Gospel Reliability: Secret Proofs in Jesus' Trial

I'm continuing my series on undesigned coincidences. Here, I explore a coincidence that involves both Luke and John. Why does Pilate specifically say "I find no fault in this man" in Luke's Gospel after asking him if he claimed to be the king of the Jews, and Jesus admitting as much. In order to find out, we have to read John's Gospel. But when we read John, it's very clear he's not trying to deliberately fill out Luke's story.
Are you a Christian struggling with doubts? Get 1-on-1 counseling at talkaboutdoubts.com
Help support me: / isjesusalive or paypal.me/isjesusalive for a one-time gift
Amazon wish list: www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls...
Join this channel to get access to perks:
/ @testifyapologetics
Visit my blog: isjesusalive.com

[@Datroflshopper]

Always worth noting that Luke is essentially a guy going around interviewing eyewitnesses - it makes a lot of sense that a random person who observed the trial but maybe wasn't that close to Jesus would remember a basic outline of "Pilate asked him if he was king of the Jews, Jesus was all 'if you say so' and then Pilate tried to throw out the case" versus John who was close to Jesus and would've remembered the hearing in greater detail.

[@jasonplayz6861]

Yea and luke got alout of his gospel from paul so maybe

[@user-hv2ru2mq5u]

@@jasonplayz6861 Matthew and Luke are believed by some scholars as based on Mark. Mark is allegedly the first to have been written. John's gospel is not believed to be based on Mark.

[@user-hv2ru2mq5u]

@@derekardito2032 Why would the gospels have to be signed to be authentic writings of the persons who wrote them? Suppose they were signed, Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John. There were, no doubt, many men by those names at that time. Not worth the paper they were written on? Well, for one thing, the gospels were passed orally before and after the four Gospel writers put them to paper.

[@jerrybessetteDIY]

That's nonsense. There are loads of proof even from his enemies.@@derekardito2032

[@harmony2369]

@@derekardito2032 Jesus very much existed, Pretty sure most athiests agree that the man existed.... Idk what you're saying, there is proof of his existance

[@10hawell]

Pontius Pilate was cool he was like "do you claim throne of Rome or incite armed rebellion?" Jesus said no, and Pontius said "why you guys want me to kill him again?"

[@michaellovinon3467]

Man must've been so confused

[@piotrplewa1889]

This is why 109

[@rafaelacosta5724]

Yeah.. but he was a coward that prefered democracy over justice.

[@andrewpatton5114]

@@rafaelacosta5724 Not so much democracy as a way to get himself out of a jam: Jerusalem was packed with pilgrims for Passover, who would be easily able to whip up into a religious frenzy considering they're already celebrating a festival about being liberated from their enemies. Pilate didn't have the resources to suppress a full-scale insurrection at Passover, and he was already on thin ice with Rome due to his reputation for provoking the Jews and his mentor recently having been executed for treason. Then, he hears and believes reports about Jesus being the Son of YHWH. Recognizing Jesus as at least a demigod, Pilate knows that Jesus could kill him easily if He were so inclined. Thus, Pilate tries to think up ways to resolve this situation peacefully, or failing that, to get Jesus to blame anybody but him for this mess, so that when the wrath of Jesus and/or His Father comes down, it won't be on Pilate. Naturally, the God of Israel sees through such sophistry, but Pilate is a pagan, reasoning as a pagan.

[@user-ns5sw6rc1e]

@@rafaelacosta5724 Yep, he knew what he should've done but still chose to go with mob mentality. Same as now.

[@manne8575]

It's always so beautiful seeing how the gospels are in perfect harmonization and addition to one another. Yet again a very enlightening detail. Can't wait for the undesigned coincidences in the old testament!

[@trentitybrehm5105]

Hints at the Trinity (the tri-unity between the Father, Jesus the Son, and the Holy Spirit as each one is identified as God, speaks in the first person as God, and has attributes and can do things only God can do like being identified individually as being the eternal creator of the universe) are found throughout the Old Testament from Genesis 1:1 (which yes, hints at the Trinity) all the way through. For example: In Isaiah 43:13, Deuteronomy 32:39, and Psalm 95:6-8, God speaks in two of those and one is written about God. God's Holy Name is used so we know those are God speaking directly. In those passages, God says that HIS people are the sheep of HIS pasture and that HIS gives life and no one can snatch them out of HIS hand. In John 10:27-29, Jesus says that HIS sheep hear and know HIS voice and that HE gives them eternal life and that none can snatch them out of HIS hand and that none can snatch them out of the Father's hand. Then in verse 30 he says that he and the Father are one. John 10:30-33 says that the Jews picked up stones to stone Jesus and he asked them, for what good work do you stone me? and they said not for good works, but for blasphemy, for you being a man claim to be God. The Old Testament and the New Testament are one continues story that all intertwines beautifully.

[@JohnM-cd4ou]

They're not in perfect harmony at all. They're clearly an increasingly fantastical series of literary constructions, as evidenced by Jesus being the not-at-all omnipotent adopted son of God in Mark vs the existent before time, part of the fabric of the universe Jesus in John

[@manne8575]

@@JohnM-cd4ou Oh yeah, the usual age old objection that has been debunked hundreds of times. Come back when you got something more exciting buddy.

[@JohnM-cd4ou]

@@manne8575 it hasn't been debunked at all. Nice try though. Jesus's power is limited in Mark by people not believing in him in his hometown. How does that square with Jesus of John, exactly?

[@manne8575]

@@JohnM-cd4ou It has literally been debunked and answered countless of times. You must quite literally have done zero research at all.

[@Kaspar502]

I think here is the joke: The sheer fact that the Jewish authorities delivered him is proof enough to Pilate that Jesus is not actually a threat to the empire. (He is a threat to the empire but on a level that imperial structures were blind to).

[@aquenwisey]

Bro, your observation is genius! It makes a lot of sense. A real threat to Rome would be a someone like spartacus with a big slave army at hand, someone hard to catch Instead the Jewish authorities being a man armiless, richness, beaten up man and say to Rome: this guy is a threat And Rome be like: lol, a threat? You bunch of weaklings just beat him up and his supposed followers didn’t do a thing to protect him and you call him a threat to us, to all mighty Rome?

