Honda B-CAN Network Diagnostics (single wire design)

2009 Honda Odyssey The diagnostics in this video revolve around the relay control module (part of the body communication area network) no high beams, no wiper washers, no high speed wipers, no parking lights etc.
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On ScannerDanner Premium I will bring you right into my classroom at Rosedale Technical College. You will find page for page lectures taken right from my book as well as exclusive classroom type case studies. What is so special about these classroom case studies? I pull live problem vehicles directly into my classroom and we troubleshoot them in real time, using and applying the theory and testing procedures we learn during the classroom lectures. There is no better on-line training of how to troubleshoot automotive electrical and electronics systems anywhere!
Disclaimer:
Due to factors beyond the control of ScannerDanner LLC, it cannot guarantee against unauthorized modifications of this information, or improper use of this information. ScannerDanner LLC assumes no liability for property damage or injury incurred as a result of any of the information contained in this video. ScannerDanner LLC recommends safe practices when working with power tools, automotive lifts, lifting tools, jack stands, electrical equipment, blunt instruments, chemicals, lubricants, or any other tools or equipment seen or implied in this video. Due to factors beyond the control of ScannerDanner LLC, no information contained in this video shall create any express or implied warranty or guarantee of any particular result. Any injury, damage or loss that may result from improper use of these tools, equipment, or the information contained in this video is the sole responsibility of the user and not ScannerDanner LLC.

[@jeremyah78]

I literally just had a smile on my face for 50 minutes straight! And I learned a cool trick or 2 too!! Love it Danner!

[@ScannerDanner]

that's awesome, thank you for the feedback, this means a lot to us

[@jeremyah78]

Honestly, brother, I can’t explain in a post how much you, Caleb, and your body of work (here on utube and your premium channel) have meant to me and my shop at a pivotal time for us! And you’ve been doin it so long for so many, and have contributed so much to this great trade, that I would understand if you stopped… but I sure hope you never do! ✌️&❤️

[@ScannerDanner]

@@jeremyah78 wow thank you Jeremy! I certainly can't stop now, this is my full-time job these days 😉 And Caleb is my full-time employee. So not only do I have to support my family, but I have to support his too. So you guys who are premium members are the ones that I really need to thank because it is you who make this possible for us! Even continuing to post here on KZbin is enabled by you guys. I'm also grateful that I am not a slave to this platform like most creators are and again, it is you guys that I must thank. Truly, from the bottom of my heart

[@jeremyah78]

@@ScannerDanner well then it’s a pleasure Paul!! And I’m glad to hear I can look forward to lots more content going forward! ✌️

[@DKFIXIT]

i damn near had a headache trying to read the schematic. Heavy equipment is so much simpler to read and understand.

[@indep80]

It's really nice to see you enjoyed that you were right... Just like a kid! This is the true kind of professional, who is learning every day. Not for the money. But the process itself. You are a really happy man. This is true happiness... With warm regards from Moscow, Russia.

[@ScannerDanner]

glad you can see that, thank you so much because you are absolutely correct

[@itstallionman]

You and your brother would be awesome on your own TV show. The charisma you two have together is something.

[@ScannerDanner]

Thank you 😊

[@gokblok]

This is it. This is the show.

[@JonnyR90]

I’ve learned so much from watching your videos I’m a mobile mechanic and everyday I watch at least 1 video just to refresh my mind when it comes to trouble shooting. Thank you for all the great information you provide for us technicians.

[@tracydiller9378]

Paul and guys this has got to be one of the ''BEST'' Diag. and Entertaining videos you guys have done.And that back ground music is off the charts.You guys rock.Stay safe everyone.

[@ScannerDanner]

Thank you Tracy! Really appreciate the feedback

[@tracydiller9378]

@@ScannerDanner Anytime.

[@bergtechautomotive8886]

Call me crazy, but it's this process I fell in love with 30+ years ago. I'm not a "car" guy...I could care less about racing or restorations. I love troubleshooting and making broken things work again. Love your process as always.

[@ScannerDanner]

You're not crazy. I'm the same way 😉

[@jeffreywilsonrubikscubeonb2428]

Amen! Lol

[@OneLegged-honda-mechanic]

Yall reminder me so much of my brother and I. We both went to tech school together and then started fixing cars in '96, he went to work at Toyota and I went to work at Honda. We're constantly sharing knowledge with each other.

