GERMAN COPS VS USA COPS | CULTURAL DIFFERENCES AND MAJOR SHOCKS

[@HayleyAlexis]

I will probably make a follow up video in the future but for now I think this is a decent comparison between the USA and German cops 🤗 you can let me know if you have had any encounters with the law in the USA or Germany and what the outcome was 😉

[@Sketchblopp]

Tbh in my experience German police might be more laid back sometimes but is also fairly useless. A friend wanted to move out of a Wohngemeinschaft with an abusive asshole and when the time was due (or about to?) that asshole started making trouble, saying furniture A, B and C would be his and my friend would have no right to take them with her. Eventually cops were called. She even had the receipts to prove that stuff was hers but the cops didn't do anything aside of trying to calm down both of them and treat them like some overdramatic babies. Thanks for nothing. Police brutality is also a thing here in Germany, especially on protests, although this depends on the region. And many Germans working for the police are rather lenient or outright best buddies with local fascists, as many recent reports about chat groups with nazi propaganda and stuff can attest. We really need an independent investigative organisation that controls the police, nothing will change as long as bad behaviour from cops is investigated by other cops.

[@schiffelers3944]

Is it okay if it is with cops in Europe in general? (Dutch, German, Belgian, French, Spanish police) I've never had a real bad experience with cops, but then I am also very compliant with them. Just answer their questions, let them do their thing, and you will be on your merry way. My experiences all the time. Alcohol check points, traffic troubles, speed checks, sitting in a parked car in a parking lot, just normal and random things. Police encounters and them being inquisitive, or doing their jobs. I had my own first car (X-hand more than 2nd), which suddenly stalled on the Dutch autobahn, smack in the middle, with cars not letting me get to the "vluchtstrook" (hard shoulder?) and my car losing speed fast. No matter how I push the gas peddle. I put on my safety blinkers, and was wondering how I could get the car from the spot I was at, and me at safety being by myself, in the middle of the authobahn. I had passed a policeman on a motor bike not that long before. So not that long after; the police came by, saw me standing still in the middle of the autobahn, putting on his flashlights and stopping behind me. Came over to me and asked what was going on, and what I was thinking of doing and how dangerous this was. This didn't come across as friendly, more like; you stupid mofo what are you doing. Too stupid to drive a car. It was't these words, but the way he spoke felt like this where his thoughts. I explained what happend. Offered him to try and get the car started and moving again. He also couldn't, and he helped me putting me and the car in safety (and the other street users), by moving his motorbike more into traffic a little bit further back, and helping me push the car to the hard shoulder, and helping me getting from the autobahn. While having to leave my car at that spot. I had been on my way to my school/education. A cop car came and drop me of at the city center where the public traffic could help me get back on my way. My father once in my youth got mistaken in identity, but staying calm cooperating, cleared up the confusion and nothing bad happened. I think it was with Belgian police, they where looking for a criminal that kinda looked like my father. With a school excursion to Paris we lost our group and bus, they basically left us. It was cops that helped us getting in contact with our parents, whom got incontact with school, whom got in contact with the teachers and bus, and created a meeting spot for us to meet up with the bus and the school group. In Spain during a holiday, my cousin (female) and I got separated after being dancing and drinking at a local bar, and she was with some "local" boy. Still don't know if these boys where actually local, Spanish, or what ever or what the deal actually was in the end. Me being trusting af first not thinking much of it being young and a little weltfremd at that. The boy that other boy which my cousin went with was with was still "with" me. Before my cousin left it was agreed upon, that they wouldn't be that long and "right" back. His friend would wait on him to return, and I would wait with him for my cousin to return with that other boy. There was this Belgian couple, (my cousin and I are Dutch, and we had seen and spoken with them at the bar and even dances with them, them and us speaking Dutch was the bonding link, etc.) And they asked me where my nice was... but then the other boy also started to walk away from where we where, and the other boy and my cousin where still not back. My cousin and that other boy agreed they would not be gone for long, and would come back - and that other boy was also there to wait for his friend to return. So when he started walking away, I was asking him where he was going. All the sudden he was acting like he could speak no English at all, but before he did speak some English. Then the Belgian couple said that there were also gangs and human trafficing stuff happening in that area. And that I (we, they came along) had to not loose that boy because he was our only link to the other boy my cousin went with. The boy started walking faster and into a different direction my cousin and his friend went into. He kept ignoring us, and the Belgian man started to confront him, he spoke Spanish thus .... the boy could not act like he didn't understand. The Belgian man then said the boy said he didn't know what I was talking about, not the boy/his friend nor my cousin. But the Belgian man (his wife was with me) had seen them at the bar, us at the bar, my cousin and that other boy together at the bar, and my cousin leave with one of the boys. The Spanish boys then started to run away. The Beligian man on hot pursuit and his wife and me right behind him, all running after that Spanish boy. The Belgian man catched the boy at his t-shirt. And then things became physical between both of them. Keep in mind his wife had already contacted police. And told me not to get involved my self any further, her man could handle himself. And he did. All the sudden police showed up, sperated the Beligan man and Spanish boy. This felt like just a few second passing. The Spanish police spoke with the Beligian couple who could speak and fully understand Spanish. And almost at the same time the Spanish police asked me stuff, I asked them if they could speak English, they didn't... but they wanted me to get into the police car. I fully didn't understand what was going on, and also why I was the person that had to get into the police car. But like I said before, be compliant is your best way to go... thus I followed their instructions and stepped into their police car. They closed the door, the police stepped into the car, a different police car had also entered the scene. And they drove off with me in the back of the car. Totally not understanding what happend. I understood they wanted to know from me what happened, but there was no way I could explain the shit that had went on in Spanish. Thus I started as calm as possible to tell them in English: I lost my cousin, we met the boys and the Belgian couple at the bar, and they got suspicious that my cousin could be in deep trouble and human trafficking. And me being drunk and not understanding what actually happened and what was going on. Then they Spoke Spanish amongst each other, and over their radio, we came close to the place I had last spoken and seen my cousin, they stopped, and let me out. Turns out my cousin was their and wondering where I and that other boy had gone to... Police let me out the car, got back in the car and went away. Don't know what happened to the other boy, the Belgian couple, nore the boy that my cousin was with. He had left because his friend called him. About the police and us running after him and the Belgian man getting physical with him. Or so my cousin presumed. I did see him make a phone call as the police came. They (cousin and that boy) where sitting on a bench being cosy, talking, looking over the water and harbor and lost track of time. Police are just doing their jobs, and if I have done nothing wrong I have nothing to fear of them. I know this can be different in different countries. But it never helped to be uncompliant with them, the are law enforcers. Yes it is scary, they can act very authoritarian (comes with the job) and especially with people not always being compliant and wanting to police how the police is doing their job/acting towards/with them. Do police overstep bounds, yes. Can police be overly agressive yes. Would it actually help you to fight back at those moments? Or would that escalate and make things worse? So no matter how the cookie crumbles, being respectful and compliant is the best course of action. In my opinion based on experiences. Do I always agree with them, our their actions? Nope. I think I would have some white privilege in the USA when it comes to cops, but not so much in Europe. Also when I am dressed a certain way, I will have security follow me more closely or even asking me questions. Because I look like certain stereotypes of people that could cause trouble. Like hoodies, baggy stuff, and not being that easily identifiable, with the hoody pulled over my head, and a cap on, and you cant see my face that well, etc. I also had/have a baby face, this might also influenced people, because this does; in positive and negative ways. A skinny twink, (white) cis gay boy.... this might have been some privilege with police while growing up and encounters with them. Non threatning at all, not physical nor in my behavior. (other times could have meant other outcomes with that also.) Profiling/stereotyping does happen, we do it, police does it. If I see a group of teen boys being boys on the street there is a big chance I will cross the street and avoid actually encountering them. They could be the nicest group of boy, but that is not what they looked like when I made my decision to change route or cross the street. Just as a stupid but clear example. I would also want to point out that legal doesn't equate to morally correct or just. There are many video's on cops and even by cops on YT, many from the USA that I have seen. And I often don't fully agree with the cops and their behavior but also always am shocked by the way how the civilians act, disrespect and don't cooperate and argue with police. For me this would be like being in court and disrespecting the judge in a similar way, and wondering why the judge wasn't favoring you in some way.

