Ford EEC-IV No Spark Diagnostics

[@marchantdj3307]

Doing electrical part of my course, this helps so much thank you mang 🙏🏾

[@jeffreywilsonrubikscubeonb2428]

Merchant DJ there is no better teacher than Scannerdanner for getting thru the electrical part of any automotive course. Even his oldest material is light years ahead of modern curriculum as far as detail and clear easy to understand approach. Thanks to Scannerdanner, I was eventually hired as a diagnostic trainer and had to go back to my old trade school and do a seminar on labscope diagnostics to all of my old automotive instructors 😎 pretty hard to beat that feeling lol. Thanks again Paul!!!

[@ScannerDanner]

Thank you so much guys!

[@billrimmer5596]

Man the good old days when we used to go to LaTours garage and you’d b out in the parking lot with your truck backed up to the car. Tripod for a lot of the vid. But we would get the shot of the burned O2 wire laying on the exhaust manifold. I love all those old vids!! And I go back and watch them regularly. There’s gold in them there vids!!

[@bartsarton2212]

It's amazing how Caleb can now anticipate what you are going to say and point the camera where it needs to be without you even telling him. Great job guys!

[@ScannerDanner]

This was an editing gem my friend. He definitely is getting better at keeping up, but we both think of the editing and what we need while filming and Caleb then works his magic afterwards. You have no idea the level of expertise he now has. Your comment proves it as you couldn't even tell the amount of editing that went into some of those captures. 😉 Props to my son! Thanks for the comment, I'm going to share this with him.

[@farmermiyagi1338]

Aw hell, now you're in my early days. When I started in auto repair, there were more carbs on the road than there was fuel injection. Actually Gm went to TBI in the Silverados the year I started my career. This is the stuff I cut my teeth on. ;)

[@jorgellamas4440]

ScannerDanner The god of troubleshooting

[@paulfiebke3909]

Love watching you do what you do. Hope you and your brother and son and his baby is all well. Keep me in your prayers I'm having having heart problems again and I'll be going back to hospital for heartsergry again. God bless you all and keep up the good work

[@isalmankhan1]

Our well wishes are with you & pray for your good health🙏

[@OvertheHills]

Nice. I recently fixed an intermittent hesitation/no start in my 1988 Bronco II (that I bought new in 1987) by replacing the distributor. I used a break-out box and oscilloscope to monitor the PIP and SPOUT voltages, and the primary ignition current at the coil. When it died the PIP voltage decreased and took out the SPOUT and primary ignition completely. One of your earlier videos clued me in to the likelihood of the distributor Hall effect sensor being the likely culprit, so many thanks for that.

[@johnhicks2277]

Truck sitting for 2 weeks, replaced all you mentioned, now distributor. Thanks so much!

[@ScannerDanner]

did you fix it then?

[@johnhicks2277]

@@ScannerDanner going to do distributor today. Just gotta get on it! I let you know, pretty confident after watching your video, Thanks again 👍

[@johnhicks2277]

Thanks much scanner Man, put new distributor in and fired right up. I know who I'm looking up on next mishap. Thanks much!

[@tracydiller9378]

Great diagnostic video on a good old Ford.Never get tired of these diagnostics videos.Stay safe everyone.

[@Paul1958R]

Paul, Great diagnosis/explanation on the good old EEC-IV - thank you! Those PIP units are such a pain to replace as you need to remove the distributor gear which is pinned and pressed on. Probably replacing the entire distributor is the most cost effective solution. Paul (in MA)

[@Smacks1]

Having mechanic skills slim to none, I wish I had a mechanic this knowledgeable and trustworthy as this guy near where I live. Having an issue with my 96 f150 4.9. Turns on just fine when cooled then after some driving just shuts right off and won’t turn back on till it’s completely cooled down

[@brianmason8400]

I can't say thank you enough for this video!! I just had an 89 Bronco w a 5.8l that just flat died on me like you shut the ignition off. Using your method and your tests, quickly figured out it was a bad ICM and pick-up. Couldn't condemn the coil at 1st bc w icm unplugged, I had good pwr in and out of coil, BUT when I plugged icm in, the bright test light on the control side of coil went dim. Anyway (sorry for rambling), it wound up needing dist assy w module, and a coil. Once I had coil control restored, still no spark from it. New coil on, truck ran like a champ! How can I ever repay all the great information......thank you! God bless!

