Helluva Boss is Frustrating

[@radioactivegum2298]

Wild how what was originally a joke (Blitzo sleeping with Stolas) became more important than the main characters and side plots like Barbie Wire

[@Hirokison]

Also fun fact- Ghostfuckers was not written by VivziePop, but Brandon himself lol That's why Millie actually FEELS LIKE A CHARACTER- And HOW MUCH improvement she had in just ONE episode Bro did more in one episode than Vivzie did in TWO whole seasons lol

[@deadspaceskull6905]

@@Hirokison and then viv literally undid it by making her pregnant, that's all Millie is now. Viv got SO pissed Brandon did what she refuses to do and wrote an actual real episode she immediately undid it afterwards to being the most basic thing a woman can be out of pure spite.

[@Hawxicity]

@deadspaceskull6905 Absolutely agree. Can’t describe how disappointed I was at the end when they revealed that Millie is now pregnant. I’m sure throwing a baby into the mix is gonna do wonders for Millie’s ‘future character developments’… Spare me. If this is Vivzie’s way of writing out Millie as a character because she’s ’taking care of the baby’ or something, just so she doesn’t have to worry about developing her as a character anymore, I’ll personally stop watching this show.

[@Seth8754]

Yes but sadly even in that epsiode the focus was more on blitz , not millie. When she'll get her own episode ?

[@seaflowers]

Honestly people should stop watching Vivienne's stuff. Not because of the bad writing, i stopped caring about Vivienne when i saw Akira O'Halloran video about how Vivienne basically disrespected sa survivors.

[@Seth8754]

@@seaflowers i saw bunch of dramas related to vivzie but wow ,this is on another level . Seriously?

[@kaxcommentssomethingREAL]

the Campers episode was so agonizing i had to skip it, and JUST NOW i learn Blitz has a sister... edit: to make it clear that was the only episode that i skipped, I thought the show was okay, even with it's several writing problems.

[@miablue136]

@@kaxcommentssomethingREAL she only got mentioned and appeared in like 2 episodes so i don't blame you for not knowing that, this show is so ahh 😭

[@Cyburim]

WHY WAS SHE A C-PLOT AND NOT AN A-PLOT

[@caffeinatedpossum]

Only reason I watch Campers during a rewatch is BECAUSE of Barbie lmao

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

it was Moxxie and his...fake ass voice

[@OliverOils]

@@miablue136 I forgot what episode she was from 💀 when Blitzo mentioned her, I was like "oh shit I forgot he had one" I didn't even remember her name... I still don't Barbara was it?

[@joosoo]

I never thought about this before, but ...why does Ozzie's club only allow couples if they find romance and love laughable and stupid? The lounge is visually set up for people to come have dates, the bouncer only lets couples in, but Moxxie singing a ballad is mock-worthy? Sure it is a romantic one and not explicitly sexual, but why draw the line there when the rest of the club is set up for couples? I know Ozzie is a hypocrite, but at that time, nobody knew about him and Fizz.

[@Komelikus]

I think I have a simpler answer: More money (?).

[@Extinct_ish]

@@Komelikus Ozzie is the ruler of an entire ring of hell, the Lust ring, not Greed, it wouldn't make a lot of sense for him to be interested in making more money than he already has, and on top of that the dude owns a factory 😭

[@Tazari]

Technically, you can do lustful stuff to yourself...but sex is usually with two or more people lol. It's not about romance. Just because the customers are couples doesn't mean they're all in love or even romantic in nature. Takes two (or more) to horizontal tango basically.

[@emikusz]

@@joosoo I think the issue was that Mox wanted to sing about love, not lust. In a place that is about lust. Like it would be weird if you started singing a love ballab in a stripper club. But maybe I'm off, that was just my impression when I watched it.

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

@@emikusz you got it right

[@ValDmitGolo]

OH MY GOD FNIALLY SOMEONE WHO USES "CHERUB" AND "CHERUBIM" PROPERLY!!!! it's such a small thing, but thank you!!!!

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

con C.H.E.U querubin

[@Double_dooo]

Can I ask what the difference is? (I’m still near the beginning of the video so idk if it’s explained later lol)

[@The_Monkey_Prince]

@@Double_dooo (at the start of the video too) but if I'm not mistaken, "cherub" refers to the angel as singular while "cherubim" is plural

[@littlemoth4956]

Give me a fuckin break. 🙄

[@Seth8754]

Ooo didnt know that nice

[@ito6787]

making Millie pregnant is like kicking a person while they're down, she got ONE episode where she was a character and not just a plot device for Moxxie, and that episode wasn't even written by Vivi, IT WAS WRITTEN BY BRANDON!!!

[@alllittlethingzz]

And I love it so much!!!! Like even Brandon knows how to write good episodes but Viv stays leaving her females on the side and I hate it!!

[@malohn2068]

Every episode that has humans in it sucked. The humans for whatever reason feel the need to act insane and goofy and make the demons look normal. Its like you can tell no one cares about humans in this show, theyre boring to animate and draw and they just want it over with.

[@cosmicspacething3474]

Shouldn’t it be the other way around?

[@deadspaceskull6905]

It's so wild how viv kept forcing earth and humans on us all season 2 instead of giving us the envy ring like genuine circus clown unironically

[@metalrob6713]

I'd go as far as say that Stolas x Blitz ship ruined this show for many viewers. It took all the focus and turned show into a melodramatic mess of a show not focusing other characters like Millie and Moxxie, also Loona.

[@samflood5631]

I thought this was going to be an adult comedy show. When did this become an angsty soap opera?

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

@@samflood5631 it still is, just put "angsty soap opera adult comedy"

[@metalrob6713]

@@samflood5631 story goes cuz fans loved and liked to ship Blitz and Stolas so much that Vizvie decided to make them to be main focus of the show.

[@docnightmares8291]

What are you talking about? Stolas x Blitz is probably the only good thing this show has going for it.

[@duckduckguse]

yeah i started watching for funny demons killing people and got jumpscared by dubious consent yaoi fanfic. i did not sign up for that

[@File.Namee2]

What bugs me even more Is that we still don't know what does D.H.O.R.K.S Stands for

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

fan nicknames: Demon Hunting Organization of Really Kooky Supernaturalists Demon Hunter Other Realm Killer Supernatural Demon Hunters Own Really Kickass Swords Demon Hunter Organization Really Killing Shit.

[@Novaurawr]

@@Sonic2024freedomera👍🆒👌

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

@ good

[@shadowbeast9671]

Or what the two agents' real names are.

[@TurnTheFrigginFrogsBi]

@@File.Namee2 same for C.H.E.R.U.B.

[@cordyceps7531]

I have to disagree with the scene where they spare the gay couple as good or well written. It feels like yet another example of justifying cheating. The characters have killed humans for less. They've caused the deaths of humans they weren't even assigned to kill. Heck Blitzo, was more than willing to ruin the seemingly innocent family in Murder Family, and this was before they found out the family were psychopaths. But this couple is the exception cause Blitzo relates to it. We're supposed to think that Millie is being the irrational one for wanting to go through with the job, but she's like the only one thinking clearly. But no, she was just having a mood swing to foreshadow her pregnancy. Whatever.

[@_vVinter]

Exactly, it was the same sort of situation as well. Husband cheats on wife who died and wanted revenge, the only difference is that this time, the one the husband was cheating on with was another man, and the woman is homophobic.

[@gdmkmrlxix632]

I feel you there. IMP has been a morally bankrupt killing service for the entire show. But the Christmas scene shows how Blitz would really feel if faced with such a familiar sight, and one that he finally understands the value of. Blitz is ready to be loved, and he understands how awful that would feel to take away now that he's experienced giving and receiving it. Opinions are opinions, and you're probably right to be logically against the scene, but I think it's quite realistic and beautiful.

[@lupoopul4039]

Well it wasn't really confirmed that he did cheat. In fact, it feels more to be implied that he didn't The ex-wife is crazy homophobic, so when she claims her husband cheated on her with another man, do you trust she's not jumping to conclusions out of hate? What proof does she actually give? The writers were clearly pushing for the audience to question her motives, with her proclaiming her husband was a cheater only to reveal her homophobia (aka, the real reason she wants him gone) after said proclamation

[@cordyceps7531]

@If this were any other show I'd get you, but considering this show's track record with Stella and Mrs. Mayberry both being angry women who were legitimately cheated on, and both placing hits on their spouses. I wouldn't be surprised in the least if this man actually did cheat on his ex-wife. For all we know either the ex-wife is lying as you said. Or the husband is actually a cheating prick who took the kids and didn't care when his ex-wife died.

[@Jdudec367]

It's not that though. Eh no it says how she is being rational it's just asking her to make one exception is all. Where are you getting that it had to do with her pregnancy?

[@jack0f4lltrades28]

Let's not forget, Sarcastic Chorus called it quits when it came to reviewing the next season 😅 he said he'll keep up with the show but not to expect anymore vids about it. And I get why. Season 2 is not at all what we were looking forward to after Season 1.

[@KgEclispe252]

Hate the fact that he claims it is because he's being overly critical when any casual viewer can see how bad the show has become

[@jack0f4lltrades28]

@KgEclispe252 I get it, he's being optimistic and doesn't want to be held responsible for adding fuel to the fire. A lot of people are divided over season 2 so it was probably best for him to call it quits.

[@clownbites2290]

A major gripe that I personally have is that Helluva Boss, and as a consenquence Hazbin Hotel, deals with the more deeper subject matters rather swallowly and THATS why people are so bothered by some of the jokes and the implications they carry it’s BECAUSE they didn’t think of the deeper implications in the world that’s so infuriating. Do I mind that the beings of Hell are terrible people? Absolutely not, it’s Hell and I expect the people especially it’s ruling class to be the worst but I do expect some form of weight and nuance. The relationship between Blitzo and Stolas embody this exact problem, we could’ve had an interesting discussions about class dynamics the impact that cheating can have on a family and child but at every angle Stolas’ actions get minimised so that he and his relationship to Blitzo and his daughter doesn’t look TOO bad. Stella’s characterisation is also a prime example of the show not thinking of the deeper implications on top of dumbing her down so that Stolas again doesn’t look bad for cheating on her.

[@Cardinal_claw]

It also does the weird trying to justify it with the gay family in the most recent episode. It genuinely feels like a fanfiction of a much better show, where the author will do anything to justify their woobie baby's actions. Any "punishment" is surface level and easily and _quickly_ bandaged up so their poor baby bean doesn't have to hurt too much

[@coolalicorn7486]

@@Cardinal_claw oh god yess. The gay family scene was so annoying. They saw the exact same happy family(except they were not gay) in 1st episode and they turned out to be monsters.so what’s so different about this one? It just looks dumb

[@caffeinatedpossum]

@@coolalicorn7486 I had the same question, but then I came to the realization that Blitzo is very emotionally vulnerable right now. I imagine if he wasn't there for Karen explaining her case, he would've had no hesitation on going through with this job because he wouldn't see the mirror right in front of him.

[@SpoopySquid]

Even when they try to tackle serious topics properly, they inevitably shoot themselves in the foot soon after through bad writing choices. You can see this best in the one episode of _Hazbin_ where they tried to explore Angel Dust's trauma from years of abuse, but then included in that same episode a gag where the punchline is Sir Pentious getting SA'd by multiple people

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

@@Cardinal_claw not even a fanfiction, because it is not making a fic of any work that already exists, Boruto feels like a fanfiction because it is already a work based on naruto (yes another insult to that series that should not exists). And every time I wonder about the consequences for Stolas, I ask myself "what do they want? For the guy to die or what?"

[@thecrakp0t]

I'm so glad you mentioned the shorts, I'm so conflicted because of them. I started to dislike the show since the first Cherub episode, and really hung on until unhappy campers, at which point I just gave up. More than six months and two episodes later I decided to give the series one last shot and found myself watching the short with Millie and her sister. I was SHOCKED by how much I liked it... So much so that I got suspicious and decided to check the credits. Sure enough, Vivziepop was not one of the writers for this short. I know some fans will hate me saying this but i genuinely believe that she, herself, is the issue. She's a fantastic artist with great ideas, but ultimately writing is not one of her strengths. If only Vivziepop would relinquish some creative control to someone who knows what they're doing then the show (Helluva and Hazbin alike) could actually realize its fullest potential.

[@littlemoth4956]

Vivzie's creativity in general values style over substance. Even her art style reflects this as every single character either looks the same or is trying way too hard to look interesting, sometimes both, but they're always lacking in any actual personality or analyzable features. Instead, they end up as complete nightmares to animate rather than something worthwhile. Overall, she really likes to hook viewers in with an interesting concept that she's incapable of expanding on.

