Ares at War, in a caravan - Space Engineers Coop Survival with BlackShadow

We're on a caravan holiday from hell, dropped onto lezuno in a caravan with no plan, no suits and even less sense of direction. Can we make any sort of impact on the Ares system of planets?
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[@KaedysKor]

That tail wagging on the trailer is a thing that happens IRL too. It happens when you have too much weight on the _rear_ of the trailer. Trailers drive _much_ better when their center of mass is forwards of their axle, so that the majority of the weight is split between the hitch and the axle (basically, if you draw a triangle between the hitch and the wheels, you want as much of your mass inside that triangle as possible, and as low inside as possible). That's also why you saw a _lot_ of it at the very start, when you put the medium and large cargo containers hanging off the back of the caravan without wheels on them yet, it shifted the caravan's center of mass _way_ behind the axle. Incidentally, I've had that tail wag happen IRL to the point where it almost throws me off the road (at freeway speeds, no less), when I've had a trailer loaded too heavily towards the rear.

[@Pystro]

This matches with how I assumed the problem needs to be fixed: Move the axles on the trailer(s) backwards (instead of putting all wheels in line). Or just limit the speed of the wheels to below where the speed wobbles happen, that way you can just stay on the accelerator without worrying about it.

[@KaedysKor]

@@PystroYou can also apply a slight amount of braking to the trailer wheels to remove any wobble currently going on. Trucks do this IRL using trailer brakes, which are recommended even for domestic towing (ex. UHaul trailers, pop-up campers, boat trailers) once the trailer weight exceeds a certain level, because it's the _most_ reliable way to remove that waggle at high speeds (as slowing down once you have waggle usually makes the waggle worse, since the towing vehicle is the one slowing, so it's pushing backwards through the hitch to the trailer and making wobbling accelerate). Not sure how you'd do that in SE, though. Maybe put just those wheels in a group, set the parking brake for them on your bar, and set their braking force at a much lower level, so when you turn on the parking brake on them, it just applies a small amount of braking force specifically to the trailer).

[@Pystro]

*Warning. This is a complete and thus slightly lengthy explanation:* There's in fact 2 factors to trailer stability: The 1st I would call "static vertical loads" and the 2nd "dynamic sideways loads". *Static vertical loads* is the factor that most people think about first. The further back the wheels on your second segment (the first trailer behind the towing vehicle) is, the more weight is on the back wheels of the tow vehicle. The tow vehicle is the one dictating the turning (since it has two axles), so less weight on it's wheels gives you less turning stability. (And putting more weight on its rear axle increases the resilience to sliding out, as long as you're not lifting your front wheels off the ground.) This factor *alternates with each segment,* though! On the 3rd segment (2nd trailer), having the wheels further forwards lifts the rear of the first trailer, which pushes down on the rear of the tow vehicle. The effect usually diminishes along the line of trailers, though (especially through trailers that have their wheels far backwards). The way dynamic sideways loads affect the trailer also depends on where the axle is in relation to the center of mass of the trailer. If the axle is directly under the center of mass, then sideways forces on the wheels can't exert any rotational moment onto the trailer (at least not any moment around the yaw axis). Thus, the _wheels_ will only shift the trailer sideways, while the moment that straightens it out has to come from the _trailer hitch._ The counter-force of this force that straightens the trailer out will in turn push the back of the tow vehicle (or whatever segment the trailer is attached to) _out_ of alignment. If instead the wheels are behind the center of mass, then sideways forces on the trailer wheels will (help) rotate the trailer into alignment. The further back the wheels are the more this obviously stabilizes that trailer. With the wheels of a trailer in front of its center of mass, the wheels will actually rotate the trailer _further_ out of alignment when it happens to be out of alignment (which is even worse than having the wheels under the center of mass). This factor *does not alternate with each segment*. Firstly, because it's bad if any segment is being pushed out of alignment, not just the tow vehicle. And secondly, these forces don't reach the tow vehicle instantaneously. They travel through the chain at a certain speed and usually get amplified along the way (unless all trailers help with the stabilization). *Summary:* On the *2nd, 4th, and all further segments,* you'll definitely want the wheels *as far back as possible.* On the *3rd segment* (2nd trailer after the tow vehicle) it's not as clear cut, but I'd bet that having the wheels as far back as possible is the way to go as well. And having as *long a wheelbase* as possible on the *1st segment* (the tow vehicle) can't hurt either. Case in point: Before the 4:00:00-ish rebuild, your arrangement started tailwagging at 27m/s and only stopped when under 20m/s, while after 4:14:10, you were doing 40m/s and doing hard turns without problems.

