WF Bern C42 & E22: Stgw90 Trials Rifles to Compete With SIG

[@hobbstactv2571]

That little storage space in the grip looks like it would be perfect for storing a bunch of extra charging handles.

[@MrSam1er]

Why did no one think of this ? XD

[@Soff1859]

The sig 550/stgw90 also has a compartment in the pistol grip and in the swiss army it is issued with a loading tool in there to load mags with the stripper clips the ammo comes with

[@earlemin]

@@Soff1859 Although a backup charging handle isn't a bad idea either, i've seen too many of them where the damn rubber was torn off or damaged.

[@Soff1859]

@@earlemin actually the charging handle would even fit inside the loading tool. Would be too easily lost tho i think.

[@Ireallylikeeggs]

You could also put jerky in there so you have jerky whenever you want to have jerky

[@Celebmacil]

Wow, they "lost" the charging handles from the trials rifles? Color me shocked. I'm sure there aren't 30 Swiss soldiers running around to this day with a C42/E22 rifle charging handle for a key chain fob. No way.

[@andrewholdaway813]

They should have had a spare in the pistol grip

[@192mickey]

@@andrewholdaway813 should have left the charging handle captive

[@john-paulsilke893]

Soldiers, they will break stuff, lose stuff and use it in ways never thought of.

[@stevegable2707]

thats what I thought lol either that or someone lost one which started the fun and games of stealing everyone elses ! boys will be boys !

[@deviljelly3]

You should tell us when you come to Switzerland... A meet up would be great for your Swiss fans

[@frankwalker3362]

He announces meet ups to his patreon contributors.

[@deviljelly3]

Blessed is our Lord....

[@ThePolorex]

+1

[@borismuller86]

Be sure to bring your lovely Swiss guns along!

[@farmerbrown84]

He was here in Oct '17, last I heard.

[@HazardousMoose]

The red 3 / white 4 marking on Swiss Army guns stands for 400m if aiming for center of mass and 300m if aiming at the lower edge of the black of the 300m target during the standard shooting competition in Switzerland. You can find the same marking on the Stgw90 with a white 3 aperture followed by a red 3 / white 4 aperture. AFAIK the combat aperture isn't specially marked on Swiss guns, on the Stgw 90 it's the 200m aperture, simply marked as a white 2.

[@ARCNA442]

And they say the US military has a problem with emphasizing target shooting over practical shooting.

[@HazardousMoose]

@@ARCNA442 if only you knew:D Turns out the bipod on the Stgw 90 is at best questionable in the field, the sling is too short to be used effectively in the field and had to be modified with either para cord or with elastic band for frontline infantry and in 2018 the vast majority of soldiers still has to use diopter ironsigths. The whole sling thing is double funny because the Stgw 90 has 3 sling mounts for a two-point sling: First one at the gas block(where the front sight is), Second at the end of the receiver(close to the rear sight) but also a third mount at the rear end of the buttstock. Idea being that you connect the sling 1. to 2. mount for presentation and carry out of danger with the stock folded, but when you'd have to possibly use your rifle you were supposed to use the 2. and 3. mount, creating a short loop that would go around your neck and under your shooting shoulder. But the 3. mount at the stock disconnects often when the gun doesn't hang in the sling and so most soldiers don't even know about this configuration, even though the original sling length only works with this 2. to 3. sling configuration and most rear echelon troops never got equipped or lost their sling extensions so they can't carry their rifles ready for use.

[@farmerbrown84]

@@ARCNA442 Yeah, the Swiss have it badly, but at least a significant portion of their (male) population can shoot at a tolerable level of proficiency.

[@shi01]

@@HazardousMoose Well, as far as i now the 2-3 cofiguration is not described in the official swiss army manual for the Stgw. 90, that's why hardly anybody even in the army knows it exists. The first time i saw it was when an Officer showed it to me who normaly it responsible for the training of the swiss mountain grenadiers and that was long after my basic training.

[@HazardousMoose]

@@shi01 AFAIK it was the original intended way to carry the rifle in the field, which is why the sling was made as short as it was made. But after fielding they realised that the hook would often disconnect from the 3rd mount during use, which obviously was not acceptable. Hence they started issuing the sling extensions and replaced the 2.-3. mount sling setup in the manual with a section on how to install the extensions using para cord. Though I can't find an original manual so might be wrong.