[@ShizukoHirawa]

mastermind was written by vivziepop

[@rainbowbears1627]

@@thecrakp0t wasnt vivzie also the person who ditched the entire crew of the hazbin pilot when it finally gained traction and even ditched the hunycast people who helped her with soo many donations and charity streams(

[@seaflowers]

Honestly people should stop watching Vivienne's stuff. Not because of the bad writing, i stopped caring about Vivienne when i saw Akira O'Halloran video about how Vivienne basically disrespected sa survivors.

[@Jdudec367]

She really isn't the issue though, it's not true. She is a deecent writer and she wrote the Chupacabra short which was pretty good.

[@seeleunit2000]

Stolas' actions are consistent. He has zero issues with "flirting" with Blitz among the lower classes. He can keep their mouths shut with money or his demon powers. But having people in his social group give him grief for sleeping with an imp ? That's when he starts to care about his reputation. The owl is consistently classist, condescending and spineless.

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

"oh i am fucking poor"

[@gloomiiii]

well he was raised that way so idk what your complaining about..

[@EllonElle]

@gloomiiii the fact that the show tries to treat him like he's not being classist?

[@Seth8754]

@@seeleunit2000 Son of Paimon cannot afford to shut peoples mouth with his money or power i wonder if there is any reasoning for this.

[@Cardinal_claw]

​@gloomiiii "When have I ever looked down on you?", The whole breakdown over being poor, etc etc. He'd be a better character if they leaned into it instead of trying to baby him/justify it constantly

[@krypton_ite]

You explained a lot of stuff that I didn’t know was actually annoying me. The fast pacing sometimes made me think that I must have missed an important plot point, because I was confused with how everything felt all over the place or out of nowhere, so I just kept rewinding. Some jokes and songs are indeed lacking, but overall the crude nature of the show never really bothered me if it felt in character (which was not always the case lol). Also, you made me realize why I felt so weird about Stolas : his character is so inconsistent for most of the show, but I truly hope they will keep holding him accountable next season. We needed more time seeing him developing feelings for Blitzø, then Ozzie’s could have actually worked as a solid episode. For all its flaws, I really enjoyed the last half of S2, I hope it’s setting up a better standard for the plot, tone, character arcs, etc. I’ll be patiently waiting for S3, I’m eager to see where things go from here. Always nice to watch a nuanced review, you had compelling pros and cons, keep it up!

[@ladyblubel]

17:00 This inclusion to Stella and Stolas’s relationship pisses me off so badly for a multitude of reasons (of course, the stereotypical bitchy wife is a rapist). Like Stella and Stolas not enjoying sex with each other, to the point that Stolas dissociates in the middle of it is fine, but why is the writing framing Stella as an aggressor when she is ALSO in the marriage of convenience and fulfilling a duty? It just feels super weird to flip a situation that is commonly delegated to noble women (producing a heir, even through a means of SA) and giving it to Stolas to go “see! Look how evil his wife is!” But also, it’s just such an oversimplication of what could have been a very interesting relationship dynamic! These two are essentially only tied by duty, their assets, and their daughter. But then Stolas acts out in a way that Stella feels is humiliating and degrading. It would really tie into the classism them to have those two be a reflection on how it *doesn’t benefit anyone* but of course Stella just as to be scorned by Stolas’s lack of enjoyment in sex that she also does not enjoy (because bitchy wife is also petty for no real reason) This is a similar issue I had with Hazbin Hotel where the premises *could* work but then Vivziepop always takes the worst execution for them

[@Cardinal_claw]

They even have a real easy justification for her being openly cruel towards Stolas. We're certainly told often enough that the class system is important, which is commonly tied with reputation. Him deciding to have a very public relationship with one of the lowest possible classes could ruin her future marriage prospects, and be a stain on Octavia's future too. Stella is such a bad lay he husband would rather // an imp. (Though this would require making her more than just the stereotypical c//kblock between the lovers, which- seeing as most of her potential was given to her brother- ain't gonna happen. Viv will do anything to avoid letting a woman be interesting lol)

[@ladyblubel]

@ Honestly, any excuse other than the current “Stella is an evil woman who doesn’t like seeing Stolas happy” is better. At least anything would give her a hint of a complexity

[@TheUnmitigatedDawn]

All of Hazbin Hotel's faults can no longer be pinned on Amazon or A24 as Helluva Boss is (relatively) independent and entirely in Viv's control. Yet a lot of the problems in HH are present in HB meaning that the blame is entirely on Viv for the poor characterization, writing, pacing, and tone. The problems in Viv's writing have been present, not just since Hazbin's pilot, but her Zoophobia comic days. It's been more than a decade and she's barely improved writing wise. Not to mention she's still as immature as she was a decade ago. Lackadaisy and The Amazing Digital Circus have blown both of Viv's shows out of the water in terms of both writing and even animation and prove that being "indie" isn't an excuse for poor writing because greatness can be achieved in such endless potentials. Viv has mostly squandered a lot of the potential her shows might have had to crank out cheap, poorly written melodrama.

[@joosoo]

This exactly. Most of her fans are too young to remember Vivzie's original work, like Zoophobia, but she has *always* been a bad writer. Her work has always overbloated with too many characters and zero focus. People want to cut her slack because she's an "indie" creator, but she literally runs her own studio and merch store. Give her flowers for her ambition but we gotta stop pretending like she deserves to be worshipped for such mediocre shows.

[@TheUnmitigatedDawn]

@ Not only that but the whole "indie studio with limited resources" excuse doesn't work when Monkey Wrench, Inanimate Insanity, the Becky Prim pilot (which is just an animatic btw), and Animation vs Animator all have lower resources and budget than Helluva Boss yet are all 100x more focused and well done than HB.

[@TheUnmitigatedDawn]

@@joosoo Honestly, you wanna know what Viv's best works are? It's her entirely silent, standalone shorts like Holidaze. No overbloated casts, no awful dialogue, just Viv letting her Tumblr-esque designed characters fluidly around a colorful world without the need for a plot beyond a basic premise. That's it, that's Viv at her best.

[@hildegarde7962]

@@TheUnmitigatedDawn Entirely in Viv’s control? Have you seen the length of the credits? Why don’t Brandon Rogers, Adam Neylon or the list of storyboard artists and other artistic directors ever get flack? Also the writing has gotten much better and exceeds most other adult animation. In an era where art has lost all soul and passion and we get the same formulaic dysfunctional family shows or remakes of old Disney movies why do people think the free show on youtube has to be perfect to be considered good?

[@TheUnmitigatedDawn]

@@hildegarde7962 Well, in terms of the overall story of the show, yes, Viv is the one who dictates it. Neylan certainly doesn't help with how he's responsible for some of the poor jokes too and Brandon's the only good writer on the team.

[@92JazzQueen]

No, I think Sinmas isn't going to indicate he's changing it's shows that Stolas is going to be even more babied and coddled.

[@internetgal38]

@@92JazzQueen yep, they treated him with baby gloves and used Octavia only to show poor Stolas is sad instead of addressing his actual mistakes. Like how he treated blitz and how he's treated Octavia.

[@fr3dm3rc0ry4]

cut to Stolas actually saying it was all his choice and reassuring Blitz to not feel guilt for him:

[@static7579]

I really don't understand what more the show could do to appease people with opinions such as yours. Every song with him is filled with lyrics of him doubting himself, feeling awful for the situation he's put himself and Blitz into and like three episodes + a standalone song set up him trying to rectify the situation to Blitz with the crystal. Since fucking episode TWO he has been weathering the storm in his life that HIS decisions caused, eventually catching up to him in such a way as to not only alienate him from his daughter but also to strip him from everything he owns, turning him into a walking pariah. If you think someone willing to lay their life on the line for someone they love, taking the blame for something they didn't do and then being rewarded with destitution, familial alienation and outcast status is being "babied and coddled" then I really don't want to know what you think actual "punishment" constitutes.

[@92JazzQueen]

@static7579 you can sing your woez over and over again but he still comes off as a pompous spoiled pos. He's all talk not actual change.

[@redpanda6497]

​​​​​​​​​​@@92JazzQueen This! People who think he's a good person because he feels bad and say he will do things differently next time don't see that it isn't visible in his action. He keeps repeating the same problems. Even if he saved Blitzo he still bragged about his past life at the dinner table and talked to him condescendingly. Yes, he apologized to Octavia, but he didn't listen to her and neglected her in the next Octavia "centered" episode.

[@NothingKingKN]

Viv hates writing women so much that she basically gave Stella's character - a character that we followed through since the pilot - to some random fucking male one.

[@Cardinal_claw]

Agreed. Literally would've been easier to just have Stella do this, Andrealphus isn't that much smarter than they make her out to be, plus more time is spent designing, writing for, animating, etc when there's two characters

[@Sillyalienyippee]

Which is INSANE like deadass that's like a whole another level of not wanting to write women characters like at this point just make your whole show full of males

[@royalxprincessbaka6875]

She recently did a top 10 tier ranking of all her favorite characters from Hazbin hotel and all the main female characters were at the bottom and the male characters were at the top. And she calls Hazbin hotel the female- centered show 😂

[@Jdudec367]

Not random, that's her brother.

[@snakesareamazing]

Not just any male one, another gay twink

[@sageseeker9197]

I have seen a lot of fanfictions that do what Helluva and Hazbin try to do, plot wise, so much better. I don't know why Viv just doesn't hire people to help write out stuff. I kinda understand some issues to the writing, as a writer. Basically, it feels like she's trying to jump to point A to point B, and doesn't wanna write the middle parts. She's got specific scenes in mind, but no connections to them. The scenes in each series are very good in some cases. Story concepts are pretty good. But unfortunately, it doesn't seem like she's mature enough to 1, hire some people to put together the parts she doesn't want to and seems like she has a very delicate ego based off how often she replies to stuff on twitter when she should just ignore the haters.

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

ok i want a example

[@OrionDawn15]

@@Sonic2024freedomera You both watch the same show, just pay attention.

[@adamzielke3541]

Jumping from point A to point B while struggling with the middle parts is one thing keeping me from writing. I have the big scenes in mind but I know I need to organically bridge them

[@Light-ro5bp]

Mastermind is definitely the episode that demonstrates your point, it feels like a big payoff to an arc we never saw, and it feels like Viv doesn’t follow through with her characters after they have these grandiose moments, Striker and Crimson become jokes after having big threatening scenes in between, we have followed Ozzie this whole season but he becomes a background character in the trial, Blitzo and Millie have a tearjerker talk about their friendship despite being the second IMP duo with the least interactions, an entire storyline about Blitzo being emotionally distant gets thrown out the window when Stolas needs someone to take care of him. On that topic it’s really clear the plot point about imps being discriminated was something added for solely for drama (especially relationship drama) and not because Viv had something to say about it, some scenes where imps are treated badly (Stolas squeezing his butler, the imp Stella threw still holding the phone for Stolas while being bruised, Blitzo getting rented as a child, impish little plaything ) don’t carry any weight at all, what does matter however is how Stolas felt after Blitzo dared to call him out on his classism or how rude imps are to him after he lost his power. I wasn’t following her on Twitter when she went private so I don’t know what’s she said of the show after that, but it always annoyed me how she used it to “clarify” things about the show you wouldn’t know by just, you know, watching it.

[@samflood5631]

I feel like sometimes this show is trying to be like Bojack Horseman whenever it focuses on Blitzo. Like for example, Apology Tour and Unhappy Campers. Both of those episodes have Barbie and Verosika call out Blitzo for his selfish and toxic behavior and how his actions affect everyone around him, just like Bojack Horseman. In fact, Blitzo tend to drink his problems away when all it does is dulling his emotional pain, just like Bojack Horseman.

[@spatuladevious]

Thats what she got some of her inspiration from, but it's falling flat.

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

it takes inspiration from bojack horseman, yeah makes sense

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

@@spatuladevious inspiration, does not mean you gonna copy it

[@spatuladevious]

@ I know what that means. But she is trying to make it Bojack Horseman in a sense. But it does not work for her.

[@royalxprincessbaka6875]

Helluva boss is if the show agreed that Bojack was the real victim along and everyone he hurt should forgive him because he had a abusive woman in his life to blame all his problems on.

[@Birdyboys]

I still think Ozzie’s is a good episode in a vacuum but I completely agree with you about Stolas’s new personality feeling completely out of no where. At the time I just assumed he was acting cute because the loneliness and depression (over his stupid actions) was mentally getting to him and that finale where Blitzo calls him out for being sexually exploitative and selfish was a reality check. Halfway through season 2 I realize that I was apparently supposed to read this as Stolas’s new personality and he did nothing wrong in the episode and Blitzo was being completely irrational for calling him out 🙄 Ozzie’s is such a weird episode. It genuinely feels like Vivziepop is just trying to scrub canon without flat out decanonizing it like she did with the pilot. I’m sure if she could, she’d say all of season 1 isn’t canon except for idk, Loo Loo Land.

