvel schlock again.

[@arugula517]

@@rhyswilliams4893thats not a problem at all. Don’t cater to anyone and do what you want, that way the people who would have been mad stay mad regardless, and the rest get a movie thats actually good. Trying to appease everyone never works and just ends up letting everyone down

[@commanderhelix]

yeah... i was gonna go see quantumania this weekend, guess not now lmao

[@DannyDaLion]

I think you’re absolutely right. In the trailer from like 4 months ago the voice over has Kang say “I can get you home, I can get you more time. What’s it gonna be…Antman”. It almost seems like they are implying Scott is the one who wants more time with his daughter . The time he lost during the blip and she grew up without him. But in actuality the ‘get you home, get you time’ is talking to Janet who wants to get back to Hope. I remember thinking initially when I watched the trailer Scott makes a deal with Kang not knowing who he is. After watching the movie I thought maybe I was tricked with the deceptive marvel editing. But maybe my initial thought was right. Who knows.

[@patrickgroening5664]

I haven’t seen the movoe but the trailer made me think that way

[@Sathrus04]

I feel like they had to make Kang more evil than how he was portrayed in the trailer because it would of been hard to find a way to justify Scott not taking up that offer, I feel like hes the one character most likely to take a deal like that.

[@jayw3512]

You’re right. The trailer was a master-manipulator. They actually could’ve had something here. Instead, Marvel/Disney jacked it up.

[@justinthomas5270]

There was a line towards the end of the film where Kang told Scott something along the lines of “You had a chance to leave.” I spent so long after watching the film and even during a second rewatch trying to figure when he *actually* had a chance to escape the quantum realm. This theory might explain that line just like the “Our word is our bond” thing

[@guccifer764]

It would make Scott’s decision to fight Kang more impactful if he was given the chance to leave too. Like, Scott has no skin in this game. He just wants to take his daughter and friends and go home. But deciding to stay and fight for people you barely know just because it’s the right thing to do cements Scott as a real hero and not just some hapless dude who gets dragged along by the Avengers. Plus, it brings him around to Cassie’s way of thinking instead of that conflict being abruptly forgotten about

[@Foxian.]

Rawààaþat

[@emancules]

Is he not talking about when Antman tackled him from the portal? He could’ve left then but decided to fight instead

[@SeasiSims]

He had a chance to leave with the “deal” Scott and kang made about the orb

[@AkinokazeHaruichiban]

@@emancules Scott had multiple chances, from Kang's point of view. 1 - If he'd just given him the core right away Kang would have honoured the deal and gotten them home. 2 - If he'd speared his daughter through the portal instead of pushing her through. 3 - If he'd let Kang through and followed him out instead of intercepting him. 4 - If he hadn't destroyed the core. From Scott's PoV, he didn't have any chances once he knew the monster than Kang is, and couldn't allow him to escape.

[@kumikothesorcerer5248]

The MCU right now feels like that one assignment you submit 5 minutes before the deadline. Every script feels like it was written in an afternoon.

[@4X4StudiosHR]

Copied comment.

[@ompalumpa6704]

Huh weird this comment feels familiar…

[@comixproviderftw_02]

That’s what happens when you have a franchise that has lasted long and a corporation that needs to continuously feed the beast with new content in order to stay relevant.

[@Idk-yp2sy]

I was the first comment how do you have 200 likes

[@mkseed9188]

@@4X4StudiosHR cry for attention

[@Garrettglaus]

This theory makes so much sense too with how the trailers seemed to position this movie - with lines like “you lied to me” and “we both just have to lose” feeling more relevant to a mysterio-like twist. If I were a part of the production team at Marvel, this would be a very helpful breakdown of why there was an audience disconnect and what was so special about these franchises to capture going forward. One of your best videos, great job.

[@shumayelkhan8154]

Marvel marketing has sucked for a long long time. After MoM I swore never to buy a pre release marvel ticket again!

[@sonicinfinity1871]

‘Cause anyway thought Mysterio wasn’t a bad guy… right?

[@sev1120]

I'd have personally loved it if the Kang we got in Quantimania was exiled by the other Kangs not for wiping out timelines, but for wiping out timelines that produced evil Kang's. And because it's the multiverse, you could have it be where he's the only good Kang left, and he took over the quantum realm not to conquer it like every other Kang, but rather to give the citizens there some form of protection, even if they don't want it. That would be an amazing twist, and a way to set up the Kang dynasty. Have it be where, with the end of the movie, this Kang could send them back willingly, but doing so sends out a signal that alerts the other Kangs that he's still alive, and so they band together to wipe out that timeline to destroy any threats to their dominance

[@CalvinNoire]

The Avengers vs a team of kangs sounds cool but also kinda one sided, unless we get the typical plot armor.

[@logicdhiya691]

I think from the dialogue in quantumania something similar could happen, kang was kinda hinting at him conquering to prevent incursions which in my mind might set him up as the evil hero, similar to thanos

[@Blanktester685]

@@CalvinNoire every story has some level of plot armor...

[@HJW3]

I stand behind the Kang plot twist theory 100%. Kang's "she'll be fine without you" line made no sense to me in theaters

[@ilovecairns5181]

What?

[@onetoman]

Meaning if the original ending was with Scott dying or being trapped not able to go back it make sense for Kang would know that would happen in this sense kang knew he would win regardless if they tried to stop him or not

[@Marvell3000]

Iron Lad

[@Mas3452001]

I’m sure some Marvel super fan will be sure to call you all sorts of names for not bowing 🙇‍♂️ to their god

[@TheDegenerateTravler]

It’s because go woke go broke that’s why they are where they are

[@MoonWielder]

Quantumania is a perfect example of why Marvel needs to stop pushing unrealistic deadlines for movies to be released. The problem isn't the writers, actors, or any of the people who worked on it, but it's the deadlines and that they are rushing to finish. They also need to stop being unfair to their VFX workers!

[@dopekidrepublic]

Well some of the writer's aren't good but you're right Disney must chill and plan the rest of the phases patiently

[@realMuseology]

They can’t, they have to keep pushing out poor quality products to keep Disney+ afloat, Marvel is now the only main draw for Disney+ and they need to have a ton of new releases to try and keep peoples subscriptions. That, plus trying to follow in the footsteps of the failed ‘all new, all different’ path that the now failed Marvel Comics tried is resulting in the downfall of the MCU.

[@DarkRaikon]

what vfx team? no one want to work for them ....

[@OfficialVontify]

The MCU Is In Shambles

[@babyshak98]

The writers are definitely the problem, they had ample time to right a script and make it good, instead we get this clump of dirt

[@jimmyboydonald6578]

The MCU is now like a long running TV show like Survivor or The Simpsons which peaked a while ago but superfans are keeping it alive because it's a comfort blanket. The general public have moved on.

[@robertokrosorban3666]

Simpsons is still very big

[@jimmyboydonald6578]

@@robertokrosorban3666 Yes, I. agree they are still big, but they are well past their cultural peak when you would hear people quote them all the time and were part of the zeitgeist.

