How Bayonetta RUINED Smash 4

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#SmashBrosUltimate #ZeRo

[@guttaknight64]

Ultimate players: “Kazuya is such bs he can kill you from one combo” Smash 4 players: “First time?”

[@zeospark9715]

At least you don't have to worry about Kazuya edge guarding the hell out of you. With Bayonetta, if you're off-stage, prepare eat a nasty-surefire combo and watch as Bayo proceeds to get back on stage without any effort lol

[@marlinmurrell620]

@@zeospark9715 true

[@Silverado-pq6xe]

@@zeospark9715 and her neutral was amazing as well. You have to be crazy talented to get in on a decent defensive player with kazuya.

[@itsnarroblox]

64 players with bs hitstun: 🗿

[@dhans9662]

@@itsnarroblox And many viewers do those tournaments get?

[@shonw2318]

Steve From Smash Ultimate: "Write that down WRITE THAT DOWN!"

[@SamiJ1508]

Steve isn't even close to bayo lvls of broken. He's not even the best character

[@accelerei7619]

@@SamiJ1508 hes joking fucking hell

[@drsipp407]

@@SamiJ1508 he is absolutely broken wym. Just not bayo broken

[@SamiJ1508]

@@drsipp407 he's broken if you let him play mine craft. Don't let him play mine craft. Force him to play smashbros. As broken as he is with full material, any character that can be without their best options on game 5 last stock can't be the best character in the game

[@Silverado-pq6xe]

@@SamiJ1508 who’s the best character then??? Cause I think a random 16 year old kid picking him up and destroying the best player in the world says otherwise…

[@henryreturns1397]

To add more salt : - Bayonetta just destroys many characters, making the match up impossible to win , thus switching to Cloud or doing the ditto - Even top players like Tweek and Leo (both at Top 2), pick up Bayo to be more consistent - Players who were not a threat or not even ranked , start popping everywhere “only because Bayo carried them” - Also to get out of her combos you need an insane amount of DI , so you literally mash your controller until it breaks - This lead to this stall meta of “get one hit and you are dead”, something that other characters would never have

[@ABC-ik9vj]

Diddy can counter bayo too

[@nightmaregames5508]

@@ABC-ik9vj her counters goes even Diddy Kong. Cloud sheik and fox the only ones

[@nevermindme3714]

​@@nightmaregames5508 I don't think fox was a counter

[@RubyGrube]

It almost sounds like this is exactly what’s happening to Steve right now.

[@littlemisseevee2309]

@@nightmaregames5508 fox wasnt a counter, lucario was, if he lives she doesnt get to play all that much… but lucario is also hella inconsistent

[@jamazin94]

The bayo winter .. dark times

[@Venandi_]

Just SDI against bayo they said I legitimately used to think that meant “self destruct immediately” And I did

[@microdemon]

LMAOOO

[@TheCrazyDog11]

I would do the same 🤣

[@redmage8719]

I would consider doing the same.

[@arkivexlr8]

Me as a hero main😏

[@sixarmedpsycho_9]

As you should. 😂😂😂

[@challengeaccepted5613]

Bayonet getting all the hate for being broken Cloud watching from a corner while sipping his caprisun:

[@Potatoman153]

Dumbass comment. At least cloud had a weakness in the form of an incredibly exploitable recovery

[@challengeaccepted5613]

@@Potatoman153 typical smash player:

[@goatfood1504]

@@Potatoman153 cloud was busted in 2v2s though in smash 4

[@spudsbuchlaw]

Cloud was a really good character, but there was counterplay and bad matchups for him

[@SSJPENGUIN]

​@@spudsbuchlawYeah his recovery being poor kinda gave him an explicit weak point

[@josephsixtos7106]

Man said "hend-sight"

[@reductosmash2483]

