Guitar Focal Dystonia - a Musicians Nightmare!

Guitar Focal Dystonia - Well, thanks to you all, I have finally worked out what I've been suffering from for the past few months.
I had no idea that a condition like this existed, but unfortunately it does and I found out the hard way!
Musicians Focal Dystonia is a Neurological condition that affects the muscles involved in the play of a musical instrument. It's so strangely task specific, and seems to only affect movements that have been heavily practised.
In this video I talk about how I learned of the condition, how it affects me and demonstrate it in action.
The original article that led me to a diagnosis is here...
classicalguita...

[@christsservant5472]

I am so sorry you are going through this. I am a pianist that was diagnosed with focal dystonia a few months ago. It's so awful! :( I am praying for you Steve. God is the only answer to this nightmare. Jesus please help us!

[@DavidYarber]

So much more than a phenominal guitar teacher, an example of true humility and grace.

[@jazzalmenasmusic]

Steve. I admire you. I have overcome medication induced dystonia, plus it also hindered all my nerve functions including stuff as autonomous as bowel movement and other embarrassing performance conditions. Today I can say I'm at 70% and since I did the technique revisiting, and I had a chance to redo myself, sort of like Pat Martino in a smaller scale. If I can,.you, master, can overcome this, too! I will be rooting for you! Thanks for the lessons and that good vibe!

[@cshaneeagle]

I can’t watch the way you play while dealing with this. It just broke my heart. I have HUNDREDS OF HOURS of practice with your videos. You are my primary teacher. I practice on a cup and steering wheel and ... lol I will send you some videos of how your teachings have impacted my playing.

[@TheReapersmoke]

Hi Steve - so sorry to hear about your condition. The fact that you are looking forward to playing with a pick shows how much you love playing guitar and how passionate you are about music, no matter the setback. I truly admire this about you and I'll pray for your recovery. I haven't played guitar for more than a year but your message reminded me what music and guitar means to me. Thank you and I wish you the best.

[@SteveGilson]

Thanks a lot, I appreciate it.

[@greenatom]

I wish you the best Steve. It must be very frustrating.Thank you for sharing your story; it will undoubtedly help others. You are STILL an AMAZING guitarist.

[@RandySchartiger]

33 years ago I was performing banjo and practiced from 6 to 18 hours every day and my playing started to get worse, no one could tell me why my hands wouldn't work no matter how much I practiced. in December last year I discovered trying to play again with gloves on and finger tips cut off. it's a miracle! problem still isn't solved and I have 33 years of practice to make up, but the fact I am able to do something I love again after all these years is truly a miracle to say the least! all the best to you my friend, it certainly is a nightmare to any musician who suffers this.

[@SteveGilson]

There's a Bass player with a channel on here, that wears a glove for this very same reason. Here's him talking about it. kzbin.info/www/bejne/rYC5eKV9d8qkn6s Unfortunately it makes no difference to me at all.

[@yvettemarie3853]

Hello , i do have problems with my right hand , what kind of glove did you used ?

[@SteveGilson]

The gloves didn't help me, but Scott from Scott's bass lessons are helped by them. kzbin.info/www/bejne/l2Wud3Z6fr54h68 The gloves he uses are these, I think... www.amazon.co.uk/Guitar-Glove-Bass-Musician-Practice/dp/B01C4QYLSE/?th=1

[@michaelasydow9502]

Yes gloves is lovely. I always have one glove with open fingers. The finger works better when i have the glove.

[@michaelmackenzie2569]

Steve so glad you have begun to arrive at a diagnosis. Really hoping things work our with you hospital. Take good care, Mike

[@SteveGilson]

Thanks Michael, I appreciate all of your help with this!

[@michaelmackenzie2569]

@@SteveGilson Anytime my friend. I PMd you some additional resources on your Patreon account. Hope they are of use!

[@adlibriffin]

Hi Steve, I've had this condition in my right hand ring finger for many years. For me it was definitely related to a sudden increase in the intensity and length of time I was putting in with my right hand fingerpicking technique. I am not a doctor but I believe that the sudden increase of practice intensity and concentration shocks the brain and somehow puts the brain out of sync with the fingers. One observation of mine has been that I had noticed if I play the guitar right after I wake up I do not experience the symptom very much at all, but it is when I start thinking about what I am doing that the symptom comes back. I've found that if I play extremely slowly while paying close attention to how far my ring finger is moving and preventing it from swinging too far towards the palm and too far away from the palm, I can better control the symptom and retrain the brain and hand. Relaxiation is extremely important to make this happen. Also, practicing in your minds eye through visualization helps to minimize the threat of an overuse condition. One final word, and that is try to avoid playing classical right hand fingerpicking techniques on an electric guitar because the tighter string spacing causes the the right hand to be in a more cramped position. A classical guitar with it's wider string string spacing allows the right hand to be more open and relaxed. All the best to you!

[@SteveGilson]

Thanks for giving your insights, I've noticed the decrease in symptoms first thing too.

[@PoPo-xp7yk]

So good to see you feeling better about things. You've given me some of the best fretboard insights i've ever had. I have no doubt you'll be doing the same with the plectrum. Looking forward to it!

[@achichilha]

Steve, I'm wishing you that you continue motivated to play the guitar. I'll check your videos regularly to see your process. Cheers my friend!!!

[@stevieboy444]

I'd never heard of this either Steve. I'm really sorry. Please keep us posted. You're still a great player.

