How Mormons (Latter-Day Saints) Are Finding The Orthodox Church

[@orthochristos]

I am in awe of what we are experiencing right now. Orthodoxy is spreading like wildfire in America. Glory to the Triune God.

[@suem6004]

Orthodox is merely another bigoted anti LDS church. LDS have reached out for dialog yet the Orthodox rebuff them. Such a great religion

[@suem6004]

Already the restored American based church: the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. Spreading like wildfire in North America.

[@orthochristos]

@@suem6004 LOL! Mormon cultists

[@orthochristos]

@@suem6004 LOL! Mormon cultists!

[@bigbowlowrong4694]

Yeah now mainstream Christianity is dying people are getting into all kinds of kooky cults! Great news

[@BSNickel]

I am exmormon and Im now a catechumen in the Orthodox faith. This described my story exactly. Glory to God.

[@ThomasG_Nikolaj]

This is quickly becoming one of my favourite Orthodox channels! God bless ☦

[@austinpissey8789]

As someone attending an orthodox parish in the SLC valley, we get Mormons showing up to inquirers classes and joining the church constantly. Very uplifting and encouraging to see. Fr is correct about the angry atheism, as well; many times the husband will come to the church first or with their children because the abuses and repression women experienced in the LDS church were so strong and have left them deeply emotionally hurt. I pray for all of them and that they may all see the light, and that they may spiritually heal from their wounds. Glory to God!

[@Saint_nobody]

What's the turnover rate? How many active Mormons who attend catachumen classes take the plunge and become orthodox?

[@austinpissey8789]

@@Saint_nobody from the last class, more than half.

[@ryanwhitney5518]

I'm an ex Mormon I was angry but now I'm ready for peace. Going to the Orthodox Church in Salt Lake City has given me that peace. Glory to God! Thank you🙏

[@suem6004]

Why didn't study, prayer, fasting, serving, loving work for you in the LDS church? What did not set well with you in your personal spiritual journey?

[@MajorMustang1117]

@suem6004 we leave because it's verifiably false. We seek Truth. Not some of it. All of it. Biblical, Historical, Spiritual. That's not a claim you can make about Mormonism after 2 hours of basic google searches. Let alone the months or years most of us go through. We don't leave for no reason, dude. It's not just about the "religious experience", praying, fasting, or doing good things. Most Christian denominations do all these things. The important thing is Truth. Mormonism has zero claim on it besides what it inherited by the Christians before them. I.E. the Bible. Nothing else stacks reliably. And when we pray to Jesus, He roots us in this decision deeper and deeper with every passing year, because we now can see. And we love Him all the more for it.

[@suem6004]

@@MajorMustang1117 Shallowness like yours is why you left. God Almighty comes to earth and you say get away Jack. “We refuse you. We do not want more. We want idolatry from the past. We refuse to study scripture and pray with the Holy Spirit powerfully witnessing the truth . Does not matter, we want dead religions taught in dead languages with no path to heaven except through smells and bells. We crave paid clergy to get us to heaven. We want to act as sinful as possible yet be confident we are saved due to having the right ‘Orthodox’ religion. That arrogance is how I know it is false. Just like Pharisees. We are saved because our law is old and by golly we are chosen. Jesus demolished the argument. He can turn stones into saints as he can gather his people from this hemisphere. Jesus runs the show. Not you dear. He chose an ignorant farm boys over self righteous Orthodox pricks. Why? Because Joseph did not lecture God as you do. That is God’s way forever. He chooses the carpenter’s son. The poor. Unconnected. Counter religious. Fishermen. Shepherds. He did not choose the pharisees like you. You have no clue about the bible, God, Jesus, LDS. Maybe the priest will tell you what you pay him to say. As for me and my house, I choose Christ on the less traveled path of discipleship. May God have mercy on your blind hatred, bigotry, intolerance, slanderous, self righteous soul. A great ‘win’ for Orthodoxy. Hope the icons help.

[@suem6004]