[@uiopuiop3472]

fitzarolly is bestest characther

[@syafeeqahisham1740]

​@uiopuiop3472 no but he's uwufied

[@Birdyboys]

@@syafeeqahisham1740 for real. I miss bully fizz

[@fr3dm3rc0ry4]

His personality was always there, literally Season 1 finale ended up on a turning point that of course would feature a Stolas with a different posture.

[@fr3dm3rc0ry4]

@@Birdyboys do you mean the robotic version of himself that was permanently on stage persona.

[@Thefakewomanwithamustache2]

Bro missed out on calling it “Helluva boss is Helluva frustrating”

[@TurnTheFrigginFrogsBi]

More like hella frustrating

[@BeeRitual]

I really think the whole story suffered because of Stolas character. He's such a whiny little "victim" now who never faces any consequences for what he's done wrong that I get actually angry whenever he's on screen crying and ruining the show. At least Blitz they kept him a jackass who's trying to do better and didn't make Verosika an abuser to justify Blitz stealing from her and Maxing her cards. With Stolas they rewrote him pressuring Blitz into sex, cheating in Stella and even him bring classist (after all, it's shown in circus that Stolas respects imps and even bows to them, but his asshole dad is actually the bad guy, Stolas is so pure of heart from the jump))

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

Mastermind and sinsmas: what do you mean?.

[@BeeRitual]

@Sonic2024freedomera Mastermind: Stolas is a martyr who sacrificed his own life for someone the last time he spoke to was in Apology tour, aka the episode that blamed everything on Blitz and coddled Stolas for how badly Blitz treated him. Stolas is seen as a hero, who once again made a big grand gesture of love instead of apologizing. BTW, Stolas has yet to EVER apologize to Blitz. Despite bad things happening to Stolas you're not supposed to be rooting for these things like, finally he's getting whay he deserved like the way it was written in Appology tour, where Stolas got multiple big moments to chew out Blitz, once on stage with the whole crowd praising him. In Mastermind you're not supposed to be rooting for Andy or Stella, or even imp kind that is now abusing Stolas Sinsmas: continued the "Cheating isn't that bad" trend to further make Stolas not a bad guy for cheating on Stella even though no one actually blames him brcause Stella is so cartoonishly vile for the purpose of excusing Stolas bad actions, but moving on Karen is depicted... well, as a Karen for being mad that her hubby cheated, she is cartoonishly unlikeable, just like Stella to further that narrative that Stolas didn't do anything wrong and being cheated on is what they deserved. While I'm glad Via is mad at Stolas and they stuck to that, Via was depicted as being manipulated by her mom and uncle AND she threw Stolas clinical depression in his face and blamed him for it. The Via scenes were very good except for this moment, which honestly felt like the writers just needed a reason for people to coddle Stolas again. And we all know Via is going to be back on good terms by the end of the series, probably theough growth of her own and realizing what Stolas sacrificed for her. Stolas on the other hand doesn't have to do better, learn, or grow. He never looked down on Blit. He never made it all about sex, he never used his powerful position to get sex from Blitz, he always loved him from day childhood, he sacrificed his own happiness for his daughter. Everything bad happening to him is because he loves too much. People had to change to become good enough to see his good intentions and treat him better. He never grew and is never expected to because he's already flawless, and the narrative points that out constantly.

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

@@BeeRitual he is hated by everyone (except the main cast)in that episode, every imp throws trash at him, so i don't he was considered a martyr, actually Blitz was the martyr for his sacrifice, now alot of imps love him for standing up against Satan. disculpe, señor bee, Stolas cheating on Stella is only cheating in name and that's as far as it goes, because Stella never loved Stolas, in fact she hated him, and Stolas never loved Stella, he didn't like her either, they were forced to marry to have an heir. Basically in this "relationship" there was never ANYTHING but mutual hatred and both parties are forced to serve a purpose in the system. and I would say that the series took it out of nowhere, but considering what Stella's attitude is like when she discovers that Stolas cheated on her with an imp (she starts throwing and breaking a lot of things, the butler and basically her point was that the guy she slept with an imp, and if the problem was that it was specifically with an imp) The only one who blames him in this case is Octavia, who the only thing she knows is that Blitz is a homewrecker who took her father away from her, and not that her mother is abusive (in fact, for her, all this is "normal" or is not as out of place as Stolas would be paying more attention to Blitz than to her). The Karen, the Karen, I am not going to say much about her, she is homophobic, that is clear, she believes that her husband cheated on her, she is not very specific, she says that maybe he cheated on her, but considering that the father is the one who She has custody of the daughters... I highly doubt that she is reliable in her story. manipulated? the girl opposed her uncle, hell she literally beat him, she clearly knows her uncle is evil, the problem is that in her mind, the reason why his father is suffering and staying with his mother, it was because of her, so in her mind, she is the reason he is not happy. Ok now, what series are you watching exactly? I feel like people are criticizing Stolas better than the series paints him, the problem is that the series doesn't paint him as the antagonist, which I think is what people expected... Look, it would be acceptable if the series left that as a note, but not even like that.

[@BeeRitual]

​@@Sonic2024freedomera he's a martyr to the audience. He sacrificed everything to take the fall for somthing he didn't do and now everyone hates him because of somthing he didn't do but had to take credit for in order to save lives. He's unjustfully hated by every imp because he did the right thing. You cannot become more of a woobie than that. With the cheating plot you're explaining the issue. I know Stella is terrible and cheating on her was justified, that's the problem, everything bad Stolas did was justified or retconned in the second season because the writers didn't want him to face any real heat or criticism. The story would have been more interesting if he actually needed to grapple with the fact that he hurts people. But they cannot admit that Stolas isn't an innocent baby who is always bullied by all the meanies in his life so unjustly. It is a writing choice to make him as town trotted and innocent as possible so the audience will UwU him. As for Karen that whole thing is a stand in for the main plot, clearly she reps Stella and the gay men are Stolas and Blitz. The issue is that everything done is a choice by the writers and the writers are making choices to downplay Stolas fault in everything, including his assault of Blitz, his cheating on Stella, his racism towards imps and his neglect of Via. All of these things are watered down to make him look better but it actually makes him look worse, we expect flawed characters from hell to be mean but change, Blitz does. But they dont treat Stolas the same, they woobie him and make it so any punishment that happens is 1. Not his fault and unjustified and 2. Youre not supposed to feel good that hes learning a lesson, you're supposed to feel bad and coddle him. Which is why so many people are dropping the show.

[@Seth8754]

​​​​​​@@Sonic2024freedomera even when he is facing the consequences of his actions its done wrong both in writing and plot wise. When he is facing them he has someome to comfort him , blitz and its shown as a good ,sweet moment when the reality of it is he basically traded his life ( both metaphorically and really) for 30 years that wont even last much in the eyes of an immortal. . Now , im not even sure whether he really realizes the withdrawals of the choice or not but i know for a fact that he never learns from his mistakes and goes back to making them again , he knows what he had with blitz was wrong yet still went to him again when both parties are firstly supposed to work on their issues . This is a flaw of both writing and his character as the events are going from A to B yet there is no real process between them which leads to weakening the meaning behind the actions and degrade the characters writing because in a way , every single act gives us insights about what the characters views/ beliefs are. By seeing Stella treating imps horrible you can get the implications of her not liking the lower classes , low self esteem anger issues etc. Now seeing Stolas not really bothering or not even THINKING that he owes an apology to blitz is frustrating. Because it undermines the concept that he is an innocent royal fed with a golden spoon who sees imps as his equals . What he is saying doesnt exactly matches to what he does. If the intention was to show he is an hypcrite, they made it in a wrong way because blitz not pressuring into the problem and only bursting out in anger while pointing this out, it seems like he is just whining and trying to blame stolas when it was actually the truth. But suprisingly , blitz goes back to cheering / supporting him , depression or pills are not an excuse for treating the people support you like nothing he is in his 35's yet doesnt have the maturity to take action and take responsibility ( yes mouthwashing ref xd) For plot wise i think mastermind episode is enough. He saw blitz for a few seconds on tv , Knew what he was EXACTLY getting blamed for , went in and made the most unbelievable lie known to man. He stole book from himself and tries to assasinate himself , appearantly. And everyone in the court , including Satan went along with it. It could be because they dont really care and just go back to their lifes but what contradicts this is the fact that stolas tried to deceive everyone. There is no way the law of hell , Satan would go along with this as he even sang about how he rules so this means that he actually believed what Stolas said. OR he could just accept the fact he gave the book to blitz but frame ice dudes lies by revealing the truth plus the group would agree with him , not to mention blitz had the crystal given to him by Stolas which again , was something from Asmodeus and he can confirm it as well. At this point im convinced that the plot/characters twists whenever Stolas around to not make him look worse than he is. And its just eye bleeding to see how people disregard this and cuddle him in a way he is no different than Stella as they both act like they are better than this :/

[@duckduckguse]

theres something weirdly cathartic about shows like moral orel where everyone and everything is so awful and theres no attempt to soften the blow. like watching a car crash or something. and helluva boss is kinda the opposite where everything is sooo sanitized and de-fanged, even though its hiding under a veil of edgyness. the main characters arent allowed to be dislikeable and characters who you thought were terrible are actually innocent victims of villians who dont even feel like serious threats. it barely feels like im watching actual conflict cus theres no stakes and i know the show can just rewrite itself to serve viv's favourite characters. characters who you thought were gonna be super important like stella and the dorks now feel like they got chekhovs gunned (idk how else to explain it) cus they lost any narrative significance. its all so boring and safe which sucks because the first season seemed to present a very different show. maybe because brandon rogers was a writer but idk also youre so right about the dialogue being unsubtle, its just constant word vomit bruh its infuriating

[@Octoweaponry]

41:57 id like to correct something here--it IS one-night stands, and apparently just people blitzo knew in general, that one gag character that they constantly insult at the party is a person who blitzo only briefly met and made out with at beelzebub's party

[@LeafRazorStorm]

I think I can explain the dissonance between "dialogue that suggests you're not supposed to pay attention" and "background details that suggest you're supposed to pay ALL the attention." It's theory bait. They don't expect the average *viewer* to notice all these details, but they DO expect the average content creator to use every little "clue" for long-form discussion videos in order to drum up fandom hype between episodes. It's a strategy that worked very well for Gravity Falls, but at least that show can still hold up on its surface-level merits, something that many of its imitators have failed to do.

[@redpanda6497]

It's like FNAF.

[@Cardinal_claw]

​@redpanda6497 Ehhh yes and no, more like what happened with Hello Neighbor imo. Saw other shows successfully practicing foreshadowing and theory bait, wanted to do the same, didn't actually care enough to do the work, end up ruining/spoiling what little future plans they do have, and are upset when people don't get excited about it

[@Jane_Doe-o4r]

@@Cardinal_claw It's more like modern FNAF. Just pointless details that don't explain much.

[@Kyoko123]

I just…. even if Mastermind was cool, I just can’t stand this version of Stolas enough to continue the series. I think it might have been easier to let the character change go if he didn’t have a kid, but I can’t just let the way things are going go. He did WRONG, but all the ways he’s being punished are all being used as escape fantasies. And now that Blitz is all lovey-dovey with him….. I just kind of feel like everything I thought this show was going to be about was completely wrong. I didn’t want to watch a Telanova or whatever this is now. I wanted to watch chaotic beasts accidentally learn friendship/family. And the fact I was SO WRONG about the direction of this show really sucks.

[@fayescarlet]

Good critique. HB is a show that, to me, is as fun and good as it is a hot frustrating mess. *Especially* Stolas and how the narrative goes out of its way to make him a victim. When I first watched Ozzies, I didn't get what made Stolas so weird, but you spelled it out: this characterization of Stolas comes out of nowhere. And when Blitz bitterly called him out at the end of the episode, Stolas had no rebuttal. Because Blitz was 100% right. And yet... The narrative treats Blitz as if only HE did wrong in their arrangement, when Stolas was the one who instigated the entire thing and brought up sex the most. Full Moon and Apology Tour were very, VERY frustrating episodes because when Blitz calls out Stolas yet again, we're expected to see him in the wrong, when Blitz is again 100% right. I hope we continue the momentum seen in Mastermind and Sinsmas, where Stolas not only gets consequences for his behavior but also LEARNS from them.

[@92JazzQueen]

@@fayescarlet I don't think so

[@viennasavage9110]

wdym the narrative treats blitzo as if hes wrong? Stolas literally tries to do better by him since that moment and treat him as an equal. Blitzo just cries because he's hurt at the end.

[@92JazzQueen]

@viennasavage9110 dude if he really was he would have known blitzo wouldn't buy this gesture. He just wanted to feel better about himself.

[@viennasavage9110]

@ No he didnt, if he wanted to feel better about himself he would just give him the crystal and be done with it. He continued to want blitzo by his side. He could have chosen any other Imp, but he stuck by Blitzo. He thought Blitzo would be okay with it because Blitzo has always complained specifically about their power dynamic, so Stolas wanted to get rid of it. Its sound logic.

