Filmmaker reacts to Starship Troopers (1997) for the FIRST TIME!

Hope you enjoy my filmmaker reaction to Starship Troopers. :D
Full length reactions & Patreon only polls: / jamesvscinema
Original Movie: Starship Troopers (1997)
Ending Song: / charleycoin
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Twitter: / jamesadamsiii
Website: www.senpaishot...
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[@Raktus]

To the comment made in the intro... I started watching a lot of these react channels when I was staying at a hotel waiting to get surgery for cancer. Yours was one of the ones I subscribed to... and still here a year later watching.

[@JamesVSCinema]

Wow, this means a lot to me but dude, shout-out to you for real. This just truly made my entire week right here. Thank you for even taking the time to comment!

[@zhollamychalis4252]

Glad you made it through. Speaking of bugs...where this real life bug is concerned...watch out and take care. Cheers!

[@windingrefn8417]

Hell yeah 💪 Fuck cancer

[@krisfrederick5001]

Glad you're still here my friend, good things.

[@michaelsegriff3362]

God bless you, and good luck.

[@onearmedbandit84]

"This could be either extremely campy or a complete bloodbath" Paul Verhoeven: Why not both?

[@JamesVSCinema]

😂😂😂

[@davewolf6256]

@@JamesVSCinema This is Takashi Miike's favorite movie, and it makes every kind of sense! (In the context of this comment.)

[@JoshuaC0rbit]

Verhoeven is such an interesting character in the story behind how this movie got made is fascinating. It wasn't even intended to be based on the book but somehow verhoeven made it work.

[@onearmedbandit84]

@al alex Why are you politicizing this? Get that shit out of here.

[@SimarGraphicDesign]

@@onearmedbandit84 the movie is all about politics though... did you not see the nazi uniforms?

[@heilmann18]

The satire in this movie was so on point that some people actually thought it was a fascist film.

[@JoshuaC0rbit]

There's three levels of fans to this movie. Those that appreciate it just for the action, those did appreciate verhoeven style and satire without necessarily understanding the deeper meaning and then those that are fans of the book. There were entire chapters of the book that read like a poly-sci textbook from college but somehow was still amazing and I really wish they had used the mech suits in the movie.

[@Hooga89]

@@JoshuaC0rbit The most funny thing is that what Verhoeven is really satirizing is fascism and militarism as concepts and not Starship Troopers the book at all. The society that is depicted in the book is way more like a complex federalist society(obviously with *some* authoritarian features) like Switzerland than it depicts a form of Nazi-Germany or Fascist Italy, but of course this kind of nuance gets lost in the noise.

[@monsterlair]

@@JoshuaC0rbit What about the fourth kind who appreciate the Verhoeven style and satire AND understand the deeper meaning? Granted, i didn't pick up on the themes and subtexts when i saw it the first time in the cinema in -97 because i was young and dumb, but it didn't take many years for me to grasp what Verhoeven and Edward Neumeier tried to accomplice.

[@plaguedoctorjamespainshe6009]

Imagine thinking a jewish man who grew up in a nazi occupied territory would be a nazi

[@GeraldWalls]

@@JoshuaC0rbit I vaguely remember reading the book when in high school (1980 to 1981 timeframe). "I am a 30 second bomb." Initially I was disappointed in the campiness of the movie but once you separate the two in your head you can enjoy this movie for what it is and the novel for what it is.

[@Vertaghost]

"The only good bug. Is a dead bug. Would you like to know more?" Lol. This classic was ahead of it's time.

[@QuayNemSorr]

Paul Verhoven deliberately used "Pretty but bad" actors for the movie. To accentuate the cheesy feeling and propaganda in the story. A movie about young and beautiful people in a fascist "utopia" that are eventually only good for.....killing bugs.

[@JamesVSCinema]

Super interesting!

[@MyNameIsBucket]

The whitest people you've ever seen living in... Buenos Aires.

[@seamusburke639]

@@JamesVSCinema It's funny, because you can kind of tell who knew what kind of movie they were in and who didn't. Michael Ironside, Clancy Brown, and Neil Patrick Harris definitely knew they were in a satire.

[@tkvids1377]

@@seamusburke639 totally agree with this!

[@michaelharvey1197]

@Krister L Ask the Portuguese.

[@TimotheeReacts]

Gotta love Paul Verhoeven! This and Robocop are absolutely amazing!

[@JamesVSCinema]

I gotta make sure to finally get to Robocop lmfaooo

[@TimotheeReacts]

@@JamesVSCinema if you liked the action in this, how it was shoot and all. You’ll love it

[@timallenbrown]

@@JamesVSCinema Yeah if you haven't seen the original that would make an AMAZING commentary! Add it to the poll!

[@andrewcharles459]

Robocop was big fun.

[@Pengi_SMILES]

Once you see Robocop the satire in ST makes more sense as well. Verhoeven has a lot to say, but he also makes fantastically entertaining films.

[@shainewhite2781]

This is film, RoboCop, and Total Recall are perfect examples of Satire.

[@jeffperdue5106]

I was surprised my mom liked these movies, she didn't like violence but loved satire

[@commanderstarstrider7176]

Aren’t those all same director? Paul vanderhoten methinks

[@otherkorean]

@@commanderstarstrider7176 They were all Verhoeven. And they were all great.

[@Artsificial]

@@otherkorean Still are!

[@sss1029]

Ironically the society of starship troopers looks much more appealing than the one the united states have.

[@jmwild1]

I think one way to describe the visuals in this movie is "brutiful".

[@Perfectly_Cromulent351]

Neither critics nor audiences appreciated the film’s commentary when this came out, but post 9/11 America and the propaganda machine that it spawned showed that Paul Verhoeven was actually prescient.

[@dirus3142]

He was also full of shit. His life and career as a director, who can make these kinds of movies, is directly a result of the men and woman who serve their country. Whether it be military, government service, or civil service.

[@BoxHeadMidus]

@@dirus3142 The US military hasn't fought for our freedoms since the Civil War. Get out here with that American Exceptionalism bullshit.

[@Perfectly_Cromulent351]

@@dirus3142 you know he’s Dutch, right?

[@SuzakuX]

@Ghost You sure are a simpleminded, uncritical bootlicker.

