Game of Thrones/ASOIAF Theories | Even More Lies of the Andals | Maegor the Cruel

[@branphillips9546]

When Maegor was utterly without mercy, he unleashed not Balerion, but his mother upon his enemies. Gotta admit, I love that.

[@johnnymatias3027]

Visenya was always the most martially skilled and ruthless of the three siblings.

[@hypatiakovalevskayasklodow9195]

For real 😂 Love that!

[@petrmaly9087]

Just a lesson from History. Saint Wenceslas, patron of Czech lands (known to you as "good king Wenceslas from christmas carol) Reigned as Lord of Bohemia. He was on good terms with the Church, pious himself, he reigned in peace, but paid a lot of money to maintain it. He was killed on his way to church by group of unknown people, probably aristocrats, who feared the extreme power of the church and foreign influence. A new king was crowned - his brother Boleslaus the Cruel (and yes, his mother was a hardcore lady, commanding elite soldiers, who taught him her ways). He was a powerful ruler, who put both church and foreign rulers in their place. He even successfully fought Otto I of Holy Roman Empire for long time, later making peace with him and forging an alliance, which helped to crush powers to the east and expand Czech lands greatly. His successor is most known for reconciliation with the church powers and for being a good diplomat. I am not saying it must have been Martin's inspiration, but he certainly knows a lot from history, so it should be considered. And in Czech, there is word for someone, who is sometimes crazy, even violent, the word is "magor".

[@Ari33sa]

I love those connections! When Charlemagne conquered and forged his empire and the church missioniezed central europe there were quite a few things that also look very similar to how the seven overtook the old gods in Westeros. Of course there are all the normal things like baptising the smallfolk, or penalizing pagan rituals. But most striking is how they started to cut down trees that were worshipped by the saxons. Most famously there's the story of Bonifatius cutting down a great oak near Fritzlar.

[@petrmaly9087]

Cutting down trees and building churches on the same sites... Yes, that was official church strategy. By the way, Charlemagne also had an important wooden tree trunk destroyed - The Irminsul. Sacred tree trunk in sacred forrest. Probably originating from the same worship of sacred trees, as in Scandinavia, because in the Norse mythology, the centrepiece of cosmos is the tree Yggdrasill. Just reading about it and the kind of worship pagans performed makes it clear, where Martin took his inspiration from. PS: With the words... Do you remember the wildling, Orell? In Czech (and in several other languages), "orel" means "eagle". Yes, Martin knows his source materials and gets more inspiration from reality, that we can imagine. Just as Tolkien did. In his books, Tolkien used two examples coming from Czech lands. First is Radagast (Czech pagan god), second is almost the journey of Faramir, which is a direct copy of the journey of King Wenceslaus I (not the lord, but the crowned king, few centuries later) in his quest against Mongols, invading Europe. It is perfect to the detail, except that it wasn't his brother, who was killed, but his brother in law. Martin is as good researcher, as Tolkien was.

[@Ari33sa]

Yeah I've read about Irminsul too. Oh wow, there are quite a few connections to the czech language. I'm completely incapable of finding connections such as these. The only obvious connection with the german language, I know, and that is absolutely easy to find, but also leads to quite the ridiculous theory 'for fun's and giggles' in the german fan-community, is that stark is german for strong. Leading to the ridiculous theory that Robert Strong is actually not Gregor Clegan but robb Starks body with a wolf head XD

[@britainlott1602]

Dude you and me need to have a beer

[@lordofbamfs-3941]

In short Maegor is the foil to Tywin. Strategically cruel to end wars and conflicts that threaten their House and right to supremacy. Except Maegor's actions enabled and let his House flourish in the long run while Tywin's actions doomed and sullied his House in the long run.

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

he was what he needed to be

[@malmorbidus2788]

Yesss I so got this vibe anytime I really read about Maegor's history.

[@praetorxyn]

@agnat86 I kind of agree here. The fault mainly lies with Cersei (and somewhat Jamie for enabling her). But Tywin still bears responsibility for: 1. Not knowing Jamie and Cersei are fucking each other despite being one of the smartest men in the world 2. Treating Tyrion like garbage for his entire life even though he's the only child who inherited Tywin's intellect 3. The rape of Elia Martell and brutal murder of her children. Yes, you could argue the children needed to die, but in that case you'd smother them with a pillow or something. Killing Elia accomplishes nothing but the fury of Dorne. Tywin said something like he didn't know he needed to tell Clegane to not kill Elia, but that's just stupid. Sending the two cruelest men in his employ to do something like that is like trying to do surgery with a sledgehammer.