@@MajorMustang1117Zero claim about God the Father and the Son appearing to Joseph Smith? How about a 530 sacred scripture text as proof? No 3rd grade farm boy who had no idea of Hebraism or Chiasmus... Wrote that in 90 days with so many bible verses esp Isaiah he what had memorized to dictate off the cuff? The proof is in LIVING the gospel. That brings you unto Christ to worship and pray to him is of God. Period. Proof enough. You do realize that Orthodox have no proof that Mary was a virgin, had a c section, stayed a virgin, was translated into heaven, was a mother of God and that we must pray to her for salvation. Not one verse in the Bible supports any of that. Neither does the Bible support Orthodox claim that James was the real lineage of the apostles, not Peter. No biblical support for atomized fiefdoms each with their own patriarchs in a coequal but not cooperative single unit. Kind of like what Protestants did. They started with reinterpreting the Bible then now 45000 different denominations all claiming they are the real church. Yah, right... right. When was the last ecumenical council of Orthodoxy? 8th century? Jesus has not opened his mouth nor directed, taught, inspired, guided you all since then? 1300 years ago? Right... Jesus is not a pagan stone idol. He lives. He restored all the cultural and philosophies that gutted the original Christian message, theology, doctrine, leadership... And we have living apostles and prophets these days. We do not worship a dead Jesus but a living one. One who is finishing his work in this hemisphere to connect the old and the new. The covenantal promises made to Israel and the in gathering. The OT is the NT and the BoM is to the NT. Imagine if the Pharisees were right that Jesus changing the OT, its laws, traditions, customs, writings and would never change? That would be your argument against the restored gospel. We know that Jesus is alive and well and still guiding his church, his plans, his will, his work and glory. People alive today deserve Jesus' headship today as they did in 30 AD. So, before you smugly thing you and outright dismiss the restoration, you better explain how your crooked path is any more suspect. LDS actually study the Bible. As a church the kids and adults all go through the Sunday school curriculum on a 4 year cycle. We need not be shut out from the eucharist; we participate and renew our baptismal covenants weekly through the eucharist. A path to sainthood exists for marrieds. Something the Orthodox Church rejects outright. The Bible says that bishop need to be married but the Orthodox say oh but not our bishops. As this good priest mentioned, LDS actually practice what they preach. The LIVE the commandments not just mumble blah blah someone said something about commandments. We are laity those don't apply to us. Basically, an LDS convert is equal to an Orthodox priest in doctrinal knowledge, biblical knowledge, prayer life, fasting, service, living the commandments, attention to family, priesthood, covenants, sacraments, eucharist.... All because the LDS church educates, admonishes, holds accountable its baptized members. That is why I could never give up more for less. More of everything that leads me to Christ and eternal life. So happy. What a blessing it has been to have had 40 years of discipleship within the LDS church. Christ the Lord is Risen!

[@suem6004]

@@MajorMustang1117 So God Almighty gave out false information? Interesting. Truth is not found in paganism though. Worshiping Mary. Venerating icons. Not biblical at all. Patriarchs lead their own ethnic and religious groups? No unity. No one Lord. One Faith. One baptism. No leadership. No revelation. The Orthodox have not had an ecumenical council since the 8th century. So, Jesus is basically a stone idol. Deaf, dumb and blind.

[@Aaron.T2005]

I am 18 and discovered Orthodoxy a year ago, now I want to convert. I will probably go to the local Serbian parish, since my family is from Serbia. They would have massive problems with me converting, they don’t know I want to yet, so I have to be patient. Lutheranism gave me a good introduction to Christianity, but I truly believe the Orthodox Church is where I will become closer to Christ. Upon discovering these realities of the ancient faith, I will take heed to the words of my Lutheran pastor: “Excitement doesn’t replace faith.” It is a temptation to be excited where we forsake the need to have true spiritual growth and patience. I will try my very hardest to avoid this, and be patient with God.

[@CikaDraza]

Slava Bogu brate. ❤

[@CikaDraza]

Very proud of you brother.

[@WhoKnoweth]

My understanding is that, in a similar way to Mormons, quite a few Muslims are learning about Islam through the Internet and are converting to Christianity as a consequence. Orthodoxy has so much to offer Muslims that they can relate to, including submission of all aspects of their lives to God, including through ascetic practices.

[@Martin-hd2tr]

That's very interesting. I've been saying for a while that Islam is very much like "ancient Mormonism"

[@Simonet1309]

Some of the church fathers saw islam as a kind of extreme Christian heresy and so shares much with the current day heresies and obvious nonsense of mormonism, JWs etc.

[@Martin-hd2tr]

@@Simonet1309 down to the fact of one random guy making up his own new "holy scripture". Wether it's "I read it in a hat" or "an angel told me", or some other nonsense. But it's always "trust me bro, the traditional scriptures are corrupted, I have the real one here". Both Mormonism and Islam have an extremely simplistic theology. And they both promote polygamy.

[@DM5550Z]

@@Martin-hd2trJoseph smith said he would be his generations muhammad, and his vision for peace would be Muhammad or all else, and they fight. And joseph inserted Joseph Smith or the sword, so he would choose conquest like Muhammad and took unto muhammads vision.

[@NavelOrangeGazer]

​@@Martin-hd2tr There's some stuff in the Koran that is sourced from the gnostic texts as well. It's basically a stew of the heresies that existed and the Christ they rejected was the false one of nestorianism.

[@DiMacky24]

My father is an ex-Mormon who became a Baptist. Like father like son I apostatized from Protestantism to Eastern Orthodoxy. There is a gap between myself and the rest of my family now, but their antagonism towards the Orthodox church lessens each year.

[@NavelOrangeGazer]

Just keep being a reflection of Christ, it will soften their hearts.

[@ilauvu]

how’d you tell them?

[@DiMacky24]

@@ilauvu Just mentioned I was now going to an Orthodox church. I live in my own place, so that makes the living situation easy enough. But we can't really discus church or scripture anymore like we used to, because we just speak different languages now.

[@oakensheild1657]

I’m 14 and I’m still Mormon but I really want to join the Orthodox church. I’ve been wanting to join for a long time now after discovering the false doctrines in Mormonism. Last night I went to a vesper in NYC and I have to say it was the most beautiful and spiritual experience I’ve ever had in a church!

[@austinpissey8789]

Praying for you and your spiritual journey, my young friend. ☦️

[@tylerpoole1557]

I got byu and I’m catholic. I’m glad u can see the false doctrine, I hope u find orthodoxy for yourself. Don’t listen to any of the lies they tell you, that you won’t be happy, or have a family. None of it’s true

[@rachell6526]

Me too!