[@Lmaoh5150]

@@SuzakuX Bro don’t fall for the simplest of bait

[@thepurenewb1584]

"They just found a legendary Pokémon and that thing looks Pissed Off" i dunno why but that line had me fricking dying 🤣😂

[@JamesVSCinema]

Lmfaooo like this is not the Pokémon Go I signed up for at all 😂

[@KevinLyda]

Same!

[@terminaldogma01]

RIP to the best person in the movie, then immediately RIP to the second best

[@ProHero86]

The book was crazy different and still Eff Carmen

[@JamesVSCinema]

Didn’t even know there was a book haha

[@thesevendeadlysins578]

@@JamesVSCinema Yep. The movies come from a book.

[@protomous]

@@JamesVSCinema all of the commentary and satirical undertones you were picking up? The movie is incredibly subtle about them, but the book just doesn't have them at all. The movie is a fantastic criticism of the militarist/fascist mentality pervasive both in society and in the military sci-fi genre in general, disguising as a good faith portrayal of that mentality. The book is just straight up military/fascist propaganda lmao

[@lambjalfrezi]

@@JamesVSCinema Oh yeah, a really good book by Robert Heinlein. I recommend it if you have the time to read it.

[@steffurness]

@@JamesVSCinema Heinlein...you're on point that there's underlying social commentary, but the book was a satire, and the movie was a satire of the book, so I totally understand how the message comes across as a bit jumbled.

[@PalmDesertRock]

I really, _really_ recommend watching Red Letter Media's video on Starship Troopers after you've seen the film for the first time. And then watching the film again after the RLM video. It helps a lot getting into the underlying subtext of Starship Troopers. There are also a thousand tiny details that are very easy to miss in this. Like a scene where a _black_ officer walks through the frame who has SS-runes on his shoulder flaps. Like, actual Nazi symbols. There is _so_ _much_ stuff in this, but it's very successful in steering your focus away from it. Seriously one of the best movies of all time and criminally underappreciated.

[@bronzewand]

100%

[@dirus3142]

I agree. They had a great discussion, and comparison to a Star Trek episode of similar themes. However they made the mistake almost every one does (including the director) about the films society. It's not fascist, it just has a different cultural mind set.

[@red-stapler574]

I like how this is basically the flip side version of the Gorn episode in Star Trek.

[@dash4800]

@@dirus3142 yes, there is a video by Sargon of Akkad that dives deep into the actual book and how the politics actually work in that society. People just think it looks like Nazis so it must be a critique on Nazis. But thats just a spin the director put on it with the art direction and propaganda, its not supported by what actually happens in the movie.

[@pooty195]

@@dash4800 the book and film are distinctly different things. the film is pretty obviously satirizing fascism, even if the book version of society is different.

[@JamesVSCinema]

Maaaaan Bug's Life sure looks different! Want to vote on what I should watch next? Click here! www.patreon.com/jamesvscinema FIRST TIME WATCHING JUJUTSU KAISEN Tuesday. Enjoy the day!

[@Eruthian]

Hey, stupid idea, and my voice maybe doesn`t really count cuz I`m not a patreon. But how about you surprise us with a movie that YOU realy really want to watch for years? Huh? ;)

[@Akaeus]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/oYfTiqmMZbRqq6s

[@bmatt2626]

The sci-fi context lets you recognize the absurdity in propaganda you might otherwise have grown up with, and internalized.

[@Scallycowell]

The one thing that I love about this movie is the levels it exists on. For example… This movie is a propaganda film that exists in the universe it takes place in. It exists for recruitment purposes, hence no matter what the troopers say or do, it’s always shown as being heroic. The film actively lied to the audience, but we aren’t the intended audience, the people of this universe are, so naturally they’ll accept anything the Federation tells them. When the planetary defenses allows the asteroid past its defense grid, it’s not because they used it as an excuse to get the Fed involved in another war to keep its citizens under their control, “it’s because the bugs are bad, duh!” It doesn’t matter that the Arachnid Quarantine Zone is thousands of lightyears away and for them to actually be able to calculate their aim or have the ability to fire asteroids at the Earth, that it would have had to be done before the Federation even existed, “because the bugs are bad, DUH!!” Also, they call them arachnids when they only have six limbs, making them insectoid. It’s because ‘arachnid’ is a slur to make them sound scarier for propaganda. They’re even compared to ‘gross/disgusting’ cockroaches despite looking nothing like them and being far more intelligent. Even with the presence of the brain bug, the propaganda still won’t let them been seen as anything equal to humans because that hurts the narrative of human superiority and bug inferiority. “I find the idea of a bug that thinks OFFENSIVE!!” TL;DR: the movie is both a satire of propaganda and literal propaganda for the universe it takes place in and Paul Verhoeven and Ed Neumeier are geniuses.

[@Cau_No]

Not to forget that in the end actually the bad guys win. This war started because humans invaded Klendathu space, which they finally take over. And anyone wondered why they used those uniform and flag designs? (Just in case one didn't notice this about the flag - green is the complementary color of red...)

[@StreetHierarchy]

And let's not forget the levels of colonialism that makes it so that English-speaking whites populate Buenos Aires.

[@ragdaj]

...and basically, that humans are the same as bugs - cannon fodder is just mindless drones.

[@Scallycowell]

@@StreetHierarchy There is definitely heavy undertones of colonialism on top of everything else the film satirizes. The bugs using their front legs for stabbing, it’s like they’re an indigenous tribal society stabbing at these aggressive invaders with spears before being blown away with rifles and canons like the English colonizers of the Victorian era. The Zulu Wars especially come to mind.

[@yodieyuh]

James, humans can't travel thousands of light years. You seem okay that humans who can't leave Earth without out technological help can use impossible forms of travel, but after we're shown that the bugs evolved in multiple ways to travel and battle in space you won't let them have impossible modes of travel? The bugs colonized multiple planets in multiple systems. The bugs evolved to do battle with either things in orbit or on other moons/planets. The bugs evolved a way to transfer and then analyze alien brain matter. Real life humans can't travel across the galaxy faster than light. Real life humans aren't psychic. The film NEVER tells or shows that humans 'let' the asteroid by their defenses. The film DOES show us that asteroids are sent from Klendathu towards earth, as Carmen and crew trace one right in front of our eyes.

[@sabre23d]

The movie is a commentary on American Fascism, Military Propaganda, and Jingoism. You'll notice the uniforms they wear are eerily similar to Nazis. Paul Verhoven grew up in Nazi Occupied Holland, so he's always been vocal against the rise of fascism in America. He actually adapted the movie from the novel to kind of shit on the novel, which he viewed as extremely fascist and Militaristic. So the movie is highly critical of it's source material.

