Top 5 Most One Sided Matchups | AoE2

[@mradul2474]

Another day, another video of Hera hating on dravidians. You could say that Dravidian early game is weak but thier late game is very strong vs franks. Idk what hera's problem is against Dravidians. First the bs about medical corps being a useless tech, urumi slander and now one of the best infantry civs in the game is somehow a bad matchup against a cavalry civ.

[@martinmarzano1523]

Wouldn't be surprised if Hera had some personal negative bias towards infantry and infantry civs, thus not giving them a good opinion. Would also check out on dravs having terrible cavalry, him loving his Hussars.

[@Mattroid99]

Medical Corps is almost useless tho. 30 HP/min is barely noticeable and is at best a "nice extra", but not something worthy of being paid for. Would have been more ok as a civ bonus

[@balvin8524]

“Franks hand cannoneers are not real, they can’t hurt me”

[@mradul2474]

@@Mattroid99 elephants archers are most viable against archers. That exchange will most probably be a back and forth, in which case medical corps comes in handy. I would only get it If I'm against a strong archer civ, nonetheless, it is still far from useless against any civ.

[@mradul2474]

@@balvin8524 not hand cannoneers, the biggest problem the frank player could present are mass throwing axemen, but then I can just switch to arbalesters. Franks have many infantry counters but still it far from a one sided match-up like hera says it is.

[@domingossn]

Another one of those "Spirit of the Law should just do a reaction video" Conversely, you could invite him to do some of those together

[@Polymachaeroplagides]

Yes as a loving teutons player the mangudai is a hard counter, as well the Conquistador is really hard to deal with.

[@teddyhaines6613]

At least conqs are worst in castle age, when monks and elite skirms are somewhat viable as answers.

[@spectre9065]

Mangudai is also a hard counter to Romans.

[@youcanthandlethetruth5433]

3 stable all in 1 tc Or 2 stable 1 tc with seige If you can't win be aggressive

[@saleem2991]

​@@youcanthandlethetruth5433But then you are playing Teutons as a generic civ but without husbandry against Mongol camels. So it's still really bad.

[@youcanthandlethetruth5433]

@@saleem2991 you have teuton cheap farms, extra melee Armour and resistance to conversion. So you can convert his shit mid game he can't convert yours Add monks or pike and seige and go ham

[@USAltefore]

Hera: "Warwolf Trebs" Auto-Captions: "world of crabs"

[@avalanchas336]

Hindustanis vs. Mayans is still quite rough even after the Ghulam nerf. Deserved a spot in the honorable mentions I think

[@fabiancampos4304]

And ghulams got buffed again recently

[@jordivermeulen2519]

Ehh, what do Hindustanis have against eagles in castle age?

[@fabiancampos4304]

@@jordivermeulen2519 swordsmen

[@riseALK]

@@fabiancampos4304 Going Long Swordsmen without being Romans, and especially without having any bonuses tO them at all is a terrible idea in general, and worse against Mayans who have super cheap Xbows as well as Plumes doing bonus damage against Infantry

[@fabiancampos4304]

@@riseALK well good luck spamming and microing upgraded eagles and upgraded crossbows at the same time in early castle age

[@MechMiko]

Im a teuton main, and whenever i get a difficult match up like mongols, i tower rush and make the game messy 😈

[@sel_ferns]

Most one sided matchup is definitely vs the Cobra Car 😜

[@cannnds]

there’s a legend where a cobra car didn’t stand a chance against a villager and got one-hit.

[@SaladEsc]

Wait wait wait, I thought for sure mayans vs hindustanis would be at number 1.

[@IndexInvestingWithCole]

Yea when he said it was obvious I knew it was that

[@teddyhaines6613]

The ghulam and the Hindustani eco both got nerfed. Besides, elite ghulam caps out at 8 pierce armor. Elite plumes do 11 damage to infantry, so that's 3 damage a shot compared to the 1 they get against elite huskarls. The unit was never as terrifying to Mayans as the huskarl; the problem was that the civ behind it was so much stronger.

[@88porpoise]

Pre-nerf Hindustani vs Mayans would probably top this list. Once Ghulams got in the field they were nearly as bad as Huskarls for Mayans. And the Hindustani economy was strong enough they could pretty reliably get there. Now their economy is much slower making it far harder to get the castle up and mass Ghulams before the heavy Mayan pressure arrives. So it is basically the same as Celts but not as good.