[@Paul-uv6mb]

Hello papish friend,you told him the right words.​@@tylerpoole1557

[@Paul-uv6mb]

Wish you the best brother,you will have god in the church of jesus Christ.

[@daniallemmon5453]

Please pray for my family that the Lord may touch their hearts and bring them to truth 🙏

[@Paul-uv6mb]

Danial you should take your family in saint ioannis, μονή χρυσίνου (monh xrysinou) i am 1000% sure they will not let the orthodox faith and will be the best Christians.

[@suem6004]

Listen to General Conference this weekend. Living apostles and prophets will teach, encourage, correct. Nothing like apostles who believe in the living Christ

[@daniallemmon5453]

@@suem6004 false prophets and false apostles will bore millions of people to death this weekend

[@daniallemmon5453]

@@suem6004 False prophets and false apostles are going to put millions of people to sleep this weekend 👍

[@rachell6526]

I was mormon and angry and my husband is still very mormon. I stood up opposed to the leadership and left to become an angry athiest. Now im a catechumin and love the orthodox church so much! My 2 daughters do as well

[@suem6004]

Angry about what exactly? I see nothing to be angry about. Explain.

[@rachell6526]

@@suem6004 being lied to? Taking our money and using it for evil? What's there not to be angry about? Finding out you spent your whole life in a lie

[@suem6004]

@@rachell6526 So, tithing, the biblical practice is evil? That is what broke your back? Really? Orthodox tithe and give offerings too. Are they now on your evil list? Did they lie to you? Really, how did tithing STOP you from praying many times a day? How did tithing STOP you from scripture study? How did tithing STOP you from visiting the lonely homebound sister next door? They have a professional PAID clergy. Where does that money come from? They do not allow you to view the consecration on the bread and wine. Taking the sacrament is optional. They do NOT require any bible study at all. No church sponsored curriculum. No teaching the children. No curriculum for kids or youth at the service. Maybe just maybe you can explain these? As an LDS devout woman, I learned not to blame others for my spiritual life, but to take command myself. I pray many times a day. I always listen to scripture, serve, teach and yes tithe and give fast offerings. If you read the old old old saints... they too tithed and gave offerings. They gave up all their possessions to the poor or to the church and lived as hermits. I cannot live that lifestyle. Very impractical in this day and age. But I CAN be a saint by loving the savior and showing through words, deeds, actions that I do follow him. And all without divorce, bankruptcy and starvation to become a 'saint'. If you can do that, more power to you.

[@rachell6526]

@suem6004 what the LDS church uses its money for is disgusting. They've been fined and their charitable giving is less than 1%

[@suem6004]

@@rachell6526 You realize that the non General Authority account mangers running non Church real estate arm did the paperwork wrong? Quick get the smelling salts! Call church headquarters! Testimony of Jesus destroyed due to paperwork! Haha So shallow. You just wanted an excuse to blame others for YOUR lack of living the faith. That is fine. Quite frivolous faith. Tell your woes to Jesus how you saved the world by denouncing the church over paperwork. Hahahahaha

[@hnymnblnk]

I AM A MORMON from the Philippines, its very hard to leave :( I cant wait to start my catechism into the Orthodox Church.

[@suem6004]

Just wait for trying to leave Orthodoxy. You cannot. No way to stop being Orthodox. Watch how thy talk with hatred towards LDS. You want to join a hateful and bigoted organization?

[@LadyMaria]

May it be blessed! 🙏 ☦

[@LadyMaria]

​@@suem6004Someone just walks away, that's how to leave Holy Orthodoxy. We may have negativity towards Mormonism because of the way Mormons treat us (like your comments) and the things that it teaches.

[@suem6004]

@@LadyMaria Honey, show me the LDS attacks on your religion by our religious leaders? Show me those videos slandering Orthodoxy. I will wait. Oh, you found none? Hmmm I wonder who is really the problem in this dialog? You know, LDS do not appreciate being slandered and attacked as you do. We have the right to defend our precious faith. You would not defend your faith? Would you cease to defend against lies and bigotry because the bully group scolds you? This is a mirror. You are being shown how absolutely bigoted you folks are. Adore slandering which is lying about others. A very bad and backwards stance on your part esp as a religious minority in Utah.

[@suem6004]

@@LadyMaria LDS have done nothing towards you at all. You are welcomed and not harassed. Not gossiped about. Honey YOU are the problem, not LDS. Show our leaders slandering Orthodoxy. Please, prove you are right.

[@IIZCHAOS]

As an ex mormon whos farther works for the church and visits utah regularly im glad theres orthodxoy out their. Please pray for my family to come to christ and leave the momon church

[@Saint_nobody]

​@@VioletMomLisalink?

[@IIZCHAOS]

@@VioletMomLisa im no longer mormon im orthodox now. I appriicate it thi

[@jamesdiluzio9906]

​@@VioletMomLisaI'd be real careful using language like knowing for sure who is not getting into heaven. Only God truly knows someone's heart, and we are called not to judge in that way, lest we be judged as well. By the way, I completely agree that adultery is unChristian and sinful, I just try to remind people that at the end of the day, we need to pray for those who are lost, not throw stones at them.

[@Saint_nobody]

​@@VioletMomLisasaw it, thanks. I'll get back to you on my discernment therewith.

