How does Reformed theology view the future of Israel compared to dispensationalism?

[@irishchocolate3872]

I use to be an Arminian, Pentecostal dispensationalist. I am now a Reformed Baptist. I probably agree more with John MacArthur than anyone else even though R.C. Sproul has been my favorite teacher for a long time. My problem is when many Reformed brethren claim Dispensationalists teach two ways of salvation. One for the church and one for Israel. I went to an Arminian, dispensationalist Bible college and not once were we taught two ways of salvation. Jews still had to repent and trust in Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior. They don’t get to enter the Kingdom just by being ethnic Jews. So I don’t know why many reformed scholars insist dispensationalists are teaching a different way of salvation for Israel compared to the church. Dispensationalists do recognise a distinction between Israel and the church as far as eschatology is concerned and that there are certain promises made to Israel that can’t be fulfilled by the church.

[@SK-mz4cq]

I’ve found that post-mills are kind of a cult in their beliefs. Things are getting worse, not better. JMac is right on this and he has you tube videos on how reformed should believe in pre-millennial dispensation.

[@cooljams_jams]

Hey there. I had a highly similar background and conversion on these issues. I just want to point out that they don’t necessarily mean two ways of salvation available today. But that covenant theology differs from dispensationalism particularly of how Jews were saved before Christ. That’s usually not intentional by dispensationalists. Those who would say “Well, it’s really the same means of grace through the cross,” are borrowing from Covenant theology to say so. But consistent dispensationalism (more complicated than can be summed up concisely) must insist on a distinctive plan of salvation for ethnic Israel than Christian Gentiles.

[@sandragambrel9721]

There is only one way to God. By believing Jesus Christ is the One God sent to save us. Jesus isn't coming back until they ("the remnant") believe He is the Messiah as well. They have to be born again, too. Only one way of salvation, by grace through faith in Jesus, The Christ, not of works, praise God!!!

[@mariosangermano5709]

Some reformed brothers are mistaken about Dispensationalism. It does NOT teach 2 ways to salvation. Dispensationalism teaches one way by grace through faith and you must be born again. The main tenents of Dispensationalism is that the church is not Israel and the church does not get the blessings due Israel. The Abrahamic covenant was a unilateral covenant God made with Israel that had nothing to do with their obedience or disobedience. This covenant was also an eternal covenant. To believe Israel is the church is replacement theology and that is heresy. I agree 100% with John MacArthur on the premillenial view and Dispensationalism. Watch , " Why every Calvinist should be premillennial ". Its a 6 part sermon series by JM. Also the blessings and curses were in the Mosaic covenant and for the Jews only, and that covenant ended with the death of Jesus. Enter now the Dispensation of grace. The bible also talks about Dispensations. Romans chapter 11 is clear God has not forgot Israel or replaced them with the church.

[@toddstevens9667]

@@mariosangermano5709 Exactly. Very well put.

[@JSkeletonNintendo]

Half way through the video it’s suggested that it ends up being “two ways of Salvation.” I don’t see how it’s concluded that just because one believes Israel still has a place, that it means there’s 2 ways of Salvation. How were Israel saved in the first place? Surely not the blood of lambs or goats, as we are told that does not nor cannot save. So clearly it was pointing forward to the cross. Both Israel in the OT and the church in the NT are saved by ONE way of Salvation, ONE means of grace which is in the Lord Jesus Christ. So then, to believe that ethnic Israel still has a place as God promised them and as is repeated in Romans 11, is not to believe 2 means of Salvation at all. They will look upon the one whom they pierced and weep (Zechariah 12:10).

[@robmarshall956]

Are you a premillennialist ?

[@franksnow5165]

That, or Jesus isn't the only way to Heaven.

[@SpotterVideo]

Based on John 19:37, and Acts chapter 2, was Zechariah 12:10 fulfilled during the first century? ===================== Who is really teaching “Replacement Theology” ? (Did God fulfill His promises to the Jewish people at Calvary? Matthew 26:28, John 19:30) The advocates of modern Dispensational Theology often accuse others of promoting “Replacement Theology”, or some may even say “Antisemitism”. What does the Bible say about their accusations? 1. Who is replacing Christ as the seed of Abraham through which all the families of the Earth would be blessed in Genesis 12:3, with Abraham’s modern descendants? (See Galatians 3:8) 2. Who is replacing the one people of God in John 10:16, with two peoples of God ? 3. Who is replacing the one seed (Christ) in Galatians 3:16, with the many seeds? 4. Who is replacing the children of the promise in Romans 9:8, with the children of the flesh? 5. Who is replacing the faithful “remnant” of Israelites in Romans 11:1-5, with the Baal worshipers? 6. Who is replacing the word "so" in Romans 11:26, with the word "then"? 7. Who is attempting to replace the Church made up of all races of people, with one made up only of Gentiles? Why did Peter address the crowd as “all the house of Israel” in Acts 2:36, when about 3,000 Israelites accepted Christ on the Day of Pentecost? 8. Based on Hebrews 9:15, the New Covenant cannot be separated from the Messiah’s death. Is the covenant in Daniel 9:27 connected to the Messiah’s death in Daniel 9:26. Is the covenant with the “many” in Daniel 9:27 the same covenant with the “many” in Matthew 26:28? If it is, some have replaced the New Covenant in Daniel 9:27 with a future covenant made by an antichrist not found in Daniel chapter 9. (See the 1599 Geneva Bible used by the Pilgrims.) 9. Those promoting the Two Peoples of God doctrine of Dispensational Theology often accuse others of teaching “Replacement Theology”, but are they the masters of it? Are they promoting a form of Dual Covenant Theology based on race? (See “genealogies” in Titus 3:9) Is the most important genealogy in the Bible found in Matthew 1:1? Is God's Son the ultimate fulfillment of Israel? Why has the modern Church done a pitiful job of sharing the Gospel with modern Orthodox Jews? Why would someone tell them they are God's chosen people and then fail to share the Gospel with them? Who is the seed of the woman promised in Genesis 3:15? Who is the "son" in Psalm 2? Who is the "suffering servant" of Isaiah 53? Who would fulfill the New Covenant promised in Jeremiah 31:31-34? Who would fulfill the timeline of Daniel chapter 9 before the second temple was destroyed? Why have we not heard this simple Old Testament Gospel preached on Christian television in the United States on a regular basis? 10. Watch the KZbin video “Genesis of Dispensational Theology” to see the origin of this man-made doctrine, which is less than 200 years old. It was brought to the United States about the time of the Civil War by John Nelson Darby. The doctrine was later incorporated into the notes of the Scofield Reference Bible, and then spread through much of the modern Church. Dallas Theological Seminary in Dallas Texas was created in part to promote John Darby’s Two Peoples of God doctrine of Dispensational Theology. Lewis Sperry Chafer, the first president of Dallas Theological, had the following to say about the difference between Israel and the Church: “The dispensationalist believes that throughout the ages God is pursuing two distinct purposes: one related to the earth with earthly people and earthly objectives involved which is Judaism; while the other is related to heaven with heavenly people and heavenly objectives involved, which is Christianity.” Lewis Sperry Chafer, Dispensationalism (Dallas, Seminary Press, 1936), p. 107. Chafer states that, ‘Israel is an eternal nation, heir to an eternal land, with an eternal kingdom, on which David rules from an eternal throne,’ that is, on earth and distinct from the church who will be in heaven.” Lewis Sperry Chafer. Systematic Theology. 1975. Vol. IV. pp. 315-323. John Walvoord, another prominent voice of Dallas Theological stated… "...it is an article of normative dispensational belief that the boundaries of the land promised to Abraham and his descendants from the Nile to the Euphrates will be literally instituted and that Jesus Christ will return to a literal and theocratic Jewish kingdom centred on a rebuilt temple in Jerusalem. In such a scheme the Church on earth is relegated to the status of a parenthesis.” John F. Walvoord, The Rapture Question.1979, p. 25 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Are there two peoples of God in John 10:16? (See also 1 John 2:22-23, 2 John 1:7-11.) What is the land promise to the Old Testament Saints in Hebrews 11:15-16? Based on 2 Peter 3:10-13, is this earth “eternal”? Will it be replaced by a new earth? Based on Acts 2:36, and Romans 9:6-8, and Romans 11:1-5, and Hebrews 12:22-24, and James 1:1-3, can faithful Israel and the Church be separated into two different groups? Who is the New Covenant promised to in Jeremiah 31:31-34, and Hebrews 8:6-13? Will modern Orthodox Jews ever be saved outside of the New Covenant Church?

[@KARMICHAEL11]

The issue intrinsic to the Disp. Premil. approach to the “church” is that it is parenthetical and excludes Jews. There’s no overlap in this system, and thus Grace is administered differently by nature of how far we are along the prophetic clock, which according to DP, has been paused while the Jews are still in exile, and will resume again after the gentle church is raptured. Hopefully the red flags are flying by now…

[@seniorscientist590]

@@KARMICHAEL11 That's ridiculous. Dispensationalism teaches no such thing. Not even worth time correcting your straw man fallacy. Be ignorant. You're the one missing out in the understanding of God's word, I assure you. But, you'll never know. Ha!

[@emmanuelndakah2864]

When Christian's began to talk about Israel in theological sense, the question I ask myself is who is Israel? Is a piece of land in palastine? Or the spiritual descendant of Abraham (Jews and gentiles) through faith in Christ Jesus.

[@ltcajh]

We were grafted into physical descendants of Abraham. Ro. 11, "do not be arrogant toward the branches. If you are, remember it is not you who support the root, but the root that supports you." Also, "aA partial hardening has come upon Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in." Paul speaks of himself and the physical descendants of Israel.

[@emmanuelndakah2864]

@@ltcajh not the children of the flesh but rather the children of promise whose hope is not earthly Jerusalem but heavenly.

[@ltcajh]

@@emmanuelndakah2864 It is both.

[@emmanuelndakah2864]

@@ltcajh no is not. The true seed of Abraham is spiritual. Physical Israel does not exist anymore. It's over.

[@toddstevens9667]

@@emmanuelndakah2864 No it’s not. You need to refamiliarize yourself with Romans 9-11. Your perspective makes a complete hash of Romans 11. It’s virtually unintelligible from your perspective. Read Romans 11:26-29. The physical nation is beloved for the fathers’ sake. Israel still exists as a category in God’s mind. At some point in the future, all of physical Israel will be saved and become a part of spiritual Israel.

[@GeorgeJosephFamily]

This is an important issue, particularly in the light of recent events. I see a blind spot in the Covenant/Reformed understanding of the Jews and Israel. This question of Israel does not have to deal with Salvation, but with covenants to Abraham and later through the many prophets - Israel has a special role in God's plans, and He cannot abandon Israel, just as He is faithful to promises to the Church in relation to Salvation. However, promises to Israel has to do with their existence and Eschatology - It is Both/And for Israel and the Church; not a simple logic but a multi-dimensional view, just as required when we try to understand the Trinitarian doctrine.

[@georgianadarcy9072]

Jesus, who is God,and who was preaching the gospel of the kingdom of heaven, told Israel that the kingdom would be taken from them and given to others more deserving. All the blessings and prophecies are conditional because God's kingdom has a law given by Jesus (if you obey me...), who is the Creator. He had one plan, not plan B or C. Israel was God's people chosen to fulfill a mission, to show the light to the world, but they failed, furthermore they killed the Son of God and cursed themselves saying His blood to fall over them and over their children. All the prophecies shouted or written by prophets would've been fulfilled if Israel had obeyed God, but they chose not to. They have had the scripures in their hands for more than 3000 years and interpreted them in a wrong and arrogant way. Jesus told them the parable of the vinyard and of the wicked servants and later said to the Jewish leaders that they had the devil as their father. So today, some evangelicals want to force God's hand so that some prophecies might be fulfilled according to their unbiblical ways.They even want Russia , China, Iran to go at war against the state of Israel- which is no more the Biblical Israel, the same way other ancient "states" are no more in their initial territories - and believe that the church would ne raptured secretly, therefore they would be saved from tribulations. Illogical things come from a literal simplist hermeneutics.

[@dimedropper]

@@georgianadarcy9072ok so you basically just ignored Romans 9-11. Gotcha

[@Objectivetruth9122]

@@georgianadarcy9072which scripture are you referring to when you say “ Jesus told isreal the kingdom would be taken from them ?