[@rp18125]

@@teddyhaines6613 elite plumed archers have a +2 damage bonus against infantry so they should do 3 damages to elite huskarls edit: i just tested it and for some reasons post imp elite plumed archers only deal 2 damages to post imp elite huskarls

[@The_Room_2_Doggys_Revenge]

Funny how this morning Viper posted a video in which he won as Mayans against Goths and was never really challenged

[@teddyhaines6613]

Just like Hera said, the matchup works differently in practice than it does on the tech tree because Goths are so much weaker than Mayans before they get to huskarls.

[@Asterix958]

@@teddyhaines6613 Yes, and Huskarl is overrated. THS+Plumed can kill Huskarl. I think Huskarl should be armored cavalry unit faster than Knight.

[@marekcelonk5596]

Noted. Blue always wins against red, thanks Hera!

[@justxavier9999]

I still remember that day back in 1300 elo. I played a match as Goth vs Mayan. We got to imp, he had very good walls with castles protecting chokes (map might have been Cenotes), defended all the chokes and my elite huskurls somehow just melted to 2hs plumes. It was quite the horror

[@saleem2991]

Plumes deal 2 dmg to husks due to bonus dmg, so chokeholes are a no-no for husks.

[@Mattroid99]

Would be interesting to see a matchup chart for some civs you know. Is something I barely see in the AoE2 community and I find them very helpful to also find the best gameplan vs each civ (Or when you have to cry)

[@teddyhaines6613]

I think the Persian elite skirms should do better than you'd think against Genoese because Genbows have a measly 4 base range, so even with bracer they don't outrange the Persian skirms. The problem is that Italians can add hussar or whatever to supplement the crossbows and then Persians get in trouble.

[@alltmisc]

Yeah that -1 dmg skirms make them do 1 dmg instead of 2 against many units. Italians also have cheap BBC which melt skirms.

[@AlphaSquadZero]

Italians also lacking siege engineers means that going all in castle pike, ram, and crossbow might give you a bit of a chance. Especially with genoese not getting a bonus against pikes.

[@fritzjovetic3302]

I remeber a michi team game I played a few month ago: I was byzantines and the opponent on my side was goth. Cataphract and hc was very good vs huskarl spam

[@LoutreDuBengale]

Its not just very good, its litteraly unwinable for the goth.

[@valger3652]

Michi is about SO , bbc, bbt and monks power. Almost all other stuff is trash.

[@1776huckleberry]

Honorable mention to any civ faced up against the civ Hera is playing that game. It's always a difficult match vs. the Habibi.

[@youcanthandlethetruth5433]

What does Habibi mean?

[@1776huckleberry]

@@youcanthandlethetruth5433 Lots of arabic words have multiple meanings. Habibi has a male and female version but I don't know how to spell each of them. It roughly translates to "sweet heart" but isn't used in a strictly romantic way. It's also growing in popularity on the internet which dilutes the meaning as it gets used in memes and stuff. "I was cruising with my habibis when all of the sudden" That kinda stuff changes perception, makes it more informal.

[@youcanthandlethetruth5433]

@@1776huckleberry yuk. Don't let Muslims take over. They're nice and all. Over in their countries. Hera gets a pass cuz he's cool lmao. Don't be adopting their language and shit it's the great replacement. And I ain't even white

[@1776huckleberry]

@@youcanthandlethetruth5433 bro this is a top 5 age of empires video.

[@zeekbt_dores]

Really fun video to think about specific matchups!

[@ominousrose7038]

I haven't peed in three weeks

[@GoldenSkeeter]

My bro hasn't pooped in 3 weeks. Do you mean you haven't pissed in a toilet in 3 weeks? Sounds like you have a very dirty diaper Ign GoldenSkeet

[@Djturd64]

As a Aztec main. Teutons are a crazy counter. They have monk resistant. You can’t go eagles. It’s a sad match up

[@spectre9065]

Byzantines also crush Aztecs in Deathmatch.

[@cannnds]

i remember some years ago even Aztecs were crushed by infantry-focused civs (teutons, slavs, and even goths or celts) back when the villager carry bonus and military creation time was nerfed. jaguars weren’t that helpful, because aztecs were primarily strong because of their early eco….their late game options were pretty abysmal (no halbs, archer/skirm with less armor)

[@akhilxy2822]

1:21 Flaming Camel

[@spectre9065]

Cavalry Archers are Teutons' kryptonite to the extent where civs with bad Cavalry Archers build them against Teutons. Malians are a good example.