[@HolyknightVader999]

@@praetorxyn You forgot one more: Funding King Robert Baratheon and fighting a protracted war against the North. That was the doom of House Lannister. Tywin funding Robert robbed House Lannister of 3 million gold dragons and gained them nothing but a throne surrounded by enemies on all sides. While the Baratheon problem took care of itself with some help from Tyrion and the Tyrells, the war with the North consumed more Lannister gold and men since Tywin couldn't defeat Robb Stark in the field. That nonsense ensured that when he died, House Lannister would be in deep disrepair while other houses like the Tyrells were "Growing Strong" due to their increasing influence in the capital and their immense wealth, which unlike House Lannister's, wasn't wasted on kings and wars that gained them nothing but titles and troubles in the long run. Also, killing Elia and her children were unnecessary. Sacking the capital wasn't even needed when Tywin could have gotten in with the Mad King's permission then had Jaime kill him in his sleep or poison him. Tywin could then have put Rhaegar's daughter on the throne and married the brat to Jaime, or he could have ruled as a regent for Rhaegar's infant son and married Cersei to him once he grew older, allowing House Lannister to smoothly take over the realm without the need for making alliances with the Baratheons. With a Targaryen and a Lannister on the throne, Tywin can rally the royalists like the Dornish and the Tyrells to his side, and with his large army intact and fresh during Robert's Rebellion, the rebels will have no choice but to bow to the Dornish/Lannister monarchs or die fighting an impossible war against both House Lannister AND House Tyrell. In short, Tywin could have gained EVERYTHING had he not sacked the capital and killed Rhaegar's kids, especially since kids are easier to influence and mold-a Targaryen child-king or queen being mentored by Tywin would have grown to be a powerful ally for House Lannister and would have wasted less money than King Robert did.

[@praetorxyn]

HolyknightVader999 I kind of agree. I don't think we've got any evidence that the Lannisters are low on gold; I know some people think the mines are dry but I think that's only been proven in the show. Yes, funding Robert was stupid, but I don't think the loss of 3 million gold really hurt them. I know Cersei was having Iron Bank trouble, but I thought she didn't want to dip into Lannister coffers to address it, not that the Lannister coffers were empty. Even after the war with the north, I think the Westerlands still had more men than anyone besides the Reach (and they had less than the Reach before the war). Overall I would restate your point as "Being competent and not ensuring that he had anyone competent to follow him." As soon as Tywin was dead they were destined to collapse no matter how much money they had. Tyrion had the mind for it, but Cersei would never let him run the family.

[@Whosaskin]

I always stated that Mageor was not a terrible king, he was a necessary evil as much as Aegon the Conqueror was.

[@LoneWolf-xe6ye]

Viserion Targaryen yeah but the andals choose what the rest of westeros hears

[@Whosaskin]

Esteban Ladtra true enough

[@matthiuskoenig3378]

Aegon wasn't evil though, he conquered and unified but wasn't bad

[@Whosaskin]

Matthew Burger the thing was, that Maegor wasn't entireley either...

[@aurelian2668]

@@Whosaskin I mean the part where he took on tyanna was bad.

[@gabrielpelletier6202]

"Visenya went to get her son Maegor, because he needed some new friends, and the Faith Militant seemed like his kind of guys." I'm dying.

[@KingofWannada]

Maegor may not be the friendliest king in history, but without him all his father's life's work would have crumbled and the seven kingdoms would have started to fight each other again! PS: great work your videos always make me happy!

[@hatmoza1]

You guys are like a companion show to the ASOIAF book series. You honestly make my book reading experience much better. I don’t think I’ll have to reread the books as much thanks to you because of how expertly you break down much of the complex plots. Plus I would never have noticed the enormous amount of material densely packed ‘in-between the lines’ . You guys have my genuine gratitude for filling in my comprehension gap.

[@tehn3085]

This is known

[@justinbowers2749]

That’s what I’ve been saying

[@asharadaynedragonblood1803]

What comes to my mind is: if the Citadel actually worked against Targaryens all the time, controlling all other houses also, it is most possible that it was the Citadel who caused the tragedy of Summerhall. I think dragons were hatched there because Aegon was so certain it would work that he invited the whole Targaryen family. They wanted dragons to regain power over the other houses again. With this new perspective we can say that the Citadel could absolutely not accept this or let this happen.

[@HelenWA]

egg was an idiot for letting the maesters know what he was planning ahead of time

[@mistersharpe4375]

This series has been fucking rad. All this time I've just sort of ignored the Faith and the Maesters as just some added world-building fluff that's not so important to the main story. Damn Grey Rats had me fooled, now I know better.

[@tavonwal1]

justice for Maegor !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! justice for the dead dragons!!!!!!!!!!! whos taking the call?

[@beyond12021]

Justice!

[@Ignisan_66]

Dicks out for Maegor!

[@HolyknightVader999]

I AM!

[@yaboyed5779]

Tom Bombadil lets whip it out 😤

[@johnecoapollo7]

Nah, Jaeherys fought the Faith much more efficiently. By using their own weapon against them, aka propaganda

[@EmmieyCathiey]

I want to hear more about how The Faith of the Seven might be related to the great other. I find it spooky that the Starry Sept in Old Town has an eerily similar name to the Cult of Starry Wisdom that the Bloodstone Emperor founded right before the long night.

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

coming next week

[@Rickuo]

The answer to that might be linked to the question where the Andals came from. Maybe the Andals were originaly Omberi, who where driven from their homeland by the Dothraki and the Faith of The Seven (Faced God) is either their original religion, a heretic version of it or a new religion based on the same roots of the other dark religions in ASOIAF. The Omberi and Tall Men are described as dark of skin. So they may be related to the Ghiscari. The Ghiscari claim descend from the Bloodstone Emperor, who was the founder of the Church of Starry Wisdom. I'm not an expert on ASOIAF, so this might all be wrong.

