FSX / P3D A2A Piper Pa28 Cherokee Tutorial - How to land

[@dioticdrone]

This is probably the best FS tutorial I've ever seen. You clearly explained it by not just saying "this is what you should do" but why you should do it this way. Thanks!

[@flightsim481]

No problem. Glad you enjoyed it :-)

[@flyerphil]

Just came across this video, which I thought excellent with clear calm commentary. Haven't flown for a number of years and hopefully will get back soon. I have to say this demo has already given me some real confidence and motivation required. Thank you so much

[@flightsim481]

Philip D It's a pleasure, so glad you enjoyed it :-)

[@gimmietheprize]

One of the best tutorials I've seen! I found 1 in 3 of my landings in the PA28 were floating down the runway. Speed is indeed the answer! Thanks for taking the time to help. I've subscribed & liked!

[@flightsim481]

Thanks for the kind words and the support :-)

[@GMBregoli]

Your channel is starting to become my favorite FSX related hangout Flightsim481. Even learning some aerodynamics from you. Good quality videos you make Sir.

[@flightsim481]

Thanks you for your support. It's rewarding to know that people appreciate my efforts. I've been a bit quiet of late due to hectic work schedules, but rest assured, I have plenty more stuff to put up :-)

[@starmarky]

17 years ago I learned flying at a little club with private but passionate teachers, doing this as their hobby besides their regular jobs. We had a PA-28 118 Warrior and a C172 for training. Now I must say: It would've been a great help then if anybody could have told me the correlation between speed, altitude, throttle and pitch during a landing with a PA-28 as plausible as you did now in this video.

[@pauliegon4513]

Hi Rich, me being a Noob at this flight sim stuff, all your videos have been very educational and enjoyable to watch, and your instructions are easy to understand. Look forward to seeing more !!! Thanks again !!! Awesome job !!!

[@flightsim481]

Hi Paul, really glad you find my videos enjoyable. Many thanks for your kind words, Rich

[@MedianNMean]

I was watching your turboprop tutorial b/c I'd like to eventually get into a twin otter, but last night I had a hell of a time landing the Cherokee and saw this video as well. Synchronicity! Thanks for the video.

[@AntonioBarba_TheKaneB]

Now I understand why I was constantly overshooting with the piper. Thanks for sharing!

[@flightsim481]

No problems, glad you enjoyed it :-)

[@Altenholz]

Very well done, and thanks for you affords. Just bought the C182 from A2A. Never had a better and more realistic aircraft in my hangar. Keep them coming!

[@flightsim481]

I agree, the A2A C182 is simply amazing. Thanks for the support.

[@NikosKalomiris]

It's quite clear that you know what you're talking about! Great tutorial!

[@jbphotos44]

Excellent guidance. Many thanks. I distinctly remember that effect on my first attempt to land a Cherokee after flying high wing aircraft. Nearly a disaster.

[@stevegwinn424]

Sharing this on Facebook and by email to some friends. Clearly, you're a great instructor. I received my pilots license back in 1978. Learned to fly in PA 28-140s and always loved flying them. I suppose it's because I learned in a 140 Cherokee I always found them so easy to fly. I've since been checked out in a number of aircraft, both low and high wing. I still love the little 140. Thanks for a great video.

[@flightsim481]

Steve Gwinn Thanks for the very kind words Steve. I have to say, it was one of the most charming aircraft I have flown. It's safe, stable and a great tourer, even if it's not the fastest :-) It's a testament to the ruggedness of the type that many of those built in the 70's are still flying. Glad you enjoyed the video, Rich :-)

[@cubicmicron]

Thank you. The plane I fly most often is the JustFlight PA28T (high tail) in X-Plane 11. It is often criticized as not modeled well for landing. That may be true, but I believe it is just a bit more of a challenge. [I do believe the PA28T has a questionable elevator set point for take off. Pitched too high.] I do like to come in a little high, slip it a bit and indeed it is hard to really grease it in. Most of the landings produce the unsatisfying thud to some degree. I have tended to use less flap as an aid to smooth out the touch down. It wants to fly, of course, and that eats up runway. Having viewed this I will try more full flap landings with the emphasis on speed control as you suggest.

