Harley-Davidson X350 & X500 Hit Or Miss?

[@Ucmpigs]

Great points Eric! I actually think they are good looking bikes. As you mentioned, if HD will spin the "pitch" on these and price them conservative I think they could have a win. Especially for the new or even young rider who doesn't have "HD Cash right now. Gets them on an HD, yeah not American made but, an American company. This will influence this rider to maybe one day when their pockets are deeper to stay with the MoCO for a bigger purchase. Maybe a trade in incentive toward a V-Twin HD.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

This would be a good plan. However, I don't think the dealer network can keep it priced down. Look how they treated Buell.

[@tastroman]

As a lover of low cc bikes I hope they make these available to the public. I think it looks kind of cool. The biking community itself is somewhat to blame for the often distaste for small bikes. Many just don't take them seriously which is a shame as they can be great fun at an affordable price. If you arn't in a hurry 350cc's should be enough to take you about anywhere.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I couldn't agree more. These bikes could be the answer they're looking for if the dealers back them up and the pricing is in line with virtually the same bike under the Benelli marquee. Thank you for sharing your thoughts, sir. Eric

[@joelmclamore1898]

I rode a Honda 350-4 from nacadoches ,tx to San Antonio.The bike had no problem making that trip.Also rode a Honda 350 twin on short trips,Waco to San Antonio,or out to Kerrville,tx

[@VeteranBiker]

great perspective on a topic everyone needs to know about

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

Just one man's perspective who's been watching their business model for 4 decades. Thanks for the support Ben.

[@KazoMoto]

Very important info for people to know Eric. Well presented and articulated as usual 👍🏼

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

This is another off the beaten path topic for HD enthusiasts. After riding and watching their business model for 40 years, it will be interesting to see how it pans out. Thanks for the support.

[@602North]

Great points and exactly what I was thinking. It really hurts the brand. The people who will buy this are people who couldn’t afford an HD typically but want to say “I’ve got a Harley”. Massive fail for HD’s reputation. That’s what happens when you hire a CEO who’s claim to fame is selling shoes 😂.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

The real issue to me is the dealer network. They're a bunch of pirates and need to tone it down for the new buyers to retain their business. Thanks for chiming in RJ!

[@mikeskidmore6754]

@@KrakensGarageandAdventures HD Corporate is Promoting the MEGA Dealers and cutting off bikes from the Family owned Independant Dealer.. My Local Power Sports Dealer started by a Husband and Wife started in 1968 sold out and retired 5 years ago. They sold out to a MEGA car Dealer.. All the Good Parts and Sales People quit. I don't know about service but the shop rate was $120.00 per hour 2 years ago .. They don't stock much clothes or riding gear anymore.. The Previous dealer was doing close to $1 Million per month in online sales.. I still use Cycle parts Nation to buy OEM parts at 10% or 20% off I used to get up to 40% off in the past when I knew the parts people and fixed a few bikes for friends.. Their Shipping prices are really high but I live 8 miles away and can pick up in person . Honda , Yamha , Suzuki , Kawasaki KTM & Indian .. During the Plandemic all they had on the show room floor were Chines Dirt bikes a new line for them ..

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

@@mikeskidmore6754 100% correct!

[@ericsuperhawk]

I feel like this is going to be a punishment bike. If you walk into the dealership not having done any homework you're not going to know this bike has the highest percentage markup of anything sitting there. They are going to convince new Young Riders that this is a welcome to the family step and they are going to gain brotherhood with this bike. Nothing could be further from the truth. Most Harley-Davidson based riding clubs have a cc limit somewhere around 600 to 700 ccs. Any smaller than that and they don't want you along. Most dealerships when they have events don't even invite the local Harley-Davidson ride clubs to their events. They want people to buy a motorcycle and a bunch of gear so that they look like they ride in a club but they actually don't even want the clubs in their parking lot. This little bike ain't going to fit in anywhere. If they show up somewhere to ride with their friends and their friends are all on 900cc motorcycles or even something like a 500 cc Honda Rebel I doubt that little bike is going to hold its own and keep up very well. We already know a lot of the Harley Riders are going to snob this bike. When you pull up at the dealership they're probably going to take a good look at what you rode in there on. If you are in a nice truck or maybe you are wearing really nice clothes they're probably going to make fun of this motorcycle with you to make sure you buy something more expensive. If you look like you are just starting out in the world they are probably going to sell you this knowing you are about to become very upside down on it simply by leaving with it. Sad State of Affairs my friend.

[@mikeskidmore6754]

@@ericsuperhawk Why won't HD Club let me ride with them on my 1984 Yamaha RZ-350? Keep up .. I been blowing Harley's away for Decades on a 350 CC bike and before that I did it with a 1976 Yamaha RD-400-C

[@HarleyThrottleJuice]

I can tell you that the Street 500 was HUGE in Australia. Perhaps not elsewhere, but here in AUS they are everywhere. ✌️

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

They couldn't give them away in the US. Most were in the back of showrooms covered in dust....