[@92JazzQueen]

@viennasavage9110 that's unhealthy obsession

[@MP-mw2kd]

18:28 (I haven’t gotten further than this so if you do bring this up later I apologize) but don’t forget Octavia’s “home doesn’t feel like home *anymore*. You ruined it”, implying that at one point, there was more than constant belittling and abuse. Yes, some may argue that Octavia was a child and didn’t know any better but as you said, we are meant to take the face-value implications of these subtle hints because it is a cartoon and unless a hidden plot point is described in great detail later, we cannot see inside the creator’s mind. Again @ 36:33- The same issue with Bee worrying about Blitz overindulging is present with Ozzie, King of Lust, being in a loving relationship. It’s absolute fan service that helps push the narrative of a Stolitz plot. You can’t tell me this dynamic would work in the pre-Stolitz era. I loved these characters’ dynamic soo much better when they were just two casual hook up dudes making fun of love. It would also help point to the fact that Ozzie sleeping with Fizz (an imp) mirrors early season 1 Stolas using Blitzo as entertainment. I’m kind of tired so I can’t really explain this well but there’s something there, something FizzarOzzie, as this wholesome ship, ruins. Also, I never understood why Overlords have soul contracts that bind sinners to them but an IMP can just leave a literal Sin if working conditions- IN HELL- get too overbearing..

[@sugartoothYT]

On the Octavia part I'm a bit divided. Stolas fucked up, absolutely, but for him to be happy he would've needed to rock the boat of their family life in some way; even if would've been a less dramatic divorce, it still would've gained the ire of his wife whose default state already was to be abusive. I cannot take Octavia's line at face value, because it just doesn't make rational sense. She is justifiably upset, her emotions are valid, but what solution was there, what could've Stolas done that wouldn't have upset her like this if the family drama is the issue? Stolas lusting after Blitzo was a very good angle to focus on as Octavia's problem and showcase Stolas' neglect, but then they bring it back to being about their family quarrel, which is ultimately not related to Stolas cheating at all, that was just a symptom of the true illness. In both the episodes she is introduced and the Shooting Stars episode (btw I dropped the series after that, so I don't have perspective about possible other events), Octavia has zero empathy for Stolas, which makes "sense" for an emotional teenager, but is fucking bizarre for how much the show seems to want me to empathize with her. Stolas is in a turbulent moment in his life which has been brewing for a long time, it sucks Octavia is getting caught in it, but the only alternative I can think of is that Stolas would've stayed in that marriage, so nah, deal with it kid. And for fuck's sake, WAIT A BIT to speak to your father about the shooting stars or fuck it, if you wanna be an unstable teen, break the phone for instance and use the attention you obviously get from that. Why get angry only at your dad and not your obviously-nagging mother hogging his attention???

[@zinniebug7555]

12:36 what kills me is that this, like many other shows, could have been fixed if you just moved the tonal shift over one episode. Make Stolas know it's a fake date. Have Blitzø need to do some actually romantic things, and show Stolas likeing it. Then have some clips of them doing some casually romantic things together, Blitzø thinking its part of the contract and Stolas thinking its free will, and move the active pursual to the next episode. There! Still kinda rushed, but smoother than diving in with no prep whatsoever

[@chilliicecream5456]

The problem with both HB and HH is that they have massive amounts of potential that they just never want to see realised. And I’ll probably just keep watching just to see if it will be.

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

this show is now potential show

[@Seth8754]

@@chilliicecream5456the damage is already done i hope they address some problems in next season tough

[@alllittlethingzz]

Especially in HH there’s so many crappy and sloppy writing that needs to be fixed for season 2!

[@koalabearkhan145]

17:43 this is what we call a retcon, when sometimes we write ourselves into a hole and we switch some things that were previously established 29:45 and here, I’d say perhaps the show is trying to have its cake and eat it to, not wanting to reasonably paint their fan favorite character as the one in the wrong

[@AcordHachi]

HB was not advetised as a romance so that's why the audience feels justifiable betrayed. Only in episode 7 we actually start to get romance plot. Viv once twetted something in the lines of: "what's wrong if a show becomes a fanfic of itself?". We got the answear: braindead plot animated well. I expected it to be bad, I did not expect “cheating is okay if it’s gay and it’s bad when a woman does it”. Making Blitz and Stolas childhood friends and Blitz be Stolas’ first love really fucked up the dynamic that had been set up in season 1 I liked Stolas better as a character when he was a problematic person, a flawed character who had a bad power dynamic in his relationship with Blitz. He was more interesting and had more potential in the story then. Like, if you want to make Blitz and Stolas have that childhood connection, make it less special for child Stolas, and make it that Blitz remembers that, but Stolas doesn’t (bc the way he was written in the beginning of the show suggested that he was privileged and spoiled enough that he wouldn’t have thought much of a lower class demon brought in to entertain him) Make hell have more explicitly problematic systems of oppression, rather than just giving lip service to it, like when Satan says imps were made to be obedient. Show us the ways imps are treated poorly by higher class demons instead of just hand-waving in the direction of it. Like maybe circus imps are regularly brought in to entertain royal children as jesters, and that’s how Blitz was familiar with the layout of the palace. Maybe Stolas- in keeping with his early series characterization- after discovering Blitz sneaking around the palace as an adult, hits on him and Blitz plays into it to get closer to the book. Make it so that Stolas’ behavior in the pilot and the first episode of the show make sense in context with Blitz and Stolas’ first sexual encounter. Having it be this sentimental “the one who wants me is my first friend” doesn’t follow, even with the joke that Stolas thinks Blitz wants to dirty talk and commits way too hard to that, and thats why he acts the way he does in the pilot and first episode. Vivzie seems to be scared of making her characters actually flawed. Like she wrote Stolas the way she did in the pilot for the dark humor of it and also bc Stolas was initially gonna be an antagonist, but then she wanted to ship him and Blitz, so somewhere along the way she just decided that they can’t have this problematic beginning to their relationship, with the power imbalance, so it has to be something more sensitive and sentimental. Speaking of obvious retcons and inconsistencies, there is something that one one knows, even Viv hreself: how much does she take from her source materials? To HH its the Bible ant to HB its The lessor key of Solomon. So all the ancient demons Viv adapts look like were born at least in the last 200 years (Bee's lava lamp body and hair, do I need to explain more?). So only Stolas, his brother in law and the parrot guy are the only one that got age nerfed, but they keep their immortality? Also, NONE of them are british or latinic or whatever culture she might pull out of her back. What is this arbitrary fanfic logic like the anime girl in the third short? Let's say hypotetically that the trial is rigged for Blitz, but not for Stolas. He just confessed that he is the guilty one, but for what? What crime? The things Blitz was accused of (stealing and attempted assasination) do NOT transfer at all to Stolas. The next logical question was also the most simple viewers fail to articulate: what was Stolas confessing for? His confession even contradicts Striker's confession so no matter how you slice it this was the worst written fictional trial ever and it was not intentional. No one had a functioning brain than maybe Bee and the parrot guy, not even Ozzie who knew and could vouch for the use of the book before but not anymore. They should have questioned him why did he do it to be the mastermind (of what? that's for organised crime) and then they should have followed the assasination plotline with Stolas in court to eighter fully clear Striker OR kill him alongside who truly hired him...Stolas knew it was Stella. I'm not one who treats the Bechdel Test seriously, but Helluva Boss fails it spectacularly. Also wow, how ironic that the most underdeveloped female character that Vivziepop insists has a lot of hidden depth is given a pregnancy plot. How much do you want to bet she’s going to be completely sidelined in the next season. ALSO, sorry yall but I don’t think Stolas is actually going to apologize for being a bad father to Octavia. Did we forget what happened when Ozzie called out Stolas in “Ozzie’s” and Blitzo chewed out Stolas in “Full Moon”, the former didn’t even keep his energy and Blitzo was so thoroughly punished that it felt like he was being abused into falling for Stolas. In fact that’s not even the first time she defensively said there’s nothing wrong with her writing feeling like fanfiction. She even called it homophobic when people used fanfiction as deragatory because some queer people like it…That’s like saying it’s homophobic to shit on Big Mouth because it has some queer fans. This is a video from Flazefire about HB and he also has one of HH, they are very informative, I recommend watching them. kzbin.info/www/bejne/baXImad-Yteab5Y&si=GcmeFlppkDFsIJSJ The tweets are at 26:00 mark and they go for a minute or so. One of the dates is december 1st 2024. Well we all have to admit. Viv beat the record for "how to avoid to tell what are the fellings of a mother about her own kid". Right now she holds the record of 2 seasons or 20 cursed episodes. I observed that while in Avengers there was only one way to end well, in every Vivziepop show there is only one way to end wrong and the writers bend over backwards to achive it. Example s2 e9 the fallout would have been avoided if eighter one of them did some gesture different and s2 e11 where no one in the court has a brain. In other shower thoughts, with season 2 ending we can finally say that Unhappy campers WAS THE MILLIE EPISODE ALL ALONG, yes, not Ghost fu- which btw was written by Brandon. Let that sink in...how much Viv cares about Millie. It just struck me: ep 2, 5 and 6 are pointless, ep 4 ruined Striker, ep 11 is the worst written trial in fiction (THE TRIAL FOR STOLAS, NOT BLITZ, THEY CAN'T BE FOR THE SAME CRIMES!!!) and ep 12 excuses Stolas further. I won't defend these remarks, however I left out the true worst episode of the entire show, the one every new watcher should skip because the writting is so bad that retcons the entire show before and even worse, after it. This episode should have his own medal alongside other boring episodes because it should not exist. Ladies and gentlemen, the worst episode of the entire show, because it spoils everithing else without ever being referenced once after its air, is...THE CIRCUS...

[@AcordHachi]

