Foucault 2: Government Surveillance & Prison | Philosophy Tube

[@gnetkuji]

There's a story about a dean from a university I went to which predates my experiences there. The story goes that a large group of men had all arrayed outside one of the women's dorms on a particularly rowdy night of drinking, all prepared to storm the halls on a "panty raid." You can tell the story is old because "panty raids" were still a thing at the time. A dean happened to be on hand, saw this growing mob, and got in front of the doors they were preparing to storm. He pleaded with them not to do anything they will regret but the men ignored them. Then just as they hit critical mass and began to charge, the dean quickly began screaming out the names of every man he saw coming at him in the group. As each man heard his name, he suddenly stopped and shied away from the door until the remaining men were too small in number to continue the charge. They had lost their group identity and had become individuals. More importantly, they had become *noticed* and *recognized* individuals. The dean didn't need to know the name of every man in the group, simply enough of them to break their cohesion. Now one could easily argue that what the dean did was a good thing, and I believe it was. After all, this mob of men were in the process of breaking and entering with the purpose of sexually harassing and assaulting a dorm full of women. But it also demonstrates part of the effect Bentham was writing about. Stripping people of their anonymity and their group identity effectively renders them timid and subject to control. The dean stopped this mob of men using nothing but the way we change our behavior when we know we are being watched and recognized. Surveillance alone managed to subdue what would have taken a dozen riot-police in full gear otherwise. The real question, though, is what it does to us when we are always watched. When the dean isn't simply on hand at the right moment, but has access to a constant live-stream of our every movement and action. The dean's action was good only because of the specific situation, but would it not be more unsettling if, for example, he were at a political demonstration for gay rights and he noted down the name of every man or woman who took part? How many people could be scared away from such a demonstration by the knowledge that their identities will be noted down and preserved potentially for later judgement? The more keen the knowledge that they are being watched, the fewer people will turn out for such a demonstration. Fewer demonstrators decreases the impression of the demonstration's popularity, which discourages others from sympathizing with the demonstrators. Smaller demonstrations also make it easier to identify members which intensifies the knowledge that you are being watched. Mass surveillance is, by its very nature, antithetical to the rights of people to assemble for reasons those in power may not support.

[@conorb6281]

that is a different context to what bentham is talking about. The psychological reasons in your example are different. I think you make a good point with demonstration situation though.

[@jokul_]

Perhaps it would be more unsettling, but then it seems like the argument is really that it's okay to observe and report when the targets are bad, e.g. the sexists going on panty raid", but not when it's something that is good. You have no right to assemble, you only have a right to assemble for something good.

[@gin3868]

But who is to decide whats good or wrong?

[@jokul_]

Why does somebody have to decide what's right and what's wrong? I don't see how that's relevant here.

[@hotstixx]

Did anyone get a pair of knickers to put on their head ? A further development,similar theme - vimeo.com/9351602 Deleuze`s postscript on societies of control.

[@p382742937423y4]

Dude, I am a philosopher and I teach on Foucault. I just want to say that your channel is really good. I really applaud this work. You explain it well, your own ideas are great and I think the editing is not halfway bad. All the best to you. Greetings from Rotterdam (NL) Leonhard de Paepe

[@neneklampir6664]

Ah.. So you teach on Foucault, yes? Your comment and your identity are listed by the government. Thank you for your cooperation :)

[@pickypenelope]

The way you described Bentham's Panopticon reminded me very much of the way many describe Santa's all-seeing (all-judging) eye to their children [Elf on the Shelf indeed].

[@Pfhorrest]

Or God.

[@pickypenelope]

Fair to say.

[@klop4228]

Pfhorrest Except, in all belief systems I'm familiar with, you know at all times that God is watching; you don't know that he could be watching. There's no uncertainty.

[@MeisterHaar]

just like Bentham's Panopticon the elf on the shelf is a very disgusting way of controlling people, only difference beeing convicted prisoners in the first example and innocent children in the second.

[@pickypenelope]

I could not possibly hate the elf on the shelf more than I do. So gross.

[@alexmeyer7986]

People in amazon warehouses have to wear electronic armbands that register where they go... Seems like the subjugation isn't so subtle everywhere.