[@suem6004]

I explored Orthodoxy but I have MORE Christ in the LDS church. 830 more pages of him. Perhaps you can explain why more is less to you? Maybe your personal study and piety?

[@krama017]

I have an odd obsession of listening to ex-LDS / ex-FLDS videos so this brings me some comfort knowing that they are finding Orthodoxy.

[@daveb5455]

I am an ex-Mormon, who went through an angry atheist phase and am now exploring Orthodoxy. I found it in part thanks to Fr. Truebenbach. Thank you father for sharing these words, they’re very encouraging and uplifting.

[@MajorMustang1117]

Seems a lot of us did. When I left Mormonism, I was so angry that I was obviously lied to that I just though Jesus was fake too. I'm glad He called me back through Orthodoxy. God bless you!

[@Gstrugglin]

May the Lord bless your journey homeward!

[@morsomnus]

I was a angry athiest for 15 years after leaving the mormon church until Christ eventually lead me to orthodoxy.

[@rachell6526]

Me too! Like all of us ex mormons!

[@suem6004]

@@MajorMustang1117 Don't be a drama queen. You were not lied to. You chose to not develop your own spiritual journey to Christ. Rather, focused on how many buttons someone in the 19th century wore. Save your fake outrage on things that never mattered to God. He cares about YOU. What YOU did. Whom YOU served. How much YOU prayed. That is all.

[@armyfirefighter]

Thank you Father. I can certainly testify of that. Grew up in a multigenerational LDS family outside of the inner mountain West. You simply never questioned what you were taught. It was the truth. I went through my mission and came home, married, became a temple worker. It was only then that I really started to encounter and question. It led me to atheism and I properly resigned from the Church. A friend from a Protestant seminary once told me he though being LDS had damaged my ability to have proper faith through that exact betrayal you reference. But here I am now, after so long, embracing Orthodoxy. There is so much new, yes, but at the same time, hints of the truth that were in LDS thinking, that I see come to proper flower as I am learning now. I live in Germany now, so it is difficult being in a massive Roman Catholic area, but I am determined.

[@tacycall8038]

Thanks for this video! I have been watching this channel awhile and enjoy hearing you are shepherding people who are coming out of Mormonism. It has definite nuance to it. “Changing the Filter” of Mormon thought is complex! It was a decade in for me before some theological concepts were able to really take hold in my heart, thank goodness for a God that can penetrate into hearts and work His quiet transformation. I still feel very much like a baby taking some first steps. It’s been a roller coaster to sift through what is the good of my Mormon past I take with me, and what things I leave behind. I took my faith journey in a Baptist community and am so grateful that they patiently walked with me without criticism. Stumbled into all these Orthodox videos and now learning about Christian History with amazement at all of the things that get buried in this idea of a “great apostasy” taught in Mormonism. Thanks again. 🕊️

[@kusterICXC]

God bless you, Father Truebenbach.

[@birdlynn417]

The family support at LDS is what attracts so many. It is a safe harbor for people who don't have any other spiritual, church, or family support.

[@lindaphillips4646]

☦♥️☦ Thank you, Father PAUL and ROOTS OF ORTHODOXY. You are doing something wonderful. Clearly it is needed. As you and all of us in the Orthodox Church know. Honestly, i marvel at many comments. I marvel at how the CHURCH is so blatantly misrepresented in some of them... but that is not a new thing. We used to live in AZ and had many contacts with LDS. I bought a lot of books on the subject to try to understand and respond But i was doing it as a prtnst who didn't have the Holy Orthodox Church and all that it is to teach us all. Many are grateful to God that such congregations as yours exist and such sites as this exist. ☦📿💝📿☦

[@Bones469]

When I walked from Mormonism in 2015 I went from Protestantism to Shamanism, back through Protestantism and now attending with Fr. Justin at St. Xenia. I am not a Catechumen yet, as I have time constraints for Wednesday Catechism but listen to Orthodox Catechism lessons by Fr. Truebenbach almost every night. I really love the Orthodox religion. This all started because I had a dream and feeling that I should have a more healthy relationship with Holy Mary, Theotokos. That left me only a couple choices. I attended a few Catholic (Roman) Masses and as a last ditch effort just before signing up for RCIA I figured to be fair I should at least go to one service at St. Xenia. I absolutely loved it, it felt like home, so holistic, it almost had a "Shamanic" Christian feeling. I probably spend many hours daily in some aspect of the orthodox spirituality but just too gun-shy to tell Fr. Justin I want to be a catechumen.

[@story7088]

Thank you so very much. Your wisdom has encouraged me greatly.

[@johnpeskey4519]

Fabulous video! Blessed Holy Lent! ❤reader John

[@ruthimegi5556]

Yes! Praise God.

[@TranslatedAssumption]

I have many very close and dear friends that are Mormon and I have had so many good conversations with them as well as having learned much from their great example and how they behave morally and treat others. Even the most intelligent and articulate Mormons I know cannot effectively defend the tenants of their faith against Orthodoxy and I know that I was the same way when I was in Catholicism so it is helpful to reflect on the fact that no one is perfect and even as I have journeyed into Orthodoxy I find myself still having much to learn every single day. Have humility to meet people where they're at in their journey in life and in faith, you never know how God may use you as an instrument to help others.