[@aurelian2668]

@@Rickuo I dont think the sarnori were whorshippers to the seven and related to the dothraki. The reason being that they fought the dothraki and thay they were never conquered by the valyrians in due part them being good allies.

[@alienazed]

Visenya and Maegor’s stories are heavily blackened. in my opinion, all they did was whatever it was necessary to ensure the safety of House Targaryen. Visenya and Maegor would not take any shit from the rebels, though their ways of settling matters were seen ‘cruel’ by many. definitely my favorite Targaryens. they did everything with reasons!

[@sarahp5880]

So, they had their "Trial of Seven" and Maegor won! So, by their own beliefs, that means their Seven Gods favor Maegor, so the church should listen to him. Except the Poor Fellows and such still rebel. Hypocrites! (Though mind you, I haven't seen any evidence that the seven gods are anything, what with the Fire Lord resurrecting people, the Undrowned God resurrecting Patchface and speaking though him, Old Gods and their Greenseers, etc.)

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

they actually had a debate about it according to the maesters...some of them believed the Gods decided and others believed that they were sworn to do as the High Septon commanded and the High Septon commanded them to kill every Targaryen they could get their hands on

[@wolfsbanealphas617]

just like robert

[@luismcfarland711]

@@TheOrderoftheGreenhand l

[@HolyknightVader999]

@@TheOrderoftheGreenhand But the Trial by Seven had Maegor win, so by that metric, even the Seven had thrown their lot in with the king.

[@rsherry7235]

Separating Church and State. A How to Guide by Cersei Lannister. So funny!!

[@matthiuskoenig3378]

in reality a country fuctions well when the leaders take into account the major relion of the country but doesn't let it control them, see the byzantines and the holy romans

[@wolfsbanealphas617]

Don't forget Vaylaria also wouldn't let religion control them except unlike our world they were demoized by said religion on another continent

[@KenDelloSandro7565]

It should be, Separating Sept and State. A how to guide........

[@KenDelloSandro7565]

@@matthiuskoenig3378 i basically agree with you. In all of history ( European history especially ) the only type of government that is proven and lasted for more than 300years is a Christian monarchy together with the True Catholic ( Catholicos is the Greek word for Universal, meaning it's everywhere )Church of Christ . Democracies and Socialist governments are guaranteed to fail because of immorality and total corruption. Pity the man who knows not history, for he will find himself repeating it. .

[@ChristianAuditore14]

The separation is to protect religious freedom

[@Ignisan_66]

Maegor is definitely the most misunderstood Targaryen king among the ASOIAF fandom. He was a total gigachad and did what he had to do to ensure survival of his house. Yes he was sometimes quite ruthless and merciless but who in Westeros isn't?

[@brianhowe1982]

Maegor's only mistakes was leaving any of his enemies alive, and allowing maesters anywhere near his children.

[@hypatiakovalevskayasklodow9195]

Kind of like Dany’s biggest mistake is keeping any if the slavers and their children alive

[@HolyknightVader999]

He should've also invited the R'hllor worshippers into Westeros.

[@zanehiam8130]

Maegor was the greatest king in the history of Westeros in my opinion. He did whatever was necessary to ensure the survival of not only his family, but the realm, sort of like Tywin. Therefore, I propose we refer to him as Maegor the Great from now on.

[@matthiuskoenig3378]

Maegor the just

[@DeadRepublic]

I've always been partial to Maegor the Awesome.

[@ayandak47]

The Cruel, I beleive serves to make his enemies know not to fuck with him... Great people can be fucked with and be greatly forgiving. Aegon may have gotten a little lazy after getting the throne but... people didn't fuck with him, even his own fam. Aenys was out here screwing around exiling him and trying to take Blackfyre back, props for him still being loyal and not usurping the crown but its tough cause I keep both of them on the same level. Tywins also been full of crap with the way he did things to Tyrion. Maegor would never do that to a bastard or sickly son I believe... shit, the homie went for another wife for the sake of having children so.. he'd be happy to know his dwarf kid getting some at least..

[@minatodroger7890]

But he killed two family members

[@giorgosgkialpis1394]

Jaeharys I was the greatest king of westeros!

[@madambutterfly1997]

Maegor saved the dynasty. If only there was a similar Targaryen that could've prevented Robert's rebellion

[@allyriastark3508]

Hasan Wilson or a smarter prince to not to start one

[@clairethebreadfascist5753]

Did you even watch the video?

[@RevealTheStyle]

zebran43 tyrant in his ways to deal with the Faith, maybe. But when your so called “tyrant” emerged alive after trial by combat and following month-long coma - smallfolk cheered. Don’t you think they would not have been so quick to support an actual tyrant?

[@RevealTheStyle]

zebran43 Joffrey didn’t care a shit about the stability of his realm or even about maintaining his dynasty.

