How Chibnall Guided Torchwood To Prosperity | Torchwood Series 2 Retrospective

[@HarboWholmes]

please help me eat www.patreon.com/harbowholmes

[@LabradorIndependent]

so long as you keep finding ways to put the word Chibnall in your titles chief

[@Temptation666]

*hands Harry a spoon*

[@mattthesilent777RED]

Only if you do Children of Earth and Miracle Day

[@lucypreece7581]

I feel bad for you having to do Children Of Earth next. not because its bad but because it's heavy. Like emotionally it puts you through it. You need to mentally prepare for and then recover from each episode.

[@bubbajordvlogs1297]

I watched it when it 1st aired and didnt think much of it but now i have kids makes me understand how far parents would fight to protect there kids

[@frazzlesreviews5379]

I love how Adrift is like a blue print for Chibnall’s work on Broadchurch. I always find it fascinating seeing showrunners try out ideas in Doctor Who that they later developed into full series such as Russel with Turn Left and Years And Years and Moffat with The Girl In The Fireplace and The Eleventh Hour for his Time Travellers Wife Adaption next year.

[@ashleytuchin7693]

Moffat's doing a Time Traveller's Wife adaptation? Cool, talk about going full circle.

[@nightowl8477]

I like how ambiguous Ianto's and Jack's relationship is. It's realistic. Not everyone has titles and clear cut-off points from friend to partner, with confessions of love. I'm cool with it. But yeah, Jack and Gwen is just dumb, that wasn't even a thing in Series 1 and really brings down everything they got going with Reece.

[@CashelOConnolly]

I thought it was gay baiting. Showing Jack was more heterosexual with his love for Gwen and showing he didn’t really care about Ianto. Scyfy-horror is one of the worst genres for gay baiting its audiences,Supernatural and Buffy being 2 examples. They know the LGBTQI community will keep watching if there’s a chance they’ll see some representation of themselves on these shows but nope the heroes always turn out to be straight or bisexual with a strong preference to the opposite sex Peace and happiness from Dublin 🇮🇪🇪🇺🏳️‍🌈❤️

[@nightowl8477]

@@CashelOConnolly - oh hi! Yeah, they did seem strangely more interested in Gwen than Ianto when it came to Jack, even though Gwen already had two love stories and Ianto needed development. Just prefer heterosexuality I guess, yeah.

[@Ben-vf5gk]

I sort of get Gwen and Jack, they might have overplayed it, but I like that there was an attraction that didn't go anywhere. For one it's realistic, people are attracted to multiple people, plus Jack is part of why Torchwood is seductive to Gwen initially. And they did bury it at least after Kiss Kiss Bang Bang before it annoyed me personally. I also appreciate they eventually landed on heteroflexibility with Ianto but that's Children of Earth that deserves credit for that.

[@nightowl8477]

@@Ben-vf5gk - Bob and Rose is the story of a gay man falling in love with a woman. It was pretty controversial (and probably too ahead of its time), landing Russell with many complaints from the community. He always said 'if it was the other way around, no one would complain.' Ianto's sexuality being retconned as a heterosexual man falling in love with one man is Russell's way of demonstrating that point (the stubborn buggar).

[@Kento300]

I think Ianto and Jack's ambiguous relationship is very much because I don't think Jack can have a real relationship with anyone mortal. But the stuff with Gwen I don't even really view as love for her, more that she's what he wants. A normal life. That's why he tries to push her to have a life outside of Torchwood. Living through her vicariously. Besides we all know his true love is The Doctor.

[@alim.9801]

"I CATCH! ALIENS!" .... "PISS OFF!!" THAT CLIP SENT ME 😭😭💀💀

[@nightowl8477]

22:49 the BBC is publicly funded by tax, they can't justify taking risks. Given Touchwood was the most viewed show to air on BBC 3, it was hardly a risk to bump it up to BBC 2.

[@jvblhc]

I watched all four series, and Series 2 and Children of Earth were the definite standouts. Good overview of the series.