[@oriventura]

My story and so many others exactly. Be strong and keep going. Recovery is possible.

[@SteveGilson]

I'm making progress, albeit slow. but enough to know that theirs light at the end of the tunnel. Thanks for the comment.

[@rixonida]

As you said...new direction, new areas to explore. Let them take over.Thanks so much for what you're doing.Wish you all the best and good luck

[@oscarjavier0725]

Very sorry to hear about your situation M. Gilson, you're an excelent teacher. Hope you recover soon

[@MovieMaker309]

Sorry to hear you're going through such a difficult time Steve. I wish you well xx

[@ZoomRmc]

Hope you'll recover in no time! Most musicians I know who have this condition adapt by applying some alternative technique, and they tend to still sound and play great (a person is most probably persistent and capable of hard work to get FD in the first place), so don't worry!

[@SteveGilson]

Yes It's probably true that you have to work really bloody hard to get this :D I'll find a path through it, I'm just glad I have some idea as to what's happening to me.

[@grahamjenkin2882]

Thanks for sharing - stay positive & enjoy the new direction that circumstances have thrown you. Your positivity is inspirational...!!

[@martinlmguitarcorner]

Thank you for showing this to us and letting us know. Wouldn't have known about that, and as someone picking a lot, it certainly is a good thing to know. All the best to you.

[@damien6685]

I couldn't help but smile. Occasionally life hits us with a complication that forces a total rethink of what we consider normal. There are a number of ways to face this, one is to passively accept that all that was good has gone. Another is to look at it as a new and exciting change full of undiscovered challenges and quests, and a heap of fun. You appear to have viewed it with the second option. As I said last week, I'm looking forward to watching your journey with the plectrum.

[@SteveGilson]

Thanks Damien, I must admit that I've spent some time in the first option too, but ultimately the second option is the only way to move on.

[@xy_kkm]

I'm literally crying while watching you play because I've been suffering with the same symptoms for the past month or so. At first I was wondering why almost suddenly I can't play the technique I could before, and naturally I practiced more, which made things worse. Then it was probably last week, I realized my figure started to shake when I play certain techniques or when it's at a specific position. But it's totally fine at other times, no problem when I play another instrument. Even my left hand is better than my right hand now. Thank you so much for sharing this. Even though I still feel so sad about the fact that it's probably impossible to fully be cured... But at least I know what it is and what caused it now. We'll go from here and see. Best wishes to you.

[@SteveGilson]

Very sorry to hear about your problems. I wish I had better news for you, but I'm still suffering from it. I am still playing and gigging though, but these days with a pick. There's a lot of information online about it if you look. There's a good scientific paper online at google. I cant link to it but I can tell you how to find it.. Go to scholar.google.com Search for "A motor control model of task-specific dystonia and its rehabilitation" Then click on the [PDF] link on the right. The other person I'd recommend viewing is Akiko Trush kzbin.info/door/JYNKqX6JZ7Bprcd7bnEb4gvideos Good luck with it and let me know how you get on.

[@Andrew-vj7gw]

Steve, I too have struggled with a degenerative hand condition in both hands (Dupuytren's contraction) and can sympathize with the struggle and loss of skill. My guitar abilities, while modest, have benefited tremendously from the clarity of your lessons. Thanks so much. I'm still trying to extract as much joy as possible with a hope towards improving my playing. I find any gains are deeply satisfying and, like you, I have had to adapt and refocus on a new direction to get them. Your Fan (from USA), Andrew

[@SteveGilson]

Sorry to hear that Andrew, but I'm glad I've been able to help you!

[@kindnick58]

You should speak to, Scott Devine.. He's had this condition for a long time.. He can probably help.. Scott's bass lessons.... A proper diagnosis is a blessing, I was misdiagnosed once and it was a nightmare. Have you ever tried going to a chiropractor? A good adjustment May be beneficial

[@SteveGilson]

Hi Nicholas, yes I found Scott's channel, and found it useful to hear his experiences, though I couldn't find a direct email address for him. It's often a problem for the bigger channels.

[@kindnick58]

I'll keep poking around

[@yeesenchai]

@@SteveGilson Check out his video of why he wears a glove when he play bass, the glove kinda fix his focal dystonia

[@SteveGilson]

@@yeesenchai Thanks, yes I saw and tried it, but wearing gloves had no effect on my condition.

[@marclopez4269]

thank you for your strength and inspiration.

[@erikpeterson836]

Thank you for sharing. You have amazing gifts and I’m sure you’re playing and teaching will translate well using a pick.

[@SteveGilson]

Thanks Erik. I haven't given up on regaining my old skills, but it's been a tougher journey than I thought it would be,

[@andressanchez4545]

I'd like to share a thaught with you. I've learned by now (as you may have as well) that all in life is mostly about adaptation, in every step of the way. I feel this is no different. You have the right state of mind and energy to mold and reshape once again whats been put in front of you, as i am sure you must have done already through life. Mastering your instrument is proof enough. I am sure you'll readapt and even gain new insight from your instrument and because of it. I hope it makes sense. Best wishes from Argentina.

[@rebutineur]

thank you for sharing so much of it. Good luck for the pick ! have fun !

