G. Mahler: Symphonie Nr. 8 by Münchner Philharmoniker & V. Gergiev

[@mabel722]

i was one of that singer. born in augsburg. i was sopran. i miss it so much i come everyday to this video.

[@ediccartman7252]

Are you soloist or chorist ?

[@mabel722]

@@ediccartman7252 i was soloist. but here i was just in the choir :D

[@ediccartman7252]

@@mabel722 so how did you feel singing under Gergiev's conducting ?

[@mabel722]

@@ediccartman7252 great.

[@gregemerson7648]

You all sounded outstanding, Mahler would have been proud! What a moment for all of you that must have been!

[@maxrudolfvonsydow164]

the camera director forgot that in Mahler the whole of the orchestra as a whole is what matters. Many closups at times when the orchestra shows all its energy. A Mahler symphony is not a chamber piece: it is a work for a symphony orchestra.

[@docnonsens1512]

Mahler ad its Best!!!! Von der Besetzung der Solisten ,den Chören und der herausragenden Interpretation von Mahlers 8 durch Herrn Gergiev selten so schön gehört, er hat ihn verstanden den Mahler der für mich zur Zeit einer der Besten seiner Zunft ist!

[@qqrus1018]

It's a performance that doesn't know what it wants to express.

[@annemarieclaudia]

49:00 reaching heaven

[@slubert]

There is one thing about this piece: Its so massive (a huge ensemble) that the conductor has to be very clear and direct, to put his ego to the side and beat the time in a very 'school book' fashion. You wouldnt want your air traffic controlled by someone who cant give instructions straight forward..

[@ediccartman7252]

Direct instructions alone are not enough to get the idea of this rock. And look at Bernstein - I don't know any other conductor who was more INdirect in 8th than him. And still he had it completely. What I agree with is that you can't conduct so massive ensemble with the toothpick, if you don't wanna singers to lose you ( like in 1:00:19 and many more places).

[@slubert]

@@ediccartman7252 Bernstein not direct? I mean, he beats ahead of the music if that's what you mean but his conducting style wasnt much different during the 8th, very clear and solid left hand.

[@ediccartman7252]

@@slubert So does Gergiev - his style looks weird, EXACTLY because he always beats ahead of music ( often with eyes or lips only). I'm not sure, I really get what you mean with "very clear and solid left hand ". Even though I'm not a conductor I'm pretty sure, you beat with the right hand, whereas the left is responsible for dynamics and phrasing.

[@slubert]

@@ediccartman7252 What i meant with the left hand was exactly what you mentioned. Gergiev beats ahead by a beat most of the time. Some other conductors seem to be leading the phrase almost by two beats and that can be difficult to follow if you are unfamiliar with ones conducting style.

[@ediccartman7252]

@@slubert that's true, they were completely unfamiliar , cz Gergiev isn't a big fan of rehearsals ( to say the least ). I guess for kids it was especially difficult. And of course he should've taken a baton - there's no choice when you have 3 choirs , an orchestra and 8 soloists.

[@JJJRRRJJJ]

Oompff. At 1:00:19, the boys choir fell behind a beat or so. Certainly a challenging piece for such young boys!

[@koeluk6831]

I knew I hear it because I am in this boys choir, but now in the bass

[@JJJRRRJJJ]

Kinggamer68 That’s so cool! Were you in this performance? It seems like they needed more rehearsal time. I think Gergiev was largely at fault for speeding up the orchestra way too much. It’s possible the choir couldn’t have kept up even if they were prepared! Nonetheless, still very cool experience to be a part of it!

[@koeluk6831]

@@JJJRRRJJJ you've said it's a challenging piece. Yes! You hear the orchestra but it is in front of you so you can't hear rhythm or so. We all knew it wasn't the best performance from us, but you came to Paris for free! Wow that was so nice and the other parts of the symphony were quite ok/good

[@phillipvietri8786]

Remember that these are GERMAN boys. It is ten times less challenging for them them for boys of any other nation, except for South African boys (KZbin the Drakensberg Boys' Choir). I speak as someone of Italian extraction, and therefore not German-biased!

[@southwestguy223]

I've heard this symphony over and over again. But I did not know there was a piano (52:09)

[@orenanpablo]

Mahler did not wrote for piano. I think it's to enforce celesta or harp sound...

[@peterwimsey1]

organ, celesta, piano and harmonium are all in the score

[@paulybarr]

@@orenanpablo It is in the score.

[@phillipvietri8786]

All these silly, bitchy comments. Gergiev is a superb and highly competent conductor. Perhaps there is just too much anti-Russian bias to allow an objective evaluation of him. he conducts with such clarity - I hear much of the score which is just not audible in too many performances. his tempi are excellent, and allow for this clarity. I think this is a highly faithful performance, never mind his conducting style, which is always idiosyncratic for any conductor. Vide Karajan, for example.