[@martinmarinaro6646]

Very good tutorial. Emphasis on pitch=airspeed/power=altitude is so key to controlling this plane and landing at correct airspeed. Two things I noticed and appreciate your comments: you didn't raise the flaps after landing which can keep the plane firmly on the ground and transfer the weight, and for breaking and to save the pads, pull yoke full aft after landing. That is how I was taught. Martin

[@flightsim481]

+Martin Marinaro Thanks for the kind words Martin. You are spot on with your observations. Raising flaps after touchdown is an oft discussed topic as shown by this forum thread: www.pprune.org/flying-instructors-examiners/453498-retracting-flaps-touchdown.html It is obviously a key short field technique but it's not always essential for every landing. Indeed, there are many techniques and decisions IRL where pilots IMHO can should intelligently rather than by rote. I used to fly ga out of a busy international airport, and often deliberately landed long rather than hitting the numbers because it allowed me to make a certain runway exit without a long distance taxi along the runway, clearing the runway quickly for the big boys. Of course it also all owed me to land beyond the TDZ for an airliner, giving an extra margin to avoid wake vortex. It's not in the manuals but neither is it a bad thing. So raising flaps after touchdown is, in my opinion a pilot decision rather than routine. However I can see that doing it as a standard is beneficial in the majority of circumstances, particularly when transitioning through the speed zone where the wing is still generating enough lift to fly. It's interesting to read about articles in the instructor's forums about students confusing the gear lever with the flap lever. Of course that only becomes an issue if the aircraft is too fast and for whatever reason (mishandling or bumps in the landing surface) the weight on wheels squat switch disengages allowing the gear to start retraction. I never raised flaps during normal landings and that behaviour was never mentioned in my PPL, IR, Multi or CPL tests. I did however use the technique during short field landings if I felt it appropriate for the strip. To the best of my knowledge landing distance figures in the POH assume flaps are not raised on touch down. There are also other short field, if more dubious techniques, such as having no flap for the initial part of a take off run to minimise drag and allow maximum accelleration before introducing flap in the latter stages to change the lift profile. Not something I am aware of in any POH, nor have I tried, but I can see the logic (if as I say a bit dubious regarding handling!) But as you rightly say, they are techniques which I should have mentioned. Thanks for the comments, Much appreciated :-) Rich

[@tonywaldron5894]

Excellent. I fly the A2A Piper Comanche and have a lot of floating on my landings so this video has been very useful to me.

[@crikycrocky]

Excellent job on this with explanation of some theory as well. Clear concise and well explained.

[@flightsim481]

Thanks, much appreciated :-)

[@ian1957ruth]

Glad I found these videos. To a non flier like my self you explain things very well.

[@flightsim481]

Glad you find them useful. Feel free to spread the word about my videos ;-)

[@SebastianDaniec]

flightsim481 Agree, you got yourself another sub.

[@flightsim481]

Thanks for your support, greatly appreciated :-)

[@matthewprince5668]

Really enjoy your videos. Its the calm way you speak and your obvious knowledge minus the arrogance of some on KZbin. Keep up the good work :)

[@flightsim481]

Thanks. Much appreciated. :-)

[@simonholt6649]

Excellent video with great demos. Great explanation of aerodynamic principles and how they relate to the aircraft.

[@flightsim481]

Simon Holt Thanks, glad you enjoyed it :-)

[@Dkentflyer]

brilliant video, never realised what a big difference setting the speed makes

[@ComesTheRooster]

Excellent video, sir. Between your A2A aircraft based instruction and MzeroA's more universal approach, I may actually get a hang of this flying thing! Cheers from the US!

[@flightsim481]

+Rooster Cogburn Thanks for the kind words. For some added interest, may I suggest visiting Flightchops on KZbin. Not instruction as such, but fascinating viewing.

[@gerryortiz7276]

MzeroA dude is a horrible instructor who gives bad habit tips

[@hamodi5801]

Perfect tutorial sir! May I ask you what addons you used for the scenery? (The trees and the fields looks amazing)

[@ianhillsdon1619]

Thank you so much, you have highlighted many of my mistakes, especially the over speed, I did a great approach, but then being to fast, had to force the plane down, the other big mistake I have been making is approaching to low (been used to flying the jets), will do lots of practice, with this new info - thanks again really interesting.