[@schiffelers3944]

This is my second reaction, just another example that popped into mind right after I posted the first (long) reaction: I was a young adult on the back seat in a car in the city I live in. There was a (local) police car up ahead doing traffic checks. [I don't know these cops, nor a cop in general, just to put that info also in.] As we passed them by I noticed I wasn't wearing a seat belt, I had forgotten to do so. [Also growing up there were no seat belts in the back seat, that had happened with time while growing up.] So, we passed them and with them in the back window I put on the seat belt, but they saw me do that through the back window of the car. So they came and stopped the car. Asked, if I wasn't wearing a seat belt just before. And I could have said, no, look I am wearing it. Who are they to prove differently now. But I was honest, which they also very much appreciated, since they had seen me put it on. And didn't want to go through the yes, no game with me/us. So they asked me for my identification, which.... I had forgotten my wallet with identification (at home), technically I was fined but they could not fine me without my identification papers. {keep in mind, baby faced twink.... this could have been my privilege in this case.... the previous example with me being stranded in the middle of the autobahn this didn't work in my favor to begin with. The fact that I was stranded and alone, was what made the cop more friendly there. Because the situation was dangerous, and it was an act of god, so to speak. He had to help me get off the autobahn into the hard shoulder. The way how they drove me from the hard shoulder and didn't let me step over the rail and walk into the living area across the large field was a postive effect for me - a free ride closer to where I need to be, since they think I am lesser capable as a baby face person. [Human psychology] So, they asked if I could produce the identification for them within an hour. I said, yes. Told them where the wallet was, at home, and gave them the adress (not that far away). {The impression I am this honest and trust worthy person, by being so compliant... and fitting a stereotype of being young and "dumb" lesser acountable/capable; baby face in my advantage? They took information from the driver (a friend of mine) and told me that if we didn't return within the hour they would put the fine on the friend that was driving. I didn't want him to get fined with a big sum of money. So, this "deal" was fine with me. (back in the early 2000's, I'm from 1980) And, they let us go, we went to get my identification card, and went back to the cops to sort it out further. They where waiting back at that parking lot space where they had us stop, while still conducting traffic checks. 1. They kinda looked surprised we came back. Not sure what they actually would have done, the outcome we got in the end, or what they said what would happen. 2. I gave them my id card to get fined, so my friend wouldn't get fined. They looked at my card, asked me some questions, again, and I answered them again respectfully. He took out the map with the papers to write fines, and the information of my friend, gave back my id card, gave me the paper with with identification information of my friend. 3. They said they liked how I actually had come back, and with it being about 30 minutes since they let us go. Thus, literally the time for me to go home get the id card and wallet, and come back to them. And that: They would leave it at a warning. [They could have fined me, but didn't] Oh, and by the way.... they said: Next time in this kind of situation don't put on the seat belt, because that was the moment they noticed I wasn't wearing it. Wait till the cops are completely out of sight before you do put on the seat belt. A common mistake people make. 4. I jumped through their hoops as the law can make them do, and they rewarded me by letting me go with a warning. Maybe I am just lucky when the unlucky stuff happens, but not the kind of luck to win the lottery. Back early 2000's with my own car, and friends and smoking joints on a parking lot, in a not that populated area, just being youngsters, talking and listening to music and no private space to "space out". Except the car. Back then driving while smoking weed was not illegal in the Netherlands, we are a strange place, not that long after laws did change and shift in that regard. {Also to point out I am not a saint, never did anything "wrong" etc. even with this being legal at that time. I have broken rules.... just to point that out. So, sitting in the car, filled up with smoke. All the sudden we see some car lights approaching. The car stopping.... not that long after that.... Knock, knock, knock.... on the window of the car. I lower the window on the drivers seat, and noticing it's the police. Before it was some person in what seemed some kind of dark unform. Window opens and all the smoke rushes out of the car, clearing up the car which we had not noticed being that clouded up. Police knows what is up.... just by looking at the situation and smelling the smoke coming out of the car into his face. They ask what we are doing, we are telling them we are just hanging and smoking.... this is not illegal (Dutch and the soft drugs policies are well known from before I was even born.) The ask for my papers and divers licence etc. And the id papers of all the people in the car, look at them give them back, ask us a few questions. They told us that a house not that far from the parking lot was the one that called the police. Not knowing who we were, what that car was doing there for a while. The police told us to be carefull, not to be too loud or make it too late, and first sober up a little bit before we would go back home, and left it at that. They wished us a fun night, and be safe. Turned around and got back into the police car, and drove away. How many and what kind of police stories do you want to hear about.... I have many different ones for different reasons, not so much for breaking laws, and my experience is: be as respectful as possible and cooperate. The only thing you can do by not being this is make it harder on you and on the cops.

[@MingyueTien-Di]

I'm curious if Germany allows for and has dash cams as well as house cameras equivalent to Ring?

[@CoL_Drake]

@@MingyueTien-Di private dash cams are not allowed

[@kaylaread8048]

Ende der 80er Jahre. Nachts Heimfahrt von der Disko. Fahrzeugkontrolle. Polizist: „Ihren Führerschein bitte.“ Ich so: „Oh Mist, den habe ich zu Hause rumliegen. Polizist rollt mit den Augen. „Fahrense weiter.“ 😂 Love it!

[@heindaddel2531]

„Wir sind jetzt in Arizona angekommen, hier interessiert es auch niemanden“

[@reinhard8053]

Hatte ich ähnlich. Kontrolle und ich hatte keine Autopapiere (die waren im Urlaub verlorengegangen, was ich noch nicht bemerkt hatte). Anscheinend sah ich ehrlich genug aus, ich konnte weiterfahren.

[@JulianKirk87]

hatte genau die gleiche Situation, nen Ausweis hatte ich aber dabei. Mein Onkel war in der Nachbarstadt Polizist, der cop schaut auf den Ausweis,schaut mich an "ach Mensch,schöne Grüße" ... gibt mir den Ausweis wieder und fährt weiter 😅

[@nicknellany2336]

As a Scotsman living in Germany for many years, I've had the odd run-in with the German Police. When working with the German Red Cross, I was transporting four volunteers, who were from different countries, in my yellow Kangoo. Stopped at the lights, a police minibus pulled up on the inside lane, and so had a good look into my car. The driver told me to pull into the next side-street. The girls in the back weren't wearing their seatbelts. I apologised and explained that we were working with the Red Cross as volunteers to help the refugees, and that the girls were from different countries. I should have checked that they were wearing their seatbelts. (I didn't mention that the rear centre seatbelt didn't click shut...). Normally, this would have meant a 50€ fine for each of the girls and for me as the driver. 200€ in total. On asking for my identitification, I explaned that, as a Scotsman, it is a Britsh passport and cost me 200€, so I keep it at home. (You must, by law, carry identification at all times in Germany). The misdemeanors were piling up... My car was also past it's M.O.T. date...which is the second thing the police noticed. (That could have been another, hefty fine). The policemen and women got back into their van and held a discussion. I was given a verbal warning, the girls in the rear were to belt-up, and I was to report to my local police station with a valid M.O.T. certificate within the next month. All very friendly and pleasant. And MORE than fair!!

[@gene9230]

You do not have to carry a passport in Germany.

[@ursusbavaricus4761]

@@gene9230 not a passport, but a means of identification!

[@rich-ard-style6996]

@@gene9230your drivers license , if you drive your car,

[@gene9230]

@@ursusbavaricus4761 no that is wrong

[@gene9230]

@@rich-ard-style6996 well, we were not talking about driving a car

[@michaeldebree4870]

Let me tell you what the German cops were looking for. They saw that Cologne number plate and they thought : HOLLAND!!! DRUGS! They thought, these 2 people are near Holland, they probably have weed or something else and drive it all the way down here in Germany to sell. I am From The Netherlands, I drive a car with a Berlin license plate, I get stopped over EVERY time, for the drug search. And how you described the actions the cop did,..searching everywhere,... it kinda explains it all.

[@mob8451]

Yes, and it was in Bavaria where the tiniest bit of weed has always been treated like a felony.

[@CamaroMann]

Bayern, Mann.

[@FulloutPostal]

agreed. either weed or kölsch ;)

[@michaeldebree4870]

@@FulloutPostal 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@berndbauch6751]

@@FulloutPostal nach wasser sucht doch niemand ;)

[@Gnin1000]

Hello, As a senior German police officer, I can only criticize my colleagues on the freeway in the situation described. Of course, it is always possible that there is information about vehicles that were conspicuous or even involved in criminal offenses. If you are then unlucky and fall into such a grid with your car, such situations can occur. But at the latest when the situation has cleared up, the colleagues should provide brief feedback for the check. A search of the car is prohibited by law and may only be carried out with a court order. Only if no judge is available and there is an initial suspicion of a criminal offense and a risk of suspicion can a police officer decide independently whether to search a car. However, a car is legally comparable to a home and this is specially protected under our constitution. The fact that the German police are generally friendlier and more understanding than their US counterparts may be due to the fact that the police in Germany experience much less gun violence or even have to fear that weapons could come into play. We always expect the worst (a hand on a gun), but in 95% of cases the people being checked do not have any weapons. The German police are also not allowed to lie in order to obtain information. These are forbidden interrogation methods and would blow up any case.

[@irinigago]

Ich Danke ihnen, für Ihre Antwort. Ich habe großen Respekt vor der Arbeit die Sie und ihre Kollegen leisten. Ich persönlich, finde es ein No Go, wie wir Bürger und auch Medien, Polizeieinsätze kritisieren. Natürlich kann immer etwas falsch laufen, wir sind alle Menschen mit Fehlern, es sind aber noch lange nicht amerikanische Verhältnisse. Danke das es Sie und ihre Kollegen gibt. Danke ❤

[@Gnin1000]

@@irinigago Vielen Dank! Man gewöhnt sich leider an solche Umstände, dass beispielsweise ein Einsatzvideo drei Tage lang in Einzelbildfortschaltung durch zig schlaue Köpfe analysiert und interpretiert wird, um dann die Entscheidung der Polizei vor Ort, die in Bruchteilen von Sekunden getroffen werden muss, zu hinterfragen und zu kritisieren.

[@dedeegal]

I was also pulled out by the police once (as a German in Germany). Suddenly, the car in front of me displayed a "please follow" in the rear window (that happend on the A7 "Autobahn" - in Hamburg shortly before the Elbe tunnel). I followed and then everything was checked: Driver's license, vehicle registration, first-aid kit (including mandatory contents and expiration date), warning triangle ... and perhaps even more ... I forgot. I had everything with me. There was also an alcohol test. But all without findings. At the end I asked the two policewomen why I had been pulled out. The answer was: "Well, we have to pass the day somehow". Great ... luckily I was in no hurry that day. But it's something to remember. 🙂

[@HayleyAlexis]

I mean I technically would not mind being pulled over to show off all of my "things", as long as I was told why 😉

[@SheratanLP]

@@HayleyAlexis Fragen hilft da oft weiter. :)

[@HayleyAlexis]

@SheratanLP we did ask why we were pulled over and there was no response so we did not push any further. It was 4 of them against 2 of us and what are we supposed to do? Fight with 4 police officers?