That's what's always bugged me...people are always so hesitant to ban a broken character because they think banning characters is toxic or whatever, but do they not realize allowing a broken character to continue to flourish in the competitive scene will create 10,000x more toxicity? Granted, there needs to be a period of time of a year or more before banning, where tournaments and performance are assessed (and also players are given the opportunity to learn the matchup and develop counters to the character) because it's always possible that a little time needs to pass and, once the character is figured out more, it's realized that they aren't as broken as previously thought. Bayo should've been hard banned from all tournaments a year after release at the latest, but nope. Instead the Bayonetta hate just festered until the community on both sides of the Bayo coin was pissed, fractured, and over it. We need to give Steve more time, but if he continues dominating in the sense that there are consistently 2+ Steves in the top 8 of majors (which was the case with Bayonetta), I desperately hope they make the right decision and ban him before the community splinters again. Way too soon to ban him yet though, because he's just now really emerging on the scene in a big way. Bayo was immediately a huge threat from day 1. If I'm remembering correctly, someone won a major (or a very high-profile tournament) with her 2 weeks after her release, which is absurd, and all of her nerfs didn't slow the bayonetta players down at all.

[@reductosmash2483]

After watching the Ludwig Invitational, I think I'm close to saying that Steve needs the hard ban. Two Steves in top 8, one got 2nd, one got 5th, 5th place Steve only lost because he went up against 2nd place Steve, and 2nd place Steve only lost because he was fighting MKLeo in grand finals (2nd place Steve TORE through all of his other opponents...he only lost sets this tournament to MKLeo); and, even though it was a 3-0, it was a close 3-0. Every game was down to the wire. MKLeo just managed to clutch them all out. Plus MKLeo cheesed him a few times with Byleth up-b sub-50% 50/50 kills. Steve, I think, is going to become a very big problem and point of contention in the competitive scene, and I think actual consideration of a hard Steve ban should be looked into. I found myself pausing the stream and waiting for more of it to load while I did other things so that I could go to the end of the Steve matches, see if they won, and either skip it if they did win or watch it if they lost, solely because I wanted to watch them lose. That's how it started with Bayonetta for me, too. And smash 4 bayo is the only other character for whom I've had this deep desire to watch them lose or skip their matches if they win. I've had that with certain players, but not characters.

[@marlinmurrell620]

Nah, until I see Steve players making half of top 8 at every major tournament, I won't believe he should be banned. The only Steve's I see at top level tournaments are Jake, Yonni, Onin, and Acola. That's only 4 top players playing that character. If you're playing a Steve at a lower level, you just need to get good at the matchup. Steve isn't the only character consistently making top 8s.

[@ChickenNEO]

Smash 4? More like Super Smash Bros. Beyonetta

[@flowerboy14]

Super bayonetta sisters

[@sixarmedpsycho_9]

​@@flowerboy14 Super Smash Da Gurlz for Wii U.

[@vickeblanka3676]

Just lore accurate

[@mitrimind1027]

And remember how many Bayonetta mains tried to defend her while it was happening.

[@redmage8719]

I am willing to bet that they were telling people to learn the match up or some other such bs. People who say stuff like that are downright toxic in my opinion.

[@ladylaracroft9647]

@@redmage8719 actually the funny part was when the last patch happened people were back on there cloud hype train that he was the best but little did they know the nerfs made bayo mains learn even more broken things about her. It was fucking hilarious as a Bayonetta main when I kept trying to tell people dude just wait Bayonetta is gonna be back at the top of the tier list by the end and in the end I was right 😂. People wanted cloud to be broken and the best so bad. Don’t fuck with a witch ahaha

[@redmage8719]

@@ladylaracroft9647 The smash community for the most part seems to be highly toxic.

[@sixarmedpsycho_9]

I call them "meat-rubbers."

[@serily4524]

not opinion its truth@@redmage8719

[@pikachuyip1478]

Was it the Witch Fist Upper Cut combo that broke the game and Rage quit too?

[@CurlyHead_MF]

Idk why people hate her so much I personally love playin as her

[@tomfoolery2885]

Im glad that steve isnt at this level... *Y E T*

[@AweDude77]

💀

[@tomfoolery2885]

@@AweDude77 statements that aged poorly:

[@concerned9890]

@@tomfoolery2885get off the copium

[@tomfoolery2885]

@concerned9890 my brother in christ, I've accepted it 11 months ago

[@stokexy]

"Bayonetta Gets Wicked" You aint wrong Edit: 25 likes is crazy ngl

[@ichiban9662]

Pointless edit loser

[@stokexy]

@@ichiban9662 callin another person a loser in 2022 is crazy honestly 💀

[@ichiban9662]

@@stokexy Cope

[@aratherlargerodent]

@@ichiban9662 with your life

[@ichiban9662]

@@aratherlargerodent You have no hoes

[@jiyucy]

and she's still unbanned at Smash Con to this day

[@Perciprius_91]

She’s not banned worthy. The only character worthy of a ban in Smash history is Brawl MetaKnight. That’s it.

