HoloEN Advent "Rebellion" Reaction + Bonus Myth songs | 'a nice song' [VOD Part 4/4]

[@Texaboose]

"It's like calling Suisei a singer... she's THE singer!" LMAO. Agreed.

[@dragonbretheren]

I think the general problems with group songs is genre choice. Journey Like a Thousand Years was actually a very personal passion project for MYTH because it came at a time where Calli was still living in Japan and Kiara had just moved back to Austria. The 5 members of MYTH had never been able to be in the same room together, despite having worked together and become good friends over a year. Additionally, Japan was still in lockdown, so nobody could visit Calli, nor could Calli leave Japan at risk of not being let back in. Ina even broke into tears on a stream saying "i just want to be able to give you all hugs." Thus, their Journey Like a Thousand Years to Meet. The problem is what genre do you choose to make everyone sound good? Ina doesn't sound good in high-tempo pop, but Kiara doesn't sound good in slow melodra tones. At this time, Ame was still not very confident in her singing, so anything too fast or lyrically dense might be hard for her. The answer, unfortunately, is to go for safe, neutral beats with simple meters and rhyme schemes. As you said, Calli was basically writing this with her hands tied. With Rebellion, you have an additional hurdle of not having an internal writer like Calli, so they had to hire an external writer. The problem is this was scheduled to go live with their debuts to highlight mostly Nerissa, but also the FuwaMoco twins and Bijou as a more music-heavy generation compared to MYTH and Council. Because it was pre-debut, said writer probably didn't have much to go on aside from lore, character designs, and "one of the five members has a power voice", so it ended up very generic and didn't actually give FuwaMoco or Bijou anything to do.

[@5boxes]

Calli was probably not so used to writing that type of cheesy song. Like, she didn't like idols for a long time before joining and getting to know the members so I doubt she had much experience with such songs.

[@ThiagoABarbosa]

You can't forget that in "Rebellion" the only one who really studied music was Narissa. She says she was the guiding voice for the girls. But for a start I think the song is excellent and I understand the idea. Which would be to demonstrate the characters and give the group's spirit. I'm the type of person who likes to see the group's music as a demonstration of the vision they want, but whether the group will continue on track is another story.

[@moneng85]

My first time knowing about this Thanks for the details!

[@nrvnqsr4001]

Came here mostly for The Journey of a Thousand Years -- what makes this silly, awkward little song special is the context. It's been released at a time where HoloMyth were apart for ages due to Covid travel restrictions. They were the only group that up until that point hasn't ever met IRL (except for Calli and Kiara when Wawa lived in JP for a time iirc). In a company where the gens are usually so tightly knit together and do lots of IRL stuff in their groups, Myth were separated by thousands of kms for around 2 years. So all these cheesy lines about waiting, longing and defeating fates are to be taken very literally. Just five friends suffering through separation, struggling with pandemic restrictions, travel bans, visa issues and stuff. That's the "wall" this song, recorded in 5 different places across the world, "connects" them through, however awkward and on the nose that is. You can imagine Calli got prompted to write a silly group song for New Years, but all that was going through her head was "man, just let me see them already". When the five of them finally met IRL and sang this together live on stream, the only reason I didn't start crying like a baby was because I've been watching in public 😅

[@ravenclawreacts]

Awwww. Thank you so much for this.

[@nrvnqsr4001]

@@ravenclawreacts You're welcome, always happy to yap about Holo and especially Myth :D Very much recommend checking out both the off-collab karaoke and 3D live versions of this song. One is just pure silliness and emotion and the other has cute choreo and a certain vibe of closure to it. (They've been waiting for their official 3D debut for 3 whole years due to All The Things.)

[@Rosamune]

I love Rebellion, its such a bop everytime it comes on blasting in the car especially. I never really lay attention to lyrics for any music so maybe thats why i can enjoy these holo group songs much easier.

[@5boxes]

My zoomer brain is definitely okay with the lyrics. It's too meme-y to not like. FIRE FIRE LIGHT THE FIRE 🔥🔥🔥

[@Raphex5]

My favourite of the group songs is still "Non-Fiction". I think it has the most effortless-feeling harmony sections, and also just flows really smoothly; it really doesn't feel like a 4-minute song.

