TROLL BIOLOGY 101

0:00 Intro
1:07 Part 1: Canon Info
34:09 Intermission 1
36:38 Part 2: Furries
44:57 Intermission 2
55:15 Part 3: Bug Trolls
PATREON: / funkmclovin
TWITTER: / bigfunkyj
MUSIC:
funkmclovin.bandcamp.com/albu...
• Homestuck Music (Funk ...
THE ARTISTS:
/ turkey_korvid
/ ragingpachinko
/ greentorsos
/ squu1d
/ technogryph
/ spruiko
/ king_of_wyverns
/ abaddonism
#SAHCon #2021
THE PREVIEW: • Troll Biology 101 Prom...

[@bluecheesefactory]

I dont even know what homestuck is but good video essay about whatever the fuck is going on here 👍

[@Queer_Nerd_For_Human_Justice]

Honestly even though I have 100% context, I feel like the essay does stand on its own. There is no point other than to collect and arrange information for the sake of it. A common theme in homestuck.

[@gatordragon6140]

RUN WHILE YOU STILL CAN

[@nightlightnobody8157]

its wonderful. but dont read it. its also kinda hell

[@__-be1gk]

That shit about Caliborn making trolls stupid on purpose so Calliope would be stupid for liking them is EXACTLY the sort of time shit that he would do because time loops are the only thing he actually understands.

[@demiTrashdotpng]

Sadly he can’t draw loops

[@cassiejade413]

homestuck: "it's probably best not to examine troll reproduction in too much detail" funk mclovin: how about i do anyway

[@gabidecastro]

Tealbloods also have really strong digestive systems. Terezi and Tagora in particular are known to be able to eat non-organic objects (chalk, batteries), and derive enjoyment from doing so.

[@dottyContrarian]

woah where did tagora eat batteries because i do not remember it at all. was it during the trial when he tells joey and xefros that he was in the bathroom for a while

[@gabidecastro]

@@dottyContrarian yes, you can give things to Tagora in exchange for info, one of which is a couple of batteries carried over from an act 1 save file.

[@dottyContrarian]

@@gabidecastro ah

[@rainbowsylvie16]

tagora still has to fight for his life on the load gaper though

[@darkseraph2009]

Chalk is actually edible. In fact, tums is basically chalk and sugar. People have used chalk as food additives and nausea cures for a lot of human history. The only issue that can arise is that some chalk can contain lead.

[@moss_fetttt]

I usually hate alien anthropomorphization but holy shit them creating our universe and revealing that we are somewhat based off of them is the BEST way to get around that meta

[@DarthZ01]

Every Sprite in Homestuck actually does have arms, they usually keep them in a nearby chest or safe.

[@grawlixz]

LOL

[@johnhenley3966]

I don’t

[@amisscreant]

I believe it is canon that trolls have different body temps based on blood color, as in Karkat's pesterquest route he is touched by the player and remarked upon as pretty warm, and he has to hide underground to prevent the drones from picking up on his mutant-level body warmth.

[@bluefoxplush2855]

yeah im pretty sure its the lower on the hemospectrum the warmer, the higher on the hemospectrum the colder

[@PIMKAMINA2]

it's also noted in mindfangs diary when she was 'embracing' a slave that was stripped of her sign (that is very heavily hinted at being the Dolorosa) that 'the temperature of [her] body gave [MindFang] a range for her possible blood color', since her sign was stripped and thus her blood color was a secret. this doesn't state that lower bloods are explicitly warmer, but it does state that different blood colors do have different temperatures.

[@gracedreams4641]

secret fourth option: trolls are plants

[@ejm1225]

Like the Schlorpians from Solar Opposites?

[@emperortenebrisemeraldwing8578]

Headcanon: Trolls are fully capable of reproducing by themselves and the Mothergrub system is only enforced to keep their Blood Caste system intact.

[@chelonianmobile]

Wouldn't the "incestuous slurry" method make the castes *less* discrete?

[@kaedotmoe]

@@chelonianmobile it is required becauses the castes are entirely illegitimate anyway. blood colours probably result in some phenotypic characteristic, example "blood" colours and horn shapes, but other features like the psiionics, or physical and psychic abilities, may in fact actually be dependent on other unrelated genetic factors that are only deliberately associated by the state-controlled breeding process with colours, again specifically for the purposes of maintaining a social hierarchy. this is easy for them to enforce because everyone grows up in a cave where they kill each other, and they can easy eliminate "unnatural" combination of characteristics and colours that way. this would also explain why it is possible to eliminate an entire blood colour (lime) despite the fact that these types all appear to be part of a single organism and differentiate only in the way, like, sexes do. They didn't actually eliminate a functional mechanism, they eradicated a blood and skin colour. the lime abilities are still present and culled in the caves.