[@georgianadarcy9072]

@@Objectivetruth9122 Matthew 21: 43; Mathew 8: 12

[@Objectivetruth9122]

@ thank you!

[@OldMovieRob]

Dr. Nichols makes the point that its just about reading the Bible, and that's the very reason I struggle to make sense of the Reformed amil position, namely as you work through reading Isaiah and over and over and over again read specific promises to Israel that are challenging to spiritualize: rebuilding of Jerusalem, working the land, men living to being over 100, infants not dying and so on. What era is this talking about, and when did it happen?

[@izaakdejager5064]

Well the rebuilding of Jerusalem is an easy one, it occurred under Ezra/Nehemiah. Which specific reference are you referring to?

[@jaquirox6579]

I think… I recall reading about each of those in scriptures following that book. Jerusalem was rebuilt, and there are a few instances that demonstrated the other things. Like the babies being saved from being murdered by the midwives. I’m not a great chapter and verse quoter, I’m sorry for that, but I just recall reading about those things happening bit by bit. I’m sure a much more eloquent person could quote them exactly for you.

[@kb27787]

Well, as these very same verses are spoken of the NT, just go with what the Apostles say. But really Isaiah hardly stands in a vacuum--the other prophets say the same thing--many of which are very clearly spiritual. You can hardly argue for the temple and the rebuilt city in Eze ch 40 onwards to be literal--and definitely not the one Zerubabbel built; especially the part about the healing waters and the trees of life and the fish from the ocean coming to live in the once salt sea and fishermen standing on the banks catching fish with nets (actually it makes complete sense to argue for the identity of the rebuilt city to be the Gospel age Church)! And whatever the rebuilt city is, it certainly isn't 1948 as people like to claim. The contradictions are glaringly obvious between what is described and what happened in reality.

[@OldMovieRob]

@@izaakdejager5064 Isaiah 61:4 "They will rebuild the ancient ruins and restore the places long devastated; they will renew the ruined cities that have been devastated for generations." When were these ruined cities destroyed, and what cities is this speaking of?

[@kb27787]

@RT God forbid you think the Lord has literally seven horns and seven eyes and is a member of the ovine family! Clearly Genesis and Revelation are different genres and should be treated as such!

[@urbanreformedpodcast7]

Actually while Calvin saw "All Israel" as all the elect throughout history or the Church, Calvin did indeed affirm a future salvation of ethnic Israel. I suggest reading Calvin's commentary on Romans 11. Dr. Sproul also included Calvin in this camp when he was asked. There is much confusion and conflation on this and this topic has been neglected these days.

[@ccchhhrrriiisss100]

I have read the Bible from cover-to-cover at least 40 times since becoming a Christian. I wasn't really raised in a "church" either (whereby I missed having some sort of coercive influence from denominations, different schools of thoughts, etc.). So, by the time I learned words like "dispensationalism" and "reformed," I really was at a good point to critique those concepts and terms by what I had known and read via Scripture (sans preexisting biases) than many other believers that I knew. What I read from Scriptures -- starting with the Old Testament -- was a lineage between Adam and Abraham whereby human beings began to lose their faith in God. It resulted in a worldwide flood followed by a God-ordained confusion at Babel. After this, people generally clamored for whatever "road" they fancied. By the time of Job, Abraham, etc., those who followed the one true living God were fewer in number. Yet, Abram was one of those. Abraham BELIEVED God -- and this was credited to him as righteousness. So, God made a covenant with Abram (now "Abraham") and his promised descendants. He promised him both descendants that would be MANY NATIONS and a specific portion of land on the Earth flowing with milk and honey. This covenant existed more than 400 years before the Covenant Law of Moses. The seed of Abraham was exiled in Egypt and rescued when the fullness of God's purpose had come. A Covenant Law was given to the people who were a part of this covenant. Over hundred and even thousands of years, the seed of Abraham often meandered from this covenant. The promised land suffered (physically) as a result. The people suffered both physically AND spiritually. Ultimately, the elect were carried off into captivity. So, they went from captivity in Egypt to captivity in Assyria, Babylon and, later, Persia. A remnant was returned (*as prophesied) to the land that was promised to them. They rebuilt the city and Temple. A 12-year-old Jesus later referred to subsequent rebuilding of this Temple as "my Father's House." This house was commissioned by a gentile unbeliever (i.e., Herod's Temple). Yet, the land was chosen by God. Two altars were built on that site. It was the very place where Abraham was told to sacrifice Isaac (Mt. Moriah) and where David would later purchase and build an altar following judgment from having commissioned a census of the nation of Israel. Mention of that altar is historical too. It is likely the very "altar of David" mentioned in the Moabite Stone. Yet, many of those people had taken their eyes off the Covenant as they were essentially held captive in their own land by the Romans. A few years later, God sent "Elijah" (i.e., John the Baptist) to "prepare the way" before the ministry of the Messiah. The people of the covenant expected a conquering king who would "restore the kingdom of Israel" and rule from Jerusalem. Yet, they received a humble God-in-the-flesh manifestation of love -- God providing his only begotten Son as the sacrifice for atonement. Jesus was God incarnate -- the physical, human manifestation of God born as a man. He walked through that promised land and explained the true kingdom of God. Yet, even his disciples still misunderstood when and how his kingdom would come. When he died, they were seemingly confused by it all. In Luke and in Acts, we read how the disciples -- before and after Jesus died -- expected that the KINGDOM OF ISRAEL would be restored (see Acts 1:6). Jesus answered, "It is not for you to know times or seasons that the Father has fixed by his own authority" -- meaning that God has "fixed" this to happen in his own time. After reading through the Scriptures (and Romans), it is clear that God is not finished with the physical seed of Abraham. Everything in Scripture was centered around this covenant that God made with Abraham. While we are free from that law, the physical seed of Abraham is still participants in that everlasting covenant. In fact, the very passage about the "gifts and call of God are irrevocable" isn't referring to salvation but (in context) the physical seed of Abraham. Paul is clear that "all of Israel will be saved" -- further stating that it would happen (future tense) in a single day.

[@williamcarr3976]

“No man comes to the father but by me”

[@milesrupert4815]

I'm guessing you got held up on romans 11:25? If jews do not repent for the bloodshed of Jesus then there is no salvation for them. They said, "No King But Ceaser. May His blood be on our hands and our children's".

[@ccchhhrrriiisss100]

@@williamcarr3976 - I don't disagree with this. You must believe in Jesus Christ to be saved.

[@ccchhhrrriiisss100]

@@milesrupert4815 - I'm not sure what you mean. EVERYONE must believe in Jesus -- including the Jews and the Gentiles. The covenant between God and Abraham was one of FAITH (as it says in Genesis and in Romans). That covenant predated the Law of Moses by more than 400 years. However, the covenant wasn't a promise of salvation. It was a covenant that Abraham would be the "father of many nations" (i.e., Jews and Gentiles) and that his descendants were promised this land (of which so many wars have been fault). As we learned in the Exodus account, even the Hebrews needed the blood of the lamb over their doorposts during that first Passover. They needed to believe no matter what. Yet, since many did not and fell into idolatry, they never entered that "promised land." Long afterward (and also due to idolatry), they were plunged into captivity AGAIN. This time they went east rather than west. It didn't matter that they were electively selected to, as a whole, be "chosen by God." The soul who sins will die. So, you must believe and live your confessed faith in Christ.

[@seabiscuit6776]

All Isreal is used 150 times in the Old Testament. It is used once in the new. It refers to the covenant people of God. You could be an Israelite and not be of the seed of abram. All Isreal will be saved. All those under the covenant of Christ alone.

[@lawrencestanley8989]

At 2:14, he said, *"this two peoples of God and it ends up being two ways of salvation..."* While some individuals have no doubt asserted this, it is nonetheless not a view of Dispensationalism, and for demonstration of this point, I would direct this panel to read MacArthur and Mayhue's "Christ's Prophetic Plans," as well as Michael Vlach's "Dispensationalism, Essential Beliefs and Common Myths." Charles Ryrie's "Dispensationalism Today" has an entire chapter on Salvation where he primarily speaks against this myth of multiple ways of salvation. Dispensationalism is primarily concerned with the doctrines ecclesiology and eschatology. But it does not promote a specific soteriology. The charge of Dispensationalism teaching multiple ways of salvation arises with the regularity of a dripping faucet, but one would think that this particular panel would not go down that same path and misrepresent Dispensationalism as they have done. Frankly, I am appalled.

[@SK-mz4cq]

I’m reading MacArthur’s book now and it’s great. Unfortunately it’s him, Phil Robertson, and Steven Lawson are the only major reformed theologians right on this issue. It seems that the a-mill and post-mill people like to ignore facts to support their false doctrine

[@lawrencestanley8989]

@@SK-mz4cq Thank you... It's nice to hear I'm not the only one thinking that. Futuristic Premillennialism and understanding that there is a future eschatological role for Israel is the only way of dealing honestly with the text. For instance, in Matthew 19:28, 25:31, Jesus says that He will assume His glorious Davidic throne at the time of His second coming. This is very significant. Jesus explicitly ties His Davidic throne reign with His second coming to earth and not before. This shows that Jesus’ kingdom is future from our standpoint. The kingdom comes when Jesus comes again. This truth makes amillennialism and postmillennialism impossible since these positions assert that Jesus is now reigning from the Davidic throne in His millennial kingdom in this age.

[@SK-mz4cq]

@@lawrencestanley8989 Yep. Also the post-mills think that Christ returned again in 70 A.D. and Revelation was written in 65 A.D. 🤣 Absolutely ridiculous.

[@sandragambrel9721]

I'm a dispensationalist and I know there is only one way. Ye must be born again. He told Nicodemus this. There is only one way of salvation and that is through faith in Jesus Christ. For Jews and Gentiles. Jesus doesn't return till they, the remnant, believe Jesus is their Messiah, the King of Kings, and Lord of Lords, amen!

[@mariosangermano5709]

​@@lawrencestanley8989 you are correct and I would add the Abrahamic covenant also spells out a premillennial dispensational interpretation of eschatology.

[@HeavyHeartsShow]

“For I do not want you, brethren, to be uninformed of this mystery-so that you will not be wise in your own estimation-that a partial hardening has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in; and so all Israel will be saved; just as it is written, “The Deliverer will come from Zion, He will remove ungodliness from Jacob.” “This is My covenant with them, When I take away their sins.” From the standpoint of the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but from the standpoint of God’s choice they are beloved for the sake of the fathers; for the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable. For just as you once were disobedient to God, but now have been shown mercy because of their disobedience, so these also now have been disobedient, that because of the mercy shown to you they also may now be shown mercy. For God has shut up all in disobedience so that He may show mercy to all. Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are His judgments and unfathomable His ways! For who has known the mind of the Lord, or who became His counselor? Or who has first given to Him that it might be paid back to him again? For from Him and through Him and to Him are all things. To Him be the glory forever. Amen.” ‭‭Romans‬ ‭11:25-36‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

[@bethoumyvision6946]

PRECISELY!! I don't know any way it could be said clearer. Suffice it to say, blindness can come upon both Israel and the church.

[@robmarshall956]

@@bethoumyvision6946 what do you mean by precisely??

[@bethoumyvision6946]

@@robmarshall956 Supportive of what 'Heavy hearts show' has posted. The Scriptures do speak for themselves. Blindness has come upon Israel for a time; they do not acknowledge their error of rejecting Jesus Christ as their Messiah. Those who practice Judaism are still waiting for Him. Christians can be just as guilty waiting for a false Messiah of their own imagination instead of reading what the Scriptures say about His return.

[@robmarshall956]

@@bethoumyvision6946 so does that leave you with a pre post or A mill precision in your view ?

[@bethoumyvision6946]

@@robmarshall956 I believe the feasts clearly point to pre-tribulation rapture of Christs bride as it is the next feast in sequencial order, the feast of Trumpets. Then the day of atonenment followed by His kingdom on earth, which aligns with Tabernacles.

[@jjreddog571]

It is now a year later and as much as I love to listen to these men and I do trust their teaching, we are seeing how God Himself is making Israel the "Burdensome Stone" from Zec Chapter 12. I still think God has a special plan for the Jewish people and will un-vale it more in the days ahead. The God who watches over Israel never slumbers or sleeps, we have not reached the end of never. It will be very interesting up ahead, I also like reading my new subscription of Table Talk. Blessings from WA ST

[@davidf6117]

I’m with you on this. Throughout biblical history and also into modern times, there has been and continues to be an unseen war going on. Anti-semitism seems to be growing and Satan is still determined to destroy the Jews and Israel. Why would he bother if God is done with Israel? Thankfully there are some reformed/covenant theologians who have either a different or more open view. I know this clip was before recent events but I find it puzzling that people who hold to this view seem to completely disregard what’s going on in the world.