[@lemnajcavite]

That's why in my Crusader Kings 2 : AGoT game, I always burn Oldtown down. XD

[@ZegetaX1]

Ha ha ha I love crusader kings 2

[@surtur9861]

Justice for Maegor, brought to you by the Order of the Greenhad

[@ivanbluecool]

Good thing dany remembers magor as a cruel yet just man. And the one who taught her was viserys as without his knowledge and stories. Dany and her dragons would be dead. If we saw them as kids. Viserys would be be seen as a hero saving dany and begging everyday for help. But no. He is a mean brother. Same a magar. We see the worst times of thier lives.

[@allyriastark3508]

ivanbluecool true even when Viserys appeared in Daenerys visions he told her while he was not kind he still loved her and looked after her. Viserys was a broken child father at a tender age without any guidance until Illyrio - things will be different if Rhaella didn't die.

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

we see Viserys as kind of a tragic character...he had the fate of a dynasty on his shoulders and he buckled under the weight of it

[@ivanbluecool]

Woohyun Fan plus he didn't see dany as attractive so he left her alone. That was his sister as well as the one he protected. Plus he was gonna be killed anyways by ilario and jorah. Also dany was cool with him taking the eggs. But no. He is the bad guy and on the level to Ramsey and joffery. Sucks about that

[@ivanbluecool]

The Order of the Green Hand thats why he got drunk so easy. Many get drunk to ease the pain of the responsibility of rule or nobility

[@wolfsbanealphas617]

especially since one of the knights who swore to serve his family and was his brother friend Barristans abandoned them claims him to be mad yet only came to dany becasue he got fired by a boy king who was mad

[@ashleyofnaath]

I thought Cersei got the idea for her book from Tommen...In S6E02, Tommen tells Cersei: "I should've executed all of them. I should've poured down the sept on the High Sparrow's head. You would've done that for me." Sorry, not Maegor related. But something interesting I'd noticed lol. Great video guys!💕

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

I actually think the QoT gave her the idea in the show...she asked her if she planned on killing them all herself or something like that

[@TYTfan]

By the Stranger I love this series. It is even better then why Catelyn sucks, and is perhaps even more important from a storytelling perspective. I'm looking forward to the next target you set your sights on.

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

Thank you so much...the Catelyn Sucks series was a lot of fun

[@MrScottie301]

such a great and objective look at Maegor. I feel like I read and understand GRRM books. I put the book down feeling confident I know where George is going and then I watch one of your videos. I love you guys for make me feel like we read two different books!

[@kaylew108]

You two dig real deep into these stories. Reading between the lines and making the comparisons and connecting the dots. Great job

[@jamestaylor4511]

When the hightowers play the game of thrones..ur mail will be late.

[@coreymicallef365]

james taylor and your food will taste funny

[@HolyknightVader999]

Worse, had the Faith Militant won, they might have propped up a Targaryen puppet of their own and have them control the dragons. Maegor the Strong, Maegor the Necessary!

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

certainly possible

[@HolyknightVader999]

It would have been far worse, don't you think? Imagine the Faith of the Seven roasting the North for not bowing down!

[@jamespinto1884]

Wait! Did you guys just say that during that year the wall received almost 200 knights who wanted nothing but to bring down the king? And that it's the maesters who get ravens from Old Town? What could go wrong? 🤔

[@cjpeterson2530]

Great day to be an ASOIAF fan. Preston and The Order both drop on the same day. No getting anything done anytime soon that's for sure!!!

[@jwalton1915]

No one quite like Maegor...my favourite Targaryen. Maegor Vult!

[@allyriastark3508]

And Cressen played the father figure to Stannis for years... Oh man I trust no one now :(

[@yimlee5140]

trust no one is right!

[@matthiuskoenig3378]

no don't trust no one he/she will kill you

[@kxnggeppetto]

With this whole "Lies of the Andals" series you two just took my view of the Faith (which I thought were actually not that bad, meaning I saw them in a good light) and Maegor (whom I thought was just a monster like a couple of others in the Targaryen family tree) and flipped my entire opinion of the two completely upside down. Amazing work!

[@emiliocamachoerice6380]

This video illustrates why lady green hand wants to put the name visenya if they have a daughter

[@emiliocamachoerice6380]

Lord Aurelius I wish you the best of luck convincing your couple to do that

[@mozart7820]

Emilio Camacho Erice a woman on radio 1 in the U.K. today was called Tyrion which was a bit weird.

[@emiliocamachoerice6380]

Jim Mozart hahahaha

[@anaisabel713]

I think this series of the lying pieced of shit andals is my favorite one so far. Which is a hard call because i love all of you guys videos!

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

thanks Ana

[@tiarajames8502]

Willow make him one

[@tiarajames8502]

H

[@allyriastark3508]

Maegor's allies seem to be hedge knights and first men if they aren't mentioned at all lol. We need real history from George.

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

Our thoughts exactly

[@HolyknightVader999]

Goes to show that the little guys loved Maegor. It was the Faith and its Noble houses that hated him and stood against him, calling him "the Cruel" when even Joffrey notes that his strength was all too rare among the Targaryens.

[@allyriastark3508]

HolyknightVader999 Royce, Tarly, Orys Baratheon all were there for him until his own family killed him for nothing? Wasn't it Jaeherys who promised to give his own child/ren as hostage to the Faith - a daughter who was going to be a Septa to please the Faith run to Essos to become a prostitute lol Orders POS Andals series and Preston's Dragon Gene series seem to connect well.