[@nvfury13]

Yep, always treat tri-point trailers (two wheels and a hitch) as a tripod, center the weight. Another reason four wheel trailers are better, though they have a much wider turn requirement as they don’t have the swing tri-points do.

[@leandermutsaers]

Shadow has PTSD, Post Traumatic Splitsie Disorder

[@SuperDriver379]

This needs to be on Splitsie Merch. Capac needs a shirt in reverse for face cam.

[@hatetrump3425]

good one ;D

[@Vessekx]

@Splitsie, to be fair, you *should* leave Capac as an option on the ‘who will die next’ poll for this theory. After all, *snything* is possible where Capac is involved, even if he isn’t involved.

[@StrangeQuarkShipwerks]

The Cosmological Capac was originally set to zero, but was modified in the mid-eighties to compensate for an unexplained increase in the entropy of the universe. This led to the addition of a second C in the ΛCDM model.

[@skipper2285]

This makes me think of a Space Legos build with a cat on the table randomly swatting your project.

[@DifinityRelin]

Splitsie drilled Shadow... Bow Chicka Bow-Wow...!

[@TheClaw47]

Around 2:13:00 when Splitsie is disconnecting the wind turbine frame my first thought was "Aww, he didn't squish Shadow." I was pleasantly surprised that I was wrong.

[@WhatTrigger]

lol, he straight up went cold hearted murder mode.

[@themini_b]

Not me watching Splitsie redesigning the camper with all the weight at the back of the trailer knowing the fishtailing will persist. 😂😂😂

[@themini_b]

Think about your trailer like a lever arm and thr hitch is the fulcrum. The further the weight is from the fulcrum the more effect will have on the lever. Put your weight near the fulcrum and the lever will barely move. Not exactly analogous but it gets thr point across.

[@csorgb05]

I watched a video that showed that in a future update there will be wheels that don't stick out as far. They showed a 2 person car that was only 4 squares wide!. I can't wait to see what you create.

[@Ackemaa]

Trailer wobble is from negative tongue weight on the front caravan hitch. It's exacerbated by the rear trailer having too much tongue weight, which tips the caravan even more backwards. But the wobble doesn't actually come from the rear trailer

[@incendiarypoprocks8700]

Knowing that splitsie’s also a Tom Scott viewer makes a lot of sense :) he’s a lot of fun to learn from

[@Flipsie]

So true, he's great at telling stories 🙂

[@KaedysKor]

Splitsie, reminder that the Improvised Engineering mod includes a _precision_ grinding mode. Right Click and hold while looking at a block -> left click to grind, you'll grind ONLY that block. It makes high-tier grinders no longer super dangerous. Edit: actually, it may be the mod that adds the weld pads, not sure if you have that one this series (though imo it's like Build Vision, should just be a default addition to _every_ game, super useful). Edit 2: derp, you definitely have that mod, since it's also the one that adds detach grinding.

[@thegreatnull6270]

Hills, highly imbalanced trailers, and snaking maneuvers do not mix well, Splitsie! XD Looking forward to another great series from you, and glad to see Shadow joining you once more for the shenanigans!

[@nvfury13]

55:33 Well, guess the “Who dies first?” got an answer… This also is more proof for my theory: Splitsie needs Capac around, because when there is no Capac, Splitsie becomes the Capac.

[@Flipsie]

Lol 🤣

[@Memlapse]

Need to have Shadow and Nab playing a game together. The potential for adorable overload would be amazing!

[@0bigsteve69]

i think the fish tailing was due to the fact that there wasn't enough weight on the rear drive wheels of the rover, it happens in real life when the towed vehicle is not balanced correctly.

