FURY/PROT SUCKS

[@true_plays_games]

4:01 is the exact moment my brain shut off and your bias became clear as day. 7:57 is spot on though bravo good point.

[@tobe4funas]

uhm, 4:01 is me telling what this video is about?

[@true_plays_games]

tobe4funas the second time stamp is all anyone needs to hear

[@tobe4funas]

@@true_plays_games well, i'm open for a discussion if you disagree with any of the statements, math i ran :)

[@jasonu3741]

@@tobe4funas Pull up your logs in AQ.... well whaddya see your Fury Prot Dual Wield tanking the bosses. guess it took a while for you to come to your senses,, not surprised if your as slow as you sound.

[@tobe4funas]

@@jasonu3741 context mate, context! :D I'm currently in aQ40 gear and raiding mostly with my guild instead of hosting pugs, threat is on another level, healers are on another level, kill times are on another level

[@АндрейГалкин-б5ф]

tfw doing >1000 tps in ANY gear with a shield as a Protection Paladin (no 2 crits or crit + crush in a row)

[@tsunamishijo2612]

I pull off a fury/prot as deep prot on patch every week.

[@tobe4funas]

wtf is pulling off a fury/prot? oO

[@KevinArcade87]

@@tobe4funas propably he means he is deep prot but dual wielding

[@tobe4funas]

@@KevinArcade87 i wonder how that works

[@ihavenoidea4727]

If someone is having threath issues its usually bc dps are fully geared like all good guilds, and are going 100% like they should be. NOTE I UNDERSTAND YOU KNOW THIS. STILL, Why make an encounter last longer and be more complicated when u can just ki any boss in 30 sec and not give a fuck about mitigation. The e counter is 30 sec so no one is gonna go oom spam healing u. I dont understand why make things more difficult when they can literally just be "zerg the boss as fast as you can and lets all go home" When it comes to pugs and progression thats a different story, that said I dont think Ive ever died on a pug to pure boss dmg in tps gear so why would I be miti Im saying all this bc youre making this much more complicated than it needs to be. U dont want me to zerg in the comments but the key to easy classic raids is to literally zerg and ignore most phases and mechanics, even in pugs w geared ppl. I also feel fury prot is just easier and more fun too. Deep prot threat feels too try hard after being fury.

[@tobe4funas]

Dunno, your argument is fairly subjective. On the one hand yes, it's easier to play when all bosses die in 30 sec, on the other hand a single overthreat might very well wipe half the raid so with that you can argue that taking it chill & slow is actually easier. At the end of the day, easy and hard are both subjective definitions, so it's hard to get a consensus here :/ And perhaps you're right, I might be overcomplicating things. The whole reason i made this video was getting annoyed by 'fury/prot is bis brrrrrrrrrr' and 'you need more threat because.... threat duh' mentality. I've seen many instances of fury/prots one shot because of their gear choices even though they're like 3rd tank and have a job of tanking some trash mobs leaving them good 20 seconds to build threat on. I'm not claiming all are like that, but certain individuals exist :) thus this video.

[@ihavenoidea4727]

@@tobe4funas sure. fair enough.

[@laeeg7412]

This is a nice analysis and you have valid points. However, I need to point out that you mitigated 20% more than your fury/prot buddy because he was not wearing a shield/using shield block. If he puts on a shield the difference is less than 5%, and most fury/prot tanks do put on a shield when they need the mitigation. Deep prot is good for fresh 60's and on progression, but when you're in farming stage, and your dps is off-the-wall crazy, fury/prot is much better. Not to mention you have the flexibility to do more damage in dungeons/pvp/questing/etc.

[@tobe4funas]

Yes, exactly that is my point! You do not need the threat for the sake of having more threat, the threat in itself isn't something glorious. Only if you cannot hold the threat anymore, only then do you need to start thinking about fury/prot as a MT.

[@Folsomdsf2]

@@tobe4funas Bingo If my DPS weren't pushing over 2k dps I wouldn't be fury prot.

[@henriklassen3435]

The mitigation is the same with a sheild on.

[@tobe4funas]

@@henriklassen3435 you can run a sim if you don't believe me - it's not although marginal difference

[@henriklassen3435]

Okay I have been thinking about it again. I dont know what spec you have been doing test on. But as a deep prot I had points in parry. I do not have that as a fury prot. So I dont know if that is what make the 5% difference. But anyway. Your video has had me thinking about trying deep prot again =)

[@Cybertriter]

Well my raid is like 20 hits on target even before the tank hit the mob once or if you go pug raids..

[@tobe4funas]

well, if the dps pull the boss instead of the tank, then it's really not the spec that makes it or breaks it :D

[@Preacher_.]

0:10 RABBLE RABBLE ZUGZUG RABBLE RABBLE!!!