[@ChristopherClarkeGuitarist]

Your tremolo looks exactly like mine! Many years ago, I was an aspiring classical guitarist but I haven't been able to play since developing focal dystonia. I had participated in and won one competition and was practicing Etude No. 1 by Villa Lobos for another and trying to compensate for my ring finger's relative weakness in that piece's repetitive arpeggio. As an aside, I think the Etude's particular right hand fingering pattern was a contributory factor to my developing focal dystonia. Although the disparity in strength between digits is anatomical, I was trying to achieve the same tone in the weaker finger and within minutes, it began curling into the palm of my hand and subsequently began affecting me in daily life. The condition in my case would therefore better be described as dystonic cramp. At the time, one specialist suggested I subconsciously didn't want to perform and attributed the symptoms to a psychological response. Another specialist suggested I try relearning the instrument left-handed. Hypnosis, carpal tunnel injections, Alexander Technique, acupuncture etc were all explored, although I recall opting not to receive the neurotoxic protein, Botulinum. Trihexyphenidyl seemed to provide some relief but the side effects were horrendous. Understanding of the symptoms of focal dystonia have moved on significantly and I'd be keen to explore the latest treatments here in Australia, not with the objective of playing the guitar again but to alleviate the ongoing arm and shoulder pain. In the early days, prior to the Internet, I started wrapping tape around my fingers and used a mirror to alter the stimulus to my brain. This would also be feasible with a glove as mentioned elsewhere in the comments. However, I found that I could make promising advances only for the relearning of the movements to revert to its dysfunctional state and I'd essentially be back to where I started soon after. After years sitting alone and trying to fix the problem, I eventually resigned myself to never playing again. Now, I regret the non-productive years and wish I'd devoted my time to another creative outlet. Later, I did play some plectrum guitar but the movement issue also became apparent in my limited right hand fine control.

[@SteveGilson]

Sorry to hear that! It's so frustrating. I haven't given up on trying to play fingerstyle, but I only use a pick when I'm performing these days, but I know that's not so straight forward if Classical guitar is your focus.! There's an interesting paper online that gives some approaches, that the authors have said are promising. I cant directly link to it, but I can tell you how to find it.. Go to scholar.google.com Search for "A motor control model of task-specific dystonia and its rehabilitation" Then click on the [PDF] link on the right. Saying that I haven't had much success with it yet, but it gives you some ideas as to where the latest research is looking.

[@ChristopherClarkeGuitarist]

@@SteveGilson Thank you.

[@KunchangLeeMusic]

So sorry brother that you’re going through this 🙏

[@brianmcginn6237]

Hey Steve. Sorry to hear about your struggles. I’ve definitely found your fingerstyle lessons to be inspirational. Best of luck with your new direction. Just a thought, I recall reading an article years ago about Badi Assad, a Brazilian guitarist who contracted FD. The article described her troubles, and the hard work she had to do, but she ultimately fully recovered, if I remember correctly. Not to give false hope, but you may want to research her story to uncover some things you might try. If I find the article again, I will post a link or send you a copy.

[@SteveGilson]

Thanks Brian, I'm still trying to investigate and understand the condition, so any new information is helpful.

[@cshaneeagle]

Your teqnique is FAR SUPERIOR and will live on in me and my 11 year old daughter who is my first student of your teqnique. My own specific technique is called ‘CALAMITY PICKING’ but it’s largely based on your ideas and philosophies. Thank you for all your years and wisdom!

[@SteveGilson]

Thanks Shane! who knows how things will develop over time, I wish you and your daughter the very best of luck though.

[@izzy3131]

@@SteveGilson I'm an acoustic fingerstyle player and coming across your tremolo technique is what inspired me to finally pick up an electric. You're awesome, man.

[@SteveGilson]

@@izzy3131 Thanks Issaah!

[@eddyeddy2887]

Hi Steve, do not worry too much. You will be absolutely back to yourself very shortly. Please only keep a positive mind and wish for the betterment. The mind is a very poweful god's gift. You will be surprised to hear stories of bedridden people who have started walking only due to the power of wishing. So just wish and be positive this is only a small hurdle, you will jump over it. May God bless you with all his might.

[@nigelrees2804]

Steve, you have given so much to the guitar community and I am deeply sorry to hear of your problem. I'm not sure that if in your research you have come across - David Leisner who is a classical guitarist and suffered from Focal Dystonia. He has written a book called "Playing With Ease" which is a description of " a healthy approach to guitar technique". He goes into his story and describes the approach he used to cure himself. I think you would find it a useful tool to assist. Hope this helps. Kind regards from Australia, Nigel Rees

[@SteveGilson]

Thanks Nigel, very helpful, I'll follow up on that for sure!

[@lancemorrison8496]

@@SteveGilson David Leisner is definitely the person to seek out. He cured himself by focusing on the larger muscles of the arm, shoulder and back. I’ve been dealing with dystonia since 2004 and it’s frustrating but there’s hope: I had FD in college in the 80s but after about 2 years it totally cleared up! I had no idea how or why. 20 years later it came back (obviously I’m susceptible to it), but there’s always a chance that it will clear up again.

[@cellardwellerproductions5125]

Steve, So very glad you can put a name on it and now have a heading. Being close in age this is something that hits home when it concerns the hands, fingers, wrists and associated discomforts. Don't both of the two middle fingers share common ligaments or tendons further up the back of the hand? As far as going mad, so many throwaway idiosyncrasies can be easily dismissed, and in this day and age may be praised as being normal. Maybe something to work on in your spare time. Be well and thank you, always looking forward to your next video.