[@hotstixx]

All big box retail is horrorshow - Fordism,Taylorism,industrial psychology,art practice etc etc and you have to smile widely until your lips stick to your teeth.That`s the essence of the American dream - Pseudo happiness and optimism.. and flog product.Enjoy and take a hand in your own subjection,the payoff is always around the next corner.Frowning is heresy,dissent is crime..questioning the official orthodoxy - COMMUNISM ! Assuming authentic political agency under empire and you will find your head in a spin in the margins.They know how to ruin lives. Conservatism is a mode counterrevolutionary practice,to preserve hierarchy and power,to naturalize and fix notions of "truth" that preserve order and protect specific interests.Case in point is Jordan Peterson and his attempts to universalize man in primordial mysticism.

[@Vixielicious]

This is such a useful channel. You have no idea how many of my politics essays you have helped me pass simply by having a space where you discuss things like this. Thank you for your hard work!

[@Your2ndPlanB]

Something really interesting in this conversation is the ubiquity of cheap labour in American prisons. In fact, all physically able inmates are required to perform labour, at rates far below minimum wage, "at the grace of the state", and it is not illegal to use forced labour as a penal method. It is essentially (and explicitly!) a form of slavery, and it's happening in a developed country. This is even one of the driving forces of the prison-industrial complex: exploiting prison labour is highly profitable, especially if you can treat the inmates as sub-human. And this is just one facet of the prison-industrial complex. Really, the american penal system is the perfect illustration of Foucaults central thesis: Prisons are not for rehabilitation, deterrence oreven retribution; they are for profit.

[@SergioLongoni]

the 13th amendment abolish slavery "except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted" so forced labor in US prisons is actual slavery.

[@michellespiritual7729]

+Your2ndPlanB - prisons in America are BIG BUSINESS. Most if not all, are privately owned & it's known that judges accept money from these prisons to convict people so the beds get filled b/c they make a fortune filling beds. Of course most of the prisoners are minorities. So I don't know who pockets the cash from the sale of these items the prisoners make or the EVIL CROPS & gov't split the profits, all I know is that society with government is SLAVERY, not just the prisoners. Until we STOP allowing gov't to exist (aka control us), we are ALL slaves, some slightly freer than others, but slaves nonetheless.

[@ekki1993]

I refuse to call a country with no free healthcare "developed". Also, most of those problems are innate of the usa penitentiary system.

[@jewfroDZak]

As a former prisoner who knew nothing about this prior to my year long incarceration, let me relate what I saw. The vast majority of "jobs" are ones that the state would have to hire a non-incarcerated person to perform instead of the forced labor right there in the institution. Jobs like growing/cooking/serving the food, cutting the grass, and janitorial services. That's why you can basically double the prison population without procuring additional funding from the taxpayers--the prisoners needs are systematically provided by the other inmates... so, you might be thinking, like I used to before I actually went there, "Even if they assign you a job, it's not like they can make you actually do it. You could just stay in your cell all day and refuse, right?" Not exactly. First you're gonna get written up, charged with a crime, then you're likely to go to the "segregated unit" (solitary confinement) until your crime has been adjudicated (by 3 prison officials, not your peers). This is Illinois, btw. The penalty is 30 additional days added to your sentence for a job refusal. Wash, rinse, REPEAT. ...How insidious is that?? In theory, they could transform a year long sentence to a life sentence because you wont be their slave (Well, technically, not a slave, I suppose. I got compensated $20 a month from the state for my "job," and my job was one of the best jobs in the entire joint as far as pay is concerned).

[@ernstthalmann4306]

It's just slavery with extra steps

[@klop4228]

A lot of the CCTV cameras you see are actually empty, but there to make it look like you're being watched there, to stop crimes. Not really furthering the discussion, but I wanted to share some knowledge.

[@michaeld387]

klop422 I would say that does further the discussion. It is a modern panopticon! You don't know whether you are being watched or not (remember, the central tower had windows that the guards can see out but the prisoners cannot see in). This is supposed to force you behave because they could be watching.