[@Panzerfan93]

There was also a Bullpup version as far as i know Also, the barrel change was, according to an article i read in a magazine, supposed to be as followed: Everybody gets the full length rifle. but depending on your job, you get a shorter barrel issued during service. you give it back and switch it out for the long one when you go home

[@fenixman2]

I cant find anything about a bullpup version, do you know whats its name was? It sounds interesting

[@Panzerfan93]

@@fenixman2 I didn't find much, but apparently there were at least 2 prototypes: an earlier one called WEIZE Maschinenpistole (WEIZE is an abbreviation for the rifle program, i sadly can't find the article were it said what it meant) and a later one labeled as "5.6mm Kurz C2" (5.6 refers to the 5.56mm NATO cartridge) i found a picture of it with the other rifles from Gunco-Books-Tripod

[@fenixman2]

@@Panzerfan93 awesome, thanks!

[@mattfleming86]

I love how the upper receiver went all the way out to the gas block. I imagine with a NON quick change barrel (i.e. firmly affixed at both the chamber/barrel extension and in the front at the gas block) accuracy would improve. That with a non-reciprocating charging handle that stayed in the gun and the results could have been very different. I would love to own it as-is, and the potential "A1" in my head would be a surprisingly modern-featured rifle. It is quite nice.

[@Diego-k4u]

"And the day before christmas he displayed 3 swiss prototype rifles amen"

[@borismuller86]

Diego Legui 🎵🎶AND A CARTRIDGE IN .303 🎶🎵

[@scowler92]

AMEN.

[@tllt5472]

This is a really fascinating video. I have never seen these prototypes before. I'm glad we ended up with the STGw90 over these rifles.

[@sawyere2496]

Yeah, they look kinda sucky

[@71TOXIC]

Salü, e ha das Gwehr scho e de Händ gha: Das esch e top Waffe! Klar, s 90er esch erschtklassig, kä Frog, aber d GP 80 wär as Kaliber de GP 90 klar öberläge. Aso esch das Waffesyschtem dorchus es Aug vou wärt!!! E Gruess, ond guet Schoss.

[@jesusdontlikethatimgaybuts9493]

in fairness they probably would have been more refined if they ever were adopted

[@Sergeant1127]

I looks like a low effort video game model, I love it.

[@hellcatdave1]

Blacklight: Retribution.

[@NarfoOnTheNet]

Reminds me of a gun from E.Y.E. Divine Cybermancy

[@scowler92]

@@hellcatdave1 It fits.

[@DeNihility]

@@hellcatdave1 definitely BLR-ish. Reminds me of the default SMG, though the default AR was also kind of inspired by the Sig SG550 series.

[@gregorycomey]

G3a3s weird son

[@TheArmourersBench]

So you could say the Swiss, weren't feeling the Bern?

[@TheKlink]

somebody were definitely Bern-ed.

[@3Dant]

They were impressed by the competition's SIGnature quality

[@iac4357]

BWA HA HA HA !

[@iac4357]

@8:00- The 3/4 setting isn't a Battle Sight, it's for competition shooting. With the dial set to 3/400 meters, you shoot at 300 meters, with a 6 o'clock hold on a 23.62" black circle. And to be fair, the Sig removable charging handle isn't much larger !

[@TheTejanoJose]

Thank you Ian for bringing a Swiss topic on December 24th. The Red 3 setup is used on all Swiss Stgw to zero in the rifle at 300 meters using the A target. The "Scheibe A" is a bullseye target with a black target in a 60 cm diameter. Standart target setup is 200 meters or "Visier 2". Ex Swiss Mountain Infantry NCO

[@seppesneyers3592]

MERRY CHRISTMAS FELLAS

[@JahgotMoney25]

*Christmas eve

[@deviljelly3]

Close enough :)

[@Beavereaver]

seppe sneyers merry Christmas.

[@codyjackalope8464]

Merry Christmas mr wolf

[@thecynic75]

Thanks for all your great work, Ian. I think I can speak for us all when I say we appreciate it!

[@charleshaynes815]

You were in familiar stomping grounds. My Wife grew up in Konstanz Germany just a few blocks from the auction house. Very cool

[@Kampfhamster81]

same here. The store is just 20 minutes away from where I live. Been there many times.