[@tobe4funas]

:D

[@ar15_madman5]

Here a point needs to be made. Fury/Prot tanks that are running with speed running guilds, have to pump out that much threat. However, you are implying that many fury/prot tanks don't build up giant threat leads, then swap to a shield. For most fights, pop Death Wish and duel wield for the first 20 sec and then swap to a shield. That is how you can tell a difference between a "parsing" tank vs a good tank. Once threat thresholds are reached, a shield should be worn. Fury/prot is very strong, which is why deep prot isn't really good. You are assuming that wearing a shield vs dual wielding is all or nothing. Situational awareness is important. Also, Alliance has more of a leash for Deep Prot as well. Windfury is a helluv a drug, but threat is a bigger issue on the Horde side. Deep prot is definitely easier to tank dungeons and 20 mans.

[@tobe4funas]

yup, this is the next level where you realise than even as a fury/prot, you're not about dpsing, so i aint even taking it that far :D but obv., good points of yours for sure

[@mike20988]

Deep prot is great. If you can convince 26 DPS gamers to not click their buttons.

[@tobe4funas]

math isnt religion mate

[@jasonu3741]

Deep Prot is like paying your bills by mail, when the rest of the world uses online banking. The bill still gets paid, it likely only cost you an extra 2-3 minutes of your day. However it just feels wrong to do something so ineffecient.

[@novo6462]

Tank 1 approves!

[@Bingcrens]

Honestly most guilds that have have threat issues might get more out of a feral than fury prot. Yes fury prot can generate slightly more threat, burst threat specifically , but bears don't have to give up much mit to generate great threat, if they are good. But most of the time our deep prot MT doesn't have threat issues and most of what I do as a bear is stay second on threat incase he dies, which is the big advantage of both fury/prot and feral.

[@tobe4funas]

yup, staying 2nd/3rd on threat is a huge + for fprots or bears :) kinda sucks how bears simply cant tank some fights due to mechanics (fear, chrom bronze debuff etc.) :/

[@Bingcrens]

@@tobe4funas I've tanked the bosses that fear without too many issues, including nef when the MT died, even sometimes without fear ward. I probably wouldn't MT Cromagus but of all the current fights that's really it.

[@tobe4funas]

@@Bingcrens i mean, yea it's possible.... but you can't claim that not having a mechanic to avoid fear (granted no fear ward available) is comparable to having such mechanic? Fear into the raid with aggro on you + shadow flame on top -> RIP most of the raid. On chromaggus you can't remove stun, on Nefarion you'll get consistently 1shot during druid call. In my book, that's enough to qualify bear as not eligible to tank at all certain fights.

[@Bingcrens]

@@tobe4funas Never been 1 shot during the druid call on nef as the big hitting ability he has is shadow flame and the druid class call doesn't affect magic damage taken and shadowflame doesn't even 1 shot warriors on neff during their call so getting 1 shot isn't the issue. You do need good healers, but for neff I think that's somewhat of a given. And warriors having a fear break is certainly an advantage, but in my experience druids can manage all the bosses that fear. I've tanked phase 3 ony, as an example, many times without fear ward and while is can get a bit hairy it's nothing a half decent raid can't deal with. There is a way with a macro to tank chromag as a druid, but I'll let the warriors take that one and not risk it.

[@tobe4funas]

@@Bingcrens ech, that's the issue of arguments based on "I've never been/seen X". I can show you some logs of me getting 100 to 0 in ~1 sec in BWL-level mitigation gear as a fury/prot and deep prot. Yeah if you have ZG, DMT buffs, or like a flask then for sure, it's probably impossible to get 1 shot on either of the classes but are we really counting on it when discussing this? Kinda same goes for Onyxia. Your argument is 'if your raid is half decent'. Well, what if folks come on their alts, mana is depleted fast, everyone is at half health and you get feared during shadow flame/cleave? Yes, many things are doable in classic, you can have Rets outdamaging rogues, however when discussing in general - should we really rely on such examples? The biggest challenge of classic is working in non perfect circumstances. The human error gets escalated to 40 different individuals - that's a lot of potential for fuckups and adding variance on top of it when it needs not to be added (kinda rephrasing the whole point of this video) - what's the point in it?

[@yakkamotogaming2656]

Our fastest val kill was 36 sec, we are not a midmaxing speedrunning guild. I had 2,3k dps and the tank had 1,75k dps. Are we supost to stand AFK for 20 sec to let u get thrett ? If we manage to kill the boss 15-20 sec faster becous of higher dps you could count that as less damage taken xD i dont se what ur point is. Healer is fine dps are suuper happy so whats the problem ?

[@tobe4funas]

I mean mate, you're missing the whole point of this video... If you actually need threat - by all means, go for it. If healers are fine - by all means, go fury/prot. All I'm saying is if your highest dps is 1k and you claim you want the tank to do more threat - then that's bs, because deep prot can hold that much threat, so might as well take the free mitigation instead of the unneeded threat. Also, anyone who does 1.7k dps (let alone a tank) is a 90ish+ parser, that's top population's top 10% performer. That's statistically the opposite of your average player, which often is considered a 'casual'. Lastly, the old age discussion is the encounter easier because it's faster or is it easier because there's less room for error? Both are right and wrong. Faster kill means less room for error, however it comes at the cost of potential overthreat. Slower kill means more room for error however it rooms the error of overthreat. Pick your poison really..