[@ramblingmillennial1560]

Wow

[@SheratanLP]

@@HayleyAlexis So that's really cheeky. The police are not allowed to search your car without a court order and must give you a reason. You have the right to know the reason for the search and you have the right to refuse the search. If you refuse the search, they will probably call a judge and get an order. But at least you'll find out the reason for the search. We live here in a constitutional state and not in a banana republic where every police officer can do whatever he likes. No matter how many police officers are there, you don't have to be afraid to exercise your rights. Oh yes, and always smile nicely. :)

[@kaylaread8048]

Differences between German Police 🇩🇪 and Police in the US 🇺🇸 Probably the biggest difference between Germany and the USA is that in Germany you have to do a three-year (bachelor's) degree to become a police officer, while in the USA, depending on the state, about 6 months of training is sufficient. Other differences: In Germany, the psychological suitability of every police candidate is tested, in the USA not. In the USA, ex-military experience makes it easier/quicker to be accepted into the police force, but not in Germany. In Germany, a police officer does not have to constantly expect to meet armed citizens*, but in the USA in many countries they do. That's why US cops are often so trigger-happy and use the gun early on. They fear for their own lives. The German police use firearms much less frequently. (*There are 5.83 million legal guns in Germany (83 mill.) and they belong to 2.31 million gun permits. By comparison, there are an estimated 300 million privately owned edged weapons in America. In Germany, you have to prove you are safer with a gun than without. In Germany, police officers receive much more psychological training in de-escalation methods than in the USA. In the US, police officers can behave much more aggressively towards citizens and have the backing of the police force. In Germany this is far from the case. In the USA, police officers very often get away with minor or no penalties, despite serious violations of the basic rights of citizens - up to and including death - but this is not the case in Germany. German police officers are civil servants with all the advantages of civil service (secure job, pension,...). In the US, police officers are municipal employees - without great fringe benefits and their contracts are not for life. In Summary: The US does not have the infrastructure, budget, personnel, equipment and training that the Germans have Given the choice, I would 3 times prefer to be stopped or taken into custody by German police officers than by American ones.

[@NicolaW72]

A very good and concise comparing Summary! Indeed, exactly!

[@vtxgenie1]

Just to add, US officers are taught to say they fear for their life even if not faced with a weapon, which is one of the reasons even when they resort to shooting an unarmed person they use the same statement - I thought they were armed and feared for my life = justified shooting.

[@fjordweit6170]

In my opinion, most American police officers would fail the aptitude test for the German Police Academy with all their might, especially if they don't have a college degree. The police authorties are not looking for lone fighters like Rambo, but rather team-oriented, resilient people with high interpersonal skills. That make the difference. Practical skills such as handling resources can be learned, but a wrong attitude is much harder to correct.

[@danieldieste9905]

You need a bachelor to become a detective (Kommissar) - the regular training is three years vocational training.

[@nillyk5671]

This is soo perfect. You only missed the IQ test. In the USA you are not required to take one while in Germany, it is part of the process. And let me tell you, it shows.

[@lieselstrick]

When I was 18 and got my driving licence I took the car to drive to work. Usually I started at 5.30 in the morning and all parking paces were empty. It was a small car, Opel Corsa. And when I returned to my car after a long shift in the hospital, my car was blocked from both sides (front and back). So I tried to maneuver the car out of the parking space by moving 15cm back and forth while turning the steering wheel. I was nearly done and in the last second I touched the car behind me and broke a piece of plastic from the plate holder. But only that, nothing else, that plate was fine, the holder still hanging. I was so shocked and called the police. When the police arrived, I was so devastated, I felt so guilty about having broken something. They had to calm me down and comfort me first because I was crying like a baby. They spent more time with me that the actual accident. Poor guys. One of them could have been in my father's age and that's how he behaved. Fortunately I have never had any bad experience with the police.

[@klarasee806]

I can’t tell you how much I love (and missed) to listen to your opinion on more serious topics like this.

[@gina88isa]

My sister got stopped by the police several times for drinving to slow (yes, she is a terrible driver). We always make fun of her saying :" You will never get "blitzed" by a radar, they can make a portraitpainting of you while you are driving.

[@manub.3847]

In principle, one cannot rule out the possibility that there are really bad police officers who actually deserve to be banned from their profession. And here in Germany, for example, young drivers are also more likely to be checked during traffic checks near dance clubs or other public events where alcohol is served (particularly around Christmas parties). Our son once played the driver for his friends, but since he was driving the company car (family members were also allowed to drive the car), he was stopped once and properly checked. On the other two tours the police waved him through with the words: "Oh, there's the chauffeur again."

[@Airman-nr4yb]

In 45 years, since I got my early driver's license, such a situation has never happened to me as a German in Germany. When you are pulled over, no policeman has his hand on his gun. I think that's quite unusual, to say the least.

[@aphextwin5712]

I’ve only been “pulled over” once while running alongside a street. They were apparently searching for a specific person and I fit a very general description (probably male and about my age). I was asked to empty my pockets, they radioed in my details and quickly realised that I didn’t actually fit description after they had a better look at me.

[@Bunny99s]

Unusual? No. At a usual traffic stop there are usually two cops, one on the drivers side and one on the passenger side. The one on the passenger side is usually securing and usually always has his hand on the gun with the holster being open. They usually are quite relax but they have to be prepared. The cop doing the stop of course usually does not have his hand on the gun. Though we don't know the exact situation. Since they got outside the car and the cops searched the car, it'a not clear which role which cop had. Search for "Eigensicherung bei Kontrollen" or "Keine Kompromisse mehr bei Polizei-Kontrollen". It's essentially an order for the whole of germany (since about 2001) that even at trivial stops the cops should have one hand on the gun. I have my drivers license for "just" over 20 years now and I barely got into any traffic stops (back then I also lived close to Munich / Erding). Though before driving a car I had a "Mofa" (since 1999 I think). How the cops react most likely depends on the situation. With more than one person involved the situation can get confusing. When you're alone in the car and don't look or act suspicious they are probably more relax. Anyways, it's totally normal that they have a hand on the gun for protection.

[@vtxgenie1]

Glad to hear this isn't normal. In the US my friends and I were once chased and stopped by an officer we didn't see while we were playing in the forest. He then had a hand on his gun while accusing us (a group of 10 year old kids) of hiding drugs and alcohol. Thankfully he "let us" leave, but that's only the first of many such instances in places I've been, and something I'm hoping to leave behind with the US.

[@rolfgarske8174]

I can remember one instance in the late 7ties or early 8ties where I was stopped in a road checking and asked for my driver’s license and the Zulassung (permit). The last thing was at that time in DIN A5 format and to bulky for the pockets of my jacket. So I was keeping it in my cars glove box. When I reached with my right hand for the glove box, one of the policemen raised his machine gun, unlocked it and pointed it at me. I explained to to policeman that had asked me for the permit that if he really wanted to see it I had to open the glove box, because the document he was asking for was in there. He allowed me to proceed, which I did slowly and carefully. After he had checked my documents and found nothing wrong I asked him why they were so nervous. And he replied: Bader Meinhof. Bader Meinhof was a terrorist gang in Germany, that was well known and feared. They had been known for taking hostages and or killing of some famous people. That explained everything.

[@asgardiner]

I have to agree wholeheartedly with this comment! In Europe and in Germany in particular, if you are pulled over, it is customary and polite to get out of your car. It's happened to me more than once and NEVER have I seen a cop reach to touch his gun! CONVERSELY ... I have heard on many occasions of Europeans being stopped by traffic-cops in the USA and getting out of their car, ONLY for the cop to not just touch his gun, but pull it out of his holster and threaten the driver! Europeans almost NEVER carry guns in public and indeed getting a gun-license is a difficult and lengthy procedure!

[@gerardosalazar161]

In Europe police officers are citizens trained to serve and protect the people, never forgetting that everyone deserves respect whereas in America many are ex military that see civilians as the enemy and act accordingly, with violence, intimidation and a very aggressive attitude.

[@bavariancarenthusiast2722]

This encounter you describe was really weird, it only can be explained that they were searching for somebody which could have matched your profile (Car, Mike, you, couple) the call it "Rasterfahndung". The Bundespolizei is not stopping anybody for just speeding or for the fun of it. And if you are friendly to them - they are also always (my experience with normal police) to you. They were searching for something serious.

[@HayleyAlexis]

I am assuming it was because they were a) looking for drugs or b) looking for suspects and we fit the description: couple in a black suv.... BUT nonetheless it was a very weird encounter.

[@altblechasyl_cs2093]

Cops in the US call you at the first step Sir or Mam. 😉

[@demadhatta]

I had 2 experiences with German police back. Drain the World Cup in 2006 I was trying to find downtown Frankfurt and I keep missing the exit. So I went back to the airport and so a police officer. And I told him my situation and he started to give me directions. Then he stopped then he said. Follow him and he actually led me to downtown near the bonhoff. I was so happy. I almost hugged him because in America. A police would have given you a wrong direction and send you on your merrily way. To get even more lost period my second encounter It's in K town. I drove over a medium, and the siren came on from nowhere, and they gave me a brethealizer test. I was drinking however I was below the limit.And they sent me on my merrily way period

[@HayleyAlexis]

I have had some generally positive experiences with cops in the USA. I think one that I remember vividly was one time my friends and I were at a bar and one of the girls was extremely drunk and the cop saw us trying to get her to the car and he helped us get us across the street, helped us lift her into the car (we were driving a big truck at the time) and gave her a bottle of water. We could have had a different outcome if he wanted to be an ass but he went above and beyond to help us... Which he honestly did not have to do.