[@cyberslacker5150]

Throw away the Snap-On. Grab the Autel instead. Or an Xtool. It has functions to program boxes like that! No need to call some dude who will charge you a hundred bucks just to program a box. I've programmed various Honda modules with the Autel. Oh, And it has more modules listed. It probably has the Relay Module listed too. Snap-on didn't. You said the best scan tool is the Dealer tool. The Autel software is based on the dealer's scan tools. It's great that you had to cut a CAN wire. I do it all the time. It's the fastest way to test whether a module is working or dead. Super great video!

[@deuceelec]

TSB's and common repairs only come about because someone has gone through the systematic diagnostic process that you teach. Excellent videos Sir.

[@ScannerDanner]

Thank you my friend

[@andyrogerson3813]

I love the pride you take in the process and the joy you have in sharing it!

[@The_Redkween]

You guys rocked it!!!! So awesome! That feeling when you find it is the whole reason we troubleshooter do what we do.

[@ScannerDanner]

yes sir!

[@BriannaFleury]

I'm working on a A029 communication fault in my Prius hybrid battery system. This really helped with troubleshooting the single wire system. Thanks.

[@PivotGrowth]

Did you resolve your issue? Fingers crossed 🤞🏽

[@jusellz]

Bro i was selflearning at home and followed you for my learning cool..

[@guianders]

That's right step by step scanner Danner duo. Doesn't get any better.😊

[@xjssts7127]

Great video you are master tech, I am 30+ years mechanic.

[@lameckarika1949]

Dang I never thought about the B-can communication being bidirectional during continuity test. No wonder you rock😊

[@peugeotplanet7553]

there's no time i watch your vids that i don't learn something new... you always have fun doing your job. nice one Mr Danner

[@ColeTanner88]

Ive been using this same method on networks for years. Check it plugged in, then unplug it, if waveform stays the same, network is good. Ive always wondered if that was a valid test method, ive always thought so and youve confirmed that. Ive also wanted to depin the network wire and plug the connector back in to check if anythings coming from the failed module but never have. Was cool to see you do that even though you cut the wire lol just giving you a little bit of a hard time. Caleb, i was laughing my butt of when Danner was messing with the wipers and the music you edited in. That was classic, great job.

[@ScannerDanner]

Thank you my friend! This was a good one and I appreciate this feedback

[@amr-50]

We are lucky to have these videos on youtube thanks danners

[@ScannerDanner]

And I'm blessed that you guys are here to watch them. Thank you!

[@autogc22]

Honda in Europe commonly use, for all comfort systems, a protocol called VAN (as of Peugeot, Citroën, etc.). It's similar to CAN in implementation in the way that all units talk but in a 0 to 5V signal. But it's the first time I´ve seen this B-CAN protocol. I'm not aware if this had been used in Europe. Thanks for the video. It's great.

[@herrkiwi3110]

Mr P Danner you are so awesome ! Your cutting the wire test is brilliant but of course no manufacturer is going to say cut the wire. Thanks as always for the excellent content.

[@snooketcher]

From speculation to confirmation, small victories💪🏻

[@ScannerDanner]

exactly! Thank you

[@moebassidji8306]

the thought process is amazing.

[@josedejesusvelazquez6863]

Paul, There is no doubt that the level of analysis that you have and that you have acquired through life is amazing and here you gave us the proof, please continue like this. as always receive the best from who is considered your FRIEND. from Tijuana 🇫🇷 Mexico. 👍👍👍

[@codywichman213]

The feeling of accomplishment from the wire cutting test, combined with the proof of concept of the tap test. Priceless!

[@jimkillen1065]

I always recommend your channel for a learning opportunity.. Thanks for all you do . Not a chance i ever use a dealer if i had to have work done ..i want someone i trust

[@mohamadmushrif7689]

I learn lot of thing from u man..i am a MG elaetrican...today i worked like this problem power window,PNRD moudle and sunroof all lost comm...any way i leraned lot of thins from u...good job man..keep going

[@ScannerDanner]

That's awesome man. Thanks for sharing!

[@wowcoop]

Loved the wire cut to prove the answer to the bidirectional communication question…..I literally wanted to do that last week for a $1000.00 headlight I had to call for a diagnosis ( a can networked headlight!)…. Great video!! Paul the greatest thing you do in all your videos is the genuine honesty that you have the guts to show in your diagnostics ( have a question… can’t answer it. Come up with a test and go for it), way to go!