[@Martha77]

“I do not want you to be ignorant of this mystery, brothers and sisters, so that you may not be conceited: Israel has experienced a hardening in part until the full number of the Gentiles has come in, and in this way all Israel will be saved. As it is written: “The deliverer will come from Zion; he will turn godlessness away from Jacob. As far as the gospel is concerned, they are enemies for your sake; but as far as election is concerned, they are loved on account of the patriarchs, for God’s gifts and his call are irrevocable.” ‭‭Romans‬ ‭11:25-26, 28-29‬ ‭ Very clear that there is a hardening until a particular time, and “all Israel will be saved” has to mean those who are elect. Clearly not every Jew will be saved, the Bible consistently speaks of a remnant.

[@tompreacher6274]

You got it right Martha.

[@uncasunga1800]

The remnant is the elect.

[@junk3996]

yup there is always a promised remnant. right now "Israel" is still in exile for their wicked ways. their exile will end 1960 years after it started, when they rebuild the temple. and from those who adhere to the old ways, the only way they know how to reconcile back to God, the promised remnant will "come out of her", which will be the 144,000. that is who the promised remnant is, sealed with the seal of God, who will flee into the mountains of Judea to be taken care of for a times time and half a time.

[@uncasunga1800]

@@ThxGod_ItsOver who is going to quit their job and read your rants 😆

[@ThxGod_ItsOver]

@@uncasunga1800 who is going to quit their job and read your rants 😆WAKE UP SATANIST NOT RECRUITING WHY? JOHN 10:26-27KJV! - 26But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you. 27My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: NOW YOU KNOW WHY YOU HEAR NOTHING BUT YOUR FATHER SATAN JOHN 8:44KJV! LAY DOWN LASSY! YOU ARE NOT EVEN RELEVANT TO THE EXISTANCE OF CHILDREN OF GOD! 1 JOHN 3:10KJV! LATER DEVIL!

[@ccchhhrrriiisss100]

There is absolutely NO DOUBT that Romans 11 is referring to ethnic Jews -- physical Israel. It's clear in the very context. Anyone who thinks or has been taught otherwise simply needs to read Romans 11 (the entire chapter) aloud. As Peter said to the Jews in Acts 3 (who he was telling to repent and believe in Jesus), "You are the sons of the prophets and of the covenant that God made with your fathers, saying to Abraham, ‘And in your offspring shall all the families of the earth be blessed.’ God, having raised up his servant, sent him to you first, to bless you by turning every one of you from your wickedness" (Acts 3:25-26 ESV). Thus, there is no distinction when it comes to salvation. In the old covenant, it was by grace through FAITH (i.e., "Abram believed God and it was credited to him as righteousness"). In this new covenant, it is by faith too -- but in Jesus Christ. Every message of salvation preached by Jesus and the apostles until Cornelius (after Peter's vision of the sheet from Heaven) was directed to physical Israel (i.e., Jews). That is a period of between 8-10 years (given the timetable mentioned in Acts correlated with Galatians). So, from the Day of Pentecost in Acts 2 through the death of James, Stephen, conversion of Paul and, finally, Peter's realization via the vision and meeting with Cornelius, the Gospel was only presented to physical Israel. However, the original covenant with Abraham -- the one that predates the covenant law of Moses by 430 years -- included a promise of a people and land. It doesn't have to be "either/or." While Jews still need faith in Jesus to be saved, the covenant is still valid regarding the inheritance of this land. They play a crucial role in eschatology after the "fullness of the Gentiles has come in."

[@laever1804]

I just replied to you on another comment. I think you and I are very much alike. Let the Scripture tell us what it means. Half of the labels, I have had to look up to know whether I agree that is what the Scripture teaches.😁 I wonder what the apostles would think, if they sat through denominational debates.🤔

[@mosesking2923]

and yet in Hebrews 11, the hall of faith passage makes it clear that Abraham was not seeking an earthly land but a heavenly one above. The land was simply a metaphor for heaven, not physical land on Earth. This is the interpretation of Hebrews and subsequently the interpretation by all the church fathers.

[@ccchhhrrriiisss100]

@@mosesking2923 Actually, it clearly states that Abraham -- who LEFT one land to dwell and live in the land that was promised to him -- was looking for a CITY whose builder and maker was God. He foresaw a new Jerusalem -- the One in which God would build. This is a type and shadow -- earthly and spiritual -- and both have substance.

[@samluke8121]

You have started with a non-starter. Define an ethnic Jew.

[@ccchhhrrriiisss100]

@@samluke8121 - An ethnic Jew is someone who is a physical Jew -- someone who is a physical descendant of Abraham.

[@rickderwent]

Though I generally am grateful for coming to a Reformed understanding of scripture, it has been a most shameful experience watching very earnest Covenant preachers and evangelists respond so blindly, harshly and dismissingly of our Jewish family. I love how caring, balanced and supportive John MacArthur is towards God's most hated, persecuted and displaced people on earth. I still believe Jesus Christ still has eternal purposes for the nation of Israel. (Romans 12). I love the discussion and you gentlemen.

[@bernhardbauer5301]

@@rickderwent Romans 12 ???

[@alangalloway8700]

Should be Romans 11.

[@cue_khb]

Ethnicity simply matters nothing at all. In Christ is our identity reckoned.

[@demsyciu]

Acts 1:6-7 "When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time RESTORE AGAIN THE KINGDOM TO ISRAEL? And he said unto them, It is not for you to know THE TIMES OR THE SEASONS, which the Father hath put in his own power." So yeah the apostles asked Jesus about RESTORING.. Restoring what? THE KINGDOM which is refers earthly kingdom.. To who? TO ISRAEL

[@2timothy23]

I side more with John MacArthur here when it comes to this topic. You don't have to be a full-fledge dispensationalist to read the Old Testament and see there are future promises made to Israel. I believe it is a stretch to take all those promises and say that it is fulfilled in the church age. Romans 11:11-32 seems to tell us that there is a future salvation for ethnic Israel (just based on the language/context) of these verses. And this question of Israel seeps into the theology of the Millennial as well because Revelation 20:1-9 has to be interpreted through an amillennial or post-millennial grid that is difficult for me to grasp. To be honest, I haven't heard anyone preach verse by verse through those texts and explain how the grammar and symbolism reflects the amil and post-mil view. I'm certainly not as learned as these brothers in the video, but I am reading/studying my Bible (2 Timothy 2:15).

[@SK-mz4cq]

JMac is great. Anyone with a decent understanding of the Bible knows that Israel has some sort of future. The post-mills also change the date of when Revelation was written and think Christ also returned in 70 A.D. 🤣

[@robmarshall956]

I’d read Sam storms book kingdom come for a lengthy response to all these questions, it really does outline the post pre and a mill situation thoroughly and go into lengthy detail on replacement theology, dispensationalism, promises of Israel’s restoration and the book of revelation and biblical eschatology. Well worth a read, it’s 600 or so pages so takes a while to digest.

[@robmarshall956]

@Solus Christus haven’t read that yet will check it out.

[@toddstevens9667]

@Solus Christus How exactly do we know that it’s all symbolism and doesn’t mean what it says? Is there a verse in Revelation that specifically says that? Or is that just an opinion?

[@JP-kg3ko]

Voddie Baucham does a very decent review of The Revelation which explains the traditional amillennial point of view and it makes perfect sense.

[@Jeremyb2023]

I follow dispensationism... I don't know anybody who teaches that there are two ways of salvation. Sorry, but it's hard to listen to someone who is presenting dispensationism with that kind of straw man attack. To be clear, there are only "two peoples of God" in the sense that there is national Israel according to the old covenant and the body of Christ according to the new covenant. Clearly, both jews and gentiles are of the body of Christ. But God still has a purpose for national Israel and that is clear in the NT. Nobody is claiming that they are saved in any other way. *Correction - I accidentally wrote "all jews and gentiles are of the body of Christ." I meant "both" not "all."

[@Brayguanzo]

I agree. I remember being younger and hearing that baptists were wrong because they believe "once saved, always saved" and that calvinists are wrong because they believe "God already knows who is going to heaven and hell so there is no free will". Those are stereotypes, and just not true, at all. So much damage is done by telling people what other people believe.. as though you know for a fact. There are so many different degrees of dispensationalism as well. But anyways, agree that it's painful to listen to people explain your views incorrectly. Maybe there are dispensationalists that believe what he said, but most do not.

[@LMBBA90]

You really believe that all jews are the body of Christ? Have you ever read the gospels?

[@Jeremyb2023]

@@LMBBA90I was wondering where in the world you got that... then I realized that I made a mistake. I didn't intend to say "all jews and gentiles" but rather "both jews and gentiles." So to be clear, I was intending to say that the Jewish nation was the people of God according to the old covenant. The church is the people of God according to the new covenant and it is composed of both jews and gentiles.

[@willya6690]

I didn’t understand anything. What was the answer?

[@victorrene3852]

I love reformed teachers, on this issue I agree with John MacArthur

[@1lebero]

I agree more with John MacArthur on a lot of eschatology than my fellow reformed bretheren . A lot of us as reformed are extremely confusing in explaining the end times

[@reformedwretch2071]

It's one thing that reformed theology didn't reform. They basically stuck with the Roman Catholic eschatology

[@1lebero]

@@reformedwretch2071 Basically just old Roman Catholic teaching of Jesus coming back a second time and that's it. Unfortunately our reformed eschatology is a nothing burger. But we shine on other doctrines.

[@AmazingGrace1729]

Same here.

[@geraldpolmateer3255]

Would you contend that Jesus will return and then seven years later return again?

[@reformedwretch2071]

@@geraldpolmateer3255 Nobody believes that. If the rapture happens to be before the tribulation, it would be "stage" of the Second Coming, much like the First Coming was comprised of 33+ years. Would it be so strange if the second was comprised of 7+ years? What you say is a strawman. No one believes Christ comes 3 times.

[@alanhaskins7688]

The Lord Jesus Christ said there would be one shepherd and one flock and I am content with that. In the fulfillment of the types and shadows and wonderful promises contained in the Old Testament scriptures, the one people of God emerges. New testament saints are fellow heirs with their old testament brothers and sisters and we are all one in Christ Jesus our Lord and Saviour.

[@davidstockeland8648]

When I saw the title of the video I watched it because I wanted to learn more about the differences between the two. When one of you say that the dispensationalists have two ways of salvation with out giving any example or explanation and then say reading the Bible with a dispensational viewpoint is dangerous, again, without giving any example or explanation, you come across as not being truthful. Those two comments would make me want to lean toward the other side...whatever other side you are talking about...just because you are seeming to hide something you do not want to explain. I did not learn much from this video. I would like to see you do one where you explain both of the statements you made that had nothing to back them up. That would be a help.

[@AmazingGrace1729]

They must realize spiritual Israel is different from physical Israel. How can you explain Romans chapters 9-11 then? Israel was and will always be the only covenant nation of God. I don’t believe ỉn replacement theology since i can read my bible very well.

[@AmazingGrace1729]

@@matthewsouthwell3500 dear, the New covenant is the replacement of Mosaic Law which is the sacrificial system. Read the book of Hebrews, especially chapters 9 and 10. Our salvation is through the finished works of Jesus on the cross. But Abrahamic covenant still exists.

[@AmazingGrace1729]

@@matthewsouthwell3500 you can read the Abrahamic Covenant in Genesis 12. And God repeated it multiple times. Regarding 1 Peter 2 and Ephesians 2 just listen to Pastor John’s sermon. I’m not an English speaking so my vocabulary is limited. I can understand english pretty well but having difficulty when it comes in writing. To be safe just listen to Pastor John. God bless you🙏🏻

[@jessedhakal5406]

So basically they answer a lot but dont actually answer the question. What does Reformed Theology have for Israel?