[@broblerone413]

I'm pretty sure it's mentioned that the reason The Sufferer's (and Karkat's) sign is Cancer is because in the reality where the Sufferer grew up to be a leader, he was put in cuffs of that shape (when being punished and eventually killed). Also, It's been theorized that red blood is a mutation of lime blood (there's also theories that limebloods have special powers to calm highbloods/reduce their hostility, which would make sense considering Karkat was able to calm Gamzee down, and the fact that Eridan doesn't act particularly hostile towards Karkat, despite him being of lower blood). If this truly is the case, it would make sense why Limebloods were hunted to extinction, as they can interfere with the power highbloods and royalty have over the rest of the hemospectrum

[@DapperKingpinCobblepot]

I wanted to leave a like but the likes are at 69 and it would feel wrong to mess that up.

[@broblerone413]

@@DapperKingpinCobblepot it's the right thing to do. thank you for your sacrifice.

[@undyingUmbrage413]

That's not just speculation. In the extended zodiac, Cancer is the limeblood category. Cancer is between Leo and Gemini in real life, and limeblood is between olive and gold.

[@Mirai_the_weeb]

They are somewhat sensitive to temperature, when vriska visits John's ghost memory, she comments on how cold it is and asks how anything can survive there. I'm assuming alternia never gets cold enough for something akin to snow to occur

[@lunar_proxy]

alternia might have very mind weather that stays relatively the same throughout the sweep, so they don't have seasons, at least not super noticeable ones

[@nuhuhm]

hussie: trying to making trolls different from humans and unique while still being human like creatures also hussie: *haha pupa pan*

[@spiderq848]

In regards to Hussie sucking at worldbuilding, he's incredibly good at coming up with starting points and somehow terrible to the same degree at actually fleshing those things out. The hemospectrum is pretty unique as far as I can think of yet trolls are canonically just grey humans. The quadrant system is so fun to play with and yet we never even see a healthy kismesisstude in homestuck proper and most of the endgame relationships are just matespritships anyway (with nepquius being the exception I guess but they both die so does that even count)

[@nerd_nato564]

Honestly the only thing worse than kismessitudes in terms of unhealthiness are auspisticisms. Like, those don't even have the flirting/admiration aspect to them, it's literally just "one person does massive amounts of emotional labour to stop other two people from committing/being murdered."

[@spiderq848]

@@nerd_nato564 Just to clarify, I'm not saying kismesistudes as a concept are inherently unhealthy, and I don't believe auspistices have to be either. But I know I'd just end up rambling if I got into it so my point was just that Hussie doesn't know how to optimize his own concepts lol

[@nerd_nato564]

@@spiderq848 Oh yeah, I absolutely agree. Can't remember where I read it, either HS or HS^2, but it was something like "a kismessitude needs a degree of respect and admiration, and should push you to better yourself" and I wish hussie played more with that concept rather than just "i hate you so much i wanna make out with you," same applies to auspistices.

[@ericquiabazza2608]

Exactly! Luckily there is SEVERAL fanfictions who grasp the concept and work good with it, one of my favourite is a crack ship fan fic, where the world ending is drop to the side and Nepeta is task to be the SHIPER for everyone else. Focusing a lot more in characters interactions and expositions. Specially her hinted kissmesitus with Eridan, is really well develope. What i has most gripes tho is the line between Red and Pale. Everyone seems to have a diferent standard for it, as people tie it to human romance togheter. For me Pale manage the motion aspect, and Red is more Mate attraction, specially as the interpretation that Trolls must "Pity" someone because they are too Pridefull to admire someone. But i must stop ranting. Sorry for that.

[@brezo9192]

Despite all problems you mention, Trolls are the best constructed alien species that I have ever read in fiction, even in Dune or Cosmere

[@KazzieBB]

Colder body temperature the higher up the hemospectrum is actually canon, as well as it being very difficult to kill a seadweller.

[@discipleoftzeentch8384]

“We have to write his own comic for him” Yes… that’s how the epilogues went…

[@DarthZ01]

Thanks I hate them.

[@Luigicat11]

Hey, let's not lump in all those other continuations with the Epilogues. 90% of those are incalculably better than their "dubiously canon" counterpart, and often just as much more accurate to Homestuck.

[@batbehavior]

personally I like the headcanon that troll's blood is hued by haemoglobin variants, and the higher up the hemospectrum you go, the more effective their haemoglobin gets which affects how their bodies absorb/transport oxygen and can then explain their varied lifespans :>

[@ethangnasher3848]

Kind of makes sense... But red blood (as far as I know) is the most efficient in our world

[@mvxsr]

iirc karkat and one of the humans bonded over both of them having red blood (perhaps dave). My idea is human blood looks closest to Karkat’s “candy red”, which I think could be atributed to a less bright or saturated blood color in the more common blood castes. You know how human blood looks a little brighter in thinner containers, or when.. spread i guess? Maybe burgundy blood looks practically black, and that burgundy shade we see in the splatters is the “diluted” shade.

[@StepperBox]

On Karkat is a lime blood thing: if you take the headcanon that Slime is actually lime blood and it has properties that sooth trolls. And how during the shoosh pap, Karkats text is lime green. (While Gamzee's is still purple)

[@cruelcimmcia859]

Yes !

[@nocanseegreen3845]

or if you just take that karkat being calming to gamzee was soporific, that explains the green text without making the leap that karkat's blood is not red

[@Luigicat11]

@@nocanseegreen3845 I don't think they're saying that Karkat's blood is literally lime-colored, but that his mutation is specifically a mutation of lime blood.