[@thiagoulart]

"Enjoying"? Bro these have been an awesome help to rebuke skepticism. Thank you!! 🙏🏻❤️‍🔥

[@Jfernandez02]

Definitely interested in some of this for the old Testament, it always fascinates me when I find a connection between one of the historical books and one of the prophets for example

[@donnalambs9578]

For example ?

[@natereath4966]

​@@donnalambs9578One example is the prophet Jonah being mentioned in 2 kings 14:25.

[@dangeroso121]

I literally read this verse in my daily reading today. The false accusation about encouraging his followers not to pay tribute to Ceasar was an interesting aspect in Luke's account.

[@Cheezy_Bunz]

Right before the video ended I said to myself “they never say “we saw” or “I saw” they simply tell the gospel like it is” and then the video ended with saying it doesn’t read like fiction which is absolutely right! It reads like a almost omnipresent view spectating describing events simply as they are. And we know the Bible was written through men with the aid of the Holy Spirit. What a “coincidence” right? Good video I enjoy your channel 🙏

[@mattr.1887]

How do we know that?

[@seanhogan6893]

Absolutely right. Luke and John are explicit that they are written to sustain belief. The gospels just weren't written for modern historians.

[@SonnyWane]

This series is so enlightening and original! It’s a real treat when there is a new upload! Please continue your excavations!

[@silvertbird1]

Bro, I'm intently listening and absorbing this important, fascinating information and then at 4:30 "happy new ear". I had to pause the video and recover from uncontrollable laughter. That was the best thing all day. God bless you for this series, more evidence the Holy Spirit brought certain details to the minds of the several writers.

[@freshbakedclips4659]

Man, this went over my head as I was doing something else while listening

[@trentitybrehm5105]

Thank you for these videos, friend! It was a personal, supernatural experience that made me believe God was real. It was looking into the evidence for Jesus and the Bible that convinced me by logic and reason that it's true. Most Sunday services don't dive deep like this into the facts of the text, instead docusing on theological meaning in whatever passage. Those can be very powerful, but we need more learning of the facts for the evidence for the Bible because they are soooo much more effective at helpping to convince someone to look a little deeper into Jesus that just saying you felt God one time years ago.

[@Bildad1976]

​@TestifyApologetics, this is just some brilliant detective work! Have you shown this to J Warner Wallace?

[@The_Autistic_Christian]

Here's an undesigned coincidence for you: One of the prophecies of the Messiah's humiliation comes from Isaiah chapter 6, where it says, "I gave my back to those who strike, and my cheeks to those who pull out the beard; I hid not my face from disgrace and spitting." And all of the gospels talk about Jesus being scourged, spit upon and mocked. But none of them talk about the beard on his cheeks being plucked out. Which would be one of the most humiliating things for a loyal Jew to have happen to them. But when Pilate brings Jesus before the crowd, after he has been beaten and scourged, he says something very strange. He says, "Ecce Homo!" (Traditionally, in Latin; the Greek text says "Idou ho anthropos.") Which our Bibles today translate as, "Behold the man!" But why would he say this curious phrase? Well, we have to go back about 380 years, to ancient Greece, for that answer, and a curious confrontation between two Greek philosophers, Plato and Diogenes. Plato was teaching in his Academy one day, and told his students that the definition a man was nothing more than a featherless biped. Diogenes was outraged at this definition, and immediately ran out into the street. Finding a chicken, he plucked its feathers off and brought it into the Academy and held it forth, saying, "Behold, a man!" Fast forward to Jesus' time. The tale of Plato and Diogenes would have been common knowledge to the learned Romans by that time. Suddenly Jesus is brought before him, stripped naked, beaten, bleeding from head to foot and missing parts of his beard, looking undoubtedly like little more than a plucked chicken. And Pilate couldn't help but make a sick joke about it. Something that probably would go over the heads of the average Jew in the crowd, but the more learned teachers and his Roman cohort would get it. "Look, here's your man! Your plucked chicken!"

[@Greyz174]

this is a great example of how undesigned coincidences can be assembled by picking out a loose collection of datapoints across sources and just assuming a story that would tie them together if true

[@AnHebrewChild]

Interesting. How does the underlying Greek read for the account of Diogenes? Do you know? It seems like that would be important to know.

[@The_Autistic_Christian]

@@AnHebrewChild I do not know. I think there are several versions of the account. (But 380 years later and speaking off the cuff, I wouldn't expect Pilate to quote him exactly anyway.)

[@TestifyApologetics]

I don't think I would label these as undesigned coincidences

[@tearren1]

Theres just no evidence to link Pilates exclaimation with the Greek story. Saying Pilate ‘just would have know the story bc he was a Roman and probably well educated bc he held his office’ isnt evidence. Also the story and Jesus situation are unrelated.

[@thelearningmethod]

I love this series, good work doing the Lord's work. BTW this pun at 4:29 totally undid me 😂😂😂

[@arcguardian]

What pun? I missed it.

[@arcguardian]

I see it now, the actual text. Thought it was something he said.

[@silvertbird1]

I lost it at "happy new ear" just laughed till tears. I think the Lord would appreciate the humor, He gave us the ability to appreciate it.

[@joezar33]

4:04 no 1 remember it being a Roman Solider or Guard and not a high priest ?

[@1Iljo1]

This really is an amazing series, thanks

[@MyCupOfTea101]

This has been very helpful. Undesigned coincidences is going into my apologetic utility belt.

[@budhuedbuedbed]

Your channel is a gold mine. Thank you very much

[@007marcius]

This is awesome bro. I always enjoyed reading and solving the puzzles, piecing the eye witness testimonies together. God bles!!!

[@macwade2755]

Great video Testfy! God bless you!

[@toddhouston4523]

This is a great series. Thanks.

[@alejandrogarcia6187]

Thanks a lot. Your analysis make the gospels shine even more beautiful to my eyes.

[@don_hss]

Excellent as always. Any good recommendations on apologetic books?