[@flightsim481]

Ian Hillsdon Hi Ian, sorry for taking so long to read your post, but I'm glad you enjoyed the video. many thanks, Rich

[@Piper8bw]

I was always told by my instructors to put full flaps when you crossed the runway fence & never to side slip with full flaps. I also felt that he reduced too much power when he was still far away from the field so he needed to add more power to climb which then you have to loose altitude which now you are picking up more speed & the idea is to bleed off airspeed before you land

[@flightsim481]

What is often the case is that different flying schools/clubs/instructors have their own way of doing things. As long as it remains within the POH, that's fine. A common one I found was to use an aiming point 1/3 of the way down the runway, and then when appropriate to lower flaps which should bring the aim point and aircraft trajectory towards to threshold. Many flying schools don't like lowering flaps when crossing the fence because they would rather the pilot concentrate on the landing at such a critical phase than adding in an extra control and the subsequent changes in aircraft handling. I believe the Pa-28 can slip with full flaps unlike the Cessna 172 which suffers rudder blanking problems.

[@n1vca]

Brilliant work - great audio, video and explanations ... thanks so much for this and your other videos on FSX vs. X-Plane and P3D ... very knowledgeable and thoughtful compiled content!

[@flightsim481]

Thank you :-)

[@welshpete12]

This is the best explanation I have seen, well done !

[@flightsim481]

welshpete12 Thanks, much appreciated.

[@andrewc9234]

having flown the pa28 since i started my license i actually had no issue flying the A2A aircraft, now the a2a skylane is a different story that thing is a handful although i just got it

[@flightsim481]

Andrew C Yes it's a significantly different beast. I have made a couple of videos about it. kzbin.info/www/bejne/bZinZKqwf796htE kzbin.info/www/bejne/jYuUmahsp7t1sKM

[@andrewc9234]

ive watched them :) love your videos

[@stum5639]

Excellent video. Clear and concise. Got me keen to start up my PPL training!

[@flightsim481]

Thanks, glad you enjoyed it. :-)

[@fsxsimpilot22]

I feel like my instructor is talking to me lol. You're very intelligent. If you haven't I think you should become a CFI lol.

[@flightsim481]

Thanks :-) I was part way through training as a flight instructor when I lost my medical and my commercial licences :-(

[@williamleadbetter9686]

3rd class medical reform has passed please get back to flying

[@flightsim481]

Thanks for the support. Sadly I don't have the ability to get a Class 3 medical even after recent changes :-(

[@williamleadbetter9686]

Dang it just come visit me here in Ohio and well go flying from Time to Time in my Ercoupe. Love that old art decko design.I am serious by the wat LETS GO FLYING

[@flightsim481]

Now that's an iconic aircraft but sadly visiting Ohio is a long way out of my budget.

[@edisonhernandez2605]

good video man just want to add normal approach speed in this aircraft is about 85 mph short field about 70 mph for short field and soft field

[@majowa83]

Really enjoying your video tutorials. Hope to see some content with A2A T-6 soon! :o)

[@flightsim481]

+Majowa Thanks. Hoping to do some Texan stuff soon :-)

[@kennethcanfield595]

Excellent video and explanation - now I understand 'ground effect' much better.

[@flightsim481]

Kenneth Canfield Thanks, glad it helped :-)

[@mrlambo9321]

Great video. Looking to learn to fly in the near future. Currently learning gliding and hoping to go solo early 2015 :) I know the basics and theory of flying but it's always good to watch videos like this :) I mainly know about ground effect through work as I maintain helicopters for a living. Helicopters use ground effect all the time, essentially the hover. Such a shame there are no good helos for fsx :(

[@flightsim481]

There is one good heli. The dodosim 206. Glad you enjoyed the video.

[@Caleb230CH]

Upon landing it says in the manual of a real Cherokee to put flaps up upon wheels down to increase wheel friction.

[@flightsim481]

Yes, it adds weight on wheels which affords more braking however I know many a pilot who leave the flaps well alone where braking distances are not an issue.

[@MrJcardimen]

Another excellent, and incredibly practical, video.

[@Mitog24]

This is really a well done tutorial! I've learned a lot more in FS landings here than in years of simulation. What about the ground texture add-on? It looks really amazing

[@EchoChick2009]

my uncle lets me fly in his FSX sim after school and this vid' helped me immensely, tnx! i practice wit A2A's J3 Cub, so this low wing stuf is interesting. he won't let me get another plane until i can land Cubby 5 TIMES in a row without bOuNCiNg :) if i can pull that off, i'm thinking bout either this Cherokee,, or maybe the Cessna172 Skyhawk wit a high wing for my next plane?