[@nazthesilly]

trolls most definitely have noses, there are several pages where they are drawn with such.

[@iridiumSerpent]

I just saw a theory that troll horns function as some sort of aposematism, the bright colours serve to warn off potential predators.

[@azealot7112]

This is an actual 101 course because it's as long as real lectures.

[@cycloppsss]

The ultimate guide to make an OC, !!

[@gameygeemer4142]

Because Chitin is the thing that gives mushrooms their structure, I like the idea that their skin just feels like a mushroom.

[@mithril5869]

It is also the material that bug shells are composed of. Which is probably what they were going for.

[@Juniper_Rose]

Nobody: Jojo: Kanaya is buff and sexy.

[@Juniper_Rose]

And they're right.

[@Samookely]

based and true

[@Luigicat11]

When it comes to headcanons about troll biology, I've discussed the subject of troll blood color with some other people online. It was proposed that troll blood isn't actually all those colors, and I don't mean in the same way our blood isn't actually red. Basically, the component of a troll's blood that are actually genetically part of the troll is colorless, but there's a variety of endosymbiotic microbes of varying colors saturating trolls' bodily fluids (primarily blood of course) that also influence the way the troll grows from the earliest stages of their development, explaining caste variation. Or maybe the "default" for troll blood is candy red, and Karkat's mutation is that he just never got a dose of the caste microbes.

[@CloudyDaze]

It only occurred to me now listening to this in one sitting but Kankri's probably the only example of Troll Body Heat, seeing as Porrim made him a sweater because he looked cold. I dont look in your comments enough to see of this was brought up but I felt I should mention it nonetheless

[@Inktron]

About wings- it could be that the trolls dream/god selves don’t have them bc subconsciously the trolls don’t want them just like how Terezi was still blind on Prospit.

[@Windwalker59889]

I always thought the reason the Rust and Bronze blooded trolls have shorter lifespans was because they were more likely to be culled by drones or the higher bloods, where as Gold bloods are “useful” so they aren’t culled often. I may be wrong though.

[@Palepetal]

I thought burgundy-bloods living like a dozen sweeps "naturally" was because of the constant abuse they suffer from society. Like how slaves used to have like half the lifespan of free people. A lifetime of exploitaction and abuse can really shorten your lifespan.

[@Avabees]

Shedding skin is more of an insect-like characteristic, but they probably dont actually in adulthood. It would be funny if they got called “instars” and needed to shed multiple times as grubs

[@Avabees]

Oh, reminder as well that tavros also refers to his own horns or at leasts laments how hard they make sleeping for him

[@Luigicat11]

Caliborn may not be smart enough to pull that terminology plan, but remember, Lord English is part Lil Hal. Y'know, the guy smart enough to have "solved" pi and found the aleph-nullth and final digit (which is apparently 4).

[@VivBrodock]

Each colony having a mother grub could be what jadebloods are responsible for once they leave alternia, taking the virgin queen with them once they are an adult

[@raimicannon733]

its going to drive me insane if i don't bring up that the cell walls of fungi are also made of chitin and while being sturdy it isn't necessarily rigid!!

[@azechase6597]

I think that the shedding skin makes sense bc bugs do that as well. My hc is that troll skin is sort of leathery/plastic-y Also that sopor slime is pretty much just an elaborate chuckle voodoo. That's why it can make you high and you can od plus the sufferer and his followers all stop using it.

[@Juniper_Rose]

Alright alright serious post time. Headcanon: Trolls are way WAY older than we know. They're not one specific species. They're at least ~4 subspecies. The Empress before the Condesce, perhaps even before that, genetically modified many of the species conquered by Trolls. The basics of these features (incredible strength, psionics of varying power, mind control, aquatic adaptation) show through in the caste that was originally of this species. Likewise the lifespans. A telekinetic species that didn't have a lot of options and only lived 3-5 decades needed powerful deterrents to predators, or assistance for hunting. An insect species with voidrot developed vast energy stores to counterbalance this, and when Voidrot was mostly eradicated, it left some with power energy projection. By sampling pieces of each species and combining them into something that was thought to be "ideal", they needed to be differentiated for experimental purposes. Was this the Psionic? No she broke my finger this is the strong one. Next batch has indigo blue blood modified into them. This is of course over an INCREDIBLY long amount of time. Perhaps the species that did this was just the ones who created the Troll session (the Horrorterrors/Squiddles perhaps). Perhaps it was a Dirk-style "create the ultimate lifeform for the Game". This goes a long way to connect all the things that don't make sense like lifespan, strength, resilience, powers.