[@gezefreitas]

If Ezequiel 36 is not talking about the conversion of a broad ethical Israel I don't know what it is, how about Jeremiah 31 especially from verse 31 and forward, "I (God) will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and the house of Judah". The problem with Covenant and Replacement theologians is that they see a text and they try to spiritualize it to say what they want it to say. Basically, it ends like this, (the text says this, but it doesn't mean what it says). Another problem is, instead of going through the Bible to get their answers they go to tradition and history, it doesn't matter Calvin's position on this matter, between Calvin (and I'm a Calvinist) and the Scriptures I stick to the Scriptures. Tô says that we don't have any prophecy about a worldwide conversion of Israel to act in bad faith or not to know how to read, or they are so brainwashed that they can't see how the Scriptures make it clear. How about the New Testament, do we have anything on this matter? Yes, it does, the apostle Paul says "And all Israel will be saved", so, let's be honest theologians, and stop twisting the Scriptures. I didn't even mention when God says, "I established the sun and the moon and the stars, and the universe order, only if this order vanishes I will forget my covenant with Israel ". For those watching this video I say, please read the Bible, look and see what Jeremiah 31:36 and forward say about this matter, and for those who will try to say that Israel in this text is not Israel please explain what is Judah because it says Israel and Judah, any first-year seminary student knows that this language is about the divided kingdom of Israel, it means that God will bring to Himself not only Israel (northern kingdom) but also Judah (southern kingdom), (Benjamin and Judah) in this case. It is what the apostle Paul was talking about, all Israel will be saved, people from all the tribes will be saved, a worldwide conversion of Israelites.

[@beerobb8220]

Would anyone like to exposit on the views of Amir Tsarfati? I like his teachings on Israel and the church very much and find them to be simply what the Scriptures teach. But I don’t see anyone in any other “camps” commenting on him or his teachings. Thanks in advance.

[@tompreacher6274]

He has it right on Israel's future

[@melissab7777]

If you like Amir you would love reading Dr. Arnold Fruchenbaum and Dr. Richard Hill. You can find their materials at ariel ministries. Pastor Brandon Holthaus is also really great. God bless.

[@alangalloway8700]

@@melissab7777Good advice. I just found Dr Fruchtenbaum and have begun learning under his teaching. He is very detailed and thorough, and has a great sense of humor too!

[@alangalloway8700]

Amir has it right!

[@jgeph2.4]

He’s a dispensationalist

[@alanmunch5779]

Did I hear it right? One speaker said that only the NT epistles are important, and the gospels and rest of the Bible are of much less importance. That’s astounding error. Jesus and the apostles clearly accepted the whole Old Testament as fundamentally important, and Jesus said none of the Law and Prophets would pass away… i.e. the Old Testament. I thought these guys believe that all Scripture is God-breathed, etc.

[@willielee5253]

@Alan Munch, erroneous ownership, that's a large footprint with no crown. That's like milk and honey without the cow and the bees. God bless you us on our journey!!!

[@brianevans6328]

He's referring to the beliefs of certain dispensationalists.

[@schaferbam]

That's what I heard... Andy Stanley theology. What happened to "all Scripture is inspired of God"? I love the epistles and certainly Paul gives great church instruction, but we never minimize the teaching of the Old Testament nor the Gospels (the teachings of Jesus)! I would include these men as heretics...

[@gregorylightcatcher1058]

Derek Thomas speaks about this with understanding, clarity and grace.

[@davidstockeland8648]

I am not sure he speaks with either clarity or grace. He makes a statement that reading the Bible with a dispensational approach is dangerous, and gives no example. If I was on the dispensational side I would not sense that is with grace. If I was on the reformed side I would be disappointed my colleague did not defend or explain our position more clearly.

[@melissab7777]

Unfortunately what seems to be happening is there is no understanding of the Jewish roots of Christianity which make all the difference in biblical understanding. I would highly recommend anyone reading this to visit ariel ministries and get a hold of Dr Arnold Fruchtenbaum’s teaching materials. His books Footsteps of the Messiah and Yeshua life of the Messiah are excellent. God bless.

[@alanmunch5779]

I find this quite disturbing. Christians are not supposed to be ignorant of such things, as the apostle Paul said, but these gentlemen, who I’m sure are experts on some parts of Scripture, and on the history of the -isms they adhere to, seem quite confused and clueless on this issue and somewhat detached. The apostle Paul would be weeping if he heard this conversation, I think.

[@christianblack9426]

Paul literally said that Gentiles were grafted into the same fig tree, God didn't plant a new fig tree only to take care of the old one later. The church is God's covenant people, and the church is made up of people from all tribes, nations, and tongues, including Jews AND Arabs, so I don't know how it is disturbing that God's covenant is, and always has been with those who agree to the terms of His covenant, and that is now with a much broader spectrum of people than it once was, and it INCLUDES ethnic Jews.

[@tompreacher6274]

Covenant theology makes God out to be a liar. If He forsakes the clear promises He made to national Israel, why should anyone trust Him on anything? The restoration of the Jews to their own land in preparation for the "time of Jacob's trouble" (Daniel's 70th week) and their Deliverer coming to save them (Romans 11:36) is still in the future. Every prophecy of Christ's first coming was fulfilled literally. Every prophecy concerning Israel and Christ's return will be fulfilled literally.

[@SpotterVideo]

Who is really teaching “Replacement Theology” ? (Did God fulfill His promises to the Jewish people at Calvary? Matthew 26:28, John 19:30) The advocates of modern Dispensational Theology often accuse others of promoting “Replacement Theology”, or some may even say “Antisemitism”. What does the Bible say about their accusations? 1. Who is replacing Christ as the seed of Abraham through which all the families of the Earth would be blessed in Genesis 12:3, with Abraham’s modern descendants? (See Galatians 3:8) 2. Who is replacing the one people of God in John 10:16, with two peoples of God ? 3. Who is replacing the one seed (Christ) in Galatians 3:16, with the many seeds? 4. Who is replacing the children of the promise in Romans 9:8, with the children of the flesh? 5. Who is replacing the faithful “remnant” of Israelites in Romans 11:1-5, with the Baal worshipers? 6. Who is replacing the word "so" in Romans 11:26, with the word "then"? 7. Who is attempting to replace the Church made up of all races of people, with one made up only of Gentiles? Why did Peter address the crowd as “all the house of Israel” in Acts 2:36, when about 3,000 Israelites accepted Christ on the Day of Pentecost? 8. Based on Hebrews 9:15, the New Covenant cannot be separated from the Messiah’s death. Is the covenant in Daniel 9:27 connected to the Messiah’s death in Daniel 9:26. Is the covenant with the “many” in Daniel 9:27 the same covenant with the “many” in Matthew 26:28? If it is, some have replaced the New Covenant in Daniel 9:27 with a future covenant made by an antichrist not found in Daniel chapter 9. (See the 1599 Geneva Bible used by the Pilgrims.) 9. Those promoting the Two Peoples of God doctrine of Dispensational Theology often accuse others of teaching “Replacement Theology”, but are they the masters of it? Are they promoting a form of Dual Covenant Theology based on race? (See “genealogies” in Titus 3:9) Is the most important genealogy in the Bible found in Matthew 1:1? Is God's Son the ultimate fulfillment of Israel? Why has the modern Church done a pitiful job of sharing the Gospel with modern Orthodox Jews? Why would someone tell them they are God's chosen people and then fail to share the Gospel with them? Who is the seed of the woman promised in Genesis 3:15? Who is the "son" in Psalm 2? Who is the "suffering servant" of Isaiah 53? Who would fulfill the New Covenant promised in Jeremiah 31:31-34? Who would fulfill the timeline of Daniel chapter 9 before the second temple was destroyed? Why have we not heard this simple Old Testament Gospel preached on Christian television in the United States on a regular basis? 10. Watch the KZbin video “Genesis of Dispensational Theology” to see the origin of this man-made doctrine, which is less than 200 years old. It was brought to the United States about the time of the Civil War by John Nelson Darby. The doctrine was later incorporated into the notes of the Scofield Reference Bible, and then spread through much of the modern Church. Dallas Theological Seminary in Dallas Texas was created in part to promote John Darby’s Two Peoples of God doctrine of Dispensational Theology. Lewis Sperry Chafer, the first president of Dallas Theological, had the following to say about the difference between Israel and the Church: “The dispensationalist believes that throughout the ages God is pursuing two distinct purposes: one related to the earth with earthly people and earthly objectives involved which is Judaism; while the other is related to heaven with heavenly people and heavenly objectives involved, which is Christianity.” Lewis Sperry Chafer, Dispensationalism (Dallas, Seminary Press, 1936), p. 107. Chafer states that, ‘Israel is an eternal nation, heir to an eternal land, with an eternal kingdom, on which David rules from an eternal throne,’ that is, on earth and distinct from the church who will be in heaven.” Lewis Sperry Chafer. Systematic Theology. 1975. Vol. IV. pp. 315-323. John Walvoord, another prominent voice of Dallas Theological stated… "...it is an article of normative dispensational belief that the boundaries of the land promised to Abraham and his descendants from the Nile to the Euphrates will be literally instituted and that Jesus Christ will return to a literal and theocratic Jewish kingdom centred on a rebuilt temple in Jerusalem. In such a scheme the Church on earth is relegated to the status of a parenthesis.” John F. Walvoord, The Rapture Question.1979, p. 25 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Are there two peoples of God in John 10:16? (See also 1 John 2:22-23, 2 John 1:7-11.) What is the land promise to the Old Testament Saints in Hebrews 11:15-16? Based on 2 Peter 3:10-13, is this earth “eternal”? Will it be replaced by a new earth? Based on Acts 2:36, and Romans 9:6-8, and Romans 11:1-5, and Hebrews 12:22-24, and James 1:1-3, can faithful Israel and the Church be separated into two different groups? Who is the New Covenant promised to in Jeremiah 31:31-34, and Hebrews 8:6-13? Will modern Orthodox Jews ever be saved outside of the New Covenant Church?

[@carly-0-7]

So Simple. Isn’t it? God warned me about this and he showed me this past week why it can’t be true what they claim. Romans 11 is so clear! God bless you. Can I ask what dispensation do You follow?

[@neverkneelbeforezod5124]

Luke 1:32, Mary was told her Son would rule on the throne of David. That did not happen at His first coming. I think most adherants to covenant theology are going to be very surprised when they find themselves worshipping a Jewish king with His throne in Jerusalem, and they aren't able to bring Him offerings on Sunday because the temple is only open on Sabbath and the new moon (Ezekiel 46:1-2).

[@mosesking2923]

He is ruling on the throne of David right now and all power on Heaven and Earth has already been given to Him (Hebrews 1:3, 10:12). There is no millennial kingdom, it doesn't exist and will never exist. Even the original Protestant reformers understood this clearly until the mid-1800's.

[@neverkneelbeforezod5124]

@@mosesking2923 I don't agree with your understanding of what the throne of David is. I don't think you can spiritualize and allegorize everything in Scripture, especially when it comes to the geopolitical promises that God made in the Tanakh about Israel. Good day to you.

[@mosesking2923]

@@neverkneelbeforezod5124 "geopolitical promises that God made in the Tanakh about Israel." And what are these promises exactly?

[@neverkneelbeforezod5124]

@@mosesking2923 A nation, a land, a kingdom (all with defined boundaries), a king, a throne.... All of these promises are unconditional and everlasting, btw. If you don't think God will keep His promises to Israel, what makes you think He'll keep His promises to you?

[@mosesking2923]

@@neverkneelbeforezod5124 God kept his promise to Abraham. The promise of land and descendants were accomplished in the time of Moses and Solomon. God made a promise and it was fulfilled. Simple as that. They were fulfilled IN THE PAST and there are no remaining promises for unbelieving Jews in the future. A. For example, regarding the land in question, God says through Joshua: “Thus the LORD gave to Israel all the land which he swore to give to their fathers; and having taken possession of it, they settled there” (Jos. 21:43). B. Joshua 23:14-16 “ you know in all your hearts and in all your souls that NOT ONE WORD of all the good words which the Lord your God spoke concerning you has failed; all have been fulfilled for you, not one of them has failed. C. God also declares through Solomon that all his promises to Israel have been fulfilled: “Blessed be the LORD who has given rest to his people Israel, according to all that he promised; NOT ONE WORD has failed of all his good promise, which he uttered by Moses his servant” D. God further says through the prophet Nehemiah that His promise to grant the land to Abraham’s descendants has been fulfilled: “Thou art the LORD, the God who didst choose Abram and… thou hast FULFILLED thy promise, for thou art righteous” (Neh. 9:7-8).