[@jessicaely2521]

You can't say police would give you wrong directions and send you on your way. My friend and I were lost down in South Florida. We stopped by an officer, and he had us follow him (it was my boyfriend driving). One time in a restaurant, my brother said the wrong thing to a patron. The patron was either drunk or high on drugs. This patron wanted to go out to the parking lot (this means get into a fist fight). There were 4 officers sitting behind us. My brother, my husband, my brother friend, and I whispered we won't leave until the police leave. About 45 minutes later, the officers got up and came to our table saying if you want us to walk you out, you need to go now. In the end the police were waiting for us to leave and we were waiting for them to leave. The police didn't have to walk us out to our car and watch us leave, but they did. Another time I was arguing with my friend over driving home. I was to drunk to drive home and she was also to drunk to drive home. An officer saw my friend and I arguing over not driving. She thought she was fine to drive her car home. The officer stepped in and gave my friend a field sobriety test. She was drunk off her ass and my friend saw that. We called my brother to pick us up. The officer didn't have to do this. He could have nailed her for a DUI. She wouldn't have made it out of the parking spot. At my house we were having a fraternity and sorority party. There was definitely under age drinking. An officer came to tell us to wrap up the party. He also said under age drinkers better not be leaving the property. The officer could have waited off of our property and nailed people for underage drinking. He could have also nailed me for supplying alcohol to a minor (meaning under 21). This would be a $5,000 fine and 5 years of probation for me. This could have ruined my life if the officer chose to be an asshole.

[@altblechasyl_cs2093]

Story from the Paulaner Garten. 🤦‍♂️

[@vtxgenie1]

​@@jessicaely2521one of my family members did have the bad end of that kind of leaving the bar story, ended with a dui, permanently confiscated car, plus around $10k in fines, so roughly $25k total and she was maybe 22 at the time. She never recovered from that, they could have just taken her keys, but they waited, and there are many programs like that instead of just funding taxis for late nights and or drinking. I hate drunk driving, but having bars we drive to shouldn't be a trap that ruins lives either.

[@tic-tacdrin-drinn1505]

​@@jessicaely2521 I find it so strange that it is considered normal for Americans to drink to the point of drunkenness.

[@aphextwin5712]

By some counts there almost 18’000 police agencies in the U.S., city, county, state, federal. In Germany, you have basically 18 agencies, 16 state police forces, one for each ‘state’ (Bundesland) and two federal, Federal Police and the Federal Criminal Police Office. Depending on how you count things, you might add the German Parliament Police and the Federal Customs Service to that. What this means is that you have only about 20 ‘police academies’ and ‘heads of police’, which enables a much more even standard of training, procedures and oversight. Germany also has Municipal Code Enforcement Services belonging to the municipalities (there are differences between states) that however mainly just enforce local codes and only hand out fines. In some states these services look more like police and might be allowed to search people or deal with unruly citizens.

[@BernieUndErt]

Qualified immunity is a magnet for idiots with a god complex. And the fact that you can be to smart, but not to dumb to become a cop in the US tells everything.

[@seelenwinter6662]

is this not a must in the US to be a cop...? dumb as fck and aggressive like hell...?

[@scarba]

By coincidence we were at an Agentur für Arbeit Berufsmesse today with my daughter who is in the 9th class. It is a job fair in English but it was about apprenticeships. We spoke to a policeman, ( lovely uniform), and I asked what characteristics do you need for the job and he said just a normal disposition, and he explained about the three year education and how you live at the training school and if you have bad luck you have to share a room. I found the customs officers job exciting as they search for illegal trafficking and I asked if they needed police back up and she proudly said nope we have our own guns. I find the police here professional and very approachable. I think it helps that there is an Ordnungsamt which does all the less serious crimes leaving the police to get on with other things. I can’t think of a translation for it in English, maybe you and Mike have a good equivalent you can think of?

[@alicemilne1444]

The official translation for Ordnungsamt is "municipal office for public order". It doesn't deal with crimes, but with minor offences against local regulations. In other countries it might be called the local authority or the city council, or the town hall, or similar. But the police do get called out to attend to minor offences as well. It's not just serious crimes.

[@scarba]

@@alicemilne1444like noisy neighbors

[@marylacken4016]

Deutsche haben ihren ersten Kontakt mit der Polizei schon im Kindergarten, den zweiten in der ersten Klasse. Dort kommt ein netter Polizist, erzählt den Kindern, wie sie sich im Straßenverkehr verhalten sollen und übt mit ihnen, wie man sicher eine Straße überquert. Im 4. Schuljahr macht er Radfahrerziehung und nimmt die Radfahrprüfung ab. So erfahren die Kinder einen Pollizisten zwar als Autorität, aber nicht als beängstigend.

[@MihcaelTube]

Kindergarten und Schule? Nicht bei mir. Aus welchem Bundesland kommt die Erfahrung mit der Polizei im Kindergarten?

[@sisuguillam5109]

​@@MihcaelTubeIn Fall der Kinder in meiner Familie: Hessen.

[@marylacken4016]

@@MihcaelTube In SH

[@axelurbanski2828]

In NDS ist heute auch ein Teil der Verkehrserziehung in den Händen spezieller Beamter. In meiner Region ist besonderer Beamter in Rente gegangen, der hatte dazu ein Puppentheather.

[@helgaioannidis9365]

​@@MihcaelTubeich stamme aus Bayern, da war das in meiner Kindheit in den 80ern auch Usus.

[@JMS-2111]

What are the other qualifications for enrolling into the police academy in Germany and US? In Slovenia we also have a requirement of a previous education of at least a finished middle school to enter the academy as any student would.

[@HayleyAlexis]

I think in Germany to get into an Ausbildung you have to finish "middle school" or their equivalent (maybe high school equivalent but they have a different system in Germany). In the USA you have to finish Highschool or the equivalent (GED). The other educational requirements are not that "strict" in my opinion

[@JMS-2111]

@@HayleyAlexis Thanks for the explanation. Still love the videos. 👍

[@danieldieste9905]

To being enrolling in the vocational training you need to have finished your 10th grade diploma (Realschulabschluss/ Mittleee Reife). There are all sorts of testing to actually be accepted.

[@callsigndd9ls897]

It is also possible with a primary school diploma and completed vocational training. The important thing is that you pass the entrance exam and the psychological tests. A cousin of mine only had a primary school diploma and vocational training as a tv technician. In his career with the police, he has now even made it to the highest rank of the middle service.

[@sarderim]

Servus Hayley, for me it kinda sounds like the encounter with the german police was more like the "Bundespolizei/Zoll". At Neuschwanstein it's close to the border and so it could be you got into a "Schleierfahndung". They're allowed to search your car, when ever they want. Because I'm pretty sure as soon as Mike opened his mouth and talked to them, they knew for sure he's not from Köln! I had good and bad times with german cops. And I had only two encounters with US-cops. Both of them have been very professional. Also I have to say both times I was lucky and I could play the german card. Once a Sheriff came to a bar because of two guys had some beef. And the second time a state trooper pulled me over for speeding. Luckily both have been in the army before they became law enforcement so both were stationed in germany and they loved it! 😂

[@sirephil5302]

exact. I bet is was Zoll.

[@BerndFunken]

A few years ago i read something interesting that describes the biggest difference between the American and the German Police: the whole German Police fires less bullets per year than the Police of Chicago fires in one day xD

[@c.b.4270]

Keep in mind that nearly no-one in Germany wears a gun.So probability of getting shoot as a cop is extremely low here in Germany. Otherwise Chicago is one of the roughest citys in USA.

[@gustavmeyrink_2.0]

Have you read one of my posts elsewhere? ;) Either way the statistics are freely available and German police fires on average 60-80 shots on people per year. In the USA that is the number of shots police fires on one suspect...may be two.

[@christianebank5098]

Hello from germany,.yes thats trug 😂

[@CornyCF]

@@c.b.4270 Germans have guns BUT they use it for sport or hunting. For self defense using a gun u need a good argument to get it. Hope y unterstund me

[@c.b.4270]

@@CornyCF Germany ca 6.5 Guns/ 100 Inhabitants USA 120/100 . Furthermore you have to pass hard ! test to get one and you have to profe a need ( Hunting,special Personel danger Situation). To give You an different example how strict germanrules are:Totale cost for car driving liscence on average 3 k €=$, over 700 Questions.But at least no speed Limit 🥰

[@lieselstrick]

My friend does an Ausbildung as a policewoman and the 5,5 months are just the first year of theory. During these 3 years you have block seminars. The sport aspect is important as well but theory and law are extremely important since these marks have a high value if you want to pass the year. And the times for the block seminars changes annually.

[@TheMightyFrog]

Endlich! I was so hoping for a video like this! Thank you!