[@woodyk5127]

Hello, Thank you first of all for posting all these excellent videos. You are clearly an expert mechanic that is very hard to find these days as most mechanics these days don't have the knowledge of how things work and all what they do is change parts. I have a real good one for you. I have a 1991 F150 5.8L engine with 123k miles on it that I bought from a chief pilot at United Airline. Anyway, I drove the truck over 800 miles and drove like brand new. I parked it for a week and when I tried to start it, it wouldn't start. I watched your video and I said to myself I can follow your method to figure out the problem. Note that About 2 months ago, the ECM went bad and I took the ECM out and was able to fix it and it was the same issue with the capacitors going bad. Anyway, I followed your approach looking to decide whether I have spark at the coil. To my surprise, there was a spark at the coil but not much at the spark plugs so I replaced distributor cap and rotor but to my surprise, the engine still wouldn't start even though I have a spark at spark plugs end. So now I am thinking I have a fuel problem but giving that I have dual tank, it is highly unlikely that both pumps are bad. Hence, I replaced the fuel filter and again the truck failed to start no matter how much I cranked it. Next , using a new fuel pressure gauge, I measured the fuel pressure and it was around 41 PSI so fuel is no longer a possible problem and I am out of options till I disconnected the 2 hoses to air filter and noticed that intake is completely closed. So now I started to think that may be the fuel mixture and spark plugs are flooded giving all the attempts to start it for the last 7 days. To make the story short, I pressed on gas pedal all the way which forced intake to be wide open to outside air and not going through air filter and after few attempts, the truck finally started. It ran rough for the first 30 minutes of drivings and after that the truck is back now running like brand new, idles and drives beautifully. I am glad the truck is running again but have no idea what caused the no start problem in the first place. This only happened to me once before but the truck started back then after letting it sit for few hours but not this time. One thing to note is when the truck was sitting for a week outside we had very high humidity for few days but not sure if humidity is a factor. I would very much appreciate your input on what really was the problem. Again, thanks to you, not only i was able to get the truck going without having to wait 10 days for the dealer to look at but I am sure I also saved myself over $1000. The dealers in Chicago area charge extra 25% if your vehicle is old and many don't want to work on it. Look forward to your reply, ANJ P.S. Are your classes available online to take? If not why not? I would live to take your classes. Also, do you do remote consulting for a fee?

[@ScannerDanner]

Was there a difference in the spark at the plugs after the cap and rotor was done? Weak spark could definitely cause a flooded condition and the clear flood crank was what you needed to do after restoring proper spark. Hard to say. What did you say was in the intake??

[@woodyk5127]

@@ScannerDanner There was nothing in the intake. I was referring to the metal plate that sits on the inside of the intake and opens and closes with the depressing of the gas pedal and functions like choke I think. I am very much interested in taking your classes if you have them online like KZbin or using zoom. Thank you again, ANJ

[@woodyk5127]

I forget to answer your question and I don't think there was a big noticeable difference in the spark after changing distributor cap and rotor. I am planning on doing tuneup as it has been a while since existing spark plugs and wires have been replaced.

[@ScannerDanner]

@@woodyk5127 oh okay, that makes more sense. Thanks! My classes are all available on my website at www.scannerdanner.com I have over 450 hours of training available for $11 a month. Hope to see you there!

[@ScannerDanner]

@@woodyk5127 okay, there are other causes for flooded conditions too, one in particular to pay attention to is the engine coolant temp sensor. Google how to get flash codes from your truck, it was a really weird procedure and involved using a test light and a jumper wire but I don't remember how to do it. See if you have a code for the ECT

[@jamesmiller5160]

I have a 1997 f350 dually 460, I’ve tested the wiring down the grey orange wire to ensure continuity to the computer from the ignition control module, I tested with a test light both sides of the coil -+ sides and have voltage there, i tried jumping the pip wire with the test light as shown in the video and using the coil wire and spark tester i get no spark, when i unplug the icm jumper plug i get spark, the icm has power to it and it is a black module not grey, originally i swapped a distributor out of my other truck that runs and still had no spark nor injector trigger, i did also swap out my eec with the same running truck and still at the same result. I’ve ensured all the fuses have power and the eec computer has power and ground. I’m sure I’m missing something obvious, I’m open for any questions

[@T-Hogie]

That's handy, a ratchet hammer. That electrical diagram brings back memories of when my son had an ignition problem with an old Ford Ranger 4-banger. It would not start with the SPOUT wire connected but it ran fine if you first started the engine and then connected the SPOUT wire. Never did figure it out he ran the truck like that until some lady fell asleep at the wheel on the DC beltway, t-boned his truck and totaled it.

[@grabovg]

When I was 16 I used to have to start my 88 Ford ranger by jumping the solenoid connections with a screwdriver. It was a manual. one time I left it in gear and it drove into a telephone pole 🤦‍♂️

[@khatokhato9350]

Yes cars are extremely dangerous when caught someone on surprise. Any individual is exposed to risk of injury when mishandled.

[@throttlebottle5906]

LOL 🤣😝

[@kd7cwg]

I had to that to my 83 mustang gt. Grabbed the linkage to give a little throttle while cranking….. got a decent jolt 😬.

[@cullenmiller8170]

Nice video. That fan without the shroud can ruin your day quickly. Specially for all the people wearing hoodies and draw strings swinging around. I worked with a guy that was putting a fuel filter on a crane and was holding on to the radiator shroud to support himself and the operator pushed the starter button. I was really impressed with the guy not choking the operator with his other good hand. His nick name was big Al and he was a hand to hand combat instructor in the Marine Corps. 😁😁

[@jessemedina4482]

I have an 89 F250 and 89 Lincoln Mark VII. I'm becoming an expert in these systems quickly.. both vehicles had a habit of just quitting unpredictably and then coming back to life after cooldown. Considering a remote mount kit for my ignition modules if they fail again.