[@Paljk299]

I'd heard of focal dystonia. I've had problems with carpal tunnel syndrome for a long time and read about dystonia when investigating that. It's a shame for you sorry! But you sound like you have the perfect approach and attitude to it all. I had a lot of problems and frustration with Carpal Tunnel, but thankfully some changes, lifestyle, instrument, and technique helped resolve it mostly for now, without surgery. I'm way more conservative with chord voicings, string gauge, practice time, etc. now. Though honestly, I'm playing better than ever in some ways I think. I'm very aware now these problems could come back or another could occur that limits my playing. I've spent some time on piano and music production. It's nice to have different options. Fundamentally we have to be a bit philosophical about these things like you said. I feel for musicians who earn their sole living from performance who become injured, it's a hard blow.

[@stuartarnold4495]

Thanks for the update on a condition not so well known. I think that your positive way of looking at your style and going to practice using the plectrum instead is to be admired. Is hybride picking also a no go. Looking forward to your revised style videos. Take care

[@SteveGilson]

Hi Stuart, Thanks! Hybrid picking seems different enough for me to be able to do it right now.

[@drregemv]

Steve I have gone exactly through the same experience. Only difference is that I have made very significant recovery by taking forward the the method shared by American guitarist Leisner. I am a physician & I could identify that all those having FD of right hand are deploying muscles of forearm EXCESSIVELY. It's too long to text it all Any interested can seek free help as I know how depressing it is to lose dexterity.

[@SteveGilson]

Yes I spoke to him briefly and got his book too. Its not an approach that I've spent much time on, but I'll give it another look.

[@ProSpeedflying]

Thanks a lot for this video Steve! I have the same but opposite problem with my right hand. I want to play with a pick, heavy riffs and leaks with a lot of palm muting, Buckethead style music... And the first 3-4 months of my guitar journey was great, but then my wrist motion was switched off. I found other ways of motion and pick grab and it was good and progressing at the beginning and then again switched off. And again and again. It is really breaking my heart. But now I've started playing with my fingers. It is constantly getting better, giving me an opportunity to be in a music world. Maybe I will find my style with this technique. Or maybe the left handed guitar is my option. What I can't understand is that focal dystonia is a problem of 1-2% of professional musicians with years and years of practicing, so why me, a beginner with 1 year of practicing?

[@SteveGilson]

I'm really sorry to hear that. I'm finally beating it, what was a full on dystonic reaction is now a very mild twitch that affects me when I play the most advanced stuff. I am intending to talk about how I've worked on it over the years, but I want to completely deal with it before I do that. What I can say is that... 1. it's a neurological condition, it's not a physical condition, there's nothing physically wrong with your hands etc. 2. It's a real condition, that shows up in brain scans, it's not just faulty thinking that you could for example, hypnotise away, but... 3. For lots of people there's trauma or childhood trauma, or chronic stress going on during the onset of the condition. 4. The condition itself creates stress, anger, depression etc. which continues to feed it. 5. Rehabilitation included rebuilding the damaged neurological pathways. Much as a stroke victim who is paralysed can relearn how to control their limbs, you can rebuild the neurological pathways that allow you to play again. So the steps to resolving it are different for everyone, but broadly... 1. Deal with the trauma/ childhood trauma/ stress that was around when it started. Get counselling or whatever you need. It'll make you a happier person. 2. Let go of the negative emotions that it creates in you. They reinforce it and block your path to recovery. Learn mindfulness/ meditation. When you rehab have a curious, mindful mindset rather than an emotional negative mindset. 3. If possible don't approach playing as a musician, approach it as someone rehabilitating an injury. Musician's care about the music they play and will instinctively do what they need to do to sound good, not what is best for the injury. So in your case use fingerstyle to get your musician "hit" and only play with a pick when you're rehabilitating the condition. 4. Don't try to work around it by holding your hands in weird ways or trying to force through it, or changing your technique. You are just reinforcing the condition and also stacking these strange movements on top of the dystonia. This whole ugly mess then gets a training effect and gets reinforced. You want to be able to play normally again, so that is what you should always try to do. 5. The rehab involves looking for the "edges" of the condition. These are the movements where you just start to feel it coming on. Then your focus is to relax away any unwanted tension anywhere in your body. Then look for another one. When I started, my first "edge" was holding my hand, in a relaxed state, near the strings, without trying to play anything. My fingers would twitch and pluck the strings on their own. so my first goal was to relax that away. 6. Don't have any expectations about how long it will take, or how quickly it will clear. This feeds into creating a negative emotional mindset. 7. When looking for "edges" everything is up for grabs, don't just play normally. I've don't some of the weirdest, totally unusable techniques that have nothing to do with playing the guitar. You're in a rehab mindset not a musician's mindset. There's no such thing as bad technique. Progress is not linear. you can feel like nothing is happening for ages and then one day. you're suddenly able to do something you weren't before.

[@ProSpeedflying]

@@SteveGilson thanks a lot for this detailed and structured answer! It helps me a lot to understand what is going on, not only wandering around. Also it helps me a lot mentally, knowing that I'm not alone in this little hell and someone is succeeding in this battle. Just in case you need some statistics for your work and teaching I can share more about my fight. With videos, detailed descriptions and surcamstanses. Thanks again for your help and kindness Steve!