[@mej6519]

old klang has still got a few tricks up his sleeve i see, i mean who'd thought a deity of his age could double kick flip a combined rover and rv unit and land it, seems that you can teach old deitys new tricks.

[@arctichowler8487]

bit of advice, if it starts fishtailing at all, keep wheels straight, stop acceleration, DO NOT touch the brakes, trailers will align naturally, if you're on a downward slope, same thing, up hill wont happen but WILL slow you down to a crawl if you don't accelerate if not stop you outright if you try to naturally align... the biggest thing is to fight your urge to overcompensate(or try to fight it at all really)

[@millenniumtree]

I've been waiting for you to do a no suit survival. I watched all of MadMavn's No Suit Survival series, WITH lightning damage. What an epic series!

[@gum__]

Part of me wishes chat didn't point out the offset wheel, which took you waaaay too long to notice 😂 Also yes to more plate-up! Initially found it a bit slow going, but later really enjoyed the bunch of you all playing it. Very cozy vibes.

[@Flipsie]

PlateUp will likely be a one-off (with more coming when Capac and I are at PAX) as Icarus' new map releases the following week :)

[@MMuraseofSandvich]

34:00 "Odyssey, this is Houston, go ahead and give your oxygen tanks a stir..." Man, I remember w4sted doing this to a _large_ grid rotor, and let's just say the results were spectacular.

[@Flipsie]

You mean like the several times he/I did it in wrong way down? :D

[@MMuraseofSandvich]

​@@FlipsieThat would be it! He even blew up the entire team after Capac said, "Hey, can you kill my clone?"

[@Eisen_Jaeger]

I need to try a no suit play one day when I feel like hitting myself in the head with a hammer. :P

[@Flipsie]

lol :D

[@Chronostra]

Watch what you wished, Eisen. Lest Splitsie drag you in a no suit session.

[@Eisen_Jaeger]

@@Chronostra nah, he knows he wouldn't get the reactions out of me the viewers have come to expect. :D

[@Chronostra]

@@Eisen_Jaeger whoa whoa whoa Splits I think Eisen just give you a challenge here lol

[@thulsadoon]

I see BlackShadow is channeling her inner Capac from the word Go.

[@EGOKitten7770]

that snake build is awesome. I'm surprise the rear hitch batteries stayed attached from that crash.

[@knutzzl]

3:26:00 (ish) you can put a wind turbine on top of the basicassembler and use a single small grid beam with a magplate on ether end, one locked to the ground and one locked to the basic assembler. then the game will recognize the grid with the turbine is static.

[@Vessekx]

Really, the decorative converter hatch covers should be a way to give access to ship storage through the covered port, without providing extra storage capacity.

[@alanevans4955]

When I come across a large wreck early in a salvage style save like you have at ~ #4:15:00, I like to put an assembler and basic refinery on it to use it's own power to break down everything into ingots because they take up considerably less space. If it doesn't have power I'll give it a few turbines on stalks and charge my rover while I'm there also.

[@grantlangdon7009]

This really was a lot of fun even for nearly 6 hours! Looking forward to more!

[@what4494]

Rvs at war, surprised thats not like a demo derby event here in america

[@martinwyke]

I know it is far too late now, but moving the wheels further back would avoid fishtailing.

[@csorgb05]

Rather than a trailer RV, why not a Bus style RV. That would give you stability and the ability to add things to a more stable platform. For power, how about a wind generator boom that can be raised and a landing gear to lock the vehicle to the ground so it will work.

[@Flipsie]

In this case we did the caravan start largely because it was a little bit weird :D

[@podtrh]

3:37:22 Epic moment for showing us the mysterious cockpit screen picture 😀

[@Flipsie]

lol :D That's too perfect

[@driven2destruction515]

@Splitsie Your trailer wobble with the middle trailer is because the wheels are too far forward, the size has little to do with the stability problem. The issue is that the dynamic center of gravity of gravity needs to be in front of the wheels this includes the drawbar weight of the next trailer and all other loads that can affect this balance. if you know that your set. (long time fan with over 2100hrs ingame and and built many multi tralier vehicles in the 5-20kt range in small grid. You introduced me to SE)

[@kyoukotsukino6322]

2:45:00 Industrial Overhaul would be an awesome mod if it didn't have the most annoying thing automation games do: have a stage where you have to manually feed materials to a machine to make parts needed to automate everything. It's like "here, have this car, but to earn the right to use it, you have to push it five kilometers uphill first."