[@chillsahoy2640]

I have had some experience there. One of my relatives had their debit card stolen and the thief went to the nearest ATM to take out as much money as possible. The police were able to identify which ATM had been used, but the bank that operated it said that the camera wasn't even turned on so they couldn't see the thief. In the end, the criminal was never caught because nobody knew their identity. On the one hand I'm glad that we are being surveilled and recorded less than I previously thought. On the other hand, what's the point of having so many cameras if they don't actually benefit us, the general public, when we actually need them?

[@ernststravoblofeld]

Cameras are much cheaper now, so more are real. Some aren't recording, but that is changing also.

[@neilmcdougall4927]

Modern day scarecrows

[@technophobian2962]

@@chillsahoy2640 It's been 6 years, but I would say there's two reasons. It's intended to make potential criminals scared of being caught. In theory it would deter them from committing a crime. Another reason would be to act as security theater for non-criminals. You might feel safer at an ATM when you think that there's a camera there.

[@Zelios26]

One of my favourite channels! Never stop! :)

[@RanderMinn]

I will never forget the face of my middle school art teacher, possibly the most respected teacher by the students at that time, the afternoon it was his duty to monitor after school detention. He walked in late, looked at us with an angry face full of disgust, slammed a thin folder of papers on the front desk, then said something like, ''I have to take roll then you'll work for a little while and we'll all go home.'' After sitting down he said, ''This is ridiculous they make you stay after school.'' He didn't say anything after roll, never smiled once during the entire detention, and just read a newspaper the whole time. At that moment, and not a moment earlier, I began to question authority and probably unknowingly started leaning towards Foucault's philosophies. I heard he died this year so R.I.P. Larry Woodson

[@xzonia1]

So Santa Claus is a panoptic structure for children? After all, we do tell kids: You better watch out, You better not cry, You better not pout, I'm telling you why: Santa Claus is coming to town! He's making a list, And checking it twice, Gonna find out who's naughty or nice. Santa Claus is coming to town! He sees you when you're sleeping, He knows when you're awake. He knows when you've been bad or good, So be good for goodness sake! Maybe it is this childhood indoctrination to the concept of Santa Claus (or gods, or whatever omnipotent concept exists in the society one grows up in) that causes us as adults to change our behavior when we think we're being observed. Would our behavior while being observed change as adults if we'd never known of such concepts as kids?

[@tobiashagstrom4168]

That song never made any sense to me. It seems not only to combine contradictory ideas, but implies that they follow from each other. There is clearly a contradiction between telling you to be good so Santa will give you presents, and telling you to be good for goodness sake. Why should I be good for the sake of being good, you've just spent a whole song telling me why I should be good for selfish reasons! The song even says: "He knows when you've been bad or good, So be good for goodness sake!" Which is ludicrous, because it's telling me that it somehow follows that I should be good for goodness sake, because being good has selfish motivations. It's like non-valid argument: Premise 1 - Being good for goodness sake means doing good without selfish motives. Premise 2 - You have self-centered incentives to do good. Conclusion - Therefore, do good for goodness sake (follows from p2... somehow...(even though it's contradicted by p1))

[@xzonia1]

Lol. "For goodness sake" is an expression / exclamation that means basically the same thing as saying "Good grief" (which you may hear Charlie Brown from Peanuts say quite a bit if you ever read that comic strip or watch the cartoons). :) In the song, they're not really telling you to do it for the sake of goodness, but I got a good chuckle from your response. You're totally right, though; that would be contradictory if they'd meant it literally! Thanks, Tobias! : ) There's a Friends episode in which Joey tells Phoebe there's no such thing as an unselfish good deed, which sets her on a quest to do a good deed that doesn't make her happy to do. It was a funny episode. :)

[@noobsc0uter1]

Religion is even worse. If you think of something "evil" you will be judged.

[@valeale8851]

@@tobiashagstrom4168 I always thought the song went "So be good for your own sake" which made it a little more sinister

[@billjoe5991]

@@tobiashagstrom4168 yeah, going by kantian and other ethics, you’re supposed to be doing things in the name of a good will, it’s supposed to come from within not to follow orders or to use others and certain action for an ends

[@SimplyMayaB1994]

I'm a philosophy student myself (third year) but my degree also has other topics. I've actually been studying about the Panopticon in correlation with cyber culture and psychoanalysis. It's fascinating! Great video as per usual, I recommend your channel all the time :)

[@koopk1]

Most minimum wage jobs have panopticons in them

[@daddyleon]

surprising isn't it, that people hate those jobs?