[@HayleyAlexis]

I will make a follow up but I have to collect my thoughts

[@DerHoschi]

Ich war noch in der Probezeit und im ambulanten Dienst beschäftigt (bin immer noch bei derselben Firma), stehe im Dienstauto an einer Rechtsabbieger Ampel, aber natürlich muss man die Fußgänger abwarten und dachte ich wäre noch bei Gelb durchgerutscht. Natürlich habe das Polizeiauto direkt hinter mir nicht bemerkt... Kurz nach dem Abbiegen haben sie mich dann angehalten. "Sie wissen warum wir Sie angehalten haben?!" Natürlich wusste ich woraus er hinauswollte! Also. "Es war nicht nicht rot." Dann Führerschein und Fahrzeugschein... Er kommt zurück und sagt: "Sie sind ja noch in der Probezeit! Und offensichtlich beruflich auf Ihren Führerschein angewiesen." Ich habe mich darauf hin entschuldigt und versichert das ich nicht bewusst über Rot fahren wollte. Dann ist er wieder zu seiner Kollegin, die haben geredet und er kommt zurück und sagt: "Sie waren nicht angeschnallt!" Das stimmte nicht und ich habe einen Moment gebraucht um das einzuordnen. Ich wollte gerade klarstellen das ich angeschnallt war, da fällt er mir ins Wort und sagt sehr deutlich: "Wären Sie der Zahlung von €35 für Nichtanschnallen einverstanden?" Und da hat es Klick gemacht. Nochmals Danke an diesen Polizisten! Und was er am Schluss gesagt hat werde ich nie vergessen: "Eine Ampelphase sollte keinen den Führerschein kosten. Einfach die nächste abwarten!" Da tue ich seitdem...

[@nitwit999]

6:51 Students in the US have to pay for their police training. In Germany and The Netherlands police students get paid during their training!

[@rosemariebrown2413]

and at least 3 years of police school !

[@van03de]

I couldn't agree more! Let me support your findings: (1) In most German states police officers need to graduate from police college and receive a bachelor's degree. (Btw, police students are public servants, don't pay a tuition fee, but get a salary.) (2) In Germany, you need a reason (such as hunting) and a license to own a gun and another license (e.g. for body guards) to carry a gun. Police pulling you over are not in constant fear of being shot. On the other hand, people carrying a gun are most likely criminals and can get arrested before they commit any other crime like robbery etc. (3) Police in Germany can engage in random identity checks. They are not required to have any suspicion of crime.

[@danieldieste9905]

I'll have to correct you on the education part: the regular beat cops do a three-year training. The detectives have a bachelor in poublic administration or other subjects.

[@van03de]

@danieldieste9905 It depends on the state, but I was wrong saying that "most" German states require a bachelor's degree. In six German states every new police officer gets a bachelor's degree. In nine other states police offers both, a 3 year training at police school and 3 year college studies. See Wikipedia: Polizeiausbildung in Deutschland.

[@Miaka1805]

Your hair grew so much Hailey, you look so adorable. Seems like it has been some time, since I watched a newer vid of yours. Luv you!

[@HayleyAlexis]

It has been a few months since I have gotten into an upload schedule. I have been posting random videos every now and then on my channel but nothing consistent for a few months :) hello hello and welcome back!!

[@jasminsafari1915]

Same thing happened to us (I am German, boyfried was American,) we drove a rental car with Hamburg license plates to Dresden and back to Stuttgart. They had a huge parking place with spot lights, full of small tents. In every tent they looked at a pulled over car, searching for drugs, asking specific questions. Hands always on the weapon.)

[@HayleyAlexis]

A lot of people don’t believe the story but it has happened to other people 😩🫣 it’s not that common but it does happen

[@johanneshalberstadt3663]

Well, I think they were looking for some criminals with a Kölner Kennzeichen and since it was during Corona and traveling was limited, there probably weren't many around from Köln.

[@imzadi76.2]

I live at the border to The Netherlands and Belgium. You see regular cars pulled over at certain points that don't have regional license plates. Of course it is because of drug searches.

[@michaausleipzig]

I had a similar experience during Corona. I have a car with an L for Leipzig but at the time I lived in Rostock and onw day just like you I wanted to get out a little and went to Lübeck. On my way back I was stopped but immediately figured why so I just told them right away that I was living in Rostock now, backed it up with my ID and that was it. Thankfully they didn't searchmy car like they did yours. I just think they were bored. Corona was a quiet time (except for the protests) and they were like "damn now that we pulled them over we need to find something to justify it".

[@HayleyAlexis]

Yes... We could tell they were perplexed because they really thought they "caught" someone doing something bad or illegal... but when Mike explained the situation they just couldn't let it go. Maybe they were teaching the other officers with them but nonetheless it was an interesting experience

[@wanneske1969]

Another difference might be that cops in Germany don't expect civilians to carry guns ...

[@proislam-co6pg]

And a big and increasing percentage of people in germany is not prosecuted at all.

[@AntonioBarsanio]

That is true and the size of country makes a difference, and in Germany they don't have drug problems as big as in the US. It must be easier to manage a smaller country as opposed to the US.

[@MISSYGful]

770hrs what the... That's insane. AND they carry weapons!! Sorry Disneyland I'm never going to Florida.

[@HayleyAlexis]

I was actually shocked by this number as well... I honestly thought it was a lot more but it is not. Also when you look at the schedule it isn't even a "full time" program. The program days are sprinkled throughout the week and it just doesn't seem "too serious" in my opinion when you are comparing it to Germany.

[@altblechasyl_cs2093]

Yes, in FL 90% of all inhabitants can carry guns because of CC and nothing happened everywhere with them. So better you stay home or go to Disney Paris, very safe place instead, ask the people visiting the Bataclan club. 😂 Germans so stupid most of the time, its a wonder they do not falling on her face every minute.

[@AnonymousG3R]

I see the huge different between Cops in the USA and in Europe in general are the training (Ausbildungszeit). In the US 14-16 WEEKS and in Germany or in Europe 2,5 and 3,5 years. In your case this was targeting and profiling what isn´t allowed even during the pandemic. They pulled you over for a normal traffic check. That´s OK. They want to see Mikes and your paper. Fine. They want to check the first aid kit. Also fine. Did they have the right to search your whole car? Definitely NOT! Only, and this is the only exception, if you are a kind of suspect in a heavy criminal case. But then they had to declare your rights.

[@Alias_Anybody]

A lot of cops seem to think that if they suspect or accuse you with enough confidence you somehow become guilty. There's nothing more satisfying than them doing every check, test and search in the book and finding absolutely zero of anything, because your only crime in life was being a boring person. No matter how confident, being able to use a radar pistol doesn't make one a detective and they should just chill. I prefer the lazy over the narcissistic ones.

[@HayleyAlexis]

hahahaha well is that an insult? AM I BORING 😂🤣😆😂🤣😆😂🤣😆

[@Alias_Anybody]

@@HayleyAlexis Hey, I was talking generally. 😂

[@HayleyAlexis]

@@Alias_Anybody 🧐 I am keeping my eye on you!

[@michaelschuckart2217]

Some years ago I had a rather funny experience not with the police but with customs officers. We were on our way to an event offered by a shop, that delivered most of our professional material. The first unsusual thing was, that the event was at an Autobahn Service station, in a private room of the restaurant, about 200 km from our home. When we left the autobahn and entered the area of the service station, there was a checking station of customs officers. By our licence plate could be easily seen where we came from, and this Autobahn goes towards Konstanz and the swiss border. The officer asked us where we wanted to go and I answered "right here". The officer: "No, I mean your destination". It was not so easy, to explain to him, that someones actual destination was a service station in the middle of nowhere, but he finally believed us without searching our car for cash (to be smuggled into Switzerland for tax reasons).

[@hueyiroquois3839]

My high school German teacher told us that traveling internationally in Europe is simpler than what you described.

[@biloaffe]

Ein tolles Video👍

[@HelgaJanso-mt1ex]

What I find weird is that cops in the USA calling others dude or bro. That is not right, that is ghetto slang.

[@stephantrzonnek1720]

Once, I was pulled over in NV because I made a U-turn where a sign clearly prohibited it. The cop asked for my license and explained why he pulled me over. I apologized, saying I just missed the sign. He gave me a verbal warning. It was a nice encounter. Nothing to complain 🙂

[@MartinAmbrosiusHackl]

As far as I know, police is not allowedvtolie even to a murder suspect, in Germany.

[@gordonwallin2368]

I don't feel safe in the US anymore, and I've been taking cars and motorcycles down to the US since 1967. Now it doesn't feel as welcoming as before. "Cute Cars?" yeah, sure. American cops usually note the out of state plates-and my age, and don't want any hassels or exta paperwork, but I still done't feel as comfortable as before. American cops doen't have a good image up here. Good Video, Hayley. Cheers from the Pacific West Coast of Canada.

[@bryonyvaughn2427]

Since you modeled giving your "unwanted opinion," I'll follow suit. ;-) Your hair, your glasses (and the black that pulls it all together)... Super cute! 😀

[@HayleyAlexis]

Thank you! I am trying to let it grow back and not shave it again! The urge is very strong though :p

[@rairei]

German police is doing their job but/and their slogan is ' your friend and helping person' As well the first thing coming up in my mind is that in Germany 95% of their job they don't have to fear facing a firearm though for the rest they're trained to be careful due to criminals. The pulled over in Germany: It was Corona virus and one job was to controll the restrictions not to travel. The experience they took so much time for it could have been that they have been bored. My first idea was Bavarian police but as pointed out in another comment: Federal police. and haha... they didn't found the millions you smuggled to Switzerland ????? Great thumbnail (very strict face) ... combined with the title I knew it will be a successor :-)

[@NoNoTheGreenOne]

Wow, I love your style here. ❤

[@HayleyAlexis]

Thank you! 😊

[@zorrothebug]

You really had a very weird encounter with the German police. Even though this was at the time where it was the "Lockdown" and you were not allowed to travel (more than x km from home) the police has no right to search your car. Only if they have a warrant or when they have a reasonable suspicion of you committing a crime. So you could have asked if they have a warrant or what reasonable suspicion would justify to search the car. They did not provide that, they did an unlawful search. Still you should let them do the search but give to protocol that to you the measure seems unlawful, you do not agree with it but you will not hinder them for not getting the accusation of hindering the police in action.