[@tarandeiniol3092]

Thank you I'll check mine having same issue on foxbody I relocated ignition module behind strut tower but had my bolted down lol

[@JoesAutoElectric]

Nice brother., Like you, I have worked on tons of the EEC IV systems. You can change the pickup on them, but the time involved to take apart the distributor isn't worth it. I think the puller kit is still someplace at the my shop for these.

[@billrimmer5596]

Nice to c another super tech Joe’s Auto Electric comment. I never missed any of your vids. Watched them all. Miss your content. U always had good stories to tell.

[@alb12345672]

Never use aftermarket distributor caps :lol:. I bought a wells one when I first got the 85 crown vic in the mid 90s to do a full tuneup and I had nothing but problems. Then I pulled the center post and the whole terminal came out of the distributor. I fixed it with wire ties to get home. I put the old motocraft one back and returned the POS. Learned my lesson about aftermarket parts.

[@petar443]

Hey Joe. Liked your videos a lot. I remember that most of them were very interesting because were tricky to diagnose or because somebody already "worked" on them . 🚬

[@jarvishill1007]

A very appropriate teaching with experience and safety. To augment (Naval Aviation Electronics Advanced Maintenance) working radar, experienced a common FAILURE caused by a weakening magnetic FAILURE! With an elderly motor, it's likely the same weakening of the magnetic field of the distributor rotor shaft is getting below the engineered limits of the HALL EFFECT (a semiconductor) to perform. That limit would be sensitive and influenced by a variety of varying influences, creating the "confusion" of intermittent! (Heat of varying mechanical spacing, heat effecting magnetic strength, heat effecting the sensitivity of the HALL EFFECT semiconductor AND the COMBINATIONS, etc.)

[@cyberslacker5150]

They don't make them like they used to. This truck shouldn't be in a junkyard. Not for another 30 years. The new 2021 Ford Broncos will be in the junkyard within 10 years. Great video Danner!

[@joeidaho5938]

Agree completely. I just did some upgrading work on my 92 F250...virtually the same truck as the Bronco...and I'll be driving it long after anything else I see on the road meets the junkyard crusher...lol. I cringe at all the sensationalizing of old great car and truck models...by reintroducing these modern things that have no semblance at all to the spirit of the older models.

[@dennisthomas4766]

I did a 92 f150 5.0 no spark 2 years ago no spark. The first thing I did was pull the distributor cap and the inside of the distributor was alot of rust inside so I replaced that it started and ran but with 200,000 miles on it I replaced module and coil so there wouldn't be any problems.

[@throttlebottle5906]

ignition module not cleanly mounted on heatsink(with thermal transfer grease) will overheat and die in mere seconds to minutes, depending on ambient temps. overzealous screw tightening, can warp the heatsink and module both, making them not have good contact except at the outer edges and yet again self kill in short order! been there done that, long ago. many of the GM setups had the same issue, with module on heatsink near coil and internal distributor mounted ones, both. after the factory module died, a "yinyang" often repaired and caused the replacement to fail quickly(did that once also), but being into electronics and most all mechanicals, I figured out my err real fast :)

[@fascistpedant758]

IIRC, the spout connection was unplugged to allow the PIP signal to directly fire the ICM to set distributor timing. Disconnecting the spout was also a handy way to determine whether it was a PIP or PCM problem.

[@gmax341]

Is the spout connector the part that connects to the ignition module?

[@fascistpedant758]

@@gmax341 Check out the diagram @14:50. It's between the ICM and PCM.

[@gmax341]

@@fascistpedant758 ohhh so just a connector that connects wires together. Not sure how to explain it so sorry if it sounds stupid. I think I have seen a few of those. They are rectangle or squared shaped. Normally black in color with maybe red, orange or grey/white weather seals at the ends. Can you believe I've gone through three ignition Control Modules before I found the correct one that didn't set a CEL? Only problem now is my remote start don't work no more! Engine cranks but doesn't fire. I'm sure its probably some wire I knocked loose from the aftermarket system they installed. Thank you anyways!

[@fascistpedant758]

@@gmax341 I seem to remember it being a small block plugged into the distributor, but there may be different designs.

[@gmax341]

@@fascistpedant758 I'll have to check and see for sure. If it helps any, I have the 5.8l V8 351W. In a 96 E150.

[@exmotorsports]

It's been awhile since I've seen you work/diag on one of these old trucks. Great stuff bro. Done many of those pick up coils..Had a feeling that's where this was going when you said a new coil and IGM already been shot at it. 😄 Surprisingly these PIPs are still available yet from Ford (E9TZ12A112A) I have found a few things that are getting hard to find tho. Thanks again Paul and of course..if she's still reading all the comments. "Hi Mom"... Hope your doing well. Wanna see you in another video again soon. take care. ☺

[@kd7cwg]

Had this happen to a friends 95 mustang. #1 injector will also not be commanded when the pip fails.