[@rayesafan9628]

Yeah, I feel that. Well, Simpsons is ok to be a comfort blanket because it’s 22 min episodes still airing on tv. It’s an old world content for old world means. Same with Survivor. The medium is the content. Marvel on the other hand was part of the blockbuster medium. And they can’t live up to that anymore. I wonder if the medium of theatrical film is dying at the same time though. Maybe you’re right on the money. Simpsons with family centered sitcoms, Survivor with reality tv competitions, and Marvel with blockbuster franchises

[@DerMoerpler]

@@rayesafan9628 Nah, theatrical film isn't dying. People still want to have the theater experience if there's a well made crowd pleaser. Just look at Top Gun: Maverick or the entire Barbenheimer hype.

[@Scarshadow666]

@@DerMoerpler True, it's more that theatres are getting more expensive, so people are more hesitant to spend a lot of money on movies they're not certain about enjoying.

[@waitaminute2221]

This is so accurate to what is happening right now. I feel like all of the big movie corporations are just dying out because they aren’t remembering what people really love. I was trying to find something to explain it and this is PERFECT. Thank you matpat for all of the amazing videos and I hope that your channel thrives longer than these random character resolutions.

[@unusuarioimportante]

I don't like the "woman knows more than man because it is a woman even when the woman has done nothing and the man is an established character" trope. (She hulk, ant man's daughter)

[@johnathancoopersantos3882]

Yes. MatPat and his team perfectly described what the issue is, when so many others miss the point. We cannot forget the pandemic happened just because we want to move on from it. It negatively affected the movie making process and companies NEVER had to adjust to something like this before. So they have been making bad decisions out of inexperience for what to do. But Marvel said they will slow down production, which seems they already figured out the problem MatPat is saying.

[@kjk607]

Everything feels so lazy which is hilarious when you consider all the money and tech that goes into these movies.

[@thatfighterguy5846]

A bunch of bean counters are dictating how art is made, and the results are very bad.

[@tokiyakillsinsight160]

Marvel’s been at the top for too long. They need some good strong competition. Maybe they’d start to be critical and fan favorite films again.

[@trs5127]

I like how for Phase 4, Marvel had just the absolute infinite possibilities with how well they set up a dark precedence of Thanos going away not really fixing much of the issues of created, and yet they decided to make the most basic, milk toast movies and shows out of it for the most part

[@blazingtrs6348]

milquetoast*

[@DooDooWater9732-n5z]

​@Grey Philosopher Completely true.

[@wrathofthelamb318]

@@greyphilosopher8609 oh gods here we go.

[@DarthCiliatus]

@Grey Philosopher I'm actually working on a paper for my English class right now criticizing this model and the overall proliferation of streaming series and how they are practically mandatory to watch which is a significant monetary and time commitment in-order to fully understand the associated films and how their unwillingness to take chances with the films to avoid alienating audiences will just lead to the audiences becoming bored and dropping the franchise.

[@Rian-vk8kj]

I don't like your grammar.

[@fawksninja]

This should have been a kang solo movie. It's a fresh idea that we get to follow the villian perspective as he grows, and we could have seen kang go full ham on a different universe's avengers

[@Kalise1d]

Love this idea, but I would love to see it kind of how infinity war was Thanos‘s movie featuring the avengers. I think that would be really helpful for Kang as well!!

[@batsaubattler3200]

I'm hoping that's what they do with Kang dynasty

[@SubZero-hs9xc]

Yeah, they didn't care about Scott at All

[@Juice_the_Guru]

It would of been hilarious if kang was doing research on Scott and sees him promoting his book, and even his family saying he's a sell out now. 😂😂 It would of been even funnier and been justified reasons why kang thinks little of the Ant-Man lol

[@TheRibottoStudios]

@@batsaubattler3200 but then that's just rinse repeat of Infinity War-iWar was through Thanos' POV he was the protagonist. If Kang is the protag in Kang Dynasty that's just them telling us we're getting a spedrun version iWar but less good.

[@starcaptainyork]

The perspective on Wanda wanting to "rip the life force out of a Latina teenager to resurrect a fake version of the American dream that only existed in her imagination" is actually a super poignant take.

[@dougrobinson6683]

Scarlet Witch wears a red hat.

[@lukesmith4698]

@@dougrobinson6683 it’s hard to consider them human

[@dougrobinson6683]

@@lukesmith4698 You mean the bots in the KZbin comments?

[@connerwills6802]

I personally think that's a bit of a stretch but I can see it

[@skyesilverwing8922]

I did think it was a bit odd when Scott and Cassie got captured by the rebels together and then Cassie had already drank the ooze before Scott was brought out. That felt like there were supposed to be some scenes where they were supposed to be separated.

[@johnjohnrn8655]

Because Cassie is so “for the people” she obviously trusted the gooo……I really didn’t like her character . She completely underestimates her dad has risked his life several times and missed many years of her life - now she wants him to go do it again.

[@MegaZeo]

Yeah, I was all set for a "Scott and Hope trapped in the Quantum Realm" cliffhanger, which would not only work better as an ending, but it would also explain why they wouldn't just immediately run to the other Avengers and inform them about Kang. Instead we just got... not that.

[@watema3381]

The movies are building together into a bigger picture. That's what made Marvel, _Marvel!_ The pizazz of each movie being it's own story, yet at the same time building into a much bigger narrative. It's a shame that they've become so sloppy. Quantumania was fun in a way, but it has way too many plot holes. Written like amateurs on an unrealistic schedule.

[@gggris2960]

It was a sloppy ending. They already explained that it was Kang tech that pulled them into the quantum realm and the device she made was designed to simply transmit signals. No way they had the power to create a new portal, pinpoint their location in a matter of minutes and get the back. That ending was bs to the highest degree. They nerfed Antman alot in this movie too, bro was goofy for the first half of it. Whole movie he could have turned big and won most of the fights they were in. How u gonna go from fight Thanos army to a coward like that, it’s not his first time.

[@skyewilson9258]

I wanted this as well but think of it this way they can return to the realm and possibly leave with an army since the people were practically wanting them as a ruler

[@baconbellypig826]

I mean this would’ve been the third ant man movie ending with him trapped in the quantum realm, so it doesn’t sound like that big of a cliffhanger tbh

[@althealee9375]

I was expecting Scott to get stuck, then saw Hope and was like “oh okay” and then they got back to their portal and I’m like “oh…okay”

[@Lord_Baphomet_]

When even the actors start talking publicly about how inhuman and strange it is to work on these sets… you know there is a problem…

[@ethansanders7598]

My cousin is a storyboard writer and a comic consultant assistant, and she was telling me that they are basically being like children taking a multiple question/multiple answer test and our second guessing her right answers with answers that are incorrect… Long story short they’re making drunk decisions basically With tons of insecurities of how they think the public will react to it

[@dominicherce5310]

Judging from the trailers., it seemed Kang was trying to negotiate with Scott by giving him "time" with his daughter in return for his help. That might have been the original story.

[@Garrettglaus]

Absolutely! I forgot about that. Even at the beginning of the movie, missed time seemed like a major theme that would’ve been so interesting and hit way harder, but somehow drifted out of the plot.

[@nya69696]

Misleading trailer I guess

[@dosomestuff1949]

YEA RHATS WHATBIM THINKIJG

[@ibzy1211]

literally i thought the whole theme about the movie was the idea of time and how humans spend it

[@legalize420]

That's exactly what happened in the movie. Kang tried to negotiate with Scott for that exact reason. Exchanging time with his daughter for help escaping the quantum realm.