[@Pook1914]

Hello Steve, I am a professional musician who has a degree in classical guitar, but I am also very adept with a pick. A couple of years ago I experienced the same type of thing in my right hand, only it was my a finger that would curl up into my hand forcing me to swing it out and hope for the best. Needless to say it was devastating. The a finger will curl up into my hand when I use ANY right hand techniques; im rest strokes? up goes the a finger. Arpeggios? Up goes the a finger. My tremolo, which was very good, is now a shambling mess. The a finger is just clumsy when I do use it. I also get great discomfort in my arm as I attempt to control my hand. After around 10 minutes of playing I am done, and I can feel the pressure in my forearm for hours after. I can still play slow, very easy student pieces, but all my concert material is gone, and my a finger will often misfire or miss. I feel for you as I am going through the same thing. I am fortunate as I was already very accomplished with the use of the pick, so now almost all of my playing is pick based. No more classical guitar-wedding gigs for me, but my rock playing has never been better... so I guess there was an upside. I wish you all the best, sir.

[@SteveGilson]

Sorry to hear that Mark, I still suffer from it so have transitioned to a pick too. Like you say, its a huge shame to have to leave behind all of that technique and experience, but I'm enjoying playing with a pick too, and still get out and gig. I wish you well too.

[@drregemv]

Sir, I am in the same boat. I used to play with pick and also finger style. Initially I thought that I was not practicing enough!! I have taken Botox injections in affected muscle but it did not work. I found temporary relief with Lorazepam, but this needs expert's advice. I have been told to practice at very slow tempos to overcome this. I have now changed my grip & use a devise named `Pykmax' to overcome the disability.

[@SteveGilson]

I'm still able to play with a pick, so I'm lucky from that point of view. I wish you the very best of luck with your own journey and hope you're able to overcome it.

[@mrtrista007]

Hi, im a dystonia patient aswel be it generalized though. Its been a nightmare . This video helped allot mentally

[@SteveGilson]

I'm sorry to hear that Tristan, but I'm very glad that I was able to help in some way - Steve

[@woot808]

I'm not sure how useful it would be for you considering how long you have been playing but Troy Grady has a wealth of knowledge regarding plectrum picking techniques on his channel.

[@SteveGilson]

Hi John, Yes I've been following Troy since he first started on KZbin. I've always been interested in the techniques, even though I haven't used them directly myself. I guess now is the time!

[@jazzguitarneophyte-christo7988]

So sorry to hear about this but looks like you are starting to rule out arthritis. I hope you get to the root cause and able to apply your technique again. Praying for you brother!

[@SteveGilson]

Thanks a lot!

[@stephenhodgeman6496]

1:02 Scott Devine(Scott's Bass Lessons) has that same thing. That's why he wears a glove on his fretting hand most of the time. He's even got a video explaining it. It sounds hard to deal with, but he doesn't let it get to him. I didn't know anything about it before he said he was diagnosed with it. I wish you the best as you find out more about it.

[@SteveGilson]

Thanks Stephen.

[@heldenby]

When this condition occurs in athletes they call it "the yips". When highly practiced and very "hard wired" fine motor skills suddenly go wrong after many years (typically the likes of golf, snooker, darts). I believe some part of the hard wired brain skill develops a short circuit and since it's a totally subconscious action it's almost impossible to consciously override. Best of luck with your diagnosis and treatment.

[@SteveGilson]

Thanks Alex

[@izzy3131]

I wonder how many musicians have experimented with psychedelics and this condition. If anything could help to re-rewire a brain...

[@burgessspeed70]

I'm going through the same thing but with my left hand! I've been to hand surgeon's, neurologists, acupuncturists, etc. , and nothing has worked. Just last week, another guitarist mentioned the term focal dystonia and how the Alexander Technique has helped musicians with this condition. This has been going on for several years now and is incredibly frustrating! I am starting to look into the Alexander Technique, as nothing else has been able to help me with this.

[@SteveGilson]

Yes it's horrendously frustrating isn't it! I'm still working through it, but I keep encountering people who have recovered from it, so don't lose hope. Here are a few things that have helped me in the past. Joaquin Fabra: kzbin.info/www/bejne/j3yqomyFhbNkb8U Akiko Trush: kzbin.info/door/JYNKqX6JZ7Bprcd7bnEb4g This is a useful interview... kzbin.info/www/bejne/m4Snm6WuotCCnqM The other thing to remember is that it has equivalences in all kinds of sports. for example The Yips in golf, "Dartitis" in Darts. I'm pretty sure that The Twisties in gymnasics is their equivalent of it. So sports science may give you some clues too. I haven't given up on it, and I feel like I'm making progress, you can bet when I have something definitive to say I'll talk about it on here. Good luck - Steve

[@burgessspeed70]

@@SteveGilson Thanks so much for your response, Steve. I will definitely check out those links. I will also share with you anything helpful that I may discover. I wish you the best and a full recovery!

[@satschel9273]

please stop waisting your time just write to me

[@daleschimpf]

Hey Steve. No doubt at least knowing what the condition is provides some level of comfort and as mentioned now leads to impetus to develop in other areas. Maybe you will become a heavy metal sweep picking monster! :-)

[@SteveGilson]

Thanks Dale, but I'm not sure I have the hair for it!

[@michaelasydow9502]

I think I have the same issue but I dont play anything. Work by computer. Really strange. My middle finger is dropping but it doesnt hurt. Really strange.

[@markgiglione9696]

This paper by Jason Solomon might be helpful: “What Every Guitarist Should Know: A Guide to the Prevention and Rehabilitation of Focal Hand Dystonia,” Guitar Review 133 (2007): 2-9. A PDF of the paper is downloadable at: citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.580.6486&rep=rep1&type=pdf Professor Solomon's page is: www.agnesscott.edu/music/faculty/jason-solomon.html

[@SteveGilson]

Thanks Mark! I'll give it a read later tonight.