[@usagijojo2]

FWIW so is custom Mii Brawler, so it's almost fair.

[@zeospark9715]

@@usagijojo2 Yeah because of the small Mii Brawler as well. Miis in general broke the competitive scene in Smash 4 because of the custom moves controversary so most places had them banned outright

[@NILno-hm4io]

@@Perciprius_91 even being such a broken character he didn't have a 0-to-death combo.

[@ax8914]

@@NILno-hm4io but he had a ridiculous neutral and advantage state and basically no counter play and no losing or even mu besides maybe pika being even at best

[@RiverRiceRansom]

I remember one of the first times I played this game and my friend did some Bayo bull to kill me at 0%.

[@Gruntilda-Winkybunion]

Sorry to all her fans: I hate this character with such a passion! Such a feminists fridays for future character! Glad that nobody cares about her in ultimate! And as a Witch Hunter Main myself (Banjo-Kazooie) its a pleasure to destroy her in a tournament!

[@toadboy4]

Steve is nothing compared to this lol Steve is probably the least broken best character in any Smash game Pikachu in 64, Fox in melee, Meta Knight in brawl, and Bayonetta in Sm4sh are easily all more broken than Steve and I don’t think he should be banned unless he starts to take over the top level scene And yet I think Meta Knight was the only one ever banned, and Fox in melee is almost encouraged

[@carlosbrambila4667]

You should make a follow up on how Mkleo saved smash ultimate by getting bayo gutted

[@carlosbrambila4667]

@@justjoshinaroundz1249 Nintendo hosted a smash competition and invited a bunch of the best melee and smash 4 player so that they can test out smash ultimate and look for glitches or changes that they need to do. Sakurai was in attendance I believe each player got to chose 3 characters and Leo chose bayo as one of his. So it was plup top melee player vs Mkleo and let’s say that plup was sacrificed for the greater good. Leo pulled out a smash 4 and dragged plup’s Ridley with a latter combo right from smash 4. After it happened leo shock his head with disapproval and sakurai noted that some stuff happened that should not have happened. Next time we say bayo she was gutted unable to do the latter combos that killed smash 4. Yes it was a heavy and in a non tournament approve stage but the message was received.

[@justjoshinaroundz1249]

@@carlosbrambila4667 gosh thanks so much for the reply. Really nice of you

[@JS-ne2sd]

more like ruined ult by ruining one of the most interesting characters

[@carlosbrambila4667]

@@JS-ne2sd you are the firs person that with that take in the history of humanity. congrats

[@JS-ne2sd]

@@carlosbrambila4667 not really

[@sixarmedpsycho_9]

I remember when she was first announced, I figured she'd be OP. And I wasn't even focusing on competitive Smash at that time.

[@aynsley1002]

I'm so glad bayonetta was added and hearing people say they hated her makes me love it more. Didn't even play her hahahahaha

[@VenomHEDGEHOG]

She's not broken, she is just lore accurate

[@Togekiss.]

I think the reason bayo wasn't banned was because of a similar situation to the meta knight ban in brawl. A lot of top players mained her, so if she was banned, then most top players wouldn't show up to tournaments

[@redmage8719]

People who main characters like Smash 4 Bayonetta or Brawl Meta Knight are not top players in my book.

[@alive527]

Brawl Meta Knight: 😈

[@ethanv7330]

In hind sight banning him would have been the best course of action. -Someone in 2028 talking about Smash ult and Steve.

[@marlinmurrell620]

Nah

[@ABC-ik9vj]

Nah, get good

[@ragames7320]

Steve is MID compared to Smash 4 Bayo.