[@snakebite6511]

Thats the problem with American's they can see beyond their own stupid borders and they think the entire world revolves around them.

[@SpyderWayne]

One has to wonder why Royal Enfield would choose to have their North American headquarters only 3 miles from Harley Davidson's headquarters in Milwaukee. Royal Enfield doesn't have any bikes that directly compete with HD bikes... but they are both competing for the most important key to growth... new customers to their brand. One of them has figured it out, the other keeps trying to figure it out. Only 3 miles away from each other... it sure looks like HD has noticed and have reacted with the strategy in this video. Very nice "Hit-or-Miss" review Eric 👊😎👍

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I thought the RE proudly made in India 🇮🇳 would grab your attention. 🤣 We shall see what happens as this all shakes down. Thanks, for always supporting what I'm trying to do with my channel, Wayne.

[@SpyderWayne]

@Kraken's Garage & Adventures Yep, how could I miss that part 😳😁, with what RE will be bringing to the U.S. this summer, and the hint of a 650 Himalayan adventure bike next year, I may end up with 3 RE's for the price of a Heritage Classic. I'd love to own an HD, but I never could get past the premium price, when all I'm trying to buy is to ride with a big ole smile on my face. 😊😁😄😃

[@RidingandWrenching]

An excellent, unbiased viewpoint. When the Ford Thunderbird was reintroduced, high dealer markups killed sales. I would be surprised if dealerships markup an entry level bike, but limited production models tend to see those markups.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

We shall see what happens in the near future. Buell comes to mind when I think about this topic. They're were in the back of the showroom, and the salespeople wanted no parts of even showing you them.

[@RoadReality]

You hit a big sticking point I have with dealers, and not just Harley, but many other brands, too: The Staff. My wife wanted to get a Street 750 at the same time I wanted to get a 2015 Street Glide Special. Instead of spending a few minutes trying to locate her a bike, since they didn't have one, the salesperson just gushed over the SGS, yada yada... fast forward a few minutes, and we walked out without buying ANYTHING. Without changing how the Staff approaches sales, they'll never move. It's like what the sales guy said when I took a LiveWire for a test ride: he said that people poo-poo the bike until they ride it. If you can get them on it, they want it. Same goes for almost any vehicle sale. All that aside, I'd love for Harley to have a great entry-level bike, even if it's more for the buyer to say, "I've got a Harley". Car manufacturers have been building loss leaders and low-margin cars for decades on the whole idea of getting younger buyers in and getting them hooked on your brand - when they've got more money, they'll come to your brand first to buy the more expensive model. And it works.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

All great poins, John! We shall see how this pans out, but I don't have high hopes for success. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

[@RoadReality]

@@KrakensGarageandAdventures Yeah man! I don't have high hopes either, but hope springs eternal, or something. Ride safe!

[@YouMotorcycle]

Just to clarify a point, not all made in America Harley-Davidson's will begin with VIN 1HD. VIN beginning with 1HD refers to domestic sale, whereas 5HD refers to international sale. So my V-Rod was made in Kansas City for sale in Canada, so it had a 5HD vin despite being made in America

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I have never hear that as the VIN has always defined the country origin. I'll have to look into this, and thanks for the heads up Adrian.

[@YouMotorcycle]

@@KrakensGarageandAdventures It's what we use over here to know if the Harleys were made for Canada (5HD) or made for the US market (1HD). The 1HD VINs will typically sell for less as most imports do, people tend to trust them less and assume whoever brought them in did so because they got a bargain that should be passed on. Logic (or lack of) aside, that's how she goes :)

[@RodKrisBisdakMotovlog0627]

That's really cool and interesting discussion bro. Keep it up and more vidz to come brother.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

Thank you for commenting.

[@TheSlab24]

Good thoughts Eric, the quality of the bike and enjoyment of the bike is it's worth - but so is the price people are willing to pay, and the mindset of the salespeople. Street 500s are common in Australia, these things can sell well when promotion and other things are somewhat on balance. I hope it goes well, I'd like to see Harley have a good prosperous future.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I, too, wish them all the best. We shall see how this pans out. Just sharing my thoughts of things to come. Thanks for sharing your thoughts, Nic.

[@harindranathghosh1283]

very logical and honest evaluation of the upcomin bikes with available data.... much appreciated

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

We shall see how this plays out. Thank you for stopping by and commenting. Eric

[@gasmann6746]

If only they would listen to you..👍🏻🇦🇺

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

We shall see how this shakes out. What comes to mind is how the sales reps treated Buell. Shoved in the back of the showroom, covered in dust, and they got annoyed to even show you the bikes. Thanks for leaving a comment. Eric

[@mikeskidmore6754]

Most HD Dealers hated Buells.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

True here in the east. Buell never had a chance, in my opinion, due to the dealer network. Thanks for stopping by sir.