[@Juniper_Rose]

Additionally this causes some bleed over for some things. Indigos being strong meant that there was at least a little intermingling with higher bloods and lower bloods. So ceruleans and purples are very strong for their size and physical ability. But not so strong as Indigos whose species ability was strength. Likewise Jades, Teals, and Olives. Jades lived in a climate FAR harsher than Alternia, so the sun doesn't bother them. Olives and Teals can live in caves and forests and the like because they don't entirely survive in the sun but there's bound to be some sunlight and heat they can't avoid (likewise we watch Terezi appear mostly fine in direct sunlight...until she stared at the sun and scorches her eyes out.) Perhaps this is why Limes were so dangerous; they weren't naturally inclined to tending to their young in caverns (like Jades) and were resilient to sunlight. So the threat came from the fact they could freely gather when the higher ups could not. But that's unrelated to this topic and is mostly an explanation for where Limes fit with the other green/teal blooded trolls. Finally the lower bloods all exhibit psionics. Perhaps it was Burgundy and Gold who had these, but the more peaceful/farming Bronze base got animal communion to help tend to packs and farms. The seadwellers are just amphibious and aquatic species. Fuchsia were more like lobsters or deep sealife; incredible strength and toughness to live at the bottom of the ocean, and living essentially forever. Whereas Violets were more like dolphins and whales. So they're tough but they need air. Since developing a generic subspecies that can survive in the ocean depths and on land was probably a tall order, fuchsia becomes the rarest caste; it took a lot of effort getting them to survive the surface, so there were never a lot of them.

[@liamfidller4319]

the "create the ultimate lifeform for the game" thing is specifically stated. thats what doctor scratch's job was.

[@terezioctober5460]

about the horns being pretty much useless and not meaning anything (around 1:10:41), in hiveswap act 2 Joey has to get fake horns for herself to try to blend in better on alternia and she asks xefros if they have any meaning. if you choose the traffic cones he says it means she has a "REALLY well-developed... personality!"" and if you choose the cornucopias he says she has a "REALLY big... heart!" not sure if this is just like. a throw away dick joke or has any actual implication but still worth mentioning imo.

[@kitkat1880]

Actually during (it may be gamzee’s or karkats route in friend sim, might be wrong, mspa reader says they lack the nightvison that trolls do. So I think they (trolls) have some nightvison.

[@liamfidller4319]

they are nocturnal

[@lunar_proxy]

they definitely do as they are nocturnal (they literally can't go outside during the day, sooo...)

[@haydin3503]

THIS IS ONE OF MY FAVORITE TOPICS EVER IM GOING TO EXPLODE

[@Faunadoodlez]

Same

[@Crocodilianstides2]

what if troll horns are just vestigial antennae, left over from insectoid roots. maybe they are like impressive coloration on birds, to impress peers. bigger horns = more attractive/higher social standing. this is also backed up by the fact trolls of higher castes seem to have larger/more complex horns. also something that I think is either more or less cannon or in the very least widely accepted fannon is that horns serve a purpouse of caste-identification, for example rust bloods seem to all have roughly bovine horns, violets seem to have wavy/curly horns, and you mentioned jades all seem to have hooked horns.

[@Vincent-yx7tg]

Imo mutantbloods can very in colours. For ex lime is cady red, purpleblood would be cyan etc. Limebloods posessed soothing powers, as u can see in the comic Karkat was able to Sooth gamzee into being calm that was prob their role in the cast before they were killed.

[@DarthZ01]

Makes sense why they were executed. Being able to quite the anger of extremely powerful trolls at will can be deadly to their position. For example Karkat can approach and even touch a raging grand highblood and quiet him into passivity unharmed. Imagine a lime blood assassin who can calm a high ruling troll so thoroughly that they can come right up and touch them without being in any danger. They may conspire with an heiress to calm the current empress enough to allow the heiress to usurp their throne.

[@reconboy0454]

cyan is pretty similar to teal tho

[@VivBrodock]

It would be interesting to examine the idea that maybe the empress and heiresses are actually just as mutant as a crimsonblood though. Would really be a poignant part of the whole analogy for real world systems of oppression stuff.

[@lunar_proxy]

@@reconboy0454 and candy red is pretty similar to rust. obviously most mutant blood colors would still look somewhat similar to the real hemospectrum (because it covers a whole ass rainbow, duh), but still be different, especially if the mutant color and "real" color don't really match (you might've thought karkat was a mutated rust, but sike! he was lime all along!!)

[@frenzyproductions]

I always thought that since they were most likely bugs, the horns are antennae since they dont have noses and sometimes no ears

[@floatyloser5817]

Lanque isn't the only male jadeblood, there's also that one H2D (troll kpop group) member whose name i forgot

[@bluekittyyoyo6592]

everyone also forgets homestuck end credits best boy, Cliper Borden

[@caseyjarmes]

Trolls canonically can’t eat onions

[@Queer_Nerd_For_Human_Justice]

I'm so happy about the bug troll portion. I feel so vindicated. I've always seen the similarities to ants, and the idea that all trolls except for the mother grub are sexually male makes SO MUCH SENSE. When you suggested the drones were the non-reproducing females, i was like "OH"

[@sparkybleu]

the biggest hype for the lovely human known as Funk McLovin

[@jasombee]

Man. I haven't finished the video yet but lemme just say, mad respect for this. I want to write fanfiction about the trolls and I this is the best video for me to look up canon compliant material about them. This needs more views. :D

[@ericquiabazza2608]

18:15 "Royals are easy to kill" *Correction needed* Please see: -Polipa Goezee chapter, requirements to kill a violet. Fanon: -Pesterquest, Eridan and sollux fight.