[@alltmisc]

Wish you released this vid yesterday. Played Persian flank vs Italians on BF. My team mates got incredibly mad when I tried something different. Also worth noting, Italian player had 6 extra boars at his TC on that bugged fn map. Game was over as soon as it started…

[@dearestcomrade8638]

Great video! Can't wait for "Inside the Mind of Pro" ep 3!!!

[@exeonx6561]

Very happy to see #1 here I main Teutons and like you said, nothing you can do about mangudai, the best way of dealing with mongols as teutons is by not letting them get there. Trushing is my main go to, and it can really throw them off and not allow them to get to castle age/mangudai easily. The other one is to out-boom them and do a semi-fast imp to take out castles before the mangudai ball gets too big. Mangudai are still on my top broken unique units, while I don't think they are as strong as they used to be, and not that bad to deal with for some civs, it's a deathball killer, especially for infantry/siege civs.

[@jadearrowgamer1762]

Huh, my immediate guesses were Malians vs Tatars, Berbers vs Cumans, Italians vs Turks, and Huns vs Teutons. Kind of surprised none of those made the list. On the other hand, the whole list were matchups I didn't think of but made sense. Overall, good list with some good points. I'm loving these top 5 lists you've made recently.

[@Asterix958]

I think Turks counter Italians with BBC+Janisssarry+Hussar. Hussar holds Condos and Genoese enough time and Janissary+ BBC counter Condottieri, Genoese and low range Italians BBC. Turks is better than Italians in every stage of the game. Turks early game eco is also better than Italians'.

[@teddyhaines6613]

Obviously depends on map, but none of those matchups is necessarily unwinnable. Malians vs Tatars: The Tatars player at least has the early castle age timing with crossbows and free thumb ring to try and make something happen. It's harder against Byzantines because of their cheap skirms to blunt your momentum. Berbers vs Cumans: Cumans have halberdier-siege ram to push Berber castles. Italians vs Turks: Turks can go fast Imp gunpowder or fast castle castle drop Janissaries to pressure Italians before they can mass their counter units. Huns vs Teutons: Well if we're talking Arena, the matchup is unwinnable for the Huns since they die to halb-onager. But even on Arabia they can potentially get overwhelmed by Teuton knight-pike play before they can mass cav archers. There was a classic game between Daut and Iori where Daut used Teuton knights to force Iori into mass pikemen which he then countered with a Teutonic knight switch. This blunted Iori's pressure and bought Daut time for his eventual composition of halb-scorpion that Huns just could never engage because of their lack of good siege.

[@jagosvujovic2086]

none of these make a whole lot of sense to me except berbers vs cumans i guess but even that doesnt seem one sided at all

[@elgaro]

YES. Every time I played Teutons vs Mongols I died no matter what I do. I played as Mongols against the hardest AI just to learn what could I do, and the only answers was skirms, and it died anyways...

[@youcanthandlethetruth5433]

All in aggression with 3 stable knights

[@carlospallete3030]

I love how you throw in your loss to Viper after saying how bad the match up is and that it's free and impossible to lose, takes balls man, respect

[@herotalib9556]

A 2k player will always beat a 1.5k player even on bad match-up. At that time viper was just a better player than hera.

[@KaoticPhoenix]

@@herotalib9556 They were literally the same Elo at that time 11

[@justincronkright5025]

Britons against Bulgarians seems like the one I hate the most... The lack of final armour upgrade for Skirms means that even if you go for them you're still taking 4 damage per arb shot, starting at a longer range with more kiting potential from a Briton's player - the only thing in the situation salvaging that is the fact that they don't get Thumb Ring to give full accuracy & a faster attack. In 1 vs. 1s that might work out that the faster attacking cav do enough damage/keep a Britons player down in Castle. But if they ever get to Imperial on a stable economy for arbs, there's not much you can do I'd argue as even full Siege Onagers take 35 shots to kill with arbs & only 24 shots with Elite Longbowmen. Even if going arbs (not needing castles) the Keeps with +3 Arrow Slits & then +2 for Unique Tech do 16 damage... that's 10 damage per shot to Cavalier & even 8 damage per shot to Siege Onagers. With the gambesons for Britons too or even just basic Halbs you can't even protect Siege Rams as the arb damage against your two handed swordsmen even if they were garrisoned in rams is just so great... then Heavy Cav Archers are at best okayish here. For the last one Halberdier then Paladin/Cavalier + Hussar versus them, Snipe enemy Trebs and try and make use of your cheap farms to pump out units. Snipe enemy Siege - particularly trebs & use the longer range Castles to hit the 4 Pierce Armour Mangudai on their way in. I think the slow Teuton push with castles & the cheaper farms into constant spams of units seems the only focus I can think of.