[@sjappiyah4071]

This series is absolute gold

[@Wstydzie]

just found out about your channel, great content! keep up the good work brother just throw in some materials on the topic in the description

[@csmoviles]

Thank you for your ministry ❤❤❤

[@thelaughingphilosopher2421]

Great Video!!! Laus Deo!!! ✝️

[@agreatmanlookingtotheright]

All these leaving out details really paints a picture of a bunch of people writing down details they think the most important and leaving out the rest. Wonder if they would notice that fact if they got to read it like we do today.

[@rickfilmmaker3934]

Excellent!. Clear and concise! I will share with thousands. Keep'em coming!

[@BinaryJoe]

Jesus didn't pick the disciples at random, he knew what was in their hearts, aka: how their minds worked and what motivates them. Each of the four Gospels highlights an aspect of the character of Jesus as Messiah, Suffering Servant, Son of Man, and Son of God. Each of the four Gospels has a slightly different perspective because it's reflective of the respective authors' focus and understanding of the message. Also, the apostles weren't present at the trials, so the snippet that they recieve to record must have been delivered by sympathetic spies or attendants of the trial. None of this is coincidence any more than its a "coincidence" that Jesus fulfilled 48 articles of prophecy about the coming Messiah...something that's a statistical impossibility to achieve by accident. It's the providence that accompanies the fact that the Father is in complete control of things even as we struggle through this fallen world. In telling Pilate that his kingdom is not of this world, it illustrates that Rome, like the tradition bound elders of the Hebrew community, waa rooted in the world and only considered secular punitive power as a real threat. Where he asks Pilate, in John, "Do you say this of me or have others told you that I am?", he's illustrating that whether he is someone's King relies on them beleiving that he's their King. Another illustration that Jesus "stands at the door and knocks" and doesn't break down doors to force anyone to do anything. He's also not going to proclaim himself King as he had not yet fulfilled his role as the Lamb, the final sacrifice, and even so when he had fulfilled that role it would be the Father who would crown hin and only those who accepted him as their King over whom he would be King. Telling Pilate that "I am who you say I am.", even in not so many words is a double edged sword by which he conveys both that he IS the King of the Jews but that Pilate and all others who don't beleive in him as Messiah will perceive him in any way they want and call him many other names...and *to them* he is what they say he is. It's also an allusion to the original "I am.', God's declaration of his eternal nature, which he expounds upon earlier when talking to the Pharisees and Sadducees. People perceive Christ differently and insofar as that shapes their attitudes and actions, he is to them what they call him. But above and beyond people's disbeleif, he *is* the Messiah, Emmanuel: God with us, Yahshua: Yahweh the Saviour, and so King of not only the Jews, but all of mankind. So, both statements are true and they're given from different perspectives because, I think you'll find, each of the Gospels presents Jesus from a different aspect of the character he holds that qualifies him as Messiah, which is the character also of The Father. This is not a coincidence, this is the work of God and that's clearly stated in the book.

[@tonypaino]

Online you can find letters of Pontius Pilate, Herod the Great , and Augustus talking about Jesus, his miracles, how Pilate was secretly afraid of Jesus and so forth.

[@MrMortal_Ra]

😂😂😂 oh gosh. What a fucking joke. You honestly think that a the medivle forgery acts of Pilate, is historically reliable? Especially when it claims that Jesus was a white skin, blue eyed, golden hair man? 💀

[@AnakinGuyChopper]

These letters are most likely forgeries, read the Wikipedia article for "The Pilate cycle"

[@williamwalls9768]

Brother keep this up you doin Gods work and youll be so set in 5he sweet by and by thank you Jesus for leading you.

[@4LoveAndJustice]

Good stuff... God bless you brother ❤

[@iyad0102]

God bless brother ❤

[@QuinnBook]

I love this channel!

[@TKBreaksTheRules]

thank you for this video! ive only recently started getting into the religion of christianity and it is so interesting to me and it poses a lot of questions, like the miracles and legendaryisms written in the bible. it took me many years to wisen up to the fact that the bible is actually the best well preserved library of books, and my tune changed when i started treating the bible as instead - historical documents. on a tangent; i have been studying AI and its implications for about 13 years now, and in my research it had led me down many complicated pathways. these pathways namely being ;biology/health science , mathmatics, science of the universe (very complicated stuff), and only recently quantum computers, and quantum physics, which lead me to christianity. i can tell you confidently, that the universe is full of marvel and it all communicates on the quantum(as small as possible) scale. quantum entanglement specifically is what got me to question things. i started to think about the fact that atoms can be paired (any number of them) and communicate with each other anywhere simultaneously, that means it could be 1000 light years away and still at the same time, rotate together with its paired atoms, they could even be in other dimensions. these are characteristics of a computer, or something that thinks. it supports the idea that we have a creator. it supports the idea that there is a god.

[@EndYouTubeShorts_]

That's pretty cool. I thought it was the Joker on the thumbnail.

[@Derek_Baumgartner]

Thanks for this!

[@ryanrockstarsessom768]

Thank you

[@meltdowntf2865]

Hello, I am an aspiring linguist, and noticed you spelled ‘ut oh’ for a phrase. Analyzing your speech pattern would help build some ideas. May I ask what region you live in? Template: western Connecticut, northern Michigan, etc. this would help greatly for any future projects:

[@iamjustjoseph]

"Thou sayest it" I believe this is the best translation, using the KJV. Reason being, Christ *IS* prophecy. In this moment, he declared it in a way that is prophetic. It would be Pilate who writes, "King of the Jews" in spite of the mob clamoring at him... “Pilate answered, What I have written I have written.” John 19:22 KJV It seems he told Pilate in that moment just as Peter what would come to pass, albeit more cryptically to Pontius.

[@tateharrigan8061]

Doctor Pitre has a great point about how Jesus speaks in latin to him and that he specifically touches his roman philosophy about “truth”.

[@feliperodriguez4187]

Awesome info!