[@ScannerDanner]

Thank you my friend. I wouldn't have it any other way. Really appreciate this comment

[@WA-zl6ju]

Love the stack of yellow pine fresheners 😊

[@robertpope3619]

This has to be 1 of my all-time favorite videos yet, the trouble shooting all the way to the voice editing to the music at the end 😂 love u guys

[@ScannerDanner]

Thank you! Share with your friends 😊

[@grabovg]

It is so fun being able to 100% prove it. I recently did this same thing on a Tacoma with a BCM

[@isalmankhan1]

@ 9:55 "Bass ackward's" that term for flowcharts was pertinent, how did you come up with it🤣 Awesome, it was very confusing when that defogger relay started latching with testlight connected, but you really made it easy for all of us to understand & troubleshoot them properly👍 Special Thanks to James Danner & Caleb Danner (Congrats Bro😍) Thanks for sharing SD, Stay Blessed Bro❤

[@ScannerDanner]

weird design that was for sure (with the fuse being on the ground side of the control side of the relay) Thank you my friend

[@thebaldmechanichardatheari1124]

Have not watched you for a while but your method of diagnostics is great. I would say you should be a teacher but you already are. Lol very good fix

[@turningwrenchesautorepairm5017]

The final "unplug test" is worth a million thank you's. Another test in my arsenal, Thxs a bunch scannerdanner

[@ScannerDanner]

I agree 100%, if nothing else was gained, the unplug it test that still showed network activity was super useful in identifying the network wiring integrity without using an ohmmeter to check for an open circuit. Also, this is a universal concept that we can use across the board on network diagnostic stuff.

[@gt3tunecl725]

recently I started to see his complete videos on diagnosis, before I only saw the ones from classes and they were spectacular. Now I go to the moment it hits the communication module, I do not know the name (smart fuse box) , but since the CAN network is multimaster it does not matter, it gave me a lot of laugh that when hitting it it gave a signal, the best test I have seen. Thanks for sharing your knowledge.

[@medicfour9268]

"This is not the silver bullet...This is the Smoking Gun of the Silver Bullet"- John Anello. I bet that the working circuits are a fail safe so that you still have wipers and headlights in the event of a failure, because those are critical for safe operation of the vehicle. Similar to a transmission having 3rd or 2nd gear default in the event of power failure to the shift solenoids.

[@ScannerDanner]

I agree about the fail safe stuff, makes perfect sense! Thanks for the input and the comment

[@abraman5]

"Everything can be fixed with a hammer" -Jeremy Clarkson

[@patriot2164]

That one was great , almost lost me when you cut it but you explain that each module was sending / receiving signals , meaning other modules were sending , but that module wasn't ! took a me minute Got it now Thanks !

[@davidgriffin14]

God I wish I could work with those guys. They all seem like some genuine guys.

[@nalinperera5754]

Excellent diagnostic technician ever seen…..

[@ScannerDanner]

Many many thanks

[@mohawkmike142]

Watching your videos has my attention like TV shows (some) did in the past. TV is mostly worthless crap anymore so tuning the Danner show is where it's at. I'm 68 but still crave learning. You guys provide that constantly. TY and keep the great content going.

[@ScannerDanner]

Wow, thanks so much! Glad to have you here

[@andrewwmacfadyen6958]

The brothers Danner double act will be playing Las Vegas soon. 👍

[@accordingly]

Being in electrical repair at a manufacture and dealing with communication lines and networks often this is the kind of content that will be a huge help. The step by step to finding the issue is gold. Subscribed and looking forward to lots and lots of content!

[@ScannerDanner]

Awesome! Glad you're here, I'm sure I'll learn from you too!

[@rickw.9298]

That as fun. You got to love Can’s fault-tolerant circuit design. Anything that can work will work even if it’s only partially. It just keeps giving!

[@karolisgarbaciauskas5445]

This video had been wached more than 16k times, ant it has only 1k likes..?? Come on guys.. I know you liked it. To push on this 👍button doesn't cost🙂. Good video as always. Thank you for what you doing Paul!