[@kyoukotsukino6322]

48:40 "I have an idea" is the line that was uttered before both the greatest inventions of mankind, and their greatest failures. 49:20 There is absolutely nothing that can't be improved by turning it into a giant mech. 54:45 Splatsie returns.

[@Flipsie]

Did splatsie ever really leave? 🤣

[@feivel069]

Since I'm in AZ, the snake rover at 2:26:40 kinda reminds me of either a rattler w/a big assembler tumor on the back, or a snake scorpion hybrid due to the drill tail. Either way would not wanna have to drive next to it on the I-10 or I-17 while Splitsie is driving.

[@nvfury13]

4:15:04 Yeah, you lost your gun when the container it was in exploded, apparently it went up with it.

[@mikalegault9012]

Anyone noticed that Splitsie never reajusted the rear left wheel on the buggie making it higher than the other.

[@tommy0con2]

11:58 "we could add an extra tailer", as someone who just finished watching wrong way up that made giggle and say "oh here we go again"

[@kian3289]

lol convinces him by repeatedly changing steering direction to cause a near roll xD

[@damaddog8065]

Flipsie pulls a Wille Coyote move at about 55:09, it is funny.

[@tyriaelsoban8909]

That altered cost you mention at 1:13:00 is called "default assembler efficiency" 😛 AAW doesn't change the assembler efficiency, which for streaming, i don't think anyone would blame you if you changed xD

[@WhatTrigger]

lol 5:07:45 Capac's delayed response was more him thinking about what possible repercussions/death that Shadow could possibly cause him.

[@erubianwarlord8208]

probably a bit late but i think your tower steps are what are causing your turbines to be so weak as its effectively a block right next to them try grinding them back and see what you get

[@PhildiusX]

You can pass the static status to the assembler by another grid. take a small grid and landing gear it to the ground then landing gear that grid to the assembler.

[@lordsherifftakari4127]

naturally, you land in a storm and have to make with the blind driving aka Splitsie's sense of direction! to be fair, the Caravan does need to be 2 blocks wider for a bit more walking space inside. everything is more fun with a Capac involved!

[@JAY-fq7sb]

Note, The Goose. A Splitse Classic! Way before we had hinges. A purely rotor-based trailer system of connection. Give Splitse a way to build a trailer. He will! 🤣😂👍 Always!

[@4deepwater8]

Watching this has made me realize that it's not always Capac's fault.

[@Flipsie]

Capac wasn't there, which means it's his fault because he wasn't there 😜

[@dawnfallon6812]

*shhhhhhhh* It is *always* Capac's fault. Every single time, without question. *Especially* if he isn't there.

[@danielancona5293]

Just started this series. I have a feeling that some variation of "it's fine" or "It will be fine" will be a running theme.

[@ceberoushayes3827]

-Did u put the assembler on a router or a advice rotor -Eather way it's on a large port so u could have transfer out of the assembler

[@martinopellizzari3955]

This reminded me of '50s movie "The long, long trailer". I wonder why.🤔

[@thorivaldic]

Need a flatbed trailer! Also a better insult than 'doom voxel', is being called a flatbed trailer! (Previous Series) ")

[@barryvanleeuwen]

"I blame Tom Scott for knowing what that is" - Splitsie, referring to the Schwaa sound, but also: 90% of my "Weird knowledge of the world" databanks.

[@Flipsie]

Lol 🤣

[@MMuraseofSandvich]

14:26 Insert defective turret voice from Portal 2

[@umbrellacorporation8932]

Good video!

[@TNH91]

2:27:00 Around here it looks like speed wobbles 2:31:44 MORE SPEED WOBBLES!

[@Valenorious]

Splitsie: "If you were driving like a ..... Capac" .... Did you just nearly called him a lunatic?