[@danielbrowniel]

"My kingdom is not of this world. If my kingdom were of this world, my servants would have been fighting, that I might not be delivered over to the Jews. But my kingdom is not from the world." ESV I have always wondered if what Christ is saying suggest that it is of this world that power is established with violence. It would fit with "be as gentle as doves/ wise as serpents" and it would make sense that at the last supper the "command" to sell your cloak to buy the sword is probably a point of disappointment having the foreknowledge of what will happen, the 2 apostles who will disappoint Him next are Judas and Peter and before He mentions the sword He mentions the money bag and before He mentions both those things He makes the point that He sent them out with nothing and it is more than enough. (something to bring up with people that think the 2nd amendment is in the Bible, not that I think it is wrong to defend yourself) I simply think there is a place to be peaceful to the death. After all how would Paul survive to become an apostle?

[@barry.anderberg]

Is this at all based on Who Moved The Stone? I'm reading that now, he makes s similar argument.

[@TestifyApologetics]

I have that book but have yet to read it. No, these come from JJ Blunt and Lydia McGrew

[@seanhogan6893]

@@TestifyApologetics could you include references to your sources in video descriptions? I know you're busier now but you have in the past and it feels an important part of being thorough.

[@arcguardian]

​@@seanhogan6893doesn't he list the scriptures in the video?

[@oblonghas]

This was just the right amount of meme to work

[@user-yy2mu9qm7g]

The thumbnail is hilarious!

[@JTFtheTheoPhPoliticalHistorian]

Amen, this is good.

[@MatthewChenault]

What could be the likely reason is that John was with Jesus during his trial and may have overheard the conversation whereas Luke might have heard the crowd, but might not have been in the room to hear the full conversation.

[@christiancountryboyilovejesus]

I believe Jesus answered. "I Am."

[@duvvly]

An interesting reinterpretation of the word "proof".

[@TestifyApologetics]

what do you know? you're a skeleton

[@aspermwhalespontaneouslyca8938]

Extremely novel approach to apologetics! Good job.

[@iranianskeptic]

Very interesting

[@91wheelz]

I have a couple of questions in regard to the gospels: Is there any evidence for or against the idea that each author did or did not reference another author's work? Is there a reasonable explanation that can be given which can prove that each gospel was not just an added on piece of work to an original piece of work, with all being pieces of work without truth?

[@TestifyApologetics]

I talked about this at the video in the endscreen

[@reeldisconnect2590]

Couldn’t a skeptic simply say though that John saw holes in Synoptics and decided to fill them, and that he didn’t feel the need to keep in the parts that are already in the Synoptics because they’d be a waste of space as they’re already in the others?

[@TestifyApologetics]

I already addressed that several videos ago

[@rysloan]

Skeptics usually prefer to attack on the basis that the gospels are so different that "it's basically a different Jesus" so they can't very well turn around and say "John read the synoptics really closely and tried to chime with them really well, to the point of filling in tiny gaps in the story". Those views contradict. So we have them in a catch 22. Either it's obviously a consistent Jesus in the four accounts or the complimentary differences prove these are eyewitness accounts of real events.

[@marvalice3455]

​@@rysloanoh they _absolutely can_ and often do. It's called a tea cup argument. When one throws every possible argument at the wall, even ones that are mutually contradictory, just looking for something to stick. And it's a clear sign of intellectual dishonesty

[@seanhogan6893]

Or even that "John" was trying to reframe the narrative and needed to appeal to having an even greater insight than the other gospels. "Sure, you've heard Peter's perspective - but what about the disciple whom Jesus loved?"

[@marvalice3455]

@@seanhogan6893 thanks for the example.

[@Michael-bt6ht]

Ty

[@markhorton3994]

Every place the translation is " you have said so" or "You say so", there are many, context indicates that it means "Yes".

[@Gutslinger]

"Context indicates that it means, 'Yes'." Did Jesus tell Pilate "Yes" under His own initiative? Or did Pilate say it was so about Him?

[@markhorton3994]

@@Gutslinger Pilot asked Jesus if He is the King of the Jews. Jesus answered " You say so" In context Jesus's answer means YES Do you get it now?

[@Gutslinger]

​@@markhorton3994It sounds like He's saying that Pilate is saying it is so. In context...Jesus follows by saying that His kingdom is not of this world. If it were, His servants would be fighting so that He wouldn't be handed over to the Jews. Then He goes on to say that *"You say* correctly that I am *a* King." His original answer sounds more complex than a simple "Yes", given the full context of the conversation.

[@enanguko2237]

Wow..lovely

[@zacshifler]

How would Luke or anyone know what Jesus and Pilate said to one another?

[@nuclearsynapse5319]

It was done in a public forum. It was a trial that many attended.

[@allaware1971]

You forget, pilate's wife was waking up in night terrors for 3 nights about Jesus, which means he knew he was a prophet. Remember, he was pagan and believed in God's coming to earth in human form, and Jesus directly showed one of his signs, the same pagan gods do, and would never do anything to diss a god.

[@piface3016]

But how would John and Luke know about what was said in the trial? Who could have informed them?

[@kiwisaram9373]

John 18:15Simon Peter and another disciple were following Jesus. Because this disciple was known to the high priest, he went with Jesus into the high priest’s courtyard, 16but Peter had to wait outside at the door. The other disciple, who was known to the high priest, came back, spoke to the servant girl on duty there and brought Peter in.

[@IslandUsurper]

Jesus himself could have after the fact. He was on the earth for another forty days, though we don’t know everything he did and said then.

[@alexandermorse1306]

It’s very likely that when Jesus mentioned His kingdom wasn’t of this world, Pilot likely thought Jesus was a demigod, child of one of the Roman gods. Hence why he didn’t want to be responsible for killing Jesus.

[@MrMortal_Ra]

Or he was he just saw him as another Jewish present who was an esoteric mystic guy who bears no actually serious threat to the romans or himself. This idea of “oh Pilate for some reason realised that a poor Jewish Galilean peasant was somehow a divine binge from the Roman deity’s” is bullshit.

[@joezar33]

Gwad what a Mandela Effect 4:04 , it's was a Roman Solider or Guard .

[@negativedawahilarious]

❤❤❤

[@jesusisthechristthesonofgod]

i never found that passage baffling

[@TheEncouragementKid]

that thumbnail is so good 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@Michael-bk5nz]

I noticed the apparent connection between Luke and John as a teenager back in the early 90s and I thought I was the only one who ever noticed it. I've yet to see an advocate of the standard two-source theory of the origins of the Syntopics explain this. If John was written last how is there this close connection between John with Luke but not the other two synoptic?