[@flightsim481]

I've never flown a cub in real life in terms of tailwheel, just a Citabria, but tail draggers require a lot more footwork on the rudder. The difficulty is that when you land a nose wheel, you land on the mains and lower the nose, reducing angle of attack and thus lift, meaning you generally don't float or bounce too much. If you 'wheel' a tailwheel aircraft on (ie. land on the main wheels, with the tail up), you can't just pull the stick back to get the tailwheel on the ground because the angle of attack increases and you jump airborne again. You also can't brake heavily or you nose over, and it can eat up runway trying to slow down to get the tail down. If you try to do a 3 pointer (ie. land all 3 wheels on the ground at the same time), you have the right attitude for landing and sitting on the ground, but the only way to go down and therefore meet the runway is to reduce throttle, slow down and thus reduce lift. Slow down too much and the aircraft sinks too fast and on occasions, the suspension can throw you back into the air! Tailwheel is generally considered harder to master than nose wheel.

[@garethdyos8018]

Your tutorials are fantastic! Very informative!

[@flightsim481]

+Gareth Dyos Thanks for the support. :-)

[@MontyDeane]

Can u share your hardware? Great graphics. Video card or processor?

[@andriiyeromenkov6337]

It seemed to me that in 2nd airport, short landing was a pure 3-pointer, more speed should be bleeded. And aiming point was not numbers on a rwy, but grass 7-10 meters before threshold

[@lionofjudahlives]

Very well done, precise and to the point.

[@flightsim481]

+Lion of Judah Thanks for watching and for the kind words :-)

[@philchamney7653]

Thanks for the tips. Nice vid. Not too wordy, just enough info.

[@flightsim481]

Glad you enjoyed it :-)

[@krankbuster5827]

Bourn is an tough strip to land on. I took lessons there.

[@flightsim481]

Nothing like a challenge ;-)

[@ChrisJones-lj7nb]

I learnt a lot from this video. Thanks. I would like to know what flight sim software & hardware you use.

[@flightsim481]

+Chris Jones Thanks. Hardware is in the description and software for this is FSX SE, A2A Cherokee, ORBX FTX England and Rex Soft Clouds.

[@fadde10000]

nice explanation, i really notice when i bought my low winged Jodel D18 (real Life) it is a lot different compared to highwinged (my club Aircraft) regaring ground effect, the low winged has a tendens to float quite a lot on the "air-pillow", thanks /Mikael

[@flightsim481]

fadde10000 No problem, glad you enjoyed it :-)

[@vikramodedra4351]

Simply the best video , thanks for a such highly informative and simple video

[@philipridgers2632]

Thank you so much for your informative videos my flying has improved a lot.

[@flightsim481]

Philip Ridgers That's great to hear, and thank you for the kind words :-)

[@mattmobes_1025]

Amazing tutorial, love the A2A Piper, and I used to have it but then FSX shat itself and I didn't get it back. Some things to note on the scenery, however, the ILS lights just under the threshold go onto the freeway. Also, Runway 313?

[@MrCobolman-FSPro]

I'm curious - do you use rudder pedals to do this? I find the twist action on my joystick really difficult to use for side slipping.

[@flightsim481]

Yes, much easier than twist grips. I find the twist grips on joysticks can often be imprecise at best and a pain at worst.

[@yunowamsayin]

such a good tutorial hat I am actually using your info to land the real thing on soft landing.

[@flightsim481]

+yunowamsayin Glad to know it helps. :-)

[@yassernaeemmian8555]

Nice landing and informative video. Afrer a lond time heard that word "windscreen" :) Anyway Are u using track ir and ezdock? Also which airport is this? Any orbx rbu using?

[@flightsim481]

Yasser Naeem Mian Hi, thanks for the support. I didn't have TrackIR of Ezdok for this video, although I do now have both. I tend to use Ezdok more than TrackIR. The airport is EGBB Birmingham and the grass field is Bourne in Cambridgeshire. Thanks for watching.

[@yassernaeemmian8555]

Ur point of view is a bit high so thats why i asked if u hav ezdoc. Can u send url of this landclass payware i mean.

[@MrTornadoman97]

What addons do you have in this video? Im debating getting XP10 just because to get FSX up to par visually (im not a huge graphics nerd but it does help with the immersion) you have to spend tons of $$$. To get XP the way I want, would only cost $40 at the most besides the cost of the sim.

[@flightsim481]

The add ons are FTX England (about £30-£35), rex4 for the other textures (eg. clouds) and Active Sky Next for the weather engine. However, you can get decent free weather engines and cloud texture downloads for FSX. The FTX scenery range is amazing but can be quite expensive once you buy a few areas so I would check their website to see if they cover the area you want to fly in and the cost.

[@TheMissendenFlyer]

Great fun - really enjoyed that, thanks!

