Have the X-Men Always Been Political?

[@jordanloux3883]

The fact that "People shouldn't be persecuted for the way they were born" is seen as a political topic...

[@MixedUpMedia21]

It’s frustrating but unfortunately, titling it this is the only way a lot of people who are looking for an answer are going to find it because of how much damage the news and social media have done to the way a lot of people think and consume entertainment. I almost threw up when I thought about using the word woke as is commonly accepted these days instead.

[@calebh373]

Mutants actively distrust humans and exclude them from their communities. It is no surprise why no one wants to help them.

[@nikhook9430]

Human rights are inherently political. The concept of Human rights is only a few hundred years old. There are plenty of countries and cultures that wish to end our way of life just because of our concept of human rights.

[@stevenwoods5787]

True, but the problem with using X-men as a bigotry allegory is that it really only works so far. There’s a legit reason to be wary of mutants. Should it go so far as to trying to kill all of em, no, but there is reason to worry

[@critique0767]

Political just means “relating to the government or public affairs of a country”, when people protested during the civil rights movement against their treatment from police officers (government workers) and people in general (the public) it was political. I’m not sure I see the problem you’re implying, are you using the word political to mean something else?

[@nerds-nonsense]

“Yes” -Anyone who’s ever read literally any X-men comic

[@MixedUpMedia21]

Yeah pretty much haha

[@spv4711]

Or has seen anything x-men

[@misterfour8233]

@@MixedUpMedia21 What is sad to me is that I feel like the same people who complain that XMen has suddenly become political are the same people think that its ok for cops and military to wear Punisher logos.

[@MixedUpMedia21]

@misterfour8233 they are definitely in the same crowd

[@MrVoyeurific]

@@misterfour8233fun fact in one of the punishers comic he gets furious at cops for idolising Him and useing his logo

[@Noahs_Chair]

Why is this a question that exist? This is like asking if Milk has lactose

[@MixedUpMedia21]

I have no idea, but I have seen it be asked so many times over the years

[@lCore17]

Because culture war frauds are really stupid

[@officialgoogleyoutube]

I feel like you get an idea of how fundamental something is to a Marvel title based on how much retroactive credit Stan Lee has taken for it. If he's fully claiming it, you know it must be important.

[@MixedUpMedia21]

Dude this is a great observation lol

[@an8strengthkobold360]

Not always but most of their best stories are incredibly political.

[@SonicBRmario]

This is true. Sometimes, they just work with the super-heroic plot, and that's enough.

[@am.bisonmain9077]

Me when young “LOGAN IS THE GOAT!!! THE GOAT!!!!!” Me now “Wow. I can’t complain because it’s good writing and politics”

[@BubbleoniaRising]

Of course, the X-Men are political and always have been. This is only threatening to the grifters who pretend they didn't know Rage Against the Machine is political.

[@MixedUpMedia21]

😂

[@Drixenol86]

I didn’t know that.

[@willfenholtart]

Man that RATM controversy was hilarious. It’s literally in their name and every single lyric they ever wrote. Who did people think they were raging against? 😂

[@potatoman305]

​@@willfenholtartprinter

[@kikrinman1450]

​@@willfenholtartwell, they're not raging against that machine anymore. If anything, they're in service to the "new" machine (ps. There's always a "machine")

[@davidletarte214]

x-men '97 does sorta destroy the entire "get woke go broke" narrative pushed by these grifters, which is why some of them seem to be avoiding the topic at all costs since the show began.

[@MixedUpMedia21]

It's been hilarious seeing all of the people who make their money complaining about that type of thing have nothing to say about this show because its so good

[@WiGgYof09]

To me, "woke" media is poorly written media that thinks a character being gay or trans or black is their entire personality. This is why "woke" projects don't make money. They are just bad overall. Xmen 97 isn't "woke". The characters and story telling are compelling. The animation is great. There is just the right level.of action. It's just a good show that also serves as an allegory story for marginalized groups. Even Morph being non-binary makes sense for the character. They can literally become anyone, man, woman, or even object. If anyone should be non-binary, it's a shape shifter.

[@davidletarte214]

@@WiGgYof09 that's cool that you have your own definition of "woke," but when everyone defines it differently, it loses any & all meaning & makes any intelligent discussion obsolete. why can't you just say "i don't like the way it's written nor do i like the portrayal of these characters," instead of "IT's WOkE lol !!1"? to most people, "woke" means any positive representation, outside of straight white guys, is contrived & terrible & will always fail. x-men '97 (& historically the x-men in general) does indeed push the dreaded "woke agenda," by representing outsiders & reviling bigotry. so again, it's nice that you can justify reducing intelligent criticism down to one meaningless word, but the truth is that it's right-wing virtue signaling, the exact type of messaging all the woke-haters rail against... so while i appreciate the nuance you're trying to bring to the word, your vocabulary & critical thinking skills suggest you have no need for it & are, in fact, better without it.

[@VunderGuy]

No it doesn't. Even if '97 was a proper example of woke, you are literally using one data point against an entire set of information. Leave it to a wokester to be so focused on a 'minority' that you ignore 'the majority.' And for the record, something that is inherently viewed as expressly political tends to not be palatable from anywhere to half to even more than half of an audience, meaning that just by virtue of that, the best you can ever expect to get is brief intense success and/or a decent niche, but you're never gonna make Pokemon or Japan levels of money in their entertainment sector, which is let another reason why Japan's entertainment sector is kicking the burger out of America's with a sushi roll.