I have several problems with Helluva Boss, some of which are: 1. The series is too focused on Stolas. It's still hard for me to believe that Stolas, a character who was initially conceived as a secondary character (and a somewhat antagonistic one, at that) has become one of the main protagonists, with even more development and episodes centered around him than main characters like Millie or Loona. 2. Blitz's newfound "love" for Stolas feels... off and artificial. Are you seriously telling me that Blitz, a person traumatized by multiple tragic events, with a history of unstable relationships, and great difficulty in maintaining relationships and showing affection, is going to end up falling in love with... a privileged man who pressured Blitz into a relationship based on "favors for favors" and where Blitz had no choice but to accept using his body sexually to keep his business afloat, his only source of income and survival? Seriously, are you telling me that someone like Stolas awakened the "tender" and "romantic" side in Blitz? After so many disrespectful and abusive incidents? It makes no sense. The relationship between Blitz and Stolas was conceived as a sexual arrangement, and Blitz was subjected to multiple humiliations and mistreatments by Stolas. It makes no sense that someone with so many attachment issues and traumas like Blitz would end up so in love with Stolas... although, now that I think about it, it does make sense in the context of trauma bonding or Stockholm syndrome. Yikes. 3. Octavia needed so much more development! Viv forgot about Via's existence until now. Her song is beautiful, but it lacks all the emotional impact it could have had because Via has no development. Her character needed many more appearances in other episodes to further explore her relationship with Stolas and Stella. But I guess when you're too focused on Stolitz, there's no time left to develop the other characters. What a waste. 4. Does the series... justify infidelity? Don't get me wrong, the scene with the gay family was sweet, but... um... one of them is still a cheater. Lmao. Even Blitz says "infidelity isn't a big deal these days". Yes, it is. Even if your relationship is trash, ask for a divorce and then do what you want. Infidelity is never justified. IMP has never had problems killing children, families, or whoever for money. Now they're passing on a job... because Blitz thinks about his life with Stolas? What is this series? What happened to Blitz? I don't recognize these characters. They've all become so soft. Too soft. It's embarrassing. 5. Millie's pregnancy wasn't shocking or unexpected, but it was absolutely unnecessary. I don't need to clarify that I'm totally worried about how Viv is going to handle this topic, and I don't trust that they'll do it well. It's a very sensitive topic that affects many people in different ways, and I don't think a series like Helluva Boss is the right place to explore it, because I don't trust the writing team to do a good job. I don't understand what the need was for Millie to be pregnant. This situation only raises questions: you're married to a good man, you're very much in love, we can assume you have regular sex... so Millie and Moxxie weren't using protection? Honestly, I don't get Millie's shock or surprise, lol. Yes, Millie, if you have unprotected sex regularly with your husband... you'll probably get pregnant... Lmao. Which leads me to another question, if Millie doesn't want to have a baby because she's poor and they barely have enough money to get by... um... why weren't they using protection? I don't know. Millie's surprise doesn't make sense to me. Yes, Millie, if you have unprotected sex, you'll get pregnant. It's not rocket science. It's logic. 6- Stolas, you got what you f*cking deserved. I HATE HATE HAAATE how the shows tries to manipulate the audience into feeling bad for Stolas CONSTANTLY. No. You cannot make me feel bad for this asshole. All of this is his own fault. He told Via "I would never leave you!" And "you're the only good thing in my life!" But the MOMENT you decided to make a sexual arrangement with Blitz you KNEW that would have awful consequences and you decided that banging Blitz was so much worth the risk. The moment Stolas came up with the deal, he gave up on Via. He saw his own desires and lust as way more important than his relationship with his own daughter. In Loo loo land he is focused on Blitz all the time up until the end. In Seeing Stars he's more concerned about arguing with Stella than hanging out with Via...and even when she gets lost, he just spends he entire time...watching Blitz perform. Loona finds Via. Not Stolas. Also, now that I think about it, Stolas "has his ways" to find Blitz in the human realm without his grimoire...but he can't find his own daughter...? When Stolas is depressed, we see him watching telenovelas thinking about Blitz, we NEVER see him spending quality time with Via. When Blitz and Stolas fight in the Full Moon, insead of, I don't know, spending time with Via, maybe teaching her some spells, or something, Stolas much rather go to a party dedicated to Blitz and getting involved with another dude. Nice, Stolas. Octavia is 100% valid for feeling like Stolas loves Blitz more than he loves her because he literally does. That's literally what the show has demonstrated over and over again. And I absolutely HATE how he is portrayed as a victim, crying, sobbing and being consoled by the entire main cast. Stolas, after being an absolute jerk to Blitz, after neglecting his daughter NEEDED to be held accountable. This aint it. Portraying him as a tragic victim is not holding him accountable for all the sh1t he has done. He. Is. Not. A. Good. Person. and I'm tired of the writers trying to manipulate me into feeling sorry for him. 7-Helluva Boss now feels like a soap opera. The series went from being a dark comedy focused on action to a series full of unnecessary drama and poorly developed relationships, romances that feel more like toxic codependent relationships, and everything revolves around shipping. The series feels, at least to me, like "Stolitz, with some cool scenes in between, and some good songs sometimes". For a series that takes place in Hell itself, the relationships that Viv puts on a pedestal... are quite socially accepted and "classic" relationships, Millie and Moxxie are married, and the humor in their relationship was that it was something seen as so uncommon in Hell that it was repulsive, well, now it turns out that even the sin of Lust has an adorable, sweet, and monogamous relationship with Fizz. What a coincidence, you might think that Ozzie, being literally the embodiment of Lust, could be polygamous and have multiple lovers, but no, again, a monogamous, sweet, and classic relationship, ignoring the fact that they're two men. And then there's Stolas and Blitz, now also in love, in an adorable, sweet way, and we can assume it'll be a monogamous and classic relationship too. I'm monogamous myself, and even I find it strange that, as residents of Hell, all the main couples have quite "conservative" relationships. The series has turned into a soap opera that takes place in Hell, and it has all the worst attributes of soap operas too: interesting characters are left aside in favor of the "main couple", toxic and harmful relationships are put on a pedestal because "it's so romantic!" and the series is filled with monotony and contradictions. This is what Helluva Boss has become. I'm not interested in Stolitz. I don't care. There are many more interesting things to explore. Stolas has demonic legions? Cool, will we ever see them? How do they work? Andrealphus is an Infernal Marquis, great! Can we explore the differences between the princes, dukes, and marquises of Hell? Wasn't Helluva Boss supposed to serve as supporting material to contextualize the universe of Hazbin Hotel? It seems that's no longer the case. The series is a complete disappointment, and I'm no longer interested in it at all. The show is just a boring mess now. What a damn shame.

[@elizabethriley9403]

@AcordHachi I really just watch the show because I have nothing better to do, and I agree with these points. I'm especially disappointed that they turned Striker, a genuine threat, into a bumbling idiot so quickly. None of the antagonists actually feel... threatening. Stolas and Fizz got turned into lover/friend, Stella is... stupid, (I can't spell peacock fellows name) is just annoying, the cherubs aren't a threat they get beat so easily, the demon hunters are just.. kinda there, Verosika got on more neutral terms again, Striker turned into a bumbling idiot, there's just... no stakes against their life in a show about assassins.... the only stakes are just romance and relationships

[@spatuladevious]

People keep saying, that it's about relationships with characters. Like ok, maybe Fizz and Oz, but that's pretty much it. Blitz and Stolas do not count for me. They have still not even talked about that night at Ozzie's they brushed it under the rug. Stolas still has not once apologized to Blitz at all as well. Millie and Moxxie, I don't care for those two. Loona, don't care for her too much either. Yeah, she's changing in personality, but that means crap all to me.

[@nevaehhamilton3493]

The reason why it was never advertised as a romance show was because it didn't start out that way.

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

wait is this a copy paste?

[@Ju-hn9zg]

I hated apology tour so much that I didn't even notice 2 more EPs were released

[@Jman92854]

Stella being made into a 2D villain to justify Blitz and Stolas getting together is one thing... but honestly seeing her devolve even more as the show goes on that now she's completely stupid... it just hurts to see them not even try to make her compelling in the slightest. And honestly, finding out that Brandon Rogers helps with the writing, as a fan of his KZbin channel, Stella feels like she's turned into one of his characters. One who is stupid and loud to the point that it makes no logical sense and it doesn't help she's voiced by one of his friends who has acted in several of his videos for years. Obviously not saying it's the actress' fault, I'm just saying her voice sounded familiar to me, and I realized, yeah that's why. Granted Brandon's writing tends to get away with it because his universe is set up to be so nonsensical that certain things can be overlooked and it's never supposed to be that deep... the problem is that doesn't work here in a show like Helluva Boss.

[@Toast-com]

I think it's really funny for Vivziepop to take one of her female antagonists and have a male antagonist basically take the spotlight. And then make said female antagonist stupid and absurdly cruel to make the male character she's cruel seem like a saint in comparison, which he's not. It screams badly written yaoi fanfiction.

[@ilovesmelling]

@@Toast-com i find it funny when she makes trans characters and then purposely misgenders trans people

[@ilovesmelling]

@@Toast-com i find it funny when she makes trans characters and then purposely misgenders trans people

[@shuya3421]

45:02 i actually have to dissagree on your take of mastermind, because I thought it was really bad. Like the main villains entire plan is kinda just a gamble, its based on the chance that stolas might be watching the right channel. Which I know it was shown that the excacution was put on every channel that the imps, but I mean it was just the imps, wasn't shown to be forcibly put on. Stolas was flipping through the channels on the couch, and that just implys that there was a chance that he couldn't have seen it if he just sat around to watch a random show. They could have just written in that Oz just texts stolas or something, since they were shown to interact before and he was looking at his phone a bit in the episode anyways. Plus I there was the glaring thing the whole time while I watching the beginning of the ep, which was why didn't blitz just use the crystal to go to the human realm and use the interns as diversions? Like whats even the point of the crystal being introduced if they didn't even use it in a time of need? That was disappointing when I watched the ep. Plus I thought satans design looked boring, I swear there are better ways to do wrath, and I also didn't like the sudden appearance of all the sins. Felt like they could have gotten some better build up, along with that one red star owl guy. I dunno he sounded Spanish, but like he was never mentioned (not that I would know of by watching the show) plus I think hes supposed to stolas friend? But he was never directly mentioned before when stolas probably needed a friend for advice or something. Also didn't like how they dumbed down striker into following some rich person above him just for money(or for getting back at stolas and blitz) When striker was shown to be someone who really doesn't like the class divide at all, and doesn't like the people above him. I dunno I just think that it was contrived as a episode, and made sinsmas worse. And I don't like sinsmas either, the dancing part is pretty but feels undeserved. I dunno I don't wanna yap more then I already have

[@redpanda6497]

Yeah, I agree.

[@Seth8754]

Agreed

[@runawayfromtoads674]

S2 was abysmal for me. But you actually sold me to consider watching the last three episodes. I adored S1 and liked Stolas. He actually felt like a Goetian demon with authority, who hilariously shot himself in the foot by sleeping with an imp. Everything snowballed for him then! Octavia is unsure if Stolas would even stay. He's under the DHORKS' radar. Stella put him on the hitlist. And Blitzo, who he's feeling all romantic for, just believes it's transactional! I was so excited for S2 and see how his arc goes. Then they excused everything he did. And he's been mostly an uwu sad boi. I stand by with how S2 Ep 1 and 2 should have never happened. The season should have started with IMP and shenanigans! Stolas should have been reduced to less screentime and only shown in snippets until he finally matters in the plot. Like, how much intrigue would it have been to have all IMP episodes, and then huh? Fizzarolli? Why is he the focus here? Then you have Stolas show up asking for a favor from Asmodeus. And he's only shown in fractions until he either gets in trouble like Western Energy, or the next full moon where he wants to give Blitzo an Asmodean crystal. I'd rant all day, but yeah, honestly just disappointed with the show until you gave me that glimmer of hope that long swam away from my hands since Western Energy. (Edit: *DHORKS from DORKS)

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

Dhorks are not even a danger, the are the CLOWNS of this series, they are harmless, even the lowest of the hell cast system can defeat a entire army of them, imagine fighting a Goetia.

[@runawayfromtoads674]

​@@Sonic2024freedomera I agree! Dhorks can't even handle a fraction of what Stolas can do. It would be sensible for Stolas to barely have an inkling of worry about being seen by humans. But to me, that's the exciting thing! Imagine having not a rat's ass about a bunch of humans. But imagine these humans kickstarting a lot of demonology research and shenanigans. Enough to have the higher up demons start to notice humans know about them! And maybe know enough to trap or repel them. Someone's not using human disguises. Someone made a slip. Now, if the other higher up demons find out about IMP? They'll eventually learn about his deal with Stolas. Very similar to recent eps, but hey! ✨Fun!✨ (Edit: added sparkles just cuz)

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

@@runawayfromtoads674 oh yeah

[@mason-k2t6q]

My favorite thing about Sinsmas is that Stolas finally regrets what he did; my problem with Apology Tour is that Stolas isn't in the right at all

[@GaminfDog]

@mason-k2t6q (assuming you're talling about the deal, judging off your apology tour point) Actually, Stolas regretted the deal ever since Blitzo called him out at the end of Season 1. Which is why he's been trying to get him out of the deal ever since episode 6 of season 2. So idk what you mean bg "finally"

[@gloomiiii]

@GaminfDog im pretty sure they meant that we actually see him think about it blitz as in “finally”

[@Jdudec367]

I meean he was in the right to feel like Blitz was kinda wrong, he was wrong too at times but yeah.

[@alllittlethingzz]

Yes finally someone sees that Stolas wasn’t the victim in Apology tour!! He was apart of the problem!

[@syafeeqahisham1740]

Honestly,If I want to name a parent that is better than stolas it will be morgan from high potential,fiona from shameless, doofenshmirtz from phineas and ferb and finally mickey from lincoln lawyer. Mickey:Even though he has two divorce wives,he still has a great bond with them because the 3 agree they divorce because of falling out of feelings between the other. And besides,mickey supported his ex wives as h eshare custody with his daughter from his first ex wife. And for his second ex wife,both are coworkers but they still bonded as just friends and the fact his second ex wife sometimes comforted him and knows his ins and outs. Fiona:Shes not a parent but she is the oldest of her siblings and have to play the part of a parent figure. We can even see in many episodes that she cares for her siblings one by one and even has her own demonds to fight. Yet,doesnt hesitate to put her siblings first before herself. Its so sad to hear that she has done this since she was just 9. Morgan:Morgan is a single mom and has 3 kids. The show makes a good job on seeing how even though she solves cases as a consultant,she always spend times with her 3 children and even defended them. On the recent episode,morgan stands up to her son being bullied by his classmates. We can also understand what morgan is talking about due to her experince as a single mom whose raising her kids when her husband left her for an unknown reason. Doofenshmirtz:Ehhh,lets say hes a better version of stolas and we see a lot of evidnce that proves hes a good dad to vanessa and also a good ex husband/friend to his ex wife.

[@AllenReyes-991]

Vivziepop is a George Lucas. Makes a WONDERFUL fictional universe we all LOVE, has good story ideas, but can't write for the life of them. Vivziepop should just write the pain plot points she wants, then let Brandon and others handle the rest.