[@lilje372]

Bruh at one point you hear more harp pedals than actual harp

[@DonCYHaute]

He plays it too Stravinskian

[@DonCYHaute]

I notice a couple of times the strings fall a tiny bit behind him for a moment or two because they must be instinctively trying to make it more appropriately romantic

[@DonCYHaute]

Singers are among the better of the performances of this I've seen on KZbin though for my taste.

[@stevepillemann9373]

The very last chord was totally ruined by a poor trumpeter who missed the right tone...

[@georgeluft7881]

Wait, really?

[@lilje372]

Haha just heard it as well lmaooo

[@Ale-qf1pm]

God that's such an immense slap in the face, probably the biggest moment in musical history ruined by a wrong note that sticks out like a sore thumb

[@ianng9915]

I laughed out loud bruh...

[@docnonsens1512]

To S problem with your ears?

[@1968KWT]

Premiered exactly 111 years ago! 💐💐💐

[@alessandrosevera3859]

This composition had been used as example in the italian youtube cultural video "Lezioni di Musica - Survivorship Bias" of the channel "musicamonteverde". A really very very interesting video.

[@gonzalobarrogil4246]

Críticas muy minuciosas (deben tener mejor oído que yo). Impecable, maravillosa.

[@korbi217]

Das klingt alles ziemlich kraftlos. In jeglicher Hinsicht. Meine favorisierte Version ist der Mitschnitt von den BBC Proms 2002 mit Rattle und dem NYOGB. Da spürt man die Energie, jederzeit, ohne dass es außer Kontrolle gerät. Aber das hier klingt einfach lasch.

[@Unverbindlich]

I love this part 46:32

[@jansoukup7579]

Without power, without energy. I ask you why??? Veni, Creator, Spiritus... Sounds like lullaby.

[@koeluk6831]

I've sang there in Paris and we had given all what we had

[@ediccartman7252]

@@koeluk6831 which choir did you sing ? And how many rehearsals did you have with Gergiev ( if at all :)) ) ?

[@koeluk6831]

@@ediccartman7252 I was in the boys choir, and we startet one day before

[@janmaartenkoeman]

@@koeluk6831 yes, I conducted my boys in Rotterdam with Gergiev, we only had a short quick afternoon rehearsal....

[@orenanpablo]

During Chorus Mysthicus I've always heard so many sopranos singing against woodwinds. I think: haven't them never heard Mahler? Is It their First time singing the eight? Don't they perceive that they Sing the same melody played by flute??? Jesus!!!

[@ediccartman7252]

Why is it so soft ? ? Sound producer definitely cared more about neighbours, than Mahler

[@Dylonely_9274]

50:15

[@historiacriticaprof.carlos5261]

Wanderfull!!!!!!!!!!!!

[@marcfranke4254]

Oh my god! Look how he conducts 22:40, one hand in his face and "Cocktail shaking" with the other... This is no Mahler conducting, this is ridiculous.

[@whosaysitmatters]

Bizarre - did Gergiev forget his baton and just use the toothpick he had in his pocket?

[@LeonardAbbado3]

The version of Gergiev with the LSO is quite better

[@ediccartman7252]

Agree. But the singers here are just another league than in the record with LSO . The guys from Mariinsky don't speak German very well and don't really understand this music. BUT the point of that record is that they made it in church . It gives you that heaven-like feeling , you'll never get , playing in the hall . And a big organ , instead of harpoon like here...:)))

[@gregemerson7648]

@@ediccartman7252 Great observation totally agree! I have heard this live once, by the Toronto Symphony, it was outstanding....I was studying Clarinet and of course focused on Clarinet Legend Joaquin Valdepenas LOL:)

[@TC.....]

I don't like this version. And where the hell was the organ? Too soft to hear?

[@ediccartman7252]

If you don't have an accoustic organ ( like in church) , just think you don't have it at all. I'm pretty sure that's the reason Gergiev played it so modestly.

[@sukholee7826]

Gergiev should not really mess with Austro-German repertoire.

[@ediccartman7252]

He just should rehearse.

[@pavlelazarevic3270]

Yes. Great only for Shostakovich.

[@ediccartman7252]

@@pavlelazarevic3270 if you don't hear how much Shostakovich was influenced by Mahler , I'm really sorry for you.

[@馳川頌弥]

超お忙しいゲルギエフさん、本番でスコアの読み込みをなさってるようで……ずーっとスコアご覧になっていらっしゃいます。 演奏者の自主性に支えられた名演と言えるんでしょうねえ。

[@ediccartman7252]

You're right. Gergiev definitely didn't take a look at the score before the concert.

[@馳川頌弥]

That is for sure.

[@thomask1424]

Well, that final chord was unfortunate.

[@301250]

My Eight has got to be the Chailly with the Leipzig Gewandhaus, that once can be heard in its entirety on You Tube. Peerless performance from everyone! Compared to which, Gergiev’s here is quite pathetic & insipid and does not move me at all as any Mahler 8 ought to, being a work of almost cosmic dimension.

[@Richard-b5r9v]

Conducting with a toothpick?

[@galahadlancerot]

Yes, he often conducting with it ))

[@whosaysitmatters]

I am sure the assembled forces could have done a better job under a more competent conductor.