[@Fate862]

For me it was the opposite of effortless because it sounds like they had to use some autotune which hurts the ears when they try to hit the higher notes but can't like with Ina most of all and abit with Kiara trying not to peak with her already high pitched voice. Like just now I tried listening to it again to see if maybe my view has changed and it definitely still hurts to listen to. Lower the volume doesn't help the higher pitches not hurt as if their voices are breaking or hearing some autotuning to adjust for their voices in some sections like some point out in reactions or comments of the song for people who don't think every song hololive makes is perfect but give some criticisms here and there. I'm glad you enjoy the song but I can't, I seriously can't without cringing to most of their voices when they try to hit notes they aren't use to. Harmony is a song like that doesn't save it. Journey like a thousand years sounds more like harmony with less effort and much easier for everyone to hit their notes which is nice to listen to moreso and you get their voices more clearly so you get a nice clean sound. Opinion of course.

[@Flugmorph]

Rebellion was like the most hype performance at the Breaking Dimensions concerts lol

[@ravenclawreacts]

I really enjoyed the live version! Just one of those songs that feeds well off crowd hype I reckon

[@Flugmorph]

@@ravenclawreacts yeah I was glad to be in the audience especially for that one, the energy was incredible.

[@gokbay3057]

I really enjoy Journey Like a Thoudand years. Probably my favourite Holo EN group song. I find Rebellion quite entertaining as well however (haven't watched the video yet so I have no idea what Ravenclaw said about them yet lmao).

[@gokbay3057]

Darn, missed a typo before the heart.

[@S9staryu]

​@gokbay3057 Good thing KZbin-san included an "edit" button

[@loveliveshrek]

@@S9staryuif you edit your comment when you have a heart on it, the heart will dissapear

[@gokbay3057]

@@S9staryu Editing a comment removes the heart given by video uploader/creator/channel owner.

[@hiryuu1115]

I saw the warning but wanted to go all the way though to give it a chance. I haven't really liked these livestream segments and will probably stick to the longer form content going forward. I know it's supposed to be brain dump with a friend, but it came across really mean spirited and not the same comfy analytical vibe that your other videos had. The little stops to say "oh, but we still really respect the girls and the staff that worked on it" didn't really come across as genuine with the rest of the content being so negative. I appreciate that you are trying different content with the channel, but I'll avoid these livestream sections going forward.

[@ravenclawreacts]

All good! Each to their own, and I appreciate your view. This is actually old content - we’ve always had watch parties on our Discord server since the start where everyone lets fly with their honest reactions and opinions. They’re a different flavour, hence the warning at the start. I’ll still be putting out analysis videos in the future :)

[@LethalShadow]

@@ravenclawreacts Just to balance things out, I'd like to say that I personally enjoy this kind of content. Firstly, because more reactions is better, imo. If that means some of them are in a less polished format, so be it. I'd rather know what you think about some of the songs and some of the girls, than not know because you choose not to make a formal critique video. Secondly, because I think it's perfectly fine to be critical. If I just wanted to hear Hololive get praised regardless of the quality of a piece, I'd tune in to any of the fan channels or forums. It's a bit ridiculous and bordering on cult'ish, the way some of the fanbase acts like everything Hololive releases is pure gold. The fact is there are many Hololive songs that are just not that great, and specifically the group/wave/gen songs tend to be a bit "meh". It's a cool way to introduce a new generation, but as a standalone piece, they tend to be mediocre. Not every song is always going to be huge a hit. I am reminded of Suisei's song with Calli; Capsule. Two artists I adore, but the song was mediocre and I recall you calling that out and pointing out the specifics. That is exactly the kind of knowledge and insight I tune in for. TLDR: Love your insight, whatever form it takes. Please do not feel like you can only put out critiques or content that praises Hololive, or highly produced/polished videos. Thank you for releasing these VODs.

[@KharaChmiel]

@@LethalShadow To balance things BACK out, I'm pushing 100% back on the idea that Hololive gets "praised regardless of the quality of a piece". I said this in the previous video, but we all know that the girls have different skill levels at singing, gaming, dancing, etc. When they do a good job FOR THEIR SKILL LEVEL, we praise them, because what's the point of saying something like "I wish she sounded better" when she physically can't. When they go above and beyond a good job (like Biboo doing Palette in her 3D showcase), we lavish the person with praise because we know how much work went on in the background. These girls work extremely hard; so its okay to give them constructive criticism, but its NOT ok to make jokes at their expense that come off very negatively. There have ALWAYS been criticism about quality, quantity, jokes to be made, etc. Criticism devoid of maliciousness is perfectly acceptable. The problem is when that criticism becomes malicious or becomes malice-tinged. MOST of what Raven does here is critique and I have enjoyed it. However, some of these chill streams have veered off into maliciousness. I point to the Shuba "should sing like a duck" comment from last video. Having to qualify that you "really respect the girls and the staff that works on it" means subconsciously Raven and co. realizes they may have gone too far OR that their critique could come off as such. Saying it after the fact doesn't absolve you of having said the thing you said. There needs to be a balance where you can be more relaxed in your criticism BUT temper your jokes that veer into malice. As I said in the previous video, I want Raven to do more videos with Hololive because we can always use more people in the space, BUT you need to temper your jokes and maybe think about why sometimes your jokes come off as malicious.