[@stevepittman3770]

One of the things that most frustrated me working minimum wage jobs was that employers treat you like a criminal until you prove otherwise. I was always asking, if you didn't trust me to do the job and not rob you blind, why did you hire me?

[@triton62674]

When machines are cheaper I'd like to see how those on minimum wage adapt

[@brandonlangfeldt9809]

when machines are cheaper we will need a universal basic income

[@oneorangeshoelace]

Thanks! I was telling my roommate that in class I was learning about Foucault's thoughts on the Panopticon and they said, "Oh, I think Philosophy Tube has some videos on that!" Extra information is always helpful.

[@wordsofdv]

From the new videos we often forget that she started this channel to make knowledge more accessible and damn it works!

[@ponetium]

I grew up in a cult-family, and I was watched and monitored a lot. This actually made me realise further how much it is hard, to grow without privecy. People who didn't had their information used against them don't know how scary it is to have people much stronger being able to do things, just because. Part of my way to deal with this is to keep the secret amount minimal, but it requires people to be ok with others being unlike them.

[@chegeny]

Thank you Abigail. Wonderful content always.

[@vaggiofelize2174]

Thank you Abigail, for this amazingly informal video. I found it very helpful in the pursuit to grasp Foucault. Also, you have such kind eyes!

[@ballinangel3231]

Back when I was a novice debator, I was struggling with grasping biopower as a concept. He made the argument that biopower is intrinsically difficult to understand because it goes against a system we think we benefit from and that we are familiar with. It was my first time having my "mind blown" learning about philosophy because I had to look at something I thought I knew atend recognized as entirely different, I had to learn that some things within the system were designed to make the tower noticeable. Good memories.

[@sibilebrazauskaite7350]

one of the better niche feelings in life is hearing a word in a Joanna Newsom song and then having it explained by Philosophy Tube

[@badhanpaul3779]

The way you describe the whole concept is really praiseworthy. May b this the style by which we are touched by these dry facts. ❤. Thank you sir.

[@Niekpas1]

For those interested in structural violence I will also strongly recommend David Graeber's "The Utopia of Rules: On Technology, Stupidity and the Secret Joys of Bureaucracy".

[@theMuBot]

It didn't occur to me until right now that I know more about Jeremy Bentham's corpse than I did about his life and that it might be worth actively changing that. Thank you.

[@TechmagosCantido]

This ties in so well with your Racism, Law, and Politics videos, in particular the notion of race as a tool designed to preserve power. The US allows slavery of those convicted of crimes so it could criminalize Black people and continue with business as usual.

[@PhilosophyTube]

Yeah, Sheth cites Foucault a bit in her work!

[@KarateExplodo]

Thank you for one of the most interesting conversations about decriminalization and surveillance I've seen in quite a while! I know it's uncommon to hear from someone sincerely questioning their own beliefs in social media spaces, so I'm particularly happy to admit that I feel this conversation has really problematized some of my views on surveillance! I look forward to brushing up on my Bentham and my Foucault, and giving this one a very thorough thinking through.

[@RSousa-ru7xi]

You’re the best explainer of Foucault ever.

[@brandonmock5105]

One thing that may be added here is that language and communication are also essential elements of this surveillance. In a way many societies govern their own actions by labeling some good or bad. Many people don’t commit crimes simply because they know that’s the “bad” thing to do. For example, what is to stop someone at any point in a restaurant from throwing a chair across the room? I think this is more of what some of Foucault’s other work is addressing, but regardless this is a great video! I love the channel, you’re helping me get through my PhD!

[@MichaelKilmanAuthor]

Wonderful short and accessible explanation of this important concept. Thanks for another wonderful video.

[@xtxpxhx]

I just wanted to say thank you for taking time a posting such wonderful resources :)

[@rachellawhead6923]

So my theatre history professor is a huge Foucault fan and talked about him, Bentham and the panopticon in relation to melodrama in (I think) the 18th or 19th century, but it was all way too dense for me to ever understand. Thank you for helping me to understand a little more, and making me more interested in the subject. Cheers.

