Hero Wars | Is Jorgen the Best Hero? Jorgen Tier List Discussion

[@kirbyverse]

great insights! I just learned so much about the game itself! ... not just the astounding Jorgen ... Thank you.

[@gelaldo18]

Since Jorgen is brother of the twins, he should be included in twins teams so their new team name will be Triplets. xD

[@Hadar1991]

I have triplets on ma Facebook team and their are superb! :D

[@TheGoldenboyf]

Jorgen is pretty awesome. I've got him with the twins, astaroth and celeste.

[@jetli3333]

I started a week after Jorgen event but I finally have him and am using him as a swap in for my main team/2nd team. Great video cant wait for the counters to him and others

[@HAYBRYD]

The best way to counter jorgen is by using satori

[@smaragdchaos]

Nope, the best way to counter Jorgen is by using properly built up Sebastian

[@ima7333]

Awesome video. Jorgen is easily 1 of my all time favorite hero. I absolutely love to team him up w/ astaroth & astrid. Then simply throw in any warrior & marksman and he’ll be my last hero standing.

[@jordanwolfe607]

Added an underleveled Jorgen to my Kiera team and saw an immediate difference. Small sample size, but I was impressed anyway

[@rantoppp]

I use Jorgen for my magic team. though I may not get the benefit of his Leper ability, his magic attack buff from his artifact makes up for it! It's a big bonus that I can put him into my physical team and make them that much better as well!

[@taviadalton3310]

Great info! I have been slowly leveling him up!

[@engimoore2374]

Thanks for all the videos. Does it make sense to just go with the ability (strength) skin first since none of them are what he really needs? (As you point out)

[@danieljoung5398]

Probably the best hero specific video I've seen from you. Thanks

[@ragingturnip7854]

Great video as always. Why was it advertised as a livestream? Visibility?

[@bevanjonsson2284]

Yorgen fits well into so many teams. Easily one of the top defensive heros in the game

what is the best teams to build around jorgen or include jorgen in mid-tier / cheaper build? i'm thinking a few: a) Astaroth, Satori, Celeste, Jorgen, Orion (magical, strong energy manipulation and shields) b) Galahad, Qing Mao, Keira, Jorgen, Martha/Thea (physical, quickier at doing massive damage) c) Astaroth, Qing Mao, Keira, Celeste, Jorgen (mixed physical and magical) Qing Mao can also be exchanged with Elmir for armor penetration. While she pushes front, Elmir makes up in distraction and damage with clones

[@Dabolds]

(On mobile) I actually used my jorgen as a tank in tower...I used jorgen daredevil dorian helios and martha...with jorgen "tanking" that was even more energy so his first skill was almost constantly up :P ran through tower to the top lots of time at team lvl 120 with only like 150-160k hero rating

[@katorah_]

TIL Jorgen is the Twins's big bro. No wonder they work so well together

[@damian5420]

Anywhere I can find METAs for Jorgen other than “every team”?

[@HolyLovHealer]

Planning to use Jorgen on my Magical team, looking forward to it!

[@screwthenet]

I keep looking for gameplay...wtf am I missing with my searches?! lol

[@geekinuniform]

good video, totally agree on the tier placement.

what is the best teams to build around jorgen or include jorgen in mid-tier / cheaper build? i'm thinking a few: a) Astaroth, Satori, Celeste, Jorgen, Orion (magical) b) Galahad, Qing Mao, Keira, Jorgen, Martha/Thea (physical) c) Astaroth, Qing Mao, Keira, Celeste, Jorgen (mixed)

[@masseducators]

in first and third line up there is no healer means a bad team

@@masseducators Celeste is a healer. the best single target healer actually.

[@masseducators]

@ but she is failed in case the enemy having jorgen can't get energy to heal then what you will do ?