[@franksmithii608]

Wth . Advent: the arrival of a notable person, thing or event.

[@Ryo39]

The most recent full EN group song, Breaking Dimensions, is actually amazing

[@S9staryu]

Also i hope you check out Breaking Dimensions, since they have 15 EN performers in one song

[@dragonbretheren]

Unfortunately, I think they won't like Breaking Dimensions for the same reasons they didn't like Rebellion or Journey Like a Thousand Years. It is VERY overproduced, a VERY generic beat, and doesn't give a lot of them anything to do. I know someone who listened to it before watching the MV and was utterly confused why Fauna wasn't in it because none of the voices sounded like Fauna. They also thought ERB was somehow one of the voices even though they knew Justice wasn't supposed to be in the concert. IMHO, Breaking Dimensions is one of the weakest group songs they've ever released.

[@brokeback9299]

I'm here for the suisei bias

[@blackfirehedgehog7725]

Journey has a special place for me just because of the context in which it was written (Myth not being able to meet up and all that), but I don't end up listening to it that much probably for the reasons touched on here. The more group songs I've seen, the more I feel they're difficult to write properly with a bunch of different singers. Meaning-wise I at least like the lyrics of the Myth group songs. The more recent ones for Advent and now Justice are... Really fun to listen to, especially live, but the lyrics hurt me lmao.

[@darkflames9039]

My favorite EN group song is Above Below, I hope you listen to it soon.

[@tintillor]

I might be alone in this, but I really like Rise from Holo Council.

[@Flugmorph]

yep thats still my favorite generation song from all of hololive, good shout!

[@KazePhoenix]

You should totally react to rebellion but the April fools rendition. Makes it perfect

[@outsideboxer1448]

listen journey is not my fav musically either, but its a song about them not being able to meet for almost 2 years during the pandemic, and the lyrics were written by Calliope for everyone. shes gets a bit whacky with her lyricism but it somehow makes me emotional with all the context. and because its myth:D and sharks are totally fish what do you mean haha

[@bediahvandougaljones]

I think there’s some parts of rebellion that genuinely sound good, but there is a lot of parts that break apart those better sections, killing the energy of the song. The new group song they put out is definitely a way better song for them. That one for sure was written by an English speaker, in fact it’s one of the people who have been working on a lot of Kiara’s new songs. So maybe I’m a little biased there because of that.

[@Adyen11234]

Oh, have you seen Ayunda Risu's new MV for her probably best original song "Sing Out"? It's super worth looking at, and it's a great song too!

[@Bobbias]

Now listen to Elizabeth sing the entire opening of Rebellion in a single breath like its nothing lol. I'm aware that for good singers that's not that huge a feat, but I dont typically hold hololive members to the same standards as I would a commercially successful singer.

[@jkgiron1]

unfortunately, most english songs from the hololive EN branch suffer from the weird english pacing/emphasis/timing? that you mentioned in the video. One thing i can think of why that is, is that they're shoehorning english lyrics to music that was written for japanese lyrics (which has a differnt rhythm than the english language). It ends up sounding weird and forced. Another thing that I can think of, is that maybe the english lyrics were written by native japanese composers/producers/songwirters who speak english, but not fluently. 🤷‍♂

[@shaithis77]

English lyrics for these type of songs are fine. Plenty of electronic music like this that have English lyrics that sound great. The problem is the lyrics are really, really bad in this one. Chorus works well though.

[@vkarvanzer4243]

This! This explain my weird feeling toward Holo/StarsEN songs. Like, it just didn't fit.

[@dcresistance]

That's literally not it, it was written by a fluent English speaker

[@LethalShadow]

I agree with your general feeling. I remember some of Kiara's songs suffering from the same problem. Regardless of the reason why it happens, some of their songs do feel like the rhythm is off on the lyrics. Some verses feel like they're either forced to be sung too fast, or cut off abruptly off beat.