[@BigBert]

Interesting Eric. My local deal advertises all prices on all there bikes maybe that’s why they sell so many and to other states.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

Maybe it's a US tactic? Sooner or later (here in the US), the cradle will fall, I suspect. We shall see how this pans out in the long run. Thanks for commenting, Bert.

[@browngreen933]

The upside to the China-Davidson is the extensive Harley-Davidson dealer network. Benelli has no dealer network. Price gotta be right tho.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I agree, the dealer network for Benelli is terrible. I don't think a HD dealer will be able to control themselves and will gouge on the fees. Excellent point on your part!

[@HDVIBE]

It will be interesting to see how these bikes are received. We will add 3 of the 350s to our Riding Academy fleet this season. I was at the dealership Saturday, and they haven't arrived yet but will soon. Great perspective as always. Ride safe and enjoy. 👍👊✌️

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I've been a customer for 40 years watching their business model. It will be interesting to see how this shakes out. Thanks for commenting, Rick.

[@HarleysDinersRides]

Hi Eric, Thanks for sharing I found this video interesting. I think you were right on with your points, cheers Dave

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I am just sharing a few thoughts after following HD for 40 years. Thanks for stopping by and commenting, Dave.

[@mikeskidmore6754]

I sat on one a week ago and Twisted the Throttle .. It stuck wide Open .. Benelli Designed a nice bike .. but the switch gear and controls is just a bit cheap .. Considering the throttle stuck any place I put it .. I thought these models have been built for a while for Benelli ..?

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

That sounds like a setup PDI issue to me. They're a solid bike, and yes, the switch gear and instruments are on the cheap end but function fine. To me, the weakest link is the pirate mentality of the dealer mentality that won't fly with a new buyer. Let alone entice them to return for a bigger bike. We shall see 👀!

[@mikeskidmore6754]

@@KrakensGarageandAdventures Last Summer I bought a 2008 Buell Ulysess for $4,500.00 ... I go ripping by other Harleys like they are sitting still on the Twisties.. When I sat on that Buell ..A Couple guys said that really suits you I'll bet you want to buy one. I was thinking but I already have Yamaha FZ-07 too and it's paid for far better bike with a bit more power. I have lubed the throttle cables on both of my street bikes never really had any issues with the throttle cables.. How on Earth can a mechanic at a Harley dealer set up a bike and put it on the show room floor with a sticking throttle ?

[@MinnowMoto]

Those bikes would need to be priced to sell. HD could make $$ on selling kits. Swap out some parts and turn it into a scrambler or a little adv bike. They would make great trail bikes. Enfield are on the showroom floor with the HD in Gettysburg last fall. I did not expect that. Love the topic. Would like to see the brand push in the right direction.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

Gettysburg is also a Vespa dealer of all things. I agree with having kits to make them into other bikes like the scrambler. Good call!

[@Petesmotoadventure]

Excellent points and well researched Eric. The dealerships do have a lot of leeway for sure. When I was shopping for my Pan America, 3 different dealers with 3 different prices, for the same bike. 1 was $2K over MSRP with the same options as the dealership I bought the bike from. You hit the nail on the head, it is the customers fault for letting the dealerships do it. When I buy new I wont pay a penny over MSRP. I want under MSRP. HDMC does need smaller displacement bikes, I don’t think partnering with the CCP will appeal to the US customer.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

It appears we are cut from the same cloth, Peter. I refuse to pay over MSRP for anything. I fear the MoCo is in for a rough ride in the future. Thanks for sharing your experience.

[@OutbackOutlaw]

HD got rid of the 500 in Australia and New Zealand. Makes perfect dumb sense to send em to America.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

From what I understand, the Street 500 and 750 sold like gangbusters in Oz. They couldn't give them away here in the US. We shall see soon enough. Thabks for commenting King 🤴 OO!

[@Free_Ranger_CT110]

I'm sure we all wish to see Harley prosper & attract new riders, is this the way? Personally I think they should have brought out a 500cc version of the Pan America adv bike which didn't need a step ladder to get on the thing or a second mortgage to purchase it. A collab with China will damage the HD brand, Harley stayed in business by doing what they do best, concentrating on the big twins.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I agree with you as I feel the small cc market has true potential. Tha KS for sharing your thoughts on this topic. Eric

[@PaulG75]

Great insight. To me that would never be a Harley. For those who would buy then if it was labeled as HD would be missing out on all of the customization through the aftermarket, which is one of the best things about the brand. I couldn’t agree more about the dealerships being the main problem for HD. You know I’m with you about not getting jerked around and finding a dealership that doesn’t play the games. Hope your enjoying your getaway.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

Down in FL sitting by the pool now trying to reply to everybody. 🤪🤣 The core of the problem to me, as stated in this video, is the dealer network. We both have lived the MoCo dream getting clowned at dealerships. A buyer has to be savvy and willing to travel to get a fair deal. Once again, I feel all I do is bang on Harleys balls. I hope they learn their lesson someday. Thanks for stopping by, brother.