[@valger3652]

Actually once i had experience Bulg vs Brit on bf. 1 hour of hopless attempts and slow but unavoidable death.

[@StRodeNL]

What do Persians do vs Genexbow? Siege Rams? Pretty sure a Siege Ram push backed up by hussars and maybe skirms is plenty to seriously threaten Italians.

[@xemnus766]

I’m surprised goths vs byzantines wasn’t mentioned. I always assumed that goths had absolutely no answer to cataphract. But I guess there’s some other dynamic I’m not thinking of that makes that match up not so one sided.

[@teddyhaines6613]

@@donjoncraig6804 Well remember that castle age cataphracts only have 12 cavalry armor, so pikes get 10 bonus damage against them. The right of that stands, though.

[@Potatoflesh]

How appropriate that I just got Persians against Italians in Arena the last time I played. It went exactly as you would expect.

[@saleem2991]

It's just brutal. You can't even castle drop with Persians unless you want to make elephants. Italians win the imp race too with their discount.

[@tomtenthij5676]

Thank you Hera! 😊

[@Yassir833]

Im waiting for the viper reaction lol ... he definitely dont agree for the dravidians worst match up

[@IndexInvestingWithCole]

Surprised you didn’t include Slavs in the Teuton/Celt destroyed by Mangudai

[@faruksarihan]

10:40 Fun Fact: Hera lost Mongols vs Teutons matchups against TheViper with his account "WeWinThose" 😅

[@Chainy555]

i would like to throw in MAYA vs MALIANS. With the malian champion its like maya vs goth, but you have a good early game and dont need a castle. I think it could even be worse than against goth.

[@teddyhaines6613]

One big difference: the Malian "champskarl" caps out at 8 pierce armor. The elite plumed archer has 11 attack against infantry with full upgrades. Ergo, it does triple the damage against them compared to elite huskarls. Champions are also significantly slower than huskarls.

[@valger3652]

Malian champs by themself are good vs standart arbs but not vs fast range (CA type / plumes). Btw plumes deals 2 dmg to huskarls and somehow playable. But issue microing them requires a lot of time and could cost a castles potentially. Mayans struggle in many late game scenarios, for ex. no answer to champs+onager, and need to make something happen before that stage begins.

[@mundolincurve7577]

what about mayas vs Hindustanis ? We saw it a lot after the indian pack, and it seemed very hard for the mayan player

[@ChrisNihilus]

I'm not a pro or anything, but I'm surprised Berbers vs Huns is not there. Berbers have not one, but two unique units that are a hard counter to the only units Huns have bonuses with, and even if they switch to Tarkans or any cavalry, Berbers have fantastic camels.

[@teddyhaines6613]

Huns at least have halb-siege ram for that matchup.

[@niks2584yt]

Huns can win that with early game domination! For example, watch game#3 in the KotD4 Final between Viper and Vinchester...

[@OJC1992]

Inca's VS absolutely anyone! (Inca's for President)

[@xiphonos1115]

Nope

[@Davtwan]

I was not expecting Byzantines to be on this list let alone be a winner against a civ on this list.

[@aoe2and3fan]

Persians can go SIEGE RAM vs Italians. You wondered, while playing on 10th dec. 2020, what Slavs could do vs "fast genoese crossbow". Viper answered with a siege ram push and won. 🙂 K1 even made a cool intro about it! :-D

[@Mattroid99]

Italians also have BBCs if needed

[@valger3652]

Italians always can add asap condos to deal with skirm/ram stuff. Not too easy to mass genbow , but if it happened - most cavalry civs will struglle, not only Persians.