[@SnowLeopardtherebel]

i'm going to be honest? i love stolas. he and fizz are probably two of my favorite characters in the show! but...no. just no. like you said, yeah, stolas' character does a COMPLETE 180. to the point where if you compare s1 episode 1 stolas and s2 episode 12 stolas, you'd think they were different characters. and while i love s2 stolitz (the end), its so completely different and so, so poorly written. stolas is NOT the victim. he actively played a part in the mistreatment of blitz, and while blitz does shitty stuff too, its jst...a mess. and i love fizz from oops onward, and i totally agree that episode 7 was fucking amazing, but it ALSO feels like a character 180. at least fizz has a reason for the character change, especially once we get more details about mammon. it just feels poor, especially since we only get like...4? episodes? with him? and it just feels off. full moon was an absolute dumpster fire and apology tour is...alright? originally it was my favorite episode but upon reflection its just kind of odd. the party doesnt really seem *good*, and the speedrunning of blitz 'apologising' just doesn't sit right with me

[@Toshineko]

The show pretty much shifted from a show about an assassination company, to a melodramatic Stolitz show, where Stolas is the good guy and everyone else he wronged is in the wrong. The villains are also unbelievably weak and one-dimensional. All of them are pretty much pure evil for the sake of pure evil, don't pose any threat to the main cast, and the tonal whiplash makes it difficult for us to take them seriously. I especially dislike Andrealphus's plan due to how dumb it was. We're supposed to see that he's this "true mastermind" but really, his plan to lure Stolas out was based on pure luck. He didn't have Stella taunt Stolas about Blitz being executed. Stolas just conveniently turned on the TV, and he just showed up. Plus, I feel like the supposed "consequences" for Stolas's actions were made just to make us feel sorry for him even more. The loss of his powers didn't really punished him for projecting the same things he had done to Blitz, nor did Stolas really got punished for sexually harassing Blitz. Even if the opposite was true, this came across as too little too late to me. Stolas had his chance, yet in the end, all he wanted was to get into Blitz's pants. And we're supposed to root for him anyway. Bojack Horseman does this dramedy way better than Helluva Boss.

[@khazakibunny]

50:56 the thing is even though stolas is facing the consequences of his actions he still getting the good end of the stick by making it seem like he deserved better. I mean yeah octavia finally tells her father off after breaking her promise and neglecting her for blitzo more than once, but yet he still happily gets to be with blitz (the homewrecker that he’s been obsessed with and the one his daughter’s family life) as they dance and prance together on the balcony. Plus when he says “she hates me” about octavia as if doesn’t why she does. And that goes for his other consequences like yes he got stripped away from his powers and now has to live as mortal with blitz and the gang yet he still hasn’t apologized for everything he did to him.

[@MorShadows]

Notice how they lost the main premise of the show so much that it become 5 min "specials".

[@MiraBoo]

Episode 1 of season 2 is basically just a sloppy retcon of Stolas that the writers had to include due to changes in the show’s direction/focus. I think Blitzo’s past was already planned out (minus knowing Stolas as a kid), but everything with Stolas was incongruent with the first season. I especially hate how they stripped Stella of any nuance or sympathy in order to make Stolas a more empathetic character-which was unnecessary.

[@anntan9913]

The writing honestly feels like...A fanfic writer got ahold of the scripts sometimes.

[@joshinray5303]

I preferred hellava bosses original pitch and i hated it when it just turned into a drama

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

people would have been bored for that, it is better for shorts or when it is required, not all episodes should be about the assasination missions.

[@Cyburim]

@@Sonic2024freedomera Why is a common criticism that it barely is involved with the pilot then as a conception. Even the Bible Pitch Concept art explicitly states Stolas to be a villain/antagonist and the I.M.P. gang being a 'found family'.... People prefer the shorts over the actual series is a high telltale sign that vivs writing is wrong. Also the shorts here are probably because of budget restrictions/making her team work on MORE episodes at a time is appalling I can't believe this fandom praises the way she's a director, she overworks and crunches her team constantly.

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

@@Cyburim that was the pilot, and not all pilots stay true, there are exceptions, but that, just exceptions (also concept art is...concept art, like the concept art of sonic prime never turning into what actually happened in the series). Because the shorts are not an entire chapter dedicated to the murders, it is good to have the plot of murderers, as shorts and that it does not take up the entire series or all the chapters. Did you make that up or what the hell? The shorts are supposed to be there so that the wait for the chapters isn't so long and the fans don't run out of content for a long time.

[@Seth8754]

@@Sonic2024freedomera idk bout you but i'd prefer action over UwU boy story with daddy issues

[@redpanda6497]

I like the drama, not the melodrama though.

[@MissFlow]

Introducing Andre was a big mistake. Stella being a plain evil antagonist is completely fine, not every villain needs a tragic backstory. The fact that they made her despicably evil is all fine and dandy. But then for gods sake make her REALLY evil. Make her cunning, sly and manipulative. Now, she's none of those. She isn't cunning cause she can't think further ahead than her feathered forehead. She isn't sly cause Andre has to come up with all the evil plans. She isn't manipulative, at least... not shown to us. The few times she was it was most likely because her brother told her what to do and say. All she is is an emotional brute with the literal brain of a bird. Wasted potential

[@redpanda6497]

​​ I've already said it in another video, but if they really want her to be just plain bad, they could have just made her a Mother Gothel. She's realistically abusive and she creates many conflicts to the other characters. We would still have a problem with Stolas' morality looking whitewashed, but at least she would be a good character.

[@aduckofsomesort]

Let the girly be a dumb bitch ❤ dumb bitches need representation too

[@OliverOils]

34:23 DUDE IF YOU DO THAT We wouldn't have gotten Over The Garden Wall! which is PEAK FICTION

[@idkwhat01]

There would be no ULTRAKILL too :(

[@josephsigala6631]

If there was a big problem with helluva boss characters it has to be its female characters and it villains reason all of HB female characters are mostly used to development this male characters development and it never the other way around like loona was used to development blitz characters during season 2 episode 2 or millie used to development moxxie and blitz character and for HB villains they all have the same problem there ether one dimensional with hollow motivation the show can't decide if there supposed to be serious or comedic villains with plans that ether nake no sense or was a complete wasted of time and there to many villains happening at the same time that it feel bloated like there like 6 ( if you count the churbs and agents as 1 )

[@e-122psi3]

I'll give credit that Loona at least had SOME exception in the last two episodes. It's not mentioned in the video but I do really like that brief POV focus with Loona in Mastermind, she's gagged and helpless and all she can see is Blitz taking the fall for her. All her asshole behaviour is clearly flashing in her mind in guilt and she can't say or do anything to amend in Blitz's final moments. Her change in behaviour from that point forward makes total sense in terms of the huge scare she just went through.

[@Seth8754]

@@e-122psi3 kinda pathetic it was the most attention she could get in last epsiodes. Lets hope they just doesnt discard this and make her treat blitz like shit for almost no goddamn reason.

[@davissmedley5937]

You wanna know something funny? There’s a fanfiction based on this show called “A Loud Among Demons” that acts as a crossover between HB and The Loud House, with the setup being that Lincoln is cursed to live in Hell and ends up working for IMP, with Moxxie and Millie acting as his surrogate parents and him then following along on the group’s escapades we see in the series proper. And I kid you not…but it is actually *REALLY* dang good and well written. Better than the series itself I’d even say. Why is that? A couple reasons. 1) Many of the characters who barely get development in the actual show, like Loona and Octavia, get WAY more fleshed out in the fic and end up becoming much more interesting as a result. 2) Weird as it’ll sound, the series just feels more complete with a character who fits Lincoln’s archetype in this story. By that I mean, in this version of the series, he acts as the kind straight-man who, while losing his temper sometimes, is able to keep a positive outlook and bring out the good in others without being looked down on for it. A character like that just feels REALLY needed in a show where most of the characters are jerks and the ones who aren’t get pushed around all the time. Give it a read if you ever get the chance. It’s well worth it!

[@cdarixxx]

@@davissmedley5937 good god i thought this was ab admiraldt8 i got scared

[@redpanda6497]

@@davissmedley5937 I've heard Millie is well written here.

[@davissmedley5937]

She certainly is, both her AND Moxxie. The thing that makes their dynamic a lot better in this story is that a lot of their drama isn’t centered on their relationship problems like it is in the main series over and over again, but rather their struggles and doubts about being able to be good parents.

[@Jman92854]

It amazes me that Viv has two shows with multiple seasons... and they're both blown out of the water by The Amazing Digital Circus which, as I write this, only has 4 episodes. FOUR. Quality over Quantity.

[@Veanixonn_]

The contrast between the first episode where they MASSACRE an entire family just because they think it's justified, to the last episode where they have to ask themselves whether it's right to kill a family or not is really frustrating

[@caitlingoins2103]

They shouldve kept stolas as he was in the pilot. More of a villian type

[@Derethevil]

I'm sorry but Mastermind itself was horrible in writing. It had so many logic flaws. What if Stolas wouldn't have zapped through the channels? The big evil duo with Stella and.. brother (i forget the name all the time) completely relied on that to happen to catch Stolas. So many things were so wrong. Suspension of disbelief has to be.. so extreme for it to work and it just makes it.. poorly written. The only thing i liked was the latest episode showing that Octavia at least had an actual natural reaction to all of it. Constant lies of Stolas. Making it clear that he would have chosen his own death over his own daughter. No.. Sorry. Stolas is just as awful of a father.

[@Jdudec367]

It wasn't horrible in writing though. It really didn't. Eh the news would have reached him eventually either way really, like the news paper for example, so they didn't completely rely on that happeening really. Not really it all made sense really. Eh no it really doesn't have to be extreme at all, it really isn't poorly written. Eh no not really he wasn't thinking clearly at the time.

[@royalxprincessbaka6875]

​​@@Jdudec367you dumb

[@redpanda6497]

@@Jdudec367 Why are here arguing with everyone if you don't even want to listen to us? The only thing you say is "no, it's not true."

[@tiagoskinwalk4667]

49:34 Yeah,but then i rewatch apology tour and realize that the first episode was kinda...meaningless. Especially after learning the crazy lady is together with the sinner who wanted her to die lol

[@static7579]

I didn't agree with everything in this video, maybe not even the majority of it? Frankly though that doesn't matter, I could tell this was a genuine review from someone who honestly engaged with the source material AND came out with a unique perspective; that's worth infinitely more than the majority of critique videos I've seen that amount to little more than "HB sucks and swears too much also I hate Stolas!". You've earned a sub

[@Seth8754]

@@static7579 imo some others have valid arguments in stating those both because it is kinda true

[@themac6356]

@@static7579 Same honestly. Very well made video listing the problems with the series and the suggestions that could help improve it. It’s a breath of fresh air to see a video that addresses both the good and flawed aspects of the series instead of the usual “Helluva Boss suck lmao” that a majority of the internet tends to hold.

[@LunaHasima]

I hope they fix the women in the next season because stella millie octavia and loona are all carried by other characters Loona is caried by bltizø shes doesnt really have anything abt herself then one ep Octavia doesnt really have her own personality then complaining about stolas (which is justified tho) Millie is carried by moxie she has an ep about *her* family but its still about moxxie and the only thing abt her was her past as an assassin meeting blitzø (again not about her) but only has one short abt her and her sister And stella was just made to look stolas good and was just a villian who also got forced in to a marige but is just evil for nothing Hazbin hotel shares this problem but its probably getting fixed in season 2

[@ZooWeeMama113]

I hope so, because I feel like they still didn't properly address how wrong it was for Loona to abuse her own father??

[@Seth8754]

@@ZooWeeMama113 at first i was like oh ok so she is the tsundere type but then she fucking kicks blitz in the balls after having a heartfelt talk about having fathers with via She is immature asf

[@Logan_Zimmerman]

Characterwise problems I had like Hazbin Hotel is it's villians mostly Stella. She can be so stupid and so cartoonishly evil it's a wonder Octavia never figured out the abuse she was doing to Stolas especially in Sinsmas. She is as Andrealphus said a stupid cow. And andrealphus isn’t much better.

[@e-122psi3]

Really for all the complaints to the CHERUBs I think Collin is actually the most interesting antagonist, for the simple fact he ISN'T really a villain. In fact he plays off the fact IMP are villains because he's basically this sincere little angel who only wants them to stop killing people and pays horribly for it every time he appears, now even getting forced against his will to face them in battle. He's a character that plays off and challenges IMP's most genuine unlikeable qualities, that they hurt people for their cause and don't care who suffers for it, which leaves to think it's a shame he's just sporadic comic relief. He could be a REALLY compelling writers challenge in a show that wants to go through hoops to make it's bad guy protagonists look sympathetic. The only point to successfully attempt that otherwise is the abandoned assassination in Sinsmas. I think there's more meaning to such moments than just pitting IMP against loads of meaner bad guys than them.

