FSD V13 | Construction, Pedestrians, Highway E2E Thoughts and More

[@robbstewart921]

Excellent videos. New subscriber with notifications turned on.

[@CanadaFSD]

@@robbstewart921 hey thanks so much, I appreciate it! I’ll have new content coming out soon.

[@richb134]

I agree 💯 on your follow distance thoughts

[@CanadaFSD]

Thanks, I am glad people do... it's wild to me when people argue against a safe follow distance.

[@h.e.c.]

Tank you for great FSD videos! I agree that having (back) an option to set your preferred following distance would increase both the safety as well as user's confidence in FSD. The only issue (from my own experience) is that other cars will regularly take advantage of large gap and will get into your lane, which (apart of resulting in likely a bit slower travel overall) might might actually increase the likelihood of or create a dangerous scenario.

[@CanadaFSD]

@@h.e.c. you’re welcome! Glad people are enjoying them. Yeah I understand with a larger follow distance you’re more likely to have someone move into the gap, but I’d rather that to be honest. I just have zero interested in tailgating at highway speeds.

[@h.e.c.]

*Thank

[@happycamperinc.]

Man such high quality content.

[@CanadaFSD]

@@happycamperinc. thanks so much I really appreciate it!

[@tonyvelasco5732]

Used to live right across the border in Lynden, now down in Vancouver WA and enjoying the real world use of v13.2.2! It's driving me to work each day without interventions, and took our fam on a 400 mile round trip drive from Vancouver WA to Edmonds WA for a family Christmas party on Christmas Eve Day. Only one intervention that whole trip, and that was turning into my neighborhood 2 blocks from home on the way back. It had to tackle city driving both down here and up in Edmonds, 80mph I5 driving, stop and go Seattle driving, and then 3 heavy rain squalls on the way home. No interventions until it failed to get in the suicide lane to turn into my neighborhood and was trying to turn into it from the main lane, where traffic behind me was going 45-50mph. Still, what an amazing real use of FSD!

[@CanadaFSD]

@@tonyvelasco5732 wow that’s incredible to hear how good it’s been for you. I really think v13 is a turning point, now people just need to experience it for themselves. Sounds like your one main issue comes down to bad map data, which I keep harping on as one of FSDs biggest weaknesses at the moment.

[@tonyvelasco5732]

​@@CanadaFSDweirdly on the commute home tonight I had zero interventions or disengagements because for the first time it actually used the suicide lane! It was raining and dark but it found it this time and used it! We'll see if that ends up being repeatable.

[@CanadaFSD]

@ yeah suicide lane is hit and miss for me. I’m not sure what causes it

[@ReverseFlash23]

2:11 - I almost let V13.2.2 do this with a construction crew but I chickened out lol. It navigated the same situation as yours as the 2nd car and beyond, but I only had 1 chance as the leading vehicle to see if V13 would stay stopped, but I just couldn’t help myself and took over in fear of looking like an idiot lol. I was really hoping to see that happen here but dang

[@CanadaFSD]

@@ReverseFlash23 yeah I wanted to be forced to a full stop, but there’s a ton of construction around here so I’ll do my best to get that scenario recorded and upload it here.

[@ReverseFlash23]

@ sweet!

[@Discoducky73]

Hopefully on the way back, you'll get to see if it handles the construction handheld stop sign well!

[@CanadaFSD]

@@Discoducky73 I’ll try and have that uploaded today

[@galaxiedance3135]

I agree with you. If you're in a "Hurry" and you're following a vehicle ahead going 130 km/h for 100km and you're always 5 seconds behind it, you'll arrive at basically the exact same time. no need to ride their tail. Besides, even rushing at 130. if you stop at Timmy's and the guy in the drive through orders an entire meal for the family in front of you... All the time you "gained", you just gave back and then some ! I like to follow a real 4 or 5 seconds behind. My vehicles don't have any stone chips, no broken windows. I never emergency brake and I can slow cars down behind me nice and easy when I have that much space to play with so no crashing into me, cuz you just know someone behind you is watching their phone!

[@CanadaFSD]

@@galaxiedance3135 yeah I have the exact same mindset as you. The time you save speeding and tailgating is negligible, but the overall safety risks are massive. It’s just not worth it at all to speed or tailgate, I wish more people understood that.

[@julianorossi2450]

Tailgating is indeed *by far* my biggest issue with FSD right now. I feel like 80% of my disengagements are due to me not feeling comfortable with the following distance it takes while driving at 110 km/h and clearly having no clue there are other 2 cars tailgating each other in front of you. Yet, I must say I notice a small improvement on that between 13.2.1 and 13.2.2.

[@CanadaFSD]

@@julianorossi2450 yeah we just drove to Squamish and back and I had zero disengagements, but I did have to manually dial the speed back a couple of times just because of close follow distance. Once they get that sorted out v13 will be nearly perfect for me.