[@HFMartini6]

Fun Fact about the Swiss Army: You can break whatever you like and it's totaly fine but if you loose something you're screwed.

[@Lobstersarefabulouz]

Sbg

[@Amondsen3]

@@Lobstersarefabulouz ska

[@TiloHalvorsen]

HF_Martini6 Ja denn ich de Fäldi hässig😅

[@Marco-ie2xn]

Selbst erlebt?

[@Lonewolf6565]

Thats any military. They care more about lost shit because shit going unaccounted for is still the responsibility of the military. Last summer US troops lost a belt fed machine gun off the back of a truck somewhere inside the country and the whole unit was shaken down and people lost their careers.

[@jesusoftheapes]

that .250 savage was a hell of a gun cartridge that was way ahead of its time!! Would loved to have shot this prototype you are showing here . . Savage is responsible for some of the best old calibers like the .300 savage ,.22-70 grn high power , and the .250 savage that became the famous rounds we still use today like the .308 winchester , the .223 and the .243 winchester . The Savage 99 was probably the best lever rifle ever invented and Savages practice of finding the best hunting calibers of that era do not get enough credit as one of the most important rifle manufacturers ever . Winchester and Browning take most of the credit and rightfully so but anyone having a conversation about the history of rifles and cartridges you cannot forget Arthur Savage ! He made some wonderful hunting rifles that are still relevant today as well as the radial tire ! Forgotten weapons needs to do a savage 99 model comparison and a tell everyone who Savage Was . With every weapon you have done on this channel it still blows mind that you have ignored Arthur Savages rifles and weapons systems . More people need to know what this man did !

[@farmerbrown84]

Not sure baout the .223, but you missed the most obvious - the .22/250 - which is an awesome cartridge! And it shares the case rim diameter (.473" = 12mm) with the .308 family. Edit: Although I just checked the 6.45x48 XPL Swiss cartridge, and it had a slightly smaller rim diameter than the .473".

[@mazkact]

www.forgottenweapons.com/biographies/arthur-w-savage/

[@falcon-jy5wt]

I think the multi tool is one of the best features of the weapon.Bore carbon scrapper, head space guide, Gas tube adjustment, and site adjustment tool all in one. With it's very own storage place. the weapon it's self is very nice to look at.

[@Lion_Hamza]

Fröhlichi Wiehnachte a alli Schwizer und natürli a alli ned Schwizer :)

[@thegoldencaulk2742]

Between the chunky grip and the nice fat buttons for disassembly, this seems like a very comfy gun

[@mrkeogh]

The quick change barrel mechanism might have been the cause of the poor accuracy: not hard to imagine it could have been headspacing or alignment issues if the barrel was moving ever so slightly throughout the trials.

[@helveticarms]

I wonder if the charging handle getting lost really played much of a role in the selection, considering that the charging handle from the SG550 rifle they actually adopted, also requires the removal of the similarly sized charging handle to take out the bolt. Very interesting video!

[@JizzburnGigaqueer]

Really aesthetically pleasing rifle honestly

[@NookyAvenger]

The red 3 on sight elevation is to shoot at 300m holding the sight at the bottom 6 o'clock on the target to get a bullseye while seeing the whole target.

[@farmerbrown84]

Correct - it's for lollipop hold on the black centre of 300m target rather than a centre target hold.

[@Braun30]

The red distance number on the aiming drum is the setting to shoot what we call "A" target where we actually aim at the 6 o'clock position of the black circle at the centre of the target. By aiming there, the hit point is the bullseye.

[@TheAngryPasta]

Merry G11 Eve

[@thomasschreiber9559]

Christmas in Switzerland? Sounds good.

[@Kappi1997]

11:40 True that but for an easy reason. In switzerland you have to store the bolt and the gun seperatly if it is fully automatic because it is a "forbidden" gun by law. You can still get it by a special permit or the army but you have to lock in the bolt seperatly to the gun...