[@wolfsbanealphas617]

But why I don't understand what do they gain by betraying the one who saved them after all if things had gone differently the seven kingdoms could have become a new freehold

[@allyriastark3508]

Wolfsbane Alphas Alyssa Valeryon's job imo. She knew her children wouldn't able to rule until Maegor died so she put him in a though position and then ran away to Essos with Dark Sister still Jaeherys only become King after Maegor's murder. There is also subject of Viserys then a hostage for Alyssa's good behavior - his fate is not known. Maesters says how Tyana tortured the boy but hostages aren't tortured they just have their heads cut off, we know that from Theon, other hostages given to Starks by northern Noble houses, Ned and Robert is given to Lord Arryn as hostages and not like wards if Aerys could demand their heads at the beginning of the rebellion. I love to think that Tyana and Maegor planned to name Viserys the heir after rising him instead of Jaeherys who was close to the Faith if he could offer hostages to them. That's why I said PJ Dragon Gene and this series go well together, he makes you understand why which child, the ones who hatched health dragons, were taken from the Targaryens

[@dratheart]

Amazing work as always! I really look forward to these videos each week as a spot of brightness and escape into fantasy. Thank you both so much for continuing to make these when other content creators seem to be struggling to explore more within the material we have so far. Keep it up =)

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

Thank you so much

[@alexanderz3556]

You guys are one of the best ASOIAF channels on KZbin! Liked and Subbed!

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

thank you Alexander

[@ZegetaX1]

That cloudy stuff called smoke was hilarious

[@madambutterfly1997]

A lot of death mythos for some minor houses

[@wolfsbanealphas617]

Hasan Wilson what does that say about the great houses then

[@cassiocosta9854]

I used to think Jaehaerys the Conciliator was Greatest Targaryen King after Aegon the Conqueror but MAEGOR THE CRUEL he was serious man

[@allyriastark3508]

Cassio Costa Jaeherys offered his own children to Faith as Maester/Septa. His daughter escaped to Essos and become a prostitute to not to allow Faith control her body. Preston's Dragon Gene series and Orders POS Andals series should be watched together imo

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

Maegor should be remembered as the man who saved House Targaryen at the very least

[@NovaBell23]

I wait all week for your videos.

[@batman4329]

Thanks for another great video. This is my favorite GOT channel. I love the original content and I appreciate the hard work you put into your theories. There are a lot of channels that regurgitate common theories and most of them do a good job but I don’t think there is another channel that digs as deep as the order of the green hand! Don’t change a thing.

[@aaronneal6421]

So it looks like the Maesters (and maybe the Hightowers) might have thrown the Faith under the bus on this one. It does lend credence to the whole "Oldtown destroyed by dragons prophecy" idea that the three of them might be privy to. Although, I wonder if it's prophecy alone. It makes me think of Preston Jacob's speculations about high-tech pre-dawn age Planetos, and the possibility of some world-shattering doomsday weapon that might be hidden at battle isle. Also what is with major beacon towers on the western coast of Westeros? There's nothing past there, is there?

[@han-oq6bo]

The iron islands

[@madambutterfly1997]

Thank you so much for this series. Before the first video, I thought I was the only one who saw the Maester conspiracy throughout all five novels and prequels

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

we started noticing blatant lies the maesters tell back when we were doing the Tywin series, but it took months to accumulate enough examples to start this series

[@madambutterfly1997]

The Order of the Green Hand I am a firm believer in the accounts of Barth and Mushroom before any Maester

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

Barth is almost as good as getting information from Old Nan

[@guitar19971]

The grand maester conspiracy is one of the most widely covered ASOIAF theories I’ve seen. There are a lot of cool videos about it you should check them out.

[@LoneWolf-xe6ye]

Hasan Wilson They are very shady i mean really why do healers need a poison there is no cure for

[@wahhabmiah3270]

Whenever I'm bored I watch any of your old videos love the amount of research and thought you put in. Love and respect from London

[@ashleyferguson3115]

There is so little on Maegor and this was really eye opening. Great work, guys!!!

[@madambutterfly1997]

The Maesters killed his children. Maegor was never the problem

[@tavonwal1]

agreed but now the story is the north and valerian vs andals again plus andal on andal crime :)

[@madambutterfly1997]

tavon walton the First Men and the Valyrians might not get along well. The First Men psychologically molest animals and the Valyrians.... I can't find anything bad to say except for the slavery

[@lynnjohanssen6552]

What a lovely notification to get right before my daughter's naptime! :)

[@debodatta7398]

You guys are great, really opened my eyes to just how in-depth and complex this series with another fantastic video! This video further proves at least to me a theory among my friend group that reads the books, that Jon's real name will be Maegor.

[@Xaviar_St.Thomas]

Daaaayyyaaaammn Separating church and state: A how to guide by Cersi Lannister?? LMFAOOO This channel is SAVAGE !!!

[@filipeborela515]

I always cry in the last minute! Can't thank you enough, guys. Just keep beeing awesome.