[@erikkirby1]

ah the ford module!!! was it a 7/32 socket or a 9/32 socket? and you had to grind it down all the way around to fit in the hole!!!!... never forget dy-electric grease between the module and the heat sink!!!

[@kd7cwg]

Kept one of the module tools, a spare module, and a tube of arctic silver in the glove box in the mustang 🤣

[@rainbowdiamonds2865]

Thanks Paul and cal for this Video. Very interessting Video. Thanks from germany. All good for you and your Family. LG.

[@williamreed1493]

Bro, I don't know jack about auto electrical but your changing that! Freakin love the videos!! Keep the amazing job!!

[@ScannerDanner]

Thank you William! Glad you're here

[@timtimwike22]

I'm in the same boat with my 92 f150 5.0 going to try distributor next thanks

[@isalmankhan1]

WoW amazing SD, you made it look so easy to fix, Superb as usual👍 I've never worked on these, bcuz when I started as a Tech most of these were probably parked permanently, but I've always wished to master these previous gen systems, they're fun to work on😉 Special Thanks to Caleb & James Danner👍 Stay Safe Guy's❤

[@jeffreyyoung4104]

I would pull the fan belt for troubleshooting as it should not get hot in 3 to 5 minutes of running, and you can pull on wires and pound on modules safely. Of course, reinstall it once you are done!

[@throttlebottle5906]

I can say I rarely replaced PIP sensors. but I made sure there was good plugs, wires cap/rotor at first sign of anything amuck. high voltage fireworks inside the cap = PIP death! GM was more famous for secondary ignition issues killing the coils and that smacking the module, which was then self inflicted short life after from over-torque and bending.

[@TheBadasspony]

Awesome!! Same problem with my 88 ford tbird..great video!!!

[@SMAutoRepairLLC]

Awesome video SD!!!!

[@SmittySmithsonite]

Great stuff fellas! Good to see you. I've been taking a breather from auto related stuff both here and on KZbin. No fault of anyones - just needed to step back and breathe a bit. Modern cars still frustrate the crap out of me. Just when I think I've got a handle on it, 3 in a row will come in and mop my ass! I think I'm going to stick with what I'm good at, and that's carburetors, points, or old school electronic ignitions like this system here. Going to pick my battles with modern stuff much more carefully going forward. Still running this exact system in our '86 Grand Marquis. I had this same failure back in '07, but without troubleshooting knowledge or patience, I replaced both the EEC module and the pickup. I had a 50/50 shot of getting it, but I'm not a gamblin' man, LOL. Oh, I meant to mention that EEC module needs heat conducting compound on the back of it, wherever it's mounted - heat sink or distributor body, for anyone that's reading. I'm sure you already know this. She's still running great to this day, closing in on 290K miles. Getting ready to park her for the winter, whenever the first road salting happens (or if it even has the potential of happening). We'll be hitting 300k next summer more than likely. Still has the 100% original driveline. Transmission has only had fluid & filter changes. Even has the ORIGINAL in-tank electric fuel pump ... and I ran the ORIGINAL plugged up fuel filter for 14 years, since I had forgotten I had never changed it!! I couldn't hardly blow through it when I removed it! Try that with a modern fuel pump, lol. Anyone that thinks new cars are "better", I beg to differ. ;)

[@moneymikesupplymusic]

Hey Paul, I noticed that when you dropped the paper on the ground at 2:10 - 2:20 the paper was still clean. That tells me the oil spill was dry from a different vehicle.

[@smoothrelaxation9221]

Hi ScannerDanner Is there any posibility I could get a link to buy Relay jump starter kit.I am living in uk.I tryied Amozon Ebay I couldn`t find the same stuff.I really like your videos.Great stuuff.

[@joetuktyyuktuk8635]

Sometimes the connection to the ignition module, the Pip connection can be corroded... placing your tester in the connector sometimes scrapes just enough of the corrosion away to allow it to run... just a thought.

[@CANDiagnostic]

Brilliant thought process as always

[@karlswanseen7526]

Great diagnostics, thank you, but… 92’ e350 5.8l, diagnostics pointed to bad ICM, replaced and same results. Read to pull PCM harness plug and test for spark, it did spark indicating bad PCM. Pulled and opened PCM and sure enough one of the blue transistors(?) corroded and came off when touched.

[@markhava6491]

Thanks great info. Got all the goodies. Still no spark. What’s the next check?

[@ScannerDanner]

What does your test light (incandescent) do on coil positive and coil negative

[@markhava6491]

@@ScannerDanner with the key on, and test light on ground, the red wire lights up, the light green wire does not, but it sparked at he connection when i touched it, like it's a bad contact on the coil.??

[@markhava6491]

Watched your video 4 times, making all the checks, just missing something...all the fuses are good, cleaned all the connections, got the spark tester, and the remote ignition, can't trigger a spark by tricking the pip wire with 12v either. going crazy.

