ECM vs PSC motor #2

[@ccthepope]

Thanks for going to so much trouble to post these videos and teaching us.

[@grayfurnaceman]

Welcome GFM

[@scottkasper6378]

Great video, thanks for making it. I love the super low speed you can get with ecm for use in winter for filtering air and de stratification. Only drawing 80 watts is a bargain. I always suggest an ecm surge protector though because they burn up easy and are costly

[@grayfurnaceman]

Agreed GFM

[@jimbola77]

thank you GFM love and watch all your video's!!!!

[@atlantarene]

I am new to this topic and I found this educational. Now, I am curious about the relationship between static pressure and current draw with an ECM motor application. There was also mention of static pressure vs inlet and outlet.

[@xzibit8614]

Does the ECM get better power factor than the PSC?

[@grayfurnaceman]

I can't say its power factor but the ECM uses less power when it is on the lower speeds. GFM

[@chiplaurn8175]

Can you do a vid on what a power chimes used for? Thanks!

[@chiplaurn8175]

Power Choke

[@danielthechskid]

Thank you for this update.

[@brianellsworth4767]

ECM wins considering a slightly higher static as well.I was sure the higher amperage would give higher wattage with voltage the same regardless of the power factor . The lead lag seems to change things a bit more than I expected ..

[@danielthechskid]

In the ECM case it isn't leading or lagging phase, Since current is only drawn when the AC input instantaneous voltage is higher than the DC bus voltage you get big current spikes at the sine wave peaks.

[@brianellsworth4767]

Servo motors, stepper motors, ECM motors .I give up and believe what you say...

[@servicetechokc]

Maybe try using a med-low on the ECM to get roughly the same static pressure as the PSC. Sure the static is less, because the motor is doing less work.

[@dtrrtd774]

Yes, if the ECM motor could be adjusted to achieve the same static pressure as the PSC on low, it would be a valid comparison. Otherwise, turn off the PSC for zero energy consumption, with both motors effectively doing zilch. Low speed on one doesn't equal low speed on the other unless they're at the same static pressure.

[@johnc4352]

You da man, Grayfurnaceman.

[@cd-stephen]

dumb question im sure...what does the big R sticker mean

[@grayfurnaceman]

Beats me, I just work on them. GFM

[@jasonsouliere703]

Awesome test, great video. I am trying to decide whether it's worth the $1000 cdn to replace my faulty (for the second time) ECM 2.3 motor, or to permanently convert to a PSC motor using a QT6104 board. I currently have a bulletproof 25 year old PSC motor installed, wired directly to the mains, drawing 6.5 amps on hi-speed for A/C. I'll need to get the conversion board so the electric bill won't kill the bank account, or I'll need to order a new ECM which will only kill the bank account every four years when they always fail in that time. What should I do!? Are there improvements to the reliability of newer ECMs? Not sure of my static pressure but I have removed the dampers from all of the registers, and the filter is cleaned or replaced every 4 weeks. I would benefit on electrical costs as we run the fan in low speed 24/7/365. But would it be enough? The Luxaire furnace is only 9 years old. Any advice is appreciated.

[@grayfurnaceman]

I would replace it with the PSC. If the PSC is running at its high speed, it is fairly close to the power usage of the ECM. It saves quite a lot if the PSC is operated at lower speeds. GFM

[@jasonsouliere703]

Hi there. Thanks for the advice. I used a Qwik board to replace the garbage ecm 2.3 motor, but the Qwik board will not run the fan on HIGH speed when cooling. Is there a setting on either my oem Emerson board that needs to be adjusted or the Qwik board? The second floor of the house is not being cooled, not enough CFM coming from the blower with this Qwik board as it keeps switching from HIGH, to MED, then staying on LOW for extended periods of time. I've tried putting the thermistor on the coils, tried moving it outside the furnace and even dunked it in hot water and the Qwik sets the fan on MED for a short time then back to LOW. Previous to receiving the Qwik 2.3 board I simply connected the PSC directly to power and the house was perfectly cool. Any suggestions?

[@starflite3]

Do you recommend replacing a PSC motor in an electric heat/AC airhandler with an ECM motor? Issues I am having is wifi interruption when furnace blower comes on. Also looking to maybe increase efficiency some. PSC motor in furnace is now about 10 years old and I believe the brushes are getting worn and increasing RFI and it is interrupting my Wi-Fi signal.

[@cwair]

~I suspect amp spike adds quite a bit to the equation in favor of the ecm, particularly when a digital power meter is on the power supply

[@EricsiPhone]

This was a great update. Those Kill A Watt's are very accurate for the money, but they can be off quite a bit with some 'electronic' loads that have poor filtering and low power factors. Unfortunately a very good power meter is rather expensive. But for most peoples purposes, the thing they care about is what the meter on their house reads, and those are fairly cheap. So thats not a bad test. You'd need to very carefully count the disc rotations over time to determine the power since the numbers won't give you great resolution. If there is a speed tap on the ECM to make it run the same static as the PSC, that would be a better test. The ECM should be more efficient at every speed, and the gap widens as the speed drops.

[@notanewbie1718]

Can an ECM be wired to replace a PSC motor? If you think so, what wring changes are ncessary? Maybe do a video on how.

[@servicetechokc]

Mars Azure is a "drop in" replacement for PSC. Hooks up the same way as the old PSC.

[@ryanmalin]

They sell a kit to hook up a x13 in place of a Psc motor at all the supply houses down here in Florida. Try tropic supply or united refrigeration.

[@dtrrtd774]

What provides the speed control signal if the system wasn't designed for variable speed operation of the blower? Manual control?

[@twosawyers]

DTR RTD control 50 to 150 dollar control board. Depending on how much you want to spend!

[@joeydelmarsjr.646]

quikswap for the win

[@willardcrafto]

Hi. I have a few questions about that electric furnace that you showed the elements on the element on. 1 who was it made by 2 what diameter are the elements And finally what is the model number Also. Would you please make another video showing the elements running. Please reply. Your videos have made me have an interest in that kinda stuff. Thank you2 days ago•

[@surefire07]

House utility installed power meter doe not include power factor effect i.e. it is KVA prox meter. Your experiment data shows that compare to PSC based unit, the ECM based units are expensive and needs frequent expensive repair. I think industry needs more research and engineering improvements on ECM to justify the added cost.

[@robertcherry4971]

I thought the lower the static pressure the more air that could be moved and the higher the pressure the less?Or am I confusing blower pressure with TESP? Please explain for me.

[@servicetechokc]

With the same ductwork, higher static means more airflow. If the ductwork is charged to reduce eh static, airflow INCREASES

[@joeydelmarsjr.646]

@@servicetechokc ideal is .5wc . higher static pressure means less air flow restriction lower cfm's

[@theairconditioningguy]

Wow look at the difference on low speed.