[@ragdaj]

not specifically American, but just to show, that propaganda could brainwash you into thinking, that you are "good guys", even though you are ...fascists.

[@ambrosiogiovanni6952]

Stop spreading lies. Verhoeven never even read the book. He just made a movie he wanted to, and then use some stuff from the source material to use the name.

[@jeffperdue5106]

Oh wow. Never read the book, but my brother had told me the book was a commentary on the propaganda America used to fight Japan in WW2.

[@Kurdinov83]

@@ambrosiogiovanni6952 Are you the guy that goes into all of the starship troopers videos and comment this? Is there an army of dudes hating on Paul Verhoeven and defending Heinlein's novel?

[@Bryan_Master_Blaster]

The book is fantastic, and includes a lot of political and cultural observations. The only thing the movie has in common with the book are some of the character's names. And that's about it.

[@krono5el]

Verhoeven was a staple in my childhood and the visual effects in starship troopers are still amazing, miniatures and cg working together in harmony.

[@zenonorth1193]

That's one heck of a childhood!

[@KS-xk2so]

The Teacher/Lieutenant is pretty awesome. "Rico, we've got an urgent briefing for the war effort son!" See's the girl... "Nevermind fam, get you some ass!" Now THAT's a leader!

[@bretbuchin1033]

"What the- *sucks teeth*" Yes. Yes we are with you on her being whack from the drop. P.S. "every nfl coach" is Jake Busey! Gary's son Definitely has got his fathers attributes! And "nuking respectfully" is definitely brutiful. Love this movie and your channels! Keep up the fun!

[@JamesVSCinema]

Hahaha glad to hear you had a good time with the video as much as I did haha!

[@WHADATBOYNAMEIS]

dude needs to watch Freightners for some great jake busey moments

[@bretbuchin1033]

@@WHADATBOYNAMEIS The Freighteners is the best A+ movie that is thought as as B grade. That'd be another fun "campy flick" for him!

[@davidhasselblad3825]

Dude that man needs to play duke nukem 😂

[@cadenstrampe4216]

1997 was an amazing year for movies and their impact on pop culture. This, Boogie Nights, Titanic, L.A. Confidential, this list goes on and on

[@booniespur1882]

Pulp Fiction was the catalyst for the ground breaking cinema that followed its 1994 release, it opened everyone's eyes.

[@JoshuaC0rbit]

Mid-to-late 90s was an excellent time for film. Of course I feel the same way about mid-to-late 90s hip-hop so I'm a little biased.

[@Browncoat66]

Titanic, not so much.....Really LEO sucked in that movie and there was PLENTY of room on that floating door for him...just saying y'all!

[@cadenstrampe4216]

@@Browncoat66 that's why I added the "impact on pop culture"

[@pablom-f8762]

1995 and 1997 are the best years in my opinion in terms of moviegoing. 1999 might be number three.

[@billwithers7457]

One of the great satires of our time.

[@JamesVSCinema]

I was catching it here and there. It was disguised pretty well even looking at it for the first time today

[@billwithers7457]

@@JamesVSCinema It's disguised because it's EVERYWHERE. It's built right into the foundation of the world. It's hard to point out one thing that's being satirized, because there's just so much to unpack. It's like... if you don't go into it knowing that all of it is satire and social commentary, it looks like it's taking itself dead serious. Anyway, love your videos man.

[@ChrisHoltDC]

@@billwithers7457 I was thinking the same thing. At the very least it was absurdist humor (I think it’s hilarious from the outset). Love your music btw.

[@maximillianosaben]

Oh hell yeah! This is Paul Verhoeven in all his pulpy glory!

[@JamesVSCinema]

Was epic!

[@bobmessier5215]

It was a social commentary about fascism, but it was fun and entertaining with great effects. Paul Verhoeven's films always have an underlyng socio-political message or commentary. It's in all his movies like "Robocop", "Total Recall", "Basic Instinct", Flesh + Blood", "Hollow Man" and even the cult favorite hated by critics "Showgirls". I enjoyed all of these films.

[@sherigrow6480]

Yes, Hollow Man. Working up the nerve to watch it again.

[@Taeerom]

It's not just a satire of fascism. It is using the satirical fascism to draw parallels to (and implicitly criticize) the fascistic elements of our own society.

[@pauledwards9493]

'They just found a legendary Pokemon and its pissed off' Dude, now that made me laugh!

[@cameron2506]

Me again. My uncle was the production designer for this also!

[@JamesVSCinema]

Dude that’s badass haha! He killed this!

[@jaym10918]

"I can't help but think there's a deeper social commentary happening" - The movie is a brilliant and often misunderstood satire of fascism.

[@nebulous6660]

is it tho?

[@spaz113z]

@@nebulous6660 Just watch the film

[@nebulous6660]

@@spaz113z seen it 500 times

[@MistaZULE]

@@nebulous6660 To answer your question: yes, it is a satire of fascism. Just watch the directo'rs commentary or read any interviews he's done for the film. He 100% intended to criticize and satirize a fascist utopia. You may think he missed the mark, but his intentions behind the movie are clear to anyone who knows what to look for.

[@nebulous6660]

@@MistaZULE The claim wasn't just that this was an intended satire of fascism. It's that it is a "brilliant" satire of fascism. Clearly the director intended it to be. I don't believe it is. There are funny moments in the film that satire fascism, but the story & it's society are not examples of fascism.

[@n4rf645]

"There has to be a deeper commentary there" You understood what literally no critic at the time realized. :D

[@visualartsbyjr2464]

I always liked this movie, first off the “dumb action” then later on for it commentary on nationalism, propaganda, fear baiting, media, and human arrogance. One would have to be willfully blind to not see that these tactics have utilized very recently around the world… from any side of the political spectrum.

[@nebulous6660]

Can you call it fear baiting when entire peaceful colonies & cities were being wiped out? Sounds like legitimate reason to take action.

[@visualartsbyjr2464]

@@nebulous6660 in the movie, Mormons defied the arachnid quarantine zone and set up a settlement. I’ll also suggest that the Federation was looking for a reason to escalate things… kind of like most governments we currently have.