[@ScannerDanner]

@@markhava6491 it could be? Both sides of that coil should be lit with the key on

[@ScannerDanner]

@markhava6491 if your connections are good, you have one of 2 things going on. 1. Coil negative is being grounded all the time, making your test light not light when connected to ground. 2. Your primary coil winding is open (bad coil). To confirm, with key one and coil positive showing you that the test light lights and coil negative showing you it doesn't. Switch your test light to battery positive and recheck. Tell me what you see. It's important that the key stays on and you confirm coil positive stays hot so we don't get a backfeed when we check coil negative with the test light to battery positive

[@the_retired_mechanic]

Paul please please do more newer European cars for us people across the pond. Stay safe and thank-you

[@nigelnkunzi6414]

Scanner Dunner u are the man lov watching yo vids my man I wish if u were here in SA too was gona bring my Mercedes w203 c240 v6 giving me headeck with misfiring on cylinder 1,2 n 3

[@oscarrojas4281]

You are a great teacher

[@maxwebster7572]

There is a section in the Ford service proceedure on those revolving around disconnecting the spout, jumping the spout and disconnecting the ECM. In my batch fire 5.0 we had an issue where the ecm advanced/ retarded the timing randomly (and) there are issues in those ECM's with dried out caps. If I recall those will throw spark with ECM disconnected asa the coil works off of a feedback between module and ECM. In my case we had spark, fuel, timing and compression and would not fire with ether.

[@mashamambea5704]

Now that was easy Awesome lesson video.

[@jeffreywilsonrubikscubeonb2428]

Love it when my notification has a blue dot glowing on SD 😎 Can we hope for a Saturday vid also?? 😉😎

[@pantherplatform]

I have a 96 F150 with a 1351 after replacing the icm. The icm doesnt need to be grounded but it definitely needs the heat sink so it won't burn up.

[@richardcranium5839]

the sad truth is the parts are still available and so cheap its almost worth it to shoot the parts cannon because most of todays techs never worked on these and the diag labor alone will be the same as the parts

[@xephael3485]

I'd have probably looked at distributor first... always seem to be the issue.

[@Lambros_Stefaneas]

In some cases, it's absolutely true what you are saying.....

[@alb12345672]

@@xephael3485 I had a similar issue with a wells aftermarket distributor cap. Not hard to diagnose though, the center terminal just pulled right out

[@jamesd6247]

It's true, those old mustangs have that system and it's parts galore. New high performance parts being made, replacement computer systems being built for the user to program and tweak. An automotive community in its own.

[@alb12345672]

@@jamesd6247 On my 85 crown vic CFI I remember how complicated diagnostics were. You could have a bad EGR solenoid and the car would stall intermittently, etc. No datastream either. You really had to know your electronics and voltages. I really learned a ton from that car, many years ago but solid basic skills that you could use today.

[@petar443]

Thanks. And old cars are awesome 🥃

[@garydiggins1836]

Very informative. Thanks

[@chipschweiss]

Yes, you can buy the pick-up and not the whole distributor. Just bought a Motorcraft pick-up a few months ago. Much better than any aftermarket parts.

[@tonygoulding9086]

Hi I’ve taken the relay out of my discovery 2 for the air compressor Will there still be power and ground to the compressor

[@frobles21]

Help trouble shoot issue: 1994 Ford F-150 5.0 automatic. Issue: running rich, allot of black smog coming from the exhaust and strong smell of gas. Does not seem to be switching gears, RPM are almost hitting 4,000 running at 55 mph. Parts I’ve changed so far; - EGR Valve - cleaned out the Trottle body - TPS sensor - IAC sensor - O2 sensor - PCV Valve - MAF sensor - distributor - plugs - ignition coil - ICM - air filter - fuel pump front and rear - canister purge valve - vacuum lines - oil change - Temp Sensor - fuel pressure regulator

[@rustysgarage]

What generates the square wave that you are doing by hand?

[@windward2818]

The TFI heatsink does not need to be grounded to the sheet metal for a ground return. However, it is usually mounted to sheet metal that is a cooler spot within the engine compartment to further reduce TFI temperatures. PIP = Profile Ignition Pickup output is usually pulled up to VBAT. I think I would have put a scope on PIP before trying to manually spark the coil. For the side mounted TFIs with the large heatsink mount I think the distributor pickup fails at about the same rate as the TFI, maybe even more. To be more specific the PIP output is a conditioned window hall effect circuit, which compared to a simple reluctor wheel like in a GM distributor circuitry is prone to failures.

[@murraykriner9425]

Rudimentary electric knowledge is required for type IV systems. Great job waking up that old girl. Sure she'll be better than new after the Hall-effects is replaced.

[@genelineberger2205]

I have no power to cab no headlights nothing had smoke under dash ground wire for windshield wipers burnt down caused issue good battery any thoughts thanks

[@josephwash109]

The wiring diagram shows that the PCM can monitor the coil negative terminal through a 22K resistor. It would be interesting to see if it set a DTC. Also, given the high idle speed, I figure the base ignition timing is over advanced.

[@PaulCTownsend]

Also hooking up a battery charger on medium can uncover a defective hall effect. Charging system voltage versus battery.