[@unwrangler11]

Makes excellent sense, hopefully someone in The Motor Company pays attention to this!

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I hope so, too, as it's a solid bike. Tha KS for watching and commenting.

[@jonnymac8925]

These bikes aren't being sold in North America. I really dig your Roadster! I picked up a 2018 48 in 2019 for $9700 Canadian. I got an absolutely killer deal on it!

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

There were some great deals on Roadsters out there, and I'm glad yo hear you got one! I need to get back to finishing that build on th le Cafe racer. Thanks for commenting, Jonny.

[@MRGS48]

It’s definitely a miss for the US market because let’s face it who is going to buy such thing unless they live in a city… Now the Asian market-maybe even- Indian market is an effort of establishing a foothold for the MoCo. And that’s where the big bucks will come from to fuel our addiction of the better models here… Great vid Eric🤘

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

They will do well if they price it right for the Asia and Indian market. You have shopped a HD dealer. Do you really think they'll not sharpen their fangs on a new buyer with fees, extended term loans, markups by the $1,000? Tine will tell!

[@MRGS48]

@@KrakensGarageandAdventures ohh for sure but hopefully they’ll go hungry and get sensible…if not it’s gonna suck for em big time.

[@FLYANDRIDE15]

Great Info and video 💯🤙

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

Just sharing my thoughts in things to come. Thanks for watching FNR.

[@MATTTHEGREETER]

Most of mainstream America is already made in China. It seems folks want to draw the line at their favorite bikes, but, on the other side of that line are enormous price tags. I'll be hanging on to my FXDL as long as I can (for life, I hope) but can't swing another H-D price if I pick up a second bike. I'm all for a lower cc ripper but it's going to have to be quite a bit used, or unfortunately made on the cheap. Maybe H-D will bring these bikes over, people will buy them, then sell them after half a year and I can snag one cheapo haha. Time will tell! Nice work as always Eric

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I'm just sharing my thoughts through my crystal ball after watching the MoCo for 40 years. Come to VA and have a go on my bikes if you get time. 🏍💨🦑

[@MATTTHEGREETER]

@@KrakensGarageandAdventures Someday man!

[@DFWMoose]

Ford did exactly what you suggested. During the pandemic and continuing at least through now, FOMOCO told their dealers you will sell our vehicles for sticker price. If not, they would lose their franchise. I genuinely think HD will fail with the entry level bikes. $ for $ - I’d buy a Honda

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I'm presently trying to order a Ford. Ford also raised the prices in an effort to stop the dealers adm. It's not working...

[@MoeLarrycurly1]

Exactly. I've seen the chopper iron horse they tried I've seen the smaller bikes they've tried and different than the normal Harley ask bike that they have made for years. They sat inside on the showroom floor it was hard enough to get them to talk about the salesman ... Sometimes I observed it was hard for them to even break away from talking to each other... They even sell one of the normal Harley.. I too when I bought a new bike in 2009 . There was no dealing here in the northern area of Indiana. I had to go to a shop in Pennsylvania...

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

Moe, you know exactly what I'm talking about. Sooner or later, this is going to bite HD in the rear. The dealer network needs an enema. 🤣

[@MoeLarrycurly1]

@@KrakensGarageandAdventures 😲👍

[@PurpleOnThree]

Well, this is quite interesting. I like the looks of those bikes but why would you pay extra for the logo...just paint one on, lol.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

We shall see how this shakes out. I feel so pessimistic posting videos on HD sometimes. 🤔 Thanks for stopping by and outstanding job on the Spyder oil change video!

[@f.t.w1066]

Well said..👍👍👍👍🇦🇺

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I wish I was wrong on this topic, I really do. I wish them much success.

[@thestonegateroadrunner7305]

If you have driven a Benelli Leoncino 500 (my son has one) you know that HD could do worse than these bikes. They are affordable and reliable, not like the Street 500 with all its clutch and brake issues. Of course, if the price isn't fit for the market they will not sell. The Leoncino officially is priced around 6000 Euro here in Germany, but it's not difficult to find a new one for about 5000 Euro. Once people see how good these bikes really are even arrogant HD dealers won't stop their success. In Italy Benellis sell like hot cake. If proud italian buyers could be convinced I don't think these bikes would have bigger problems to get proud Americans convinced, too. On top, I think these 2 new Harleys look quite good.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

Make no mistake, I have a high opinion of Benelli bikes. They make a damn fine, dependable bike. The issue here in the US all lies with the dealers and how they serve it up. Look what happened to Buell. They sat in the back of the showrooms and god help you if you wanted to look at one. I too, think these two HDs look good and I hope they do well. Thank you for sharing your opinion. All the best to you son on. his Leoncino 500!

[@thestonegateroadrunner7305]

@@KrakensGarageandAdventures Oh, I didn't mean to imply that you underestimated Benellis. I meant to say that other than expensive Buells with their limited possible customer base these affordable bikes will sell themselves.

[@mikeskidmore6754]

Sounds to me like Quaizang bought Benelli ???