[@1988thefreeman]

So it's illegal to possess the rifle you're required by law to possess? xP

[@AllAboutMiims]

Illegal to store the parts together*

[@Kappi1997]

@@1988thefreeman kinda, but if you are a person in service the law is special anyways. I mean in my country only the police and the army are allowed to carry a gun except transporting it to a gun range

[@azk3826]

@@1988thefreeman You don't own your rifle, it's still the army's property. The army allows you to take it home. When you finish your duty, you can keep the rifle but the full auto parts are removed

[@mousseman8239]

The charging handle of the SIG550 is not THAT much better when it comes to losing it.

[@christopherpappas7474]

Hey Ian, you do know that you can take a day off once and a while! We all love ya and want you healthy and happy for many, many years to come so.... Merry Christmas to you and yours. PEACE:) And a good bottle of cognac also...:)

[@mrb692]

One of the perks of filming and processing in batches is scheduled uploads

[@christianstahl4099]

mrb692: Do not ruin the fun...

[@user-ko1vj2tx6q]

Lan if not you,your channel,i would not made my project over without knowledge i got from your videos,thank you dude for your job

[@simonrival1613]

What a wonderful Christmas present from Ian. I am sorry that I didn't get you anything in return.

[@edward9674]

Merry Christmas from Finland!

[@farukaydinsteel]

This channel is a treasure for gun lovers.

[@Kulichenko88]

Bolt mechanism resembles AB-46 by Bulkin, one of Kalashnikov's competitors in 1948 trials. It took 2nd place (1st was AK-47, of course). So history repeated itself.

[@Scardpelt]

Beautiful firearms

[@JahgotMoney25]

Ok

[@edlubs11]

Thanks Ian. Nothing else to say but hopefully more fan interaction makes the video more popular.

[@1973honza]

Christmas evening is today here, so merry christmas from czech rep. Ian and eveyone else. This is one of my favorite channels, thank you for your work.

[@phille7669]

I feel like a kid again waiting for Christmas morning. The G11 video is going to be my favorite present. Besides the jelly of the month club.

[@devilnion]

You brighten my Christmas with this clip, thank you

[@ravener96]

that proprietary cartridge did come with something, but i wasnt blown away. 55gr 556 has about 1760 joules. the proprietary cartridge had 2542 joules. so it was about 3/2 of the energy of 556.

[@tripleog9557]

I just searched the comments hoping someone would be able to explain the brass widget thing..? And I realized it’s a prototype so not gonna get an answer there... my best guess would be with u Ian, probably some kind of chamber or bolt carbon scraper...??? Love the content

[@joshua7233]

It makes sense why that one part would have been lost so frequently, but also, as a soldier, it is part of your responsibility to understand your firearm and know its operations. If you disassemble your gun and can't even keep all the parts together, that's not a very good look.

[@maryolee8303]

You have the best job in the whole country. I love your channel.

[@cookingonthecheapcheap6921]

Merry Christmas Ian, thanks for the mind meltingly detailed videos teaching me more then I thought I could about the weapons used in the conflicts I've studied. Have a great Christmas and I hope you have a happy and productive new year.

[@mrb692]

With how tiny that bolt handle is, you’d think the doctrine would be to store it alongside the stripper clip guide in the pistol grip. I wonder why that wasn’t the case?

[@CadmusCurtis]

Wow what a unique cool looking gun, I want one! The color pattern gets me with the matte finish on the metal

[@_Wiseguy7]

For some reason, when I hear WF Bern, I expected it to be toggle locked somehow. Merry Christmas everyone.

[@browndd]

It seems to me to an easy fix for the "losable" charging handle would have been to just magnetize its base. Even a weak magnetic attraction like for instance the kind you might find on a screwdriver would probably have been enough to prevent it being lost in most cases.

[@AmbientSpectrum]

I would bet that the fancy barrel quickchange system was responsible for the accuracy problems- too much freedom between the barrel and the body/sights

[@crazyfvck]

@AmbientSpectrum Possibly. However, I think it might also have to do with the bolt only having two locking lugs. One of the main reasons that the AR15 is inherently accurate is due to the large number of locking lugs that it has.

[@arielgarcia5065]

@@crazyfvck ak/ stg90 only has two (but bigger) locking lugs

[@arielgarcia5065]

@@crazyfvck and I'm not sure but fn fnc also has only two locking lugs .... Remember m1 garand/ m14 / m1a ....all of them only have two locking lugs... And all of them are accurate

[@mattclements1933]

@@arielgarcia5065 The FNC has like two and a half lockinglugs...two definitely (like the rifle in the video) and another that may or may not be a true locking lug. While it is an excellent rifle overall, it is no where near as accurate as my AR.