[@soulbreaker625]

​@@ragames7320the ignorance here lmao he basically warps reality in this game, mid my ass

[@ragames7320]

@@soulbreaker625 lol you must be getting your booty super whooped by Steve to compare him to Smash 4 Bayo. Bayo completely destroyed the essence of Smash 4. F-air canceling combos, I longer witch time, lethal aerial's and edgeguarding plus a lot of other stuff completely invalidated every single other character in Smash 4, even characters who were considered broken before DLCs came out (Sheik, Diddy, ZSS, Sonic, Rosalina etc) Smash 4 was over before it started, and only went more and more down with Bayo making the game unplayable. Steve may be miserable to fight, has a few overtuned mechanics, shocking kill confirms, and is a spammy character here and there, but nothing from him particularly "breaks the game". Especially NOT when compared to Smash 4 Bayo. Are we really supposed to believe that Steve is comparable to S4 Bayo?

[@insomnia88]

My smash 4 tier list Sss:Bayonetta Gap: S:cloud,Diddy, shiek, and small mii brawler

[@ax8914]

small mii brawler is better than bayo though

[@promc2890]

Cloud is SS

[@ABC-ik9vj]

Say sheik dude

[@Sheniqwa69]

@@ax8914 No😍

[@ax8914]

@@Sheniqwa69 god tier neutral, kills you no matter what at 20, insane mobility, too hard to catch and combo and bayo had none of this except killing at 20 yet it required more than 2 inputs

[@multiversegamer6587]

May I also remind you guys. *Bayonetta used to be able to witch time final smashes*

[@NILno-hm4io]

Wtf really???

[@ABC-ik9vj]

Who cares about final smashes

[@multiversegamer6587]

@@ABC-ik9vj 💀 Don’t even get me started

[@Les____]

she still can

[@multiversegamer6587]

@@Les____ I’m talking about smash 5, ultimate. She can’t do that anymore.

[@PrinceSamTV]

Crazy thing is: I knew all of this would happen the day I watched her reveal trailer. It was obvi this character was literally gamebreaking

[@redmage8719]

I feel the same as you.

[@PrinceSamTV]

@@redmage8719 I made another comment stating that we never really wanted bayo. Before her inclusion in the game I did not hear a single person (IRL & Online) ever mention her as a smash pick, not one single youtuber, twitter account, top players, nobody. I’ve Played video games my entire life, and have spent countless hours learning and consuming video game culture, media, lore, history, etc and never was this character even remotely in discussion whatsoever. Easily a d-tier pick

[@sixarmedpsycho_9]

Same.

[@PrinceSamTV]

@@sixarmedpsycho_9 if you were going to make a gamebreaking character you should’ve atleast went with someone we like. Coulda Been Dante, coulda been Goku 🤷🏽‍♂️

[@gamejitzu]

0:36 always gotta pop the balloon. Wish Ultimate Smashville was like Smash 4

[@ogisrb101]

Steve from 2014

[@lto5764]

Dude bayo was wayyy worse than Steve

[@criticartist3911]

@@lto5764 yeah, Steve has weaknesses,bayo was just true torture like brawls meta night

[@marlinmurrell620]

Until a character becomes the center of the meta, being capable of beating every other character in the game, and said character being the only character in most if not all top 8s, no character should be banned in Smash Ultimate.

[@nonupload8064]

did you main steve, meta knight and bayonetta?

[@marlinmurrell620]

@@nonupload8064 The point being what? And no, I don't think that Steve at the center of the games meta.

[@nonupload8064]

@@marlinmurrell620 the point being those limitations are t0o hard to get to

[@marlinmurrell620]

@@nonupload8064 Well that's when I believe a character becomes ban worthy. Other than said character having a very broken and viable tech. If a character has that, then the character should be banned, but if you can ban the tech instead, that's fine too.

[@sgs6593]

In the Darkest corner He's still waiting to be added in the sitting on his monoblock

[@Saturn50420]

I even main bayo in smash ultimate

[@teamhydrangeaP404]

Everyone: OH GREAT ANOTHER META KNIGHT-

[@nickh4676]

True I stopped watching a good chunk because of Bayo

[@frederickdawson2253]

I truly believe they did the opposite with Sora.. not wanting him overpowered on the way out the door they delivered him underwhelming

[@fbgaming6987]

And then there's meta knight...

[@medabosss1954]

And now there’s Steve

[@roberthararisfadia2262]

I was gonna say that

[@ThrowingRave]

@@medabosss1954 they were talking about smash 4, smash ultimate is full of OP characters.

[@sophietwilight5051]

i remember the excuse of not banning Bayonetta because Meta Knight wasnt banned. and Bayonetta isnt as bad as meta knight so no ban

[@gr8645]

omg, that Bayo scream at the end is funny!!