[@AnHebrewChild]

Can you flesh out your last sentence a bit more? I guess it's unclear to me what you're saying there.

[@Michael-bk5nz]

@@AnHebrewChild if John was written decades after the Synoptics then why does he have such deep and intimate knowledge of Luke and apparent obliviousness about Mark and Matthew? To put it another way, why do Luke and John have a source in common that neither of them shares with Matthew or Mark? This is a rather bizarre anomaly that the Two Source theory not only cannot explain but I'm not aware of even a single advocate of the theory that has attempted to explain it.

[@Greyz174]

the same idea is in Mark, which is where Luke got it from

[@AnHebrewChild]

@@Michael-bk5nz Interesting. I guess my question tho is, what makes you say John is oblivious to M&M? Some would say that he is aware of the Markan & Matthean material due to things like Mk14:58 & Mt26:61 (in light of John 2:19) as well as due to explanatory statements which assume the reader's knowledge of traditional stories about Jesus. For a striking example, see John 11:2 (which has, it would seem, reference to Mt26:6-10 & Mk14:3-7 and NOT to Luke ch 7:37-47 Now a certain man was sick, named Lazarus, of Bethany, the town of Mary and her sister Martha. *(It was that Mary which anointed the Lord with ointment, and wiped his feet with her hair, whose brother Lazarus was sick.)* Therefore his sisters sent unto him... That statement above comes out of nowhere in John's account… In other words, it assumes the reader's knowledge of some event corresponding to it.

[@Michael-bk5nz]

@@Greyz174 really? The gospel of Mark has John a and Peter rushing to the tomb with John arriving first? Mark has Peter cut off the ear of the servant of the High Priest? Where? These are details that are only in John and Luke, and there are several other things like this.

[@BFMC169DeadBroke]

Also in The Book of Mark when Jesus is praying in the Garden of Gethsemane and they come for him there was a young man dressed only in linen and following them a skirmish took place and the naked man ran off leaving his linen behind. And he also says one of them cut the ear off but doesn’t name who?.?. Of course when Luke writes about it it was Peter

[@BFMC169DeadBroke]

I don’t know who the naked man was. Just seemed weird but it had to be one of the disciples 🤷‍♂️

[@thealex5838]

Idgi then, if he said if his kingdom were of this world they would fight bc of him being hand over but peter did fight so is he saying his kingdom is of this world?

[@chrisdaniels3929]

If you are the king it means you won the fight. Also Jesus told them not to use violence. He was expecting to be arrested.

[@eikeksi11]

cutting ear can maybe be saying something so he cant hear something, like jesus says those that have eyes to see and ears to hear

[@saltnessmonster]

Christ is King!

[@15nicinho]

Subscribed

[@AmbianEagleheart]

Pilate knew the Hasmoneans were usurpers.

[@HandledToaster2]

I would like to ask this not out of ignorance or "gotcha," but of genuine interest: How does this prove the reliability of the bible? Couldn't a council be smart enough to design separate books that complement each other with intentional flaws and weirdness such that they don't seem designed to be fiction?

[@user-chumbuck3t]

God is real☺️

[@bencordell1965]

The romans killed jesus for the pharases to avoid a tantrum

[@MatthewFearnley]

The guy on the left at 4:31 clearly does not appreciate a good pun.

[@arcguardian]

That was probably Judas lol.

[@Greyz174]

John doesnt need the detail of Jesus healing the ear for the story to make sense, if Pilate said "but your guy just cut a guy's ear off" and Jesus would say "yes and I told him to stop and turned myself in to be killed by you guys" even if Malchus was still bleeding Whether he healed the ear has pretty much no bearing on whether Pilate would think to contradict the claim (since either way the sword was swung, in public), and it has no bearing on whether Jesus would have a good response.

[@danielesorbello619]

i don’t think that’s a sound argument: because this supposes 2 things: the pharisees would’ve wanted to tell to Pilate and that they would’ve tought Pilate would’ve believed them: i think both are unlikely: the first is because the jewish clergy wouldn’t have wanted to attribute healing powers to Jesus as they were accusing him of being a blasphemer: from the same narrative of Luke we read: 12:10 And everyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven; but whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven and giving the fact most scholars agree Luke was written after mark; and the synoptic problem. this is most likely a reference to Mark 3 that says: 22 And the teachers of the law who came down from Jerusalem said, “He is possessed by Beelzebul! By the prince of demons he is driving out demons.” 23 So Jesus called them over to him and began to speak to them in parables: “How can Satan drive out Satan? 24 If a kingdom is divided against itself, that kingdom cannot stand. 25 If a house is divided against itself, that house cannot stand. 26 And if Satan opposes himself and is divided, he cannot stand; his end has come. 27 In fact, no one can enter a strong man’s house without first tying him up. Then he can plunder the strong man’s house. 28 Truly I tell you, people can be forgiven all their sins and every slander they utter, 29 but whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven; they are guilty of an eternal sin.” they wouldn’t have wanted to admit he had divine powers, if he had them. Other than this: this supposes that even if they said that to the roman authority they would’ve believed them: even if the men that went to arrest Jesus testified they had been attacked but had no scars (or in this case no ears missing) it would’ve been very unlikely the authorities would’ve believed them and just tought they were either crazy or corrupted (to make the case against Jesus worse).