[@ericquiabazza2608]

Aditionally: There is the posibility that as you go higher on the hemuspectrum that -OFFENSIVE Psichic habilities decreases -DEFENSIVE Psichic habilities Increases. This in mainly 2 instances: 1st: Is comented the in case Glob where to not be fed and it scream it would begin killing from the lower blood upward. Commented by Eridan (if i am not mistaken) that let it scream by a valculated amount of time would kill all member of certain lower clases, living ultimatly the royal as the last living. 2nd During the Dancestors Dream Buble shenanigans we can see the Serkets dominating a lot of troll, specially Eridans and Cronuses. But, when Vriska is left alone she coudnt control any of them. Pointing that Highblood have resistances to Spichic mental attack, but may ultimatly fail to a Milenia Skill adept like Aranea Serket. Mind you, this is resistance to MENTAL attacks, not Telequinesis or other more Physical effects. People seems to forgive this sections a LOT. Have seen my fair share of Highblood control by even mild adept Psichic and kill by mundain means. Tho, not unexpected when we concider the mental resistance is mostly background. And have Feferi, Eridan and kanaja dying fast. Obiously ignoring that both Feferi and Kanaja got shot by something severaltimes stronger than Ehab Crosshair, and has been discuse that Kanaja may have use Space attributes to separate Eridan's halfs.

[@lucianchristinzio2630]

1:20:05 the retroreflective eyes speculation is actually corroborated by the end of hiveswap act 2 when we see Joey take a soldier with Xefros, and Xefros's eyes light up from the flash

[@thatonepunkguy]

hmmm if i had to guess... based on the descriptions of parts and the general biology of trolls... troll reproduction is likely similar to snail reproduction in certain ways

[@PocketDeerBoy]

I'm personally of the belief that the entire hemospectrum is rigidly socially constructed, as are many of its associated biological traits like lifespan. The lifespan thing was adressed in the video already, but i think they cull basically any grub with a coloration that falls too far out of its constructed category. If I remember correctly, it's stated that karkat was rescued by his lusus at an early age, so it's possible there's blood colors like candy red and lime that are simply culled before they're allowed to be nursed. To me this just also makes sense with how rigidly eugenics-y the troll's world is: you have to make up an ideal way for trolls to be for the system to make sense at all, to justify all the killing that goes on.

[@Celeste-jh2lj]

Another thing to note about blood which can explain why there are varying shades on the GHBs wall is blood darkens over time. It could just be that the different shades are old blood from previous kills that changed slightly in color bc of its age. The closer to the spectrum could indicate freshness

[@benwaffleiron]

i like when you acknowledge when a theory doesnt really hold a lot of water, but still think they're cute, like with furry trolls. it's how i feel about transfem noelle holiday: i dont think the biological justification regarding deer antlers works, since the holidays aren't deer, they're monsters that superficially look like deer, but trans noelle is still my headcanon anyway because its cute :)

[@rainHellsing]

Recently got back into homestuck and am having the time of my life hyper fixating on it

[@snortingcatnip2842]

Me currently 🫶🏻

[@murlocknight1427]

I believe it’s mentioned at some point that trolls cannot eat onions? Just putting that out there, since it seems somewhat relevant.

[@raydarcarter6721]

I love that bc of the background you can gently shake your phone and make all the photos and words dance :)

[@arempy5836]

Maybe the wings aren't removed but they are atavistic, like humans born with tails.

[@moss_fetttt]

Also, coming at Trolls from an evolutionary and/or planetary perspective a lot of things seem to change with them. Alternia's star forcing them to hide underground during the day likely made them adapt night vision similar to cats' hence their yellow sclera. Since heat comes with light (especially with stars) Horns were likely adapted as a way to radiate off extra heat from the sun, similar to some species of cow. It's also important to note that karkat's 'mutant level of warmth' would come from his tiny horns in this regard.

[@divvyn]

I am haunted by my past experiences, at least homestuck still brings me joy despite the punch of seeing homestuck content

[@Quantumironturtle]

Potential add-on: the Lusus/Lusi are the guard female drone variants, born from the mother grub and tasked with safeguarding the genetically viable males. The whole reason eusocial insects work is because the fertilized and unfertilized eggs both hatching means you pass on more of your genes by defending the queen than by trying to reproduce yourself (see Tierzoo for a full video on the topic), so the sterile lusi drones protecting the fertile trolls makes perfect sense. Plus, it clicks a lot better if all the symbiotic species we see on Alternia are different breeds of the same species instead of the large collection of symbiotic relationships they appear to be, especially given the sheer variety on display. Not even humans have that many symbiotic relationships with other species, and we go out of our way to build them on purpose.