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

To my knowledge, they did, but Benelli handles all design styling ques. Thanks for the support Mike.

[@nakedlakedip57]

Price in Australia $11500 dollars for the X500 Harley ,Benelli is $4000 cheaper..? You are spot on.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

Thank you! My point exactly! Ride swift, ride safe. Eric

[@SHHHMotoTravels]

Your point of view is bang on Eric. HD recent decisions are getting old. The small bike market around the world is massive, Harley is missing out in that massive market. If they can’t get pricing inline - don’t even try to get in that market.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I really wish HD would take the small bike market seriously. We dhall see how this pans out. 🤔

[@SHHHMotoTravels]

@@KrakensGarageandAdventures Agreed...their pissing out on a huge market worldwide. they could leave the bike bikes in North America but they could increase revenues and profits by tapping onto the world wide market ! In my mind, that would make their company stronger and maybe get NA prices back inline ! Cheers buddy

[@SHHHMotoTravels]

@@KrakensGarageandAdventures - haha. I see I have already seen, reviewed and commented before !!! Just forgot. Haha. Thx Eric

[@mikeskidmore6754]

Shhhhh Harley Davidson does not want people to know that they are paying the Harley Tax.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

Bwahaha! You're probably right Mike!

[@mrsmel269]

crazy Kraken. hope the day is going good

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

All is going well and the weather is getting warmer every day!

[@pjourneys5337]

Good talking vlog !

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I'm glad you enjoyed it.

[@0toeknee0]

it's crazy. MSRP is way inflated already. there is NO bike in HD's line up that is worth msrp+freight+(the bullsh!t) surcharge. Nevermind what some dealers are trying to pull with set up and doc fees. Dealers and the MOCO need to realize that the party is over. 500-1000 under MSRP out the door plus tax and registration always has been the norm except for a short time around the 100th anniversary and during covid. If they don't, they'll loose their base. I've been riding and buying new since 2000....there is NO WAY i'd buy a new bike currently. edit=and any conversation with Chinese built Harley makes me want to throw up.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I fear that I have bought my last HD for the very reasons you stated above. The dealerships, for the most part, are out of control with adding on huge fees. I have never, and will never pay for ADM and exorbitant fees. I'll buy another brand before that happens. When I shot this video, I was thinking about how Beull got treated in HD dealerships in my area. They never had a chance... Thanks for watching and commenting.

[@Kris_P._Bey_Ken]

It's a hardly Davidson

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

@@Kris_P._Bey_Ken I see what you did there. 😉 😂

[@mikeskidmore6754]

If they sold the Chinese bikes for a Reasonable price maybe they still sell a ton of Riding Gear with HD Logos on them ?

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

Agreed, the real question is, can they're pirate dealers sell these bikes at an affordable price without gouging on fees, prep, doc fee, adjusted dealer markup, long-term loans, etc etc. I hope they succeed bit I wouldn't bet on it.

[@mikeskidmore6754]

@@KrakensGarageandAdventures I sat on one at the Local HD Dealer.. I suppose you just have to twist the Throttle . The Throttle stuck wide Open .. My Local HD Dealer gets mostly 5 stars ratings.. The HD Dealer in the next nearest city gets rather bad reviews.. I told the Service manager that a throttle stuck wide open might not be good on a learners bike ..

[@news603redux]

Hard to add anything but I'll try. 1] The 350 HAS to be out the door at $5995.00, period. You can get a Rebel 300 {albeit smaller but a much nicer seat height} for a grand less with Japanese Honda quality OR you can get a Royal Enfield and they're pretty damn sweet! 2] NO Harley service department is going to do repair and/or warranty work on these bikes while there's a room full of $30,000 sleds needing attention - it's just never gonna happen. Great vid tho, thanks!

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

You're 100% on point, and I should have mentioned the service aspect of it. I have little faith that these bikes will succeed. Thank you for commenting. Eric

[@edwinbrown3303]

I have three 750A streets, best bike ever. HD never gave them a chance.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I have to agree with you. I believe the same thing could be said about Buell. Thank you for commenting.

[@Texmotodad]

Absolutely sir!

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

Thank you for taking the time to watch and comment, Perry.

[@ScooterintheSticks]

It seems Harley, along with other manufacturers, are living an old business model that they won't release from their death grip until economic calamity walks through their doors. Boomers with cash are aging out and fewer GenXers are buying. Add to that any governmental shove into electric vehicles and Harley seems more like a museum thing than a reasonable choice. Your comments about Royal Enfield are spot on. They are proud of the India heritage and also focus on value in a way that others don't. I don't have a crystal ball, but it seems to me that Harley will find a way to muck things up whether because of the marketing or the dealers or just plain bad luck. Other than that -- they're fine! PS -- Those new motorcycles just look like every other plastic motorcycle.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

Agreed on all points, Steve. I'm just sharing a few thoughts of a brand mucking it up for 40 years. I'm not an expert, but I do have a long history with the brand. Thank you for sharing your thoughts, sir.