[@amaelboisson5439]

I've never seen Jack/Gwen/Rhys as a love triangle, to me when Jack sees Gwen and Rhys together it's just that he remembers he had what they have before, for a brief time in his long life, and he could never really have that since he's immortal. He's not in love with Gwen or attracted to her, he just envies her life outside of Torchwood, and more time passes more he sees Gwen like a friend/"daughter". And that's why Jack has trouble forming a relationship with Ianto And I think Gwen in season 1 already had a character arc, her fall into Hell working in Torchwood, I really love how she became unlikeable, I like really flawed characters like her and Rose, and I think it was done on purpose, it wouldn't have make sense to write her a redemption arc before the season 1 finale, they just waited for season 2 as planned, and it works perfectly. It's part of a big plan, like how the Doctor evolves through series 1 to 4 for example.

[@macra_]

Will the children of earth episode be one long review or 5 individual ones / split into multiple parts?

[@NoahIsCanned]

Been wondering that too.

[@1972LittleC]

and do we have to talk about miracle day afterwards? (Please say no)

[@nicolebee3283]

I think Harbo said a while ago it'd be one long video

[@nightowl8477]

@@nicolebee3283 - it was shot in one block, like a four hour movie, so one long video would be fitting.

[@icatz]

Your breakdowns are really great to watch and also thought provoking. Being a yank, I first saw TW on a plane to London, and a BBC episode (Adam) while I was there. I've since bought all available DVDs, which your vids are egging me to watch again for the Nth time. Thank you!

[@alim.9801]

YES ADAM IS ONE OF THE BEST EPISODES

[@alim.9801]

Martha is my favorite companion and I looooved seeing her in those episodes so much she is TOO DAMN UNDERRATED!!!!!!!!

[@etreacy]

Yesterday it was 10 years since Torchwood ended. Anybody notice? Maybe celebrate? Lol

[@thomasgladstone6531]

Harbo, you don't HAVE to do The Sarah Jane Adventures reviews, but I would be VERY disappointed if you didn't.

[@alim.9801]

Seconded!!!!

[@steveericson9137]

I miss Torchwood, man.... I wish Barrowman hadn't screwed up that potential revival. 😔

[@orangeapples]

I didn’t really follow Who news. What did he do?

[@nightowl8477]

@@orangeapples - unprofessional behaviour concerning bodily nudity on set over the years. Not malicious, just misjudged and kinda pathetic. Everyone's always known, even fans, but it's only now being dealt with. Better than nothing, I guess.

[@alim.9801]

@TheRealRogerEbert I definitely agree, not saying Barrowman shouldn't get any consequences but the two topics should not be conflated, that's not fair for anybody involved

[@knoober3756]

We still hard at work on Children Of Earth?

[@osku6025]

Love these torchwood reviews! 😆

[@lpc9929]

30:36 the the bacteria spiderman feces spinach floorboard. carpet Desk

[@wrightsalternativeuniverse2798]

Please will you do Children of Earth soon. I beg of you.

[@lotemylife3006]

Now I just have to wait for the Children of Earth Review :D

[@edwardhilton4344]

Please do a full series review of the Sarah Jane Adventures. Thank you. That is all.

[@Stephneechan]

Quill was the best character from Class. And i wanted to know what kind of a baby she would have! Like a baby of a bird alien creature disguised as a human, crossed with a shapeshifter... what would that end up looking like?

[@PathsUnwritten]

Gray, the walking sofa cushion.

[@DanTheMan2150AD]

Children of Earth bout to get dark son. We love to see it.

[@PathsUnwritten]

Meanwhile you've got a whole handful of contemporary Doctor Who companions that lived through the prolonged and global Miracle Day event and never been mentioned it.

[@BambiTrout]

Something Borrowed is what Passion of the Nerd would call a "candy" episode. It's an episode that's not particularly deep or complex, but it's just fun and silly and the perfect treat to break up a long string of dark and heavy episodes. They help avoid darkness-induced audience apathy - i.e. the audience getting too depressed or bored by the constant heavy topics so they stop watching. For the more sadistic showrunner, they also provide a great contrast to make the adjacent episodes hit harder. If you want to make a character death hit harder, do it immediately after an episode in which they had a really fun or happy time. Buffy made masterful use of this kind of candy episode, and both Moffat and RTD employed the same technique during their runs on Doctor Who - usually before the finale, but with a bit of a patchier success rate than Buffy (think Unicorn & the Wasp vs Love & Monsters - one is a glorious little sherbet lemon, while the other is a used bit of chewing gum stuck on a paving slab that looks a bit like Moaning Myrtle)

[@loturzelrestaurant]

As a Doctor-Who-Fan, you surerly watched Jay Exci and his 5 Hour Analysis-Essay, yeah?