[@gabrielgonzalez3462]

I wish I knew about this as I saw this comic where under a black light Troll blood is visible throughout their body with a neon glow of their blood color

[@lokos-zs2ex]

i remember watching this exact panel whenever it was live during sahcom

[@eb8515]

I've always seen the horns as some kind of poorly evolved form of antenna tbh, seeing them as insects. That or they once were used for showing off to/defending individual mother grubs like rhinoceros beetle 'horns'. I had considered drones as put in place by the empress, but seeing them as female workers makes me wonder if they used to be more troll like, only becoming heavily armored and violent due to the Doc's influence. If they had them on beforus that is. In Lanque's friendsim route, he states while seducing the reader that jades are forced to stay chaste and tend to the mother grubs once they become adults, so there's also the possibility of the jades starting as sexual 'males' as to pass on genetic material, but then after ascension into true adulthood, becoming the 'female workers' that then handle the care of the queen and her eggs (the role itself being like nurse bees in hives). The rainbow drinking phenomenon then making jades stronger and more easily able to defend the mother grub. I don't remember all of Porrim's discussion of this but there might be some evidence for this idea with her as well. As for the blood, perhaps it's a secondary "hierarchy" system like the queen/worker/soldier split, but this time it has become almost completely vestigial over time, now mostly societal- fuchsias and jades still have proper "roles" in the hive system, but other castes only have the powers left to them. I'd assume that in the hive system trolls had earlier in evolution, it was necessary to have different types/levels of power as both a means of providing for the hive, and defense mechanisms. (Violets perhaps did deep sea hunting, like worker bees finding flowers, where psionics could help build hive structures. Blues with their strength could defend the hive from predators, and so on. Teals and possibly olives seem to have no extra purpose, whatever role they filled before could have already been lost in evolution.) By hierarchy I do want to clarify not as a status thing, just as an 'assigned specific work by mother grub as a colony type species' thing. Great video!

[@cgoose500]

35:24 Karkat has cancer as a sign because The Sufferers shackles were shaped like that. Like how Jesus is represented by the cross even though that was the thing that slowly and torturously killed him.

[@Cybercerialdestroyer]

47:54 well about the “trolls can get pregnant” it is show in hiveswap: friendsim that trolls and humans can “have intercourse” together, but that game is dubiously cannon

[@vanilla7349]

Sorry to react to such an old comment but the same was basically said by Dave in one of the Epilogues (Meat). It's somewhat cannon, if I understand correctly...

[@julianbello8376]

Oh worm, big hype

[@novabee6503]

I've always had the headcannon that freckles are also blood colored, or at least tinted that way

[@lucianchristinzio2630]

During the diet part of the video towards the end, I noticed something else. Faygo does indeed have a soporific effect on trolls as seen in friendsim when chixie gets drunk off of it. However, it's possible that they manufacture faygo differently, as during Chahut's route in friendsim, MSPAR drinks from a communal chalice and gets somewhat tipsy off of it.

[@karstb8830]

Consoom the sopor chalice

[@whentheskittlesfightback]

trolls r kitty. i also think they would have thicker skin cause if not they would b able to tekl karkats blood

[@mr.selfdestruction]

WHY ISNT THIS POPULAR????? THIS IS SO USEFUL AND WELL MADE

[@Luigicat11]

There's kind of a big hole in the whole "Ancestors are less genetically modified than descendants" thing. That being that all twenty-four of the main Homestuck trolls, Ancestors included (reminder that the Dolorosa and Porrim Maryam are alternate-timeline versions of the same person) were all born in the same place, at the same time, within the same set of two generations. They would have to be around as similar to each other as the eight humans.

[@boobaboo6197]

Trolls need to have hearts though, because Heart is an aspect that they understand, also moirallegiance is represented by a heart

[@OfficialKarkatVantas]

That's matespritship, moirailegiance is represented by the diamond ()

[@Faunadoodlez]

@@OfficialKarkatVantasdoes that mean they have hearts and also diamonds and also spades and clubs in their body Konspeerassy theoree

[@solarium_]

im reading though main homestuck for the first time and theres actually a canon reason for signless' symbol being ♋️ in the (first afaik) doc scratch interruption its mentioned that it was adapted as a symbol of the signless because that was the shape his red hot irons took while he was bejng executed. It is portrayed as grey bevause after his corpse was burned the metal cooled down "as if his very anger was calming" (roughly paraphrased from memory, it is noted a bit earlier that in his sacrifice his compassion for the trolls turns into a raging fury that cannot be quelled) as such any trolls that followed his teachings used ♋️ as a way to carry on the sufferers legacy, and signify that they were his followers

[@josiebianchi3481]

In regards to redbloods, Doc Scratch mentions in passing that the Signless' recollection of his past life may have been due to his mutant blood.

[@Maxwell-yk8hz]

I will say for the fuchsia living for hundreds of thousands of years, the condesce is also thief of life, and it is speculated that might have something to do with her long life as well.

[@InkSans_FandomSoda]

Ok but Hussie literally said that if Karkat and the other Vantas’s hadn’t mutated, they would have been Limebloods.

[@FunkMcLovin]

Where?

[@InkSans_FandomSoda]

@@FunkMcLovin Well I’ve been told that he has by several other people. I’ll try and find a source on that and get back to you if I find one-

[@InkSans_FandomSoda]

@@FunkMcLovin Hold up, bingo, I’ve got some decent proof. The extended zodiac. All of the cancer signs are listed as lime however true cancer is red, implying this mutation I will be back if I get more solid evidence.