[@nebulous6660]

But if the Federation was looking for escalation they wouldn’t have set up quarantine zones. Even though the Mormons defied the restrictions, they were still unarmed & the bugs were also colonizing the area so it wasn’t like the bugs’ natural habitat was being invaded. The bugs slaughtered unarmed people in cold blood without attempting to share or co-exist peacefully. They then went further to attack Earth which was the natural habitat of humans.

[@Yora21]

This movie goes very well together with Idiocracy.

[@Naatti922]

@@nebulous6660 Buenos Aires was a false-flag operation to justify the arachnid war. You've fallen for federation propaganda.

[@lotuswraith]

Yes, there was a deeper message intended when making this film. Verhoven's premise for this movie was "war makes fascists of us all," though there is some disagreement to how well he succeeded in that regard. This movie is based on the Heinlein novel "Starship Troopers" (which Verhoven famously didn't read before making the movie) and is a very different tone from the movie based on it. The premise of the book is that only people who are willing to take personal responsibility for the government should have any voice in it and Heinlein goes out of his way to show that everyone who joins the Mobile Infantry (or any Federal Service) is there by choice. Also, technically speaking the humans started the war: a group of colonists decided to settle on a Bug planet despite being warned by the government not to, and the Bugs in their hive mindset viewed this as an invasion by humanity and retaliated with the asteroid strike. In the book, the Federation is involved in multiple conflicts over the course of the movie with several different alien races of which the Bugs are only one. To state my own biases: I am a fan of both the book and the movie and believe both have merit in their opinions, though reality is rarely so simple.

[@ChrisHoltDC]

Interesting. Those are some key omissions. I always knew it was a social commentary, but I never could quite pinpoint exactly what. I watched it multiple times, but like 20 years ago. I might need to revisit.

[@nebulous6660]

I think it's highly debatable if humans were to blame for the war. Like you said, the Federation had set up quarantine zones. The movie points out that the bugs were not indigenous to the planet the Mormon colonists chose to settle on, & it shows that their small colony was unarmed. So the bugs could have co-existed with them but instead chose to slaughter them. Then, instead of just leaving it there after the slaughter, the bugs took it a step further and started attacking Earth & committing mass genocide against humans on their home planet.

[@jimtatro6550]

This movie is a great satire about fascism. Paul Verhoeven was so great back in the day. Btw, the buddy is Jake Busey, son of Gary Busey

[@JamesVSCinema]

Clever filmmaking!

[@Philernator]

My childhood was comprised of this film, and Sesame Street.

[@JamesVSCinema]

The duality of childhood honestly haha

[@baskervillebee6097]

13th Warrior Superb cinematography Superb cast Superb soundtrack Superb battle scenes Superb adventure Bet you don't watch it just once.

[@rawl93]

Lo there do i see the line of my people. Back to the beginning. Fuck yes he should watch it

[@BloodSportA2]

James' every reaction to Carmen is a mood

[@MyNameIsBucket]

When this movie came out, the satire didn't resonate with anyone. It was just another dumb action movie. 20 years later, the backdrop to this whole story is downright horrifying.

[@voodoolilium]

I wouldn't say not with anyone, but definitely not with general audiences. I loved this movie when it came out haha

[@elenavorobeva6747]

This is not entirely true. I watched it in 1997 and realized what this film was about in the first 5 minutes, maybe because Paul Verhoeven is one of his favorite directors and it was obvious that he uses the style of Leni Riefenstahl

[@zonastarwars4397]

I think you meant to say "It took 20 years for the Americans to get the film"

[@fryke]

Yep, "general audience" must be amended with "US" as far as my social group here in Switzerland was concerned back then. The fact it's satire is clear when you see the first propaganda clip, really.

[@ChrisHoltDC]

I can see that. I was 22 when it came out and my friends and I thought it was hilarious. It was so absurd to not be some sort of satire. Unfortunately a lot of people don’t get that kind of nuance. To be fair, at 22 I’m not sure I could have said exactly WHAT was being satired. If you want something more obvious think Team America World Police.

[@justinpeck6015]

The Animated Series is pretty good to. Roughnecks: Starship Troopers

[@Teeklin]

This film was Verhoeven's attempt at displaying the downfalls of fascism. He shot it in the style of the old "Why We Fight" World War 2 propaganda videos. Their entire society is fascist and the swing he was taking here was to show the protagonists and their society in the positive light they attempt to shed on it, while at the same time letting us as the audience see just how fucked up their society (and by extension, fascism) is. It isn't a brilliant film but it's one of the best critiques on fascism we've had in this medium and it's enjoyable enough to watch a few times for sure. Thanks for the great content, keep it coming man!

[@jimglenn6972]

It seems like nobody talks about the author of the book. Robert Heimlien was a famous science fiction author in the late 40’s and 50’s. Many of his novels were about the far future but this is about earth at war. A lot of the campy features are RH versions of America after the war. It really is about a commentary about war, society, youth and lots more!

[@nitrokid]

I haven't read the book, although as a fan of military scifi works, I should rectify that right away XD Anyway, yeah. I heard some good things and 'bad' things about the book. How the book glorified war and military power and how the readers felt that R.H was just projecting his views etcetera, etcetera. Also some feel that the society in the book was fascist, hence R.H also branded fascist. LOL. Although the book has some elements that the film don't. Like how the Arachnids are actually technologically advanced, and there are another alien race joining the fight. Btw, the animated series also worth to look. It's called Roughnecks: Starship Troopers Chronicles. It's basically a fusion between the movie and elements from the book. And it's pretty good.

[@youngrutiger5343]

@@nitrokid I don't like the book's politics but it's a decent read.

[@rumblebars]

I like that this movie took the original book and made a Satire out of it. Back in the mid 1960s, Harry Harrison wrote a book that was his satirical "answer" to Heinlein's story... (Bill, The Galactic Hero) which I rather liked. Harry thought Heinlein celebrated the military mentality too much, which he personally detested. So he expended a lot of effort on writing his take on it, which he then had some trouble getting published. I'm not sure if a proper movie version will ever get made of it. A zero-budget student movie was made of it at one point, I doubt it will ever get anything more than that, so Verhoeven's Satire will have to stand in its place. (I doubt that Verhoeven was even aware of Harrison's book)

[@youngrutiger5343]

@@rumblebars cool, I think the book is interesting but it promotes that a somewhat authoritarianism Gov is good. I will have look up the book you mentioned.