[@neoshadowdukeofgames8223]

I liked how ya showed the hours of MCU content and how much we’ve gotten this last year. That does explain why I’m feeling kinda burnt out

[@AluminumFusion22]

It's franchise fatigue.

[@ammarbaagu]

Tbh hated the fact that i have to watch Series to keep up with MCU especially when the series sometimes feels weak. Too much content, hence i stopped watching all together

[@captaintoet1983]

​​@@ammarbaaguImagine thinking you have to xatch all of mcu to get caught up when you really dont have to because there are billion of recaps out there

[@thelightwing818]

​@@captaintoet1983 Won't viewing experience hinder if he just watches the recaps?

[@captaintoet1983]

@@thelightwing818 not if you pick the right ones. Also it's personal preference. Do you want to know and spot all the details and eastereggs? Then its going to be very rough. Do you want to watch your favourite mcu shows and get the gest of what is happening elsewhere in the mcu? Watch your show and recaps and still be dissapointed about phase 4

[@jacksongreen9729]

I really, REALLY hope Marvel listens to people like Mat. They’re literally TELLING them what they’re doing wrong.

[@megaultradamn]

They're too proud and vain to listen. People have been saying the same things since Endgame, but the Disnoids went along with it. Now the brand is tarnished, and there's no going back.

[@AaronSmith369]

Brand dilution is always the most expectable tool from uncreatives playing it safe while ruining our nostalgia or fandoms.

[@nickmrkobrada8027]

I believe they have. They pushed marvels out by months.

[@ZolaRenard_01]

But they won't because they won't admit they have made a massive mistake...

[@TheDegenerateTravler]

It’s because go woke go broke that’s why they are where they are

[@oxygen3143]

When watching this movie I had only realized we were approaching the climax of the story when we literally arrived there. This movie has some of the weirdest pacing I’ve ever seen

[@lucas_wintle]

For some reason from the lines in the trailer I assumed the plot would be that Kang was going to make a deal with Scott to give him more time with Cassie that he missed in the quantum realm for 5 years. To give him a chance to see her grow up. I feel like whether that was the plan or not that sounds like a better film lmao

[@Tao_Tology]

True but that might put attention on the whole "remember when Stark * could * have reset ALL the damage and fallout, across the ENTIRE universe.......but said nope because of his 1 child?" issue.

[@captainsprinkles6557]

It doesn't fit with Scott's character at all

[@lucas_wintle]

@@captainsprinkles6557 it doesn’t fit Scott’s character to want more than anything to be a father to his daughter?

[@captainsprinkles6557]

@@lucas_wintle He went back in time with the Avengers to save trillions of people, and not a single one of them was his daughter. He's not gonna throw everyone he just saved back under the bus. It might fit a random father, but not Scott.

[@kalebbrown9146]

Tony ripped off invincible lol.

[@shinysilverstardust]

If even MatPat starts to doubt Marvel, you know stuff is wrong.

[@EddieNgatia]

I swear dawg. You can feel the end of marvel looming

[@UltimateNut]

@@EddieNgatia and the dcu will shine and take its place

[@slurples149]

@@UltimateNut I highly doubt that, it's going to be hard to create something better than the first 3 phases of the mcu

[@willbrashear]

I like his movie he found better than the real movie as well

[@Tetrathegod]

yup imagine if the WOKE youtuber starts doubting the WOKE movies thats really insane.

[@rileyclark9096]

I agree with you 100%. Phase four was messy and it makes me miss the old mcu. Things really changed in a short period of time…

[@markcarpenter6020]

Then never read the comics. It changed even faster and you wouldn't recognize most the characters now if you have only watched the movies. Specially the X-Men. Those comics are a disaster of biblical proportions.

[@wismuel]

It really went from killing a big strong guy to the fact that there are multiple different universes that can be connected but if they are then bad things happen.

[@kiriha86]

they make right choice for use title "Endgame".

[@mateoreyes6921]

​@@markcarpenter6020 But that took A LOT of time in the cómics until they had to use things to try to make unique stories like time travel or travel to other universe

[@markcarpenter6020]

@@mateoreyes6921 that's cause the movies are jumping over a LOT of comic history straight to the "all new, all different" era of marvel.

[@okwaho5316]

Think you nailed this. The last several movies felt like they were rushed or missing something. They didn't have that same confidence and character development of what came before.

[@yishaya1]

The idea of Kang’s deal being a much bigger plot point would also make much more sense. Kang should have offered the same deal to Scott that he did to Janet. He would now have the option to get back all the time he has lost with his daughter. That’s how the trailers made it seems like the movie was going to go also. That would have been a very interesting character dilemma Scott would have had to face and fits in with him and Cassie’s divide.

[@orrorsaness5942]

This! In the meantime, while this movie sucked real bad, there is always my comic book series, The Pensuke Files! You can see it by watching my videos and content. Wanna watch and see?

[@cir0plus]

He was a cool character and a good actor. But when Scott made that deal, I was like "yeah he's going to 'break their deal'"

[@ramonandrajo6348]

Also, the w@keness.

[@cir0plus]

@@ramonandrajo6348 Ok, I know "wokeness" can ruin something, but can you be a little more specific?

[@fr0ck360]

MCU has been pretty known for misleading some details in trailers. But, goddamn this is just false marketing

[@wwaxwork]

I just want Marvel to go back to each film telling a complete story. Every film just seems like it's made to build up to some other later story, that just never comes. Every movie just feels like a promo.

[@Novsev9069]

I think that marvel is dead my friend

[@animationaxolotl]

Agreed

[@Sasu123456789x1]

Now this I agree with

[@shadetee234]

*every property just feels like a promo

[@reymondlopez7468]

Here’s the root of the problem: Bob Chapek. In the 2 years he ran Disney he took control away from creatives and gave it to number crunchers. When that happens you get stories that won’t make sense and too many corners are cut.

[@LoganWH8]

The biggest thing I want to see in phase 5 is for someone to finally acknowledge the new continent the Eternals left behind.

[@chezperky]

It did say they will return sooooo

[@rivalflash4569]

Apparently that’s gonna be a big deal in Captain america 4

[@shivamsud]

I feel like marvel themselves is trying to forget about eternals as a whole

[@jamilbarbee6169]

​@@shivamsud i think they did mention it in she-hulk

[@shivamsud]

@@jamilbarbee6169 i skipped that series after the 2-3 episode....but now that u mention it ...its pretty fitting

[@SuperNova163]

They really should just take him into the Marvel writer’s headquarters and have him piece everything together for them. At this point I’m positive MatPat could really make the franchise continue to thrive better than the actual team.