[@chbonnhoff]

The red 3 is for target site shooting when you aim according the „black 6“ target rule. Which means that you aim directly under the black center circle so that only a tine string of white is showing. If you master this kind of aiming you are much more precise. All Swiss Stgw have this feature.

[@kenhelmers2603]

Pretty darn slick, I like that EZ swap barrel :) Thanks Ian

[@ironwolfF1]

Interesting weapons, but no, an easily lost charging handle is a no go. OTOH, a storage space for a stripper clip is a clever idea worth copying... after-market manufacturers take note.

[@scwhk1]

Its basically the same design as in a lot of other rifles, for example FNC. No one ever make a big fuzz about losing the charging handle.

[@yangcheng-jyun8542]

Basically,it's a Swiss problem.No other militaries will complain about it

[@pamerak]

On the StGw 90, which was selected over these, the charging handle slots back into the bolt after removal with a spring-loaded lever. The stripper clip in the bottom of the handle was also issued on the StGw 90.

[@andik.4235]

Nice video as always. The brass widget thing is probably a cleaning tool like the "L-Stück" for the Sig 550 for cleaning the gas system at the gas port and the locking lugs cut outs at the chamber. The caming system for the bolt is very unique. But over all... very AK like, like the Sig 550: Two lug bolt, long stroke gas system, non free floating barrel. Triggers are always good in swiss military fire arms. But this Sig 550 trigger is a real clock work thing. In full auto for example, the hammer falls exactly 20 times, matching magazin capacity. And you don`t have to clean it regardless how dirty it is, because you can destroy it. The rest of the gun is pretty straight forward. It is a heavy, pleassant to shoot, acurate rifle, and you have to deal with HK style sights. Oh, and the charging handle is on the wrong side, just like an AK, but you don`t loose it. And no quick detach barrel, which is most likely responsible for better accuracy compared to the WF Bern rifles.

[@cyri96]

how the Barrel and sights on the 550 are fixed together certainly should help with accuracy, though it makes things a bit unwieldy for cleaning as that whole assemly quite unwieldy.

[@terry7907]

“They didn’t shoot so well, which is a really big thing in Switzerland.” Glad it is somewhere.

[@beaconsandhelos]

The red three is for use with standard targets in the 300m range (the Stgw 57 and 90 both have it too). The idea: you aim your sights to the lower end of the black center bit on the standard target (instead of aiming at the center itself) but the round will still hit the center... it's an aiming aid.

[@pLAST3RdISAST3R]

W.O.W. So glad to see this one, don't think I've ever heard of it before. I knew Bern would've had to of made an entry for those trials.

[@stevethorn7634]

Ian, just subscribed to your channel. Unfortunately I live in the UK so you know how restrictive our firearms laws are. So watching you channel is not only hugely informative but it gives me the opportunity to see and experience firearms that I will never have a chance to see or handle. However their is light at the end of the tunnel as my in laws live in Texas so every visit involves a trip to the gun shops!

[@crazyfvck]

@Steve Thorn Good man ;) Always nice to hear about law-abiding Brits getting a taste of actual freedom :)

[@spoeny]

There is one up for auction at Kessler on the 22 of August 2020, 4000 CHF estimate and full auto of course! And a total of FIVE SG 541 in 6.45mm as well, including one short version...

[@mueffe1357]

I'm confused. They dq this gun because charging handle? The 550 has a handle similar size to this gun and also detachable when disassembling too. Probably the bigger problem was that detachable barrel ruining the accuracy? Hmm.. weird

[@johneden2033]

It's probably a combination of the quick-change barrel lockup not being tight enough, and the bolt only having 2 locking lugs, which doesn't give a very consistent lock compared to bolts with more lugs, like the AR15 or Sig 550.