[@davidletarte214]

@@VunderGuy first of all, yes x-men '97 IS as woke as it gets, but please go ahead & explain to me how their pro-diversity, pro-inclusion & anti-bigotry messaging is NOT woke. & look, i didn't like the marvels either but to say that it was bad because of "politics" is just wrong. it was bad because it had no stakes, no character development or emotional hooks & a mediocre story. & to disregard that & blame "woke," is, in the words of south park, "just lazy." also, why should i care about the success of a multi-billion dollar corporation?? why do YOU care about the financial success of a media conglomerate? my point is that the world & it's problems are WAY more complex than just "it's WoKe Lol!" which is just a childish excuse for a lack of vocabulary & critical thought. just because yer favorite youtubers or whatever say something is "woke" doesn't mean it's true, all i'm saying is think for yourself & don't buy into propaganda that is disguised as intelligent film critique.

[@munanchoinc]

I think the political messaging in XMen developed similarly to how Batman formed his backstory and no-kill rule. It didn't come overnight. Batman used to use guns and constantly killed the "Bad guys". It took after a ton comic issues before they finally nailed the perfect formula for Batman, Robin, and Alfred.

[@zacharycremen7545]

I feel like a lot of people in the comments are missing that. X-Men undoubtedly has an anti-bigotry message, but it wasn’t always that way, and that’s what the question posed in the video adresses.

[@2FINE4YOUBABYGIRL]

Batman used to kill people?

[@drnanard9605]

​@@zacharycremen7545in the very first issue of The X-Men in 1963, written by Stan Lee, Professor X says that humans distrust mutants and that mutants have to hide as a result, saying "the human race is not yet ready to accept [mutants]". It's the whole concept. Xavier built a school for mutants because they were not accepted outside of it. It's in the effing first issue. The political commentary was always there. Maybe not as prevalent as under Clermont, and not every issue was like that, but it was still there.

[@JUSLOFI]

When you mentioned Tad Carter, I was like “yep, this brotha did his homework FR FR”

[@logicalparadox2897]

I love how you give a nuanced and complete answer to this seemingly innocuous and simple question that apparently has a lot more history and layered complexity to it than I was previously aware of. Props.

[@sterlingpepke9372]

I think the Stan Lee meant it with a sense of levity when he was saying it was 'Laziness" that led him to using muteins as a method of giving an origin to the people in his story's who have powers. From a writing stand point its great use of the ideological concept of forwardism. (aka the fastest path between any 2 points is a straight line) The truth about if it has always been about Social Justice / political is Yes X-men is and always been about Social Justice / political topics. the reason you see it more and more as time pass's is because the topic's sociologically have become more expectable in the mainstream over time. as Stan Lee said he didn't want to "beat people over the head with it" because Marvel is a Business and teaching emerging topics to kids wile still being marketable is a delicate dance so to speak.

[@nagashtheforsaken]

I've you've read a single X-Men comic, your answer should be yes! It's pretty much an extreme reflection of the civil rights struggles of gays and blacks in the US.

[@MixedUpMedia21]

It's pretty obvious so I don't really get why people argue so heavily about it.

[@benc77]

And people with disabilities

[@prophecybydefault4708]

​@@MixedUpMedia21Probably because they personally don't want it to be true.

[@JonahShaw-i7e]

I'd like to add that a lot of the time when reactionaries call stuff political, they aren't referring to themes or metaphors, but representation of minority groups, in which case X-men certainly has fit since the Claremont run.

[@MixedUpMedia21]

Exactly! The only reason why I used the word political in the title is because I know this is how most people are going to end up searching for the topic. I absolutely hate the incorrect usage of the word woke, but I even considered going with that.

[@knganarxhy]

Even if they weren’t, Chris Claremont was the writer who made the allegory so overt and obvious that’d you’d have to be a toddler in Order to not notice it and he started writing x-men in 1975. In a year from when I’m writing this that will have been 50 years of the x-men being an allegory for the oppressed. 50 YEARS, they’ve spent more time as that allegory then not and all of there best stories were told both AFTER becoming that allegory as well as BECAUSE of it, tbh this question/argument is meaningless(no disrespect to the creator of this video or the video itself, it’s always awesome to see people actually research the the questions and points that others are quick to toss out in an argument but never fact check themselves)

[@MixedUpMedia21]

No offense taken lol and I pretty much agree. This video is pretty much my attempt to show what the facts really say without cherry picking for a specific side like I’ve seen so many others do

[@515JUKE]

This!

[@drnanard9605]

Even in the very first issue in 1963, Xavier says mutants have to hide because humans "are not ready to accept them"

[@mathewwilliams6801]

Grifters want to deny that they are political

[@MixedUpMedia21]

They try pretty hard to convince themselves too

[@sageoverheaven]

​@@MixedUpMedia21Being political and pushing political propaganda are two different things. I think that this misuse of words is what causes the divide between people who I think would be largely in agreement on a qualitative analysis of media over time.

[@mathewwilliams6801]

@@sageoverheaven are we pretending they are not trying to push a political agenda

[@sageoverheaven]

@@mathewwilliams6801 I believe I was very specific in my wording.

[@reneastorgaterre1954]

I think other thing that draw comic book fans to the X-Men at the time was the idea of how being different can be counter productive to the group you are already part of; comic book fans are not the norm as they are now, from the 90's backwards if you were a comic book fan, mostly as a kid or teenager that were the age demographic comic books were aiming, you were outcasted and even bullied for what you liked, hell even the adults would see you with comtempt if you were found as a fan of comic books, because of that fact many fell in love with the X-Men and their stories, the readers saw themselfs in them.