[@flightsim481]

+TheMissendenFlyer No problems, thanks for watching :-)

[@rlsmustang]

Hey there. Love the video! I am training on a cherokee and I want to download that same set up. can you tell me what you have? Thank you.

[@flightsim481]

It's the A2A Cherokee being flown in FSX Steam Edition

[@tonywaldron5894]

Excellent tutorial thanks. Gave me a great insight into landing a low wing aircraft. I have a Piper Comanche (A2A) so I'm sure the very same principles apply. By the way what scenery are you using - looks great?TonyDublin

[@flightsim481]

+Tony Waldron Thanks for the kind words and I'm glad you found it useful. The scenery is FTX England in FSX:Steam

[@faisalhassan3876]

@@flightsim481 how to buy piper simulator

[@EinkOLED]

Faster jets normally maintain -800 fpm during the decent at around 140 knots, the piper being less than half that speed should descend at around 350 fpm. So it is not advised to follow the papi

[@davey6693]

What a brilliant video. Thanks!

[@thebluegreengoose]

I was taught by a good instructor how to fly my Cherokee 140 in 1989. 3rd notch of flaps is drag only. I hardly ever use that, but usually I use 2 notches of flaps, I forget how many degrees, 20 I think. One time with a female instructor, in a 150 with flaps, on very short final, I slipped it down the last bit. She told me not to do that because the Cessna 150 does (or 152 it was likely) not have the performance. With 2 aboard (170 lbs) and full fuel, it is slightly over grossed. On the Cherokee 140. It drops like a rock with all flaps in. I could not imagine doing this, and I would suggest (300 hours) NEVER try this. If you do, try it at 2000 feet. I don't recall much about float but it does not hang around in the air very long without power in. My estimation is in case of engine failure. Lets say your 2000 AGL. Look down, straight down. Look at your watch. You have about 4 minutes unitil your on the ground, in whatever condition. The F4U glide is about 45 degrees, 42 if your good (i've read). I think the Cherokee is better but not much. I was told the Arrow drops like a rock without power. Best Glide is 80 miles per hour. Your speeds with flaps scare me. Stall is 59 no flaps. I have POH in PDF but have seen it on the web.

[@flightsim481]

Jeffrey Perkins Thanks Jeffrey. I do point out in the video that I accidentally keep saying knots as opposed to mph which may be where some confusion occurs. The figures I always used were Vso = 55 mph and an approach speed of 1.3 x Vso giving 70 mph and then for flaps down Vs1 63 mph and thus a flaps in approach speed of 1.2 x 63 giving 82 mph. That's not actually dissimilar to the A2A figures. Given the fact that the performance of the simulated aircraft is set by A2A, then the figures I use are those supplied by A2A. The A2A model is quite slippery, and I don't recall having to work as hard in the real aircraft to manage the speed, but then this is a simulation and thus there are limitations to what the designers can work with. At the end of the day, any real life pilot should never be contemplating learning to operate their aircraft from a KZbin video let alone a flight simulator video, but as you quite rightly say should be using the POH. You are quite right about being cautious with full flap in the 152 because of the lack of power and thus performance and yes it quite often gets operated over gross. Indeed, when I was solo with full fuel, I was right on the forward C of G limit. In addition, I think both Cessna 152 and 172 have placards and notes in the POH advising to avoid crossed controls with full flap due to the airflow from the wings blanking the rudder and affecting control of the aircraft adversely. I have been fortunate that virtually all of the flying I ever did with Instructors was with hoary old experienced instructors, often current or ex-military. Indeed, my first ever instructor was an ex Jaguar OCU boss with thousands of hours who's touch when flying was incredible. I consider myself honoured to have been in an aircraft with him, but would never, ever attempt what he could do with a plane! His flying was sublime and his ability to use sideslip as an additional tool to manage aircraft energy was quite exceptional. Quite a few aircraft can be crabbed with full flap and the trick is to read the POH. I don't have a copy of the Pa 28 POH to hand, so I can't recall specifically if side slipping with full flap is forbidden or not, but I suspect not. I lost my medical due to incurable cancer whilst doing my FI rating so sadly my move to simming was enforced, but critically my videos are not aimed at or intended for qualified real life pilots but for those who want to enjoy simulation. As a result, I am grateful for those who wish to help by adding their real world knowledge. Thanks, Rich

[@mafarachisi]

Well presented and very clear. Thanks mate!

[@flightsim481]

No problem, glad you enjoyed it :-)

[@challenger_commander]

Really useful in interesting video, thanks. Can't wait to put it into practice.