[@davidreynolds4684]

On my 90 f150 4.9 liter the ice is mounted on the distributor. I should be able to connect my test light to the pos on the battery and probe to the pip wire(being the top wire?) and with a spark tester between the distributor and coil I should see a spark. Correct? I've been leaning toward the pickup coil being my no spark issue

[@ScannerDanner]

Yes, top wire is the PIP signal that is basically your hall effect signal or pickup. With the key on, measure voltage there first. It will depend on where one of the hall shutters is, as to if the signal voltage is high or low. If it's low, yes, test light to B+ and pull it high If it's high, then test light to ground and pull it low Make sense?

[@khatokhato9350]

Some years ago I owned vaz 2109. It had ignition module generating square wave signals upon hall sensor pulses. It was mentioned in the manual to ensure the hull of module securely fastened to the car body. So I sometimes applied multimeter lead to the hull of module and the other to the car body. In case of poor contact with the body it showed some value. And the second, in case of bad contact with the battery the module unrecoverably damaged. So it was prohibited to unfasten the battery leads when engine is running. I remember I touched the insulation sheath of central wire with bare hand while engine running and have some discharge run through me, some moments engine was choking and then recovered. I was wondering that the sheath of a hot wire carries some high potential charge on its surface and could harm someone if exposed or touched.

[@obsoleteprofessor2034]

I had a crank crank no start 85 mustang. It blew me that the 5v reference was floating all over the place. Turned out the only ground for the computer was a single wire that had rotted off the battery terminal.

[@7DLeathery]

What if I have spark at the coil? Any suggestions

[@murphytoadster9864]

I live in Phoenix and I drive in 110°-115° and that ICM has never been an issue on mine

[@madfab7132]

I have the same issue in my 85 f150 would it be the same problem?

[@ScannerDanner]

It's possible

[@Ruskaga]

I once had a distributor stator that would only fail after the engine warmed up, and then I'd have to sit on the side of the road for it to cool before it would start again. It took ages to track down.

[@steveross9058]

I have a coil spark to ground, enough to stop your heart, but nothing to distributor , hence no spark at plugs. Any help? And of course, ty

[@ScannerDanner]

Rotor burn through possibly. It happens sometimes where is grounds through the distributor shaft

[@Matthewjo22]

Awesome video, thanks man

[@steamy1225]

Will this test work on the older duraspark ignition on Fords?

[@ScannerDanner]

The control testing with a test light? Yes, absolutely

[@PistonShack]

Seems like we might see new 2020 Ford Bronco models on your channel guys as well, probably soon) Great video!

[@joeidaho5938]

They have the same name...and it ends there. These old guys are trucks you can fix and maintain on your own....with a few tools in the back of the truck. Blatantly not the case with anything new. Same name....but that's where it really ends.

[@bbmd2200]

Hello, Paul. Do you think that an ignition coil can be cooked by an oil leak from a leaky tube seal? If yes. could you please explain how that happens?

[@ScannerDanner]

"Cooked" no, ruined yes. Oil could swell the boot and act as a conductor shorting out the spark from getting to the plug

[@paulward2947]

So what would the problem be if you've already replaced the pickup coil the ignition coil the ignition module and it still has no spark? I can induce spark with a pin stuck into the PIP wire and a test light off the negative side of the battery... I can also produce spark with the old ignition module plugged into the trucks wiring harness and the old pickup coil plugged into that and running my pocket knife blade through the pick-up coil.. but when I pulled the distributor out of the motor and plug that into the trucks wiring harness and ground the distributor to the battery using a jumper cable it gets no spark however I did notice that by touching the distributor housing with the grounded battery cable it creates park in the same way the test light create spark when touched against the PIP wire.

[@steveedwards1072]

That’s the stuff I learned on. Oh, good times. Peace

[@austinepperson3576]

On an older video with Eric the car guy you did a similar truck and used the test light to make the Hall effect but on that one you had the test light to ground and this one you had the test light to battery positive. Why did you change the location of the test light lead? And does the connector to the distributor have to be disconnected?

[@ScannerDanner]

It's all about where the signal voltage is at rest (where the drive plate or trigger wheel rests). If it is high, pull it low, if it is low, pull it high. Make sense?

[@austinepperson3576]

@@ScannerDanner Got ya! I'm in tech school now and I own one of these trucks. Mine stalled out and was diagnosed as a bad module. put a new one on and it ran fine then wouldn't start again. old one won't work period, new one now works (for now) but gets very got and was smoking. New one was making spark but I could not get the test light to trigger the Hall effect but it will start and run at least for now despite me not being able to make it spark at the PIP wire, and it would only kick the fuel pumps and relay on once when I touched the wire. I am getting another motorcraft module and I'll try again and see if I can trigger the Hall effect. Thanks a bunch Paul! Always look forward to your content and always learn a bunch!

[@jedk9523]

my 89 f250 is having the same issue, i havent tested it but vvould it be a distribuator?

[@labrat6910]

Your videos are awesome.Thanx S.D.How often do you work on Mercedes bro?

[@ScannerDanner]

On occasion

[@BobBlystone]

How did you do the bypass?