[@RunItsTheCat]

Loved Foucault; it's always nice to observe the shortcomings of contemporary systems. The real challenge, as always, is how do we make them better / what better replacements are there.

[@chasesmay7237]

I’ve literally spent hours trying to google and remember the panopticon philosophy in the last two days. I’m glad I found this video, thanks... I can’t remember why I wanted to find it, I just needed a review of the details lol

[@Bennick323]

Came here because I just got a vinyl of Isis' album Panopticon in the mail and read a quote by Foucault on the jacket. Came here for more. Interesting stuff. Thanks Olly.

[@ChrisSchwally]

Olly that's a really cute cardigan

[@lauramcguire1382]

Hi, thanks for another great video. As an undergrad, I'm really inspired by your videos but would love to know if you have tips of having a broad and deep level of knowledge, when you have to balance it with university reading lists, plus usual social/life commitments (not necessarily going out, but I think we can all agree that a night of wine and netflix can be considered a bit of a life remedy!). I'm so inspired by the breadth/depth of knowledge you have, and would love to be able to think similarly and apply it to my studies.

[@fighter4711]

Great episode! I was wondering if you had ever considered making an episode (or series) on phenomenology? That would be fascinating.

[@thomaspalazzolo5902]

By the bye, Guardians of the Galaxy had an actual panopticon in the prison sequence.

[@maldoso76]

Completely love this channel. Thanks.

[@PhilosophyTube]

Aww, thanks!

[@abrahamgomez653]

Discipline and Punishment is a masterpiece.

[@homerdomincus5378]

The panopticon in the penal sense functions as the tower is the overseer of the cells. The panoptic system placed onto the social body functions as a person to person overseer. Thus " comrades become their overseers"

[@jonsnor4313]

Personally i know those things from the criminally underrated series PERSON OF INTEREST, which had those topics explicit suvelience from social media, any electric tool with a wifi ever, ... and even the slogan you are being watched. That was pre snowden reveal which proves it was common knowledge already for those interested. It also is exploring various philosophies and dilemmas while being fun and having impressive production quality, acting and writing. Snowden was maybe leaking it, but it has already known by savy experts. Good for him making it public, public, but i find the series better, and more entertaining at tackling that while being semi realistic. Basically the entertaining approach. They go throughly that the government spies on us too, and why we should be scared of super ais.

[@TheLaughingOut]

Excellent set. Foucault is not an easy philosopher to explain, but you did very well. Thank you.

[@greeeeeeeeeeeetg]

I am writing an analysis about the issue of surveillance, monitoring and “the look” with the short film of Alan Resnick: “This House Has People in It” and i think it is very interesting the discussion that you’re making about the direction taken by the panopticon with respect to our reality. I would add that the panopticon has undergone a change, a transition to our technological gadgets and, above all, the concept of the camera. For example, the author Gérard Wajcman poses in his book "The Absolut Eye" that the camera we can characterize it as a democratic ontological machine, whose gaze makes the man or, the otherness, virtually dangerous. The society is experiencing a transition in which need to be monitored to themselves and be seen simply for the reason to exist, it is a paranoia. Roland Barthes also came forward with his "La Chambre Claire" to explain the iconic and representational quality of the camera by referring to "what has been,", the idea of a man becoming an image of faith. There are many interesting problems in this discussion and i think it is worth to continue with such questions. Thank you for your video, without doubt this will serve me for my next thesis. Greetings from Mexico!

[@enta_nae_mere7590]

Could a panopticon of panopticonations not prevent abuse of the system for those in power. If every citizen could know if they were being watched and who was watching them, like Norwegian tax returns, then would the panopticons effects be lost or enhanced. Removing the element of unknown would surely empower those to protest but at the same time make them knowledgeable of when they were allowing a check on the system

[@mathieuleader8601]

the time lords capitol is called the Panopticon and I heard a childrens novel in the form of a radio play called the Incarceron by Catherine Fisher which is about a metaphysical Panopticon in some aspects you should read or hear it,

[@Kumbaya6991]

I think the panopticon is a physical representation of negan's psychic authority

[@bella-bond]

Even better than Part 1!

[@dhwanipandya5604]

Thank you Olly! This really helped 💯

[@momo-hs5jn]

i miss these kinds of informative videos on this channel...