[@Dimiterer]

Fun fact: mayan plumed archer has +1 (+2 as elite) bonus damage against infantry. Combined with his speed and rate of fire, he might be not that bad against huskarl or ghulam

[@couchpotatoe91]

Huscarl with their 10 pierce armor only take 1 dmg from plumed archers [5 (base dmg) + 2 (bonus inf dmg) + 4 (upgrades) = 11dmg]. EDIT: I was wrong, they do 2dmg! The only (edit: other) archers that do 2 dmg against Huscarl are those that deal 12 dmg when fully upgraded: Mangudai (8+4), Camel Archers (8+4) and Magyar Heavy Cavalry Archers with recurve bow unique tech (7+5). That might seem not much on paper, but killing Elite Huscarl with 35 arrows instead of 70 is a 100% increase in dmg. On another note: Only the Magyar heavy cavalry archer can 4-shot Goth Halberdiers who have only 2 pierce armor and 60hp [12 (full upgrades) + 4 (bonus dmg against spear) + 2 (parthian tactics) = 16dmg]. Elite Mangudai (+1 against spearmen +2 parthian tactics) and Elite Camel Archers (+0) fall flat, Berbers even lacking Parthian Tactics alltogether. That leaves Elite Mangudai with 6 shots to kill a Goth Halberdier and Elite Cavalry Archers with 8 shots! In short, Magyar cavalry archers with recurve bow are the only cav archer unit viable against Goths late-game as they annihilate their Halberdiers like no other unit and even dmg Huscarls semi-significantly. Thanks for coming to my TED talk.

[@tcsiyic3584]

@@couchpotatoe91 Class-bonus damage is not reduced by pierce armor, it's calculated through class-armor, which Huskrals have 0 anti-infantry armor. In addition, when a unit's pierce attack is lower than the target's armor, it is not instantly converted into 1. Only when the unit does NOT have other bonus class damage against the target (e.g. Arbalest 10 atk vs E.Huskral 10 armor = 0), the total damage is set to be 1. So Elite plumes do 0 (pierce damage) + 2 bonus damage = 2 damage per shot to FU Elite Huskarls. You can try it in scenario editor or in game.

[@couchpotatoe91]

@@tcsiyic3584 Ooh really? Didn't know that, thanks for the correction! So the non-elite version doing 1 bonus dmg would still only result in 1 dmg because the pierce armor is higher than the attack and the minimum dmg of 1 only applying after all dmg?

[@tcsiyic3584]

@@couchpotatoe91 Yes! You are correct! The calculation would be 0 (pierce damage) + 1 bonus damage = 1 Total damage. The pierce/melee damage in calculation doesn't take negative value for clarification.

[@Dimiterer]

@@couchpotatoe91 No. No matter how much armour target has, at least 1 damage will be dealt. For example, rams have over 100 pierce armour and still can be destroyed by archers, even without any bonus damage

[@dan-kn3dm]

Burmese vs Britons is top of list for me. Like even the Teutons vs Mongols, one can make the argument that once you get that farm economy going in late feudal with Teutons, you can prepare to mass spam knights in early castle and absolutely overwhelm Mongol player. Monks won't work and neither will camels. So there's chance (granted, I am just 1500elo). But I never felt as powerless as Burmese against Britons, I literally went into meltdown thinking what to make. Burmese got literally nothing starting castle age and it gets only worse from there.

[@ИосифЛуна]

To be fair, Viper loves his teutons and has more ways to play with them then most of other players so no shame in that. Keep up a good work!

[@mikelivingood7797]

From what I have seen, you have two choices as Teutons. Castle rush or onager skirmishers with raids. Even then you need high level onager play. Which Viper has.

[@teddyhaines6613]

@@mikelivingood7797 In the game in question Viper did it with Teuton cav archers, actually.

[@f40734]

A challenge to win this matchups would be good

[@hansoskar1911]

i think what you said about Mayans vs Goths used to be true, but then Goths got eco bonuses in the longer lasting Hunt and freeish Loom that should get the over the hump. bc the clock is ticking.

[@Liam__Obrien]

I think there are a few more you could consider, which involve at least one unpopular civ: - Italians v Khmer. Love the Khmer but they are in trouble against Italians because of Genoese Crossbows, which crush Elephants even worse than they do Horse cavalry. - Celts v Dravidians: Slow Dravidians have now answer against strong siege - Strong infantry civs v Goths: Though they are often thought of as the best infantry civ they have struggled against strong infantry civs over the years. Japanese, Vikings, Aztecs, Malians, etc. The Huskarl can't stand up to their infantry.