[@Greyz174]

@@danielesorbello619 the roman guards would be the ones who saw their guy get his ear cut off so they would be the source. but even your point about the pharisees not wanting to attribute magic to him, they already have an explanation that he's an evil sorcerer, this wouldn't really be a stumblingblock. this is what jews think about someone who does miracles but they think is a false prophet, it's in the torah. there's no teaching of "hey if you admit he does miracles that means you have to admit he's a true prophet" so this all works perfectly fine within their own framework jesus' response and reasoning there only applies to him casting out demons not healing an ear, but the text doesn't say that the Jews then agreed with him and proceeded to say "ok so we can't admit he's a sorcerer anymore" they would just make up some belief preserving thing to maintain the idea that he's a sorcerer and people shouldn't listen to him or take his miracles seriously this all misses the point though that even if john's story internally doesn't have the ear getting healed, Jesus would still be perfectly able to make that statement in response to the presentation of the bloody guy where he would say "Malchus hello do you remember when I also told Peter to cool it and turn myself in and stop swinging his sword? that has to do with what I am telling Pilate right now, about how my kingdom isn't of this world and that's why nobody's attacking the complex to try to free me"

[@Greyz174]

@@danielesorbello619 i love it when i type a long reply and it disappears :) the point is that if they brought a bloody guy to Pilate Jesus would say "Malchus hello do you remember when I told Peter to stop doing that and turned myself in to be executed? it has to do with the point I am making to Pilate right now" and there would be no problem that needs to be solved by the detail in Luke's account also being true, because they're all tied to what actually happened. there's no question that needs to be answered by another interlocking testimony. so that was the main point, but also, they wouldn't have any problem with admitting that he does miracles, they think he's a sorcerer. mark doesnt say "and then they actually listened to what Jesus said about a house divided and updated their model about him going forward, shifting instead to miracle denial." they already have a framework to maintain their belief that he's a false prophet but also has supernatural powers.

[@danielesorbello619]

@@Greyz174 “Yes, you're right about that but this is the only time he speaks. In the rest of the verses he stays silent which is inconsistent with how John presents what happened. These are obviously not descriptions of the same event. But they're supposed to be! This doesn't address the problem. I never said "he stays silent in one story but not the other." There is an obvious problem with the historicity of these narratives because they are so different from one another. Both cannot be a correct depiction of events.” i’m gonna respond to those at the same time: yes it does address the problem: because: in mark Pilate asks jesus if he claimed to be the king of the Jews and he responded briefly while the account in John is longer here. Then the witnesses make other accuses and Jesus doesn’t speak both in mark and John: there’s no contradiction between the two events because Jesus stays silent in different parts of the dialogue. “Or Mark's more accurate because he's earlier and John's account has been fictionalized....That's what it looks like anyway.” it is 5-8 verses longer. The purpose of undesigned coincidences and other arguments for the reliability of the gospels is to argue against this impression: the stories can both fit together and have an undesigned coincidence inside them.

[@Greyz174]

@@danielesorbello619 i think that response was mistakenly for someone else in another thread, i didn't make those quotes and the subject matter doesn't relate to the ear chop one

[@theuberlord7402]

How did Judas die?

[@TestifyApologetics]

I get so many insincere questions so I have to ask, are you changing the subject away from this video, or do you really wanna know? Because there's a lot of videos on this platform on this very topic.

[@Powerviolenc3]

His guts spilled from botched suicide by tree 🌳

[@John-zb9yw]

“Are you the king of the Jews because you’re Jesus or are you Jesus because you’re the king of the Jews?”

[@walkerx1813]

"I am"

[@TheForgivenOne777]

Amen🙏🏻♥️!

[@user-xi3fn4iw5f]

Why wojack Pilate, he tried to defend the Lord and washed his hands in innocence. The crowd took the blane for his murder on themselves and their descendants. People really gotta stop acting like the Romans are to blame for the murder of Christ.

[@user-bj6lk8mw2i]

It's not fiction. If you've actually studied the literature of that era, you'd know that the Gospels don't look like anything else - that is, they were written in the style/manner that people of that era wrote down eyewitness accounts, not the style they used to write down fiction or even religious tracts. You might as well argue that they're screenplays or memes as fiction because all such claims are anachronistic, failing to consider the literary forms that actually existed at that time. See CS Lewis for more discussion.

[@user-ow2yr4nu4z]

Pilot was a roman magistrate, he didnt get into that position by being stupid, he knew Christ had to be a actual threat to be turned over to him like that. The leadership of Israel had faced so called messianic travelers dorming little groups, but i imagine most faded into obscurity with out their intervention. Christ had the actual ears of some of if not the biggest spiritual leaders of the time. One thing the Romans understood way better than most is whats required to be good leaders and if people are actually noble born, you can put a crown on a fools head and a scepter in his hands and some people will still know hes a fool. Not ro diminish Christ but a part of the story is monolithic and common at any great societys decline. Almost a reversal of fortunes. The King is the product of opulance and theres a people who love the gifts of a God more than the God. They see themselves as esrning it and not by Gods good favor and entitlement thats does not have to be earned, and the man who should be king is a peasent. None of this is meant to diminish Christ even tho i says this stuff is in the Monomyth..but theres a reason its in the monomyth..because its always been Gods problem with us. No Kingdom has flurished with out his acknowledgement even tho they do not acknowledge God. Its like a question, essentially anyone anywhere can ask it but theres only one answer. Like what CS Lewis said but this my take on it these things we share with pagans halfway in around the world do not discredit Christ or my faith but actually prove all society all cultures are branches and have the same root.

[@HesusEleison]

✝️

[@Thor-Orion]

3:00 yeah, the Roman policy before the violent revolts is pretty hands off on the religious nuts.

[@jellyface401]

THERE IS NO FAULT IN HIM!

[@LordMathious]

Do you own slaves?

[@zenyogasteve401]

I know Matt and John knew Jesus personally. They were there. Were Mark and Luke, too?

[@superawesome5780]

Mark was a follower of Peter who was one of Jesus' closest disciples and Luke was a follower of Paul who was close to people who knew Jesus personally

[@Zero.freingetei]

Wave

[@Greyz174]

Mark already has Pilate not finding guilt in Jesus, because the perspective that Mark is giving is that the Jews put him on trial and Pilate is like "what why are you guys doing this what crime did he commit" and is wowed by Jesus' compliance with everything Looks like he just did a quick job summarizing the idea of Mark, just like you would think he did a quick job summarizing the real events that actually happened that are in John. And we are all on the same page that Luke used Mark, so this is a pretty good explanation with uncontroversial presuppositions. Either way it's just an author having a bunch of background facts in his head from his sources (either from reading Mark, or eyewitness testimony) and then writing what comes out, because people casually write pieces of whats in their head whether or not they are eyewintesses, so this doesnt tell us that it's more likely eyewitness. Like I said in another comment some time ago, not being an eyewitness doesnt mean youre going to be really explicit and heavy handed about everything, both types authors will just have a set of background information in their head, and then they will write what pieces of that come out when it's time

[@TestifyApologetics]

You guys really need to stop with the while reading Mark, added this detail, took this out. Could it explain a coincidence or 2? Maybe. Dozens? No.