[@3DMint]

"There are some links in the dooblydoo" ya watch vlogbrothers

[@diazri]

This seems to apply everywhere - grading systems in schools, omnipresent security cameras, even social media to an extent. I wonder, though, if that's necessarily bad. After all, without systems of incentives and disincentives, it's nearly impossible to get large amounts of people to follow through with difficult long-term undertakings (education especially). Even excluding mandatory follow-through, it's still important for us to make accurate records of what people do (transcripts, resumés, etc.), and these papers are, to a certain extent, panoptic. How might one distinguish between helpful and harmful panopticons? Is it merely picking and choosing which aspects of our own society we think are worth forcing on others? Or are there varying degrees of violence in panopticons, some of which are acceptable and some of which aren't?

[@neymow2242]

A while ago I asked you which neuroscience book I should read. You replied that you had no idea and I should let you know if I find a good one. Long story short: "Incognito" by David Eagleman is an easy read which contains much knowledge. It also has a segment about the prison system and how it should be. You definitely should read it. Currently I'm all about to read "phantoms in the brain" by V.S. Ramachandran. I'll message you my oppinion afterwards.

[@tyrionlanyster1562]

When you say "the people in power" feels like you completely disregard Foucault thesis on power, that being that power is like a chain and it flows in every relationship even without a subject

[@disrxptv9327]

Yes! Ive just mentioned this. Im pretty sure he says power is pervasive thoughtout society.

[@joanjett24]

Bentham's heaaaaaad

[@Kimmaline]

I HAD TO SCROLL TOO FAR TO FIND THIS.

[@octopodesrex]

😎 Ask a Mortician!

[@dahbiafarez8837]

Thank you so much for this video it's really helpful

[@Huntracony]

In these videos, I always hear you say, "It's like putting a hat 'round at the end of a lecture." Except, I have never experienced this and would find it much stranger than a KZbinr asking for donations so they can continue what they're doing.

[@Companion92]

The Beholding. I just listened to a fiction podcast (The Magnus Archives), who works parts of this into its story in great ways.

[@loverdeadly6128]

The Panopticon was used as a puzzle in Silent Hill 4. Interesting bit of trivia, I guess.

[@jewfroDZak]

As a former prisoner who knew nothing about this prior to my year long incarceration, let me relate what I saw. The vast majority of "jobs" are ones that the state would have to hire a non-incarcerated person to perform instead of the forced labor right there in the institution. Jobs like growing/cooking/serving the food, cutting the grass, and janitorial services. That's why you can basically double the prison population without procuring additional funding from the taxpayers--the prisoners needs are systematically provided by the other inmates... so, you might be thinking, like I used to before I actually went there, "Even if they assign you a job, it's not like they can make you actually do it. You could just stay in your cell all day and refuse, right?" Not exactly. First you're gonna get written up, charged with a crime, then you're likely to go to the "segregated unit" (solitary confinement) until your crime has been adjudicated (by 3 prison officials, not your peers). This is Illinois, btw. The penalty is 30 additional days added to your sentence for a job refusal. Wash, rinse, REPEAT. ...How insidious is that?? In theory, they could transform a year long sentence to a life sentence because you wont be their slave (Well, technically, not a slave, I suppose. I got compensated $20 a month from the state for my "job," and my job was one of the best jobs in the entire joint as far as pay is concerned).

[@jacobbarlow7034]

Looking for Foucault content, and this is useful, but utterly bizarre to see egg Abi. Thanks to her for leaving it up. However jarring it is to me it must be a thousand times weirder for her.

[@wxs09]

Hi Ollie, I think a few years ago there were stories coming out of UK about the police having arrest and speeding ticket targets. The idea of targets on policing always rubbed me the wrong because I think it gives an incentive for miscarriages of justice by the police. If we accept that the job of the of the penal system is to defend the ruling class ( still trying to formulate my own opinion on the idea and intend to read more) what role, do you think that miscarriages of justice play in the penal system in defending the ruling class. Get the feeling you might have spoken about this in another video but I'm not sure. Also I just want to thank you for making these videos, I have recently became more politically aware (would hesitate to say active since I don't really do anything) and I consider myself on the center-left. However, your videos have really helped broaden my understanding of lots of political issues in our country (I'm from the UK too) and helped me see the dangers of having a wishy-washy centrist positions on issues of equality and power. P.S. Even though the Tories have lost a lot of ground in the polls, this election is terrifying.