[@Sillyworld777]

Link to the whole thing?

[@RobinStaple]

I would love to see the whole discussion that this clip was taken from... Where can I find it?

[@rubiks6]

The Jews are saved the same way everyone else is - by repentance and trusting in the life, atoning death, and resurrection of the Son of God, Jesus the Messiah, our King. However, as far as _institutions_ go, there is the Church and there is Israel and when Jesus returns and splits the Mount of Olives and saves Israel from her enemies in a very real earthly sense, the Israelites there and then will collectively believe and be saved en masse. This is the most natural reading of the biblical text. This idea of _two ways of salvation_ only exists in the minds of anti-dispensationalists. I am not a dispensationalist but I wish to defend them on this point. They are accused of believing something which they do not believe. While I am not a dispensationalist, I agree with many of the ideas. My introduction to systematic theology was through C. I. Scofield's annotated Bible which was the first Bible I received or ever opened. I read it cover to cover including all notes. (Somehow, his foolishness in Genesis 1 did not stick in my mind. Perhaps I was protected by the Holy Spirit.) I understand the notes are not "God's Word" but many of them made a lot of sense. My understanding of God is that He does things _every_ way possible. That means there are two bodies - a spiritual body, the Church, and there is a physical body, Israel, but both meet at the cross and both are saved there in the same manner.

[@carly-0-7]

What about Romans 11 than. Broader Romans 9-11?

[@rubiks6]

@@carly-0-7 - I'm going to need time to process this subject. In the meantime, if you would expand your question(s) a little bit so I could be more clear on exactly what I am forming an answer to. Blessings to you.

[@glassworks4850]

John Macarthur has a series of "Why every Calvinist should be a premillennialist". It's a 6 part teaching and the points against opposing views were made clear.

[@AndonJamesTyler]

Lol. I've heard John MacArthur say that so many times and I've always thought it funny because Calvin was not a premillennialist.

[@glassworks4850]

@@AndonJamesTyler still a great presentation though

[@mkshffr4936]

I love Johnny Mac but I think he misses the boat on this one.

[@SemperReformanda17]

@@mkshffr4936 For sure. He's not even on the right boat on eschatology, lol

[@toolegittoquit_001]

We do NOT lose down here 😏

[@Mike-qt7jp]

Some say Israel is NOT God's covenant people, but GOD Himself says, in Genesis 17:7-8, "And I will establish My covenant between Me and you and your descendants after you in their generations, for an EVERLASTING covenant, to be God to you and your descendants after you. 8 Also I give to you and your descendants after you the land in which you are a stranger, all the land of CAANAN (Israel) as an EVERLASTING possession; and I will be their God.” The land of Caanan is promised as an everlasting inheritance, and God clearly declares an everlasting COVENANT with the Israelites who have inherited the Land of Caanan. That does NOT mean God doesn't have a covenant with the Church, BUT He is NOT done with Israel. Romans 11:25 says, "I do not want you to be ignorant of this mystery, brothers and sisters, so that you may not be conceited: Israel has experienced a hardening in part until the full number of the Gentiles has come in, 26 and in this way all Israel will be saved."

[@boaz63]

This is a misrepresentation of dispensationalism - there are not “two ways of salvation” there. That is either ignorant or slanderous. Please issue a correction for integrity’s sake. 🙏

[@mikepent9184]

According to John Nelson Darby, Israel would be saved by observing the law. he [Darby] declared Israel would be saved by the law, with the millennium’s purpose being to “allow the Jews to fulfill the law that they never properly fulfilled in the old covenant.”

[@christinehunt625]

Derek Thomas is always more complicated and confusing than necessary. Thank you, Dr. Nichols, for speaking so clearly.

[@ThxGod_ItsOver]

DOES SATANHAVE YOUR MIND? MATTHEW 24:36KJV - But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only. MATTHEW 7:21-27KJV! PROVERBS 1:7KJV! - The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction. ⦁ GENESIS 2:10-15KJV - HAVILAH, ETHIOPIA, ASSYRIA, EURPHRATES = AFRICAN CONTINENT! NOT EUROPE OR MIDDLE EAST! ⦁ NUMBERS 12:1KJV = MOSES ETHIOPIAN WIFE! ⦁ ACTS 8:26-27KJV = DESERT/GAZA/ETHIOPIANS/WORSHIPPERS! ⦁ ACTS 11:26KJV = CHRISTIANS/ANTIOCH = AFRICAN CONTINENT ⦁ JOHN 4:21KJV - Jesus saith unto her, Woman, believe me, the hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this mountain, nor yet at Jerusalem, worship the Father. ⦁ JEW AND JEWISH ARE FAITHS JUST LIKE BAPTIST AND CATHOLIC. ⦁ 1 CORINTHIANS 9:20KJV - BECAME JEWS ⦁ ESTHER 8:17KJV - BECAME JEWS ⦁ ROMANS 2:29KJV - No, a person is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is circumcision of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a person's praise is not from other people, but from God. ⦁ GALATIANS 1:14KJV = RELIGION ⦁ PSALMS 118:8KJV - 8 It is better to trust in the Lord than to put confidence in man. ⦁ KZbin - BORGIO / JESUS PART 1 KZbin - NO WHITE JESUS / WHO IS JESUS 1:20 KZbin - "Blacks Are Gods People. You Better Shut Your White Mouth" Alabama Preacher Puts His Entire Church On Front Street! ⦁ EXODUS 12:32-41KJV = REAL ISRAELITES OF THE BIBLE OUT OF AFRICAN NATION NOT MIDDLE EAST OR EUROPE!! MATTHEW 24:24KJV! REVELATION 22:18-19KJV! REVELATION 2:8-9KJV! REVELATION 3:8-9KJV! ⦁ MALACHI 3:6KJV - For I am the Lord, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed. 1 JOHN 2:22KJV - 22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son. TITUS 1:14KJV - 14 Not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth.

[@uncasunga1800]

@@ThxGod_ItsOver you copy and paste all day Go work at a soup kitchen. Find something useful jim jones wannabe

[@Soobinleee]

It’s probably because he speaks with more technical language that the untrained person doesn’t understand. He’s a seminary professor

[@seniorscientist590]

Is impossible to read the bible and believe in covenant/replacement theology unless you were taught it. You'd never get those ideas from the text, God's actual Word to mankind. Jesus is pictured 100s of times in the OT and every single time the pattern is consistent: Israel would reject Him, gentiles would come in to faith, and through a time of trouble Israel would be helpless and would turn to their savior. This is pictured in most accounts but more obvious in Joseph who married gentile bride then dealt with his brothers in 7 year famine. Moses, exiled, 7 sisters as the church, marrying gentile bride, led flock of Jethro (church) to mountain of God, then through series of judgements led his people to freedom. Ruth, gentile bride, picture of church, and Boaz, the kinsman redeemer. They are married, ruth brings Naomi (picture of israel) food. Then has baby with boaz and boaz gives ruth Obed, which means servant, which is her savior (israel saved again!). It goes on and on, again and again the consistent pattern. Prophecies, promises by God who cannot lie, that speak of the time of Israel trouble and restoration literally fills scripture. Jesus Himself spoke of this same exact pattern, foretelling of a time yet future. The epistles, its all over them, and revelation is mostly about Israel. From start to finish in the bible, not one detail out of place. Romans 11 leaves zero doubt. Paul finishes his thought in that chapter just in case he wasnt perfectly clear, vs29 "For the gifts and calling of God are irrevocable." (Meaning Israel in this context, where he contrasts with gentiles). "Moreover the word of the Lord came to me, saying: “Son of man, when the house of Israel dwelt in their own land, they defiled it by their own ways and deeds; to Me their way was like the uncleanness of a woman in her customary impurity. Therefore I poured out My fury on them for the blood they had shed on the land, and for their idols with which they had defiled it. So I scattered them among the nations, and they were dispersed throughout the countries; I judged them according to their ways and their deeds. When they came to the nations, wherever they went, they profaned My holy name-when they said of them, ‘These are the people of the Lord, and yet they have gone out of His land.’ But I had concern for My holy name, which the house of Israel had profaned among the nations wherever they went. “Therefore say to the house of Israel, ‘Thus says the Lord God: “I do not do this for your sake, O house of Israel, but for My holy name’s sake, which you have profaned among the nations wherever you went. And I will sanctify My great name, which has been profaned among the nations, which you have profaned in their midst; and the nations shall know that I am the Lord,” says the Lord God, “when I am hallowed in you before their eyes. For I will take you from among the nations, gather you out of all countries, and bring you into your own land." Ezekiel 36:16‭-‬24.

[@williammartin6949]

God always has and always will love the Jewish people. They are His chosen. Israel is not the church. Amazing that these ligonier men hardly ever speak about the book of Revelation. Read verse 3 of chapter one. We are blessed by reading, studying , and adhering to the words of this book. Read it, and the book of Daniel, along with Ezekiel, Jeremiah, and Joel, to understand God's dealing with Israel in the last days.

[@tompreacher6274]

You have it right. Read commentaries by Covenant theologians on OT prophecy and you will quickly see that the spiritualizing of Scripture makes no sense. You can make it mean whatever you want it to mean.

[@carly-0-7]

Never!!

[@AgeDeo2009]

God's overall plan is the salvation and redemption of His whole creation and not just that of one nation.

[@minorsingingairhead]

Who claims God's plan is solely about the salvation of one nation?

[@AgeDeo2009]

@@minorsingingairhead The nation of Israel is loved by God and has a part in His plan - to bring forth the ONE TRUE ISRAEL - the Messiah, Jesus Christ, for the salvation of the nations. Israel ought not to be the Center of our attention but JESUS CHRIST. He is what Scripture is all about as He explained to His disciples on the road to Emmaus.

[@minorsingingairhead]

@@AgeDeo2009 As a non-reformed guy, I can say amen to that. Although the Emmaus passage is blown out of proportion by covenant theologians.

[@AgeDeo2009]

@@minorsingingairhead Kindly explain what you mean by this, my friend. Thank you.

[@minorsingingairhead]

@@AgeDeo2009 In short, the Emmaus disciples were sad, because Jesus, the messiah, died, and they did not yet believe the report about His resurrection. They did not not even recognize Jesus yet, and He said to them: '𝑌𝑜𝑢 𝑓𝑜𝑜𝑙𝑖𝑠h 𝑚𝑒𝑛 𝑎𝑛𝑑 𝑠𝑙𝑜𝑤 𝑜𝑓 h𝑒𝑎𝑟𝑡 𝑡𝑜 𝑏𝑒𝑙𝑖𝑒𝑣𝑒 𝑖𝑛 𝑎𝑙𝑙 𝑡h𝑎𝑡 𝑡h𝑒 𝑝𝑟𝑜𝑝h𝑒𝑡𝑠 h𝑎𝑣𝑒 𝑠𝑝𝑜𝑘𝑒𝑛! 𝑊𝑎𝑠 𝑖𝑡 𝑛𝑜𝑡 𝑛𝑒𝑐𝑒𝑠𝑠𝑎𝑟𝑦 𝑓𝑜𝑟 𝑡h𝑒 𝐶h𝑟𝑖𝑠𝑡 𝑡𝑜 𝑠𝑢𝑓𝑓𝑒𝑟 𝑡h𝑒𝑠𝑒 𝑡h𝑖𝑛𝑔𝑠 𝑎𝑛𝑑 𝑡𝑜 𝑐𝑜𝑚𝑒 𝑖𝑛𝑡𝑜 𝐻𝑖𝑠 𝑔𝑙𝑜𝑟𝑦?'𝑇h𝑒𝑛 𝑏𝑒𝑔𝑖𝑛𝑛𝑖𝑛𝑔 𝑤𝑖𝑡h 𝑀𝑜𝑠𝑒𝑠 𝑎𝑛𝑑 𝑤𝑖𝑡h 𝑎𝑙𝑙 𝑡h𝑒 𝑃𝑟𝑜𝑝h𝑒𝑡𝑠, 𝐻𝑒 𝑒𝑥𝑝𝑙𝑎𝑖𝑛𝑒𝑑 𝑡𝑜 𝑡h𝑒𝑚 𝑡h𝑒 𝑡h𝑖𝑛𝑔𝑠 𝑤𝑟𝑖𝑡𝑡𝑒𝑛 𝑎𝑏𝑜𝑢𝑡 𝐻𝑖𝑚𝑠𝑒𝑙𝑓 𝑖𝑛 𝑎𝑙𝑙 𝑡h𝑒 𝑆𝑐𝑟𝑖𝑝𝑡𝑢𝑟𝑒𝑠. (Lk 24:25-27) What the text is saying: Jesus showed them "in all the scriptures" (what exactly?) "the things written about Himself", i.E. specific things that relate to the specific context of "these things" (Christ's death and glorification). What the text is not saying: Jesus showed them that the Scripture as a whole is all about Himself. Therefore, Jesus went to specific passages (like Isaiah 53, cf. Acts 8:26-40) to show them the things that apply to this very situation. He did not say, that He is, in some surprising way, the point of each and every verse of the OT. Not sure if a covenant theologian would say it that way, but covenant theologians definitely use this passage to legitimize their "christocentric" hermeneutic. This hermeneutic enables them to spiritualize and typologize OT prophecies. The end result is usually Amillennialism and replacement/fulfillment theology.