[@Greyz174]

​@@TestifyApologetics i explained the mechanism in my last paragraph, i wasnt under the impression that this type explanation only covers one of your examples and i have to come up with a completely different type of thing for each one of them

[@TestifyApologetics]

​@@Greyz174yes and I think the latent memory lemme fill a detail in and leave out others repeatedly just isn't a good explanation

[@Greyz174]

@@TestifyApologetics isnt that what youre saying is happening on reportage? One witness says one thing and doesnt say another thing, and so do the others

[@danielesorbello619]

“Mark already has Pilate not finding guilt in Jesus, because the perspective that Mark is giving is that the Jews put him on trial and Pilate is like "what why are you guys doing this what crime did he commit" and is wowed by Jesus' compliance with everything” the central poi t of your argumentation is that Pilate was wowed by Jesus’s compliance: i would ask from where do you derive this? the account of the trial from Mark 15:2-15 says: “2 Pilate asked Jesus, “Are you the king of the Jews?” Jesus replied, “You have said it.” 3 Then the leading priests kept accusing him of many crimes, 4 and Pilate asked him, “Aren’t you going to answer them? What about all these charges they are bringing against you?” 5 But Jesus said nothing, much to Pilate’s surprise.” 6 Now it was the governor’s custom each year during the Passover celebration to release one prisoner-anyone the people requested. 7 One of the prisoners at that time was Barabbas, a revolutionary who had committed murder in an uprising. 8 The crowd went to Pilate and asked him to release a prisoner as usual. 9 “Would you like me to release to you this ‘King of the Jews’?” Pilate asked. 10 (For he realized by now that the leading priests had arrested Jesus out of envy.) 11 But at this point the leading priests stirred up the crowd to demand the release of Barabbas instead of Jesus. 12 Pilate asked them, “Then what should I do with this man you call the king of the Jews?” 13 They shouted back, “Crucify him!” 14 “Why?” Pilate demanded. “What crime has he committed?” But the mob roared even louder, “Crucify him!” 15 So to pacify the crowd, Pilate released Barabbas to them. He ordered Jesus flogged with a lead-tipped whip, then turned him over to the Roman soldiers to be crucified. not only does he affirm he is the King of the jews but doesn’t respond to other accusations: this surprises Pilate but how do you derive that Pilate was surprised in a positive way and decided Jesus was without guilt? “Looks like he just did a quick job summarizing the idea of Mark, just like you would think he did a quick job summarizing the real events that actually happened that are in John. And we are all on the same page that Luke used Mark, so this is a pretty good explanation with uncontroversial presuppositions.” i don’t really understand what you are trying to say here so it’s likely i’m gonna give you a response that doesn’t really have anything to do with the point you are giving. First who is “he”? Luke? Then yeah i think it is reasonable he is summarizing Mark but Mark gives us the same problem: why would Pilate think he has no guilt if he hadn’t responded to any of the accuses and confirmed or alluded he declared himself as king? “Either way it's just an author having a bunch of background facts in his head from his sources (either from reading Mark, or eyewitness testimony) and then writing what comes out, because people casually write pieces of whats in their head whether or not they are eyewintesses, so this doesnt tell us that it's more likely eyewitness. Like I said in another comment some time ago, not being an eyewitness doesnt mean youre going to be really explicit and heavy handed about everything, both types authors will just have a set of background information in their head, and then they will write what pieces of that come out when it's time” i think you are missing the point of undesigned coincidences: the argument isn’t about proving the writers and scribes were eyewitness but that the content of these text are derived from eyewitness testimony. As you said:”and then writing what comes out, because people casually write pieces of whats in their head whether or not they are eyewintesses” even if i believe the process of writing was much more intricate and the scribes’s work was also to contribute to writing the text in the best way possible as second authors; i can agree with you that the authors didn’t obviously write it in extreme detail: and that’s the point of UCs, we don’t believe they were trying to cover up what the authors of previous gospels wrote: the argument simply points out that there are a lot of instances when these random pieces combine and explain each other.

[@DookyButter]

I would also reckon that Pontius knew Jesus was innocent all along. No doubt he was privy to the Jewish leaders’ jealousy, and his wife had the dream about Jesus as well, which she communicated to him. Hence, it makes sense why he would easily move to a not guilty verdict.

[@bubblegumgun3292]

he never said yes, because he wasn't

[@kurtiscal3msetccdwell618]

We dont actually know if the apostles left those parts out due to the simple fact that the word of God has literally been torn apart, edited to death, and destroyed entirely then repieced together based off of what the flawed thinking and hands of human beings thought was acceptable. The literal bible we have due to it being heavily edited and modified, we're talking over 30 books of the literal word of God have been removed not by God but by human beings, is not anything to consider accurate. We should be demanding the original unedited copy in it's entirety to be released by the many denominations that formed councils over the years and decided they knew better than literal God on the word of God.

[@zackk7501]

You are wrong. And if you did any semblance of research you would find out just how wrong you are. Perhaps before spouting untruths on the internet you would do your research first.

[@kurtiscal3msetccdwell618]

@@zackk7501 Nah i'm 100% correct. Anyone can google it and see that. The Ethiopian bible is the oldest bible we have in existence and it contains near 30 more books in it than the canonical version. FYI "canonical" is a word in this context that actually means "approved by humans thinking they know better than God". The people who ripped apart the word of God should put it back and apologize. We have a right to God's word unabridged, edited, or mutilated.

[@kurtiscal3msetccdwell618]

@@zackk7501 The truth is that modern day organized religion thinks they can just do what the Jews did for thousands of years and shove God behind a veil. They cannot. Jesus Christ died and when he did the veil was torn down and God was freed and we all have access to God as a result. No organization, church, pastor or preacher required to commune and communicate directly with God.