@@masseducators i dont think that happens often. she gains and spends energy very very fast. every 4 sec she can transform

[@maskedriderweaver4122]

I thought his shield was used on the ally with the lowest health

[@flyingdragoon6492]

Could you ake a video on Satori ? I'm interested in your thoughts on him because im thinking of levelling him

[@florinsuciu6346]

I was serching for info about glimps on Jorgen, so this is right in time

[@arnego849]

is it realy a magic based atk? it doesn't work on outland boss which is immune to physical attacks... so wierd thing there

[@sha0tube]

His basic attack is physical, but ult is magic. He's useful in speeding up energy accumulation in other heroes. Not really a make or break for the outland boss. For outland boss, I'd level up either Satori or Orion to do the damage dealing.

[@franciscolindorjr6749]

Great vid Charlie. BTW does anyone know how to do that testing thing where all the heroes are red rank and level 130?

[@cynosureram3780]

I believe the Facebook version

[@weldercody1]

@@cynosureram3780 Go to chat and then "guild battle"

[@cynosureram3780]

@@weldercody1 that'll just allow you to battle challenge your guild members, with the Heros & titans you have!

[@squid8616]

Jorgen is one of my favorite healers. He's on my main team with Bob. I use Astaroth, Karhk, Jorgen, Faceless, Martha. Has great survivability, and I switch Martha for Nebula if I need more damage.

[@ac9384]

Jorgen isn't a healer

[@squid8616]

@@ac9384 haha whoops. I think my phone autocorrected heros to healers. Good catch ;)

[@Barbaricdave]

Amazing hero to use in almost every team at least at mid level for me

[@zaka2630]

If I had to create an S tier list for noobs, Jorgen would definitely fit there xD

[@zaka2630]

@@mmohon93 of course there is a counter for everything. Satori is really good. S tier material for a situational counter hero

[@MAD2g]

If you meant this only for Patreons then you oopsed. Thank you though for the info. I've buffed Satori for killing Jorgen although Torment seems to work on Satori.

[@shawnmatthews5118]

Does it stop Corvus from using his altar?

[@smaragdchaos]

9:25 You're focusing on the bad things when assessing the usefulness of Jorgen's skins. So what if Jorgen doesn't have Magic Attack skin(s)? Jorgen is not a damage dealer, and his support abilities don’t work in a way that he would require all the Magic Attack in order to make them work. If we go over his abilities that in fact do utilize Magic Attack, we find out that the skills are primarily used for a different purpose than its Magic value. His ultimate ability is meant to suppress the opponents for 9s, regardless of the Magic Attack he has, the extra Magic Damage is just a nice extra on top, or in very rare cases a detriment since the Magic Attack strikes first before the curse activates, meaning it does charge the enemy's energy bar before they're shut off from their energy generating ability, so it’s entirely possible for an opponent to use their ultimate ability while they’re still cursed. His other skill that utilizes Magic Attack is his green ability, which does protect from a small amount of damage and allows its bearer to gain energy at 2x the rate. Sure, in this case one could argue that having all the Magic Attack you can get would make a difference, but the problem with that is, this ability absorbs very little to begin with, so you'd require a bizarre amount of Magic Attack to make this ability even worthwhile, far more than what skins would provide. In fact, on top of having multiple Magic Attack skins, you'd also require Jorgen to change his main stat from Strength to Intelligence, change his 2nd and 3rd artifacts from Armor/Magic Defense to Health/Magic Attack and Strength to Intelligence, his basic skin from strength to Intelligence etc. Doing all these things, you would be able to elevate Jorgen's Magic Attack from his subpar 38k or so at maximum stats to something like 80-90k or even 100k, which would be the necessary amount to make this ability slightly meaningful as a durability ability (and ideally by buffing the skill, so it takes more from Jorgen's Magic Attack stat), but at the cost of making Jorgen much more fragile and easier to kill, which would instantly undermine his versatility as a support hero, because his Health would instantly plummet by at least 300-400k and his Armor would decline by at least 8k (His Magic Defense is debatable, but I'd say even that would decline to lesser extent if we were to take away his Magic Defense skin, alongside his second artifact). Additionally, he would be also very weak against Cornelius (not that it's a bad thing balance-wise, since Cornelius currently is a very subpar PvP hero, but it would still mean that Jorgen is getting much weaker).