[@theeggthatsurvivedhowtobas778]

Honestly i think some of bayonettas nerfs actually made some of her combos more deadly

[@BluerunnerZ]

At least she was cool tho

[@Hakido]

Each smash iteration has their god. 64 has Kirby, Melee has Fox, Brawl has MK, WiiU has Bayo, and Ultimate has. . . Steve. . .

[@GlitchanBlack]

"Ultimate has. . . Steve. . ." **points to Joker, Min Min, Sonic, Richter, Mario, ZSS, R.O.B., Sephiroth, Shulk, Simon, Snake, Hero and Yoshi** There are MULTIPLE COUNTERPICKS FOR STEVE. Seriously, learn the matchup.

[@cavaliersarecute6899]

64 Pikachu

[@YOLO_NSG]

This is why I never got the DLC

[@FinagleBagel]

Does anyone have the song name?

[@DaltonIzHere]

Every game in the series has one of these characters: 64: Pikachu Melee: Fox Brawl: Meta Knight (or Ice Climbers) Smash 4: Bayonetta Ultimate: Steve Ironically, both of the most powerful characters in the recent games were one who nobody expected to show up.

[@wyattdegroot417]

Basically brawl Meta knight 2.0

[@MicspytheCrazyguy]

ok but what about the sa allegations

[@marlinmurrell620]

What about the so called victim coming up?

[@Jakefrommaine1]

make a full video on this

[@vanillajellyfish]

I think Brawl Meta Knight was stronger but, unlike Bayo, Meta Knight was actually cool to watch.

[@lovereno5958]

The biggest difference was there were characters in brawl able to play against meta knight, not so much for bayo in sm4sh

[@lostsauce911]

I would love a platform fighter where everyone has bayo combo killing off of a stray hit

[@michellenegash4686]

I main her and feel bad lmao

[@futurewario9591]

Fek Bayonetta 😡 a.k.a. the FAKE ballet winner.

[@chaosdragoon1]

Lol I don't like that you posted this with Bayo 3 getting released next week. You're a petty man and I like that. Keep the content rolling, bro. I'm definitely here for it. Haha

[@brodaciousbro1149]

Yeah watching her was boring cause most the time it's usually the same combo your dying too

[@Cat_1887]

And now, we have... Steve.

[@RHMreborn]

Smash for 3ds: I dont even exist

[@TheGamersState]

I honestly feel bad for Bayonetta, first she gets hated on because she broke Smash 4's Meta and now her VA has turned out to be a lying entitled brat.

[@Sheniqwa69]

Eh

[@DominaLilium]

True, Bayo is a complete queen and doesn’t deserve the drama surrounding her.

[@serily4524]

deserved@@DominaLilium

[@ytcmbt2505]

Salem was straight up carried, so where all other Bayo only mains. No real W's. What did Salem do after 4? Not getting out of pools and then getting banned. Bayo carried so hard, yo ass didnt need to do anything

[@redmage8719]

What did Salem get banned for?

[@ytcmbt2505]

@@redmage8719 look it up, its all over twitter and shit.

[@dr.deeznuts8790]

Strongest and hottest

[@iambatman3091]

She does have a big downside tho It's hard to play with only one hand

[@sixarmedpsycho_9]

I know that joke.

[@WanoPirates]

She's just Lore accurate lol

[@Sacred_Fox]

Maister killed so many Bayos in Smash 4 you would think it was the Salem Witch Trials

[@philswiftreligioussect9619]

Before Bayo there was Small Mii Brawler who could kill heavies without rage at 36% from the ledge.

[@santajohnsduraorduraclause4678]

Looks like someone got up B’d

[@redmage8719]

I really hate when people say stuff like learn the match up or some other such thing. Stuff like that is just plain toxic in my opinion.

[@kishiberohan7955]

And now we’re back to those smash 4 days with Steve in Ultimate

[@malcolmfletcher2659]

lol no not really

[@muzuchama]

nice joke

[@kishiberohan7955]

@@muzuchama just like Crash Bandicoot being in smash.