[@TheSerialHobbyistGirl]

I agree with Foucault's assessment of panopticism, but I don't necessarily agree with its existence and implementation, if that makes sense. However, I don't have any suggestions for an alternative system.

[@kevingordon4984]

Those inside the tower are all ex-prisoners, who believe that this was the only alternative to the cell. But they don't see that the fear of being sent back controls them just as effectively.

[@martinae34]

Thank you so much! This will help me on my essay!

[@yeahnah3312]

how important do people think it is that the power tower (TM) in the case of mass surveillance wasnt visible? and that they wanted it kept that way?

[@MrHeroFamily]

The latest example: Hong Kong, if you were too young, wearing black, or both. (5:25

[@mathieuleader8601]

I during my time as a member of the youth parliament for Mid-Cheshire did a stop and search video for Cheshire Police however I thought the implementation of a Youth Court system like ones in Europe and Canada where a jury of the young and the young either acting as a defence and prosecutor to add a sense of civic pride and understanding of the law but was met with a frosty atmosphere although in retrospect during the open evening showcasing said DVD I did think Britain needed police and crime comissioners and that did indeed come to pass.

[@sirmeowthelibrarycat]

Mathieu Leader 😖 Punctuation - try it, please!

[@naufilmanasiya1368]

There is a word in English called "personal space ". Loosing that can affect ones mental health . It's not about fear of getting exploited by men in power (which is inevitable fate for almost every human being on earth including those in power too).. we evolved as social animal and so we enjoy getting people's attention but on the other hand we desire theirs acceptance and so we constantly try to project better (little bit of fake) part of ourselves . As a kid When my class teacher asked why I don't want to become president of India. I had only one reply that I hated being constantly surrounded and watched by security guards, and who likes ones privacy being invaded although doing nothing illegal.

[@petersmythe6462]

What if we sit in the tower? What if the apparatus of the surveillance state is run by the public directly? Its extent equally controlled by them?

[@davidw.carstens7367]

I really like your shirt, Olly!

[@nikolademitri731]

Thanks for these two vids on prison/punishment, they're excellent. I'll definitely be watching them again, taking notes, and using these vids for educating students (and my right wing family members who are all about that retributive justice!). Cheers from across the pond!

[@miguelconstantino-guzman7957]

Thank you, Philosophy Tube. Here is a like from me. I will share so that others can watch as well. Cheers!

[@gargapurv]

What if existence of the tower is enough to create the tension of being surveillance even though there might be no one in the tower then can we say that we don't really need any real physical surveillance but to make a situation or phenomenon to make the person feel as if he is being watched. For example, not crossing red light even if we can see there is no car passing by and there is no chance of accident.

[@Shiv-jg6gs]

Where did you find those principles of the panopticon? Or are they you’re interpretation and summation of various definitions and explanations? I’d be interested in reading it for an essay I’m writing

[@urjakhosla211]

A Big Thankyou♥️

[@conorb6281]

have you read Louis althusser?

[@estellerussell352]

It is surprising how long the problem of space took to emerge as a historic-political problem. - Michel Foucault, Power/Knowledge

[@PlayRoom44]

Still the music. But I guess this is part two. I studied that prison. I think of the Foucaultian eye upon me all the time. Or panopticonian eye

[@marko112kg]

Does making the prisons profitable cause more prison sentences in order to boost the profits?

[@ThisIsEmaxx]

Do you have any sources about the 4 principles of the panopticon or somewhere where I can read more about it? Thanks

[@madsjensen7753]

But @Philosophy Tube wouldn't the NSA be more relevant to Deleuze revaluation of Panopticism? Surveillance access points, control society etc?

[@dominic4311]

Hey oli, love your work. Why, under Foucault's interpretation, should hate crimes be punished? It seems most hate crimes, more or the less, strengthening the ruling class

[@HansPeter-qg2vc]

Religion installed a virtual panoptic structure by telling people there is an invisible man watching them. Worked out damn well for religion. (Not so much for all the people slaughtered to fight about religion.)