[@thejester-king4135]

Time to abuse no sub-grid damage to excavate the ship

[@Flipsie]

Don't even need sub grids, just keep moving the drills. Also I'm pretty sure drills on sub grids can do damage to the parent grid much as grinders can

[@chakatfirepaw]

Doing a no suit, hostile atmosphere, stream could work the same way idle game streams work: It's really a chatting stream with the game as something to look at and see progress from.

[@noneyaonenoneyatwo2879]

I've got a bit of driving experience hauling towable boom lifts across America one thing that is nice is power brakes they prevent the death wobble when you're slowing down. Basically turn your brakes on and increase the traction in the back

[@tarab9081]

So I see the horns and like....Shadow is a multiverse Loki?

[@mworld]

Splitsie, to find out what is crashing SE when it's running, run dnSpy and attach the SE instance to it.

[@akaSanka89]

The problem with outposts is that they don't move with you and can't do awesome flips. (I'm honestly hoping for another city on wheels.)

[@treycox33]

We want Capac, we want Capac, …..

[@jasonfabrick9308]

Splitsie, on your recent stream I saw that you were scrolling back to zero to stop the pistons on the drill to change them. In case you forgot in Build Vision a right click will change the value back to what it was before, so if it was 0 and you went to -0.05 m/s a right click would instantly go back to 0.

[@Flipsie]

Since pistons default to -0.5m/s I tend to scroll to zero out of safe force of habit :)

[@jasonfabrick9308]

Habit and Mussel Memory. I know how that goes. Just a thought that if you didn't know/remember that the info might be useful.

[@StickJock819]

When you got stuck in your drag trench, I just had a thought that you could put a cockpit on the rear wagon and have a second driver provide occasional pushing power. It'd be a fun and potentially hilarious/catastrophic way to get around the multi-grid wheel script while playing co-op.

[@Flipsie]

Dang, I've never tried to see if that would work. Now I'm definitely going to when I get the chance 😂

[@Valenorious]

4:58:00 Well, Capac was standing right next to the cooking burners. Maybe he was leaning on it with his hands.

[@astranger448]

Shadow? Flaming Red? Horns? That's Karlach from Baldur's Gate 3 all right!

[@user-yp3kx2ro7w]

Lol I just started this other day and was thinking I would like to see you play this.

[@bmjones66]

splistsie needs to watch that video of a toy truck trailer on a treadmill. jfc

[@cyclonicoverride4337]

4:23:00 The allure of static grid finally wins!

[@FlakJacketActual]

Man this would have been a good one for the food and water being needed….. then there would be absolute chaos

[@TheWellHungPony]

Speaking of Plateup!, y'all really should do some more of it.

[@Flipsie]

We did more this week 🙂

[@phil4510]

Your first instinct is always 'lets make an abominable train.'

[@marcgarrett4401]

2:18:47 Just a thought, but retract the piston and flip it forward. Might have helped here.

[@n0bl3hunt3r]

Mmm, Splitsie base building. Haven’t seen that in awhile. It’s all been spaceships and scavenging.

[@Flipsie]

Which is funny because the space thing hadn't been done for a while before that :P

[@nvfury13]

3:35:58 Every wheel not on the front vehicle itself, *except* the right wheel on the rearmost trailer is locked at that point. 3:36:58 Then the right locks up and the left unlocks…this bodes poorly.

[@StrangeQuarkShipwerks]

Shadow did not lose her legs in Vietnam just to get space murdered by Splitsie!

[@EikeSky]

I still don't understand why we don't have a mod or some kind of Keen update to make "no suit" gameplay essentially vanilla. being able to change out hydro thrusters for ions or extra storage space... Or an ore detector, or small refinery, and have it interchangeable, it would make this early game so much more fun (and if you start with a survival kit-esque module, you could functionally eradicate stone-aging!)

[@RobTheSquire]

Whenever I play SE I do tend to use build and repair for base building and to build my first rover then I switch it off for when i'm building my first space craft and blast off from the starting planet.

[@kyoukotsukino6322]

2:43:00 But what about that legendary Australian hero, Croc-o-dile Dundee?

[@Ben-wi4ww]

Come on splitsie careful that’s how baby happen, with accidental drillings.