[@tavonwal1]

after the last book Netflix should do the most an animate every details of this book series and the valerian history and the dawn empire the epic animated picture book(2d Disney or dreamwork style) 2 years of binge watching lol

[@MrWolf0451]

At last! you guys have really given me a different perspective on what is going on in this series, i feel stupid when watching the videos. Keep up the great work

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

thank you so much...we will definitely try

[@michaeleaverly7943]

So my question is if Visenya picked up on the maester at dragon stone poisoning Aenys (Maegor comes back and immediately beheads him) and when Tyana comes to Maegor after the trial of 7 and he wakes right up after the maesters are dismissed shouldn’t/wouldn’t both Visenya and Maegor distrust maesters??

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

They must not have realized it was a systemic issue and thought that it was a few bad eggs so to speak

[@wolfsbanealphas617]

What about pycelle how come no finds it suspicious every king he served died of mysterious and suspicious circumstances along with their wives babies dying

[@yimlee5140]

you kept us hanging there...i was like..."where are they?" "what are they doing?" "are they even thinking of ASOIAF right now?"....but you never dissapoint in the end!

[@atomicsunrise85]

I love how you have 13 likes and it says uploaded 2 mins ago!! You guys rock!!

[@AKWatchX]

I think this is your best one yet. Well done folks.

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

Thank you Alicia

[@natashaconrad3367]

37K subscribers!!!! Heck yeah! You guys do an amazing job on these book pieces! I thoroughly enjoy them! Thanks so much for another great video!

[@HebrewsElevenTwentyFive]

Powerful video. Changed the way I saw Maegor. Man those grey rats are irritating!

[@King_Steffon_II]

I'm new actually, and I must say I love it here. So comprehensive and well presented. Great.

[@gregorytaplin3166]

Great research and compilation! Wow...it really gets deep when one realizes the maesters are fridges faceless men...at least a handful of them. Jaqan Hagar is way way way up in the chain of command if he has to be super sneaky to get to the glass candles.

[@szbszig]

I must admit, I never thought of the Faith as being evil before watching this video, but I always found it strange that they continued to revolt openly even after losing their own trial by seven. Didn't really seem like they truly believed in what they preach.

[@tavonwal1]

from most hated to the greatest and favorite .you guys and martin should collab on the a real history book!!!

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

we'd be happy to

[@chadsummerchild1120]

That's Captain Morrigan

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

Long time no see Chad

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

hahaha i just saw this.! totally rad chad!

[@Antecedentful]

30 minutes of bliss ahead. Thank you so much for these!

[@thisguy8106]

That was a very good video. History can be whatever the victor's want it to be.

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

I feel like it is always important to think about who is providing information before deciding what you think of what they said

[@thisguy8106]

The Order of the Green Hand Completely true. The books have so much to actually finish, do y'all think everything will ever be fully revealed?

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

George has said that he will leave quite a bit to the readers interpretation but he likes to drop hints in interviews which is why our theories always begin with what George has said on any given topic

[@brucekentallen]

Do you think every maester is in on it? Most? Just some of the closest ones? The "key" ones? While it does seem the more recent ones like cressen are ideologically closer to this hightowers, he didn't seem like a manipulative power peon of the citadel, at best you could argue he was indoctrinate and thought what he was doing was the correct thing.

[@011cole]

It's time, call out there B S. Love the original content world's better than most. Cheers

[@freekodakblack6473]

It was a good day until this notification came up about more andal lies. Once Stannis the Mannis becomes king they’re done.

[@matthiuskoenig3378]

chants, Stannis Stannis Stannis, although i prefur house targarion but i don't know if i want the young griff or dany

[@evalationx2649]

When using the naming convention to look at House Targaryan is really interesting also. Targ is old Germanic for Shield, Aryan is ancient Sanskrit for Noble one or Noble ones. So Targaryan can be translated as "Shield of the Noble Ones."

[@nithinkhydrose4899]

So, Maegar was not that different from Bloodraven and Jon Snow. I wonder, however, wtf did he trust the maesters considering how many of them stood up against him in favour of Faith of 7. He was supposed to be paranoid,right??

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

I feel like he didn't see it as a situation where all maesters were pieces of crap...he seems to have thought that two were "bad apples"

[@nithinkhydrose4899]

I wrote the comment before noticing someone else wrote a similar comment that you answered in the exact same way. Thanks for replying anyway.

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

no problem

[@britainlott1602]

While a son of the Starks (first men) preferably so but as a bastard not taught as much? Idk I’m not George Martin lmao

[@sevensodacunningham5229]

My thanks & I bow to your greatness. I have only recently come across the wolf den & I am now a leal bannerman of the order of the greenhand (first & foremost) I will follow up this claim with patreon support in the not too distant future (I already support history of westeros & Got academy but am trying to budget better so I can support you two)

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

Thank you so much

[@ivanbluecool]

Best part about this serious is how everyone in the books and its readers see magor as evil but george doesn't write like that. I see everyone even joffrey who I dont hate much. I just see him as a spoiled brat with too much power and told the world is his. Magor I see like ned or Robert. Knows more about combat than politics.