[@BambiTrout]

@@loturzelrestaurant Of course. Why do you ask?

[@loturzelrestaurant]

@@BambiTrout Just because i like to have a picture just how many have watched it, if you know what i mean.

[@loturzelrestaurant]

@@BambiTrout On another note: I wanna convince some 50-Year old Father to let his 8-10 Year old Sons (2 of 'em) watch Doctor Who. What's your thoughts on that? You think its ok for that age? I wanna argue its designed as a Family-Show, but well...

[@BambiTrout]

@@loturzelrestaurant Ahhh ok. I'm assuming you probably know a lot of what I'm about to say, but I'll explain it as if to convince someone who doesn't :) From an age perspective, it's definitely appropriate for those ages. Doctor Who is mostly PG-rated. There's the odd episode where you'd possibly class it as a 12/PG-13 but it's mostly on a similar level to the Harry Potter movies. I personally started watching when I was 8-9. However I would definitely recommend them watching it with a parent at that age, as there will definitely be some episodes that they might need a hug or a check for monsters under the bed afterwards! A few key early examples would be The Empty Child/The Doctor Dances, The Impossible Planet/The Satan Pit, Blink, Midnight, and Silence in the Library/Forest of the Dead, as these are all quite intense and horror focused. I would recommend starting from series 1, not just from a story perspective, but because I personally think the early seasons are some of the best family TV out there with a good blend of action, drama, and fun, with some interesting monsters and great stories. I also like, and especially liked at the time, how it doesn't patronise the viewer, and explores some big themes and concepts while still keeping them accessible (something which I feel is lacking in the most recent seasons). This characteristic is also part of what makes it a "family" show, rather than just a "kids" show - it's still interesting and exciting for adults to watch and rewatch, without being too much of an "Ugh, we'll put the kids' programme on" It was a really important part of my childhood. It had great storylines, it was fun to watch, and features a lot of good role models, while also still treating people as people and allowing them to make mistakes and learn from them. Also just because this is on a Torchwood video, I will just mention the spin-offs. Torchwood = absolute hard no for kids - mid-teens at the earliest and even then, I would be careful with Children of Earth (S3) and Miracle Day (S4) as those are dark even by adult standards. Class is aimed mainly at teens but is generally viewed as skippable. The Sarah Jane Adventures on the other hand are excellent for kids and they can watch those without supervision with no issues. I hope this helps!

[@caitlin329]

'Fragments' is basically the Torchwood equivalent of Firefly's 'Out of Gas'. Both really good episodes for basically exposition.

[@alim.9801]

Yall don't hate me but I would KILL for a video on miracle day

[@saff3748]

nah same omg

[@paddymoloney746]

I would love to see on screen, The Doctor meeting Owen Harper and seeing The Doctor help him, not gonna lie

[@nightowl8477]

Series 1 has more of its own identity, where Series 2 has better quality episode to episode. Not my thing either way, but both are redeemable. It's only Children of Earth I find myself recommending to people, Who fans or otherwise.

[@Ben-vf5gk]

Same tho even with Children of Earth I feel like I have to know a person well before I can decide whether I recommend it

[@pundahandz7403]

I enjoy listening to these reviews, but what is the music between each part xD

[@Zauchi]

I actually like season 1, didn't know peeps hated it (lol) but did prefer season 2 and 3. Though imo going straight to season 2 would make it not as good as you need the first season to get to know the characters so you care more about them in season 2, as I had a similar thing with season 5 of Doctor Who being pretty poor but if I skipped it then I don't think I would have cared that much about the new doctor and companions in season 6, which would have been the season of me getting used to them and dulling down the 'dramatic' episodes.

[@magoo9866]

23:41 nup gotta redo the whole video over again lol

[@alim.9801]

Who was Grey's costume designer I just wanna talk

[@alim.9801]

Honestly I have a lot of mixed feelings about Tosh and Owen...like it didn't feel like a slow burn romance to me, more of unrequited love, am I the only one? Like the two got closer for sure but a slow burn to me means they both have feelings for each other and I feel like Owen didn't have any interest in Tosh romantically until at least Adam (and that doesn't even really count??). Idk man I have thoughts.