[@cosmicspacething3474]

People really took all the wrong lessons from Big Jack Horner

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

because for Octavia, her mother has been like that since forever, with his father on other hand, it was obvious when he was not...himself

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

@@cosmicspacething3474 Stella existed before he was writed in that movie

[@cosmicspacething3474]

@@Sonic2024freedomera That doesn’t mean things can’t be changed partway through

[@Cyburim]

1:48 disagree, blitz doesnt have any character development or evolve throughout the series i heavily wish to see what series you have been seeing to think hes gotten character development... especially considering that the classism is NOT focused nor discussed whatsoever besides in Sinsmas, sorry but you're wrong. Fizzerolli, Blitz, Crimson, and even Vortex and Loona despite allegedly being the 'bottom of the heigherarchy' are literally doing just fine by themselves and half are dating overlords/people in power. The only thing viv says about classism is 'yeah date into it if you're poor sorry thats the only way is by fucking a rich dude' thats abhorrent and sickening dude

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

goetias or sin level, overlords are lower than those two.

[@Cyburim]

@@Sonic2024freedomera ???you realize even the series itself doesn't respect the hierarchy we're imagining exists within this series right??? Like if it isn't set in stone outside of Mastermind then why isn't season 1's classism called into question.... Why was a Goetia so casually at Loo-Loo-Land with an IMPISH GANG..... He literally has IMP BUTLERS and it's addressed in canon to go NOWHERE. Stolas' internal classism is NEVER called into question so don't get me started on how the Goetias are supposed to get a 'pass' when they're treated like a joke. Much like how overlords' entire labelling and system is-- an imp can interact with and out-drink gluttony and can bad mouth the overlord of greed but I have to believe that just because he used a Goetia SUDDENLY CLASSISM??? The story and lore is thinner then straws here because THERE IS NO LORE.

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

@@Cyburim Stolas didn't need IMP to be protected, apart from the fact that he is immortal and could have taken down the assassins alone, he wanted a moment with his daughter and didn't want to be bothered. Overlords are sinners who gained power thanks to owning the souls of other sinners, not sins or royalty, you are confusing Mammon from a overlord, when Mammon existed before the concept of overlords even existed (the oldest overlord is only a few centuries old, Mammon is billions of years old)

[@Cyburim]

@@Sonic2024freedomera you're confused about my confusion here buddy. Viv herself admitted that she's terrible at writing her own characters and was more of an animator/storyboarder at the time up until now.... What she thinks of her ocs/what the fandom writes for her isn't overwriting what is happening/being shown to us in the literal show. Blitz has no consequences as a main character objectively because none of these characters face the consequences about them, we're literally back to square zero like the pilot I have no hope for the future or for Stolitz.

[@connordalton7316]

I'm so happy you've said this. People have praised Blitz and the story for having him become a better person, and all I can say is "where?" Like you said, he recieves no real consequences for his actions because they're either all just misunderstandings, or the people Blitz reflects his abuse onto just "deserve it". He only acts nice so that the story can say he's a better person, and then it's right back to square one.

[@deecollinssuperitandficays863]

Ngl the Blitz x Stolas ship taking over most of Season 2 is what I think made most people begin to dislike the show, or at least that season

[@NikaNani686]

i can sooo relate to what you say regarding the shift in stolas' character! i felt like "why is he like this now? .. does he behave like this, because when getting asked on a date he thought there is an actual chance for romance?" i thought i just missed something but seems like I'm not alone with this. Also i still can't really believe that Blitz ever liked Stolas in a romantic way before S2E8. there is no, or too little, development of his feelings. before full moon it felt more like Blitz sees this as his duty, he is not in love, he is actually annoyed by Stolas, .. and suddenly he is heartbroken, depressed, and sings "you're my heart" .. that felt like it came out of nowhere.

[@aniflowers1998]

"Hopefully the next seasons will have more on the level of 'Mastermind'-" HOPEFULLY NOT! I dislike that episode with a passion! (Not "hate" it, that goes to "Cherubs" and "Happy Campers". But "dislike" non the less!) Every single character, with exception of Vasago and maybe Bee, acts absolutely stupid in that episode. I can't stand Andrelphus stupid plan that completely relies on the small chance that Solas is watching TV and just happens to click on the right program. I can't stand Stolas self sacrifice build on a stupid over the top lie, when him simply telling the truth would have had the same outcome. I fucking HATE that the writers VERRY CLEARLY avoided getting Ozzy involved, becouse his involvment would ruin Andrelphus alredy stupid plan! Most I can give this episode, is the aknowledgment that the stupidity of most of those characters was at least somewhat in character. That's all. (Hell, I didn't even like the song! Which is probably my most onpupular opinion about that episode xD)

[@liffablobsen5600]

I hope that Stolas new life will teach him how he has mistreated Blitz and I feel like everything they are doing is building up to that. (I hope this won't age poorly)

[@TurnTheFrigginFrogsBi]

Tbh the only reason I’m even slightly looking forward to season 3 is because I wanna see Belphegor

[@tigerfalco]

8:05 It's a little nitpicky, but while I agree with the past 2 examples of the dialogue lacking subtelty, im certain the Blitz one is different. Like, I could try to make an excuse for Moxxies awkward ass... but with Blitz its definitely supposed to be comedic characterization, not a clarification. He's saying it to make Moxxie even more nervous, to fuck with him cuz he's an asshole and its supposed to be humorous. Look at his facial expressions. The nonchalant eyes, the shit eating grin, all exclamated by saying "No pressure" then literally pushing him before he's comfortable. And for more proof, as a musician, they ham it up with dramatic music that crescendos only to end it with one note modulation for comedy. It feels like something youd see in an old sitcom like Suite life of Zack and Cody or something, at least it does to me cuz ive seen that joke in so many of those shows. Only difference between those shows and this, is in those shows theyre trying to calm the person down and its suposoed to be funny how bad they are are it...but here Blitz is clearly doing it on purpose. I think the previous 2 examples are fair, just not that one. Sorry for the nitpick, but hopefully it makes that scene less aggravating than how I assume you originally took it.

[@glassbearproductions]

Great vid! One thing I wanted to point out was that in S2, there was a stretch of episodes where Loona was technically there, but was completely silent. Allegedly this was because Erica Lindbeck took a break from VAing to mourn the loss of Billy Kametz, her partner at the time. That said there has apparently been interest to flesh Loona out more, and given the bits and pieces of her warming up to Blitz and being more social in the back half of S2, I'm hoping that's one of the improvements S3 can make. UPDATE: Everything past the first two words of the first paragraph has been debunked. I'm still keeping the comment up because I was wrong and I don't wanna hide that, but also because the clarification in the replies is still important info to have for the context of Season 2, and I don't just want to copy and paste it.

[@Birdyboys]

For clarification: this isn’t true and was just fan speculation. Vivziepop confirmed on Twitter that it was because she couldn’t afford her VA (forcedpositivity made a video showing her tweets). This is also why Velvette doesn’t speak in the finale

[@glassbearproductions]

@@Birdyboys Oh shit. I knew I saw something about Billy being the reason, but I guess that was conjecture/hearsay. Thanks for the correction! (Also, this being my first time learning Erica was Velvette...)

[@wolf19360]

It is true that the voice actress for Loona lost her fiancé, and I offer my deepest condolences. Losing a loved one unexpectedly is incredibly heartbreaking.

[@maltsoymarai2243]

@@glassbearproductions Erica lindbeck doesn’t voice Velvette, I think they mean they didn’t have budget for Velvette’s VA either

[@JoseCido-s3s]

​@@wolf19360This is a lie, look at the comment above

[@-w-377]

Sometimes I think about the fact that if the show was actually about Fizzarolli and Asmodeus trying to navigate their relationship would fit the intended theme of the show way more. The classism can come through by Ozzie being shamed for dating an Imp and that even if Fizz is a celebirty, he still is nowhere near a Hell's prince level in the hiarchy. Then we can also explore the abusive relationship between Fizz and Mammon (the Helluva Boss in this) and how that works together. And how Mammon discovers Fizz and Ozzies relationship and tries to blackmail Ozzie with it. This could lead Fizz to panic that Ozzie would leave him or that Ozzie actually is forced to leave him because the other sins judge him for it because again...classism. But in the end it is resolved in some way.

[@hildegarde7962]

You put a lot of stock on a portrait of Stella with arms crossed, shooting daggers with her eyes at Stolas, with the most forced smile, while he smiles interacting with his daughter. In the backdrop of a scene where Stella is throwing objects and people at him, yelling about how embarrassed she is that he slept with an imp and would consider booking a motel, never stating that she was mad because she was heartbroken or it was a betrayal of their marriage to cheat generally.

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

In fact, it almost sounded like having relations with an imp, an imp specifically, was his problem, that is, as if having relations with another goetia wouldn't be a problem.

[@roxycauldwell544]

I hate the Dhorks as antagonists, and i like the Cherubs even less. I can never take them seriously. Like....how are they even antagonists? Wtf are they going to do against literal demons?

[@JoseCido-s3s]

Have you noticed that since "Sinsmas" was released the number of Helluva Boss critical videos has increased a lot?...just an observation of course

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

Well, I have also noticed that someone says "what a great video talking about [Hazbin or helluva]" and then I look back and see a list, but seriously, A BIG LIST, it's like, 3 meters of videos that talk about the shows.

[@Mint_lemon-16w]

To be honest, idk why they ruined moxie's character in happy campers.

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

by making him want more attention and a little bit of recognition?

[@Cyburim]

@@Sonic2024freedomera *that he already got in Harvest Moon Festival, Truth Seekers, and to a degree Ozzies??? Why can't you admit he was so written out of character in that episode agreeably the worst episode ever?

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

@@Cyburim In Ozzies, Asmodeus literally disrespected him, in Truth Seekers it wasn't much, or rather it wasn't that notable, rather it was focused on the fact that they were both honest with each other (and the massacre of the Dhorks was for the entire team). In Harvest Moon, he is humiliated by a shark, Striker, and when he has the chance, he half-gets it because Striker escapes, although he manages to save Millie. although yes, the fake voice was the worst, i hope the spanish dub does something with that...or they would make it worse.

[@Seth8754]

Agreed. One time he is insecure about his ablilites in killing one time he is worrying about his charisma and every single goddamn time it was Millie who had to support him. She always supports him and others along the group im suprised by her mental capacity to be honest. Like if he is this insecure get him some therapy

[@jakedoesyoutube]

​@@Sonic2024freedomera no, by making him a whiney annoying brat that cries over not getting the adoration of literal children while also completly forgetting about the job to play dress up. The best assassin character had his character assassinated, you gotta admit it.

[@allimari]

Loved the video!! I appreciate that instead of just retelling the entire plot of the show and then getting to the point, you interweaved it throughout. I won't lie I'm not a fan of HB, but I think you gave it a very fair review. Thank you!!!

[@SpoopySquid]

The Hella-verse wants so badly to be seen as "edgy" and "subversive" but then you watch it and realise it's just Hot Topic with swear words and sex jokes

[@Notyouraveragename]

HI MY NAME IS ILIKEDITCUS AND THIS IS MY WIFE, IAMGREYSEX!

[@mrliteral9321]

This show will never recover, Vizie has her flawed vision and will never change course, reflecting all criticism as "trolling"

[@deadspaceskull6905]

I legit don't see a season 3 happening. I think everyone has just stopped caring and moved on to better Indy projects and if it does start I don't see it getting one or two episodes before it gets cancelled because by then the views will likely be only in the thousands or hundreds

[@mrliteral9321]

@deadspaceskull6905 let's hope so before she ruins it more 😂

[@benchappearo1580]

Between the fandom defending this show to their death and other analyses tearing this show to bits, this felt like the most nuanced take I've seen so far. It's a flawed show with a lot of potential that does some things really well. I also think that the last episodes improved a lot compared to "those" parts of season 2. And I also have hope that season 3 will manage to adress the show's current flaws. The world and the characters have enough in the tank to make it a really good season.

[@koalabearkhan145]

5:20 how did I realize until only now that blitzo mentions to verosika she’s drinking a beezlebub drink product? Beezlejuice I think? See, stuff like that just flew over my head

[@providence1517]

It really does suck how much Helluva Boss has fallen. The biggest crime is how they treated Stella. You had the makings for a villain is clearly a woman scorned. Her actions are wrong, but you can understand where she's coming from. And if you add in the arranged marriage angle, she becomes even more tragic. But no. No, no, no, instead, Stella just hates Stolas for lolz and wants to make him suffer, she is relegated to the background while her brother who came out of nowhere takes over (btw, I'm 100% convinced Andrealphus is just what villain!Stolas was supposed to be before Viv got hooked on Stolitz). And in the process, you got Stella fans being labeled abuse and RAPE apologists (that's right, they call Stella a rapist based off of one throwaway line that is never touched upon again), that even Viv gets in on it. Other crimes include: Loona being sidelined (literally no lines between Seeing Stars and Full Moon, basically half the season, if you don't count the late release of Queen Bee) despite being a main character. Meanwhile, Fizz and Ozzie got TWO back-to-back episodes (did we really need that Mammon episode fr?). Apology Tour. You cannot convince me that Verosika is the good guy/girl for hosting a yearly party shitting on ONE ex-boyfriend, and daring to call it 'therapy'. Barbie Wire. Jesus christ, why was she even introduced if you were only gonna use her for two minutes in a WHOLE SEASON And what makes it worse are the fans. You will never find a group of fans (or stans to be precise) so ignorant of the show's failings, so argumentative, and so blinded by their worship for Viv that they will go as far as to harass, talk down, and flat out ignore wrongdoings of both fans and Viv herself. I wouldn't be surprised if this video attracts some of them here and try to start shit. All over a show that's mediocre at best with a few good moments, and just bad at worst period.