[@flightsim481]

+Kristian McGuire Thanks, glad you enjoyed it :-)

[@jltaviation]

Is there a software addition for voice communication to contact air traffic control myself rather than the game???

[@flightsim481]

I think there is although I've never used it.

[@williamleadbetter9686]

I quite often don't use much flaps on most airplanes I fly. Don't really need them on my Ch-200,the ercoupe doesn't have them, The other planes I've flown don't either citabria, cub or champ. gonna try the pitts and taylorcraft next them should be finished with the sonerai. How many of you only use themsparingly?

[@flightsim481]

IMHO people are too prescriptive at times. As you say, there are many aircraft which don't even have them, but likewise, there are occasions when one might use different settings.

[@williamleadbetter9686]

Oh i can definitely see why people use them in sims because in these ww2 combats sims you can't much see over the nose so people come in a bit steep so they use flaps to counter that nothing wrong with that. I do it too sometimes. Its also just a bit of a problem for aggravating ground effect and floating too far down the run way

[@flightsim481]

Floating is mainly due to people having too great a speed on the approach and flare which is a common thing in flight simming. As you say, early stages of flap are good for lift, but the latter stages primarily to increase drag and thus allow a more nose down attitude on approach with a higher power setting to improve engine response in the event of a go around. Of course the high drag doesn't help with the go around but that's where flap selection is important. I used to frequently land at an international airport in a Cessna when hours building for my commercial licence and would often do flapless approaches both to practice them, but also because the higher ground speed on touch down meant I could get to the runway exit more quickly so the heavies weren't baulked by me.

[@isaacridge4493]

this for msfs 2020 would be awsome

[@estebangonzalez2291]

Does this plane come with FSX ? Because I don´t have it. It´s in my Airplanes folder though

[@flightsim481]

No, it's an add on aircraft, the Pa-28 Cherokee from A2A simulations.

[@james082459]

Great video. Very helpful and informative.

[@flightsim481]

Great to hear it helped and was enjoyable. Thanks for watching :-)

[@beovp91]

how do i get this simulator? can you also show man pres, and rpm of prop?

[@flightsim481]

The aircraft can be bought from most of the major retailers web sites. The Cherokee doesn't have variable pitch prop, so doesn't have prop rpm or manifold pressure. It does however have an engine rpm gauge.

[@hunterfagan6272]

how did you know the wind direction without a wind sock

[@flightsim481]

TupolevPilot Being a tutorial, I set up a reasonable wind (I can't recall what it was). To be honest, I don't think I have seen a truly accurate windsock in FSX.

[@matthewparkinson9723]

How did you get your terrain to look so good, thanks :)

[@flightsim481]

It's FTX England payware from ORBX. Thanks for watching :-)

[@MrSameeg]

Nice intro very good instructional vid once again Is there a chance of you doing a series on Instrument flying Cheers Mike from Scotland

[@flightsim481]

It's on the to do list.

[@SeamusMcNeil]

Another fine video mate - Thanks again Cheers Jim

[@bobhatcher5505]

Nice video, very informative, very helpful, thanks!

[@Steve-Slacker-Philipson]

Great Video thank for the explanations. learnt a ton from this one. now need to go practice :) Cheers mate.

[@g7usl]

Nice video. Your comments were valued. ;)

[@flightsim481]

+g7usl Thanks for watching :-)

[@cpt.georgeikapel2271]

Thank you for the landing lessons, really helpful...

[@flightsim481]

Glad you enjoyed it :-)

[@luisserrano2753]

Where can I find this Aircraft? I mean in my flight simulator I havent't that piper

[@flightsim481]

It's a payware add on so you need to buy it from A2A.

[@luisserrano2753]

+flightsim481 thanks

[@wim3999]

Great! Practical video. Thanks!!

[@Lexandmax81]

AWESOME vids and awesome channel !!!! THANK YOU SO MUCH for doing this and sharing this!!!!!!

[@flightsim481]

Its a pleasure.

[@BlackoutHUN]

First things first, I'm at my 10th hour with a Piper PA-28-140 (HA-SKU). I'm training to my CPL. Your approaches are way too low, your airspeed is way too low, you don't seem to really care about the centerline, and you don't really flare the airplane, just crash it into the ground. These landings are not a great deal in FSX, but if you try to land a plane, with these vertical speed, it would hurt. (Unfortunetly, I've experienced it.) If you flare sooner (yes, I see those trees) and more, you could stop earlier. Practise landings more, try landing with 2nd notch flaps, setting throttle closed sooner, and try opening full flaps when landed, it increases drag, so shortens roll on the ground.