[@codys7789]

all Foucault aside, you my friend are a physically beautiful being.

[@RomaInvicta202]

How come Olly is the only one on the media talking about issues like that? How it's not taught at schools?

[@poi2lkj3mnb]

Panoptic structures can only be coercive to the extent of power the state (or the guards) can exercise. The panopticon in a prison wouldn't matter at all if the guards couldn't also punish you for what they see. It might then be possible by limiting the states authority to punish, or exercise power. It does not matter that the state can see into your home if they cannot do anything about it. Does it?

[@stevepittman3770]

I think it does, because knowledge of being watched alters behavior. It encourages you to self-correct toward whatever normative standard society enforces on its members. Removing the ability to punish doesn't remove the urge to self-correct, nor does it remove the feeling of being subjugated to someone else's idea of appropriateness even if the watcher is utterly toothless to actually enforce it.

[@poi2lkj3mnb]

Why does that felling exist in the first place though? If you are self correcting to fit into society and avoid social ostracization then that is a form of punishment. The urge to self correct doesn't make much sense if there is no weight of punishment behind it. You say that the feelings are still there but why are they? What justifies their existence?

[@nullset560]

Bentham actually got somewhat close to making his prison at the height of the utility craze

[@niklasbirksted8175]

It'd be nice if you included the third dispositive as well, these two vids seem to focus on the first two.

[@CosmoShidan]

I find it interesting how Foucault's Bentham analogue is similar to Zamyatin's critique.

[@rihadjc1178]

Can somebody please explain me relation between structural violence and profitability please little bit more? Thank you!!

[@vasilisioannou5794]

1:33 reminds me of 1984

[@WeAreEternal55]

So you want to know how to break through the power structure of the panopticon? Start by critically and precisely identifying the power structure, its origins, its means for maintaining itself, and finally its aim(s). Essentially you conduct a historical investigation. If anyone is really interested in understanding the current power structure at present I very highly recommend an excellent film titled "Communism by The Backdoor" by Dennis Wise. It is one of the most revelatory documentaries I have ever seen (the other being "Adolf Hitler: The Greatest Story NEVER Told"). Best wishes to all!

[@LimeyLassen]

On the other hand, 4chan. There's a difference I think between being observed by law enforcement and being observed by anyone at all.

[@swheeler94]

Limey Lassen well but in that case you’re not really being observed. Anonymity kinda breaks down that effect I’d think

[@m.c.ballyhoo1494]

See but this method gives the prison guards ultimate control. This system would only work to deliver justice if you could assume that those prison guards are COMPLETELY just. They have all the power to beat anyone that they want even if they did nothing. It works on paper, but idk it seems like what if the prison should be overthrown? What if it’s become corrupt? It would be impossible to revise the system. The system ensures optimal restriction of prisoners. But justice?

[@dougdimmedome5552]

I’m getting some real clockwork orange vibes from some of the ideas here. Is my intuition right here?

[@gledger1963]

"This phone call maybe recorded for quality and training purposes." Panopticon is everywhere. Can I opt out? No. Can I know exactly who is recording me? No. Seems inocuous, but it is just part of our surveillance society.

[@kennetheriksen1091]

How about using the panopticon paradigme with applicable government house utilitarianism? Would that provide a positive regard as to how those who in power (let's define this by thinking knowledge is power, education is knowledge). Everyone could see how China or North Korea would use this to strangle the freedom of it's citizens, but given the time we're in, with Covid-19, how healthy systems of power can use the panopticon structures within the political realm to aid those who are surrounded with too much information to know how to stay healthy? Is this all that negative? I would suggest that it seems like the panopticon paradigme is neutral rather than bad or good. It could be used for both. Would you say that i misinterpret Foucault?

[@kevinperera18]

How does affect creativity?

[@AdriLeemput]

How much is "less than half"? Is it 5% or 49%?

[@hedgehog3180]

I mean at least with stuff like the NSA and other forms of surveillance you can avoid them, to some extent. Unless you completely stop using anything that isn't on the dark web you'll be surveilled but you can do things like use Linux or an encrypted browser.

[@stockhuman]

Oooh, please consider a part three; a "Deleuze and control societies", perhaps.