[@andrewchance9847]

What conference is this from?

[@ChristIsKing]

John Calvin on Romans 11:1,26: “He so modifies what he had previously said respecting the repudiation of the Jews, that no one might think that the covenant formerly made with Abraham is now abrogated...When the Gentiles shall come in, the Jews also shall return from their defection to the obedience of faith; and thus shall be completed the salvation of the whole Israel of God, which must be gathered from both; and yet in such a way that the Jews shall obtain the first place, being as it were the first born in God's family.”

[@billmartinn9851]

I think you panellists need to read the bible, and understand God loves the Jews and always will. The church is not Israel.

[@followeroftheway1928]

I think you need to stop worshiping Jews. They’re not saved. You’re idolizing a group of evil satanist

[@thunkful343]

It is false to say that Dispensationalism teaches 2 ways of salvation. To learn the truth about Dispensationalism, Read Ryrie's Dispensationalism Today. If you find that somebody at some time was a Dispensationalist & taught 2 ways of salvation, that does not prove that such a POV is an essential of Dispensationalism. Not withstanding you can find 2 ways of salvation in a sense, on of which is by works keeping the law But it is a hypothetical way of salvation which never occurs, if salvation could be by keeping the law; for in fact nobody ever keeps the law. You can read Romans 2 on that, where Paul might be interpreted as teaching salvation by works, but such salvation is only hypothetical, as it never happens. Salvation on man's side is by faith alone. And there definitely is a bifurcation between the economy of The Law of Moses with its animal sacrifices & the Economy of the Church starting with Acts 2.

[@danielwarton5343]

What’s about Acts 1:6?

[@SolaScriptura77]

And who are these reformed /calvinists theologians are they the authority in matters of faith and conduct??? And who appointed them???

[@bobhutton1409]

I see that the speaker at 2 min 20 is repeating the lie that Dispensationalists teach 2 ways of salvation. That is NOT the case. If these so-called "wise men" wish to attack dispensational theology at least they could have the good grace not to misrepresent it.

[@pm3850]

Calvin is wrong, pure and simple. what part of everlasting does any covenant claimer not understand? the logical extension of deformed theology is replacement of Israel with the church

[@shawnmoose6119]

They wouldn’t deny the everlasting covenant brother

[@kristypack9313]

Just throw out any influence of man if you’re confused. Pray and read the Bible. Ask the Lord to guide you into all truth. These endless debates will go on forever. Let God be true and every man a liar. We do need to learn to rightly divide the word of truth.

[@patrickhanly7458]

Please explain Acts 1:6-8.

[@cooljams_jams]

Covenant theology is refreshingly eloquent for answering many questions at once.

[@tompreacher6274]

It is false teaching!

[@caroledonaldson5195]

@@tompreacher6274 Chapter and verse proof or your opinion?

[@uncasunga1800]

@@tompreacher6274 you are false teaching jim jones wannabe. Lol you sure are triggered by the actual truth tho. You don't know the bible at all.

[@uncasunga1800]

@@caroledonaldson5195 youtube keyboard warrior millennial 5:7 ; All things revolve a faceless nameless zombie minion incoherent aggressively typing nonsense all over the internet instead of getting a real job lol.

[@uncasunga1800]

The only way the Old Testament can be relevant is there and the removal of the blindness of the ridiculous cult of pre millenialism predominant in fake revivalist easy believism man centered biblically illiterate stupefaction. God does not owe a single man anything He gave His promises so His true children his elect His remnant will be able to know what to hold to and how to place and hold their faith in him.

[@rocketman1090]

Why do reformed theology people look to 1600's and leave out early Church fathers in eschatology? Calvin has been made into a godlike human by reformed theologians.

[@j.clements2093]

Sproul doesn’t. He quotes Augustine a lot.

[@SKfilming]

The problem with talking about disp. / cov. , as they mentioned in the video, is that there are just so many "flavours" of each and it tends to be hard to discuss it without using strawmans.

[@Gospel-coalition]

the one thing is that God is faithful, if he has chosen Abraham, then it is forever, if you think he is going to abandon His chosen people then he is not faithful.

[@Beachlocked]

So show one text in context that says the church has replaced Israel.

[@ianphillips1365]

You know that is a disingenuous question. It was always a continuum of faith. Using the word "replaced" is just a way to strawman those you disagree with. It's not an attempt to discuss in good faith.

[@thunkful343]

Now tell us where the Bible speaks of one "Covenant of Grace."

[@lauriemilam8805]

The Church is NOT Israel, and Israel is NOT the Church. That’s, ‘replacement theology.’ Not Scriptural.

[@deliaflores987]

I would like to clearly understand the difference in meaning between Transgression and Sin. Thank you.

[@franciscafazzo3460]

Have you not read the Prophets?

[@petermillist3779]

I’m with Calvin on this.

[@rocketsurgeon1746]

Not sure what I would be labeled, but what do they call a guy that repented to God and simply follows the Bible's directions?

[@danielbuller6991]

Thanks for the snapshot on this important question from a covenantalist perspective. Of course, one would need to hear the entire conversation, but - based on the few minutes that were posted - the biggest issue that I am having is with the person who spoke in between (sorry for not knowing the name). First of all, speaking of "two ways of salvation" is a typical misrepresentation of dispensationalist view. Second, the person said that, in my own words, "what really matters are the epistles." This just shows the major hermeneutical difference between both views and I disagree with this characterization. The epistles have their authority from the OT writings (see, e.g., what Paul means with "all Scripture" in 2 Tim 3:16) and are NOT superior to them. In the same way that the OT looks forward to what has been fulfilled in the NT, the NT's authority is dependent on what was said before. It is really hard to find good representation of both views these days (and it probably always was).

[@ncmilive]

Reformed Full preterism solves this problem and answers Romans 11 perfectly well.

[@valerianoapawan4603]

Please explain Genesis 17:8, God promise to Abraham. And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.

[@kb27787]

Now to Abraham and his Seed were the promises made. He does not say, “And to seeds,” as of many, but as of one, “And to your Seed,” who is Christ. (Gal 3:16) For the promise that he would be the heir of the world was not to Abraham or to his seed through the law, but through the righteousness of faith. (Rom 4:13) The true and rightful owner of Canaan (and for that matter, the whole world and heaven too) by inheritance is the Lord Christ, and therefore all who are Christ's seed, Jew or Gentile alike, are rightful owners of every single square inch of this ball of dirt we live on, including that particular small little piece of land known as Palestine. Therefore let no one boast in men. For all things are yours: whether Paul or Apollos or Cephas, or the world or life or death, or things present or things to come-all are yours. And you are Christ’s, and Christ is God’s. (1 Cor 3:21-23)

[@willielee5253]

@Everlasting, John 10:35 and Galatians 6:7. If one gets the scriptures wrong and teaches accordingly, he gets his reward. It's better to walk up rightly and seeing straight forward than up side down.

[@toolegittoquit_001]

It has been fulfilled

[@RoyalBlooded1]

I didn’t understand how people can’t see that Roman’s 11 is teach that natural ones who believe (the people who the word of God first came to) of Christ will be kept in , the natural world ones who don’t believe in Christ will be cut out so that the unnatural ones (those who the word of God came second GENTILES) will be grafted in , and in this way “All Israel” (All Who Believe AKA Kyriakos= the Lord’s AKA Church) will be saved

[@GregVasquez777]

wow a great talk gentlemen! Romans 11:26 The people who numbered the bible cut a sentence in half with v25, 26 that reads "Israel has experienced a hardening in part until the full number of the Gentiles has come in, and in this way all Israel will be saved. " All who are true Israel or believing Israel shall be saved through the process of hardening some of Israel and bringing in gentiles. "in this way" is the grammar. and v23 And if they do not persist in unbelief, they will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again. Some cut this one in half as well and say "God will graft them in again" without reading the sentence grammar. "if they do not persist in unbelief"

[@izaakdejager5064]

"For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh; 29but he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the Spirit, not in the letter; whose [g]praise is not from men but from God." (Romans 2:28). There is one Spiritual nation of Israel, i.e. the worldwide invisible church, which is comprised of believers. The visible church however, was comprised a bit differently throughout history. In the time of the patriarchs, it was concentrated around specific families (Noah, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob). At the Exodus, it was concentrated among ethnic Jews, i.e. the ethnic seed of Abraham. After Pentecost, it is spread to all nations. Yet throughout all history, this truth is the same - "he is not a Jew who is one outwardly...but he is a Jew who is one inwardly". This points to the fact that it is not enough to be an ethnic Jews. I, as a believer, am a truer "Jew" than an ethnic Jew who rejects the Messiah. Jesus himself teaches this when he addresses Nathanael in John 1:47 "Jesus saw Nathanael coming toward Him, and said of him, “Behold, an Israelite indeed, in whom is no deceit!". What is the difference between an "Israelite", and an "Israelite indeed in whom there is no deceit"? It is this: the recognition and belief upon, the Messiah, the Lord Jesus Christ.

[@uncasunga1800]

No one can recognize the meshiach without YHVH Elohim God opening their eyes amd revealing it to them.

[@uncasunga1800]

But yes a true believer is the Israel Jesus died on the cross for.

[@uncasunga1800]

Effectively speaking..

[@ThxGod_ItsOver]

@@uncasunga1800 HEED - DOES SATAN HAVE YOUR MIND? MATTHEW 24:36KJV - But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only. MATTHEW 7:21-27KJV! PROVERBS 1:7KJV! - The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction. ⦁ GENESIS 2:10-15KJV - HAVILAH, ETHIOPIA, ASSYRIA, EURPHRATES = AFRICAN CONTINENT! NOT EUROPE OR MIDDLE EAST! ⦁ NUMBERS 12:1KJV = MOSES ETHIOPIAN WIFE! ⦁ ACTS 8:26-27KJV = DESERT/GAZA/ETHIOPIANS/WORSHIPPERS! ⦁ ACTS 11:26KJV = CHRISTIANS/ANTIOCH = AFRICAN CONTINENT ⦁ JOHN 4:21KJV - Jesus saith unto her, Woman, believe me, the hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this mountain, nor yet at Jerusalem, worship the Father. ⦁ JEW AND JEWISH ARE FAITHS JUST LIKE BAPTIST AND CATHOLIC. ⦁ 1 CORINTHIANS 9:20KJV - BECAME JEWS ⦁ ESTHER 8:17KJV - BECAME JEWS ⦁ ROMANS 2:29KJV - No, a person is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is circumcision of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a person's praise is not from other people, but from God. ⦁ GALATIANS 1:14KJV = RELIGION ⦁ PSALMS 118:8KJV - 8 It is better to trust in the Lord than to put confidence in man. ⦁ KZbin - BORGIO / JESUS PART 1 KZbin - NO WHITE JESUS / WHO IS JESUS 1:20 KZbin - "Blacks Are Gods People. You Better Shut Your White Mouth" Alabama Preacher Puts His Entire Church On Front Street! ⦁ EXODUS 12:32-41KJV = REAL ISRAELITES OF THE BIBLE OUT OF AFRICAN NATION NOT MIDDLE EAST OR EUROPE!! MATTHEW 24:24KJV! REVELATION 22:18-19KJV! REVELATION 2:8-9KJV! REVELATION 3:8-9KJV! ⦁ MALACHI 3:6KJV - For I am the Lord, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed. 1 JOHN 2:22KJV - 22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son. TITUS 1:14KJV - 14 Not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth.