[@DerekDavis213]

_I feel like 80% of my disengagements are due to me not feeling comfortable with the following distance it takes while driving at 110 km/h_ And even worse? If the car in front of you is also a Tesla, that car might engage in Phantom Braking. And that could be disastrous.

[@CanadaFSD]

@ I haven’t had a phantom braking issue for a long, LONG time.

[@DerekDavis213]

@@CanadaFSD Other FSD v13 reviewers have said that Phantom Braking still happens, occasionally. The car brakes hard, and *for* *no* *reason* .

[@julianorossi2450]

@ I used to have a lot (almost daily) phantom brakes on intersections when crossing green traffic lights on 12.5.6. It’s solved on 13.2

[@RubenKelevra]

2:08 looks like in Canada is too little work to do, if you have to send people standing around next to a construction zone holding up signs 😅 In Germany that would work without any sign. However if there's a blind corner or a longer area under construction we just put traffic lights there. Don't you have mobile traffic lights in Canada? 🤔

[@CanadaFSD]

@@RubenKelevra that’s interesting, we pretty much always have two flaggers for any sort of construction like this on our roadways. I can see how it would work in a country where people drive with more care. But here in North America people are often quite selfish.

[@Blake6602]

I have never seen the portable traffic lights for construction, but I have seen the automatic flaggers(the arm that goes up and down). They use those for construction rarely, but I see flaggers a lot more.

[@RubenKelevra]

@@CanadaFSD you think that people would drive through a red light just to get stuck in a construction zone? 😂

[@RubenKelevra]

@@Blake6602 that's funny, I've never seen a "flagger" in real life in Europe. The portable traffic lights are always used where necessary. I mean you roll them there, turn them on and done. 🤷‍♂️ I don't see how putting people there is more economical, as construction zones usually stay a week or two here.

[@galaxiedance3135]

9:30. You're following that truck. 40-ish meters behind and you're only maximum 1 seconds behind if you calculate the distance and your speed. Each skip is 12 meters apart, so just count the skips. approx. 3.5 skips behind the truck. Also, the car certainly should have moved over for the vehicles on the shoulder back there. It seems okay when you're not the one standing there. It's different when I have transport trucks going 1 meter past me at over 100 km/h. I have picked up barrels and the transport is literally 30cm from the barrel at full speed. People sure don't care. Just the wind from the truck can toss you around sometimes, almost knock you over if it's big enough.

[@CanadaFSD]

@@galaxiedance3135 yeah I was being generous with 3 seconds. The car does definitely follow with 1 second of less distance at times. I don’t care who you are, but that is an unsafe follow distance for a litany of reasons, I hate it.

[@RubenKelevra]

8:57 in some countries you're legally required to change lanes to the left here. And I think FSD should do this. And there was enough room, so no excuse here.

[@CanadaFSD]

Yeah I agree with you on this, I would have moved over for them and should have disengaged.

[@jooptablet1727]

It's possible the car sawn that at current speeds it would not be necessary to move over, which is how it actually turned out.

[@RubenKelevra]

@jooptablet1727 not necessary at 100 km/h? How do you think it ends if you drive into a human at 100 km/h?

[@jooptablet1727]

​@@RubenKelevramy bad, I thought your timestamp was a different situation

[@taggartlittle570]

I’ve spent my life on motorcycles and it’s drilled into me to want the longer follow distance so I have time to react to objects in the road that cars and trucks can straddle

[@xueyuan1]

Even at V13, there is still no sound alert when detecting blind spot event. I really dont understand why Tesla doesnt want to add this simple feature, to protect driver while manual drive. What do you think?

[@CanadaFSD]

@@xueyuan1 for when you signal and there’s someone beside you? I imagine they’ll add that - they’ve added a bunch of blind spot stuff lately, and an audible alert is something people keep asking for so I would be shocked if that wasn’t on their radar already.

[@edhill8568]

Nice video. One thing about road crews is where I live is hand held Stop/Slow/Stop signs are almost never used. The key for me is when will FSD understand hand gestures by police/road crews? I also use Hurry on City/Streets with Standard sometimes otherwise FSD is still slow. Standard/Chill on highway. I agree with you though speed management is a mystery! I am not concerned about tailgating. Using v13.2.2 which seems a bit better at this than v13.2.1

[@CanadaFSD]

@@edhill8568 yeah I actually went out with my wife and tried to see how the car handled hand signals, it was inconclusive - but I’m sure more real world testing will show how it’s being handled. I’ve watched videos where the car seems to react 100% to hand gestures, so it seems that it’s at least somewhat baked into v13.

[@DerekDavis213]

_The key for me is when will FSD understand hand gestures by police/road crews_ FSD still misses speed bumps sometimes, and it cannot read and understand simple road signs such as Do Not Enter, and Road Closed. Hand gestures are not a priority right now .