[@ChasseurKGB]

The charging handle on a 540/550 series gun can be retained in the BCG even when it’s out of the gun (lever the arm up to disconnect BCG from gas piston and remove it, then place the charging handle in the removed BCG and the spring loaded arm will retain it). To do a similar thing with this, I suppose it could be put in the trap or even a small magnet added to keep the pieces together to comply with Swiss conscript doctrine. Anyway, they are so similar (both long stroke guns with recoil spring over the barrel) that I’m not surprised it came down to minor stuff like that, and the QC barrel option seems to have negatively affected accuracy, as well as the insanely slim profile of the barrel.

[@farmerbrown84]

The other trick is to put the charging handle for the Stgw 90 in the flash hider. I leave my bolts in my (non full-auto) SIG's since they are kept in safe, but I take the charging handle out to save space with the rifles stacked next to each other. That sits in the flash suppressor.

[@Frankdude72]

I was thinking the same thing...

[@Ompasikom]

WFB could've done a lug-and-latch type attachment point for the cocking handle, similar to the Sig550. But I guess the lack of accuracy was the deciding factor.

[@FalcotteGeneva]

Thank you for this video (as a Swiss it's very intersting, love your work Ian). I was wondering, will you study one day the "PP-19" ?

[@rogerwennstrom6677]

Those nicely aligned serial numbers makes the OCD in me happy :)

[@ohredhk]

Another good one. It keeps getting better!

[@RhodeIslandWildlife]

Merry Christmas Ian, thanks for all the great videos.

[@yahyamusseb]

I love how it looks simple on the outside

[@Braun30]

Actually in summer of 1980 we tried a prototype by WFB for a couple of days during my Unteroffizierschule in Airolo, school 209/80.

[@humanbass]

I like this designa lot, especially the long bolt throw to increase dwell time.

[@loupiscanis9449]

Thank you Ian .

[@stefankrebs7593]

Funny that the SIG550 has a even smaller removable charging handle which never gets lost.. ;-) when we take out the breech...

[@johnlittlejohn2615]

Thanks for all u do Ian. Merry Christmas and happy New year.

[@norbertolagrava4734]

Clever gun, your enemy think you are armed with an ughly toy, left their cover, and you shoot them

[@supermilkshake6745]

Merry Christmas

[@seanjoseph8637]

Merry Christmas to you and yours Ian, I look forward to more of your awesome content.

[@2Potates]

They kind of look like generic video game guns.

[@JahgotMoney25]

True

[@SteveSmith-wm4qy]

That's what makes them awesome

[@leamas1210]

they look like the ARs from HITMAN

[@bomric1788]

@@leamas1210 My thoughts EXACTLY

[@drownsinkoolaid4203]

Looks like something you'd see called "Assault Rifle" or "Full Auto Rifle" or something in a game by City Interactive or something lol

[@Ratrazor]

That's a really cool gun I can't believe I've never heard of it before.

[@matteci]

Cool piece. The fact to lose the charging handle didn't change so much on the Sig 550, the biggest difference is that on the 550 you can actually put back the charging handle on the bolt body like if it is in the gun. The 550 bolt is the exact copy of an ak bolt except for the gas piston that is detachable in the 550, the thing that keeps together the bolt and the gas piston is actually the charging handle. The red 3 is probably the zero you have with the open notch. On the 550 you have the 1 setting open notch and night sights than 2,3 and 4 in white numbers and those are aperture sights. On the white 4 you also have a red 3 because there is actually a part you can remove with a screwdriver and the hole becomes much larger and the army uses that bigger aperture as a battle sight setting. I've personally shooed up to 400 meters with the wide aperture sight without any particularly difficulty. Cool to see that the army wanted the capability to use rifle grenades but they basically never did with the 550 due to the stocks being to fragile. Last thing a question for you. Do you know If the 541 series trial guns ever had a 5,56 version? I hane an hensold scoope marked Sig 541 5,56 mm but for what I know officaly they made only 6,45mm. Hope you will read my comment and next tile you travel to Switzerland please organize a meeting, we would preaty appreciate to meet you!

[@scwhk1]

When I first saw the locking method of the charging handle on the sig550, I thought it was way too complicated than it is needed. I still think it is too complicated and the complain about losing the charging handle on C42 is too specific.

[@farmerbrown84]

> The red 3 is probably the zero you have with the open notch. No, I think it's like the Stgw 90 - the red 3 is for shooting "lollipop" at the black centre bull of the 300m "A" target rather than at centre target. > On the white 4 you also have a red 3 because there is actually a part you can remove with a screwdriver and the hole becomes much larger and the army uses that bigger aperture as a battle sight setting. The big apeture on the red 3 setting is threaded on the '90, so that the adjustable diopter can be fitted. I thought the standard battle setting for the 90 was 200m.