[@PiroteusGaming]

since SE has no skulls maybe Shadow can paint the caravan one block at a time in red and black for every time splitsy or shadow die... a visual kill count remenisent of the stamps on airplain for confirmed kills and takedowns.

[@KaedysKor]

We need a skull mod, just for Shadow

[@KaedysKor]

We need a skull mod, just for Shadow

[@nopenah5681]

I swear he just attracts capac clones

[@colinericburriss]

If Space Engineers and Valheim had a baby, Would the kitchen be functional?

[@talscorner3696]

Well, that was an eventful 35 minutes

[@noneyaonenoneyatwo2879]

Why not make a speeder bike with 1 medium cargo? You found enough engines on that buried fighter? Just build a temporary charging station, my basic ass speeder has a range of almost 60-70 kms all it uses is 2 batteries 4 lift thrust 2 forward and back and 1 left and right. And that's probably more motors than I need but I like the extra go and stop and lift

[@danielberrett2179]

Surprised this new "series" is on Flipsie instead of Splitsie? Cant wait to watch more. EDIT: Whats all this talk about "last time" in the beginning, is not this the first Video?

[@blackshadow-xm9lj]

Splitsie and I finished the green hell playthrough after about an hour, so instead of ending the stream we decided to talk through our ideas for this series, that is the 'last time' we were talking about, if I remember correctly at least. The SE part of the vod is included in the green hell finale

[@danielberrett2179]

Ah so Splitsie crashed the truck in a "test" run of this series.

[@gcherfzthequietone]

If she wants pitch black she should play cube world alpha. Those nights are crazy. You cant see anything beyond the lamp radius and the start lamp is like 6 feet wide circle.

[@JollerDoller]

Im suprised klang hasnt flung the thing into orbit

[@jonathanbair523]

Really enjoyed watching this... Wish it was on your other channel where this has the other games on it...

[@Flipsie]

This channel is for the live-stream VoDs, the other channel is for edited content or stuff that's streamed there direct. Thanks to the way the KZbin algorithm works this is the best way I can manage things :)

[@dei_walker]

those torch glitches are almost seizure inducing!!

[@Flipsie]

Yeah, it's pretty awful. Hopefully it's not something we run into too often, or we can get around it by having adequate base lighting

[@tuurderom2017]

after finding out that shadow is dutch i legaly have to call her a cheesehead now, not sure if i like that law anymore 🤔

[@BrokeWrench]

The farther back the wheels and the closer to the hitch the more stable your trailers will be. If your caravan was at the back it wouldnt be too bad because it wouldn't be whipping the rear trailer from side to side. The rear trailer has wheels all the way back and that is ideal. A goose neck hitch is inherently more stable because the forces work against each other instead of amplifying each other. This is because it is ahead of the rear axle Edit: And immediately after making this comment you flipped it and blew up the properly designed trailer again and ill have to see if the horrible camper stays around 😂

[@christopherrenn8137]

Ok.. just started watching and i like this dynamic. They are funny.

[@Ben-wi4ww]

That survival kit needs to be a T-shirt

[@sennix7148]

@Splitsie, I found where you are on the map. Let me know if you would like for me to attempt to describe your location. BTW, I am going to try and restore the "Hermes" that you are salvaging. Just thought it looked like a cool ship.

[@Flipsie]

I'd figured it out by the end of the stream thankfully :)

[@sennix7148]

@@Flipsie If the wreck you found is in the same place as the one I found, then you may not be where you think you are on the map. I watched you pull up the map a couple of times, and we definitely are reading the map differently. :) I did verify where I am at by finding Cobalt and an "Ice lake". Just to check, from the shipwreck, if you follow the ridge to the SE for approximately 3.5km you should find an Iron deposit.

[@wonderingwolf206]

Keep it going

[@jeremyacke1303]

The only problem I have with SE is they need more scenarios. Xbox just doesn’t have the same options as pc when it comes to mods

[@jkirkwood2018]

you are, really, not far from that Si deposit :)

[@ceberoushayes3827]

@splitsie I made capac a rover 2drive around with his own miner drone