[@willielee5253]

@Izaak De Jager, don't stop talking now, press the issue. Without correction, instructions wont make much sense. In Isaiah, God says I have created you, I formed you and shaped you and to top it off, He says, you are witnesses that I am He. I said all that to say, you were born to speak forth His word. Not only is Jesus the Word, so are you. God bless you on your journey!!!

[@gordoncrawley5826]

Me thinks, nobody "knows" exactly about the end times, but we do know the Gospel, that Christ alone saves, and he is coming again, so focus on that. The scriptures say just to be always ready, for our days are numbered, one way or the other. It is for God alone to know exactly how the end times will be. Let's stop bickering like little children, for it is not a salvation issue, and too much time is being spent on it. No one gains salvation just because they are "smart" about the end times, and what you think about it, does not prove if you are or are not saved, but it does cause division and ill feelings. It is OK to say we are not exactly sure about some biblical things. The big question is not, what will be, but where will we stand on that day. We should be much more heated and focused on the issues of justification, sanctification and on evangelism. The Gospel is the rock bottom issue, but how many Christians are precise and expert in that? Romans 1:16

[@uncasunga1800]

You being blind and not knowing does mean everyone else is innthe same state of cult stupefaction lol. What a zombie.

[@ThxGod_ItsOver]

HEED - DOES SATAN HAVE YOUR MIND? MATTHEW 24:36KJV - But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only. MATTHEW 7:21-27KJV! PROVERBS 1:7KJV! - The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction. ⦁ GENESIS 2:10-15KJV - HAVILAH, ETHIOPIA, ASSYRIA, EURPHRATES = AFRICAN CONTINENT! NOT EUROPE OR MIDDLE EAST! ⦁ NUMBERS 12:1KJV = MOSES ETHIOPIAN WIFE! ⦁ ACTS 8:26-27KJV = DESERT/GAZA/ETHIOPIANS/WORSHIPPERS! ⦁ ACTS 11:26KJV = CHRISTIANS/ANTIOCH = AFRICAN CONTINENT ⦁ JOHN 4:21KJV - Jesus saith unto her, Woman, believe me, the hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this mountain, nor yet at Jerusalem, worship the Father. ⦁ JEW AND JEWISH ARE FAITHS JUST LIKE BAPTIST AND CATHOLIC. ⦁ 1 CORINTHIANS 9:20KJV - BECAME JEWS ⦁ ESTHER 8:17KJV - BECAME JEWS ⦁ ROMANS 2:29KJV - No, a person is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is circumcision of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a person's praise is not from other people, but from God. ⦁ GALATIANS 1:14KJV = RELIGION ⦁ PSALMS 118:8KJV - 8 It is better to trust in the Lord than to put confidence in man. ⦁ KZbin - BORGIO / JESUS PART 1 KZbin - NO WHITE JESUS / WHO IS JESUS 1:20 KZbin - "Blacks Are Gods People. You Better Shut Your White Mouth" Alabama Preacher Puts His Entire Church On Front Street! ⦁ EXODUS 12:32-41KJV = REAL ISRAELITES OF THE BIBLE OUT OF AFRICAN NATION NOT MIDDLE EAST OR EUROPE!! MATTHEW 24:24KJV! REVELATION 22:18-19KJV! REVELATION 2:8-9KJV! REVELATION 3:8-9KJV! ⦁ MALACHI 3:6KJV - For I am the Lord, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed. 1 JOHN 2:22KJV - 22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son. TITUS 1:14KJV - 14 Not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth.

[@marleyandme447]

You needed MacArthur and Lawson on the platform. I love Steve Nichols, but his comment that "you just need to read the Bible" is insulting. Read Milleniallismsm by Charles Feinberg, or He Shall Reign Forever by Michael Vlach to gain a proper perspective on Israel.

[@soteriology1012]

As far as covenant theology addressing the issue of Israel and the future of the Jew, Romans 11:28 is a most mysterious scripture to me, Romans 11:28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the father's sakes. Who are the authentic targets of this blessedness? It sounds more like a race than an ethnicity the race being those participating in the unbroken patriarchal Hebrew bloodline of Israel or Jacob ie the seed not the egg. not the matriarchal or egg side of the bloodline which often defines the modern day Jew. In what way are these descendants BELOVED ENEMIES? What then distinguishes these Jews from gentiles or Samaritans or Ashkenazim? How are they beloved if the y have not believed on Jesus Christ as their messiah and remain enemies of Him? Do they partake of the blessing/cursing clause of those that bless or curse them? I know that reformed theology does not count any one but the elect believing as beloved and all others are passed by and hated Rom 9:13 These are not carnal Christians nor carnal Jewish believers are they? What then is Paul talking about here? I have been constantly baffled concerning the target of the belovedness of this verse of scripture and exactly how or in what manner such may be beloved.

[@AnneBlythe1986]

Where can I access the full talk on this video? Thank you!

[@wanda520]

Ligonier Ministries

[@oceanbeach5990]

How can you say that GOD doesn’t keep His Promises? Do you REALLY think GOD will consult you fellows as to what HE will actually do and when and how and who will assist Him? Enjoy contemplating ❤️

[@uncasunga1800]

Enjoy your illogical pre millenialist cult instead of reading the parts of the bible you dont want to lol

[@oceanbeach5990]

@Solus Christus You bet I’m smug, Solus Christi’s, and I give all Glory to GOD for that! 💕

[@oceanbeach5990]

@Solus Christus Here’s what happened: I’ll share the details explaining my snide remarks, since you ask. First, over the past few years I have been completely restored to heath after being injured by someone who thought I deserved punishment for leaving the Roman Catholic Church. On the edge of disaster both mentally and physically, I called out to Jesus for help. And He did. Since then, I’ve studied the Bible through ministries such as this one, and have enjoyed these Q&A sessions where many points of view are expressed. What set me off today was a strange sense of futility that GOD might, and probably does, feel when He sees this entire planet hurling toward destruction while many sit comfortably in their chairs on a stage talking about dogma and doctrine. Time is short. We individually ONLY have one lifetime to be Rescued by The Savior, The Rescuer. Once Salvation has been accomplished once and for all, I think one becomes a little ridiculous with joy and gratefulness and leaves strange comments such as I did with the hope someone else sees the necessity to call out in faith and BE SAVED. 🙏

[@robmarshall956]

@@oceanbeach5990 you realise you’ve just said you have benefited from this ministry greatly yet you come to hurl stones at it, which is it ?

[@oceanbeach5990]

@@robmarshall956 i have benefited immensely from this ministry and continue to do so. And I continue to be surprised that anyone should care what I thought days ago about some men having a discussion about what GOD would or would not DO. Doesn’t anyone lurking around this comment section have better things to do - like read the Bible or pray? PS: Do you realistically suppose that we are able to communicate our precise meanings effectively through texting?

[@williambunter3311]

We are told to rightly divide the Word of God. Replacement theology fails to do this. Dispensationalists do NOT, as these men claim, believe that there are two ways of salvation. Salvation is by grace through faith in Christ, for everyone from whatever dispensation they have lived in, whether through typology and prophecy in the O.T., or through looking back at a finished work as now, or as the coming King and Lord, in the Tribulation period to come. It is, and always has been, through faith in the One Lord Jesus Christ. The covenant of Law given through Moses was conditional and temporary, and superseded by the present dispensation of grace - but God will certainly fulfill those unconditional covenants He made with the literal land of Israel, in the millennial kingdom.The gospel to be preached during the coming Tribulation will be the gospel of the coming kingdom ovr which Chriost will reign from Jerusalem. Calvinists are very good at destroying straw men. They will imply that dispensationalists don't believe in Election, whereas in fact dispensationalists do accept the biblical doctrines of Election, but just not in the clumsy and confused calvinist sense. Calvinists also see human choice as a threat to God's sovereignty, whereas free choice is very much within God's sovereignty. Where calvinists think they are strongest, they are in fact weakest. I've heard Sproul teaching students Rom. 9, and I was flabbergasted by the sheer jaundiced and one-sided, incorrect and and incomplete interpretation he presented. He was not teaching but brainwashing. As for John Piper, just look at the company he keeps, and the statement he has been making over the last few months about the insufficiency of faith in Christ for salvation.

[@minorsingingairhead]

Covenant theology - one of the many areas where the reformers failed to reform.

[@AmazingGrace1729]

Amen! I’m on pastor John MacArthur in this area.

[@nathandundore7817]

I will just read my Bible and ask Jesus. Thanks anyway.

[@uncasunga1800]

You have never heard his voice.

[@ThxGod_ItsOver]

@@uncasunga1800 HEED - DOES SATAN HAVE YOUR MIND? MATTHEW 24:36KJV - But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only. MATTHEW 7:21-27KJV! PROVERBS 1:7KJV! - The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction. ⦁ GENESIS 2:10-15KJV - HAVILAH, ETHIOPIA, ASSYRIA, EURPHRATES = AFRICAN CONTINENT! NOT EUROPE OR MIDDLE EAST! ⦁ NUMBERS 12:1KJV = MOSES ETHIOPIAN WIFE! ⦁ ACTS 8:26-27KJV = DESERT/GAZA/ETHIOPIANS/WORSHIPPERS! ⦁ ACTS 11:26KJV = CHRISTIANS/ANTIOCH = AFRICAN CONTINENT ⦁ JOHN 4:21KJV - Jesus saith unto her, Woman, believe me, the hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this mountain, nor yet at Jerusalem, worship the Father. ⦁ JEW AND JEWISH ARE FAITHS JUST LIKE BAPTIST AND CATHOLIC. ⦁ 1 CORINTHIANS 9:20KJV - BECAME JEWS ⦁ ESTHER 8:17KJV - BECAME JEWS ⦁ ROMANS 2:29KJV - No, a person is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is circumcision of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a person's praise is not from other people, but from God. ⦁ GALATIANS 1:14KJV = RELIGION ⦁ PSALMS 118:8KJV - 8 It is better to trust in the Lord than to put confidence in man. ⦁ KZbin - BORGIO / JESUS PART 1 KZbin - NO WHITE JESUS / WHO IS JESUS 1:20 KZbin - "Blacks Are Gods People. You Better Shut Your White Mouth" Alabama Preacher Puts His Entire Church On Front Street! ⦁ EXODUS 12:32-41KJV = REAL ISRAELITES OF THE BIBLE OUT OF AFRICAN NATION NOT MIDDLE EAST OR EUROPE!! MATTHEW 24:24KJV! REVELATION 22:18-19KJV! REVELATION 2:8-9KJV! REVELATION 3:8-9KJV! ⦁ MALACHI 3:6KJV - For I am the Lord, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed. 1 JOHN 2:22KJV - 22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son. TITUS 1:14KJV - 14 Not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth.

[@manonthestars]

John Calvin did believed a future restoration and salvation of ethnic Israel, "I extend the word Israel to all the people of God, according to this meaning, ­When the Gentiles shall come in, the Jews also shall return from their defection to the obedience of faith; and thus shall be completed the salvation of the whole Israel of God, which must be gathered from both; and yet in such a way that the Jews shall obtain the first place, being as it were the first born in God's family. ...as Jews are the firstborn, what the Prophet declares must be fulfilled, especially in them: for that scripture calls all the people of God Israelites, it is to be ascribed to the pre-eminence of that nation, who God had preferred to all other nations...God distinctly claims for himself a certain seed, so that his redemption may be effectual in his elect and peculiar nation...God was not unmindful of the covenant which he had made with their fathers, and by which he testified that according to his eternal purpose he loved that nation: and this he confirms by this remarkable declaration, ­that the grace of the divine calling cannot be made void." (see Calvin's Commentaries, Vol. XIX, Epistle to the Romans, Baker Book House, 1981, p. 434-440.)

[@tonyvalentine2944]

…and if Nicholas studied the Bible, without denominational separation, he would see that not only did God deal with people differently, but salvation is always by grace, regardless. Romans 9-11 is clear.

[@uncasunga1800]

Which makes it obvious being born of Abraham physically does not profit anyone

[@carly-0-7]

Clear in what? I still don’t get what your trying to say. Just clarifying?:) thanks

[@user-xn7tq1qh5r]

So sad that these men do not understand the books of Daniel and Revelation.