[@suem6004]

Try me. I can defend the reasons for the Restoration and the direct divine mandate from Jesus to restore the broken, manipulated, man invented issues with the other religions. Like their automatic infant damnation if not baptized. That was part of their theology which they have recently come to LDS truth on that. The Orthodox really remove personal accountability and involvement. Some priests hiding behind iconostasis chanting unknown things at an alter while the congregants mill around waiting for them to return. Really? That was original? Try reading the Didache on that. Yes, Jesus and Father themselves restored what man ruined through centuries of superstition, philosophies of men and with the Book of Mormon which is the clearest Christian doctrine testament on the planet. More Jesus is better than less Jesus. Talk to me if you wish to explore this.

[@suem6004]

Thank you your level headedness. Scholars often relate how much LDS and Orthodox share. LDS is one step further spiritually. Living apostles and prophets. Laity as the clergy. Sainthood for marrieds not just singles. I have read quite a bit in Orthodoxy. I sometimes translate for an Orthodox priest so have gotten to know the theology. Infant damnation is an issue for me. Non baptized infants are damned to hell because of the stain of original sin. LDS learned through Jesus how his atonement was infinite and eternal. That all children are covered by the atonement. Not just if you are baptized Orthodox. I think Orthodox do consign LDS to hell. But the reverse is not true.

[@BibbleBabbel]

@@suem6004 you're confusing Roman Catholicism for Eastern Orthodoxy. It's the Orthodox belief that children don't go to hell if they're not baptized. They're baptized so they can be in full communion with the church as participating members.

[@suem6004]

@@BibbleBabbel So, Aztec kids in 800AD never heard the gospel. Never got baptized are doing to heaven?

[@BibbleBabbel]

@@suem6004 never assume that a loving God who died for us is going to condemn people who never heard the gospel. You're LDS, LDS theology teaches that as well as Orthodox. Joseph Smith said he received a revelation about that in relation to his older brother Alvin who died without baptism.

[@alamamia1]

God bless you, Fr. Paul. Thank you for your guidance and mentorship.

[@marinalexandru5714]

Waw ! This guy is such a open book like a real brother. First time seeing such a ortodox person

[@VKTR222]

I am an ex-mo who converted to Catholicism. I am now looking into orthodxy

[@drewbrown6476]

This is what I have been waiting for!!!!!

[@Geotonrike]

Orthodox USA will be like a shining star, I can’t imagine. Especially because how you Americans are so dedicated when you start doing something, you do it until it’s 100% done☦️☦️☦️❤️

[@rachell6526]

Yes! I always say I'm a hundred and ten percenter. I do everything all the way

[@Christisking1911]

I was thinking this same thing in the past. When I became orthodox I was fully committed, and now I plan on becoming a priest. It is exactly what our country needs, because western Christianity has left a bad taste in too many lives. Orthodoxy changed my heart in a way I never knew possible. It will take awhile, but God willing American Orthodoxy will blossom into its own beautiful vibrant expression of the Eastern Orthodoxy. I am so glad I found my way home. Christ is risen!☦️

[@Saint_nobody]

I can. I imagine our founding fathers being orthodox. Theretofor, George Washington would have a worse beard than Fr Peter Heers. Lord have mercy. 😂

[@suem6004]

No, they need living apostles and prophets who speak in THIS dispensation. America does not need another 2000 year old dusty, out of touch, out of date, ritualized, clericalized church. God opened an NEW church for the Americas: The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. An "American grown" church. Not an old world institution with old world antagonisms and superstitions. The Orthodox Church in general is very anti America. Got to Russia, Ukraine, Serbia.... all spew anti American stereotypes and hatreds. God raised HIS church for the Americas. One with living apostles and prophets. With additional texts about American natives encountering the resurrected Christ. And about the destiny of the American continents. That is what is needed. Our church for our people, nation and hemisphere. Christ visited the Americas because he was joining the stick of Judah with the stick of Jesse. He was uniting old world to new world. He wanted one Lord. One faith. One baptism. He loved the Americas and its inhabitants and only warned against apostasy due to unrighteousness. Who better to deliver the gospel in the Americas than that which Jesus himself appeared in person and instituted right here?

[@suem6004]

God established his church based in America: the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints was founded in America and talks about this hemisphere.

[@drewbrown6476]

Thank you so much for this!

[@rodzorger1860]

I am a former mormon, and am coming into orthodoxy. To me, I felt that Mormonism had gone the way of the Catholic church in becoming distant from original teachings. The Mormon Church of today is nothing that Joseph Smith expected or wanted. They have even changed and deleted some of the temple ordinances.

[@Saint_nobody]

How much do you study the original teachings? I was listening to Journal of Discourse and another channel which features early conference messages a couple hours ago then I followed it with the video put out by the church today. I see no dispersion. Perhaps you do, I'll patiently read your response thereof, brother.

[@DM5550Z]

Such an interesting story. Also mormonism just is unlike any other church bc it appeared out of nowhere and smiths own culture and ideas dictated everything.

[@Adam-ww8ei]

The temple ordinances come from ma$onry. Smith desired to perfect their rituals and institute them in the church. They are not biblical. The ancient temple in Jerusalem had nothing like the endowment as we can read in the Old Testament.