[@thomasromanelli2561]

Happy Birthday, Gun Jesus!

[@alessandrok.9684]

Gotta say, I'm happy that we chose the SIG gun. It just looks so much better...

[@andeeeyeyou7665]

Something about that trigger guard is really aesthetically appealing. reminds me of a lever action rifle or something.

[@ThePolorex]

16:53 Not entirely sure, but I suspect the metal plate in the grip could be used to "convert" the trigger group into semi-only. Since I didn't a possibility to do that on the fire selector itself, like it's common on the SG 550 and that's a legal requirement when you take the rifle home.

[@DokDo1995]

Its very interesting that the flashhider from the carbine is nearly the same as on the Stgw 90 and also the stock...Greetings and merry christmas from Switzerland... Ps: Every swiss soldier keeps his rifle after his service and he zeroes the rifle so that it shoots good for the individual soldier... I hope theres a SIG550 episode coming...

[@leroyatleroys]

It may not have been the best rifle. But it had some pretty good ideas. It certainly had good modular features that took a while to show up in modern designs today. I also think it is interesting how they wanted to experiment with a larger cartridge. The U.S. military has been looking into a middle cartridge between 5.56 and 7.62. Something with a little more stopping power and grain than 5.56, but still high velocity, high penetrating, and somewhat light. I find it peculiar that watching vids on old designs make me excited to see how modern military arms develop in the future.

[@timblack2885]

The bolt system looks like it may have been a forerunner to the Tavor bolt/carrier/mainspring design

[@fab006]

I’m sure someone in these comments has already said it, but red three on Swiss sights means 6 o’clock hold at 300m. They are identical to the 400m setting on 5.56 guns, but for instance the Stgw 57 has a separate red three and white four.

[@fredboat]

The flat metal tool in the grip looks like it would fit over and or into the magazine and maybe a head space gauge. Enjoyed the video. Merry Xmas.

[@jasonz7788]

Great work

[@Thatonedude917]

I really like the way it looks

[@ratchet2505]

Owe, nearly forgot. Marry Christmas Ian.

[@luzianwasescha6056]

Hi Ian! The Red 3 on the rear sight(which is also present on the stgw57 an stgw90) is used as a 6 o clock hold on the target. Many target shooters prefer that. Shows how important out of duty shooting was in Switzerland. Regards fron Switzerland

[@ForgottenWeapons]

Ah, noted - thanks!

[@luzianwasescha6056]

It beginns even earlier. The 300m setting on the K31 for example is adjusted to use as a 6‘o clock hold. Not so much to see an enemy soldier better, but more for 300m target competition.

[@daddynaz8458]

Thank you ian, very cool.

[@adistancu6545]

Merry Christmas Jan !!!

[@crabmansteve6844]

"If you guys like a pistol grip, you should *really* enjoy our patented Staple-Gun style grip"

[@antonizajac3907]

Been waiting for this one

[@magoid]

Ian says one of the downsides of the rifle is the removable charging handle, but the chosen model, the Sig 550, also have a removable CH, so a bunch other rifles, and nobody seems to have a problem with that.

[@jarvy251]

That's really interesting, I thought that bolt cam pin setup was unique to the TAR21, but I guess everything really is borrowed from somewhere!

[@LordStarbeard]

Merry Christmas Ian and Carl, and a happy new year :)

[@Chris-0123]

merry christmas Ian.

[@williamhart4896]

That c42 is very interesting like the grip design and quick change barrel charging handle not so much thanks and have a merry Christmas eave all .

[@Galildoughty]

Good stuff, thanks Ian.

[@Hurbie_53]

Seeing those prototypes I have to admit they really went for the better gun. Not only for the accuracy but also for the serviceability. The Stgw 90 takes apart very easily and properly. Hint: Put grease on the gas tube, no matter what the armory says ;-) We all had rust on the gas tube because we've been wrongly told not to put grease on them during basic military training.

[@MrSam1er]

Funny, they told us to put it on. Looks like it changed since you went there.