[@ScannerDanner]

Thank you my friend 😊

[@Ahto42]

My experience with a CAN line was an afrermarket Pioner radio headunit with nissan x-trail/Rogue(in US) It had a CAN box for steering wheel controls and backup camera signal. The car acted strange, suddenly the dim lights came on for a sec, then no wipers, air con, no torque converter lock, no turn indicators in dash. But the indicators still worked outside, so some fail safe mode was on. Engine off and on, it worked again. Sometimes a hour, sometimes for a month. The only module I could not talk to was the BCM, othes had can codes, ECU even"change the ECU" code. Ordered a used BCM, programmed it and it was good only for a day :(. One time I went to an ATM with mi phone in my pocket and out of the BT range of the head unit. My son was in the car, engine running. As I neared the car, BT connected and the dim lights came on. So it has something to do with the head unit. I removed all connections for the head unit and fow about 2 weeks it was ok. Then connected power and speakers, but not the wire from the CAN box. It all worked, but no steering wheel buttons. The car did not have any DTC's since then. Now I have an Android head unit without can and the steeringwheel buttons work.

[@geraldwardrop]

Enjoying what I'm learning, was great video, thanks Danner.

[@rrmech11]

You Danner Brothers Are off the Chain

[@PaulysAuto]

Thanks for sharing this with us Paul. As always, learning something from your drive to teach concepts and methods in everything you do! God Bless 🙌 you!

[@flmmaz]

What are you guys using to pick up all the audio? It's very impressive!

[@jonwillfixit]

Loved the drawn diagram explanation of the can system 👍🏻

[@simonparkinson1053]

It's nice when you can "percussively" prove a module like that. You can almost guarantee it's a cracked solder joint. But will the availability (or not) of a replacement mean you have to repair this one for refitting or just open it for examination.... "Someone's been here" - they've obviously had this intermittent for some time and maybe found that moving the box restored operation. Probably saw some corrosion on a pin and applied all the grease, could have worked for some time just because they disturbed the connectors.

[@PhillipBailey]

I wonder about pin grip on that particular terminal. I'd have checked that cleaned it with deoxit and added some stabilant 22A to it.

[@CNM2020]

Great video Danner! Like Always thank you Special thank to Caleb. I love the way you teach Paul first of all English is my second language and I was able to understand so easy because of the fact that the way you explain it Thank you so much. I wear my scanner Danner Jacket so proud.

[@ScannerDanner]

thank you my friend, I'm so glad this was clear for you. I can't imagine learning this type of stuff when it is not even in your native tongue. Props to you!

[@PeteSambolin]

100 % agree with your diagnostic! again NOT A PARTS CHANGER ... and cutting the CAN B wire totally 100% sure that is the problem. this is a perfect direction went the same symptoms happened in another Honda Odyssey... thank you Paul Danner for continuing making this videos! my thoughts this case is that not even the technician from Honda Dealer do not know how to do this test the you just did...in the other hand I'm wondering if the Autel Ultra was used in this particular case if it shows that fuse module in the RED CAN B with no communication!

[@saaaron5213]

Sweet! I love learning about this comm network stuff.

[@detailedautodiagnostics]

This was very entertaining and informative! Loved it!

[@joemasterman4305]

Heads up big boy, you can see if the Relay Control Module is communicating by going into the "Body Unit Information" and "Connected Unit List". It will say "Detect" or "Not Detect" Also, the connectors under that thing are usually mad greasy, probably OE grease. Great work brother, keep it coming!

[@juancarreras1714]

Banging, found the trouble shutting, kool method, good class professor!

[@dnlmachine4287]

Fabulous work again Mr Danner. Got some Acura MDXs right now with intermittent B-CAN and module issues, was looking at the same information. Your video sure helps a lot, thanks. "That. Was. Awwwesome." Chris Farley Stay gold.

[@JD-526]

Wow... Use a bigger hammer. I have learned a big lesson on network problems, such as this. I have your book and it has changed the way I look and diagnose many problem. I worked on a 2002 ram and it would not crank, turned the key on and the odometer and headlights would flash. Weird. But using your book and watching your videos I figured it out, took a while but the ecm and the bcm were communicating not having a wiring diagram, going through every wire between the two, and many hours later checking 5 volt references learned from your book and videos I found 3 bad connections between the two. Blew my mind, I figured it out. You are a great teacher. Thanks to Kaleb for his great video making too. Oh congratulations on your new baby. Keep making these GREAT videos both of you, also great to see more of your brother in the videos. Thank you all, and God bless. Jerry.