[@fernandocruz1999]

As a teuton only player i can agree with the #1. It's hopeless

[@icethresh]

Isn't Cav Archer kinda fine for camels without bloodlines? Especially with free thumbring and +50% dmg Hill bonus

[@gabesfrigo]

I think it's an even match up, but the numbers will tip the balance towards Byz.

[@Anistar95]

CA dodge melee counters like halbs by running around and using their speed.. camel is way faster and way more HP and are a bigger threat. Discounted camel? say no more..

[@teddyhaines6613]

It's very dangerous. Camels are faster than cav archers, and if they get on top of you even once your army is gone. Remember cav archers are also rather squishy; it only takes 4 hits for a camel to kill a bloodlines cav archer, assuming equal attack/armor upgrades. You need to keep and maintain a large mass to be sure you'll take good fights, and the Byzantine player can mix in skirms to supplement the camels and make it even tougher on you.

[@dabby7dabby7]

Dravidian almost die to any siege knight push, not only Frank, maybe redemption will be a necessary buff for them

[@kevinlecavalier9720]

Extra one-sided matchup: Hera VS anybody else HeraHype for TCI

[@JAM_Brecher]

I somehow won my match for 1200 elo against goths back in the days. Was one of the most thrilling matches I ever played. Still no idea how I managed two win 2 hour game with no rec, other than wood, still on the map

[@christos49]

I wouldn't call this one-sided enough to warrant a spot on the list, but I think Berbers are one of the only civs that stands a chance against Mongols late game.

[@leventebardossy5962]

The only way I saw a Mongol win that matchup was a pikes + onagers deathball. I couldn't believe someone would do that, but it worked.

[@DrJacobsMD]

What are you all doing watching KZbin videos when the Champion's Tournament is live on Hera's Twitch???

[@joshrossman3796]

HERA, my man, what did the Dravidians ever do to you? its like they backed over your mom or called or called you Persian elephant or something? in that match up you wouldn't go skirmisher, you go pikeman and Mangonel. love your work and will be eagerly waiting to hear your back story.

[@Neverrrrr311]

Most one sided match is meeting Hera in Grandfinals ☠️☠️☠️☠️☠️☠️☠️☠️☠️

[@rp18125]

plumed archer isnt "that" bad against post imp goths because it deals 2 damages to elite huskarls thanks to bonus damage against infantry, so i m not even sure if mayans against goth is this unplayable in the lategame, tbf i think their worst match up is malians because it's basically the same as goths but they can spam their swordsmen in castle age

[@lopardop]

Chinese vs Huns and Berebers vs Mongols are super hard matchups too!

[@rhysschmutter1362]

I just lost a game as Italians v Persians. Feelsbadman

[@martinbrinkmoller7396]

goth vs teuton

[@GoldenSkeeter]

Or goth versus Vikings or any other infantry civ

[@SaiKiran-fd3gq]

@@GoldenSkeeter TK will work against goths.

[@martinbrinkmoller7396]

@@SaiKiran-fd3gq even teuton champions will do, and they are quite easy to get. Also better eco and options for everything they might need vs goth

[@yesedd6475]

3:38 Italian Paladin? :O buff incoming? ;)

[@teutonichealingfortress]

As a Teuton main with 1k+ games as Teutons, Teutons vs Turks - against mongols my win-rate is currently 40% - but against turks it's only 6.3%(ranked) I've always viewed Turks as my mortal enemy. - early game feudal, turks now have very good scouts which forces the teuton player to have to build pikes to defend your walled points, cause those will easily break into places even if they're guarded by a tower+garrisonable vills(forcing you to do either pikes or build stone walls behind the palisades, but you'll still need pikes under your tc to protect the farms) - late game or even mid-game turks are well suited to take on teuton units by either rushing to imp or being defensive - once the turk player is in imperial either way, it's a hard time for the teuton player to out micro the turk compositions.

[@vojtechvanek1686]

Couldn't Burmese try to spam allin hussars w unique tech to kill shooters w some mangonels?

[@GoldenSkeeter]

What about goth versus Vietnamese? Do they get champions?

[@teddyhaines6613]

Vietnamese get champions that only miss blast furnace and gambesons. More importantly they're perfectly capable of killing Goths before they get to late game, just like Mayans.