[@smaragdchaos]

So let's say we take current Jorgen, and give him a Magic Attack skin. A standard skin gives 10650 Magic Attack at level 60, with the exception of champion and winter skins that give teensy bit more at the expense of higher skin stone cost. His ultimate ability utilizes 60% of his Magic Attack stat, his green ability utilizes 70% of his Magic Attack stat. The power of his ultimate ability goes up from 36159 + 6390 (60% of a fully upgraded Magic Attack skin) = 42 549, and his green ability goes up from 43269 + 7455 (70% of a fully upgraded Magic Attack skin) = 50 724. From these values, we can see that Jorgen's actual damage increase is minuscule, especially if you consider the fact that Jorgen lacks Magic Penetration and thus faces the issue of damage reduction and diminishing returns, making this small damage boost even less noticeable. The increase in the durability of green ability is also pathetic, since it will still be easily broken by a single hit of a warrior or a marksman. If absorbing 7455 more damage once or twice in a fight was meaningful, we wouldn't laugh at how horrible Astaroth's ultimate ability is. For similar reasons such as this, a lot of us scorn Dorian's Champion skin, because it boosts Dorian's Magic Attack, which does almost nothing due to Dorian having only one skill that uses Magic Attack, and on top of that that said skill only takes 11% of Dorian's Magic Attack, making his champion skin a complete waste of money and time. A completely different case is Sebastian, who uses Physical Attack for many of his abilities (the only ability to not do this is his ultimate ability), and which utilize an extremely small amount of it on top (his abilities use 0.1%/0.12%/0.06% of his Physical Attack, and they’re all extremely crucial, especially his purple ability that takes only 0.06% of his Physical Attack), making a Physical Attack skin on him basically a necessity to have, since it can really turn the tides of the battle in case Sebastian is deployed. This is not Jorgen’s case, as his Magic Attack values on his skills are for the most part a byproduct that doesn’t otherwise invalidate Jorgen in his job, so he simply doesn’t care for a Magic Attack skin.

[@smaragdchaos]

Now let's analyze Jorgen's actual skins. Jorgen's champion skin gives him extra Health, his Devil skin gives him extra Magic Defense. His Health skin is completely optional to build. The reason for that is, being more fragile in this game makes you faster in building up energy, due to how attack speed is calculated and the fact that getting damaged more means more energy gained. On the other hand though, building up health on Jorgen also means your Jorgen will survive more deadly blows, and he will also become usable as the main tank in a team (yes, such teams do exist). His Magic Defense is mostly situational and was never really needed, though there exists the utility of mitigating damage taken from Satori, as well as less notorious magic attackers such as Aurora, Phobos, Celeste and Lilith. Kai and Peppy once used to be the members of this same circle, but Nexters has blessed both with Magic Penetration skins, which allows them to defeat Jorgen's Magic Defense (if even very barely so). Both skins are rather situational on Jorgen, but overall, they do so much more for him than the suggested idea of Magic Attack skins on Jorgen. That being said, Nexters does love to give heroes useless troll skins from time to time to heroes who are already overpowered and that don't really require new skins (Mostly to show people that they "care" about the game and their popular heroes. Most people don't understand how impactful skins actually are, so they tend to eat up whatever new skin comes out just because of the looks or because it's for their favorite character.), so maybe at some point your wish will be granted, but it will not make him as overpowered as you think it will, as it's not really in Jorgen's cards to be this impactful from the side of Magic Attack.

[@medo1624]

you really active to sharing any information for us

[@claudiulazar926]

Jorgen is so awesome. Thank you Charlie!

[@JacobDVerde]

The only way to counter Jorgen, is with...well...Jorgen. Satori needs to be fully leveled to compete. #iGotShirts

[@Dabolds]

Or have a jorgen and nebula to really counter...been working on a jhu team and so far I've found cleaver(since my asteroth isnt high enough) jhu neb jorgen and martha...really dominates...as long as jhu can get off and keep his enrage...jorgen definitely really makes this team to give jhu enough time to get enraged

[@vventura7786]

We know that Sebastian can counter him. Can you please make a anti-sebastian video?

[@ThEHazaRdus]

He is really strong mid/late game and caused a lot of problems for my Galahad team, but he is not that great at the very very end.