[@corvistein9016]

@@aeonreign6456 I don't know I think mat would at the very least give them some structure they desperately need. I think they have to many people that get there kooky ideas green light have there fun and leave and they need someone whos going to rein them in and keep marvel on a good pace

[@Blu_Maryze]

Honestly the phrase at the end "We both just have to lose" was the coolest thing ever and it made sense cause there's no way Antman was or is powerful enough to beat Kang Yet he ended up winning anyway Like I love Paul as Antman and definitely don't want him gone But that was the waste of such a good line and character moment It just falls flat continuously

[@orphenocou4742]

Seriously if ant man stayed stuck there as he should have, maybe with wasp joining him this time it would have felt right

[@MrSimpsondennis]

heck, even him "losing" and being stuck in the quantumverse could've been an ideal plot for another movie. Shift the character focus and make it about saving him. I mean, they did it before in Pirates Of The Carribean after Jack Sparrow was eaten by the Kraken...

[@MrJackfaire]

I mean he lost. Hope won. By sheer dumb luck of Kang standing in the wrong spot.

[@chrisbutler9594]

It's easy to see what happened story wise, they were making a story that basically said "The kids are right, the olds are wrong" and it didn't fly with some studio execs who made them redo it in the cheapest way possible.

[@Kanaweish]

That's far to easy of a answer.

[@CouchSpud91]

@@Kanaweish And yet considering it's Hollywood and even Disney hasn't been able to fully go all out on that idea, I wouldn't put it past them.

[@markcarpenter6020]

Correction it didn't fly with test audiences since they tend to be the people with disposable income...or the "olds"

[@andrewmathewson341]

@@markcarpenter6020 f**king boomers, ruining not only our future, but movies as well....

[@markcarpenter6020]

@@andrewmathewson341 no more than likely gen X and millennials(probably millennials since most gen X is near near 50 now). Boomers(most actual boomers are 65and over now) are too old for marvel movies and gen Z dosent have the disposable income yet.

[@declanhugors]

I love how in the recap of the plot MatPat passively just completely destroys the plot, just letting it all out. We all feel you Mat

[@eddiespaghetti9399]

Hello Declan ❤🎉

[@kaimemes]

I think a lot of these problems could be easily fixed if the release schedule was spaced out a little more. The infinity saga took 11 years (2008-2019) and now they plan to finish the multiverse saga in 5 years (2020-2025) - that's insane!

[@bro-uk9bt]

The infinity saga didn't really get that exciting for me until after the second Avengers movie

[@jacobmatthews7524]

not really, all you need is more people, not more time. work on more movies at once.

[@HeresorLegacy]

My biggest issue with Quantumania is how little Janet's secrecy made sense. Forbidding to engage with the Quantum Realm without reason, instead of saying: "Hey, I accidently helped a multiverse hopping genocidal dictator rise to power, but trapped him, so maybe don't go down there and give him a way out." Or she could have been the inciting factor, since she had no opportunity to go back since Thanos happened: "I have to go back down and fix this. Help the people down there defeat Kang." But no. Instead she was a "women be crazy" stereotype.

[@Robert_H_Diver]

Yea just bad writing

[@erroneous6947]

In my brain I assume she was cheating on her husband with Kang. And was too scandalized to admit it to her family. Also they made a 65 yr old woman look as attractive as possible while making Evangeline Lilly look horrible. What’s with that hair? Tired of being called pretty? Didn’t make sense to me. Lots of things didn’t make sense.

[@Robert_H_Diver]

@@erroneous6947 yea Lilly looked awful.

[@BobBob-zg5lz]

I found it funny when Bill Murray was dropping the “she is hiding stuff from you” stuff and the whole time Janet was looking at him and smiling like “why are you saying these things? I don’t want you to say these things but I need to look friendly” I’ve seen people make that face before and I thought it was funny and weird that was her face while being revealed to be hiding major secrets from her family.

[@andrewhansen7690]

Janet's secrecy, I'm assuming, is just a really bad Marvel™ take of the "Should victims speak out to protect other victims, even if they don't want to?" argument. In theory it could be a good plot point, but was handled horribly and wrote as a one-dimensional story-line

[@jamesbuchananbarnesss]

The main problem with Quantumania is that they were too afraid of Ant-Man flopping again so they turned it into a 2 hour long trailer for Avengers 5, and then they totally forgot to give the characters any arc or type of story lol

[@nicholassgobero]

Broooo these bots are too much

[@dc_galaxy1416]

Lmao wow. Y'all forgot this is part of a trilogy? It's completing a separate story while continuing another.

[@SubZero-hs9xc]

And it still flopped

[@cxmxqx]

@@dc_galaxy1416 continuing what story? 🤣 no character arcs or anything

[@happy097]

My problem with your comment is that it completely ignores the whole Cassie and Scott storyline happening as they come to trust each other. It just feels like these type of comments are all regurgitating the same incorrect take some content creator had on TikTok

[@moreplz]

What I thought was weird was that they didnt make a bigger deal of Kang's promise to leave their universe alone and only go after other universes. That is like the ultimate "not our problem." like the main conflict between Scott and Cassie. Like is it our job to act even if it doesn't involve us. They never had a moment where any character even considered it was an option to save themselves and their own universe at the cost of others. They then could have had Cassie convince them that they had to act for the good of all and not just themselves. Just seems like a big chance for plot conflict they just dropped.

[@olympusthedarkone83]

Matpat has an awesome way of growing up with the audience. I’ve been watching him since middle school and I’m 21 now and when I watch his videos they don’t seem cringy or “for kids” keep up the awesome work MatPat

[@RileyMarkley]

I feel the quote "It is often worse than you hoped, but better than you feared." matches my reaction to this movie along with much of the audiences.

[@MrInvaderOhYeah]

Honestly same

[@Rohmiesworld]

What quote is this?

[@RileyMarkley]

@@Rohmiesworld Its from the KSP youtuber shadowzone lol

[@SaraNightfire1]

My mom and I watched Multiverse of Madness. She's not a huge fan of Marvel and both of us despised it. When I watched a podcast reviewing Quantamania ame they said it wasn't as bad as MOM, I told her that and she said: “That's really setting the bar low.”

[@aboveworld8209]

It pissed me off the most that somehow Janet just never once thought to mention a super evil genius that has the possibility to take over the entire universe due to some weird PTSD from kang

[@hyperspace2752]

Lmao I didn't expect a thorough media critique on this channel. This hit the nail right in the head. Good job , MatPat and Team.

[@kingswing00]

The movie should have ended with Scott and Hope in the quantum realm. The portal could have opened the same way just a minute after they get stuck but the Cassie who pulls them through is like 65 years old. Scott and Hope are then brought to the far future where they see the world conquered by Kang to set up the next series of movies

[@kashyaptandel4678]

Marvel hire this guy

[@Bomber103378014]

I could be incorrect, but I distinctly remember Kang shooting Scott with one of the lasers and it just pushed him back. Then I distinctly remember saying, "Wait I thought those were disintegration lasers". After that the tension was non-existent for me. I haven't seen it since opening weekend, so correct me if I'm wrong.

[@stevenbobbybills]

Nope, you're right, it does do that, with a fair bit of force and returning him to his standard size, but no lasting damage. The only possible explanation I have other than plot armour is, well, the literal armour of his suit? You wouldn't think it would be mega-durable, as a shrinkage suit used by a guy whose strategy is to avoid attacks, but considering it seems to take a lot to damage his suits in each movie and he's taken hits from other Avengers and so on, and there's always the "it can withstand shrinkage and growth and pressure and stuff" argument... I'm not saying it's perfect, but I can kinda rationalise it? It would be nice to see some suit damage to drive home how powerful Kang is, but I can get why Ant-Man is more durable than the other guys without taking main-character status into account? I don't know.