[@flightsim481]

Csaba Turza Thankyou for your advice. I had one really close experience in a Pa 28 where I nearly crashed. It was after I had my CPL, I was a bit too confident and nearly crashed through a hedge at the far end of the runway. One key feature of a good pilot is always to review every flight, to assess your own mistakes (because they always happen) and to ensure you learn from your mistakes and the mistakes of others. So here is what happened: I nearly crashed because I was doing a short field grass strip landing in a Pa 28 Cherokee and came in too fast (it was only 4-5 kts as I recall). As I'm sure you appreciate, a 10% increase in speed results in a 20% longer landing distance. Unfortunately, I also tried to flare and hold off for a nice smooth landing. Of course during all of this the ground is passing underneath me and I'm concentrating so hard on getting a nice gentle landing that I miss just how fast I was running out of runway. I already had full flap, but in any event the aerodynamic drag effect of a Cherokee's flaps is far less effective than correct application of the brakes, and to use the brakes properly, you need the full aircraft weight to be on the wheels. After a very scary few moments, I eventually stopped about 10 metres from the hedge. I stopped and sat there for a few seconds, collecting my thoughts and thanking my lucky stars that I did stop. I remember the cold shiver where I realised that I could have died and whilst I suspect I was only stationary for a few seconds, it felt like I was there for minutes collecting my thoughts. I suspect ATC knew exactly what had happened and had prepared themselves to deal with a crash. I was on my own, so only the ATC tower and I knew how close it had been and when I went in to see them, the look we exchanged demonstrated that they also knew how close it had been. I flew a further 3 trips that day, returning to that same airfield on the second to last trip to drop a passenger off before I flew home. My second approach and landing was a much more controlled approach speed wise. I could have died earlier that day due to being a few kts too fast and trying to get a smooth landing when one wasn't appropriate. In all of the hundreds of hours that I have flown, that one day is still clear in my mind. I don't know how many hours I had in my logbook at that time, nor have I bothered counting them since other than as a legally required document. That day taught me that a single 30 second event can teach you more about flying and yourself than the previous hundreds of hours of flying recorded in a logbook. I appreciate your kind words of advice. If I may offer my own to you, I would offer the simple advice I was given during my training towards a flight instructors rating. We learn from our mistakes, but in aviation we have to survive them before we can learn from them. I survived that mistake and so I learnt more than any instructor I ever flew with could teach me. Be careful with your speed because too fast can be just as dangerous as too slow. I really enjoyed my CPL, twin and instrument ratings. I'm sure you will enjoy them. I also have a great deal of respect for flight instructors. In aviation terms 10 hours is very little time so it is also good to be mindful of one's abilities and to exercise a certain amount of modesty. There is a famous saying - "There are old pilots and there are bold pilots. But there are no old, bold pilots". Good luck with your studies and I hope you enjoy them as much as I did, Rich

[@BlackoutHUN]

flightsim481 Thank you for your story, I really like to learn from other's mistakes. I'm just talking from my own experiences. Here, we have high expectations, and strict instructors (old eastern block agricultural, fighter and aerobatics instructors). We are expected to do a landing with just two throttle settings (once to 1700 RPM, and once to idle) after the 4th hour. Of course you can correct, if you misjudged your approach, but you get a worse grade for it. We have GoPros in our cockpit, and after the flights, we talk through our mistakes. We are strictly expected to keep speed at 70kts (in still air) at approach. (Once my instructor put the plane in a spin at 700ft AGL when I let the speed drop to 66kts, to show, what a gust can do. With an isntructor like this, you learn to keep your speed (and other parameters) at the desired value for a life. :) )

[@flightsim481]