[@markgiglione9696]

I hope the information is helpful. I came across this paper a few years ago when I was searching for articles on guitar related tendinitis and repetitive stress injuries. I had never heard of focal dystonia before reading Professor Solomon's paper. Thank you for all of the videos and instructional material you have shared.

[@armandom28]

have you maybe considered using a thumbpick instead of a pick? this way you may be able to retain some fingerstyle skill.....thanks for sharing your story.....

[@SteveGilson]

I experimented with one in my early years, and never really got on with it. Still, it's worth a try, who knows how things have changed over the years.

[@armandom28]

Steve Gilson - SixStringsAttachedTV Fred Kelly bumblebee thumbpicks use a pick for the blade and are adjustable.....that may help

[@2Langdon]

Glad to know you found the cause, very interesting. Err....just...don't go too hard on the picking practise maybe, and repeat the effect with that, too. Maybe, just lay back a little? New directions can be revelatory. Good luck.

[@SteveGilson]

Thanks, yes I'm being mindful of that for sure.

[@user-we8xh4ex6e]

Hello, Steve. Have you ever thought about surgery, like DBS ( deep brain stimulation)?

[@SteveGilson]

No I haven't. It is responding to therapy, albeit slowly, but I'm at the stage where I have a significant part of the movement back, and I only see dystonic symptoms for the very advanced stuff now.

[@greenatom]

I've just seen that Victor Wooten the bass player (one of the best) has dystonia.

[@SteveGilson]

Yes I saw him commenting on one of the dystonia forums that I'm in, a while ago. It's a huge shame.

[@ubershredder1989]

after 4 years or relentless practice and trial & error, i also recently realized without doubt that I have FD in my fretting hand. I am having difficulty playing stuff that I could play right off the bat without even practicing in my junior guitar years. Recently I flipped the guitar over, and my picking hand actually had more control and dexterity on the fret-board than my 'real' fretting hand. I've never even practiced fretting with my right hand! Crazy!!!! still don't know what approach to take... a lot of conflicting literature on this subject. Some therapists say they treated SOME patients successfully, but this is a very expensive and time consuming, as well as restrictive on what you can play. If anyone has hand any luck, please let me know!

[@SteveGilson]

Sorry to hear that. Yes, I did the same thing and found my other hand was so much smoother, even though I've never played like that.

[@ubershredder1989]

@@SteveGilson its really bad stuff. i am definately gonna have to go for an interventionary measure and try it with a therapist.. I've never put so much dedication, time and effort into something with zero reward like this before.

[@SteveGilson]

@@ubershredder1989 A few names are coming up regularly... Joaquin Farias: www.fariastechnique.com/, a researcher-clinician from the University of Toronto. David Leisner: davidleisner.com/articles/ a classical guitarist who was able to fix himself. I'm still investigating so cant recommend one or the other, but may be something for you to follow up with too?

[@ubershredder1989]

@@SteveGilson so far i am vaguely familiar with the following therapists: joaquin Farias Joaquin Fabras Yogi kent ponanna i know that the first are quite well known, but the third one is a guitarist which might be an added benefit. i also read about leisners approach, but i do know of some players (terry syrek) that didnt get results. ive pretty much accepted that i will never be able to figure this FD out by myself, no matter how hard i try. so now i just need to get my head around which one of those therapists im gonna use. do let me know if you also plan to go down that route! ;)

[@ubershredder1989]

@@SteveGilson this guy's results looked promising, though he doesnt seem active on YT anymore kzbin.info/door/3d0I9_I5BxyLtLoJXl5mrQ

[@bluxpretion]

I'm sorry things had to go so left, Mr. Gilson - I hope you make a full recovery as soon as time can permit; maybe Dr. John Bergman could help you out

[@bluxpretion]

He has a KZbin channel too, which is his name as mentioned above

[@SteveGilson]

Thanks! I'll check him out.

[@mugzycuts706]

I have to use my thumb on my cuts on my turntable

[@itsahsah]

Has anyone here tried any holistic approaches like acupuncture or, perhaps a visit with a behavioral psychologist or even doctor who specializes in sports medicine?

[@carvinsmith8068]

I have on my left hand, please help.

[@SteveGilson]

I feel for you, but I'm still working through it myself. There's a Facebook group called "Musicians With Focal Dystonia" which I keep an eye on, you could check that out?

[@christsservant5472]

I did take some lessons with a lady named Akiko. She had focal dystonia and healed herself and now helps others recover. My symptoms have lessoned from my lessons with her. Maybe she can help you. Her channel is called The Mindful Pianist. Maybe she can help you. I am still praying for you.

[@SteveGilson]

Thanks I have watched her videos in the past and found her approach helpful

[@christsservant5472]

@@SteveGilson How is your recovery going? My Neurologist wants to hold off on botox injections because he said over time it weakens the nerves. I have tried Occupational Therapy. It did nothing. Studying with Akiko did help and I see some improvements but I stopped lessons with her for now because she was teaching me a different way than my local piano teacher. My Neurologist said the pathways to my brain are all confused with this dystonia and I need to develop new pathways. I was just getting more confused because 2 teachers were telling me 2 different things. So instead of new pathways developing, I was just getting confused pathways. But the lessons with Akiko did help. I learned some great things with her that I will take with me. I am improved a lot but still have a pretty serious focal dystonia in both hands :( I cry a lot, almost every day about it. I've decided to just put it in God's hands at this point. Nothing is impossible with God. I am praying for God to heal you and make your focal dystonia go away 100%.