[@Drixenol86]

The X-Men represent whatever the political environment was at the time.

[@Drixenol86]

@@kittycatmeowmeow963 I already knew that because I’ve read those comics from my dad’s collection.

[@ryanfitzgerald9833]

Yeah I agree with a lot of the other people here. I've read a lot of comics and well, not every X-Men story is explicitly revolving around the politics of it at their best. They do tend to be extremely political and explicitly. Especially if we include things like God loves man kills.

[@sageoverheaven]

One of the best videos I've seen on this topic. You've given a measured response to the titular question. Good job.

[@Antifrost]

I feel like this is one of those questions that gets debated by people who'll find their quote supporting their stance and ignore everything else. I'm not that big into comics so the history of things isn't as known to me, but I've been under the presumption that the political themes were always important to the series. Even if they weren't as clearly indicated from day 1, both the subtle and overt usage over time and to this day should be proof enough.

[@silverprimus321boi9]

yes, X men is political, but political in the classical sense. they were nothing like the modern day stuff thats being pushed out today, and anybody who disagrees is blatantly lying to you. Stan lee was the man who created the X men, and Chris Claremont built on it in his uncanny x men run. and the thing is, both of them would agree with me. The X men are an allegory for outcasts. not minorities, but outcasts. they can include minorities, but in general it's about the people left out by society coming together and becoming stronger through friendship and connection. it also was a superhero ensemble comic, which meant that a diverse group of superhumans would face off against crises across the world, as well as other evl superhumans, while the growing societal problem of superhumans growing in number LOOMED IN THE BACKGROUND. emphasis on background. Stan Lee was not in the business of espousing social justice or anything like that in his comics, he would reserve that for the "stans soapbox" section of the old marvel comics, where he would directly talk to his fans from his figurative soapbox. he wanted to make superhero stories, and he knew that tying it to the real world in some way or form would make it stronger, that and having strong characters. In fact, the X men in the comics never began because of mutant injustice, it was a response to the growing number of evil mutants that were wreaking havoc in the world. To prove this, all you have to do is go right to X men issue 1 by stan lee, and Charles Xavier says it outright. The X Men are a superhero team, made to deal with superhero problems. BUT, Xavier was also creating his own defenses against the reaction to the evil mutants resulting in mutant prejudice with the school for gifted children. It was a home and place of education for mutants that needed help, to be taught how to control their powers and use it responsibly (With great power comes...? you following me?). This was also reflected in the villains, with how magneto was a straight up supremacist. He was on the opposite side of Xavier, espousing Dominance over co existance. Claremont took the approach laid by Stan Lee, and added an extra layer of Depth to it. He was the one who added the layer of poetic irony by making Magneto a Holocaust victim, which made his character quite tragic, since he's acting like the same man who wanted to shove him in a gas chamber. He approached the institutional levels of mutant-government relations with senator kelly and the MRA, as well as the human response to mutants with Trask's sentinels. but he still tied all those elements in the background, and kept universal principles that Stan Lee built strong. He also understood that mutants were not the eternal victims of humanity, rather that it was a very complex problem that would actually endanger humanity if evil mutants were allowed to run rampant. and when he redeemed magneto, he wrote it smartly, by having magneto fess up to his crimes and accept that what he did was wrong, NOT BY SIMPLY GOING "but muh humans and war and nukes and holocaust" VICTIM CARD. The problem with modern X men writers is that they clearly hold magneto's views which were explored in detail in claremonts run as something that's as of equal consideration as Xaviers, when in reality they're the ravings of a traumatised man lashing out at the world. The stories are constantly warped to prove him right, the world will always have the boot on the mutants neck even when it really shouldn't thanks to marvel adding so much fucking superhuman-adjacent species like eternals, inhumans and atlanteans and all that. And the fact that people in marvel comics hold such a bizarre double standard by being okay with non-mutants but hating mutants tells a lot to the bad writing thats rampant. A person wouldn't be able to tell the difference between someone like toad and spider man unless they knew spider-man personally, they'd just round them out to be "mutants", because really, what's the difference in their mind? Modern Marvel is more interested in portraying mutants as the eternal victims to random BS in the world so that they can write their shitty revenge fantasies (magneto punishing humans or that x men green comic), instead of sticking to the original reason of the X men where the conflict was crises and evil mutants. And even when they do change up the eternal victim BS, we end up with stuff like krakoa, where the X Men build a LITERAL ETHNOSTATE, COLONISE A WORLD AND THEN GROW A MASSIVE SUPERIORITY COMPLEX BY TALKING DOWN TO HUMANS AND ASKING THEM TO ROUND UP THEIR MUTANTS FOR KRAKOA. OF course, they try and justify this with mr sinister and le evil human terrorists, but in reality it's just dumb writing.

[@willfenholtart]

I keep seeing people complaining about how it “Used to be subtle” No it didn’t. Those same people aren’t complaining about the over the top in your face nightcrawler scenes professing his faith either. Why does he get a pass on not being subtle? They’re only complaining about Morph whose potentially queer content made up less than 2 minutes of approximately 5 hours of content. I’ve also seen plenty of videos where people complaining about “woke” being “deceptive and trying to sneak in their agenda in a way we won’t notice” whenever the allegories AREN’T blatantly spelled out for the audience so there’s really no winning with your crowd.