[@bore-osofmyr2539]

You guys have the best theme music of all the GoT analysis videos

[@oclairdelune164]

Hi, another great video as ever. I have really been enjoying this serie so far. I have a question: do you believe that the maesters in charge of Maegor's pregnant queens poison them (or compell Tyanna of the Tower to do the deed) so that they gave birth to "monsters"? I think it is also possible that the Grand Septon had an hand into that as well, as Queen Ceryse was his niece and she was almost set aside for her barreness in favor of fertile women. I must add that your video has changed my opinion on Maegor. Now, we should call him Maegor the Great.

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

We think the maesters poisoned Maegor’s unborn children in the womb and blamed it on Tyanna in some revisionist history

[@oclairdelune164]

Yes, I see the deal, blame it all on the foreigner, she's a dangerous heathen and a jealous whore! But it can also be, to me, that she had been coerced into doing it. I'm sure, if she really had done it, that her hand was forced, because I don't see why she would do that to Alys and then accused her to have affairs with other men when, according to some accounts, they were paramours. Plus the Faith had really a reason to get rid of Alys as, from their point of view, she was not married to Maegor, juste a concubine. And I also think it plausible that Ceryse Hightower played a role in the demise of Alys Harroway and her house.

[@mistersharpe4375]

Come to think of it, I wonder what the Faith of the Seven was getting up to during Robert's Rebellion. The contribution of the "loyal" houses of the Reach in the war seems unimpressive to say the least.

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

Look at what happened at Stony Sept

[@josephlongbone4255]

I still think Meagor was pretty evil, it's quite telling that the normally chill Jeahearys goes absolutely ballistic when his daughter compares herself to him when talking about her multiple boyfriends. Jaehaerys had lost two brothers to Meagor and both his mother and older sister bore the scars of Maegor's abuse. Such things as well documented by multiple sources throughout his reign. Maegor might have saved house Targaryen, but he also nearly destroyed it...

[@made-line7627]

Agreed

[@ryandilavore5495]

Your both the best truest one of the few who will prolbley be right in the long run you should do more livestreams when giving the chance in between work and bringing clarity to a song of ice and fire

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

thank you...we really want to do more livestreams...we just haven't had time

[@CJ_Kelly]

Not sure if it was mentioned, but I love how George kept dropping in “Little Finger” hints while Cressen was admiring The Strangler. I love the videos, this is my favorite channel. Thanks for the great work!

[@Aniruddharmdgm]

I am absolutely loving this series of videos...... Well done guys

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

thank you Aniruddha

[@saminator3563]

Lord and Lady Greenhand. Going through AGOT. Looking at the Essos map. Just noticed there is a Island in the Stepstones called Bloodstone. As you say, Uncle George can’t move on without a name. Do you think that points at the hammer of the waters being something to do with or the magic of the Bloodstone Emperor? Do you know if there was a name for the area before the breaking of the arm?

[@saminator3563]

Maybe where the stone that became Dawn landed?

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

We have wondered why that island is called bloodstone too except there’s exactly zero information about it

[@saminator3563]

The Order of the Green Hand sneaky George

[@wolfsbanealphas617]

it's problaby a place the children used for safricies and a place that is smared in the blood of men and demihumans

[@timshift2395]

I’ve been waiting for this one I know it’s gonna be good, keep it up guys

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

sorry it took so long...we've been in the middle of a holiday season/wedding planning whirlwind

[@wolfsbanealphas617]

No problem congratulations again

[@seanmayory]

I love these. I just don't understand why you don't go back to the beginning. Why are you documenting the lies and cover-ups without proving the foundation they were built on? Why do they try to hard? What do Ny Sar, Volantis, and the Citadel have in common? Purple moss Why do the Rhoynar have a story about 10000 ships, but history tells us the sandship was the original home of the Martells? Why does the description of the base of the Hightower and a number of other sites have a basic description that sounds like the layout of Sunspear except that Sunspear isn't made of oily stone yet? Why do the maesters and the Dornish seem to share a love of poisons? Why so many outbreaks of plagues? Could there be a connection between them visiting certain places before westeros? And isn't is bizzar that the first place the Rhoynar tried to settle was right next to the mega creepy Gogossos that the dragon people were using for magic monster making and the worst people they wanted to punish? Why are we told the Rhoynar brought their own gods but no one seems to know who they are? These videos would be easier to understand if you took the time to establish the faith and maesters were put in place by people escaping the dragonlords. Without substantiating their motivation all it sounds like is basic sceptical reading. Wouldn't it make more sense to start at the beginning than waiting till the end to release an origin story?

[@krembo1077]

The Maesters are Faceless Mans confirmed

[@tavonwal1]

krembo the faceless men were correct all religions are connecting because of death .death is the death is the great other and the forces death attracts. The Religions are rulebook or guideline create by men and is all twisted and flawed like man. magic ,believe,power,Love,And and mystery of the unknown are the closeness to "gods" .legend is like gumbo and healthy mix of gossip,drama ,glamour,truth and lies lol

[@krembo1077]

tavon walton im joking lol

[@in_vas_por8810]

If the great other is death, then the night king and anyone who has been resurrected by a red priest are cheating death. Something to think about.