[@RoadsOfOz]

Harley always think they are entitled to charge premium for all of their bikes. The Pan America here in Australia is currenlty being listed at $10k less than its release price. They never learn, then drop the range blaming poor sales or get spooked and do not release the bike (like the Bronx or 975 Pan America).

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I agree Matt. So much of what I'm sharing is regional and may not be the same in Oz. So it's interesting to hear your point of view. Thanks for stopping by Matt.

[@tubadude905]

I've had two Harleys (among lots of other makes) - a Lowrider and a 76 SS250...the Italian made 2-stroke that was both a good bike and a colossal sales failure. And Italy was a well know maker of small (and large) capacity bikes at that time. But a Chinese-made HD? No freakin way, that's a non-starter and IMHO, an incredibly idiotic marketing fail. I also agree on the dealer network - I hate going into a HD dealership, its often like walking into a shark tank with uninformed sales people pushing me to sign on the dotted line. That said - I think the Charley is a great looking bike, but I sense a repeat of the AMF Aermacchi flop of 40 years ago..

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I try to be open-minded with companies I love. I have to agree with you on this one. I want to see HD succeed.

[@Moz42]

Well explained, Eric. So, Harley is going to balloon the price on these Chinese bikes. 🎈😉 Cheers

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

This is just my thoughts alone after following the MoCo's business model for 40 years. We shall see how this turns out. Thanks for stopping by, Moz.

[@GlidingOnTwos]

Time will tell if these bikes will be a hit or a miss!

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

We shall see! Thanks for stopping by Nore.

[@frankd2056]

Looks good, better than the out going 500cc bikes. Price again will be an issue

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I agree, a very nice looking bike. If HD brings them to the US market, it will be interesting to see how the dealers handle it. Thanks for the comment Frank.

[@TennRides]

I completely agree. Get a ChiComm bike at HD, through the roof, prices...no thanks. If I ever decide to give Harley another chance, I would definitely NOT buy one in my area. The local HD shops are all owned by the same greedy twit. He charges as much for used bikes than most other dealerships charge for brand new models. "A fool and his money are soon parted." Wise fable, and so true. Well done, Eric, always a thumbs up.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

Many of us have to travel out of state to get a fair deal. This is sad from where I'm sitting. We shall see how this plays out. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

[@harleeryder402]

Imagine a KTM 790 engine in a modern street legal XR750 Dual sport with 6.5" inches travel for $9000. What a great gravel bike that could be. And offer a More Off Road ADV Version with Longer Travel suspension for $10,500 . I believe HARLEY would have 2 Hot Sellers there!

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I would have to agree.

[@HarleyThrottleJuice]

On one hand I’m morally opposed, on the other I understand that as a business you generally do what it takes to stay viable. I disagree with HD’s approach, however I’m not running the mo-co and therefore not responsible for future sales.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I have to agree. Why can't they design a V-twin in 350 and 500cc on their own instead of relying on a 3rd party vendor. Thabk about the money lost on the Street series, and now this QJ series. They could have R&D it to death and had a killer small V-twin that went potato, potato 🥔 when you started it. But, what do I know?

[@mmotorcycles9497]

I like the idea of a little Harley but made in China won’t work for the US market

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I tend to agree and fell this is another disaster waiting to happen with massive losses. We shall see. 🤔

[@WindyTherapy]

As I mentioned before, HD is a marketing powerhouse with unwavering fans from all ages however here’s the pitfall they will start facing …… The baby boomers and Gen X generations (with more disposable income) are getting old and dying off. The youngsters can’t afford it despite the fact they love the brand so they will be forced to buy a Denali, Yamaha or a Honda. Great video amigo.

[@602North]

@WindyTherapy Marketing powerhouse clothing store. Who also happens to sell Motorcycles as a side gig 😉.

[@WindyTherapy]

@@602North Like I tell me friends, I would like to own a HD but can’t even afford their T-shirts so …. I may have to reduce my expectations to poker chips ! 😂

[@602North]

@@WindyTherapy 😂

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

😂😂😂

[@theadventurousrider]

How much soy sauce will it take... that was funny. I agree with you that the success on it will be able the same as the street series. I don't think many dealerships will take it seriously.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

Sadly. That's my perception at this point. Time will tell.

[@PSPTommyG]

" eVERY body was Kung Fu fighting....🎵🎶🪕🎤...Those Harley's were fast as Lighting!! ⚡⚡🎎✨🧨🎇

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

🤣🤣🤣

[@RandysRides]

lol. I've never understood why someone is willing to pay thousands more for a name. More reliable bikes with more power cost less. Even if I won the lottery, I'd never buy a harley.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

All true points, Randy. Thanks for stopping by brother.