[@readwithmeupsc9177]

@herowarscentral Which is better in Bob team nebula /jorgen

[@alfredmuhamad4196]

do you know for May event?

[@baltsosser]

He might be. He is the last man standing when all of my other heroes are beaten in the Outlands campaign.

[@jisoo2689]

i just got him. i’m trying to level him up as much as possible

[@Tiago.Catuci.Fritsch]

thank you! i have jorgen in my main team now :D

[@realmarion8568]

Another great bit of information, thank you!

[@thomasb6392]

Jorgen is clutch for my Bob team against Keira teams. Jorgen slows down Keiras ult so my Karhk's ult can draw first blood. If I can smoke Keira in the first or second ult then game over.

[@holystars]

use jorgen iran and thea with those's three you will have teams barly able to do anything

[@elliekat2594]

Even generates decent damage. Not as main DPS. But, definitely must have.

[@aryonelmers9602]

Thanks Charlie!

[@cosminalexandru8472]

I guess jorgen will be my first absolut star hero

[@drpowerthirst9093]

I'm not sure I'd call him the best hero (he's certainly a contender), but he's hands-down the best support hero. He's a good choice for nearly every team (same as Astaroth), but is power isn't what he does for your team, but that he prevents opposing team from doing what they want. If I had to rank, I'd say Astaroth best tank, Jorgen best support, Martha best healer, Karkh best physical damage dealer, Orion best magic damage dealer, and Lars/Krista best combo.

[@xman3205]

oldy but goodie

[@obenwahkenobib8899]

Yes. Tanky, works with Magic, Physical and Hybrid teams. Can’t really be your main DPS or Tank but is quite possibly easiest to give a 95 out of 100 score.

[@obenwahkenobib8899]

Also the best counter to Jorgen: Jorgen lol

[@charlesferries20]

I love Jorgen. Total game changer.

[@escadablack5154]

charlie, are you dont make giveaway anymore?

[@jesselopez8957]

Escada Black he made it yesterday bud

[@ricardoblikman2676]

I think he is the best because his soul stones are easy to get and he is very good skinless so you can use him bare.

[@lacyleech7798]

Keep on rockin' in a free world

[@StereoTyp_music]

youtube thinks it should make vietnamese subtitles for some reason on this video only

[@NonameForFun]

Jorgen is sooo useful but so many people have Satori at my server :(

[@davorfabijanic8061]

excellent hero for sure

[@finkelzo]

I gave my father $100 and said, “Buy yourself something that will make your life easier.” He went out and bought a present for my mother.

[@escadablack1626]

jorgen + nebula is crazy control enemies energy, so annoying skills

[@casek7531]

I just leveled up Nebula to 75... and based on what you said... maybe Jorgen can benefit from Nebula a lot?

[@pvz2batallaz723]

Celeste, Astharoth, Jorgen, Martha, Galahad, Keira

[@davejones5640]

Thanks Adblocker.

[@jimh.1590]

Not anymore, Satori seriously counters him and now Sebastian utterly neuters him.

[@evansprankle8058]

Jim H. If I see a Satori team I swap him out for another hero. Satori destroys him as he’s attracted to energy stealers.

[@smaragdchaos]

Satori sucks as a Jorgen counter. Jorgen can still suppress the enemy team even with the presence of Satori, and that can build up enough time for your team to completely dominate the enemy team.

[@smaragdchaos]

Are my comments being deleted?

[@NoName-wq9eq]

What is Jorgen's Sweet Spot?

[@blakeleywood]

Digging Jorgen for sure

[@GNUSupporter]

but satori can kill him with his 4th skill

[@rafarvs33]

I disagree that Satori is a counter of Jorgen, I have Satori on mobile version, and usually when I face a Jorgen team, I can't use Satori first skill and kill Jorgen, cause Satori takes so much to gain energy and Jorgen keeps using his first skill and preventing him to get the necessary amount of energy.

[@Dabolds]

If nebula is on the team with jorgen it cancels...I beat a team with a 61k satori (my highest hero is 46k) using martha nebula jorgen jhu and cleaver...neb and jorgen completely...satori was last to die and he didnt get his skill off once

[@smaragdchaos]

Satori is a bad "counter" for Jorgen. FB version Sebastian is the only true counter for Jorgen, and that's only if he's properly built up.