[@HayleyAlexis]

Yeah but MIke and I are not really people to argue too much. I think it is similar to my issue that happened in Florida ... I didnt have enough energy to argue or prove a point. I think it was also a grey area due to corona so we just had no interest in trying to make ourselves right.

[@grmpflz]

@zoorothebug Sorry, you are wrong. Since opening the European borders, the German Police Law (Polizeiaufgabengesetz) has a part, that allows the police to search people and cars for minor indications. It is called "Schleierfahndung" - "Der Begriff Schleierfahndung steht umgangssprachlich für verdachts- und anlassunabhängige Personenkontrollen durch Polizeibeamte, die seit 1995 offiziell zulässig und rechtmäßig sind. Zur Überprüfung einer Person reicht ein so genannter „Verdachtschleier“ aus - d. h. der kleinste potenzielle Hinweis, dass sie verdächtig sein könnte. Die Polizei hat die Befugnis, jeden Bürger auf der Straße anzuhalten, dessen Ausweis zu verlangen und beispielsweise nach Waffen zu durchsuchen." - During Corona, you only were allowed to drive a specific maximum distance from the place you live. So when you drive a car in Bavaria, that has a plate of Cologne, you are suspect, because you possibly broke that rule.

[@escariol]

@@grmpflz Durchsuchung der Person, mitgeführter Sachen oder sogar des Fahrzeuges ist nur in bestimmten Bundesländern erlaubt! In BW z.B. ausschließlich die Identitätsfeststellung, in Bayern geht es etwas weiter. Da ist die Durchsuchung der Person und mitgeführter Sachen erlaubt, aber das Auto soweit zu untersuchen das sogar der Spritzwasserbehälter inspiziert wird ist nicht legitim aber die machen halt was sie wollen, wenn denen ihre Macht zu Kopf steigt. Deshalb sollte man auchbei uns die Polizei immer filmen dürfen sobald diese mit einem in Kontakt tritt Aber da haben sie ja offensichtlich was dagegen, ebenso wie sich an die Regeln halten, wie in diesem Fall.

[@gilde915]

Hatte nie nen schlechtes Erlebnis ganz im Gegenteil einmal im Lock down bin ich angehalten worden nachts...habe gefragt ob sie meinen Passierschein A38 sehen wollen...die haben nur gelacht und mir gesagt, fahren se weiter:)

[@HayleyAlexis]

😂😂😂 someone has a sense of humor

[@AVKnecht]

Immer Sie mit Ihrer Galeere. Hafenkommandatur, hab ich doch schon gesagt!

[@gilde915]

@@AVKnecht Das Rundschreiben B65 das auf den neuen Passierschein A39 hinweist.....einer der besten Asterix Filme...

[@jeromemckenna7102]

When I was younger the cops could be annoying, I worked for the US Census Bureau from 1977-1981, and I was often reported to the police by the locals. Most cops were excellent but I still remember the jerks. In the US cops want to make an arrest rather than solve a problem. I mostly worked evenings and Saturdays since most people work during the week. One time I stopped at an older woman's house on a Saturday afternoon and made an appointment for later in the week. She told her brother and that brother said that nobody in government works weekends and suggested that she call the cops. The local cops rather than calling my office in NYC (which was on the letter we sent people), decided to hide in the woman's house and listen to my interview. After the interview they grilled me for about half and hour or so. They ruined the interview and they wasted a lot of my time.

[@teddydavis2339]

Hayley, it sounds like Germany is a better place for you. You seem to really love Germany. It seems like police in the West are generally suspicious. The US cops really need more training. They need a psychological evaluation before becoming a cop and they should have to be able to physical training. That would eliminate so many shootings. I never insult a cop if I am stopped.

[@vtxgenie1]

They (and US military) need monthly psychological tests. One of the problems is that psychological and physical problems can develop over time, especially if traumatic events actually do happen, and there's no requirement to quit if someone should no longer be in the position, support if they do quit, or even to be evaluated.

[@nancyrafnson4780]

Canadian Police are nothing like US Police. They receive far better training for one thing. We are not afraid of our police here.

[@wolfgangbackes7123]

I had only 5 or 6 contacts with German police. Even when I was wrong, they were very polite and friendly. When I asked for help, they were extremely helpful and sometimes offered help without being asked for. I don't know if it was pure luck, but I've only had the very best experiences with German police officers all my life. To be fair, however, my only experience with a US police officer was also very positive. He refrained from penalising me even though I was speeding.

[@Melisendre]

In almost 40years of owning a drivers licence in germany I was never pulled over by the police like many other germans.

[@gamingsuperhero2437]

In Germany, the police typically require a judicial order, known as a “Richterlicher Beschluss,” to search a private vehicle.

[@HayleyAlexis]

After reading the comments.... supposedly Bayern is unique and they allow for searches based on suspicion.

[@MrKirchhauser]

Nope. They typically ask you if they can search the car and if you agree they will do so. If you don‘t agree they will need a warrant to search your car. If they have probable cause and cannot reach a judge they can themselves decide to search the car. During which hours you cannot reach a judge differs from Bundesland to Bundesland. They also have to give you a reason why they are searching your car. Customs officers on the other hand can search your car whenever they want (in proximity to a border). And one thing that is really different and always irritates me on US TV shows is lying to a suspect. In Germany you cannot lie to a suspect. It’s a forbidden interrogation technique. If you get answers because you lied they cannot be used in court. The suspect on the other hand may lie all he wants to. (No “lying to a federal agent is a crime”.)

[@MydieLy]

It really does sound like a "Fahndung" because of the travel restrictions. They saw a Köln licence plate in Bavaria and thought you must have some serious reason to travel this far in lockdown times. Which either means emergency or something shady^^

[@hueyiroquois3839]

9:35 There are plenty of those incidents, but there are also cases like the recent Okaloosa County shooting.

[@martinhuhn7813]

Some cultural differences show up most clearly in the interaction with cops. I can´t compare german and US-cops, but I have my experiances with german vs. norwegian police. Sleeping in my car somewhere in nature in Germany: More than once police showed up the very first day, checked all my paperwork, made an efford to appear very busy and professional, polite but distant behaviour, what they generally communicated: We check, if you are a bad guy. At the end, they leave without any consequences. Why did they show up: either because of a general controll, or a local informed them, that they thought that car was somehow suspicious. Norwegian cops: Show up after I stand at a nice place for over a week. The reason is always the same: "Someone regularly passes her and saw you several times. Then your car was still there, but they did not spot you. Are you okay? Great. You want to stay longer? Okay, that´s fine. Are you fishing? Good. Do you catch enough fish? And in one case: Okay, have a nice day, I am going to wait for my college now, who already went for a walk in nature to look for you there. Controll: none. Okay, that happened 3 times to me in Norway. I also got into a general traffic controll once, where they asked for my licence and checked my lights - everything in a very relaxed atmosphere. The idea rather seemed to be: We are making sure, that you are secure, vs. "our job is to find something we can blame you for. Interestingly that different attitude is also reflected in the Norwegian vs. German "wear your seatbelt"-camaigns. The german variant: Image of distressed people, massage: You die and everything will be bad, if you don´t wear your seatbelt. Not untrue, but the norwegian campaign works different: It shows a driver, who is hugged by a loved one from behind, the hugging arm transitions into a seatbelt. I never cared to translate the text, but I bet, it was about love and care and not about death and dispair.

[@clivewilliams3661]

Hayley, I am surprised at your experience of Bavarian Police and can only think that all the conditions that presented themselves screamed 'drug/contraband dealer' at the officers. My only direct contact experience with the German police was when visiting my Aunt and Uncle in Hagen. They lived in a near city centre apartment with very congested on-street (and partially on the pavement!) parking that was made worse for visitors by the street parking requiring a residents permit although limited visitor parking was allowed. On returning from a day trip we couldn't find any parking withing 1/2mile radius of the apartment so in desperation and cheek, my Uncle and I walked up to the police station a few yards up the road and respectfully enquired what we could do. The desk sergeant (or equivalent) simply replied that we could park our British car in their yard until later in the day when the parking eased. When we collected the car there was a good deal of gratitude on our part and a case of beer for the lads in the station! I must say that the German police have a very serious attitude and you would not want to abuse them in any way but it seemed to us that it was tinged with a great deal of fairness that commands well deserved respect. BTW I overstayed the permitted time on the on-street parking after that and got a ticket that I ignored and returned to the UK. The authorities have never pursued me for it although there have been many instances of cross border fines but dare I go back and risk incarceration??

[@HayleyAlexis]

I agree 100% that German cops can have an "attitude" (I mentioned that in the video) which in my opinion is very similar to that of the cops in the USA but like you stated the main difference is that they are relatively fair!! Your story is a sweet one :)

[@clivewilliams3661]

@@HayleyAlexis I didn't mean that the German cops have an 'attitude' in the normal colloquial sense and maybe I should have said 'serious demeanour'. If you have to deal with them on official business they are not receptive to jokes or verbal abuse.