[@mozart7820]

Loved the real world stuff on the deaths head moth and the morrigan. From the beginning of agot we got the feeling maesters were not to be trusted but it just keeps getting deeper and deeper how can the lords of Westeros be so blind !

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

Barbrey Dustin sees it

[@mozart7820]

The Order of the Green Hand I'm almost at that part with my reread which is beyond all expectation in regards the amount of things I am noticing that I didn't the first time. I didn't even realise Mance was the bard who turns up at winterfell with the spearwives the first time round. doh.

[@TheSpreadCoach]

I’ve been waiting for this installment! Totally hooked on the series. Oh and “piece of shit lying Andals” is almost as good as “ the Bat Shit Crazy Sisters “ 🤣🤣🤣 great vids guys

[@wahhabmiah3270]

I remember years ago when you guys first started out I came across one of your videos, instantly became a fan of you guys. The nice thing about you guys is whenever i used to have a question or wanted to know about something you always replied and were always polite. Its nice to see that you lot have become popular and hope you more success keep up the good work I doubt you remember me you wrote back a few times to me years ago

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

thank you...that's much appreciated...I must admit that it's no longer possible to answer everyone, but I do try to comb through the comments and answer 5-10 people a day...I pride myself on being able to remember frequent the names of people who comment regularly...I definitely recognize your name, but I can't recall what we talked about...glad you're still watching though

[@wahhabmiah3270]

@@TheOrderoftheGreenhand Thanks for the reply wish you good fortune

[@summerstevens2547]

This whole series on the Andals is so amazing! You changed my whole perspective. Thanks for sharing this with GOT community. Been watching your videos for while, finally hit the subscribe button :-) Also just stumbled on your YT channel team up with Quinn from Ideas of Ice & Fire on Season 7 live stream about the "Did the Night King need a Dragon" topic. Not sure how missed that one! Hope you guys team up again; the chat was super informative and entertaining plus your theories fit together so well and build off each other. Was really great!

[@Dems1944]

All hail Maegor!

[@evarubel716]

Agreed! I do love this series and you guys make some GREAT points about Maegor. I feel i understand his fight with his nephew Aegon now but what about killing his nephew Viserys?

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

We’re still trying to figure out what happened with Viserys. We feel like the maesters blame everything that happened on Maegor and Tyanna of the Tower and I half wonder if Viserys died and being tortured to death by his uncles wife is some revisionist history to add further credence to their portrayal of Maegor’s cruelty

[@malmorbidus2788]

Omg my 4th comment but seriously My 6 year old just looked at GRRM and said "oh my gosh it's Santa!" xD dead

[@nonstructuralprotein]

the name badb is an old irish spelling of the word ‘badhbh’ (meaning crow) and is actually pronounced bayv not bad buh! also great video i’m really enjoying this series a lot, probably my favourite series of yours so far!

[@bigearl33]

Off subject in regards to Maegor but, I've been wanting to ask: Do you see any connections between Littlefinger's interest in Harrenhal being equated with Littlefinger actually being interested in The Gods Eye ?? thank you, love your content !!!

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

its entirely possible

[@williamhermann6635]

I dont often underestimate little finger, but in this case i think he is interested in nothing more than the wealth provided by the vast lands that accompany harrenhall. I could be wrong, but i dont think littlefinger has any interest in magical places like the God's eye.

[@imccom]

Do you believe that the maesters are allied with the Great Other and his minions or simply an unaware tool to ensure that the realms of man are weaker than before?

[@raswartz]

lol @ "Seperating church and state : a how to guide"

[@artssygrl]

I wonder if they just crack up laughing when they are coming up with these things. I know I laughed and even rewinded (if that's what it's called) to hear this a 2nd time.

[@raswartz]

Me too. Here it is one more time 11:08

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

There are definitely some funny outtakes

[@madambutterfly1997]

If it were me they'd have to choose between the sword or the fire

[@oxtheunlikelycontemplator2682]

That was Maegor's tactic and it ended with him being brutally murdered and ultimately having one of the shortest reigns of any Targaryen King despite his skills as a warrior and having Balerion.

[@itzfifson6140]

Great job i love this channel! Bring the truth and exposing the grey rats

[@mumblemumble6641]

Finally! So excited! I wait excitedly for another video in hope I'll get a comment on early enough to get a question answered. But then I forget to ask a question. Oh well, I just enjoy the videos.

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

sorry we made you wait...its been a little crazy at the Wolf's Den these past few weeks

[@mumblemumble6641]

You guys continue to inspire me to write my own story. I've been worki by on it for the past 13 years, and it still feels like it's in infancy.

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

If it is your dream, don't stop...great stories don't spill out in a day

[@jodiemcadams1418]

Why would he let the Maesters and Septons anywhere near his family? I can't get my mind around that.

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

He must not have realized what maesters actually were

[@AgentXA564]

Maegor is somewhat like Vlad Dracula. They both were very cruel; however, they both were doing what they had to do. Their enemies (the Maesters and the Saxon merchants) bad mouthed both of them while ignoring the consequences that their actions would have had if they were not taken. The main difference I see between them is that Maegor had dragons and Vlad didn't.