[@denonjoka8848]

Thanks Pst. Derek Thomas & Pst. Stephen Nicols *4 Answering This Powerful Question of "How Does Reformed Theology View The Future of Israel As Opposed 2 Despensationalism ?" Where I Say That I Agree With Pst. Stephen Nicols That We Must View The Future of Israel Thru Reading The Bible & View The Future of Israel Thru The Prophecies of The Coming of Jesus Christ Thru Prophet Isaiah Especially In Isaiah 43, Isaiah 9:6 & Isaiah 53 & Even When The Writer of Hebrews 10:8 Which Also Is In Jeremiah 31:33 Where He Will Write The Word In Their Hearts Where He Shall Be Their God & They Shall Be My People 4 I Say That Israel As Our Great LORD Jesus Christ Says In The Four Gospels of Matthew, Mark, Luke & John Is Viewed Thru The Kingdom of God Where Our Great LORD Jesus Christ Says 2 Peter In Matthew 16:18 That On This Rock, I Will Build My Church & The Gates of Hades Shall Not Prevail Over It* & God Bless Yu Pst. Derek Thomas, Pst. Stephen Nicols & Ligonier Ministries So Very Much.🙏🙏🕊️🕊️

[@rev.stephena.cakouros948]

''Our religion is the religion of Abraham before he was circumcised." [Eusebius] This comment based on Genesis 15:6 where Abraham is fully justified before circumcision allows a Reformed Christian to believe that Jews will be saved in numbers but within the church which preaches justification by faith. Where it says "all Israel will be saved" should be read in association with another passage, "They are not all of Israel which say they are of Israel but only those who in faith look to Jesus.

[@RC_Sproul_Reformed_Theology]

...by abolishing in His flesh the hostility, which is the Law composed of commandments expressed in ordinances, so that in Himself He might make the two one new person, in this way establishing peace;...

[@empese1127]

If we are talking about classic or original dispensationalism, It is definitely not a good way to read the Bible. But dispensationalism has long since past moved from Scofield and Darby. Covenantal theology has its pluses, but many many of its conclusions are born of inferences. For example, nowhere in the NT does it say that the Church has superceded Isarel or that it is the Spiritual Israel of God. The same could be said about the theological covenants, they are born of inferences and "necessary concequences", not of proper exegesis of Bible verses. Logical and posible inferences, but inferences nonetheless.

[@josephfolsom2030]

Consider what Jesus states in the Olivet discourse; “ For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. Matthew 24:21. Also Revelation 3:10 “Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon “all the world”, to try them that dwell upon the earth” Would the “idea” of the invasion of Jerusalem in 70 AD be considered a tribulation unprecedented in history, nor now ( when Jesus spoke it ) nor “ever shall be”, Should that be considered that fulfillment? I think not! There are too many prophesies that have to be “spiritualized” to believe that kind of nonsense.

[@josephfolsom2030]

@@ThxGod_ItsOver ????!!!

[@Faithful247]

Doug Wilson has a series on their position, a bit too lengthy to type. But it helped me understand his Post Millennial view, or at least where he was coming from.

[@Landis_Grant]

Preterism is antisemitism.

[@Landis_Grant]

@@Faithful247 I don’t accept the viewpoint of Preterists.

[@joshuakriese4604]

So sad to see that these guys really doesn’t understand dispensationalism

[@johnclaiborne2749]

I was thinking the same thing. When Stephen Nichols states (at 2:16) that dispensationalism allegedly teaches that there are "two ways of salvation", it's very sad to see people clinging to what they've been taught without even examining if what they've been taught is accurate. Take a dispensationalist such as John MacArthur. Does he believe that there are "two ways of salvation"? Of course not! Why? Because the Bible clearly teaches that every believer (Old as well as New Testament) is justified by faith apart from works, as Romans repeatedly teaches.

[@RBoas]

Dispensationalism is a man made theology that was foreign to the church prior to 1830. It is only through indoctrination into the system of dispensationalism that one accepts it. Proper eisegesis of the text would not lead you to dispensationalism. Dispensationalism has made a mockery of the church by its many advocates who embarrass themselves trying to untangle and decode the signs of the times.

[@Camilodocan-ek1ls]

​@@johnclaiborne2749so where you put "dispensation of grace" or no dispensation of grace at all, as you said that grace operates in both Old and New Testaments?

[@leefury7]

Two books. "There is a Difference" by Renald Showers and "Future Israel" by Horner.

[@bethlacasse3065]

A little bit of straw man reasoning. Many Dispensationalists do not believe in two ways of salvation. A bigger issue is to read the old testament literally and then look for all the old testament and new testament to have all promises fulfilled. If you are going to change the meaning of an old testament promise from its original context you need a new testament warrant.

[@uncasunga1800]

Incoherent made up drivel

[@bobj.7782]

You guys are top scholars and should know there is really only one covenant - Deut 10:16, 30:6, Jer 31:31, Rom 2:28-29, 3:28-30, 11:11-36

[@Presbybaptisational]

Who is the guy that just said the Gospels and the Old Testament don't matter and how is that "Reformed?" 🤔

[@NormBa]

Much of Christianity is in the grip of "being hung up on the eschatological calendars". If only Gd knows the time, then surely the proper divination of that time is not a critical facet of being fully Christian. We are prohibited from divination perhaps for this very reason. Beware hubris and over-interpolating vague verses.

[@philipbuckley759]

Israel is still, in Gods plan.....it seems that reformed is a replacement type of teaching....as the Church has replaced Israel...

[@Bombaycompany1776]

To believe in replacement theology, you have to assume we believe there are two people's of God, which we don't, therefore replacement is impossible. There has only ever been one faithful people of God from the Old Testament to the New Testament.

[@mosesking2923]

@@Bombaycompany1776 I think you must be talking about dispensationalism. Replacement theology holds that there is only one people of God: the unbelieving Jews were cut off from the Olive Tree and the believing Gentiles were grafted on. (Romans 11)

[@Bombaycompany1776]

@@mosesking2923 co-heirs is the biblical term.

[@mosesking2923]

@@Bombaycompany1776 agreed, but that’s not the relevant issue. WHO are Christians co-heirs with? That is the question at hand that needs to be answered.

[@Bombaycompany1776]

@mosesking2923 The commonwealth of Israel. We have been grafted in, the great mystery now revealed *Eph 3. Fulfillment or expansion theology is a better term. No one is being replaced. Branches were broken off the tree, gentiles were grafted in. One tree, One faith, one baptism, one Lord. Christ. All the promises are yes and amen in Christ who is reconciling all things to Himself. Christ is the true Israel, ("out of Egypt I called my Son", " the true and faithful witness"), and all believers through Him.

[@ElenaBaumann]

There are many reformed Christians having different views on this topic. This is senseless to ask such a question. Better would be just to say how this ot that pastor sees Israel.

[@amichiganblackman3200]

I think they are talking about historically reformed theology. As far as I know, dispensationalism is not a part of that tradition.

[@geraldpolmateer3255]

Chafer said there are three groups of people. They are Jews, Gentiles, and the church. Philippians 3 teaches two groups that Paul called the true and false circumcision.

[@martingoodef811]

Reading through the comments I see so much confusion, yes it is difficult to read the Bible and that is if you have not been born again. Many have difficulty with this statement so I will try to explain. Man was made in the image of God, triune, 3 parts, when Adam/Eve were sent out of Eden, it was without GODs Holy Spirit. All generations were now in man’s image, not GODs. Jesus explains to Nicodemus John 3:1-21 NIV or KJV that you must be born again. When this happens you will receive the Comforter, the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit makes you again in the image of GOD and gives you discernment of GODs holy word. I pray this will help someone, even one, would seek Jesus and receive eternal life, he suffered terribly and died for all of us, all that is required is you pray and recognize what he has done for you, ask forgiveness for your sins. It is between you and GOD. Do this and he will grow in you. There are many who think they are Christian’s because they go to a church or read their Bible but this will bring judgement upon you, you must be born again. May god bless you.

[@SpotterVideo]

Which baptism is a part of the salvation process, based on what the Bible says? What did Peter say below? Acts 11:15 And as I began to speak, the Holy Ghost fell on them, as on us at the beginning. Acts 11:16 Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost. Act 11:17 Forasmuch then as God gave them the like gift as he did unto us, who believed on the Lord Jesus Christ; what was I, that I could withstand God? Based on Luke 3:16, and John 1:33, and Acts 11:15-16, the most important thing about the word "baptize" in the New Testament has nothing to do with water. The Holy Spirit is the master teacher promised to New Covenant believers in Jeremiah 31:34, and John 14:26, and is found fulfilled in Ephesians 1:13, and 1 John 2:27. Unfortunately, many modern Christians see water when they read the word "baptize" in the text. Based on the above, what is the one baptism of our faith found in the passage below? How many times is the word "Spirit" found in the passage, and how many times is the word "water" found in the passage? Eph 4:1 I therefore, the prisoner of the Lord, beseech you that ye walk worthy of the vocation wherewith ye are called, Eph 4:2 With all lowliness and meekness, with longsuffering, forbearing one another in love; Eph 4:3 Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace. Eph 4:4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling; Eph 4:5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism, “baptize” KJV Mat_3:11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire: Mar_1:8 I indeed have baptized you with water: but he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost. Luk_3:16 John answered, saying unto them all, I indeed baptize you with water; but one mightier than I cometh, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to unloose: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost and with fire: Joh_1:26 John answered them, saying, I baptize with water: but there standeth one among you, whom ye know not; Joh_1:33 And I knew him not: but he that sent me to baptize with water, the same said unto me, Upon whom thou shalt see the Spirit descending, and remaining on him, the same is he which baptizeth with the Holy Ghost. 1Co_1:17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.

[@mkshffr4936]

Very timely.

[@stormhawk31]

This is TOTALLY false and wrongheaded.

[@chapmaned24]

I don't know why either testament is even being discussed at all. One verse in the bible said it all: Genesis 15 is the promise of the INHERITANCE of the Promised Land. Genesis 17 is the promise of WHO INHERITS the Promised Land. What many don’t realize, is that this promise is TWOFOLD, not ONEFOLD, and certainly not replaceable, nor can it ever be annulled. 1. Carnal a. Promised Land is a small piece of real estate in the middle east (GENESIS 15) b. Promised SINGULAR seed is Isaac (GENESIS 17) c. Who gets the promised land? The plural seed of Isaac, through Jacob (Israel). 2. SPIRITUAL a. Promised Land is ETERNAL LIFE IN HEAVEN b. PROMISED SINGULAR SEED IS JESUS (GALATIANS 3:16) C. WHO GETS ETERNAL LIFE? The plural children of JESUS. Both are true. And neither was dependent on either the Jews BEHAVIOR, or ours. We get eternal life, Jews get land. The Old Covenant begins in Exodus 20. The New Covenant begins at the death of Christ. Again, the OLD TESTAMENT didn't even begin until Exodus 20, NOT GENESIS 15 or 17. But the promise was NEVER conditioned upon the behavior of the children of Israel. Just like eternal life isn’t dependent on our GOOD BEHAVIOR, either. We call it GRACE, not by works, lest any man should boast. The following verse pertains to BOTH in the TWOFOLD promise: Galatians 3:18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise. Again, the Law of Moses, aka OLD COVENANT has NO BEARING on the promises given to Abraham. NONE. Jews still get land, Christians still get eternal life. However, in the BLESSINGS AND CURSINGS segment of THE LAW OF MOSES, they get kicked out from time to time (DEUTERONOMY 30:1-7). But as noted there, God brings them back to the land. Then we have Ezekiel 36 and 37. The promise to Abraham was LONG BEFORE the OLD COVENANT. So what covenant are we even talking about? Galatians 3:18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.

[@AJMacDonaldJr]

Read: "The Israel of God: Yesterday, Today, Tomorrow" by O. Palmer Robertson

[@LLH7202]

Also "The Christ of the Covenants".

[@bama101010]

Does the God of heaven approve of denominations? Did the god of this world create denominations?

[@lucille7069]

Men created denominations based upon their beliefs.

[@willielee5253]

@One. One Lord, one faith, baptism. Beyond 4000 thousand denominations and counting. Something amiss.

[@bama101010]

@@willielee5253 Yes, they preach the New Testament as if it contains only one gospel.

[@willielee5253]

@@bama101010 They all do, but God has a means to evaluate that. God bless us on our journey!!!

[@bama101010]

@@willielee5253 May God bless us beyond measure.