[@danieldieste9905]

About your overstay: No incarceration, just an old fashioned fine. Provided someone did record that and issued a filing.

[@clivewilliams3661]

@@danieldieste9905 One of the reasons that I was in Germany at that point was to buy another car and the one in question was on export plates so that the authorities had direct knowledge of who owned the car by virtue of its registration, without interrogating UK DVLA, so after this time I doubt they will pursue it.

[@sarumanork-orphanage5612]

They always rest the hands on the guns, I think it gives them a sense of security. When I trained martial arts, at some point I saw my master used to rest his hands on his belt, and when I tried that, I realized it gave me a lot of confidence, as the belt was a symbol of the path behind me, of my experience and skill. It felt right.

[@okiul]

I drove long time ago on I80 between Reno and San Francisco, I saw a fire in the woods and I wanted to report it to 911. Someone from the highway patrol answered me and they asked me to give them the location, I answered with the I 80, mile and direction/which side of the highway were the fire. The weren't OK with that and repeated again and again: Where are you! I ask her to tell me what info want exactly from me because I am a foreigner and I do not know exactly how to report an incident in the US. The answer I perceived as very rude: "If you are not from US that doesn't mean you cannot read or spell." I was really shocked. After a while I told that I was in the parking lot of a Mc Donald's restaurant and the town was xxxx. I realized that they wanted not to know where that fire was but the place where I really was in that moment. They transferred my call to the fire department and it was a huge difference between Police and Firemen. The fireman are better trained and they impressed me a lot. The knew how to communicate exactly what they want but very friendly and concise.

[@steeniversen6768]

Well done!

[@thorstenfautz4611]

A Ticket....yeah! In Germany we get a Ticket and a Picture! We have this Maschines called -Blitzer-!! Today it is real expensive, if you are speeding!

[@Aure_1007]

It was a hot summer day in 2008 - I was 19. I was living in the US as an exchange volunteer to work for a senior center. I was on my way to a concert in downtown Philadelphia. I was walking at a steady pace towards the bus station. There were not many people around. I noticed a police car coming down the wrong way on a one-way-street towards me. It stopped. A policeofficer opened the drivers door and pulled out a gun and yelled at me to raise my hands while pointing the gun at me. I was so afraid. This was the first time I ever felt in mortal danger. I was just walking down a street. He searched me. Ask me a bunch of questions. And eventually left me alone when I told him I was a volunteer at a nearby church. He said he knew that church. Nothing like that ever happened to me in germany.

[@lanamack1558]

I've had much the same experience as you many, many years ago. Later on in the news i heard that they had looked for an RAF terrorist

You have such a beautiful soft voice ❤

[@HayleyAlexis]

Thank you so much 🙂

[@ukwerna]

Same happened to me when I moved from Austria to Munich for a while, but with an English car and registration. Seems the registration plate matters to them a lot.

[@markalexander71332]

Yippee. A dashcam .😊

[@anonymusum]

I think one of the main differences in behavior is caused by the gun restrictions in Germany. I can imagine what that means for American cops.

[@geraldmenclik1145]

and afaik in Germany (here in Austria too) there is never a cop alone in one car, they are always two minimum

[@HayleyAlexis]

very true!

[@hohernorden1043]

There are no more customs controls within the EU, but certain border sections that are used for drugs or other things. is a random examination. You were on the East Europe route, where you try to introduce everything that is forbidden, so these random controls (police/customs) at a certain suspicion, the customs makes it (have more rights) The license plate is probably the reason, your overrun (too close to one of these sections). The same is available for the Netherlands (drugs) or Poland (inferior cigarettes or dangerous fireworks) in these areas there are also camouflaged vehicles (civil). You have only come into one of these controls by chance.

[@kopfkino317]

Lol bavarian cops are the worst, meanest and grumpiest of all in germany 😂 I was once an eyewitness to a pretty bad car accident in the alps region. I did what we, as good german citizens must do, called the police and waited for them. As soon as they arrived i got angepöbelt why im standing around and apparently starred at the scene. That it was against the law to be a Gaffer. I was like: "exchuse me but i was the one who called you and i know that leaving the scene of an accident as an eyewitness is against the law and will be fined." He was just like: "oh... ok then. I need your contact details as well..." Then he left me standing there for another hour before he took my details. They are just a**holes in bavaria... 😑

[@felimuller909]

you didn't mention the year... in january 2022 there was a double police murder during a traffic control (near Kusel) so I imagine since then police are reminded to be especially careful when approaching cars. allerdings keine entschuldigung, dass man so unfreundlich ist!

[@HayleyAlexis]

I actually looked it up and it was before the shooting of the two police officers (about 3 weeks beforehand).

[@slappedhappy9549]

I also believe they checked you for drugs! Especially during Coronavirus-Times police got very sensitive about order!A special situation for everyone of us then! 💝

[@thorstenguenther]

Bavarian cops AFAIK are often considered overly zealous by German standards. One example being a friend of mine who was into archery (former "Pfadfinder" = boyscout) drove to a friend's place in Bavaria but arrived there at 3 am and chose to sleep in his car instead of waking up said friend, his longbow lying along the co-driver's seat. He was woken by cops with their guns pulled aiming at him for he was reported as a foreign (i.e. northern German) car driver aiming a gun (the longbow) at a house. Instead of just shining a flashlight into his car first and finding out the facts, they made a hell of a fuzz and searched my friend's baggage to find anything they could then pin on him (they even tried the trick claiming the longbow being a weapon - it is not, according to German law the arrow tips are the weapons), and of course in their desperation they checked his first-aid kit (funnily my friend even had a defibrillator in his car).

[@hellkitty6663]

At two occasions I called the cops. A car hit my car and drove off. I called them for help. One officer did the paperwork while the other one watched me the whole time with her hand on the gun. Very disturbing. The other time we reported a bike theft. Two officers plus an teenage intern showed up. No hands on guns, joking around, nice small talk. It can be very different.

[@arnodobler1096]

There have also been cases in Germany of police officers being shot during a check.

[@tillposer]

3:15 Tail end of the Corona crisis makes this 2022, probably summer. This is Bavaria. The 2022 G7 Summit was in summer 2022 at Krün, Schloss Elmau. Both are south, southwest for Schloss Neuschwanstein, of Munich. Both castles are roughly 50 km apart, 80 by road. That seems the probable explanation. The Bavarian police was reported to be rightout nervous, given the Hamburg summit fun and games.

[@ef9033]

When did This Encounter happend ? Was it during the COVID time. I remember there where restriction on there you can Go Back then. You Had to stay Close to your please of living, and having a köln Plate might Create the thought Off a Long distance travel.

[@HayleyAlexis]

Yeah it was during Covid 😷

[@rickbruceroche2038]

I spent 11 years in Germany and NEVER heard of any travel limits (other than Berlin as it was still E/W Germany.

[@HayleyAlexis]

During Covid there were travel restrictions in the whole country. You could only travel a particular distance from your home or you could get in trouble if caught.

[@nasowas9088]

This is Bavarian police. I have a friend who lives with her husband near Munich. She drives in a company's car with a license plate from Frankfurt and gets pulled over all the time. Her husband drives the private car with a Bavarian plate and hasn't been stopped once.

[@PhotogNT]

I googled law enforcement agencies in Harris County in Texas they listed 60 sworn law enforcement agencies in that one county alone that’s crazy. In Australia we have one law enforcement agency per state plus one federal agency.

[@lazyperfectionist1]

What do you make of _no-knock_ search warrants?

[@HayleyAlexis]

Not good... that is for sure

[@vtxgenie1]

Even search warrants with a knock are bad if that knock doesn't include a call and other notification efforts. For example if someone knocks at 2am most people will be asleep and disoriented, (and that's considering they can hear and see) and it cannot be said they were "notified" in that state.

[@lazyperfectionist1]

@@vtxgenie1 Oh, yeah. I mean, by and large, I would call myself a proponent of democracy, which means I believe in a system of government that derives its legitimacy from the informed consent of the governed, but I have lived in numerous situations in which I don't know any of my neighbors, so to what extent am I prepared to trust a city of total strangers? To what extent am I prepared to ask them to trust me? No-knock search warrants are _utterly_ without justification, and so are regular search warrants delivered in the wee hours of the morning, but I've found myself thinking I would support a regular search warrant delivered in the _afternoon._

[@JulianKirk87]

if cops in germany go so "hard" on you,they 1: looking for a reported car or license plate wich looks like yours (but they wont tell you that during their interview, for obvious reason) 2:youre on a smuggle route with all their checkboxes marked like type of passengers,car,license plate,time and day

[@Death0Row]

Acorn falls on police cruiser,cop goes balistic thinks he got shot and empty's his gun in the cruiser with a suspect inside😅muurica yall😅

[@HayleyAlexis]

I saw the video and I am sure the cop resigned and the man is suing the sh*t out of the police force (which basically means- suing the shit out of taxpayers) 😅

[@Death0Row]

@@HayleyAlexis in my country cops needs a 3 year bachelor education at the police academy before they can apply for the job.

[@yarsivad000.5]

There are 35,000 German Police. There are just under 1 million cops in America. America needs to build a lot of cop colleges. 😊 Google gave me the 35,000 but that’s federal police in total federal and state and everything there are 244,000 police total in Germany according to Copilot.

[@altblechasyl_cs2093]

35000 ? Berlin alone got 33000 of them. And every state in the US has minimum one police acadamy on state level not included these of the federal agencies and PDs and SDs of big cities and counties.