[@CanadaFSD]

@@DerekDavis213 FSD definitely cannot “read” just yet. It does some basic reading with speed limits, but it won’t read text and understand it. I’m sure that’ll come soon now that it’s being trained on HW4 with v13.

[@DerekDavis213]

@@CanadaFSD You are very optimistic about FSD, despite years and years of disappointments. 8 years ago Elon made some big promises about FSD, and today FSD is *nowhere* even close to fulfilling those promises.

[@CanadaFSD]

@ what are you talking about nowhere close? In this video the car drove me with a push of a button to my destination. The system isn’t perfect but it’s incredible and is progressing rapidly.

[@jennyp706]

I had a $400 traffic using FSD 12.5.6.2 last month on PA highway 476, on a right turn from high way 95, at 12:45 AM. No traffic at all. I was driving on left line. I saw a stopped working truck flashing yellow in front of me. car stopped behind the truck. FSD did not move over to right lane. I manually change lane to the right, I got a speeding ticket for not observing move over law.😢 I am wondering if v 13.2.2 can do the move over correctly?

[@CanadaFSD]

That sucks, sorry to hear that! I have seen FSD move over for vehicles in the past, but in this video you can see the car not moving over for someone stopped on the side of the road. So it seems to not be entirely solved just yet.

[@jaro6985]

16:50 if it did recognize the signal it definitely wasn't visualized, its showing red and green lights lol.

[@CanadaFSD]

The fact that it’s visualizing lights at all is indication that it sees them. My understanding is what we see on the screen isn’t representative of what the computer is seeing/doing necessarily.

[@Vardraq]

So, I am watching this from Europe, and am surprised: the follow distance setting is now gone? What kind of a bad decision by Tesla was that? I mean, the setting was never very trasnparent on what the numbers mean you could set, but removing it, rather than improving is a bad decision by Tesla. Could the SEXY-Buttons be used to manipulate it still?

[@CanadaFSD]

@@Vardraq yeah as soon as they introduced E2E on the highway you lost the ability to set follow distance. You can’t do anything to change it, even the s3xy knobs won’t work. It’s really disappointing to be honest.

[@happycamperinc.]

You can add music when you timelapse the video.

[@CanadaFSD]

@@happycamperinc. yeah I have in the past, but I wasn’t sure if people liked music. I’ll add music on the next one.

[@mattk1358]

If you don’t tailgate in Chicago you would have thousands of people constantly cutting in front of you.

[@CanadaFSD]

@@mattk1358 yeah that’s fair, so I think it should be adjustable.

[@RubenKelevra]

Looks like driving is no longer driving, you just need to pay attention, but could do other things. Have you considered knitting while commuting? 🤔 😂 Imagine the confused face of a police officer driving by while you knit in the driver seat 😂

[@CanadaFSD]

@@RubenKelevra haha yeah I am definitely able to do things while driving that I never could before. I’ll get poke bowls for lunch now while I’m driving around. It seems dumb, but it’s so nice to have my hands free to actually eat - rather than just eat burgers with one hand. But for the sake of this channel maybe I’ll take up knitting and give lessons while I drive 😂

[@RubenKelevra]

10:04 well I don't want to derail your train of thought here, but your mental math is quite a bit off. So yes I agree, 4-5 seconds of distance should be minimum while it's raining, and 3 should be minimum on dry roads. However you don't have to "stop" in 3 seconds or you hit the bumper of the truck in front, because the truck in front can't stop at the place it is currently, as it also has a minimum braking distance. So what you want to achieve in 3 seconds is the same deceleration rate as the vehicle in front. So if the truck does an emergency braking manovre, you as a human will take 1 second to start to take action, half a second to take the action and apply full brake pressure and aournd half of that on top is how long the brake system will take to apply full brake force. So you're talking about 1.75 seconds give or take to reach the same deceleration as the truck in front. So if the truck brakes until it stops it will go 50 meter further or so as it was at the moment you started braking, but the distance between you and the truck in front will be the same as 1.75 s after the truck started braking. While I agree that FSD should still keep the same following distance as human drivers, now to FSDs reaction time: FSD evaluates the whole world in 36 Hz at the moment, so it will recognize the change in velocity within 0.027 s and as soon as the deceleration starts to become drastic plan to stop similarly drastically. To stay conservative let's say this takes 4 intervals to make the decision, then it will command the car to apply full brakes after 0.1 second. The command will likely also take 20 ms or so to be transmitted and executed plus 200 ms physical delay for the braking system itself you end up with 0.331 s delay for fully applied brakes. That's 5.29 times faster than a human. That's also 3 times faster than your cognition in a shock moment, which is 1 second. That's why automatic emergency braking systems feel so violent and "superhuman" as they are acting 3 times faster than you can realize that there is a dangerous situation.