[@mr.iiconic]

​@@stevenbobbybills I mean war machine lights him up in civil war and it doesn't really affect him at all. I know bullets aren't comparable to this but it at least proves the existence of some time of armor.

[@Jundas]

I thought Kang was pulling his punches against the heroes of the rebellion so he could let them leave and think they won and GTFO so he could resume control immediately afterwards with less resistance and Scott saw him sneaking back into the room right before he went home. He probably only noticed because of his background of a thief and then security expert.

[@Bomber103378014]

@@Jundas I don't think letting the leave was ever part of his plan. Maybe I missed it but I don't think it was communicated at all. Unless you mean he faked getting trapped in the machine, but I think the after credits heavily imply that that Kang is if not dead, at least never coming back.

[@Jundas]

@@Bomber103378014 I mean when everyone is going home and Ant-Man suddenly stays. Kang said if he had just looked the other way he would have got to live.

[@alexisthebestest8537]

also in the trailers with kang, it seemed like he was promising scott he would have a sort of redo with cassie’s childhood, but that motivation wasn’t evident at all in the actual movie. it wouldve added to the idea that while the younger generation is trying to fix things for the future, Scott is tempted by wanting to redo the past.

[@dosomestuff1949]

I think THAT was the actual initial plan for the film

[@HanmaHeiro]

@@dosomestuff1949 agree! That was a part of the trailer that I figured would be huge

[@LotanLevant]

If Kang attempted to frame himself as the good guy like Mysterio did, then offered Scott more time with his daughter like we all thought, this movie would've been infinitely better.

[@comicbooknerd9093]

You should do a theory on how fast Hammy runs in Over The Hedge, after he drinks the soft drink as there is a seen where a sensor light beam is turned on but travels in slow mo while Hammy continues to move normaly

[@rantech.]

1. it would have been really cool if they made it so janet was really working with kang 2. scott and hope shouldn't have gotten out of the quantum realm. it was meant to be 'this is your only chance, you have to go home now', but they just opened another portal, getting rid of all the danger 3. young avengers. i think the kang dynasty will have the young avengers as the heroes, and in the comics they even defeat kang

[@billbaggins7355]

The only way they can make Kang threatening at this point is by turning Kang into like a better version of Ultron. Since he exists in every timeline and all of his selves are aware of it maybe there's one Kang hanging back soaking in all the experiences of the others so every time the Avengers beat him he's learning. So while we're seeing Kang get beaten over and over again it's all do the detriment of the Avengers who will have to fight the boss mode version of Kang where he's seen enough of the Avengers beating him to know how to counter them.

[@jasonstraight1320]

I actually think Ultron is out there somewhere. I'd like to think that Hammer has it on a flash drive somewhere... But idk if the MCU would do that.

[@RuzYT]

@@jasonstraight1320 what? Hammer was nowhere near Ultron when he was created

[@SamanthaLaurier]

I love that idea and I bet we won't get to see it

[@MrJackfaire]

Nah since people don't think a Kang who was winning and only beaten by the luckiest of all shots is threatening they probably won't think he's threatening at if he doesn't end up the ultimate winner and personally resets the MCU or something.

[@youtubeuserkine]

yeah the theory that kang was initially going to befriend scott makes sense. look at the first trailer where kang says "so, what'll it be... Antman?" he was clearly proposing some sort of deal and plan and if you compare to the actual movie, kang doesnt even know who scott was, so him referring to scott by calling him antman makes him almost endearing, showing that he recognizes scott as a heroic figure that is worthy of being remembered.

[@TheParkerThirteen]

He does know who Ant-Man in the movie is though, there's a line after Scott agrees to get the Macguffin where Kang says something along the lines of "you're out of your league.... Ant-Man" before releasing him. He tried to butter him up by "mistaking" him for the strongest avenger, and then once he saw it wasn't working, he dropped the act and belittled him.

[@SuperLuis225]

​@TheParkerThirteen truuuue but he also asks if A) Have I killed you before? B) Are you the one with the hammer He gets to know scott eventually but yeh no this dudes right, kang doesn't know an antman

[@colinprime4746]

You should really go over the connected lore of the Disney Junior lineup, specifically the three show Jake and the Neverland Pirates, Sofia the First, and Elena of Avalor. These three preschool shows are more than what they seem on the surface level, they are filled with lore about what exactly makes Neverland so magical, the fact that all Disney princesses exist in the same universe, the history of the kingdom of Avalor and the magic that surrounds it, and so much more.

[@neco5740]

This, to me, feels like executives making decisions above creatives head. I believe there was, like Mat suspects, a coherent and probably ok movie. But somebody higher up wanted a different ending and a different story entirely and didn't give enough time

[@joshhord903]

Welcome to the Disney era

[@madDjakni]

I took Ant Mans shouting in giant form just as him drawing attention to himself so Kang and his forces were focusing on him and not noticing the massive ant army on it's way (and possibly to rally some of the locals as well) Some of the movie breakdown channels I watched mentioned that originally Scott was supposed to be stuck in the Quantum Realm but the test audience mentioned that's how the last movie ended and so they changed it to this new ending (don't know how accurate that info is but it's out there)

[@999fine5]

I'd like to see a Kang only film that just go through all the horror and trauma that kang sees through the multiverse that makes him convinced his ideas the right one

[@JohnDoe-oj7mg]

but how would they apply the jokes in an all horror movie? i mean u guys loved jokes right? thats why we're here coz asshats like you defended the MCU and their stupid jokes for the ENTIRE infinity saga

[@ridoduck7138]

YESS !!! Frrr

[@SecretlyaMess]

Oh my gosh yes! I thought it was just me being too "attached" to the older MCU (so the og 6 Avengers, Engame era, etc) and definitely haven't been super excited for the newer phase(s). So to hear the discussion of fans going out to see the movies because they liked the characters and the stories is so validating. I feel like (and honestly I'm sure this is due to the whole post-COVID rush) we haven't had enough time to get attached to/form those connections to these characters yet and I'm sure the heavy load of "required" viewing isn't helping either. To me it feels like we barely have time to digest one story before we're thrown into another one, which again I'm sure is due in part to the the rush and whatnot, but honestly it's just frustrating and kinda disheartening as a viewer/fan/consumer.

[@jacksquatjb]

There's a fan theory going around that proves why the second portal saving them at the end makes sense. It's not HIS Cassie, but a world created by the Kang Council to keep Ant-Man complacent. That's why everything seems to be working out for him all of a sudden. And also why he's got a nagging feeling that something isn't right. I'm hoping this is true because that opens up a great plot being stuck in the wrong universe, Stepford Wives-esque paranoia

[@jamangel]

Oof

[@TheBearfootKnight]

That sounds amazing! It would give this movie some sort of purpose

[@crazycoolkids00]

That fan theory is further evidence of the lengths people will go to redeem bad writing when they've bought into a brand. The question is, how much longer will that buy-in last? When the good will runs out, so do the charitable fan theories.

[@theRealJimothy]

In my opinion, MCU's main problem is the fact that every single film starts a new saga of it's own, and that creates quite a few loose ends.