[@St.MosestheBlack]

His original teachings were far worse. He was con man who's teachings departed completely from Historic Christianity. He taught, for instance, that God was once a man with a God. That God ascended to the status of a God, that each God had God. And that we too can become Gods and rule over our own creation. Mormons are polytheists. He also taught Christ was spirit brothers with Satan and that God the Father had a wife. - Apostle Bruce R. McConkie, Mormon Doctrine, 1966 ed., p. 250. “Mormon prophets have continuously taught the sublime truth that God the Eternal Father was once a mortal man who passed through a school of earth life similar that through which we are now passing. He became God - an exalted being - through obedience to the same eternal Gospel truths that we are given opportunity to obey.” - Prophet Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, v. 1, p. 10 “There is a statement often repeated in the Church, and while it is not in one of the Standard Church Works, it is accepted as church doctrine, and this is: ‘As man is, God once was; as God is, man may become.” “God himself was once as we are now, and is an exalted man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens! That is the great secret.... It is the first principle of the Gospel to know for a certainty the Character of God, and to know... that he was once a man like us.... Here, then, is eternal life - to know the only wise and true God; and you have got to learn how to be Gods yourselves... the same as all Gods have done before you...” - Prophet Joseph Smith, Jr., “King Follett Discourse,” Journal of Discourses, v. 6, pp. 3-4, also in Teachings of the Prophet of Joseph Smith, pp. 345-346. “The Father became the Father at some time before ‘the beginning' as humans know it, by experiencing a mortality similar to that experienced on earth... Gods and humans are the same species of being, but at different stages of development in a divine continuum, and that the heavenly Father and Mother are the heavenly pattern, model, and example of what mortals can become through obedience to the gospel.... Knowing that they are the literal offspring of Heavenly Parents and that they can become like those parents through the gospel of Jesus Christ is a wellspring of religious motivation.” - Encyclopedia of Mormonism

[@Adam-ww8ei]

@@St.MosestheBlack yes this is common knowledge among anyone who has familiarity with the LDS church. Thanks for the many quotes

[@orthodoxnet9677]

Amen! God works in mysterious and blessed ways.

[@ChristianWario]

This is a very similar situation for former Jehovah’s Witnesses. We should pray for people who are and were in these groups, it leaves them with scars.

[@suem6004]

Not me. I am closer to the Savior than ever. With the world's ever changing doctrines, doing their things, nice that living prophets and apostles guide us today and not those dead 2000 year old mute apostles only.

[@BibbleBabbel]

​@@suem6004apostle was always a term for an eyewitness to Christ's ministry. There were hundreds of apostles including women. It was never an ordained calling.

[@suem6004]

@@BibbleBabbel Um apostles were personal ordained by Jesus laying hands on heads of apostles. No “ I think I will appoint myself as apostle”.

[@BibbleBabbel]

@@suem6004 apostle is a Greek way of saying missionary. From apostellein (send forth) and apostolos (messenger). Read the scriptures that talk about their ordination again. Matthew 10:1-4, Mark 3:13-19, and Luke 6:12-16. They're ordained by Christ to teach, heal, and cast out demons. Not to an office called Apostle. Others were called to teach the gospel and establish the church who never witnessed Christ's earthly ministry, like Paul and Barabas. There are even a couple rare female apostles.

[@BibbleBabbel]

@@suem6004 who ordains apostles in the LDS church? I can guarantee it's not Christ. It's the president of the church that ordains the apostle. You are currently saying that the LDS church is false because Christ doesn't ordain personally.

[@georgepapatheofilou6118]

Kind words. Blessings to all and sundry .

[@herrgodfrey9563]

I really like this priest. He's very relatable. I've been investigating Orthodoxy, though I'm technically an Arminian Protestant. I agree a lot with Orthodoxy. The only thing my conscience won't let me do is pray to saints, intercessory prayer or not. Other than that, I'm on board. Please pray for me. I have been drawn toward Orthodoxy organically and I don't think it's by accident.

[@LadyMaria]

Nothing wrong with intercessory petition. We all do it for one another.

[@williamcordasco945]

The saints are our “cloud of witnesses” and we pray to them for their intercession, just like we ask any living friend (on earth) to pray for us. We don’t, and never should worship them- that is heresy. Note in our iconography that the saints are looking at us, as if to say “we did what we could on earth; you?”. Cherish their gaze my friend.

[@HowdyHowdens]

I love my orthodox brothers. As an ex-Mormon I found the truth in Catholicism. And I think Mormons make such great Catholics or Orthodox. I love this!!

[@on_the_journey_101]

I like how you pointed out the filter it does take time and patience im grateful that i was able to realize i had that filter even tho i no longer believed in it its a process

[@Frogman1943]

i was a mormon, but after i grew up and learned more, im a latter day saint of the church of jesus christ.

[@nathanbarth7658]

I'm a protestant, that recently converted to be a catechumen. I did not leave Protestantism because I was angry, I left because I researched about the Orthodox church. I found that they were the original church and that they could trace their ordination back to the apostles. That is my reasoning for becoming orthodox.

[@suem6004]

That is because there are great conspiracy theories some LDS get duped into believing that they have been deceived. Something about the church saying Joseph Smith's shirt was white when it was actually off white.

[@suem6004]

They are not followers of Peter. They departed from Catholicism

[@nathanbarth7658]

@@suem6004 wrong Orthodox was before the Roman Catholic church...

[@suem6004]

@@nathanbarth7658 Nope. Orthodox did not come through Peter in Rome.