[@latch2112]

Thanks

[@shreyansshah4565]

Nice content

[@tomklemp894]

Top 3 ? Who are the other 2

[@kenlin307]

My team always defeated by a lower power team with Jorgen. I hate him.

[@darrelosborne8785]

this looks good

[@ΜΑΡΙΑΠΕΤΡΟΥ-δ3κ]

Not really. He is a beast in certain setups mid or late game but there are stronger setups currently in game without jorgen in.

[@tedo8880]

jorgen is strong hero with cheap resource to make him strong

[@jasonrodriguez6771]

Nice....

[@mneacsu]

I love Jorgen!

[@mattwagner1607]

I love Jorgen!!!

[@ArcticSlicer]

Jorgen used to be the best hero in the game, but Sebastian has mostly forced him out of the metagame and completely replaced him for the title of "best hero in the game".

[@postgoats3099]

Jorgen is great.

[@weekabeee]

Jorgen power

[@jesselopez8957]

Works into any top 15 team ez

[@antonio8984]

i hate jorgen and nebula when they burn energy

[@rishumittal7177]

i use satori to counter him

[@moinuddinrehmani]

🙌🏻

[@takeiteasyjh]

skins on tight

[@godspeed821]

jorgen is good

[@marthaalicia8838]

😀

[@alfredj7194]

jorgen really annoying against galahad and jhu

[@jaydeguz9559]

Jorgen > Galahad

[@powgasim5419]

I believe Jorgen should be nerfed slightly. Reduce his ultimate ability from 9 seconds to 5 seconds, and reduce the targets hit from the ultimate from whole team to 3 RANDOM heros. He has no counter, so why does he have to be so strong?

[@quidam9568]

Marksmen works well since the first skill of Jorgen affects the frontline. And he has a counter: Sebastian makes Jorgen almost useless. He also makes useless Satori, Lian, counter some of Andvari's skills, and the water marks from the twins... I think Seb is overpowered^^ Satori is said to be a good counter against Jorgen too, but even if I like this hero a lot, I didn't manage to find a proper team for him (as good as a META I mean).

[@powgasim5419]

Qui Dam I should’ve clarified, I meant on mobile. Jorgen’s ability hits the whole team, not just the front line, it’s an area based attack, but covers the full team. The only way to counter him is to kill him.... Sebastian only blocks his curse on mobile, he still prevents energy gain for 9 seconds

[@smaragdchaos]

Wait, so mobile Jorgen can even hit the backlines?

[@smaragdchaos]

@@quidam9568 Frontline is such a downplayed term in the skill's description. Jorgen easily affects 2/3 of your enemy team's range in most cases, so marksmen don't get away from his meddling. Only the real backline heroes are safe for the most part, but they're also first-blood victims of leper. Sebastian isn't exactly overpowered, he's a balance necessity, because critical heroes were becoming very useless, and Sebastian is making them useful again.

[@quidam9568]

@@smaragdchaos Yes, I over-reacted a bit^^ And another good part is that Seb makes Helios more important too. Still I think he should be nerf a bit, maybe a x10 shield instead of x15, something like that. The crit boost is a good thing, it's his shield with his purple skill I find too powrful. But there probably new heroes to come, and rework of some others, th balance often changes :)

what is the best teams to build around jorgen or include jorgen in mid-tier / cheaper build? i'm thinking a few: a) Astaroth, Satori, Celeste, Jorgen, Orion (magical) b) Galahad, Qing Mao, Keira, Jorgen, Martha/Thea (physical) c) Astaroth, Qing Mao, Keira, Celeste, Jorgen (mixed)

what is the best teams to build around jorgen or include jorgen in mid-tier / cheaper build? i'm thinking a few: a) Astaroth, Satori, Celeste, Jorgen, Orion (magical) b) Galahad, Qing Mao, Keira, Jorgen, Martha/Thea (physical) c) Astaroth, Qing Mao, Keira, Celeste, Jorgen (mixed)