[@ScannerDanner]

Test light to ground and touch on the PIP wire on and off with the key on. Test light to power next if the ground test doesn't work. (Depends on where the trigger wheel stopped in the distributor for the pick up on what polarity to use for your test light)

[@jdtractorman7445]

I think back in the day if the TFI module was deemed bad Ford recommended changing the pick up coil in the distributor as well. I don't remember why, maybe if one fails it takes out the other or something, not sure exactly. At least this one is over near the fender and not mounted to the distributor. Ford had a huge recall on those because of heat failures making them conk out. I think in later years it was moved to where this one is. Those pickups are replaceable but you have to pull the distributor, take the roll pin out that holds the gear on and take the old one off and install new. I can't remember if the gear was a press fit or not.

[@Maples01]

California sued Ford for this system over failures putting vehicles on the side of the road. Earn the name found on road dead.

[@chriscrusader5412]

What I am really learning here is that your Brother needs to take your class!? I am sure he would be your top student! lol jk. Dude is awesome. Wish you did more work on these old Fords because I am always working on my Dad's 1988 F-150 I6 4.9L.

[@arthurbright1625]

I'm helping a friend who has the same problem he has changed everything pick up coal Ignation module and coil and still no spark but you can hear the fuel pump run what would you do

[@ScannerDanner]

New parts means nothing. Do some testing, then I can help

[@brandonwelch1315]

I just had a 98 Chevy 1500 5.7 come in with no spark after putting a motor in, they did cap, rotor, coil, and module. Control was missing, no crank signal(they had already replaced ckp also) the trigger wheel was missing. When whoever put the motor transfered covers and such they forgot the reluctor for the crank.

[@shanethissell2136]

I ran all these checks and it was extremely helpful. So glad there are people like you out there to provide this simple yet extremely effective information out there and to do it for free! But I do have one question, I’m testing on a 97 f250 5.8 and was checking with a test light on the coil positive and negative wires for that flicker you talk about, I have flicker on the negative side but not the positive. Does this indicate anything that you know of? Or is this normal? Again thanks for this I’ll definitely be subscribing and following and pass along to anyone else I know, cause this was very basic, the tools used are cheap and the basic knowledge like you said is invaluable and spreads across all makes, models and years. Greatly appreciated!

[@ScannerDanner]

Coil positive should be steady and coil negative should pulse. Is that what you see and you don't have spark?

[@shanethissell2136]

I have coil positive steady and pulse on the negative and the truck seems to be running and starting fine now…I think what happened was when I went to do this test and I shoved the test light probe into the positive side of the coil and attempted to start it, it fired right up and has been working fine now for the last couple hours and several starts and stops.

[@ScannerDanner]

@shanethissell2136 okay, yeah this test is only helpful during the no spark condition. Thanks!

[@davidessien5465]

Scannerdanner I would love to be like you

[@nm-qt2hb]

You should always pop the cap off the distributor and verify rotor rotation. It was not uncommon to see a broke or twisted distributor driveshaft or gear fail.

[@kd7cwg]

Seen a couple cases where the roll pin sheared. Had one that ran , just no power. Found out by pulling cap and could turn the rotor by hand. Didn’t have a timing light at the time to know

[@nm-qt2hb]

@@kd7cwg The valve stem seals would get old and brittle. As they broke in small tiny pieces, they collected in the oil pan. Some of them would get passed through the oil pump pick up screen and jam up in-between the two gears. The oil pump hex drive shaft would twist like a corkscrew then break. Sometimes they didn't break and the timing would be way off and run like shit. Sometimes the shear pin would also break and take out the gear drive. Drop the oil pan, clean it out and replace the parts. The permanent fix was to replace the valve stem seals with ones made out of Viton. They were good for up to 600f degrees.

[@josh-e3j]

I have an 05 ford Taurus the 3.0 Vulcan. I'm not getting any fire from 2 and 6. I've changed all the plugs and wires are good. I then changed the coil itself but still the same thing.. what on earth could be the problem? I'm hoping it's not a PCM issue. Your thoughts?

[@ScannerDanner]

Coil on plug system? PCM drivers are a common issue on these for ignition coils. I have some videos on this and how to test them

[@fulgenciomarcos9350]

Love your videos. Thanks !

[@monstersquashracing]

Loving these videos. mad respect 🙏🏻

[@raymondcascella4920]

I've got a 7.5 that has voltage to injectors but no ground at injector connector. replaced control module on distributor. Any suggestion would be appreciated I'm stumped.

[@ScannerDanner]

Didn't I answer this on another video where you asked a similar question on this 7.5 about the PIP signal?

[@Art70s]

So what happens if i don't get power to ground side of coil but it has power on the power side...only one side lights up??

[@ScannerDanner]

It is one of two things: A. The coil primary winding is open (bad coil) B. Coil negative is being grounded all the time. Next test is to connect your test light to battery positive and make sure coil negative does not light. If it does, it is being grounded all the time. WARNING. Coil positive should be powered up during this test (key on). If it is not, the test I am suggesting can backfeed and give you inaccurate results.