[@silverprimus321boi9]

@willfenholtart I can see where you're getting at, but I should probably rephrase it like this: I don't stand with any crowd other than myself. Im not speaking for anyone other than myself. And what differs the new from the old is that the old comics focused on universal principles and truths and kept the social commentary on the background (least until Claremont made rogue say that nigga with the hard r and mutie have the same weight). A lot of modern day comics are just poorly written, which ends up hurting the message or whatever else it wants to tell. You want a solid story, you better write a good one, and don't expect that by saying the right things or scoring the right brownie points substitutes for quality.

[@silverprimus321boi9]

As for stuff like morph being mildly zesty, yeah I can see where you're at, I never cared much for it. It's not really breaking anything, unlike iceman where marvel saw that one family guy cutaway gag and then decided to make it canon. As for nightcrawler and catholicism, It's integral to his character, and provides some strong themes, I mean the most devout and holy of the x men is the one that looks like a demon! Pretty cool. I wouldn't mind it if there were more x men that professed different beliefs and faiths, but I have a feeling that in the modern day, these characters would just end up being turned into mouthpieces for said faith rather than being a character on their own, with their faith as a part of them. Then again, shows like arcane, blue eye samurai, shogun and andor give me hope that quality is still there.

[@C.N.D._The_72nd]

I agree, honestly the fact that these people can break into something take it over, oust the people that made it popular and then say it was theirs from the very beginning is batshit insane.

[@AshLee92490]

​@@silverprimus321boi9Or they decided to use the X2 film parallel of him coming out to his parents...

[@RyansFine]

Surprised you dont have more views. Really well edited. Betcha you'll blow up soon, keep at it man

[@MixedUpMedia21]

I appreciate that and I hope, fingers crossed!

[@wiglasgomes2620]

My only problem with X-Men is that the writers come with the most dodgy, bullshitery excuses for why other heroes don't suffer from the same "super racism" mutants do, why other heroes can't help the X-Men or get involved in any way but being a enemy/obstacle, usually by being written extremely out of character (Cap being the biggest example), and why the X-Men can't call other heroes to help them. But everyone knows that if the avengers or the FF helped the X-Men there wouldn't be any conflict and thus, no story.

[@murk4552]

I could answer some of that. 1. Other heroes who aren't from Earth aren't always part of a group that goes rogue to threaten the planet. They keep their people in check. The X-Men don't cause all mutants are valuable to their cause. 2. Most heroes and villains on Earth didn't get their powers or appearances from birth or exacerbated in puberty onwards. It's more unpredictable and harder to detect, not to mention potentially prevalent in every household as mutates are few and a far. 3. Mutants will naturally replace humanity on an evolutionary time table, no one else so it's more existential and immediate. I tried 😂

[@drnanard9605]

The X-Men, as a group, are not what people are fearful of. The thing with mutants, is that anybody can be one, *even your child* , so it makes people paranoid.

[@DanielBMaximoff]

Modern Hollywood messes everything up. Like everything it touches now turns to shit.

[@ficialintelligence1869]

In the immortal words of Edna Mode: "Wait. Is. Is. Is this a question?"

[@angel-zd1mk]

whenever a marvel comic run first starts its always goofy and cartoony, just takes time for it to have depth or be good

[@jim-es8qk]

Most people don't really mind diversity providing its good and Chris Claremonts' run on Xmen was brilliant.

[@jordanloux3883]

And yet when it's stories about diversity that do badly those are the ones that get most violently dogpiled by the internet. Look at Ghostbusters 2016.

[@VV-ho8dg]

I haven't actually read any of the X-Men comics (don't worry I'll get to it as soon as I got time), but still, it's quite obvious how political those books (and anything related to them really) are. Like come on, just LOOK at some of the covers (X-men: 198 for example, looks straight out of a propaganda poster). Ok maybe bad example since the covers are usually just action scenes and stuff, but the political inspiration can be seen in some of them for sure. And it's not like the discrimination themes are exclusive to X-Men, it's mentioned on other marvel books that just happen to feature the X-Men as well, at least from what i've read. Ofcource then there's the movies and cartoons that basically everyone's heard of and what they're about. Just raises one question... Why is there even an argument on weather or not the X-Men are/have been political? (Sorry for rambling a little)

[@thenomad4123]

The discussion is if X-Men have always been political, meaning if they were created to tackle political issues from the first issues or not. No sane person is questionining that X-Men have been political for a long time. The video explains quite well imo, regardless what Stan says the comics themselves suggest X-Men stories were only political in the Sentinel Arc run (issues 14-16) in the first run, and if there were political messaging in other stories they were extremely subtle. X-Men became mainly political in Claremont's run towards the end of the 70's. As for why the question has been consistenly asked, it is probably because of the woke anti-woke battle, was X-Men always woke or not etc. and question evolved from there.

[@joeblaster8770]

Can you do a video on what Hasbro wants Cobra to be vs what writers like Larry Hama do with Cobra.

[@angelcanez4426]

All I know is "God love man kills" is amazing

[@zulmar5655]

The King has returned! I do not get how people think art (especially comics) isn’t political, like a lot of storytelling is derived from real world / life experiences so ofc there's going to be metaphors for racism, bigotry, etc. Similarly, I remember reading somewhere Star Wars is basically just WWII in space which when you think about it makes a lot of sense lol Very fun video, can’t wait for whatever you're cooking up next!