[@dan-kn3dm]

I am not sold on your Dravidians vs Franks opinion. Yes, if skirm armies meet and buffer is pikes vs knights, sure knights are gonna have advantage in mobility, but if you mass pikes and protect the skirms, plus you have few monks, knights can't do anything, at least not early castle. Also, Dravidians have very smooth transitions into next ages thanks to the wood bonus and thus it's very easy to do early pressure with eg. double arch range + blacksmith in feudal. And they really shine early on maps like African clearing. It's true though that as the game goes on, Dravidians fall off due to the lack of mobility, which is imo their biggest weakness.

[@schmeed0000]

dravidians is a civ win vs every civ

[@derikaem8021]

I used to find malians vs maya more onesided than goth vs maya. When they got free gold mining mayans could rarely outpace them in early game. Malians get to 5pa longswords and kill mayans, latest in imp. Ive heard people arguing that plumes counter malian longswords, but no

[@XegaZero]

I was thinking of malians vs mayans too. Like you said, malians swordsmen do well against most mayan's non-siege units on paper, plus malians have cavalry and are good early game with their gold and wood bonuses.

[@damianvergaradominguez8484]

I was expecting Hindustanis vs Mayans. Not sure what Mayans can do against Ghulam (especially since they were re-buffed recently). But is true, Mongols again certain civs is just impossible 11

[@gletscherminze9372]

I thought the same. The eco nerf gives Mayans more time to get ahead in feudal though, so thats probably, why it didn't make the list.

[@KGS17]

Mayan eco is way better and by the time, Hindustanis make a castle and get Ghulams out, you have a lot of time to do damage. If Ghulams come, add some eagles.

[@j.p.691]

I need the linkt to the video teutonen vs mongols with viper and hera pls

[@Igor369]

Top 5 most even matchups next?

[@dustinouellette9302]

What does TheViper say about the Dravidians / Franks match up ;)

[@MrAlejandro767]

Can someone help me with mongols (me) vs Hindustanis? cant use cav with their camels, or archers with their unique unit, tried even champions and siege and nothing.....

[@KaoticPhoenix]

Literally was going to comment "Didn't you lose to Viper though" for the last one until you said it 11

[@proper_noun436]

I don't float res but i will have 20 archers queued from 5 ranges in feudal (mayans)

[@herotalib9556]

Mongols vs teutons is hard but teutons tower rush is scary so you can win using that. Basically need to go all in. Teutons monk rush is also amazing so just keep pressure up. I think other match-up you discussed are worse

[@jerejarvinen625]

Hera my man!

[@michaelzrust426]

Vikings vs goth, Berserk kills all with better eco before handcannons even make an appearance

[@gebhard128]

Goth vs teutons is also a pretty bad matchup for goths, maybe the only matchup u can even go full ETK and win the game or the safer champions with 3 more armor and the superior Eco behind it. Especially on more closed maps goth can insta resign in this matchup

[@teddyhaines6613]

Goths do have gunpowder to kill Teuton infantry, but the Teutons have superior eco and siege so it still won't end well for them. Their main win condition would be to rely on the cheapness of their units to run the Teuton player out of gold.

[@Fregler]

One I find really good is Byzantine against any American civ but especially vs Incas.

[@brutalarmy4179]

I'd say they have a better change against mayans

[@iwersonsch5131]

I see no need for Ghulams to deal bonus damage to Eagles.

[@RedVSBlueIsCewl]

Nice, now i feel bad when i lose one of these… 11

[@LokirofRoriksted]

I have a hard time with meso civs against most civs, specially if they're CA heavy or early gunpowder. I feel like I can't attack them, while they can circle and snipe vills everywhere with their fast moving units or heavy hitting (conquistador has both) any tips? monks are expensive, die to CA and i'm not very quick to micro, skirms and siege are ok against CA, but i can't deffend everywhere and these dont look good against conquistadores. Should I turtle? Go cheese early, wall stone or whatever, build multiple towers and play defensive?

[@teddyhaines6613]

What maps are you thinking about here? On Arabia or most open land maps your opponent shouldn't get to conqs unchallenged unless your openings are really passive.

[@DidYaServe]

Teutons can counter Mongols with a slow, defensive castle push.

[@gletscherminze9372]

#1 most onesided is any civ vs the flaming camel siege tower comp

[@ObiwanNekody]

Persian Longsword is superior and once more you completely overlooked it.