[@medabosss1954]

@@malcolmfletcher2659 you just wait, his power grows every day

[@marlinmurrell620]

Nah, not really

[@greg47846]

im seeing a theme with steve

[@Soup-man]

They could've just added Solid Snake back in and this wouldn't have happened

[@accelerei7619]

You know they would have messed it up somehow

[@ragames7320]

Snake was broken asf in brawl, beta files show that he would've been the same in 4. He only came to Ultimate with heavy nerfs from his Brawl iteration.

[@Shhmeep]

It makes so much sense to ban ban in a phone. Competitive game played, but I guess they decided not to really strange decision.

[@noxmusic467]

She is, after all, the most powerful Witch.

[@emefcue]

The video was so good until you pronounced "hindsight"

[@MigBilk]

And now we got kazuya and Steve to deal with the broken characters never stop

[@ragames7320]

They are nothing compared to Smash 4 Bayo.

[@brandcamacho2899]

lore accurate bayonetta then xd

[@lokibdsh]

tweek's bayo tho

[@lheangavero365]

Bayonetta getting banned Players: - _-0_0-_-0_-0-

[@MMMMMMMMTTYYY]

She's canonically the strongest fighter too

[@darksleuth66]

No Kirby sonic and several others have so much more power her first game is largely a fever dream only to then get waxed by a child

[@kaiserwave5977]

Hell no there's way stronger characters

[@basedgod5223]

Gannondorf is stronger. The guy is over 10k years old

[@ABC-ik9vj]

​@@basedgod5223 lost to a kid with a sword, weak af

[@basedgod5223]

@@ABC-ik9vj eh, chosen hero regardless of age. Besides who is still alive?

[@ashketchum9230]

and now people are not complaining about sora who's even f****** worse

[@sixarmedpsycho_9]

Ehhhhhhh........Sora's not nearly as broken as Bayonetta, although I do see why you believe this.

[@ragames7320]

Sora sucks he's not even better than Ult Bayo after the nerfs... wtf are these people on

[@Tonjit41]

The two back airs at the end caught me off guard. What a disgusting character lol.

[@OmarKingBolt17]

ain’t forget

[@Isabelle-ds4om]

Wait until everyone finds out about BladePlay's Bayonetta Lol

[@pistincup352]

And yet, I have no idea how to play her in Smash 4, let alone Smash Ultimate

[@solidsnakeblair3409]

I never played against a bayo in smash 4 surprisingly, but I did play the 3ds version which was less popular than the wii version so it makes sense

[@cvlcek144]

At the end of the day. Smash 4 as a whole was broken. Had rage not been a thing, and SDI work better, things would have been easier.

[@D7nt_MindMe]

Bayonetta just became mayonaise when ultimate came out

[@sixarmedpsycho_9]

Mayonetta/Bayonnaise.

[@light_skit]

ZeRo had the best smash shorts on god

[@gilkak_gilly]

THEY JUST MAD BECAUSE SHE WAS TOO GOOD 😜😜😜😜

[@serily4524]

yea too good it was the only viable char in the game

[@gilkak_gilly]

@@serily4524 So? She better

[@redeyerabbit576]

Is this a new trend for smash cause now steve is op and it was the last update im pretty sure

[@NOG4L10]

Bayonetta supremacy

[@deathgod4122]

Enter brawl meta knight

[@edwardrobinson5470]

Enter Melee Fox.

[@kadenlee2785]

pov other players who dont main bayonetta are just mad shes good

[@Latino_Burrito]

Yk we like to complain a lot about the characters in ultimate, but boy do we have it better than smash 4. Ultimate truly is one of the most balanced smash games of all time, if not the most

[@MugEdge8]

KAZUYA MISHIMA has entered the chat 💬

[@Kahmie]

Based Zero

[@andresamaya7350]

Now let's talk about how sending a single h3nta1 picture to an underage girl ruined a career 😏

[@Hollow_Construct]

so what you're saying is they have a history of making horribly broken characters for the last dlc slot?

[@edwardrobinson5470]

Hahaha. Though i liked 4 3ds. I remember this was glorious. Especially watching it on KZbin.

[@TrubGMD]

I have smash on my wiiU

[@Sheniqwa69]

I think you mean *Made better*. It’s ok we all make typos. Were only human❤️

[@jorelperez6049]

Omg don’t remind me!!

[@unclebobboomergames]

To me any game like this should he competed at vanilla. Game is always gonna be broken. But no DLC characters if i were runnin things