[@CherryHotSauce]

@@providence1517 loona had no lines because he VA was mourning her dead partner

[@providence1517]

@@CherryHotSauce No, that has been disproven time and time again. Loona not having lines iirc was planned because Viv could not afford to have her voice as many lines. Her partner dying was just a sad coincidence.

[@cosmicspacething3474]

“…Even Viv gets in on it” *W H A T ? ! ? !*

[@providence1517]

​@@cosmicspacething3474I don't remember a lot about it, but basically, a person was getting roasted for a critique on HB, and Viv said 'It's always the Stella pfps (profile pics)'. The problem with VIv and her fans is if VIv is offended or makes a off-hand remark, her fans takes it as a go-ahead to harass that person.

[@Seth8754]

This show had a lot of potential such pity its wasted. The damage is already done but i hope they at least handle writing better upcoming seasons

[@cookies_n_clovers1189]

I understand you like the show, but for me, sometimes I can't understand how I ever did

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

maybe your heary memories made you forget

[@cookies_n_clovers1189]

@Sonic2024freedomera what?

[@Seth8754]

@cookies_n_clovers1189 Lmaoo they are assuming you are starting to develop alzheimers 🤣

[@cookies_n_clovers1189]

@@Seth8754 bc i don't d ride a show? Bruh

[@Kaijuenjoyer-nv7qn]

My biggest problem with Helluva Boss is that its inconsistent both quality and story wise. There's times I love the show to no end and get the hype and then there epsidoes thay make me question why I watched it.

[@adalwinamillion5477]

Luna is for normies, while Chaz... Chaz is for connoisseurs.

[@uiopuiop3472]

disagree, you cant even write Loona properly. #6

[@adalwinamillion5477]

@uiopuiop3472 what is a "Loona"?

[@O_R_Miller06]

​@@adalwinamillion5477 Canonically, "Loona" is how her named is spelled, not "Luna".

[@ashy_inking1476]

@@uiopuiop3472 She doesn’t deserve to have her name spelled correctly smh

[@SkillHunterThousandManPlan]

Can we stop gooning for five minutes😭😭😭

[@gray5105]

until this vid i had no idea the white was scars… thought fizz was face paint

[@amyhood9626]

@@gray5105 Honestly, that's understandable; Fizz is a jester, after all. Clowns and jesters usually wear face paint of some sort. It took me a moment as well. It doesn't really go into explicit detail if I'm remembering correctly.

[@redpanda6497]

It wasn't mentioned in the show, it was in a livestream.

[@cosmicspacething3474]

And I thought Blitzo was just naturally like that

[@gray5105]

@ same

[@Cyburim]

Its funny you say 'i dont want to send it to animation hell' because thats what the animators go through and not a single mention of the fact that she mistreats her storyboarders *Salem, Ken, and Zuerel to namw a few.... Love that everyone wants to commentate on vivs works and dont actually commentate on the animators, prop designers, background artists, or the actual storyboarders that have to deal with this mess of a series.... ugh 🎉

[@dacorrupted1353]

I've never understood the hype with hazbin hotel and helluva boss

[@mariahs6]

This video is very well formatted! I love Helluva and Hazbin myself but will definitely admit they have their flaws. What I want to see most is how Stella and Octavia’s relationship is, and hope that it goes the Mother Gothel route. The fake empathy from Stella in Mastermind is SO GOOD, I really hope they keep building on that. On a side note, I occasionally use four exclamation points to note excitement in dialogue, so when it was brought up it was like a flashlight was shining in my eyes…

[@themac6356]

Same here, very good video. I also want to see Via and Stella's relationship in the future season.

[@damainortiz]

I like the show but I just don’t know whether it wants to be a straight up comedy or drama. Both go well together they just have to be balanced perfectly.

[@cristobalbarra583]

my problem with this show was that despite selling itself as an adult show it just feels as a teen show that wants to be adult, and adult show its not just insults and sex jokes, the characters also need to be more deep, they went way too much in the way of contenting the fandom after s1 instead of focusing in the original idea wich made season 2 worse than s1 for me, thats my feeling and reason of why i stoped watching it after 2 seasons, but hey, if people like it who am i to say it should be this or that way.

[@caramel9154]

yeah it's very.. 'my soft bean baby sksksksk' type of stuff

[@ballooonghost]

18:08 I enjoyed this video, I disagreed with a lot of points but that's okay! But there is one point I wanted to make. You mention that Stolas, Stella, and Octavia all look happy in the portrait, but I'd like to point out that just isn't true. Stolas and Octavia are happy for sure, but if you look closer at Stella, her arms are crossed, and she's glaring at Stolas with a slight frown on her face (I get it's hard to see because of how it was drawn, but zooming in it is definitely a frown/grimace). I can get it's easy to miss, but if you look closer then it's very clear she is not happy, which does mean her being a not so good person was foreshadowed as early as the second episode, and it does mean it matches the portraits seen in season 2 episode 1. Also, I feel like Stella screaming at Stolas and breaking his things in season 1 episode 2 is another good piece of setup that she is not a good person, which means it wasn't totally out of nowhere that she was shown to be a bad person, as well as the fact that Octavia implies this is a regular event ("Are you two done screaming for the day"), not a one-off instance of Stella screaming at him "because he cheated." Overall I liked the video, just wanted to point that out!

[@cutiepie120048]

One example of the show being inconsistent that I've seen pointed out by others that has bugged me to this day is when Blitz is not allowed into Ozzie's because it's "couples only" and yet a few minutes later we see multiple demons surrounding one imp at a table (Stolas' butler) + polygamy obviously exist???

[@user-bw9di1cg7c]

I just wanted stolas to be a evil sexy manipulative character, not a wimpy divorced dad with no personality 😐

[@ZoeLycan]

My take on HelluvaBoss I love the show and the characters, but I do have some critics when it comes to story telling and how some characters are introduced one way, only to be re-writen the next episode. Examples are Asmodeus being the Sin of Lust, quickly changed to him respecting the journey of "LOVE". Fizzaroly being a robot to then swap to a full on fleshed character. Striker being a manly cowboy, but then established to be ACE. Nothing against the sexuality, but it doesnt work if the character is introduced a certain way. Other than that I would like to see them do more of their job, and I can't be the only one, as we got the shorts, but I would have love to see them be twice as long. So yeah. I love the project and characters, but if I have to criticize the show, it clearly has issues. BUUUUT, I'm really happy such a project exist and shows the world, small projects can have a huge impact on society, instead of the million dollar slob we often get on other shows or movies.

[@northrnstar]

slightly disagree on the striker being ace part. sure, his introduction can make his asexuality kinda wonky, but at the same time, asexuality is a spectrum. i myself am more on the demisexual side, which means i only feel sexual attraction to people i have a close bond with. it is possible he can be somewhere in there, doesn't necessarily relate how an asexual person presents themselves. that being said, i too am very attached to the show and characters, but i also acknowledge that if i start taking it too seriously i will start finding many, Many flaws. the team behind it should really consider making the seasons longer (10+ episodes at minimun), imo that would help to balance the tonal whiplash and odd pacing, aside from giving characters like millie and loona more time to be characters of their own instead of always relying on someone else to have their moments (millie with moxxie and loona with blitz). but i too feel very happy that independent projects like these exist and are so popular to the point it motivates more creators to kickstart their own ideas.

[@ktosniemiy612]

@@ZoeLycan You can be manly, charming and sexy and still be Ace. Check your prejudices

[@redpanda6497]

@@ZoeLycan And writing Striker as a team rocket villain when he was a manipulative, toxic masculine bully who almost killed the IMP by using their weakness, and he, well, a bit ironically, hated the royals for having a superiority complex ( a "you have a point, but why are _you_ the one who says it?" situation ) which was interesting. The show had me for a second, I thought he's going to seriously injure Moxxie. In season 2, he's still arrogant, but on a comedic level, and he's too incompetent to do anything.

[@frostbitetheannunakiiceind6574]

25:52 the only thing that makes this part funny is Moxxie's "WAIT- WHA-"

[@FungusMoldMildew]

From the perspective of someone who's only seen this show through reviews there's no way this is real. I was under the impression this was a show about demons who take hits on humans. What's with all the yaoi drama? Other comments across several other videos mentioned this, and I'm glad cuz I noticed it too, but the female characters seem sidelined for the weird Yaoi stuff. This isn't even romance between two male characters, it's YAOI. I was so lost when these videos mentioned the romance drama. The bird man Stolas feels like he was written after Vivs read the steps of emotional abuse and DARVO. This guy from the clips ive seen is a gaslighting manipulative selfish character. I feel bad for the bird daughter. She's clearly the victim right? Again, I've never seen the show, but comments from people who have, seem to mirror what I've noticed from these clips. I dont really care cuz at the end of the day it's just an indie show. But I'm actually in tears rn. This is just so baffling.

[@Karlos1234ify]

This show has become too much of a sunken cost to stay invested in

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

but hey, it sells stuffed animals, it sells shirts, it sells things, the show sells.

[@Hirokison]

34:15 GOT ME OFF GUARD LMAO 😭 BRO WAS RUTHLESS

[@Gamer-z3c8i]

It's actually reasonable for him to be angry this way. 53 minutes talking about bad writing in the show feels you shouldn't have done that in the first place 🥲

[@DysLEXicguy]

What an amazing video that was well worth the wait!!! Loved hearing you talk abt lunas “admittedly great art” lmao

[@averyraresnom2451]

I like the season 2’s finale, it feels like my frustration had been answered, Octavia actually confronts her dad, and chooses what I think is the right option, she’s given him so much time, so many chances, but he chooses him over her, and she’s just so broken, it’s like realizing your dad’s a dickhead and you just can’t let it slide, and I like how she hesitates realizing he at least went to earth to try to find her and care somewhat, just not enough, and yeah Stolas is weird, not much more I can say that hasn’t been said, kinda fucked up everything, but I guess that’s what happens when you leave a kid behind when you’re going through a divorce.

[@Notyouraveragename]

Some people crap on Octavia for being 'a undeveloped selfish character', but i was watching some shocking child abuse videos where a child was growing up watching their parents SHRIEK AND DEMEAN AND HIT AND PUNCH AND THREATEN TO CALL POLICE on each other while a 4 year old was crying going "MOMMY PLEASE! I LOVE YOU!" and the spouses were screaming 'TREAT ME RIGHT! YOU DUMB STUPID #!!#!".. kinda like how Blitzo screamed at Stolas in Full moon "lovingly", except however while Blitz was getting ready to punch a larger /than equal size partner, the irl abusive partner was beating a smaller partner while they were screaming and failing job interviews under stress to sabotague and trap them. While the helluva boss fandom seems to glamorize blitz, especially his anger and emotional problems and rush to violence as 'deep, complex and meaningful', imho you kinda get a weird whiplash where Octavia is written realistically as a child of abuse, who's objective isn't to be entertaining, but survive unstable parents. While Blitz x Stolas is written as "i am a rich fantasy prince and i AM MADLY IN LOVE WITH the hired killer roguish devil who told me to die!" / Bakudeku. So you have Octavia feeling hurt while Stolas is running off to looloo land to get screwed by a goblin that says they aren't interested. It's kinda weird but some people feel like a show isn't deep unless like every character has some secret motivation that redeems them. idk. i feel like beatrice in Bojack horseman was kinda frankly real by showing how, bojack waited his whole life for a abusive person in his life to turn around, love him, and be redeemed. And she never gave a crap about him to her grave and passed away without a resolution, and the focus of the Free churro episode was Bojack making sense of a story without a lesson. That there isn't always a known secret reason, that sometimes someone you waited 40+ years to hope will care about you, especially a broken parent/child bond, never existed. Sometimes kids are hated never knowing why, only to find out their parents had reckless procreation and blamed the child as 'the problem' of their own choices. It's sad and tragic and a lose-lose for all involved, but it takes a broken and messed up person to see attacking their own child or non malgignant spouse as a 'easy target' / 'prey'. Octavia is written realistically not to drama/theatre standards but irl child but kinda helpless, minus magic and putting up walls. Meanwhile Blitz does the same things for twice the damage and half the reason, and he's called deep. They're all just cartoon characters, but it kinda boggles my mind how many people seem to just kinda be sheepishly following whatever opinions they like, but not really digesting them either.