[@SteveGilson]

@@christsservant5472 Nothing has helped for me. I've had lots of false starts, where I've made a little progress, only to find that it returns to full strength a few days later. I can change my technique to use a pick and that is completely dystonia free, so I've taken a break from trying to resolve it and am just playing using that. I feel for you, its a very hard thing to have to deal with.

[@christsservant5472]

​@@SteveGilson I am so sorry. :( Glad you found a way to play dystonia free, with a pick- But I hope and pray you can also go back to playing without a pick eventually. I do not recommend the botox injections. They can ruin a musician in the long run. My dystonia is not affected when I play pieces with only chords, so I am stuck playing chords. If I play pieces with any scale like passages (or where I need to move from one finger to the next in any way) my dystonia is really REALLY bad. So I guess for now you can play with the pick only and I can play just chords. Glad we can at least play. Focal dystonia is a nightmare. I don't know why this came upon us but still believe with all my heart Jesus can heal us. There is another youtuber called: The Art of Piano Technique -that said the Lord healed her. I am putting my faith in God to heal us at this point. There is no other hope.

[@SteveGilson]

@@christsservant5472 Another name that has been mentioned a few times in the community is Ruth Chiles www.youtube.com/@FocalDystoniaCure She has a book out too, which is reasonably priced. I've heard some positive comments about her, but haven't committed myself to her approach significantly enough to say whether or not it has helped me yet.

[@mysterybotts]

Does this affect your ability to play in a hybrid picking style? I assume it would but that could be a cool direction (I’m sure that you’re already aware of that though) if the feeling is different enough from full fingerstyle

[@SteveGilson]

Hi Yes, I've been experimenting with that too. I've not really noticed it being affected by the dystonia, which is very positive, so I'll keep exploring it.

[@Hinderlengjes]

It's really weird that you can still do it on a cup. I don't suppose there's any chance that a different type of guitar - classical, acoustic - and/or held a different way - e.g. in non-classical position on the other knee - might make any difference? Just throwing things out there...

[@SteveGilson]

Yes it's weird isn't it! I tried so many different things in the last 4 months. Nothing has really helped, which is why I sometimes wonder if "doing nothing" is exactly the right thing to do....

[@Hinderlengjes]

@@SteveGilson I've always argued that doing nothing is vastly underrated...!

[@Icedsymphony7]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/nH_JoH6uZ92orbc You might find this interesting it's christian muenzner explaining how he deals with focal dystonia using a glove.despite the guy makes the most inspiring music

[@rafaelrodriguezserrat6966]

Hi Steve. I have the same condition on my index finger (flamenco finger style playing). Started on January 2021. Just wondering how are you doing now and if you've found something that works. Thanks!

[@SteveGilson]

Hi Rafael, I feel like I'm making some progress but I still have a long way to go too. I don't have any great revelations to give you, but I do believe that it has an emotional/ stress component so I make sure I let go of that before doing any rehab. Beyond that I look for movements that where I feel a mild hint of dystonia then relax into it and let it go while repeating that movement. I'm waiting until I've cleared it before I talk too much about rehab though, because I've had so many false starts and been down so many blind alleys that I don't want to lead anyone on until I've truly found something that works for me.

[@cjmeadors]

I discovered my focal dystonia about 4 years ago. Looking back, I now believe I’ve had it twice throughout my career. Once around 1992 trying to sweep like Frank Gambale (screwed up my RH alternate picking) and the 2nd was many years later attempting to play difficult classical pieces, which screwed up my ring finger. I consider myself fully recovered from the 1st one, but some things still feel different. It’s hard to explain, but I think what happened is my brain eventually rewired itself to different muscle groups. The one I’m working on now is at about 85-90%, but if I practice too long, I can feel it starting to return. When that happens, I generally take a break for a few days. Anyway, the best thing I’ve found is to practice on as forgiving of a tone as possible. For example, avoid cheap guitars, amps, etc. which goes without saying. Also, sustaining effects such as compression, delay, reverb, etc. are your friend. It’s only for practicing but takes the pressure off and helps to get the ears and harsh judgement out of the way. Also, try not to look at the hands. The idea is to recapture that old feeling of relaxation, rebuild confidence, then slowly wean yourself back to practicing normal.

[@terrypoirier4838]

Could you reverse the tremelo technique? Instead of 3,2,1 learn it 1,2,3 ? You said the transition from 3rd finger to 2nd finger specifically. Does it happen between the 1st finger to 2nd finger transition?

[@SteveGilson]

Hi Terry, yes I can and this was something that I was experimenting with. it seems to be an evolving condition though. Its almost like similar movements get "infected" with it if I start pushing them too hard, which is one of the reasons why I decided to just stop practising fingerstyle. (The movement of a pick seems very different so I don't have the same concern).

[@terrypoirier4838]

Sorry to hear that. It's so bizarre. Try to stay positive. At least you can still play and your picking skills will get crazy. Can't wait to see where you take that technique. Good luck.