[@rodvan-zeller6360]

Most shop owners don't understand that the knowledge a tech gains from time spent with proper investigative/diagnosis will more than pay for itself on future problem vehicle assignments.

[@douglash3129]

Hi again. I remember my Moms Cavalier was back firing and shutting off and it took me about 4 hrs. of back probing to find nothing wrong. Sat the ECM on the floor with the engine running, hit the ECM with a screw driver handle and the engine back fired and quit . Since then that's one of my first tests HAHAHA!

[@alrifainidal]

i was watching y'all all the way with big smile like i am working with you, when you find the issue i was jumping happy all the way, thank you very much ( i am watching you from Jordan now) i wish for you the best

[@ScannerDanner]

Thank you my friend from Jordan!

[@joseluisccoyllollacsa8902]

Thank you for teaching us and for your effort doing this video Danner, Greetings from Lima-Perú

[@felixlara2337]

Your the best since y watch your videos I fix like 20 cars on 5 volts reference circuit and you know what?, all of them it was at mechanic shop

[@ScannerDanner]

Freaking awesome my friend. Good job! And thank you!

[@yourmazdasource]

Wao !!! I watch the video from start to finish. At first when looking at the wiring diagram I was confuse until you explained very well how the communication was, making you own diagram on a piece of paper for us to understand. Thanks for sharing so valuable Knowledge. Ps I love when your brother always says… I Don’t Know…

[@ScannerDanner]

glad that paper drawing helped! Thank you so much!

[@fernandoRodrigues-fh7ew]

Men, you deserve the likes on this channel! Good work

[@ScannerDanner]

Thank you!

[@michaelnicholson9092]

Well played brother. Always a pleasure to watch you and your family smack things around. 😂 Seriously enjoyed the video.

[@ScannerDanner]

Thanks Michael! Hope all is well my friend

[@misterhandy5121]

The Danner Squad strikes again ,Great Video ,Great Editing, Great Everything !!!! Thanks Gentleman !!! now to the premium channel I go!!

[@ScannerDanner]

Looking forward to seeing you there! Thanks so much

[@stationaryenginesworldwide]

Keep it Educational guys that’s why I follow you each and every video and on premium also ……teach us that’s what makes it awesome!

[@ScannerDanner]

Thank you so much for your support

[@chicanesimon]

Another good vid Paul even the new guys would get your logic on this kind of failure diagnosis, its just whats needed so you dont end up chasing your own tail or start swapping parts even, probably a failed solder joint crap lead free solder strikes again no doubt ......maybe

[@lucianlucian9911]

Paul, your brother is such a cool dude, you know what I mean :)? Take care of each other guys!

[@ScannerDanner]

I do know what you mean 😀

[@SkillCollectors]

You're a legend, Danner. I prefer to learn the process than how to google search. I'm not going to be allowed to google search at my upcoming L1 Recertification :)

[@weshawkins7165]

The hell with the Honda let’s work on the 32 Ford and the Duster in the background. Great video Paul. I love these who done it mysteries. I just wish these sites that provide the wiring diagrams weren’t so expensive. Guys like me who work out of their home shop have a hard time affording them. Cool find, now Ivan would take apart the module and fix the bad solder joint, ha ha.

[@ScannerDanner]

There is a DIY version of what I use that runs $20 a car. If you're doing some side work, just make that part of your bill eautorepair.adtrk.biz/?a=10817&c=24&p=r&s1=

[@weshawkins7165]

@@ScannerDanner I’ve used Mitchell a little bit for some jobs, I’m just old school and like the old repair manuals. I was a dealer mechanic for 14 years before I jumped ship in 1988 and went to work for the State in Corrections but still did a lot of work at home, still do, retired from the state in 06. It’s almost a full time job working from home. I find your channel and your course invaluable. Thank you for what you do.

[@ScannerDanner]

@@weshawkins7165 thank you!

[@cullenmiller8170]

Obviously, all the customer needed was a telescoping magnet to bang on the module. Great video and nice editing. I liked what you did to your dad when he started whining. 😂😂

[@rupertoecruz]

@ 34:24 When he gets frustrated and his son speeds up his voice is the funniest thing ever . Nice Caleb. .

