Formation 101

[@StuPierce77]

Thanks Scott! Been flying civilian formation for years, and just looking to standardize the flight. I appreciate this series.

[@40joel]

This was done really well, Thank you for posting.

[@SVSky]

Very special moment flying close but the attention required is pretty intense! Looking forward to the entire series!

[@gregknipe8772]

thank you. I grew up along runways as a child, on air bases, and have always been fascinated with high speed flight and tactical team work.

[@willhibbardii2450]

Crop-dusting is probably the last bastion of practical formation flying practice. The subtle nuances of a team of crop-dusters coordinated with ground crew teams is the ability to speak without saying words other than morning and see you tomorrow at X... I'm cooking breakfast Sunday 10AM to Noon... Scott, your invited as my guest.

[@john-lb5fu]

Thank you Mr.Perdue. I love knowledge gap materials.

[@mutthaam2396]

I'll, fly with Stachel. You're The Best, Scott!!!

[@kevincollins8014]

You do such an amazing job explaining things aviation. Your channel is most definitely a one of a kind. Thanks for taking the time to put these videos together and share a little bit of your knowledge with us Scott.

[@tcook6759]

Excellent video. Thanks so much for bringing me up to speed on a subject that I hadn’t thought was so scientific. Great stuff.

[@ss442es]

Thanks Scott. Ferried a Cherokee back from Oregon that was weathered in and we flew back together in a fairly wide formation because honestly, I didn't feel confident flying close at all and stuck with my current skillset at the time.

[@airboss5446]

Thanks for this Scott. I’m hosting a group of combat wounded vets next week in Punta Gorda where we will have eight T-34’s participating to give the guys a couple demonstration flights to expose them to formation flying ..( all aviation enthusiasts). I will be leading with Brad Hood’s old airplane ( bought it last year… third one I’ve had and the last one! It’s an exceptional example. Btw… sent the link to this video to the 7 participating vets to give them the overview prior to arrival . Good stuff.

[@FlyWirescottperdue]

Sounds like fun. I love the T-34, Brad Hood is a good friend. I wish I could come, I need to rehack my Leader card!

[@alecdoyle6268]

Thank you for the knowledge. I’m just a hobby guy learning basics of everything I can. I have a jeppisen set from 2015 and I’m so far behind it’s a joke. I hope to one day use these to be trining in sims at PSA pacific state aviation in concord ca.

[@peterbrown6224]

Thank you, Scott.

[@GrumpyOldMan2]

For me, formation flying is very exacting but highly rewarding. And the bigger the plane, the harder it is due to mass and inertia. I think the largest plane I've flown formation in is a P3 (135,000 lbs). Smallest, Tiger Moth. Love it.

[@tymatt4555]

Thanks looking forward. To 2 and 3

[@alecdoyle6268]

I’m still learning thank you.

[@rgalbert63]

Thank you, sir for this outstanding explanation

[@jonclassical2024]

Fantastic educational video series Scott, thanks!!!

[@spdaltid]

Nice intro and stressed the important bits. 'Plan the flight and fly the plan' - backed up by sound SOP's.

[@FlyWirescottperdue]

Exactly!

[@arcanondrum6543]

Great Video. My cat made me miss some in the middle. My cat is worth that and more. I'll replay the middle.

[@mig29fulcrumflyer]

There are four Thorp T-18s at my home-drome, all owned by retired fighter pilots. One guy flew F-4s and Strikes, two flew light-gray Eagles and me (light-grays, F-5s, Vipers and MiG-29s). All are FWS grads. Occasionally we'll all go same-way/same-day and have done low-altitude tac formation. Fun and challenging, but the sight pictures and timing of the turns are totally different due to the small turn radii and high turn rates of around 150 KIAS versus the speeds flown in fighters. Plus, a wall o'Thorps isn't spread 5 or 6 miles across like a wall of fighters. As for me, flying formation for the sake of flying formation doesn't get me very spun up. I guess it goes back to your first statement about formation flying being a tool.

[@FlyWirescottperdue]

Yeah, if you’re not doing 450 knots you don’t need to turn at 5g.

[@Flying_Snakes]

Looking forward to 201 and 301!

[@alecdoyle6268]

The a10 is the reason I feel we have great potential for our ground teams.

[@alphaquebec]

I am aware of Thach & OHare moving the Navy into 2 plane tactics but do you know of documentation that shows where the AAF and other countries and specifically the names of the pilots that moved them away from vics into 2 ship /4 ship formations?