[@JohnAmatulli]

Thanks so much for sharing. So interesting because one of my other KZbin subscription follows is Scott Devine of Scott's Bass Lessons (like you sharing some brilliant stuff btw) and he plays with gloves because he also suffers from Focal Dystonia. He talked about it back in 2016 here kzbin.info/www/bejne/rYC5eKV9d8qkn6s I think it is great to take a break from this technique for a while and flat picking. It is great to have both. Hybrid picking in particular seems like it would fit you very well. Perhaps if you take enough time you may be able to return in a while. As someone who has worked a good bit with AI and studied much of what we know about the nervous system to apply it to machine learning (which is very much like teaching a child. practice practice practice.) I actually feel confident that you will find a "cure". A possible solution may come from a different direction like Scott found. A little experimentation over time may yield positive results. Something involving tiny amounts of electrical stimulation to the hand while playing, acupuncture, pressure (like the glove, finger picks, heavy rings) or something else that forces enough of a change to the feeling or technique that your nervous system isn't running the same exact program. I read somewhere recently (couldn't find it) that there is evidence that "muscle memory" may actually be retained further on the periphery than previously believed. Not just in the brain and spinal cord but actually in the hand and along the whole line. Something to do with measuring the amount of time it took and the amount of information being faster than what it would take for the entire electrical impulse to have come from the brain. To me the "muscle memory" techniques we develop are like "macros" and given the previous info part of these may be stored locally. When you start out you have to move every finger manually into place, eventually you develop a single command for the technique. In this case you have that command labeled TREM and have a lot of development time but now it has a bit of a bug. Perhaps you need a to reboot it somehow. Best of luck and I look forward to seeing whatever great lessons and info you decide to share.

[@SteveGilson]

Thanks John, Yes I tried a glove, but no luck. It's very early days though so who knows how things will develop after some time off. Yes I've been experimenting with hybrid picking, it seems to work for me, as I guess it's different enough to finger picking to use a different pathway?

[@verystablegenius9317]

Have you tried doing tremolo p i m a?

[@SteveGilson]

It's a strange condition that evolves and morphs over time, it cot considerably worse than this video. At it's worst, I couldn't hold my left hand near guitar strings without my middle finger randomly plucking them - Like an uncontrollable Tourette's tick. I'm in a much better place now, I know how to work on it and have got to a place where I have most of my movement back. The tremolo is probably the last technique I need to rehabilitate. One of the things I realised is that ignoring the condition and working round it (such as using pima) is not that helpful. It's better to take on each manifestation of the condition and clear it. Which is what I'm working on right now with the tremolo. I'm feeling pretty positive that I'll beat it one day!

[@biospheres]

Guitarthritis is a real common affliction with repetition, fixation of movements plus the modern denatured diets, pesticide, herbicides & toxins almost everywhere that weren't here a hundred years ago give your odds of not getting a structural disorder rare....I look at Keith Richards fingers and shudder.

[@dlodoshagging5324]

Are u fine now?

[@SteveGilson]

Unfortunately not, I still have it. I can play and gig using a pick though so that's something. but I'm unable to do the most basic of fingerpicking techniques these days.

[@dlodoshagging5324]

@@SteveGilson i’m watching ur lessons as an aspiring guitarist from Bangladesh. Its been only a year ive picked up the guitar. Watching u play the tremolo on a Lead guitar struck a chord in me like no other. Im practicing your technique day n day out.. i used to think IF I COULD JUST play a run like u for once.. i’ll have no regrets even if my hands were chopped off.. and now, hearing about ur problem frightens me. But i will not stop. We Bangladeshis still value virtuoso . My heart goes out to u Dada 🙏🏻 P.S. u dont post much of your playing. If u have any covers or any live gig videos please post or link them please if they’re on youtube. I must master ur skill and if god wills.. enhance it.

[@theguitarzone767]

Have you tried relaxing when playing? I've had this 10 years but for a while ive been focusing on playing super relaxed and small movements and it's working..

[@SteveGilson]

Yes, that's one of the things I've been doing too, and I think it's very important. I feel like I'm about 95% through it and feel like the end is in sight. Thank for the comment.

[@theguitarzone767]

Is that with your old fingerstyle technique or with the pick? Also it could be cramp where a lot of the muscle fibres are bunched up. This could be causing the tension. In this situation you have to locate the area where it's tight (it's quite tender) and massage until it loosens up. The tight area will feel like a thick guitar string.@@SteveGilson

[@SteveGilson]

Thankfully I can play with a pick without any dystonic symptoms, which means I'm still able to gig etc. For me, the issue is only related to fingerstyle technique. I feel like I'm on the way to beating it though. @@theguitarzone767

[@theguitarzone767]

One thing that i've found last few days that really helps is to be constantly relax as much as possible. If you think you're as relaxed as possible try to relax some more. You'll find you can and the dystonic symptoms fade away even more. They might come back but that's when you try to relax even more again. And again the symptoms fade away some more. This tends to work well.`And focus on not just focusing on relaxing your hand but everything, your hands, arms, shoulders, breathing, not just the hand.@@SteveGilson

[@SteveGilson]

@@theguitarzone767Yes that's something that I've been doing as well. It's also somewhat aligned with what Ruth Chiles does, www.youtube.com/@FocalDystoniaCure

[@julioseviltwin2304]

Hi Steve, have you a public email address one can contact you on?

[@SteveGilson]

Yes, you should be able to reach me at [e-mail]

[@julioseviltwin2304]

@@SteveGilson Perfect. I'll mail you later this evening once I'm home. Thanks. 👍🏻

[@ZombieCurl]

Have you tried cannabis oil / Marijuana? Hugs mate!