[@yarsivad000.5]

@@altblechasyl_cs2093 I amended the number of German police in total in my comment, but tell the lady in the video that USA police get a lot of schooling as well’ not just Germany.

[@Fabian-Wenzel]

That depends on where in Germany the police stop you. Bavaria and Baden-Württemberg have fairly strict police laws, while the situation is different in North Rhine-Westphalia or Lower Saxony or the other northern federal states. This north-south divide can also be observed in case law. The judges in Bavaria and Baden-Württemberg are tougher, while the judges in the north are more liberal. In the south, the maximum penalty is often imposed, while judges in the north tend to give low to medium sentences. This also applies to the case law of the social courts in the south, which often decide in favor of the job center, while in the north they often decide against the job center. People tend to be more conservative in the south than in the north. This is reflected above all in the voting behavior of people in Bavaria, because the CSU has been in power there for decades and the other parties are always behind the CSU. The CSU is the sister party of the CDU.

[@tommyt8998]

Sadly, in America, those police who are bullies are given a pass for their behaviors by municipal authorities. Watching police on KZbin has really opened my eyes to police misbehavior. People being slammed violently to the ground for minor non-violent questioning of police is much too common here in the States.

[@UsmanBello]

From now on, if you REALLY wanna mess with the heads of the Baierische Polizei, just rent a car! All cars from Europcar have plates from Hamburg (HH), Avis/Enterprise have plates from Wiesbaden (WI), and Sixt cars have plates from München. There! Problem solved! Side note: I rented a 2024 E-Class Mercedes a few months back to visit the Zürich Airport for sighseeing. When I exited the parking deck P2, I was surprised by a roadblock and checkpoint manned with Swiss Customs officers and Zürich Cantonal Police. Seeing that I was the truly odd-man out (Mercedes with HH German Plates, rental, Asian-looking guy driving on a US Army Europe Drivers License), I was naturally "Polizei Kontroll"ed. It did not take long to search an empty rental car, but telling them I actually lived near the Stuttgart Airport in Esslingen District (ES plates) really got them confused for a moment. 😆

[@MichaelBurggraf-gm8vl]

Hello Hayley, I'm assuming that you and Mike were traveling on the Autobahn A96 Munich - Lindau when you were making a day trip to Neuschwanstein. I'm often driving on the section of the A96 near Lindau on Lake Constance. I can't remember being stopped there but I see police patrols there quite often. There are many reasons for that. The A96 is the quickest way to get from Munich to Zurich in Switzerland by car. So federal police can be on customs patrol checking for drugs and undeclared money. Also there are many vans, lorries and semis going back and forth. Not everyone of them is being checked at the border between Bregenz/Austria and Lindau/Germany. Traffic police is busy too in that area. Chances of seeing really exclusive cars moving from Munich to Zurich and vice versa are high. Also you can see people thinking the Autobahn is a Formula 1 race track - which it isn't of course. Possibly some drivers coming from Switzerland feel liberated a bit too much when entering the German Autobahn due to speed being rigorously limited to 120 km/h in Switzerland (which could feel a bit weird sitting in a Ferrari, Lamborghini or Porsche). Even three decades ago the area in the triangle of Stuttgart, Zurich and Munich was known to be a kind of hub for distributing drugs (and gold and money related to drugs trade). The hand at the gun could be related to an incident a few years ago when a person being controlled managed to take away the gun from a holster of a police officer. However the weapon has to be in a safe state as long as it's in a holster. But like you said it might as well be just a peculiar habit of the officer without any deeper meaning. I was studying in Karlsruhe and for a few years on my way to the university campus I was passing by the top federal court of justice of Germany and the federal court of constitution of Germany. I had a few encounters with police officers with automatic weapons there - for riding with my bike on the sideway or for driving without light in the dark. Mind that there have been two incidents related to terrorism in Karlsruhe during the 1970ies - so those officers weren't there for protocolary service.

[@tiri6379]

In every country of our world you will find different types of police-officers. Those who are powertripping and those who really want to serve and protect... The better their training/education is, the better the overall interaction will be. So you'll be meeting an powertripping cop in Germany less often than in the US! ;-)

[@tomlobos2871]

bavarian cops can actually be uncomfortable when it comes to younger people from further away. could happen with a berlin licence plate as well. before weed got legalised in germany, bavaria had way stricter rules and payed attention on enforcing that. cologne region is known for being a hub to deliver what comes from netherlands sea harbours, at least from bavarian perspective. its deep coservativism around that and anyone who might be a hippie is suspicious, generally speaking. thats pretty much the frame young people are still seen in, especially by older officers.

[@Muck-qy2oo]

They are supposed to tell you why you are pulled over and they need to have a reason to do so. Just being suspicious because you are not going where they expect you to go is not a good reason. They can't search your car without a warrant either. Even Germany isn't Nazi Germany anymore. Shouldn't be.

[@CoL_Drake]

in my whole life in germany i never seen a cop with a hand on his gun or even on his holster ... stuff like that just doesnt happen so its rly strange

[@marc-julien6826]

Timestamp 3:59: There is of course (!) NO limitation in Germany (or any other European country I know of) on how far you are allowed to drive from your registered place of residence! Just think about it - this would be deeply, deeply dictatorial, I can only imagine North-Korea potentially being such a place (if you happen to have the privilege to own a car there…)

[@HayleyAlexis]

Actually, during Corona it was a rule in certain areas of Germany that you were not allowed to travel too far from your home base for "entertainment" purposes. You would get fined or other punishments if caught traveling far away from your home.

[@dergroewirsing2611]

Lots of racial profiling happening in bavaria. Happened to me too, the cops even approached me in english... even though I'm born and raised german :D

[@AFNacapella]

Momentchen mal, die Brille kenn ich doch. die seh ich jeden Tag!!! und die glossy als Sonnenbrille. dann hoff ich mal dass die mir auch so gut steht wie dir 8-) 🤓

[@wheezingjuice]

During the pandemic cops in central Europe went full totalitarian. The laws were totalitarian all of a sudden, basic civil rights thrown overboard in a heartbeat. Cops abused their newly given power a lot. I'm German living in Belgium regularly crossing several borders a day, including also to the Netherlands, Luxembourg. During corona this was NUTS, you felt like a criminal all the time. Why are you crossing a border? Why are you driving at night during curfew? You invented strategies to prevent cops from pulling you over (alternative license plates, using farm tracks at night, turning your headlights off temporarily, like a moonshiner in the backwoods 😅). I'm sure the cop behavior was pandemic behavior. They're usually meek clowns when civil rights are up and running, but quick to abuse power as soon as civil rights crumble.

[@kaya.ali.]

Last week I have pulled over by zivilstreife when riding bike and I had to ask if I could get out of the bike and take my AirPods off and put them in my pocket. I am used to us police wants to see hands all the time so I wanted to ask permission from the officer to put my pods to my pocket and he was literally surprised that I have asked his permission. They felt really sad that I was so scared and I was ready to get shot by them out of blue. they have talked to me in English and helped me to navigate to home since I was lost in an autobahn. As a civilian it’s totally a different experience with German police.

[@kissingen007]

The guiding principle of German police is to PREVENT or avoid crime. Therefore, de-escalation is an important aspect of their duties. In contrast, American cops are out there to »catch the bad guys«, which seems to go against the principle of presumption of innocence. Another point is the equipment, in particular their firearms: Several US police departments received (leftover) M16 military rifles. What can they do with this, except shooting at somebody? Certainly not de-escalate a tense situation.

[@hone-i1d]

Currently there are many YT videos about the abysmal state of some cities' police training. In order to achieve a ratio of 30% female officers, test standards have been lowered. Some cities have abolished physical training altogether because most of the female contenders fail those tests. As a consequence, in case of trouble the newly hired will probably pull the gun instantly.

[@Germanator]

Your encounter with the police during Corona is strange and this was in Bavaria in general a very tight situation where you can go and with whom. Way over the top. Even those 500€ fines for walking. I had 3 encounters with the US police and all had be neutral / positive (Didn't get shoot^^) First was on the Airport when I stopped in the US from Peru to Germany. I had some coca leaves with me, and the dog did smell something, the cop assumed I had food in there. Of course I had. He wished me a safe trip home. Second was at the Mexican - US border, when my friend and me wanted to go into the US. The border police was strong armed and every check asked for a permit. So we had to go to the border office, quite sticking out as two Germans. So we gave our ID, fingerprints and pictures. When my friend was a little slow with the fingers on the fingerprint system the cop asked if he did smoke some weed^^. At the end we filled a document and where free to go. Last was also on holiday in the US, my friend did speed with the rented car so he get pulled over. He had to show his ID and the cop just said watch your speed. Guess he has bigger issues then two tourists. In Germany I did get stopped a few times but no big deal. I have friends at the police and they are just humans and in general know the difference between regular people and troublemakers. Not be aggressive, be polite, not overly friendly or unfriendly and you are in general fine. Depending your tone you can always talk what is going on, why they are doing this and that. When you get loud, start to move suddenly or even aggressive then they will react. My experience with police in general over the world.

[@deckard6869]

If someone would be stopped by police in germany and the first thing he does is calling them pigs and worse he would be in trouble. Its actually illegal to insult a police officer or another employee of the state so it could get very expensive for you to do so. But she is right, there seems to be more mutual respect in germany between cops and ppl

[@ytgray]

It's illegal to insult anyone period. No, there is no special 'Beamtenbeleidigung' (insult to officers), that is an urban myth. It is, however, a law that is to the best of my knowledge mostly enforced when the offended person is a police officer, so I understand where the opinion comes from.