[@shivamsud]

Exactly.....MCU is becoming too people pleasing and therefore is pleasing no one....they are trying to smush in soo many ideas into one movies that none of them feels completely realised....just an unsatisfying mess

[@PlaymakerVGC]

After watching the theory, still crazy to think about how much COVID affected our entertainment, makes you wonder how media such as MCU Phase 4 were meant to originally play out had there been no pandemic lasting years (1 example is how FATWS originally had a storyline revolving around stopping a virus as far as I remember).

[@supersonical8770]

The plot for that turned out to be fake

[@Saintphish]

I don’t think the pandemic affected phase 4 too much Spider-Man made almost 2 billion phase 4 just sucked

[@arugula517]

@@Saintphishdetermining how the pandemic affected releases isn’t based on the box office earnings of a single movie but the quality of all of them. Marvel is obviously not doing so great quality wise even if they are still financially successful

[@ritzgamez]

I feel like a lot of movies in the MCU were rushed because of covid, and they needed to get all of phase 4 out before the deadline they made for phase 5. While other movies, like Shang-Chi, were already in the works before Covid.

[@kwayneboy1524]

Yeah I think Mat was on to something here.

[@jessienerdis4179]

Matt put it so eloquently and especially with his summary of the plot and what he expected to happen then ripppp it got changed is literally what everyone seems to have expected the plot to have been. It's what the story set up so it should've followed through with it if it wasn't going to meaningfully subvert our expectations Edit: totally agree I was expecting this slow reveal to Kang that really builded the tension to make us care about him as the next big bad. But then he was totally butchered. People have argued what's scary about Kang is how many versions of him there are so there's more to come but all this movie did was set up that Kang can be pretty weak if against the right variant. If they had still rushed him out as they did they could've at least put some stakes to the movie like a major death to prove to us he had some strength and characters weren't immune by plot armour.

[@cagegames4755]

Tbh I think that Kang definitely was not as weak as you say he is. Don't forget all he had was his broken down ship to build from.

[@Mediados]

What bothers me most is that appearantly every second 18 year old is born with the same technical ingenuity that Stark built up over a decade and a traumatic experience. Just instead of building a really strong suit, they achieve what would be considered a scientific wonder.

[@guccifer764]

Reminds me of a Spiderman comic which revealed that the average GPA has become super skewed thanks to so many young genius teenagers and every other kid had to invest in super-powered cheating techniques, like getting a Skrull to take an exam for you or making deals with Mephisto.

[@michealrosen]

Iron heart is the only one in the comics that is a genius, but Kate bishop,Casey, they've been buffed in intelligence, they're not this smart in the comics.

[@lucifermagne7458]

​@@michealrosen even then, Iron Heart in the comics... I hated her. She just out of nowhere shows up, is somehow smarter than Tony Stark, and takes his place. I really wish they never added her in the MCU

[@sarahjames927]

Iron heart and Shuri are know for their intelligence.

[@Avalon_1991]

They never explained how Ant-Man's daughter could build a quantum machine so easily.

[@robbybob8662]

It seems that Stan Lee was the only one that actually knew what the fans truly wanted and actually knew how to deliver it. Now that he's gone marvel is having a hard time living up to his legacy.

[@HowdyJ.Marston]

This is funny, because stan lee doesn't write nor direct. He's only there to have his glorified cameo.

[@bored_potato]

​@@HowdyJ.Marston imo, the marvel movies were still done with care and respect (most of the time) when he was still around. Idk if it's a coincidence but when Stan Lee died, the mcu started to get noticeably "greedier", preffering quantity > quality and making one movie after another that Stan Lee would definitely be appalled of. edit: yeah turns out that was just a coincidence, the main contributing factor of why their movies started turning into shi+ was COVID and in their attempt to carry the movie industry on its back like one of the comments said, they started churning out one movie/series after another at the price of what made the MCU movies enjoyable back then. Still doesnt excuse the dumpster fire that is phase 4, but it explains why it became the way it did.

[@MrJackfaire]

Part of the problem seems to be the fans only half watch the movie and then make up what happened in their own heads.

[@dannyhuskerjay]

@@bored_potato no he wouldn't lol. Lee liked all the cruddy dark ages marvel movies.

[@emancules]

@@bored_potatono it was very obviously because of Covid. Marvel single handedly carried the movie industry on its back

[@Ubermensch9240]

1:50 Oh that's a Disney movie.

[@MozartTheGOAT]

There were certain scenes in this movie where I was seriously questioning if I hadn't accidentally bought a ticket for Spy Kids 5

[@vile46]

Hate the new MCU phase 5, the CGI is more and more sieste. You feel it’s so green screen and all the young kids. There terrible

[@lucifermagne7458]

Hey, that's offensive to Spy Kids

[@livestreamgaming420]

Absolutely true

[@lynnthomas8457]

Spy Kids was bonkers, but at least it told a coherent, emotionally fulfilling story with actual character development.

[@lucifermagne7458]

@@lynnthomas8457 exactly

[@celestekierans4931]

They tore apart the Falcon and the Winter Soldier too. And it definitely felt like they had a better story that they destroyed.

[@guccifer764]

I mean they removed an entire pandemic storyline because apparently audiences are fragile children that will break at the mere mention of a bacterium now.

[@themanwhowouldbebrick]

@@guccifer764 bruh what

[@guccifer764]

@@themanwhowouldbebrick Look it up. There was originally a pandemic storyline in FATWS. The scene where they fight the Flag Smashers on the truck was originally them stealing vaccines.

[@Andrew-fb8ph]

@@themanwhowouldbebrick there’s speculation the flag smashers plan in the falcon and the winter soldier was originally going to involve unleashing some sort of virus. This entire plot line was scrapped due to the Covid pandemic and the show was awkwardly edited and paced in many parts as a result. While the villains felt like they had no real endgame in mind.

[@themanwhowouldbebrick]

@@Andrew-fb8ph that’s so stupid that they removed it

[@jmace2424]

Cassie: Troublemaker who goes to jail. Also Cassie: Genius who makes a quantum telescope. You took too many D&D cards. Put one of them back please.

[@frogs3338]

Real life isn’t DnD tho

[@shapeshiftingpedro]

@@frogs3338 How many astronauts were former felons? That's what I thought.

[@frogs3338]

@@shapeshiftingpedro Former felons wouldn’t get hired, Cassie was never hired.

[@shapeshiftingpedro]

@@frogs3338 •

[@frogs3338]

@@shapeshiftingpedro There are also different types of smart. Someone can be book smarts and tech smarts but still be dumb.

[@abraham2172]

The way you explained this old vs young generation narrative actually sounds really compelling. I wish we could see the movies as they were originally planned.

[@faithcortis7202]

Even the side characters felt underutilized- they introduced and established about four different characters and they had about 5 lines of dialogue each.

[@jessicahogan7248]

They should have had Luis and friends on the outside trying to find Scott/ Make the tech work or take it to someone who knows how to use it etc instead of introducing us to a bunch of new unimportant characters that we'll never see again. Why make new ones that flop when you ignore preexisting ones?