[@nathanbarth7658]

@suem6004 you need to research church history. Orthodox church was the first, then Roman Catholic broke off from it...

[@joshuachaffin1858]

Where is your church?? I’m an ex Mormon in Utah: I go to a Presbyterian church but have been interested in orthodoxy. Would love to attend.

[@ArchangelIcon]

Sts. Peter & Paul Orthodox Church located in Salt Lake City, Utah

[@JoshuaMonjin]

Holy Trinity in SLC and St Anna in Sandy are the Greek Orthodox if you want to try them too.

[@Saint_nobody]

​@@ArchangelIconwhat cross streets? How far from Temple Square?

[@ArchangelIcon]

@@Saint_nobody I have no idea. I saw the address below the video ;-)

[@noahibanez6414]

I’m 16 and was an LDS but looked into the early church fathers and saw orthodoxy was the truth

[@suem6004]

Except you deny Jesus as the living resurrected Lord who returned to earth to correct corrupt teachings of the clerical churches. They reject and stone prophets and apostles. Watch the Grand Inquisitor. A piece of fiction by Orthodox Dostoevsky. John Gielgud acted in that short piece. Watch on youtube. Jesus returns but the church hierarchy the church tells Jesus to leave, the clergy know the people better than Jesus. Please watch it. Good literature and good acting. You are not familiar with very clergy only do everything.

[@suem6004]

Orthodoxy does not accept Peter as the first apostle and head of the church. As LDS you know better than to give up grad school theology for nursery school level with painted boards ti kiss and worship. That is idolatry.

[@lukasmiller486]

You ought to read Lynn Wilder’s autobiography Unveiling Grace. She goes in great depth about the history of Mormonism and their doctrines and how they compare to Christianity. You can tell from the way she writes and speaks in lectures, she really loves and cares about these people even though she has moved on from them.

[@suem6004]

Having more of Christ is better than having less. See, the pharisees argued exact same thing. Christianity is ahistorical. No torah law agrees with Christianity. Completely different doctrines, religious ritual, messiah qualities. Pharisees agreed: only by previously written and kept law can judge new prophets and their preaching. Jesus of course failed their test. As you insist LDS fail your test. I highly recommend the Grand Inquisitor in which Jesus’ appearance in 16th century Inquisition times had an arrogant cleryman telling Jesus why Jesus was no longer needed. The church was in charge. Not Jesus. Inquisitor burned Jesus at the stake for being a threat or heretic to their established religion. THAT is argument against Orthodoxy. Jesus is NOT the head of the church.

[@Ray-zv8zs]

Pray for my girlfriend to find THE REAL Christ in our Orthodoxy ❤

[@cent7169]

I was raised Roman Catholic, who became an agnostic and went to investigate Iglesia ni Cristo (A unitarian Church originated in 1914) and Mormon Church, then became Muslim. What INC, LDS Church, and Islam have in common is that all of them claims that the message of Jesus was lost and their founders revided it. Another thing is that all of them were established because of an alleged "angel," (Felix Manalo for INC, Moroni in LDA, and Jibreel in Islam). But as Jesu said that His church will never be lost, neither the gates of hades will prevail (Matt 16:18). St. Paul taught us in Galatians that even if an angel preach another gospel, we must reject it. After years, now I'm a catechumen in the Orthodox Church. Pray for me my dear brothers and sisters in Christ.

[@MartyRodriguezOrthodoxMarine]

God Almighty Bless Anyone Who Definitely Discovers The Tier One and Only, Holy, Eastern Orthodox Catholic and Apostolic Orthodox Christian ☦️ Church Especially in " The Beehive State " of Utah. God Bless You All In The Name of The Father and of The Son and of The Holy Spirit, Now and Forever, Unto Ages of Ages, AMEN 🙏. AXIOS ☦️‼️

[@virginiaday2934]

And some end up in New Age when they leave lds because Joseph Smith taught that Adam and Eve were aliens. It depends on how fundamental your lds teachers were. I’m so grateful to be Orthodox. It’s a huge relief.

[@livingfreelyinspired7400]

Glories to Jesus Christ who saved me from idolatry lord have mercy!

[@suem6004]

Idolatry? What is not idolatry about Mary worship?

[@PurpleSmokeFace]

He seems to have it all figured out. Good for him.

[@willhedges6639]

I would love to get a video from you guys about advise for former atheists

[@AnAlbanyExpression]

I struggle with this as well and a beautiful series of lectures have helped me to square this circle. Look up St. Elijah Evangelion and there is an 8 part series, an Ortho 101 seminar as it were. I was raised southern Baptist and was baptized at a young age without any real belief in God, Christ or the church. The lecture series digs into what belief means in the West versus the East. In the West we have a tendency to make Christ more of a mental abstraction. I believe that Jesus existed therefore I am saved. It must be lived. Jesus in John chapter 3 talked about how the Son of Man must be raised as the bronze serpent was raised. This is referring to the bronze serpent Moses formed when the Israelites were wo sering in a region of poisonous snakes and dying fro. The snakebites. The real meat of the issue for me was this. The Israelites who were bitten had to physically see the snake. They could not simply have a mental abstraction of what the snake was and be cured of their snakebite. Imagining the bronze serpent was not enough. The belief was in the action and not in the mind. The faith must be a lived and dynamic experience. There must be an active seeking of Christ and His ways in order to believe. Much of the meaning, sadly, has been lost in the translations throughout the centuries. That's why Sola Scriptura is such a stumbling block for so many. We aren't living from the original text and things have been lost. I am very new to this but struggled through an atheist phase for decades. Nowhere else have I found an answer so satisfactory to my question: "why can't I believe?" Glory be and I wish you the best on your journey.