[@Art70s]

@@ScannerDanner ok thank you will try and get back to you after

[@kennethstrait6391]

just one(1) thing,u should have put the old mod that was inside truck on,just to see if it ran with it or not.was it a parts chaner or a part on the problem???that's all thank you...

[@Trev-fl1oe]

Hi Mr danner I have a ford in Australia 93 model using same ecu 4 in a 6.i done all in vid only thing with mine is spourt only 1.34 v at dizzy connector and at pin on ecu. Every thing else is in spec still won't fire but has spark from coil with lead and plug as soon as you hook it to distributor no spark.down test light on pip fired pump relay injectors but no spark.is it pick up ,ecu.just ask for your opion im trying not to be a part changer.peace

[@joeyv1969]

Great video!!! I have a gremlin in a ‘94 F-150, truck went to a local shop to get running. It didn’t have spark. Distributor was changed, truck started, was running fine, I drove it home. Truck died. Would not start. The mechanic came days later. Truck started about a dozen times or so. We cycled the key on and off (to hear fuel pump prime) about 5 times or so, truck died again, no spark, no fuel pump prime. Any ideas? Everyone baffled, I’m not mechanically inclined. Thanks!!

[@ScannerDanner]

no prime, no spark at the same time? you need to focus on the ECM powers and grounds and 5v reference circuit. I bet when this happens you have no 5v ref on your TPS or MAP sensor

[@joeyv1969]

@@ScannerDanner thanks for the info, this truck has many baffled. Going to check this out. The shop was thinking it was a faulty distributor/pick up coil

[@ScannerDanner]

@@joeyv1969 absolutely not! A faulty pickup will NOT cause a loss of fuel pump prime. It will keep the fuel pump from turning back on during cranking, but the key on initial prime will still be there!

[@joeyv1969]

@@ScannerDanner are you anywhere near Wyoming Pennsylvania? Lol. I need you to figure this truck out. Seriously, thanks for the info. Your videos are great. Love seeing the OBS Fords being worked on

[@brendanbarnett2724]

I got a 96 7.5… new coil, solenoid, and ignition module. Starts once in a blue moon but wont run more than 5 mins then wont start again. The yellow/tan wire on the coil plug does not light up so its not getting power. Tested the resistance and the wire is fine. When i did the pip wire thing i got spark, then it started. Then after i turned off i tried the pip wire again and no spark. what am i missing?

[@kgomotsoboshomane3024]

hey where can i get car wiring diagrams for computer or is there any app?

[@ScannerDanner]

eautorepair.adtrk.biz/?a=10817&c=24&p=r&s1= This is the DIY version of what I use

[@sanelelukhele4849]

Hi Paul and everyone, I know question is not related to video. Can by any chance a scan tool(cheap) damage pcm I've heard so saying it does any info on that

[@ScannerDanner]

I don't think so my friend

[@calastiels6733]

Hey I have a question, I was recalibration my tps, when I noticed my top wire(blk/w) was acting as my signal wire. So I tested the ACT and ECT to find they were acting as my signal wire. This is on a 1990 ford bronco II 2.9l. Do you have any suggestions?

[@ScannerDanner]

Give me the readings on all 3 tps wires

[@calastiels6733]

Green 5.05v, bk/w 1.07, o/w 0.00. When engaging the throttle the bk/w goes up in value like a signal wire, based on the diagrams though, it should be a ground.

[@ryanwilliams8416]

Hi Paul. I'M A HUGE FAN! LOL. As I was watching I thought of another variable for a no signal. Wouldn't a broken timing chain or sheard distributor gear pin also cause a no signal from the pickup. PLEASE LET ME KNOW. Thanks 👍

[@ScannerDanner]

Yes! The difference in my case was the intermittent nature of the no spark condition. So I completely disregarded that, but you're right, I should have mentioned this.

[@MikeF421]

Recently had a 1995 F350 no spark come in. Owner had changed ICM and coil. I unplugged Spout, no spark. Bright light on both sides of coil, but no control. Good PIP. Good power and ground at ICM. Scratching head, suspected owner got bad chinesium module. Plugged in new chinesium module, no spark. Hmmm. Ordered Uscope. Decided to check continuity while waiting on Uscope. Just so happen to check coil neg from coil to ICM first, 50ohm. Hmm. Wiggle harness, get down to 1ohm, spark. The square jack plug on fender was loose, which confuses me because I had bright lights at coil and good PIP. Oh well, it's fixed and out the door.

[@ScannerDanner]

Remote mounted ICM? (Not on distributor) maybe the PIP was grounded on the distributor housing and the ICM on the fender?

[@MikeF421]

@@ScannerDanner yep remote icm, how did I get good bright test light at both coil terminals through a high resistance loose connector? Unless both wires going through same connector were both equally dim and I didn't notice with no reference "bright" light. And also a good pip voltage through the same connector? PIP was 65mv and 10.23v when bumping through the shutter wheel. All the quick tests pointed to a bad module, had everything required except coil control pulse. Was just a confusing issue since the quick checks are usually accurate indicators for me.