[@zephilagaming4331]

Harbo!!! When will you review SERIES 5!!??! Also there is a show called SArah Jane Adventures that i know you have reviewed an episode of but you should do the whole thing since its like Doctor Who idk but yeah also children of EArth is a good one so review it PLEASE!!

[@-haclong2366]

Patience is a virtue.

[@mjorkus]

:( waiting for the series 3 reviews.

[@TheToonMonkey]

Making the Michelin man the main villain was inspired.

[@rinmixx]

Children of Earth video before Eleventh Hour video please

[@HarboWholmes]

Children of Earth probably won't even be this year

[@rinmixx]

@@HarboWholmes but muh continuity

[@jeckjeck3119]

@@HarboWholmes (T-T)

[@alim.9801]

Adam, best episode besides children of earth imo 🤘🏻🤘🏻🤘🏻

[@phantom115cw]

Do you think Jack will ever forgive Rose for making him Immortal?

[@mattthesilent777RED]

SLEEPER IS GREAT! ACCEPT IT!

[@alim.9801]

Ok I found From Out of the Rain a fun episode and I like it and I refuse to apologize ok I know its bad but it's like fun goosebumps bad cmon!!!

[@user0237]

6:12

[@isabellaearnhardt6380]

💗

[@loturzelrestaurant]

As a Doctor-Who-Fan, you surerly watched Jay Exci and his 5 Hour Analysis-Essay, yeah?

[@skrowatcalag2774]

So chibnall…. Good?

[@alim.9801]

Who downvoted this I'm prepared to throw some hands

[@CashelOConnolly]

I thought both series were gay baiting. Showing Jack was more heterosexual with his love for Gwen and showing he didn’t really care about Ianto. Scyfy-horror is one of the worst genres for gay baiting its audiences,Supernatural and Buffy being 2 examples. They know the LGBTQI community will keep watching if there’s a chance they’ll see some representation of themselves on these shows but nope the heroes always turn out to be straight or bisexual with a strong preference to the opposite sex Peace and happiness from Dublin 🇮🇪🇪🇺🏳️‍🌈❤️

[@mrdr0161]

One of the reasons I don't like Jack and Ianto in series 1 and 2. In series 1, it just comes out of nowhere with no build up at all. Then in series 2, despite Jack asking Ianto out properly, he still flirts with Gwen all the time. And their relationship is treated like a literal running gag, unlike Rhys and Gwen, who are treated seriously and Owen and Tosh, Tosh and the soldier. Its just reinforcing the stereotypes that gay relationships are just sex

[@darynvoss7883]

"Non-Doctor Who fans" What???

[@loturzelrestaurant]

As a Doctor-Who-Fan, you surerly watched Jay Exci and his 5 Hour Analysis-Essay, yeah?

[@darynvoss7883]

@@loturzelrestaurant I sure did. I thought it was going to be a chore but I managed to get through it in two sessions, a very entertaining video, though I didn't agree with all of it.

[@loturzelrestaurant]

@@darynvoss7883 Nice.

[@johnanthonylucock7833]

I lost interest in Torchwood, when in the last but one episode. Jack Harkness revealed himself to be a coward, who took the identity of a dead hero. In the final episode he went up against Abadon. It was thanks to Gwen, Owen, Toshiko & Ianto that Abadon was unleashed onto the world. Season 2 episode 1 prologue. Torchwood (supposedly super secret) are in a vehicle at a pedestrian crossing. An old lady waiting to cross the road takes one look at them and says "Bloody Torchwood". As for Gwen, I couldn't stand her. She had a good man (Rhys) waiting at home for her. Yet she's catting around with Owen

[@lillimarq]

Polyamory is a thing. He can like Into and Gwen...

[@SethAurelius94]

No.

[@philipjamesarmstrong1364]

I really enjoyed both of the first couple of series, some of it was fluff, but they were mostly solid stories, but I HATED Children of Earth and couldn't even finish the final abomination!!

[@deeshm7319]

Worst idea. Martha Jones being brought into it. Terrible actress and character

[@deeshm7319]

Not lying. I firmly believe she was terrible.

[@deeshm7319]

I didn't like her in series 3 and thought she got worse amd worse.

[@deeshm7319]

I don't need to I have an opinion and it has never changed