[@spellbreakerunbound]

If this was the original story, I cannot for the life of me understand why they would change it. It seems extremely fitting to the real world situation, and reediting a thing in post-production must have taken even more work than usual. You still even end with the big Kang reveal, except this time the movie has a ton of dramatic irony, as the characters could trust Kang while the audience knows he’s a problem.

[@winebottle9886]

They probably changed it because some details got leaked

[@captainsprinkles6557]

Because it probably wasn't the original story. Matpat is right like 3% of the time when it comes to marvel movies(or movie predictions in general).

[@jenjoe4359]

Multiverse of madness and love and thunder also had their original scripts being much better than the final version

[@YuTEM]

Most likely that the producers weren't satisfied and said "change this or else we won't make profit" and the writers were forced to make up a worse plot to fill up their requirements.

[@davidalacabo4298]

Wokeism

[@AmbroseSimpson]

TIL that the FedEx logo has a hidden arrow and now I can't *un*see it. So thanks for that.

[@ASecretWriter]

After being really excited for the newest Ant-Man movie, I was super let down. Major disappointment. I’m glad MattPat knew how to explain it 😂

[@johnshelton22]

Sometimes you gotta learn the hard way

[@LordNapking]

People still get excided for marvel films?

[@ASecretWriter]

@@LordNapking probably not 😂 I only get excited for a couple

[@LordNapking]

@@ASecretWriter I will admit guardians of the galaxy could lure me in as well😁

[@azrael5992]

As an aspiring writer myself, I immediately knew something was off once the credit rolled. Two version of the story played in my head. The first one is similar to this one, where Scott and Hope get trapped in the quantum realm, repeating the cycle that Janet started (leaving her daughter, Hope). But the other one is that Janet and Hank are the ones that is left in the quantum realm. Scott never did anything wrong, and so he doesn't deserve to get trapped in the quantum realm. On the other hand, Kang was Janet's mistake, and (before getting back to the real world) instead of fixing it, she just hid and ran away from everything. Even as the movie played out, Janet does not do that much, and Scott is the one who fixes her mistake by defeating Kang (somehow), while Janet gets to go scot free. Again, this was just an alternate version I made up in my head, but think about how fitting it could be. Janet is forced or chooses to remain in the quantum realm to fix and rebuild the world she broke by helping Kang, and Hank decides to join her, since he never wants to be separated from her again, and because he had already many accomplishments in the real world, maybe he could help society in the quantum realm as well. I am not claiming that this version of the ending would be any better or worse than the original. I'm just saying that, as a creative, this is how I would have preferred the movie to go.

[@bobafett4265]

Definitely sounds like a better movie than what we got, like I enjoyed Quantumania for what it is in it's current state where it's a fun trippy odyssey where in a world that's filled with many of these gritty hardcore "Realistic" films and media it's kind of refreshing to see something as odd as Quantumania, it's a palette cleanser for those types of films, I have nothing wrong with Gritty Hardcore films I do like my fair share of them like Terminator but that's beside the point.

[@sarov7658]

Priority for wokeness over writing simple as that

[@Jay-dn2fc]

@@sarov7658 I’m not usually the type of person who would agree with you on this but this time it’s absolutely true!

[@han7oee]

Sounds much better than the actual movie. There was no stakes at all in the end despite them building Kang as the new big bad. Would've preferred it if there was someone from the family who gets trapped or killed in the end, and that starts off a chain reaction of the heroes being warned of Kang's arrival

[@Maydaytrans-666]

My favorite theory ever has to be the idea that humans have been praying to something acting as a god but is more a Sheppard of humans, it’s not watching over us to be nice, but to prepare us for slaughter so they can eat. (Nothing to do with marvel was just thinking about it.)

[@SuperSaiyen64]

I agree I think the pandemic really effected the MCU more than we are aware of. I wish we could see what would've happened if COVID never happened

[@PlaymakerVGC]

While COVID obviously ruined a lot of stuff, still crazy to think about how far the extent of something like entertainment is still affected from what happened to this day. Still makes me wonder how mediums such as MCU Phase 4 would've played out in their original plans (such as how FATWS originally had a storyline around a virus and um... you know the rest).

[@LordNapking]

I'm sure it would've been somewhat the same...

[@EndoftheBeginning17]

@@PlaymakerVGC I think what might have happened is that as the studios lost their funding they had to hire less skilled writers and directors to take on their projects. As an example, with the She-Hulk series no one bothered to hire a trial lawyer to be a consultant and go over procedure and how to do examinations. They admitted to not knowing how to write rousing trials scenes. So skip it. We got the mess that is She-Hulk

[@Tao_Tology]

Oh you young kids, * takes draw on cigarrette * you didn't live through the Writers' Strike Fallout.

[@tturi2]

covid just added a few more hoops to jump through and sped up a few economic changes and a recession, it would have been the same outcome imo

[@blankjester8126]

They are cutting some projects and delaying some, so hopefully, they're understanding what's wrong and slowly fixing it, but who knows? Quantumania felt like it could've been better from simple dialogue exchanges and cutting some out like the "I had needs" scene

[@audaciousjones]

which projects did they cut?

[@taylorbeckett9686]

This is how I envisioned the movie going from context clues. But it also makes the scene where Scott yells "We had a deal!!" Make so much more sense. In the actual movie they didn't have much of a deal at all and neither really upheld any part of it. In the original version I assume Scott and Kang willingly agreed on a bargain like Janet and Kang had. This would also make Kang's random outburst at the end make sense when he talks about Scott being able to have more time with Cassie (but weirdly sounds like he's having a stroke and reliving his convo with Janet)

[@zhulok]

Matpat misunderstood the "We had a deal!" scene, Scott said in the previous scene that he was going to try to keep Kang's attention on him which is why he is being big and loud and just saying whatever he needed to get Kang to send his forces after him. There is no missing context there.

[@Xedllin]

@@zhulokThe "we have a deal" line is totally unnecessary if it's just to keep Kang's attention since he already have that by just being giant and wrecking the place. Hence why it felt "out of place".

[@zhulok]

@@Xedllin How did it feel out of place? They had a deal, Kang didn't keep his word and now in a moment of being loud and abrasive Scott is bringing it up. My point is that there's no missing context here, the scene made sense when I watched it.

[@Xedllin]

@@zhulok It felt out of place because Scott never really believed Kang would keep his side of the deal, so the anger on that line felt fully out of place.

[@zhulok]

@@Xedllin Because he's not actually angry about that lol. Again hes being big and loud and abrasive so as to catch and keep Kang's attention. He's bringing it up because it is the most recent thing Kang did to him. This is what Scott does, he's loud and annoying. I think this where you guys are getting mixed up here, you actually thought he was serious about the deal thing. He's not mad about the deal he's mad that Kang is a bad guy who has his daughter.

[@mrleaf7195]

Never new the thing about FedEx till you told me. Thanks MatPat, I will never be able to unsee it ever again.

[@ICYFilms]

I 100% agree antman quantumania was a let down. Kang was perfect and then everything else was ehhh.

[@isaiah-nk7gt]

Bro we have the same comment somehow lol twins

[@zpkspiano]

I saw a review that said the movie was great if you turned your brain off lmao

[@colton5604]

The goopy hole guy was definitely the best character tho 👌

[@M3GRSD]

All Marvel films are disappointments.