[@tart9692]

HELL YES

[@Penultimeat]

I disagree with the dismissal of Bees as an option when categorizing them as bugs. You seem to have forgotten that their homes are called hives and at no point talk about their beds; recupricoons filled with sopor slime.

[@RosettaAceAlmaak]

My headcanon is that underwater adaptation exists more on a spectrum rather than BOOM you have a certain blood color and then you're aquatic. Instead, more traits appear progressively across the hemospectrum.

[@le012]

I’d just like to mention trolls DO have improved night vision *somewhat*. They don’t need it, but it is there. You can tell because in Hiveswap, when Joey and Xefros take a selfie together, Joey has redeye while Xefros has this iridescent green/white film in his pupils which looks incredibly similar to cats eyes and the tapetum lucidum that reflects light and gives creatures their ability to see in the dark. I’d imagine it is necessary, as trolls are nocturnal(I think Alternia is as dark as earth at night, they just can’t illustrate that well due to light pollution and it being a cartoon lol) and cave/sea dwellers. But as technology was invented and light pollution happened they didn’t have a use for them. But of course, still have them.

[@Caroscribbles]

I'm at 8:30 rn so you might mention this at some point, but I find it wholly plausible that the hemospectrum is indeed a spectrum and the discreet blood colors are socially constructed, similarly to race or gender

[@walpurgis943]

In mammals, Keratin is the primary structural constituent of skin, hair, and fingernails. Chitin is a kind of organic polymer that is analogous to keratin, it's essentially pure evolutionary coincidence that mammals use keratin rather than chitin. also, all human bodily fluids are, to a certain extent, filtered blood. Yes, even breast milk (in fact, breast milk contains a large number of leukocytes). Yes, even *ahem* "genetic material". Its likely that trolls are the same. The sole difference being that in trolls, the hemopigments would not be filtered out to the same degree that hemoglobin is in mammals. Its purely an effect of evolution metaphorically being extremely essentially lazy. Why invent a new system of fluid generation when you can just run the existing fluids through some specialized organs? Lastly, I think it would be useful to do some reading on epigenetics and on the role that developmental hormone exposure can have on physical development in humans. For instance, the "magic chemicals" you posit the mother grub excreting to alter the hemotype of each troll may well be just troll hormones. ....this leads to some troubling thoughts about black market hemotype-altering hormones extracted from juvenile mother grubs....

[@cassidyarnold505]

axolotl are the closest thing to a species where some are aquatic, and some are terrestrial. normally Axolotl's are amphibious but through outside influence they can metamorphosize into a terrestrial salamander. aquatic could be a trolls "defult"

[@chromerotica]

me personally i think that all trolls are intersex and their "nook" is similar to a *cough* female reproductive part *cough* and their bulge is similar to a *sputters and coughs* male reproductive part *coughs harder*. now, i do not think that the mother grub (like you mentioned) was very needed in their society post the condescension. me and my friend have the hc that they could lay eggs themselves using their nook and perhaps they had eggs like the mother grub. although this does raise the question: would their genetic differences from their ancestors like the dolorosa have to do with inbreeding? i imagine that its not the same as human inbreeding or even our animal inbreeding, since only one half is missing. and that does make me wonder if they require three sets of genes (two from the partners, one from the mother grub, her egg) or if the egg is simply a carrier for the two sets of genes to work it out like human ones do, equal pairs of genes taken from each side. honestly i have no effing clue this video was wonderful! i enjoyed watching it in full :)

[@itzbeelzebuddy]

i love seeing this post making my troll ocs, since its easy to interpret your own canon I might make a new line more closer to cannon

[@C4NNIB4L.C0RPSE]

me learning homestuck lore at 1am

[@C4NNIB4L.C0RPSE]

im getting no eep totight

[@Einascherungspuppe]

I have the stupidest smile on my face

[@brokenocarina4997]

1:21:00 currently rereading hs, and it just so happens that recently i went through this pesterlog where Karkat mentioned "third autumn" in relation to when he'd like Terezi to visit him (or uh, vice versa? dont remember. doesnt matter much either). so yeah, maybe there are only just a few small seasonal changes to the temperature on Alternia, if that implies that there are only a few (four, i'd assume) autumns there. that ofc begs the question of why hussie didnt bother to give each of those autumn seasons their respective names, but you know. its not the first time when he uses the trolls' dialogue in act 5 to only communicate some Alternian concepts to the reader. (and/or where he straight up just hadn't fully fleshed out the concept for himself yet. there was this one time where sollux sounded partially unaware of the hemospectrum system, something like "eh what other castes are there that are lower than mine idk" 💀) his worldbuilding is sometimes a bit... raw in that regard

[@liamfidller4319]

53:27 Blood is ~50% water. If they needed to conserve it they would just not cry with tears as opposed to crying with blood. 1:13:50 Aradiabots still have telekinesis despite having indigo blood. The only place it could come from is the soul since that's the only part of Aradia that are in them.

[@lunar_proxy]

the blood *we* know of is ~50% water. troll blood could be different, i mean, they're already in different whacky colors, so why not?