[@MiracleMAX]

Well done Paul! Proof of concept is the best feeling, especially when you are working on something that you aren't real confident in - flow charts. I always tell my students that if we understanding the basic concepts, then that will give you a head start in the diagnostic path. I agree with you, that we are always learning, every day, every job. Keep up with the good content man. 😉

[@ScannerDanner]

It sure is! Thank you Max!

[@themechanic6117]

loved this one. Nobody learns anything from silver bullets as cool as they are

[@grantwatkins7402]

You guys are fricken awesome, don’t change how you produce your awesome videos. So many tech’s learning so much valuable information from you. Stay awesome guys 😎👍

[@ScannerDanner]

Thank you Grant!

[@juliomela4269]

Very good video transition, like It

[@jroman23]

Very interesting about communication waveform. Thanks Paul. God bless you!

[@rodvan-zeller6360]

Excellent video. Single wire data line demystified .

[@evanwynne5293]

Fantastic video and a great way to find the problem. That system must be specific to Honda. I'm not sure if you guys over the ocean deal much with LIN, that's also a single wire communication system. The difference is that there is only 1 master module and the rest are slaves unlike modules in CAN which are all masters and can all transmit information independently. The slaves only communicate when requested by the master so that test might not work too well for them. I have de-pinned connectors to find faults with CAN but to be honest cutting the wire like you did would be much easier and is something I'm going to start doing from now on. Thanks for the tip👍

[@fire7765]

Good job from Florida.

[@mike-yp1uk]

I like to do one last test. the pin drag test. I use welding torch tip cleaners and start loose and find the correct size it could be corrosion or bad pin contact. torch tip clean as well. I had an engine pcm stall when I used a little pressure on the plug

[@nelsonnarciso1791]

Funny we talking about CAN BUS com issues I was having. Great video.

[@PistonShack]

Proved it again, thanks guys: “Almost everything is fixable.” (Steven Magee)

[@sandmansgarage8359]

loved this episode, hopefully you could open the micu just to see whats inside and what burned.

[@luismarty1685]

Welcome back Caleb!

[@calebldanner]

Glad to be back!

[@mobileautorepairbypacheco1806]

McDonald's instead of Starbucks. You are the best. 👍👍👍🙏🙏🙏

[@jdtractorman7445]

Danner says: you're not supposed to cut wires, LOL🤣. That was neat seeing the signal drop out and seeing it disappear with that wire cut, 🤣.

[@ScannerDanner]

😄 love my brother

[@nathanburke1993]

Super cool that Paul, I shared the same excitement when the theory was proved! Once again brother top of the game! Would love to see you in the UK sometime

[@htownblue11]

Another great lesson Paul. Keep up the good work and sharing your knowledge.

[@aussiefirestorm]

You the man Paul, Danner and Caleb are ok too. Awesome show and great learning experience once again. I thank you for making me a better tradesman. Might even rebuy your Ebook.

[@ScannerDanner]

Thank you Jeremy! Don't repurchase the eBook! I can recover your license code for you. If you're wanting to simply support what I'm doing, sign up for ScannerDanner Premium and then cancel in 5 months which would be basically the same cost as the eBook. Then you'll get something in return 🙂 www.scannerdanner.com/join-scannerdanner-premium.html

[@eddiel6608]

Wow, I am impressed with your channel

[@ScannerDanner]

Thank you! Welcome!

[@johnnicholas978]

As an electrecian who has worked on controls for AC..heating...variable speed modules....I find the automotive controls are very similar...

[@remodz6385]

This was a great diag! 👍👍

[@marioalanis1855]

I love the way you teach man And how you drop the 🎤 😂

[@jimenezautorepair4450]

Nice truble shooting mr danner. And nice diag. I love your videos always whatching What ecer you do. #1 FAN

[@lovetolearn5253]

I went to diag for a car lot over the weekend. They replaced the fans and fan control module with no luck on a Lincoln. The fans not working was the original complaint. I was there for only 15 mins before I found the new dorman control module was bad. The car lot refused to pay me my hr minimum rate 85$. I'm not joking they refused and offered to pay 60$. This has been my luck lately. Before I even left my shop I told them it's a 85$ hr minimum. This is the Second time this happened. The first time it was a tow truck company. I cant believe some people. Sorry for the rant but it was getting to me.

[@ScannerDanner]

The car lot people are THE worst. My suggestion is to never do business when them again. That is absolutely complete b.s. that they didn't pay you what you quoted up front. Nice job my friend