[@Urmoma970]

One thing I couldn’t get over was that Scott was in for 5 hours but time stayed roughly the same for Janet as it did on the outside

[@scotheggie8057]

Scott was in a time vortex, Janet was not

[@MrJackfaire]

@@scotheggie8057 I honestly think 90% of the "MCU is failing" is because people are only half watching the movies and then filling in the blanks with what they think happened.

[@frogs3338]

@@MrJackfaire for some of the movies and some people, it really seems that way.

[@emancules]

@@frogs3338 it’s not even a small detail either. That time vortex is the entire underlying premise for Endgame. That knowledge is how Tony builds his Time Machine💀

[@frogs3338]

@@emancules exactly

[@Celtic1020]

10:10 I do agree with this idea. Scott isn't afraid to join the fight, he just wouldn't know which side to take.

[@cmja09]

9:43 this one makes the most sense, MCU writers SHOULD WATCH THIS

[@0XTFSX0]

I feel bad for the original actor for older cassie, she didn't even know she was getting replaced until it was announced.

[@shep3491]

A theory I have really wanted to see is the fact that small things are different since antman got back from the quantum realm. The price of the food in the store is different the Ben and Jerry’s looks different. Little details that lead me to believe he is in another universe.

[@dosomestuff1949]

I HIGHLY DOUBT THAT

[@shep3491]

@@dosomestuff1949 there has to be an explanation the little details like when he gets his daughter’s birthday wrong. They may not be in another universe but something is definitely wrong.

[@dosomestuff1949]

@@shep3491 yea something is wrong, but I doubt they are in a different universe

[@NurniyazKazaliyev]

@@shep3491 he literally says “I’m just making up for all missed birthdays”.

[@shep3491]

@@NurniyazKazaliyev Yeah but it seems like he doesn’t know at first. I’m just tryna be skeptical

[@pmgmsd]

The quick plot resolutions, the "we had a deal" line, and so many other things mentioned... I thought I was crazy, but yeah, it all felt off to me in the moment, too.

[@nisrinenisrine2508]

I like how he furnished so many efforts into this theory

[@ActKri]

I missed all of the new marvel movies but film theory has keeped me in the loop 💯

[@spacecowboyz0154]

You saved lots of time and money, everything sucked the only good movies were no way home and wakansa forever

[@BillyBeanie]

@@spacecowboyz0154 I thought Shang chi was also pretty good

[@PhantomBulletGames]

@@spacecowboyz0154 *Just Spiderman NWH

[@meapyboy12345]

same with me

[@bheemabachus5179]

It's still a really good movie, but I think Marvel would benefit from doing movies 1-2 times per year instead of 2-3 times. It seems like post-production changes are done very quickly

[@megamanx1291]

@A Nigerian ninja Meh, this has been definitely a lot better than a lot of the other films

[@zhanucong4614]

​@A Nigerian ninja mid!!!!????, this movie contains everything wrong about marvel

[@zhanucong4614]

​@@megamanx1291 for example?give me another big franchise that messed up worse than mcu

[@fr0ck360]

@@zhanucong4614 DCEU

[@MrJDog3000]

Thank you, thank you, THANK YOU! This is the first time I've seen someone else mention that the entire first hour of the movie acts like we have no idea who Kang is! I've been saying this since opening weekend. It's weird and really annoying. I love this theory for that reason alone.

[@jonruby1755]

johnathan majors as kang the conqueror is probably the worst casting decision ever made lol

[@gatorb8610]

They want another endgame to put in the bank, but they’re forgetting that it took 10 years to put together so perfectly.

[@floop1108]

I’m taking this video as canon. The way you explain everything, it allows me to actually make sense of what the heck phase 4 even was. So yeah, I’m just taking everything you said to be true, and thinking of ant man 3 as the end of phase 4.

[@Pylen]

Its crazy how Matpat and his team come up with so many insane theories. They never fail to disappoint

[@tsalVlog]

It's unfortunate that Disney isn't known for releasing "Director's Cut"s of their properties.

[@bigfailures]

The effort put into the theories totally pays off, spectacular work! 👏

[@l8studios_]

@notnow I swear to god

[@yaboiandrew8206]

bro I can’t with these bots

[@l8studios_]

KZbin needs to get a hold on this bot problem

[@forkliftposter]

this comment is so generic its hilarious, bro is fishing for top comment rn

[@militantpacifist4087]

69th like.

[@emeraldemuto]

That FedEx arrow thing actually just blew my mind.

[@bigfailures]

Great overall movie analysis, truly looking at plot points and foreshadowing.

[@TheSeaQueen00]

Matpat put to words what i myself couldnt have even expressed, my family watched everything phase 1-3 religiously, but everything since phase 4 started has felt weird and different and its not a priority in our lives anymore, and matt has pinned down exactly why

[@fcm3d]

Everyone complains about the save at the end but Kasey has a line in the beginning that she made a thing to find them. If she had it before she could found him the first time.

[@geomeopeoleo1740]

The other thing I was confused about, Scott was stuck in the shrinkverse for about 5 years right? Everyone else apart of the experiment was dusted or wasn’t there and didn’t know it happened. So why is Scott the same, why does he not know anything from his time? If Kang really wanted to find someone who could fix his power source why didn’t he find Scott? Clearly Kang has immense power of that realm he couldn’t tell when it was breached? Does he need a oblivious signal that’s repeated like in Quantamina?

[@MechTechGunna]

Scott was stuck in the Quantum Realm yeah but I think he wasn’t shrunk to the point Kang and the other QR dwellers were.

[@bookswithike3256]

Scott was stuck for five years from the perspective of the outside world, but for him it was only five hours.

[@TheRealYDA]

I Think He Got Stuck in A Time Vortex or something

[@____Carnage____]

It was only five hours for him, he had no clue what happened or how long time had passed outside it

[@thediamondplanet]

to be fair Scott was only stuck for five hours, he got pushed out 5 years into the future sure, but to him, he was there for 5 hours, probably went through one of those time vortexes Janet told him not to go, so he skipped five years where Kang could not have known he was there. There's also the possibility Kang wasn't actually there during the first MCU phases since He Who Remains made sure he was the only Kang around, but as soon as he died to Sylvie, a lot of Kangs were put right back in the Multiverse, permanently altering the timeline midway like some lame retcon. He could've not been there until the Time Heist from Endgame, where the Council of Kangs exhiled Kang to the Quantum Realm (via the Avengers' time machine), went "off course" into a time vortex back to around the time Janet was trapped in there, and therefore changing the 616 Timeline, explaining why Janet was so cool with messing with the Quantum Realm at the end of Ant-Man II but awfully scared of interaction with it during Ant-Man III in the process.

[@vinniechan]

A while back I read that one of the directors who turned down the Eternals was that when she exepcted her self doubt in handling CGI set piece, the studio reassured her that it would have been taken care of by Marvel. At that moment I was like "Oh Marvel is going at it like a big resturant chain and the director is the Chef" Basically in big resturant chain, the Chef isn't concerned about the hands on stuff. In stead you have a team of cooks that specialises in parts and the Chef worries about putting those parts together to create a dish and oversees the overall quality control when he sets the menu. Makes sense after the studio is acquired by Disney and under pressure to pump out content at pace