[@drunkbird8149]

The issue is we don't actually see normal beforan trolls. Due to what scratch says about the trolls, karkats group is the parents, while kankri's is the child group. Since kankri's is also the child group, that means their hair growth rate & pattern are derivative of their parents.

[@stinky1895]

Why do I care enough about this to watch a video essay on it? What the fuck is wrong with me?

[@Circadianarrhythmia]

The music is a bit loud, it's hard to focus on your speaking through it often. That might just be an adhd thing though! (/lh) but this was super neat! I love thinking about troll anatomy (/nsx) and other miniscule things about their culture! If i were ever to make an mspfa I'd definitely have like full planet system simulations and names for all their surrounding stars and a long, written history of their culture that would just be for me without really needing to exist. I love all the little things that make trolls and all their stuff neat!

[@zackinabox7906]

Sorry but this is strongly bothering me as I am currently playing pesterquest, THE TROLL BODY HEAT DIFFERENCE IS CANON. In Karkat's route, there's a whole portion about him hiding to hide his body heat from passing drones.

[@ieatcats5984]

learning troll biology instead of school biology

[@StinkySam440]

learning troll biology instead of sleeping (it is 12:40 am i am going insane)

[@gabenfanboy7471]

i wonder how the casts a re distributed. Knowing how adolescent lowbloods get treatet and highbloods probably being more likely to survive the trials, its likely that even less than 5 % of the eggs actually hatch an oliveblood or anything higher.

[@Samookely]

finally i found someone to translate homestucks lore to me (i fully read the entire comic and have been fixated on it for years)

[@Luigicat11]

To further the discussion of troll sexes, the troll sex determining system, going off of what you've gone over, is Z0, in contrast to the X0 sex determining system of all the real world eusocial insects we know of. For those who don't know what the hell I'm talking about: XY sex determining system: Biological females are homozygous (denoted as XX), while biological males are heterozygous (denoted as XY). This is seen in mammals, like us humans. ZW sex determining system: Biological males are homozygous (denoted as ZZ) and biological females are heterozygous (denoted as ZW), with the different notation being used to distinguish from the X and Y chromosomes that work slightly differently but serve the same purpose. This is most commonly seen in birds. X0 sex determining system: Biological females are diploid (XX, born of fertilized eggs) while biological males are haploid (X0, born of unfertilized eggs). Seen in ants and bees, as previously stated. I'm sure you know where I'm going from here, but for completeness' sake... Z0 sex determining system: Biological males are diploid (ZZ, born of fertilized eggs) and biological females are haploid (Z0, born of unfertilized eggs). Seen IRL in some species of moth. Trolls seem to use this (albeit they might use more than one sperm to fertilize each egg?), as otherwise a virgin mother grub would be unable to produce a matriorb, i.e. an egg containing another mother grub.

[@Vitaire]

Why do people keep saying trolls don't have noses? They're very clearly visible during their high-detail shot in [S] Cascade...

[@itsahexagon]

Under the "The Condesce genetically engineered trolls to fit her whims" theory, I think the fact that different hemocastes have different natural lifespans could be explained as an artifact of this modification as well - in particular, since the Condesce is an alternate timeline version of Meenah Peixes, this makes her implicitly a Thief of Life. There are other significant examples of "scratched" characters who don't play sburb/sgrub still reflecting meanings of their counterparts' classpect titles, and thus I think it would make thematic sense for the Condesce to have literally stolen the lifetimes of her species' lower castes in order to become exceptionally long lived. (I'm unsure if the lifespan differences are established to exist on Beforus, but given Beforan society's lean towards subtle oppression, biomedical control, and removing people's autonomy "for their own good" it almost makes sense that something similar could've happened there as well)

[@diggyrobinson5859]

xefros implies that horns are in some way correlated to what they're like down there, which is supported by the noticeable concept that big horns are attractive

[@terryh.9238]

"this is also called the prager U maneuver" god that's good

[@blackberrynina999]

headcanon:Trolls are homanoid beetlebugs

[@discipleoftzeentch8384]

Human blood is colored by hemoglobin, which is responsible for our ability to circulate oxygen and co2 as well, I expect troll blood to have an entirely different compound, likely one that is transparent or exceptionally pale (alternatively, it is red, making the vantas’ lack what ill talk about next): blood color is determined by an irrelevant molecule, likely a single molecule, not pigmentary cells, this is fine enough to pass through the mucous membrane filters that filter blood out of -ahem- bodily fluids like saliva, a molecule can pass out of the blood stream and through cells, although due to concentration gradients, the amount of pigment in “fluids” is reduced thus tears and saliva is a washed out color, although I think karkat cries like once? So if he cried pink then that blows my idea about the nature of the candy red mutation out of the water Sequential HC that karkat’s fluids are grey like his sign and only his blood is red. 99% sure im wrong, but it’s a neat thought

[@discipleoftzeentch8384]

Pigments could possibly be additionally functional as hornones for caste traits

[@discipleoftzeentch8384]

This explains how )-(IC is able to eventually acquire all forms of mental powers

[@starboi7719]

karkat cries like twice(im pretty sure its when sollux falls down the stairs and when he re alives kanaya) , and both times his tears are a transparent red so you got that right!