[@benjaminjones8782]

I burned my finger later ppppp earlier today

[@byzantiumn8564]

just 300 more subs to go!

[@sourathghosh5170]

Might sound crazy but is it possible to hold Britons with Burmese CA +hussar ? The CA do get parthian tactics leading to 3 Pierce armor in imp...

[@teddyhaines6613]

Burmese miss thumb ring, which is non-negotiable for cav archers because they've only got 50% accuracy without it. Besides, 3 pierce armor is pathetic in Imp. You'd be better off with their skirmishers.

[@sourathghosh5170]

@@teddyhaines6613 Oh true..no thumbring is a deal breaker .....somehow I assumed they had thumbring 11. 3PA is pathetic but was just thinking abt some ranged backline option to deal with halbs....while the hussar would be the meat shield soaking all briton arbalast fire.

[@teddyhaines6613]

@@sourathghosh5170 I think Arambai would probably work best in that role.

[@giornogiovanna6871]

goths vs byz ?

[@jackwaite4035]

Poles vs Cav Archer civs seems like an honorable mention to, very tough matchup on open maps

[@youcanthandlethetruth5433]

Not even close. How are you going to hit and run 1 cavalier at a time when there's 80 in your base? Plus Poles get arbs, bombard cannon and winged hussar too which is a composition that can also beat cav archers

[@jackwaite4035]

@@youcanthandlethetruth5433 damn can you teach me how to spawn into ranked games with 80 cavalier?

[@youcanthandlethetruth5433]

@@jackwaite4035let's play I show you. I can jump on right now in about 10 minutes

[@teddyhaines6613]

@@jackwaite4035 Szlachta privileges allows you to hit those numbers. It's a stupid tech that people still underestimate because they can't conceive of cavalier armies that outnumber their archers instead of the other way around.

[@jackwaite4035]

@@teddyhaines6613 yeah so you just spawn in the game with 80 cavalier right? Sounds impressive, why don’t pros play them if it’s just a free win? How can 3 dark age villagers beat 80 cavalier?

[@dattilo1]

100% stopped playing byzantines cz I always lose to Tatars. I need to reconsider my tactics.

[@The_Gates]

hmm what ello?

[@dattilo1]

@@The_Gates 1050 or so

[@JohnSmith-tk7nt]

Hera please do a video detailing the best civs on different maps. I play RM 4v4 sometimes and I ALWAYS have a teammate who insists on going pocket Mayans on Black Forest. Am I a bad person that I just resign these games where people pick ridiculous civs? My last game my teammate chose pocket Ethiopians on Arena and went full castle age knights....

[@youcanthandlethetruth5433]

Yes you're a bad person quitter Ethiopian and Mayan flanks are not bad. They can do halb seige and eagles respectively

[@youcanthandlethetruth5433]

*pocket

[@JohnSmith-tk7nt]

@@youcanthandlethetruth5433 Eagles on BF? And he didn't go halb siege on arena he went 4 stable knights

[@oknad2]

And so does the Dravidian drama continues :D :D

[@TheSpiritof76]

You forgot you can douch Italians as Persians for ez win

[@riccardocorradini6713]

A simple way to fix teutons vs mongols is add Imperial skirm as a generic skirm upgrade. Skirms are the only unit without an imp upgrade basically so It would make sense, and then some civs without bracer or other BS upgrades could have a Little better time, then vietanemese could get compensated with another bonus

[@toplanetxt158]

i still havent seen the video but i am sure the #1 should be wallable maps for opponent

[@JuanBayonaBeriso]

Tell your editors that everytime they reuse footage it's a good opportunity to add the link at the top to the video 😂

[@leventebardossy5962]

How about Goths vs Britons?

[@mikelivingood7797]

Do the chance of having the potential for a bad matchup preclude these civs from ever being picked in a tournament? And if so what changes would need to be made?

[@NivMizzet89]

Not really, at least as far as I can tell. Some of these get regularly picked anyway, and the ones that don't usually have other (better) reasons to be ignored. A few patches ago Mayan-Hindustani was also one of the most one-sided matchups, yet both were top civs iirc.

[@wolborg2]

My own personal terrible match up is Mongol vs Slavs because it's GG if there is a Mangudai mass so glad I was on the right page 😂

[@mubashirulmoula1798]

Turks vs Gurjaras and Bengalis vs Dravidians should have honorable mention.