[@MixedUpMedia21]

Thanks for watching, Zulmar! Yeah, I believe there's an interview where George Lucas says that in Star Wars, the Empire was inspired by the United States in during the Vietnam war

[@thetoondevil]

17:53 i know its off topic, but i just realized this image has everyone after Magneto, who isnt even bothering to look at them while under attack. I seen this image so many time growing up, and i just now noticed this weird detail.

[@vikhdez9306]

Dude MvC2 soundtrack really puts a smile on my face every time

[@davidletarte214]

i came because i am sick of being grifted &/ or falsely triggered by the rest of youtube, i stayed because of the in-depth, informative & entertaining video about my beloved x-men. liked, subbed & commented!

[@MixedUpMedia21]

Thank you so much for that, I'm glad that you enjoyed the video!

[@SpareMango]

They really saw thought the symbolism wasn't enough and decided to RUN with the Kitty Pride speeches lmfao elite video

[@MixedUpMedia21]

Yo, I appreciate that and you're absolutely right 😂

[@omniframe8612]

This was a damn good video. Much respect. My channel made a similar video years ago called The Truth - X men and Civil Rights. This is an excellent addition to this very interesting topic. Subbed

[@MixedUpMedia21]

I appreciate the feedback. I’ll have to check your video out too btw. Thanks for the sub as well!

[@NickolasZombie]

Has the sky always been blue?

[@russianoverkill3715]

I hate descrimination allegories, because they always feel justified with in the universe with mutants being able to easily kiII humans, while in in real life they're based only on appearance.

[@ikechristyii4970]

Actually if you think about it hating mutants doesn't even make sense in the context of the comics. Galactus regularly threatens to eat earth, Thanos, mephisto, the Skrulls, the list goes on and that's only accounting for objectively evils beings. Magic exists, tony stark (when is morality was inverted) intentionally created an addictive app distributed it for free started charging for it, the hulk can straight up destroy the planet. If we were living in the marvel it would be absurd to afraid of yet another group of super powered people who mostly just want to be treated equally. My favorite way of looking at it is this though, the day Humanity stops hating mutants is the day the marvel universe becomes my hero academia

[@davenoel5036]

That would be a sad day​@@ikechristyii4970

[@petermj1098]

⁠@@ikechristyii4970The reason humans hate mutants is because mutants are the next stage of human evolution. Humans don’t like to see themselves as Neanderthals. It is scary to think that a higher form of humans are out there. And Magneto bragging about being “homo superior” only justifies their fear of mutants wanting to kill humanity.

[@rigorgrynn4469]

Not really. Plenty of animals can kill us super easily. Doesn't mean we need to support their genocide.

[@rockoakira7804]

I mean I guess, but at the same time there are other heroes who aren’t mutants with powers just going around and people love them. Spider-Man is swinging from rooftop to rooftop and most people love him. Why don’t other heroes or superpowered individuals get the short end of the stick? If anything, in the universe of Marvel… Mutant hate is pretty unjustified.

[@halowaffle25]

I think that Stan Lee claiming the idea for the X-Men as the oppressed started out in issue 1 is a *bit* revisionist, or maybe even just hyperbolic in that classic Stan Lee sort of way. I think the X-Men very quickly fell into that niche as writers, and Stan himself discovered it made for good stories. But it definitely wasn't there yet in issue 1.

[@SinglePlayer29]

12:58 The “Colored Only” Sign Meme 😂

[@MixedUpMedia21]

It's been one of my favorites for a minute😂

[@hugomonstah]

yea. i got that comic that u used the thumbnail for . that one hits in the feels

[@TheVenomousBeetle]

I’m honestly shocked there are people that thought MLK and Malcom x are remotely similar to Xavier and magneto

[@saucevc8353]

Because Americans are brainwashed into thinking Malcolm X was an evil and violent radical while MLK was a peace and flowers hippie who never did anything controversial. We're trained to believe opposing the status quo is bad.

[@petermj1098]

@@saucevc8353Professor X and Mageto’s rivalry is also similar to Booker T Washington and WEB Dubois’ rivalry. Booker T Washington founded and institute to teach black youth skills and how to work in white society similar to Xavier. WEB Dubois had black youth demand and do political agitation for their rights and work against the system similar to Erik. Xavier has a friendly persona and good childhood MLK while Magento has a stoic persona and a tragic childhood like Malcom X.

[@santiagoacosta3372]

Short answer: Yes Long answer: Yeeeees

[@TempestFirestrike]

There is a difference between exploring political natatives from multiple perspectives and letting the readers/viewers interpret and discuss it, as use to be the case and the straight up political propganda which tells you what you should think and strawman's any other viewpoint, which happens now, so yes there is a major difference they use to trust people were smart enough to know who the bad guys were, now they think we won't know unless they explicitly hit us over the head with it and don't allow discussion... Just look at the difference between the 2 civil war event's, in the first one both sides have vaild point's both have things they are wrong about, in the second Carol is clearly wrong, you can't convict people for things they haven't done yet, but it is presented like she is the one in the right...

[@VunderGuy]

A comment from Literature Devil's far more accurate, truthful, and less smugly condescending video on the subject put this whole situation in the best way: "If you put Magneto and Malcolm X in the same room for 30 minutes. Brother Malcolm would call him a psychopath, and Magneto would call him a pussy. They are not the same."

[@MixedUpMedia21]

Lol word

[@Exile-exe]

Yes it has but it was always a back drop and a plot element and not a self inserted character disturbing the interpersonal relationships between the characters and the corruption of those relationships.