[@RhodokTribesman]

@@youngrutiger5343 The military sections were exciting and written well (while being grounded) but the chapters where he literally puts the reader in a classroom to preach fascism not so much haha

[@HobGungan]

I am ashamed to admit that I didn't realize who the *real* villains were until Doogie Howser SS triumphantly announced the Brain Bug was afraid and was met with cheers. In fairness I was only 12 when this came to HBO and was still averting my gaze at heavily adult things.

[@nebulous6660]

Why would that make them the villains? If the bug is afraid it indicates it’s defeated. That’s a good thing. That doesn’t make them evil for cheering.

[@jujinkaisparrow3157]

Yeah, as others have said below, director did RoboCop and Total Recall (Original) and he has a way with satirical social commentary. This is based of the book call the same name Starship Troopers, check it, much better than the movie (most are) and is not a long read...it's a si-fi classic. Love the movie though when it came out and still watch it from time to time as well as the aforementioned movies mentioned above.

[@AAA__]

Please react to The Crow if you haven't already seen it.

[@WolfHreda]

Yes!

[@crackajacka87]

Heinlein, the writer of the book the movie is based on, was a political activist who felt that society was weakening under it's current stucture and so created a new system which he highlights in his stories to pass the idea on to younger generations and it's based on the old Roman democracies where certain types of people could vote called citizens and made it more liberal in that anyone could become a citizen if they worked hard for it because he believed something given would be abused while something earned would be better respected and Heinlein believed that this would make society better as it was built by the people who cared about the state but if you didn't want to chase up that privilege to vote then you could carry on being a civilian with no drawbacks other than not having the right to vote. The problem with Verhovoen's version is that he mistook the nationalistic and militaristic views in the book as fascism when that is not true, for one, fascism is run by a dictorship while in Starship Troopers, it does have a limited democracy so straight off the bat, this isn't fascism but the biggest clue is that the story is about individualism vs collectivism as he had a huge issue with collective ideologies like socialism and communism and as fascism is based off of socialism (the Nazi party were literal called the National Socialist German Workers Party), he saw a huge threat to western societies who prided themselves as liberal and free and that's essentially what the story is meant to be about but Verhovoen blurs the line and tries to make it seem like it's a fascist society, even though it's not.

[@josefgordon7712]

You can find 1,000 movies made after this with effects that look 10 years older. Holds up so well. Great tight script, great music, overflowing with amazing world building and attention to detail.

[@JamesVSCinema]

Super good CGI

[@carsilk2492]

Most of us have had a Carmen in our lives, but the lucky ones found themselves a Diz.

[@raymontes1030]

Brutiful: Adjective. Elegant, awe-inspiring displays of extreme violence.

[@JamesVSCinema]

Ultra Violence! 🍊

[@andrewcharles459]

Sort of describes Sam Peckinpah's "Cross of Iron".

[@goldenager59]

@@andrewcharles459 Not only Cross of Iron, but much of Peckinpah's entire output as well, from what I gather. 🙄 😕

[@LobsterSpecial]

I absolutely think there is a commentary going on here, above and beyond the basic story, and that's before pointing out it was directed by the guy who directed films like RoboCop, Total Recall, and Basic Instinct. I think it's intended to look superficial on the surface, a bunch of attractive young people fighting the enemies of humanity, monstrous space bugs. But we also have the interspaced propaganda videos that portray the bugs as the equivalent of cockroaches, while we are shown that they are actually rather advanced, and it's at least suggested that it is the humans who are invading the bug's space, as opposed to the standard opposite (we only see or hear of humans attacking bugs worlds; the only attack by the bugs is done from their home planet). We are told in the political science lesson at the beginning that only those who've served in the military have full citizenship rights and that military service is a high ideal, but we are shown that the soldiers are thrown into a meat grinder time and time again with the cost in lives just kind of glossed over. I don't think it's an accident that the military uniforms look vaguely Nazi-ish.

[@antarfodoh]

Naw, you totally nailed it! This was a totally self aware satire commentary. It was relatively poorly received because few understood how intentional everything was. I loved it in theaters both times, and still do the "I've-lost-count" times I've seen it since!

[@michaellevandoski5358]

“A combination of Saving Private Ryan and A Bug’s Life” Genius

[@robertbick986]

"The bugs can warp asteroids to other solar systems." Can they, though? During the entire movie we never see evidence of the bugs invading a planet, only humans going to planets where the bugs are. An asteroid thrown by bugs would take probably millions of years to reach earth, and it would probably miss. I think humans did it and blamed the bugs.

[@yodieyuh]

Humans would take just as long to get to Klendathu, but you're okay with that. We see them on multiple planets. They got to those planets on their own. Klendathu, Dantana, Planet P, and Tango Urilla. We see Carmen and crew trace a meteor, in real time, from their location to it's origin in Klendathu space, and we see them calculate it's trajectory into Earth space. They want to send a warning to earth but comms got knocked out. We see bugs that evolved to shoot massive plasma bursts up into space and out of orbit. We see a bug specifically keep humans alive to drink their brains, after we accept that humans can be psychics.

[@CatapultGaming]

Hey.......it was never the bugs ;)

[@robertbick986]

@@yodieyuh humans flying spaceships that may or may not be capable of faster than light travel. A rock is just a rock, it’s restricted to subluminal velocities. No explanation is ever given of the bugs capabilities for travel, the movie is itself propaganda and in a meta sense we are meant to question the truth of things states as fact by the in-world media.

[@Mansplainer2099-jy8ps]

@@yodieyuh _"We see Carmen and crew trace a meteor, in real time, from their location to it's origin in Klendathu space, and we see them calculate it's trajectory into Earth space. They want to send a warning to earth but comms got knocked out."_ It would take a meteor a couple trillion years to get from the Klendathu system to the Sol system so please explain that sentence you just said. _"after we accept that humans can be psychics."_ Well, if we believe Neil Patrick Harris' character really is psychic.

[@yodieyuh]

​@@robertbick986 " No explanation is ever given of the bugs capabilities for travel," The opening scenes describe bugs using plasma to move rocks across interstellar distances. We see bugs blast huge plasma balls into space. We see a meteor come from bug space. The film never hints we were lied to.

[@CorgyOntoppya]

Whenever this movie comes on I yell "Medic!" at every gruesome death.