Csaba Turza Despite standardisations, many instructors will have different opinions on the best way of performing a manoeuvre or flight profile. There there can be several different was to fly the same aircraft. That doesn't mean that one way is right and another wrong. My first flight instruction was in the military and all of the flight instructors were ex-military. To this day, I still wish I had 1% of their skill. The chief flying instructor's first operational aircraft type was a spitfire. They had flown Spitfires, Lightnings, Hunters, Jaguars, Buccaneers, Hawks etc. Even today, I sit in awe of them. My instrument rating instructor in the simulator was a very quiet and reserved man. It turns out he used to fly Lightnings and had lost several friends in crashes and whilst he loved flying, he spoke very little about it. Whilst I admired them, I also learnt a lot. Not one of them would/could tell me how many hours they had flown. All of them had tales to tell of losing friends to accidents. All were incredibly modest and not one of them tried to tell me how good they were. It was clear from who they were and how they flew that they were very skilled. Different instructors have different techniques but I rarely criticise others because it pays to remember that no matter how many hours we have, we are all still learning. Your experiences are different to mine, which are different to many others. A key part is not to make the assumption that you are right and others are wrong. There is a marked difference between exchanging experiences and being openly critical. You may not have noticed, but I very rarely criticise other's flying in a simulator. That's simply because I don't know who taught them, what was taught and the experiences and skills of the teacher. I was in a tail chase where my instructor wanted to have some fun. So he took control, pulled tight into the turn, whilst doing so dropped some flap and pulled even further into the turn until he felt the buffet on the airframe. Not once did he look at the gauges because he knew from the aircraft's feedback what it was doing. He did all the things I had been warned about doing. I couldn't, and still can't fly like that. Be careful about being very critical, particularly with only 10 hours of experience. There are others who will challenge you and your experience. I would simply say listen to your instructors, learn from them, listen to others and share your experiences with them but be very careful of criticising others because there will always be someone out there who knows more and can fly better than you. This is a simulator and it is designed to be enjoyable. This is not a tutorial for real life flying it is just some fun on a computer. I'm sure you will enjoy the journey of your flight training. It incredibly rewarding but some of the best pilots I ever had the chance to fly with were the most modest and said very little. I have tremendous respect for them, not because of how they flew, but because of what they taught me as a person inside and outside of a cockpit. Good luck, Rich :-)

[@mintyaviation2376]

24:59, In my opinion, you were way too low over the threshold and you slammed it down! Well explained but there is a few things I would improve here.

[@bill1949wt]

Excellent. Many thanks ...481!

[@flightsim481]

+Bill1949 WT Glad you enjoyed it :-)

[@wellsevv564]

Land her on the numbers!!

[@dpdahlin]

EXCELLENT! Thank you

[@IesApac]

very nice work, liked and subbed

[@flightsim481]

Thanks :-)

[@padeksewenejt1032]

Isn't that "Side Slip" You perform couple of times is acctualy a Forward Slip ? Side Slip is used to go straight where there is a cross wind blowing You from your course to counter this effect. Forward Slip is for fast descent without or minimal increase of speed and it looks just like You were doing it. It's not like I'm wising you or something :) don't get me wrong. My point is to specify this topic for knowledge consistency :) . I read in FLIGHT SIMULATOR X FOR PILOTS: REAL-WORLD TRAINING about this topic. There were examples with Piper Cub. And that is my understanding of this two types of slip and the difference between each other. But, as I always say, I could be wrong of course :) . BTW I really like Your video. Very eye opening :) For me especially that part of going higher on approach with GA regardless of PAPI/VASI and explanation why that should be from safety point of view. Didn't thought that way about that.

[@thelogicalracer1036]

I subbed, loved the vid

[@jorgeplanello]

you were going a bit fast with full flap. With the right speed a real piper goes down like a rock with no need to use side slip, that is a delicate maneuver.

[@hunterfagan6272]

fsx or p3d? also, is there scenery as good as that for the northeast of the united states?

[@flightsim481]

TupolevPilot It's FSX. For this scenery I use ORBX FTX stuff from here www.fullterrain.com/ They do do some North America scenery.

[@hunterfagan6272]

flightsim481 OK, thanks!

[@flightsim481]

No probs. :-)

[@white88773]

Very well executrd

[@gerryortiz7276]

Nice video!

[@flightsim481]

Thanks, much appreciated.

[@filips6528]

Birmingham?

[@flightsim481]

Filips Yes the first airfield is Birmingham.

[@Ryan1236]

Do you fly online?

[@flightsim481]

Ryanthecomputerexpert Hi, yes I do but generally either chilled with a group on FSCloud, or on PilotEdge if I want a bit more realism. :-)

[@howardflies]

Rich.... You gotta hold off....

[@flightsim481]

+Howard “Howardflyer” Lau Yeah, I agree, although it's much easier in real life with some peripheral vision.

[@tomsawyer5464]

Are You pilot?

[@flightsim481]

Yes I was a commercially qualified pilot but subsequently lost my medical.

[@jamespatterson447]

Sorry to hear that by the way I liked the video

[@edisonhernandez2605]

good video man just want to add normal approach speed in this aircraft is about 85 mph short field about 70 mph for short field and soft field