[@michealmahmoud6391]

Didn’t Uncanny X-Men#8 “Unus the Untouchable “ have Beast and Iceman almost getting lynched by an angry mob for being mutants, forcing Beast to quit for a bit, going into wrestling just to look normal? (Plus got adapted into the All New X-Men comics)?

[@MixedUpMedia21]

God Loves, Man Kills actually starts with two mutant children being lynched as well.

[@burner555]

Unus💀💀

[@michealmahmoud6391]

@@MixedUpMedia21 I remember that scene got adapted in a sense in Mythos X-Men as well. So the idea of mutants being persecuted I think had basis but I do agree got fleshed out a lot more as time went on.

[@chheinrich8486]

Maybe , just remember they weren’t created to be a political allegory intentionally, they where created because Stan ran out of ideas on how to give his heroes superpowers 😂

[@drnanard9605]

I mean, in the very first issue, Xavier comments on the fact that humans are not accepting towards mutants

[@mobgabriel1767]

"its X gene i ain't gotta explain shit" -stan lee, probably

[@MaxP_88]

They've been always been political (except when it's about time travel or cosmic forces), but everyone uses it for their own particular politics when it's always been about outsiders in general. Besides, they are a terrible metaphor for minories (discriminated only by appearance or sexual orientation) since we're talking about living walking weapons here. Fear in this case is justified.

[@johndoe-jg3if]

So no but the themes were add later

[@TheSuperhomosapien]

"It's 1987. Do you know what your children are."

[@MP-db9sw]

What Stan intended when the first flash of inspiration hit him isnt even relevant at this point. The writers and editors have deliberately embraced the political implications of the story on so many occasions that no matter what it may have once been, the ship has fully sailed on the political dimensions of the franchise.

[@heyya3207]

HUUUUH?!?! stan lee lying to make himself look better? IMAGINE MY SHOCK

[@KA-wp6zo]

wow what a thoughtful and well researched analysis, thank you for this

[@MixedUpMedia21]

Thank you for watching!

[@red_crayon9771]

On today's episode of Gen Z Discovered..., Gen Z discovers fiction!

[@stuartcluff5841]

The problem with x men is that the allegory makes no sense from an in universe perspective. The mutants are persecuted despite having the power imbalance in their favor. This makes the humans look stupid while the mutants look spineless. Now x-men has combated this problem with the sentials and mind control serum, but that raises more questions such as. Why make a mind control serum to persecute the mutants when you can just use the serum to turn the mutants into sentiant weapons to fight wars for you.

[@kaylemathewcomendador6964]

It’s weird how those clickbait ranters say “Stan didn’t create X-Men with wokeness in mind” when that’s not the version most of the general audience think about when they think of the X-Men. It’s Chris Claremont’s work where the wokeness is more blatant that most think or care about when it comes to the X-Men. Basically not much people care about Stan’s run on the series, so using him to debunk the X-Men not being woke is kinda dumb.

[@ashemabahumat4173]

Yes, but it was _good._ That's the biggest difference, and it didn't feel like they were preaching for privilege for a small group but rather to treat those around you how you would expect to be treated. Not... whatever it is things are like now

[@aersiul]

Excellent video. Thank you for sharing 🙌

[@Stopmotionguy2049-cf2bp]

They are political. They’re meant to represent those who are different and exiled.

[@genesismultiverse4896]

You know it's halerios people in the marvel universe don't realise that how they treat mutants is like how nazis treat other races so if we were to actually fix it with cap Cap: you do realise that how you treat mutants is like racim right World: what no it's different Cap: how different their still human but you treat them differently because they are different isn't that racist? World: well erg oh oh god what have we done

[@genesismultiverse4896]

@rickmel09 wait hey are?

[@internetgoat4831]

Yes, always have been Next question please.

[@loganpars]

Love your videos. This one, in particular, was wonderful.

[@MixedUpMedia21]

I really appreciate that, thanks for watching!

[@fake_robin9045]

I think originally it wasn’t meant to be political but then the writers saw how well political allegory’s could work with them so they went all in.

[@noobmastershake1427]

This video is a 10/10

[@MrOrcshaman]

There's being political in the allegorical sense, which the x-men were as being a mutant isn't something in the real world, but it can be intrepid by any social group that's been maligned. That said there's being ambiguous about it, and then there's just being full on blatant with the meaning. The people writing these comics today are so over the top with their messaging, it can't even be interpreted with any subtly. I'm a 40 year old gay man who went through a time where homophobia was still rife, I saw the changing landscape, and frankly today it just pisses me off so many in this community still think we're living in the stonewall riot era, we're so far from that era now anyone claiming otherwise is just looking for victim points. It's no wonder modern x-men writers can't understand the subtle nature of ambiguous storytelling, they have to pretend to be victims all the time to feed into their narcissism.

[@lordquastheonly]

Thank you people tend to forget that the time period a piece of media is written in greatly affects the story the xmen arent an allegory for the civil rights movement i hate when people compare magneto to malcolm x because malcom x didnt want to exterminate a race

[@willfenholtart]

I’m a 40 year old gay man too and completely disagree with your entire take. There we canceled each other out.