[@janhawranke8064]

Agree with this - well explained. Also FSD will never drive exactly as you would, so comments related to personal preferences in driving are really the same as your thoughts about an UBER driver you are riding with. Nevertheless, he has some really great comments regarding how competent the system has become and how this message needs to be broadcast to anyone who has never experience FSD. Thanks!!

[@RubenKelevra]

@janhawranke8064 while yeah, FSD will never drive exactly as you may want in a situation, I fully agree with him that FSD should keep a larger following distances. I would also argue that there should be no option to change that. Safety isn't optional. So yes the 3 seconds shown here in this video is safe, but not for rain, which FSD doesn't seem to take into account at the moment. 4-5 seconds would be the better option here. And as he said, it's not like you are arriving faster because you tailgate, you on average arrive slower, because you may have to take a detour to the next hospital on some drives.

[@jaro6985]

"However you don't have to "stop" in 3 seconds or you hit the bumper of the truck in front, because the truck in front can't stop at the place it is currently, as it also has a minimum braking distance." No, worst case scenario is a turned over semi that they don't see and slam directly into. Thats a 0s stop.

[@stephencampbell9095]

I have high faith in FSD stopping in an emergency situation. The car has gone from highway speed to a full stop when traffic abruptly stopped. It handled it perfectly applying maximum braking power and stopping well short of contact. That was on V12.6.3. V13 seems to anticipate other vehicle behavior quicker than humanly possible. On several occasions I have wondered why the car is behaving the way it is only to have a pedestrian or other vehicle pop out of nowhere. The way I see it, FSD has a constant 360 degree view of the world and is making decisions in tens of milliseconds while I can only react in tenths of a second. (My fastest recorded reaction time is 0 .1 second.) With the car constantly monitoring the speed and trajectories of everything else on the road, yes, I’m comfortable letting the car drive a little close to the car in front.

[@CanadaFSD]

@@stephencampbell9095 that’s what I was trying to say in the video though. Even IF FSD is able to stop in time, that leaves no room for error for the car behind me. I’d rather not put myself into an emergency braking situation, and instead just leave ample space to the car infront of me.

[@stephencampbell9095]

I have high faith in FSD stopping in an emergency situation. The car has gone from highway speed to a full stop when traffic abruptly stopped. It handled it perfectly applying maximum braking power and stopping well short of contact. That was on V12.6.3. V13 seems to anticipate other vehicle behavior quicker than humanly possible. On several occasions I have wondered why the car is behaving the way it is only to have a pedestrian or other vehicle pop out of nowhere. The way I see it, FSD has a constant 360 degree view of the world and is making decisions in tens of milliseconds while I can only react in tenths of a second. (My fastest recorded reaction time is 0 .1 second.) With the car constantly monitoring the speed and trajectories of everything else on the road, yes, I’m comfortable letting the car drive a little close to the car in front. As the percentage of self driving cars increase, the need for traffic controls will continue to diminish as the cars interact better with each other smoothly and confidently. There is a whole new paradigm coming few people see yet.

[@matthewfarrell3491]

By the same logic, the truck in front of you would also need some time to stop . It cannot stop abruptly

[@CanadaFSD]

@@matthewfarrell3491 it can if it slams into a vehicle. I don’t understand why people argue against a safe follow distance. Google it for yourself. You will not find a single reputable source saying that a 1 second follow distance is safe.

[@Pico_444]

This is something I don't understand. Driving above the speed limit is ILLEGAL. Personally I would not want my car to drive 70 kmh in a 60 kmh zone. Is this just an American thing ?

[@Pico_444]

On another note, in Europe we almost never pass on the right (exception: traffic). Does FSD know where it is and what laws apply? (for example, turning right on red does not exist in Europe).

[@CanadaFSD]

@@Pico_444 definitely a North American thing I guess. Pretty much nobody goes the speed limit here, you’ll get honked at for going the exact speed limit.

[@user-erick007]

Half the people complain about FSD being too far from other cars & other half complaints about FSD tailing too close. It's all about preference & wjere you live. Nothing wrong with fsd & nothing to change

[@CanadaFSD]

@@user-erick007 having the option to not tailgate would be helpful. That way people who want to drive unnecessarily close / aggressive can choose to do so.

[@cafl9844]

Still wouldn't trust it!

[@CanadaFSD]

Fair, it's definitely something you need to experience and spend time with before you can fully trust it.

[@cafl9844]

@CanadaFSD Would you trust it driving your children around with nobody behind the steering wheel? I for sure wouldn't. I am really curious who will be the first to take that kind of risk.

[@CanadaFSD]

@@cafl9844 Once the software proves itself and becomes unsupervised I am sure I would. I already trust it with my life, and so does my wife. FSD Unsupervised wont happen overnight, but we are well on the way there.