[@guyfuller1369]

This strategy is a no-hoper. About as convincing as adding a new paint scheme for the Breakout and calling it “Re-imagined for 2023!” As my little grandson says, no fank you.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I was narrow focused on the globalization of the entry-level bikes. I'm not going to shoot a video on the 120th anniversary bikes this year. The very core of this video is the pirate mentality of the dealerships. To me, they're the weakest link and need to be addressed. I never heard one peep out of the MoCo when I reported the illegal activities that happened when I purchased my Revival. I think that speaks volumes... I hope I'm wrong on how this will play out, but I wouldn't bet on it. Thanks for listening to my thoughts Guy.

[@guyfuller1369]

@@KrakensGarageandAdventures Always interested in your take on the moto universe, Eric.

[@hachewie]

I have no real problem with Chinese made as long as the quality control is there.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

We shall see how this plays out. Thank you, chewie, for taking the time to hear my thoughts.

[@harleeryder402]

Thanks for being a TRUTH SAYER. A somewhat rare quality in America this day & age. NOW I will admit I AM looking forward to buying a Modern HD XR750 ADV Bike with the Chinese / KTM790 motor for only $9000! ESPECIALLY IF it's Reliable, The Dealership is Supportive & also HONEST . So I SAY , GO AHEAD HARLEY ! Combine HD X500 style with a CF MOTO 800 Engine, Decent Adjustable Suspension & Let QJ MOTORS Build USA The Bike WE'RE Waiting For! Seriously The "CALISTOGA MILE " is right up the road from me.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

Thank you, I really appreciate you sharing your comment. Eric

[@Gator1699]

They will be here in Aus December 23 $8000 over if it had a V twin and belt drive it would kick ass.🐊

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I agree, I hope they trend in that direction for an entry level bike.

[@TheBlueBikeDoyle]

Agree 👍 my opinion is we shouldn't have nothing to do with China.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I agree. We shall see what happens with this bike in the future.

[@barrettwbenton]

Given what I'd call the Motor Company's current identity crisis, I'd be wary of getting hold of one of these new, smaller machines…not on account of the bikes themselves (which I'm sure are at least competently designed and built), but because of Harley's inability to show any sure-footedness regarding where they're going. They wax back-and-forth from "go with what we know" to "we're going all-electric…one of these years." Not especially confidence-inspiring.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

Barrett, I could not have said it any better. After 4 decades of being a customer and watching their business plan, I don't have any confidence in the direction they're going. Thank you for taking the time to share your thoughts. Eric

[@larry68hd11]

I would never paid more than list price.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I never will either. I believe wr are the same on this front.

[@stanweaver]

That would be a HARD pass for me on a bike like that.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I totally get where you're coming from. It will be interesting to see how this unfolds. Thank you for sharing your thoughts Stan. Eric.

[@ohdirtracer]

I would ride that x350.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I would, too. I think it's a sharp looking bike.

[@JustGKue]

At the point your just paying for name...

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I totally agree, GQ. Time will tell how this shakes down. Ride swift, ride safe. Eric

[@PillowheadCreations]

If u want this then get the Honda scl500 it’s practically the same bike

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I would rather have the Honda. I think it would retain its value better. Thanks for watching.

[@Boleh888]

For Asian... its a Harley, and its a brand new Harley with didn't broke pockets. The brand sell itself.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

You're are so correct! I hope if HD outs these bikes on the showroom, that they are priced right. Thank you for commenting. Eric

[@toofastnobrakes]

Honestly I think the 500 would make a good affordable beginner bike for Harley considering they no longer have one. “If they can keep the price down” However I’m not happy it’s made in china at all

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

If HD brings them to the showroom for sale, I hope they keep the price down. I don't think they could have picked a worse country of origin for this bike... Not hating on China, but the USA is fed up with everything being made in China.

[@WindyTherapy]

Google Fu ? Lmao 🤣

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

Bwahaha! I'm a ninja on Google!

[@WindyTherapy]

@@KrakensGarageandAdventures We came from the Yahoo, Ask Jeeves and Netscape generation so we’re unstoppable 😆

[@roadstrom]

Definitely a miss the build quality isn't there yet just a rebranded Benelli

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I saw a big reveal being advertised for these bikes at Geelong HD. We'll see how this pans out. They're not bringing them to the US yet. Thanks for commenting. Eric

[@PaulsMotoZen]

For twenty thousand dollars, you could probably purchase a dozen of those. 😁

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

Yes. You sure could Paul. 🤣

[@darrenlingerfelt5879]

May be a flop like the LiveWire Great video 😎👍

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

It all depends on the showroom staff and how they handle it. We shall see 👀 🤔

[@VVoltz]

I think is neither. Globalization works in both directions. One day labor won’t be as cheap overseas so companies will need to look for alternatives

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I guess my thoughts are look at the billions the MoCo has lost on the Street series and shutting that down. I sadly suspect they'll do the same with QJ on the Chinese bikes. Take all that lost revenue messing with globalization and invest in R&D into a small 350 or 500cc V-twin made by harley. Bonus points if it goes potato potato 🥔 when you start it. We shall see how this shakes down Walter.