[@willfenholtart]

P.s. there are multiple videos and literally thousands of comments online complaining about the scene where morph turns into Jean Gray and says I love you to Logan. They’re literally complaining because Beau DeMayo did a tweet confirming Morph was in a way confessing his own love for Logan in that moment and the conservatives are freaking out because the scene WAS too subtle and they’re accusing the “woke agenda” of being “deceptive and trying to sneak the message into the content without people noticing”. They complain when it’s ambiguous and when it isn’t so stop being a useful you know what to these people. The only reason they truly need to hate people like us is that we exist. Every other excuse they give is just window dressing trying to justify it.

[@MrOrcshaman]

@@willfenholtart That's because its a blatant push instead of a natural progression. You yourself are a useful 'you know what' to the dredge that's infested this community, the ones who don't give a shit about equality but rather victim points and grandstanding

[@prophecybydefault4708]

​@@MrOrcshaman It was a natural progression. It seems that the only reason you don't like it is because the message was obvious.

[@sahilhossian8212]

Lore of Have the X-Men Always Been Political? Momentum 100

[@andrewcabrera505]

Stan Lee definitely didn’t mean to make them an allegory. He has a track record of giving himself more credit than he deserves, and he’s either lying or has tricked himself. Frankly, if the early comics are a metaphor for the civil rights movement, the way they’re portrayed would be incredibly disrespectful to said movement. Chris Claremont was the one to make them political, and they have been ever since. Even then, he has gone on record saying as a White American he didn’t feel comfortable representing the Civil Rights movement. Instead, it’s an allegory for bigotry in general. In fact, Magneto was inspired by an Israeli figure who started as a militaristic terrorist but later mellowed out, became PM, created peace treaties, and even won a Nobel Peace Prize. This resembled Magneto’s own redemption arc over Claremont’s run, as Claremont always wanted him to eventually succeed Xavier. I will say, in the sentinel arc, Stan Lee does show some of these themes, but I’d say it aligns most closely with his own experience as a Jewish American. Jews are model minorities and, throughout German, Eastern European, and even modern history, have always been attacked not only as lessers, but as lessers who are also somehow superior and are secretly trying to use their power take over the government and subjugate others.

[@Labcabin96]

People compare magneto to Malcom x because of the _ by any means necessary" like from the 2000s X-Men movie.

[@petermj1098]

Professor X and Magento’s opposing rivalry is also similar to Booker T Washington and WEB Du Bois’ opposing rivalry as well. Not just MLK and Malcom X. Booker T Washington founded an institute to teach black youth skills and how to work in white society similar to Xavier. WEB Dubois thought black youth that they need to make political agitation for power against the system instead of work with it similar to Erik.

[@jg3000]

Mutant levels whole city block. At least people would've seen that. "What have we done to you?" Says innocent mutant. Obviously there is good reason for mutant hatred. It's sad that it is blanketed for some people. Because there are good mutants. But what I would like to see going forward is maybe the human plight. You could have a person lose his wife and kids to a mutant. He develops a way to fight mutants. And he's a challenge to the XMEN. And is it possible to win this person over? Maybe he's rescued or unknowingly falls in love with a mutant. Who maybe saves the XMEN. I'm just spittballing but the depiction of regular people tends to be bad in the comics.

[@jg3000]

@rickmel09 With the excuse of protection or fighting for freedom.

[@jg3000]

@rickmel09 I never said I did. But a lot of people do. And it is what the media puts forward.

[@-obamium5320]

It is politically charged but using it as an allegory of race is not a good idea, because there are elements of bioessentialism. Same with movies that use animals as allegories for race, super powers muddy the message.

[@andrewscears7345]

@rickmel09but Xavier can kill like every person on earth by thinking about it hard enough

[@prophecybydefault4708]

​@@andrewscears7345And certain people can kill every person on earth with the push of a button, what's your point?

[@andrewscears7345]

@@prophecybydefault4708 his mind is the weapon - not a missile or something more tangible. It’s not traceable and it would be impossible to prove that he actually killed someone since the weapon is his powers.

[@prophecybydefault4708]

@@andrewscears7345 He needs cerebro to reach a large amount of people, and there are numerous ways that a regular person could kill someone without being traced. In the event of nuclear warfare, knowing about the source of your immanent death is almost worse, because you can't do anything about it.

[@andrewscears7345]

@@prophecybydefault4708 I’d assume he could still kill people on a small scale without cerebro (though this is never established to my knowledge). Additionally, although the person might not be able to be traced, the method of killing still could be (like knife wounds or bullets found in a body). But, what this really boils down to is an ethical question that is completely based in a fictional world, and we have differing opinions on the fictional outcome of this fictional problem.

[@worrysoup]

Thank you for the great video!

[@MixedUpMedia21]

Thank you for watching!

[@Lusciouslysorry]

I thought surely you would explain the thumbnail. Why was Leslie Nielsen such a dick to Nightcrawler?

[@MixedUpMedia21]

Hilarious that you called him that😂. This is a page from the comic “God Loves, Man Kills” that I mention. This is William Stryker, he actually began as an influential, hateful reverend. He preached that mutants existing was against God’s will and that it was right to rid the world of them. He was a big time racist.

[@Lusciouslysorry]

@@MixedUpMedia21 Surely, you meant to say, "This is Frank Frebin, he actually began as a detective on the Police Squad." Surely, I hope you understand. It must be clear now, surely.

[@amerejester3295]

What did Jack Kirby have to say about this?

[@MixedUpMedia21]

He isn’t known to have commented about the subject.

[@solblackguy]

You could argue that the first two years when Lee and Kirby worked on the X-Men wasn't political. You'd still be wrong though.