[@yakkamotogaming2656]

tobe4funas im just saying, even if you are not trying to pars ppl are more happy if they get an higher pars becous then they feel that they did a better job. Even if we are talking about a 50-70 pars. You as a tank are the one draging all the others down and making 39 other ppl think less of themself becous YOU feel you dont need to do your best. Thats selfish. Just take any other game Counterstrike, its possible to win without buying wepons or grenades, but you are a troll and noone wants to play with you if you dont. But in world of warcraft good tanks are hard to find so ppl have to put up with you. Dont be that toxic person just becous you feel you dont want others to have fun. I get that furry prot was not the intention of the game, but you as a tank have a responsability, dont let your guild dps down :)

[@tobe4funas]

@@yakkamotogaming2656 i mean mate, you're missing every single point i make :/ if you're slowing down the dps and in no fear of dying - by all means, go fury/prot, it's the better spec. I've never anywhere said otherwise. My point is, often you don't need more threat than a deep prot can produce. So if you don't need the extra threat, you literally have 0 point going fury/prot.

[@true_plays_games]

Your tank had 1.75K Dps? Link that because there is no chance

[@true_plays_games]

@@tobe4funas This is just not true- Fprot has way more burst threat, and you can still macro all kinds of shield swap. Fprot is the better raiding spec for anything tanking bosses hands down- arguing this is pointless.

[@aeopimp92]

as a top 100 warrior in the world.. fury prot is SOOO MUCH BETTER THAN DEEP PROT.. YOU ARE JUST WRONG.... i wish deep prot was better because i like it more.. but its just no where near as good..

[@tobe4funas]

Ech mate, context, it's always about context...

[@aeopimp92]

@O K i am listed idiot.

[@aeopimp92]

daboodie

[@AmateurSuperFan]

"fury/prot yabadaba fucking do" tobe 2020

[@tobe4funas]

im proud of it

[@Folsomdsf2]

You missed something giant.. fury prot is the most painful spec to play in zg/ubrs/5 mans as well if you're a raid tank. Not being able to swap tances, charge around, it's just SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO BIOOOOOOORING

[@tobe4funas]

heh, it's kinda the opposite for me tbh, when you're usually with undergeared folks in those dungeons/mini-raids, you're actually topping the dps :D i find it far more inconvenient playing fury prot with a shield on in bwl...

[@thatguyzodiac543]

I still love u tobe

[@tobe4funas]

awwwwwwwww, at least somebody! :D

[@jimbelladonna1480]

Good shit sense I was a deep prot for a long time and honestly with the right consumables I don’t see a difference but again gear does play one hell of a good thing sense until I got my full t2 I was deep prot. Love the video.

[@tobe4funas]

cheers, glad ya enjoyed it :)

[@BarrickMacready]

Play the way you wana play. Not how others WANT you to play.

[@tobe4funas]

generally i would agree with it but raiding is a team game, so if you wanting to play it in a certain way causes inconveniences to others (i.e. they have to spend too much gold because of you, the tank, either not holding threat or dying too easy) - i can no longer go with such statement

[@BarrickMacready]

@@tobe4funas tanks job is to not die ans hold aggro. So long as im doing that , should be fine. I understand your point on the matter.

[@tobe4funas]

@@BarrickMacready ah then yea :)

[@Half_Finis]

4:25 about time

[@emileklund1200]

I guess deep prot works in casual but it will be switched out for a fury prot in semi an hardcore guild asap... im sorry

[@tobe4funas]

yea, for sure, never argued otherwise :)

[@jasonu3741]

This video makes no sense as those people who dont raid with World buffs or consumes ARE NOT LOOKING UP VIDEOS ON FURY PROT ON KZbin. The very nature of this video is a misnomer for the Audience it will receive. Like having a Tampon add in the middle of a video about Men's Shaving cream

[@tobe4funas]

@@jasonu3741 that might be a good point, fuck knows. At the same time, you could argue that if i state in the video that if your vael kill time is 30 second, this video isnt for you, the folks who kill vael in 30 seconds would actually ditch this video

[@kungfujoe2136]

are you hitcaped?

[@tobe4funas]

yeeeep, with every single item set

[@jonathanbrand3379]

I'm just here to Zug Zug in the comments.

[@tobe4funas]

:(

[@jonathanbrand3379]

@@tobe4funas Zug Zug

[@exisTxD]

Nice sleeping pill in a digital format tobe

[@tobe4funas]

i was going for tired...

[@polikouts8763]

Alt account of panini so i can dislike

[@therealbigshooter]

Also your conclusions are bad.

[@tobe4funas]

can you elaborate?