[@xavvi]

In Nazi Germany they used to use propaganda to compare Jews to insects. Verhoeven grew up in the Hague while occupied by Nazi forces and his fear and absolute loathing of fascism is only equaled by his understanding of just how insanely persuasive it can be. NPH literally walks in dressed in SS garb. They attack and dehumanize their enemy. You watch this movie having a blast and almost never realizing until it's too late that you've been cheering on Nazis. That's his point.

[@NoActuallyGo-KCUF-Yourself]

I loved that feeling when I first saw it, half-way through . . . "oh... the Earthlings are the villains."

[@ronbock8291]

It 100%is a satire on Fascism and colonialism. Verhoeven was explicit about it. You were picking up the subtext with… why are we attacking these creatures on their own planet? Well, because we’re imperialistic assholes is why.

[@nebulous6660]

Nah, in the movie the bugs start committing mass genocide on Earth before the humans respond by invading the bugs' home planet. The bugs are also depicted as an aggressive colonizing species. They're not just minding their own business & wanting to live in peace. As soon as the bugs colonize a planet & encounter some peaceful colonists, they slaughter them in cold blood. The Federation was actually wanting people to steer clear of bug occupied territories.

[@ronbock8291]

@@nebulous6660 Mormons colonize a bug planet first. There’s no mention of bugs colonizing the planet after the mormons got there.

[@UberNoodle]

The great thing about this film which a lot of people at the time misunderstood was that it was made as a propaganda film from a future f*scist society, i.e. it's an artefact from the future. If you compare the style and the plot to those kinds of films, you'll see many similarities, e.g. the cheesy melodrama, the over-the-top p*triotism and n*tionalism, the deus ex machina, the plot that sometimes defies reason. Even the rationale for the war is a massive logical leap that is nigh impossible -- Light years away from Earth, an asteroid was dislodged and sent on a trajectory to Earth in an attempt to attack it? That doesn't make any sense. That's like a pocket shot in interstellar billiards by a race of aliens that don't even have interstellar travel let alone the ability to know that humans exist. But it's just the kind of rationale that a human society as in the film would generate to justify and perpetuate a war against an external and literally alien enemy.

[@rustyforceps1012]

Michael Ironside is one of my favorite character actors ever!! He can play a hero or a villain. Plus his name is awesome.

[@PeterEvansPeteTakesPictures]

Ahh, the glorious Starship Troopers, a hugely entertaining sci-fi satire that unifies and brings harmony to audiences both left and right with the one thing everyone can agree on: Carmen is just the worst. Team Diz!

[@mejftw]

11:42 aight startin to see the street fighter references

[@chaost4544]

Thinking the bugs were dumb the entire time is how American generals, politicians, etc. thought about the North Vietnamese and the Vietcong in the 60's.

[@Miss.6ixEdits]

and these days it's how much they underestimated the Taliban in Afghanistan.

[@WolfHreda]

@@Miss.6ixEdits exactly.

[@JGfromSpace.]

This movie is actually genius. It’s like hyper satire. It’s a film MADE by the fascist society it’s depicting. Told from their skewed point of view. The camp and corniness is intentional.

[@GKinslayer]

Hey James - considering the artistry used in making the film and the quality of the gore - I think brutiful is a totally apt term to use. Also hoping you do more Kuraswa soon, I bet you will love Yojimbo and or Seven Samuari.

[@JamesVSCinema]

Hahaha glad to hear!! And stay tuned my friend!

[@Damiana_Dimock]

I highly recommend checking out the Chapo Trap House post-screening panel about this film, (it’s somewhere on KZbin.) Bruh, if you’re really not sure if there’s commentary happening in the film go back and take a real close look at NPH’s uniform. lol.

[@Bryan_Master_Blaster]

The movie is somewhat entertaining. However, the book Starship Troopers and the film "adaptation" have absolutely nothing to do with each other. The book is fantastic.

[@zionthedon7745]

This movie has TWO huge cult followings. The people who took it at face value, and the people who understood the underlying commentary. If you watch Honest Trailer Commentaries: Starship Troopers, not only do they talk a lot about it, but the after who played Rico makes an appearance too.

[@andrewhussey4538]

The commentary is so odd too because for any if you who've read the books it's virtually the exact opposite...it was definitely intentional because the book is very much pro-military, pro-corporal punishment and so on, verboten basically took the general plot, made it movie worthy (because the book is a little dry, it's mostly just philosophical discourse like you saw in the class at the beginning) but then made it almost a total pulp flip side to convey the opposite message. Also, that scene in the shower where they're all naked? Apparently Verhoven got naked to film it so everyone else was...uh...comfortable I guess?

[@nebulous6660]

Interesting point. IMO despite Verhoeven's intentions, this movie never really made a solid case against the military & didn't really depict fascism in the way most fans claim.

[@TTTzzzz]

Paul Verhoeven is a moralist filmmaker. Everything in this movie was done on purpose. The clean cut actors (former tv stars), the 'soapy' human drama, ultimate gore and violence. Verhoeven enjoys confronting his audiences.

[@danieldunlap4077]

The book this movie was based on is a masterpiece of Science Fiction and political commentary. Robert Heinlein was a genius.

[@toschememestation1031]

Yes and no His ability to imagine the future was definitely amazing But he also was a child/product of his time His vision of a militarized society, is quite outdated today, even more than it was in 1997 The movie has a great way to portray that, and even make fun, of some of his more outdated idears, but still explains what Heinlein was trying to say Showing all aspects of his ideology is what make this movie a Classic

[@SantiAgo-eg5to]

@@toschememestation1031 Heinlein wasn't an ideologue.

[@toschememestation1031]

@@SantiAgo-eg5to during coldwar he was, like many ppl was back than

[@huemungy3212]

@@toschememestation1031 he doesn't depict a militarized society he depicts a liberal society with restricted suffrage. The story is following a soldier in a war.

[@toschememestation1031]

@@huemungy3212 not saying that the society he was imagine, is not a liberal one But a society can be liberal and militarized at the same time. I think he was trying to say That you have to be willing to get militarized, in order to protect the liberty of yr society Which is at least questionable

[@algi1]

To be fair, it's very hard to decipher satire when it's so close to the real thing, I hated this the 1st two time I watched and understood it only the 3rd time. Compare this film to 300, which is also a campy, gory propaganda genre film, but lacks the satirical elements of Starship Troopers and is played straight pro-Sparta, anti-Persia without criticizing the militaristic society. I enjoy both of them, but this one I agree with.