[@danyelh.8630]

Well of course it was political, 1/3 of the silver age antagonists were evil commies. X-men was a bit more original as it was mostly good mutants vs evil mutants, but they weren't created with oppressed groups of people in mind, that allegory became more apparent under Claremont and such. And even then, Magneto was based on an Israeli military leader. Not Malcolm X. Before that, in the Lee-Kirby years, he was a Cartoony Hitler bragging about being of the superior race, using WWII German Soldier look a like illusions to invade a defenseless republic.

[@travisatchison8429]

And now professor x says the dream is dead

[@halowaffle25]

16:13 Nahhh they really cut to storm here!?

[@MixedUpMedia21]

That’s hilarious and I didn’t even notice at first😂

[@insuchaway]

My favorite crossover is the X-Tinction Agenda; just wanted to share.

[@Zoeila]

when talking about x-men you have to separate the original book and uncanny xmen

[@ryuusaki7309]

Well I’d say the X-men became more progressive when Chris Claremont and other wrote X-men ! Before hand wit Stan and Jack Kirby it was just good mutants vs evil mutants train in the danger room fight magneto and evil mutants and other enemies

[@Dreadpoolz3977]

You can't get any more political than CAPTAIN AMERICA his name is literally the country. The issue is not comics being political which they've always been it's the particular politics in question don't sit well with the fandom who believe in a certain ideology. The second it touches on historical events that involve a certain group of people they wanna avoid it because of guilt, then it becomes woke and too political even though it's been political the entire time. Nobody called the X-Men woke when it came to Eric and the Holocaust everyone sympathized with his motives and reason for wanting to get rid of humans but Killmonger literally had the exact same ideology and he was racist and crazy. Politics aren't the issue, bigotry and double standards based on biased weirdos is. Either comics are all political or not at all and if they're not political they're not comics the whole idea is to get you to see from different points of views and perspectives I don't agree with Batman's ideology but there are people who do doesn't mean I wanna boycott Batman for legitimately being a crooked cop in a bat costume because I understand it's a comic it's supposed to be reflective of real life in some aspects where the hell do you morons think these ideas cones from? Obviously have to take real world events and experiences and add them to the comics just because you don't like it doesn't make it racist or woke grow up. You don't wanna hear about AMERICAN history then leave America because you're never going to escape it no matter how much you try to deflect, gaslight, or bury it it will never go away so deal with it.

[@woongah]

As soon as Stan Lee passed the writing duty to somebody else. Stan is also the dude who create a weapons making industrialist super-hero, so left-leaning he was... not.

[@prophecybydefault4708]

..said weapons maker's entire purpose as a superhero was to stop the overproduction of weapons and get them out of the wrong hands. So.. yeah.

[@1wayroad935]

This is the dumbest thing to ask about the X-Men ever. People who do this are only riding the controversy wave for attention.

[@G-LukeJA]

I DON'T ANSWER TO MY SLAVE NAME?!?

[@MixedUpMedia21]

They might have gone a little too far😂

[@emilianotype-g6877]

Remenber the extremes are bad, like the brother hood of mutan and FOH, the x-men tried to be the midle grount

[@randomguysays]

The X-Men are the social justice warriors of Marvel imo.

[@aimanmarzuqi4804]

Yes it has

[@Goober12345]

Yes nuff said

[@Joseph_Drew_III]

…YES.

[@SGredblitz]

I genuinely don't know how bigots like most Marvel characters lmao Like the majority of Marvel heroes have always had some message to them that reflected current day issues :3 But no, wokeness and pronouns were invented in 2013 obv :P

[@skeletonlover3214]

good video

[@UndeadNerdT800]

So let me ask y’all liberals. Are you guys so egotistical, that you think prejudice is only stuff you believe, you think we don’t like others because of modern day ideology with characters like morph. You think we can’t have flaws or positives with an imperfect metaphor. You think we are racist just because we are different isles of the spectrum. If anything I think conservatives are hated nowadays in the entertainment field.

[@whocares8576]

"Let me ask liberals" [Immediate Strawman]

[@UndeadNerdT800]

@@whocares8576 you gonna answer my question or not?

[@nenohuh]

I don't care, and I think caring this much about fictional characters in the first place is stupid. In reality, no one is created equal or seen that way. That's just how it is

[@whocares8576]

@@UndeadNerdT800 No, because it’s a blatant strawman fallacy. You’re attacking the image of what you think rather than asking a simple question. It’s like if I said "Let me ask all the conservatives out there, why do yall say you hate trans people?"

[@Emma-Queenofhell]

Ok..... that's the strawest strawman to ever starw. At a certain point, you had to read this and realized little to no one believes any of this, right? If not, I can't help you other than to say reject the premise.

[@C.N.D._The_72nd]

No

[@vikhdez9306]

Will Disney make a good adaptation without it being a woke shitfest of endless cringe? Yeah, no

[@prophecybydefault4708]

What the fuck do you think X-Men has been about this whole time? 😂

[@zainmudassir2964]

I love x men

[@flavsdepadua8516]

"oh they made 𝚡-men woke" oh boy do i have news for you

[@RonnieMyers777]

🤡: _xMeN wEnT WoKe!!!_

[@Shiirow]

theres a difference between being political within the confines of the stories narrative structure and pushing a real world political agenda using characters as simple mouth pieces for the writers point of view, regardless of how out of character that makes the character act. Only idiots and disingenuous losers try to argue otherwise.