[@abhisekapambudiutomo52]

i still wait for kobo 😁

[@thetcaseaway4306]

Where can I catch the stream? Where is this uncut VOD? 😂 I want to see more uncut raw reaction with all the "harsh" Comments 🤣

[@AriixYT]

Wait, question, has Ravenclaw reacted to the Suisei Comet-chan song already?

[@thenoisyninja]

Gen songs tend to be weaker overall since theres anything done to cover the weaker performances stands out.

[@impossible7163]

Rebellion lyrics may be whatever but "Fire fire light the fire" has become a staple. And I guess you had to be there but it's all about the hype. So I see why you want to shit on it as a precious real musicians because you can read notes. What I don't undestand is why Ravenclaw wants to do thses reactions just to be negative. Clearly you don't like this stuff, so why waste your time on it? Go back doing things you like.

[@sya2711]

constructive criticism ?

[@impossible7163]

@@sya2711 There is nothing "constructive" about this. "No filter, no mercy, no laws." Just two edgelords giggling like schoolyard bullies who are jealous about people that are more succesfull and talented than they will ever be.

[@luker2999]

If you want to check out the new Gen "Justice" which debuted not too long ago. Please listen to Elizabeth, she is such an incredible singer!

[@sedpotato251]

Have u check out Unknown mother goose cover by the hololive jp member:?

[@serpiton]

To me Rebellion is an awkward song, for the lyrics, the pacing of the lyrics, in some phrase the length of the lyric and the music don't match, in general it seems to have two/three section with different style that don't really match together that well. "Journey like a Thousand Year" was the first Myth group song, everyone hated "Country road" for how it was managed, the girls talked about it, real horror stories, and didn't want to do another group song for a long time then, I don't remember if it was Gura or someone else, wanted to do a little song for the halloween special, they did everything themselves and "Myth or Treat" was great, so they decided to give it another go, "Journey like a Thousand Year" was a song about how they put their everything into this strange new job, and how after all those year of cov*d they would finally be able to meet IRL, all five of them, so probably a lot of the fan that followed Myth from the start, or started following when cov*d was still at full force attach emotions and meaning to that song, even if it's not the best.

[@ravenclawreacts]

I do appreciate the sentiment in ‘Journey’ a lot, thanks for the contextual info!

[@GabrielRojasAhumada]

I remember a lot of people crying when watching this when it came out, specially since we started getting the off collabs, the takamori thing and all of that

[@Micheldied]

That's how I feel about most of the EN group songs tbh. Most of them don't sound particularly great, especially compared to the ID and JP group songs.

[@タマ48]

Now if u think the other is just meh u should checkout fuwamoco cover song because in here i dont think they got justice. (Especialy "let me be with you" or "white love" cuzu said u prefer "oldish" song)

[@sya2711]

these are def more of a brain off just jam , kind of songs.

[@mulinblack]

Still no kobo kanaeru song? Why ?

[@payableondeath7]

Thankful you didn't listen to Council and Promise's songs. You might have been turned off from Hololive forever

[@Flugmorph]

theyre too emotionally laden for us fans. i really love especially Rise but i can see someone who hasn't gone through the first year of council with the girls to not get it at all.

[@am_frog]

Yeah Shiori isn't really a singer and is definitely more the entertainer type...Her streams definitely attract a certain type of person. She's as weird as you think she is and can and will say whatever cursed thing she can think of. In regards to 2nd gen singing abilities, idk if you've heard of the weird 1.5 gen former vsinger Irys who got moved to gen 2 eventually. It gave that gen a much needed strong singer imo.

[@KharaChmiel]

I would say that Bae and Mooms are pretty damn strong singers, just in their own style. Kronii has also become really strong. Fauna's the only one I would consider actually "weak" in the grand scheme of things (still better than like 50% of the singers out there lol).

[@Ludecil]

I'm glad we agree on Rebellion, the verses are too sing songy for too long and any sense of feeling meaningful or deep then feels out of place.

[@defenestratedone]

this seems pretty standard for every gen's first song. They're really there for a thematic/tone intro to the members more than anything else, not a standalone song.

[@Ludecil]

"maybe the the one we haven't heard is the techno savvy entertaining one" Shiori was definitely the one that had the flashiest debut with lots of OBS effects. If you really want to hear their genuine singing, try checking out any of their karaoke streams. Nerissa is very consistent, and Fuwamoco are very clean with some refreshing harmonizing. Bijou has potential with her soft voice, as you can hear in her first cover and in Rebellion, but I think she prioritizes her squeaky character voice. I like the whispery texture to Shiori's voice when she relaxes, too.

[@Ludecil]

More Livestream VODs are always welcome if it means more Hololive content!