[@Caseytify]

This movie is piece of garbage. Verhoven took a serious military/SF novel and turned it into "Bug Wars," while portraying a fascistic society that didn't exist in the novel. You could even say the movie was a bad parody of the novel, drawn poorly in crayon. The only think this monstrosity has in common with the novel is the title and some of the names. The original novel, by the way, is still on the recommended reading lists for many military academies.

[@MsMelyjean]

I keep getting reminded how insightful and hilarious James is.

[@krbkrbkrbkrbkrb]

If this movie had been intended to be a surface level humans vs bugs adventure flick then the "mobile infantry" would have been what they had in the book: mech suits. They were 'mobile' infantry because they cold run fast and had jump jets for limited flight. It would have been something more like Pacific Rim but with *armies* of mechs fighting *armies* of kaijus. Instead they gave us a bunch of half-wits running around in rubber body armor who just stand there blasting away with rifles. Despite all the talk about "brainless bugs" it is clear that this version of human society is like a fascist version of Idiocracy.

[@coyotefire69420]

If you like sci fi just wait for the new DUUUUUUUUUNE! Im pumped

[@JamesVSCinema]

I’m pumped!

[@KevinLyda]

The novel it's based on is probably Heinlein's most influential work. Even at the time the militarism and proto-fascist society it seemed to glorify was criticized. His views on humanity generally... well, not a world I'd want to live in. The director turned it into a fascist parody - taking the original text and using it to criticize exactly what it seemed to support. Which was a brilliant way to reinterpret an anti-social work. Something that should be done more often. But I think you're right. It didn't fully get there. I think with the context the message gets there but it doesn't stand on its own.

[@batbrick3949]

When I first saw this in 1997, I hated it. Starship Troopers had been one of my favorite sci fi novels since childhood, and had been one of my father’s favorites, as well. I initially felt like the movie was mocking the book, and mocking the military itself. Over the years, I’ve come to see it as mocking military propaganda and the propaganda-like war films of the past. I still don’t particularly like the movie, but I’ve made peace with it.

[@spacedinosaur8733]

I enjoy the action aspect & laugh at the propaganda shorts, just like the commercials in Robocop, but you are right, definitely missed the mark of the book.

[@chago4202000]

It sounds like you really want to read the book, Starship Troopers, if you want the deeper meaning. It's short and it's free to listen on KZbin. The humans are actually fighting two different aliens at once. They all have power armor and good weapons, not the crap they have in the movie. Different people die. They also explain things like why the soldier they first met didn't have any legs. That wasn't by accident. They explain how humanity got to where it is in the movie, what citizenship means to them...it goes much deeper.

[@tiredoffools8929]

"He's the coolest person" Exactly my thoughts when I was watching this the first time as well. :)

[@richard_n]

The Starship Troopers movie is a pure popcorn movie, it's purely for entertainment. They try to make social commentary, but it's horrible. Which is tragic considering the book it's based on is (IMHO) one of the ten best books ever written. It has amazing social commentary. The only thing the movie and the book have in common is humanity fighting insects and the names of the characters. Everything else is totally different. This is the movie that needs a reboot that is true to the source material.

[@kylelewis4685]

This is a cult classic that is just as fun to watch now as it was when it came out. If you don't take it too seriously and just enjoy the ride, it is priceless

[@douglascampbell9809]

Do yourself a favor and read the book. It's completely different and a solid piece of science fiction. While I like the movie I feel it was a lost opportunity to put out something more like the source material which would have been bugs versus something like small Gundam units.

[@DecSteele]

Loved when they’re all in the compound with the epic music playing 😂 they really need to make a game on this

[@josefgordon7712]

Yeah, that would be pretty damn fun I think. Time to start pointlessly conceptualizing in my head for the next month, thanks.

[@Scallycowell]

It actually was a game when it was released and it unfortunately wasn’t that good. However the films score, composed by Basil Poledouris who also scored Robocop, is nothing short of amazing. It is very similar to, and I suspect this to be on purpose, to the opening movement of Gustav Holt’s symphony ‘The Planets’ entitled ‘Mars: The Bringer of War’.

[@WayStedYou]

They did make a game of this

[@zr00t]

My wife and I wrap the kids chrismas presents the night before christmas. We'll drink a bottle of wine, watch Starship Troopers and wrap presents until the wee hours of the morning. This has been our holiday tradition for over a decade. We absolutely love this movie.

[@davidlee4903]

"Do you want to live forever?!?" EDIT: Empathy for the captured Brain Bug is the intended effect. Showing a mortal enemy forced into submission as a test subject is a representation of innate cruelty and total apathy. The Bugs fought as the Citizens fought: In defense of their people, of their homes.

[@voodoolilium]

That quote is based on a real quote from a US Marine haha. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Daly#%22Do_you_want_to_live_forever?%22_quote

[@davidlee4903]

@@voodoolilium Wow, That's awesome.

[@goldenager59]

The Bugs' mindset is so different from ours that peace may never be practicable. We haven't been told anything about the time humans first encountered the Bugs or of any attempts to communicate thereafter (perhaps there were a number of such efforts, all of which the Bugs never even acknowledged). Perhaps the Bugs have well and truly earned our hate and apathy. Even so, I do feel for the Brain Bug in its captivity. ☹️ 😕 🙂

[@maskedman1337]

I saw this on opening day in 1997! It took the audience maybe 45 minutes to get into it, but by the end, everyone was hooting and hollering and having a great time.

[@alwayswrite2011]

The similarities between this and the book by Robert A Heinlein: Some of the names are the same. I can't recommend the book enough. This relatively short, and has a far deeper sociopolitical commentary. Mind you, I still love this movie because it's wild, silly fun. And about helping out... Gotta confess, James, your reactions have been helping me get through some stuff. Recovering from a foot amputation, being alone during the pandemic isolation, and various miscellany with all of that. Watching you react to some of my favorites, like this one, is a lot of fun. Oh... and since I can't afford to join Patreon and the like, I'm going to request once again that you watch "Superman: The Movie" from 1978. It was my ABSOLUTE FAVORITE when I was a kid... and how could it NOT be with a tagline, "You will believe a man can fly."