[@FlyWirescottperdue]

The Germans adopted the Schwarm in Spain prior to WWII. That is the 'Finger 4' that broke into two ships. The British RAF knew, by rough experience, that was a superior tactic at the beginning of the war in France, but could not address it until after the Battle of Britain. I've never heard of any specific person that championed the idea in the RAF. The US sent emissaries to the UK to learn what was happening and changed tactics at some point after the US entered the war. that would be a good history monograph, or book, maybe when I get time I'll consider doing that. As I remember Gabreski was one of those folks that went to Europe to observe, but again I've never heard of a specific American that championed the idea. Would love to know! I think its pretty clear the Germans did it first (in the 1938-39 timeframe), just who that was would be interesting to know. Might need to know how to read German. O'Hare was a subordinate of Thach, Flately had ideas of his own (he shown best as an outstanding leader), but the truly original thinker of that era was Thach. His 2 ship and 4 ship ideas were seminal to Navy tactics of the time. Gentile and Goodson of the 336 FS developed a shooter/shooter tactic when they flew together that is the basis of the way USAF fighters fly combat today. It was radically different than the Leader/Wingman concept everyone else used in every theater. Great comment and question.

[@Qrail]

Scott, your videos always put scenarios in my mind. Like whether or not a F33 in a 1 v1 vs an Apache could win? Or at least get away from it.

[@FlyWirescottperdue]

I think it would mostly depend on the pilot. But I'd put my money of the F33;)

[@Qrail]

@@FlyWirescottperdue thanks for the response from your friend in Rio Linda.

[@gsxr1kmatt]

Thanks for this video, this is one of the things I really want to learn as I’d love to get into air to air photography, and keep fun flying with friends safer. The link to the manual didn’t work, and I don’t see one in the description.

[@Parr4theCourse]

Well, I know now why I don’t have a overly strong desire to do this….LOVED flying with the guys in the RV’s at ACCA, but realized I’m a long way from being good enough to learn…

[@mikebell2112]

Do formations give a significant fuel efficiency/range boost?

[@FlyWirescottperdue]

No

[@maajr57]

Good video. Thanks, but I don't see links for docs.

[@pilotashley620]

Thank you Scott! Would you be interested in doing a class on FF in person? I’m in north DFW with a v35.

[@FlyWirescottperdue]

Sure.

[@jerrysikorski219]

As a uh 1 pilot in Vietnam we always flew formation unless we were single aircraft kept us from running into each other That would be 2 aircraft or 20

[@alecdoyle6268]

How many fps am I going before thrust down? I’m 280 nmp. Closure rates?

[@alecdoyle6268]

Now days I see air crafts firball the new computer robot cannons it looks crazy. Way more than I could imagine. My mind is blow. Yet he ejected and was not shot my it.

[@vitoruffalo2576]

H-53 flight of 4, for midfield left break. #1 breaks right, I was almost killed by an idiot USMC Major, we were #2 looking at that giant rotorhead coming at us with 2 other aircraft behind us. This could have been a real disaster, A newsmaker

[@actonman7291]

I wonder what may be the favourite formation the Ghost of Kiev will set up? Cheers.

[@Bortnoone]

Air Force guy doesn’t mention the Thatch Weave, of course

[@FlyWirescottperdue]

Dude, Jeez. You need to see my video on the Battle of Midway. The Thach Weave is a tactical/ operational maneuver. It is essentially the foundation of USAF Tactical Formation and how we fly fighters. You gotta wait for Form 301 for more on that.

[@Bortnoone]

@@FlyWirescottperdue my bad. Impatient. I like your channel

[@741al6]

"There are strict rules of the road that we have to sign up for in order to earn the right to go home after each flight"

[@alecdoyle6268]

First jet can fail And it coast those behind. It those failing behind can mis judge approach to positions and cause tragedy as well.

[@Wild_Bill57]

Great video Scott! Ready to head over to the Ukraine! (JK)

[@FlyWirescottperdue]

I've been tossing and turning thinking about interdicting that convoy!

[@nickinportland]

But seriously… put Scott up there.. 😂. I can see the documentary now, rouge retired tomcat pilot suits up one last time to save Ukraine. I’d watch that.

[@SVSky]

@@FlyWirescottperdue Warheads on foreheads!

[@gtarick1225]

Talk about the russo/Ukrainian conflict!

[@FlyWirescottperdue]

Maybe, there is so much FOG going on there!

[@alecdoyle6268]

I’m just a no one in this. I love USA and air crafts.

[@alecdoyle6268]

Nope the parts will fall into the lower aircraft.