[@ediccartman7252]

You mean, under conductor who didn't perform "Boris Godunov" or "Khovanschina" one day before and then played this after a short single rehearsal. Cz if it wasn't the case, Gergiev's 8th would've been always a great event.

[@astridarraut9502]

This orchestra and Gergiev are about the best you can find in this field, however it doesn't sound that great, it has to be the sound producer and the recording.

[@docm27]

no, he's not the best in Mahler's field.

[@ediccartman7252]

@@docm27 after all sounds very clear and solid, don't you find ? I think Gergiev's approach to this piece is just different from what we used to.....

[@docm27]

@@ediccartman7252 Gergiev and Mahler? Like Salami with chocolate.

[@roobookaroo]

@@docm27 You're a case of a grouchy grudge against Gergiev. Hope it keeps you happy

[@docm27]

@@roobookaroo I'm very happy liking who I like and avoiding who I don't like. Compare him with Abbado! Bitter against sweet.

[@jacobbump1282]

I must say, his conducting is odd and seems difficult to follow. As a chorister I find it hard to interpret his movements but then again I'm not there...and I know every conductor is different. However, what on earth is he holding? A tiny baton...? Barely to be seen? Over all, great interpretation though a bit sloppy sounding areas in my ears at least.

[@richardwilliams473]

Why does he insist on conducting with a TOOTHPICK????

[@rolandgumpp4490]

too much of this world………………………………………...……………………….. mahler is beyond the grasp of gergiev . and goethe even more so . (listen to bernstein !!! )

[@orenanpablo]

Gergiev may not be a good conductor to Mahler, but Bernstein with VPO has too much gesture and jumps with a lot of distuning through the whole symphony. I think he asked so much from brasses that they could not hold their embochure till the end. I dislike Benrstein's renditions not only in Mahler. Yet, he was a lovely conductor, but... There are many better than him, to me.

[@ediccartman7252]

@@orenanpablo Gergiev is terrific in Mahler's 2nd,4th and 5th ( haven't heard, but looks like 6th must be his music too - this is a symphony , Shostakovich was very influenced by, and Gergiev is a beast in Shostakovich). And I guess, 8th wouldn't be an exception, if he dedicated a bit more time for rehearsals. You can't expect for more if you play it after single 1-hour rehearsal ( probably at the day of the concert).

[@marks1417]

Major Putin supporter

[@fmyoung]

This is the ultimate "sing"-phony!

[@ricarleite]

Mediocre, sloppy execution

[@cismoll_]

Very poor orchestra playing :(

[@ediccartman7252]

I think , it's just balanced different way than usual .The orchestra is deliberately put under soloists and choir , that lets you follow every nuance in their part. I personally like it this way - immaterial and gradually rising up to 1:09:40.

[@JJJRRRJJJ]

Vova Hrenov Can you timestamp an example? I wasn’t listening/watching very carefully. But I couldn’t miss the boys choir goof at 1:00:19.

[@ediccartman7252]

@@JJJRRRJJJ Well I have that feeling in nearly all over 1st movement. An example might be a place from 3:46 where in 3:52 soprano steps in, and then the rest of soloists. Do you know how it's difficult to keep here clear voice-leading and not to crush it with too much passion ? Specifically in this place they have it completely. The same is in 12:56. Of course you can hear it's under-rehearsed : the place you marked speaks for itself. I guess children just didn't expect this huge and pointless acceleration, Gergiev made.

[@jomicu1941able]

Guergeiev a VERY COLD CONDUCTOR! BORING!!! Look this sinphony with the Netherlnds Philarmonic orchester and Mark Albrecht.

[@johnvaughan7096]

Also Eschenbach

[@warjacare]

I cannot understand how European people listen to such disjointed music ... Have you ever heard of Bach, Vivaldi or Mozart... I think they are all "politically correct" persons who follow and agree with all shit media tell them. It's the same thing like Picasso's paintings: Worthless "art" for people, lacking opinion. Poor persons...

[@JJJRRRJJJ]

I agree with you emphatically about your point on the culture - “Here, listen to this insufferable dogshit. HOW WONDERFULLY PROFOUND!” 🙄 But I strongly disagree that it applies in this case. Mahler writes some of the most beautiful flowing melodies in this work and others. The second half of the symphony is especially wonderful. Sure, there are definitely moments of dissonance, but they’re always beautifully resolved with elegance and catharsis. When music abandoned elegance and grace full-stop, it just became noise. And the public understood this, rejecting the atonal and dissonant garbage being pumped out by the academy. It’s why nobody seeks out modern orchestral music. But Mahler does not fit in that category. (Also, don’t judge this work by this particular performance; it’s shockingly poor in execution. Many jarringly sloppy mistakes all across the board. 2/10, generously.)

[@johnvaughan7096]

Pathetic comment. If the composers you mention came on the radio, my eldest grandson used to say "here you are grandpa; some more diddle-de-dee".

[@luke9947]

Ok boomer