[@TheOli4D]

The movie is obviously a satire. A comment on the propaganda of militaristic cultures and countries like the US for example. Legend has it that this film in this form of a military propaganda satire was only possible because Sony as the producing studio was in quite a turmoil at that time and they kinda missed on the social commentary of the film and it got approved. Something that usually does not happen with big production. Usually big production studios try to show the military in a heroic way or at least in a neutral way. Certainly not as a satire.

[@likecrazyhorse]

Yes! So many people misunderstood this movie when it came out. Enjoy!

[@JamesVSCinema]

Thanks!!

[@floydster23]

No-one misunderstood this movie when it came out. The satire is laid on thick, and it's the same audience who grew up watching Robocop. It's the later generation that didn't see the pseudo nazi uniforms, the insane nationalism & xenophobia.

[@likecrazyhorse]

@@floydster23 Right on, dude, thanks a bunch for that insight. I'll be sure to go back and change my experience once they invent time travel.

[@floydster23]

@@likecrazyhorse Who needs time travel when your experience is based on a narrative from the last ten years, instead of it being from sitting in a theatre in 1998.

[@n1ghtofthedead411]

Hey, thanks for this, cool reaction! Can you please react to The Prestige by Nolan and Body of Lies by Ridley Scott too, if you haven't seen them.

[@nebulous6660]

Many fans worship this movie as a "brilliant satire of fascism". I'm in the process of making a video that challenges that notion. Most of the arguments people make are either unsupported by the film or just completely made up. I still love the movie & see it more as a coming-of-age tale where naive kids get a crash course in personal sacrifice & responsibility...the kind of stuff many geeks love to label "fascist".

[@Chaosm03]

Neil Patrick Harris shows up in an almost one for one recreation of a Nazi SS officer uniform at the end. Then everyone cheers the fact that instilling fear in the enemy is a good thing. How is this not a satire?

[@nebulous6660]

@@Chaosm03 Sensing that the brain bug was afraid indicated that it was defeated. Cheering for that is perfectly normal & not satirical. The bug had just finished brutally murdering prisoners of war, it didn't deserve any sympathy. The uniforms are not a brilliant satire of fascism simply because they're fashioned after SS uniforms, you have to look at what the people in the uniforms are actually doing.

[@Chaosm03]

At one point they are celebrating while someone is fiddling Dixie. At every point all the people refuse to acknowledge the bug's intelligence and ability to reason in anyway that doesn't pertain to their capacity to kill. It's a metaphor for dehumanizing the enemy. Maybe you could make a case that it's not necessarily a sole satire of fascism alone. But, it's heavily as well a satire of military fanaticism. The film offers a look at what a war propaganda film made in a society of fascists would look like. Hiw would they see themselves as the heroes, how do they justify themselves. Everything is there in the subtext as well as the news cut ins.

[@nebulous6660]

@@Chaosm03 Actually when the movie starts, the kids are admonished by their instructors for belittling the bugs & are taught that the bugs are superior to humans in many ways. Yes, at first the military leaders underestimate the intelligence of the bug leadership but when they lose the first battle they acknowledge that mistake & move to try & understand them more. While I agree the propaganda films are meant to be funny & over-the-top like when they're giving bullets to children, you can't fault them for being positive & viewing themselves as the heroes. Every society justifies itself & paints it's warriors as heroes. That's not inherently a bad thing or a fascist thing. Also it's important to point out that the media doesn't hide the horrific losses of war, they are surprisingly honest about the military defeats. You'd think Verhoeven would show the media painting a different narrative than what was happening on the ground, but he doesn't.

[@Chaosm03]

His teacher also gives a big speech on how military might solves every world problem. There's also the fact that the military regulates things so much you can't have reproductive rights unless you serve. There's tons of subtext.

[@okradiohead7430]

Definitely a satire on propaganda, nationalism, xenophobia, etc. Definitely agree it could have gone deeper, but it's fun

[@Ken-ij4ry]

The book kind of unironically lays out this fascist society, so Verhoeven decided to lean all the way into it and go full satire. Too few people picked up on it at the time

[@josefgordon7712]

Not really

[@andrewcharles459]

After watching the movie I had to re-read the book just to be sure it wasn't always a satire and I just didn't notice.

[@zynius]

There's not much fascist about the society in the book though. I'd describe it as a benevolent technocracy. The book after all makes it clear that protesting or being critical of the government is completely acceptable, free speech is absolute, and that no one is silenced or oppressed. Plus all the issues that the USA currently has (compared to Europe) has been completely eliminated world wide.

[@redspecial4102]

I like how the obvious Nazi style uniforms just fly over most people's heads. MEDIIIIC! 🤣

[@EricPalmerBlog]

The book is outstanding. The movie is pure garbage. Anyway thanks for sharing. Keep up the good work.

[@rigger151]

Had they named this movie anything else I probably would have loved it when it came out. Instead I despised it. About the only thing the book and movie have in common is a couple of names. The book was one of my favorites in high school. I had been super excited to see it when it came out, then spent the entire movie trying to figure out if I was in the wrong place, because it certainly bore no resemblance to the book. I'm old enough now that I can love it for what it is.

[@MrBigPicture835]

I like this movie, but there is a vast difference between this film, and the original novel its supposedly based on. The director absolutely refused to read the original book.

[@chairmanofthebored6860]

This movie is secretly genius. Great social commentary, great critique on a neo fascist future where service to the government is the only way to have basic rights. The CG and practical effects still hold up so well. As someone who has seen war firsthand, they are a bit too real

[@7woundsfist]

Paul Verhoeven changed the tone of the original book into a satirical film about fascisim and the industrial military complex

[@pheerstringer]

Thanks for doing what you do. Yeah Michael Ironside is awesome. You are correct about seeing the totalitarian undertones in the movie. The director wanted to show how fascism could hide as patriotism.

[@SierraSierraFoxtrot]

Yes, he is the coolest person. Now you HAVE TO watch Michael Ironside in "Scanners".

[@odin741]

Robert Heinlein wrote the book decades earlier and is way better than the movie- unfortunately Ibanez is still equally annoying in it lol.

[@GuarmaRummy]

Hey James, you should add Sunshine to your list. Danny Boyle. Great sci-fi/ horror!

[@baronfriday989]

Paul Verhoeven admitted that he did not read the book before making the film. Definitely read the book if you have the time.

[@AlexanderForsman]

You should watch Ender's game, it's similar to this, but on the more serious side of the spectrum.