[@luismancilla7815]

I lilke your accent which state are you from?

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I live I'm VA. Thank you for stopping by.

[@luismancilla7815]

@@KrakensGarageandAdventures thanks for the video 👍

[@BlackphoenixEntertainment]

yeah no one is going to pay that kind of money for a bike like that. The entry level bike market is slowly not becoming the entry level bike market anymore.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

My thoughts exactly. We shall see how this pans out. 🤔

[@andrewbecker3700]

The end is near.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I hope you mean the end is near for Jochen Zeitz! It is amazing HD using Chinese bikes...

[@DUHOVED_FOR_RELAX]

*꧁ Genial 🌸🌸🌸 Gracias 👌 ꧂*

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

Thank you.

[@HollowBurden]

Making the street series look like a well thought out and executed idea. So let's take the same idea, but make the value proposal worse... and....make it in China! Brilliant!

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I couldn't agree more. The lost money on these two lines of bike has got to be staggering. Thanks for stopping by.

[@Pablology]

These “Charley’s” will be an epic fail for the core HD rider. Face it, HD is slowly dying along with its core riders. It’s trying to avoid the inevitable but barely keeping alive. It needs to face the inevitable and hope for a resurrection! Maybe just maybe the rebirth/reincarnation has a better future for HD.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I can't say if the MoCo is dying. Nor can I say I approve of the direction they're going either. I do think this joint venture with China is not the right path. Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

[@DUHOVED_FOR_RELAX]

*꧁ Very cool photo 🌈☀ Thank you 👌 Everything is Super 👍 ꧂*

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

Glad you liked it.

[@white_devil73]

At this point, they're taking some Chinese weed-eater engine, slapping a Harley sticker on it, and calling it a Harley. Harley needs to bring back the plain-Jane 883 Sporty for $5995 if they want to lure in the younger demographic. Not everyone can afford to put 30k plus into a bike. Especially not a college student buying their first bike.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I couldn't agree with you more. Remember when they had the buy back at what you paid for it at $5,995 within 1 year towards a new HD?

[@white_devil73]

@@KrakensGarageandAdventures yes sir

[@joelmclamore1898]

Buy one,get one free!😂

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

Right! 😂😂😂😂

[@AdventureTomek]

Im sorry but come on, a Chinese Harley Davidson the should be illegal haha. KTM is doing the same thing with the new 790 models, moving production to China.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

Yes, KTM is farming the 790 and now is in many bikes. I think these companies are watering down their heritage with globalization.

[@harleeryder402]

Chinese Motorcycles ARE increasing in QUALITY In Leaps & Bounds. Look at the KOVE 450 Rally, Benelli 800TRK & CFMOTO 800 MT , SWM V1200. WOW!! Check out the Reviews. To ME It's ALL about getting the "Best Bang 4 tha Buck" I want the most for my dollar. It looks like I'll be doing business with the little motorsports business already here near me up the street.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I'll check out the Kove. Yes, there are some quality products coming out of China.

[@dashobie]

It sounds like a toy,Love big V-Twins.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I agree. I wish they would have taken the money from India venture on the Street 500 & 750, plus this Chinese globalization and invest in their own small vtwin for entry level. The amount of money they've lost is staggering.

[@brontarlabta.k.a.briantayl3484]

Well, call me old school, dinosaur, old fart or what ever, but for me if it doesn’t sound or look like a Harley…why bother?

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

If you took all the money, they lost on the India version of the Street 500 and Street 750, plus the money they invested in this China venture. They could have designed a 350 and 500 V-twin made by HD that went potato, potato when you started it. But what do I know? 🤔 Thanks for sharing your thoughts, Brian.

[@billsinclair313]

Buy a Royal Enfield over a China made Harley. The new CEO at Harley is driving Harley into the ditch.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I honestly don't know, Bill. He stated that when he took the position, he was going to cut production and make more edition bikes with more profit. I would be happy to see him get fired. The working man or woman can't afford a new HD these days, with the benchmark starting around 30k.

[@billsinclair313]

@@KrakensGarageandAdventures 👍

[@alfred-vz8ti]

too heavy, absurdly complex and doesn't go real fast. but it may serve a poser's coffee-shop cred.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I have to agree, it's not going to do well. Thank you for watching.

[@dashobie]

It's not a Harley it's a Ping Pong Paddle Motorcycle.

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

😂😂😂

[@PurpleOnThree]

Funny joke! lol

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

🤣🤣🤣

[@memphysmoto2649]

Harley it’s been Overpriced for a long time 👎🏻

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

On this, I agree 100%‼️ it's gotten way out of hand. The average working person can not afford a new Harley these days.

[@larry68hd11]

I'll try not to buy anything from China

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I do as well, Larry, buy in today's world. It's literally impossible not to. Thanks for stopping by.

[@reynaldochua772]

Cheap chinese fake Harley

[@KrakensGarageandAdventures]

I don't think they could have made a worse choice. Thank you for watching.