[@cabudagavin3896]

You are viewing a book in hindsight and claim truth, it is very easy to erect false falsifications and then falsify them in hindsight.

[@TestifyApologetics]

you trying to examine my head and motives doesn't say anything about the argument itself

[@cabudagavin3896]

@@TestifyApologetics I was referring to the argument

[@danielesorbello619]

@Greyz174 hey, i have had the same problems in sending messages under that thread, if you want, let’s continue the discussion about the first UC of this video, under this other thread: Hey, i wrote this yesterday but forgot to send it, here it is: i’ve noticed you are struggling with youtube algorithm deleting your messages, and you rewrote them a couple of times, so i’m not gonna respond to the slightly different versions of the points you made. “Pilate knows the claims are baseless because when he repeatedly asks for a basis they just keep repeating that we need to crucify him, and he tries to get Jesus out of it by offering the Barabbas alternative.” we are talking about Mark’s narrative, i don’t think this is a valid explanation: In Mark’s narrative Jesus affirmed or alluded to have claimed to be the king of the jews and doesn’t respond to the accuses: and this happens before the crowd yells to crucify him. These accuses made by the pharisees are said to be false but not baseless: in 14:55 The chief priests and the whole Sanhedrin were looking for evidence against Jesus so that they could put him to death, but they did not find any. 56 Many testified falsely against him, but their statements did not agree. the testimonies that didn’t agree with each other were set in a different location, they weren’t the same ones made to Pilate, they were made to the Sanhedrin. Jesus didn’t respond to the other accuses made by the pharisees when be was brought to Pilate: the narrative isn’t centered around the testimonies being clearly false: Jesus knew they were false but he didn’t do anything to argue against them *and this surprised Pilate* : the “”hole”” still remains. “Luke and John are both inheriting a tradition of Jesus being unjustly brought to trial, and they write about that in their own ways. For Luke this is as simple as having read Mark, seeing the whole view that Mark presents, and summarizing it as "jesus went along with the accusations but Pilate found no guilt in him"” ok, i agree with that: Luke summarizes the account of Mark. “The "sheer number" of undesigned coincidences don't matter because this thing I am speaking of can happen in many ways; facts get into author's head, author writes down some subset of them. doesn't matter if the source of facts of eyewitnesses or reading the sources a bunch of times and reconstructing a cinematic universe, it will all have the same ring of "casualness" and there will be overlaps between similar material.” so you are agreeing with the argument? You are saying facts that an author knows either from eyewitness testimony or written sources are causally mentioned? The sheer number matters in this case: because it is more likely that a story is derived from eyewitness testimony if there’s a great number of them: because they are far more likely to happen if the account these various authors talk about is derived from eyewitness testimony. “It's also a sign of a weak argument that every time I talk about specific instances there's a slight concession but an appeal to all of the other ones, especially when I use the same central mechanism to describe all of the other ones when they are brought up.” a common analogy is that of a chainmail: these coincidences isolated aren’t evidence for nothing: if there was a smaller number of those it would be more likely that they were just a coincidence, the sheer number of them is central in the formulation of the argument. “Plutarch is talking about taking events and comparing them to previous and distinct events that have some similarity, not incorporating everything your source says into what you say” what do you define as:”incorporating everything your source says into what you say” in those verses from the life of Sertorious he makes some examples of parallels, for example: “there were two Actaeons, one of whom was torn in pieces by his dogs, the other by his lovers” he notes how parallelism in ancient writings to previous sources was seen as a mark of a good author, and even if you consider this a stretch of what Plutarch was saying: still if i wanted to explain in more detail a certain event i wouldn’t remove the premises of that event: i would have a complete quotation to that event: it happens a lot of times in the NT and is also the most logical thing to do. “ive spend too much time trying to salvage and rewrite my comments to get through the autodelete filter” Oh my god it’s terrible. In these cases there’s not much that you can do: maybe you commented 2 comments to fast and the algorithm thinks you are a bot: you just have to wait.

[@barry6053]

The picture is misleading and stupid. Why would Roman pagans be upset about some carpenter claiming to be the son of the Jews' God?

[@BHow02]

Unless you are already a Christian, I don’t think these points hold much weight as evidence

[@TestifyApologetics]

I'm not a presupposionalist. I'm not coming to the text believing it's true to prove it true. I could always not choose to be a Christian if these evidences didn't hold weight, and the evidence was against Christianity. It's best to attack the argument. This is just ad hom fallacy. Show me where I've gone wrong.

[@youtubezcy]

It would be great if anyone had recorded any of this at the time instead of centuries later by true believers along with magic.

[@ChewyChicken589]

He's the king of the judeans

[@champfox1]

The gospels were not intended to be picked apart. They are designed to bring us closer to God, by following the path of Christ.

[@TestifyApologetics]

If it's God's word, and he's the God of all truth, then why can't his word be held to scrutiny? Didn't the apostles preach about what they were witnesses to, and that Jesus fulfilled prophecy, which is publicly available data? Evidence is nothing to be afraid of, it's our ally in apologetics and evangelism. Second, I never said that they aren't designed to bring us close to God. You're making up a false dilemma here.

[@champfox1]

It's not God's words though! It written by men who are fallible and are easily scrutinized. That scrutiny doesn't negate the universal truths that Jesus brought to us. It is his beautiful and God inspired stories that bring us close to God which is the real purpose of it all. Each gospel has a different take on certain aspects of the story line to some degree. They can be scrutinized at a certain level, but not at how close Christ's example and stories bring us closer to God, the Universe, or whatever you want to call that energy, that some people believe in and other's don't. No matter what, if we all were as Christ was, it would be a much better world.

[@jtb229]

How was any of this historical

[@sliced_glass_2901]

It isn't, it's religious.

[@MrSamdabeast]

How is any history book you've ever read historical? Your statement becomes very naive if you take a moment to think

[@DAYthaTRUTH]

Whether you believe the spiritual aspect of what is being said the Bible is a historical account of events in history. Just like any other book or information you have from the past it was written by somebody you've probably never seen or have proof exist. Just like in the video it explains pilates response to Jesus is the same response you're having rn "what is truth?"