[@alexdiaz155]

If St. Sophrony is right (and he probably is) I’ve got another 18 years until I’m Orthodox 😅 in God’s time ❤

[@clanmacmillan4483]

I'm former LDS. On a social level I've always liked mormons, but I never believed in the book of mormon- which therefore I wasn't really LDS to begin with.

[@dustins382]

Most Mormons I've come across express the same sentiment. They don't really care about theology. They just like the community.

[@Saint_nobody]

​@@dustins382most mainstream Christians are the same way. Most Muslims as well. Likely most jews and other faiths also.

[@suem6004]

There is Utah cultural Mormons (LDS) then there are converts outside Utah whose testimonies are strong. I think the LDS church has more light and knowledge than any other Christian church but as happens in all churches, the members do not always live the gospel to its fullest. The priest in this video comments on how pleasantly surprised that converts actually live moral Christian lives. Most members of other Christians faiths have dissonance with being a cultural member of a parish vs being a genuine disciple and living the commandments. LDS come into all other churches with basically a master's degree in scripture studies. So many discussion I can hold with clergy of other faiths because of 40 years of LDS Church curriculum. I know more about their faiths than they know about ours. So, tolerance, in my experience, is unidirectional. They share their faith with me, but have no interest in hearing about mine. Such unilateral relationship are never genuine or beneficial. In my experience.

[@atkkeqnfr]

The View of the Hebrews must be an eye-opener to a lot of Mormons.

[@Saint_nobody]

How so?

[@georgerolfs9004]

It was to LDS historian and apostle B.H.Roberts!

[@BibbleBabbel]

That and I think 3 other books the BOM plagiarized off of 😅

[@suem6004]

The book of Hebrews confirms LDS theology. All the Bible does. Orthodox cannot explain how the OT merges into the continuing story of in the NT and why God would stop communicating with humans over 2000 years. They have no explanation. Question Orthodoxy's claims. They eliminate all participants from the eucharist blessing behind screens. It is a clerical religion and not an all members are saints theology. Their saints are few and far between and not really Orthodox as we know it. Anthony of Egypt they claim but he was a hermit. Never had the eucharist. You have the entire Mount Athos which excludes females like the early Jewish clergy considered females as spiritual pollutants too. Ordinary Orthodox merely passively participate. They have no saintly model for families. Only single people become saintly. No eternal families. No children with parents in heaven. Nope. Not on the mark.

[@Saint_nobody]

​@@BibbleBabbelplease. It's mostly taken directly from Isaiah. Everyone knows that.

[@Callahan757575]

I am in Lovland CO. I wonder if he is under the same Bishop?

[@brianhuffman2070]

I am a Utah resident. Near salt lake. Raised split between Catholics and Mormons. I tried to attend an Orthodox service near downtown and found the outside gate locked and no way to enter

[@georgeovchinnikov1105]

Have you looked at their website and found what time their services are? I’m sure you’ll find some contact info too. Don’t give up, keep knocking.

[@austinpissey8789]

Hey man, if you need a service to go to, feel free to come to St. Anna's parish in Sandy any Sunday. It's only about 20 mins from Holy Trinity cathedral downtown (they're the only ones I know with a full gate). Vespers start at 9, and the liturgy starts at 10. New people show up all the time, and there are plenty of Mormon and Catholic converts at the parish; You'll feel right at home and welcomed. Hope you make it out sonetime!

[@brianhuffman2070]

@@austinpissey8789 if I want to attend a Catholic service I'll go to either our Lady of Lourdes in magna or st. Margarites in Tooele.

[@suem6004]

LISTEN to GENERAL CONFERENCE of the Church of Jesus Christ of latter day saints. THIS WEEKEND. All Saturday and Sunday. You cannot consider joining the church without understanding its teachings by living apostles and prophets.

[@brianhuffman2070]

@@suem6004 I am a baptized and confirmed member of the Mormon and Catholic churches. I will not be attending conference this weekend

[@jimpix6677]

QUESTION: What does humility mean? Saint Isaac The Syrian said that "Genuine humility means to see reality as it actually is in God. It means to know oneself and others as known by God" - but that leaves the question of, how does God see me and others? I often think humility is degrading oneself and having no confidence or self esteem. Is this a wrong view of humility?

[@BibbleBabbel]

Humility is receptivity to God's teachings and correcting yourself when you're found to be in error. Please, please, God doesn't want you to hate yourself. In fact when Jesus taught to turn the other cheek if slapped, in context of that ancient culture turning the other cheek forced the other person to slap you as they would an equal instead of a backhand which means you're below them. All of God's children are worthy of respect.

[@scarboroughbluffer169]

Are you Canadian? I’m guessing lol. You sound like an NHL player (and I’m CDN btw too) lol

[@KnoxEmDown]

Ancient Faith Radio has several good podcasts on this topic

[@Saint_nobody]

I listened to their one about prophets and prophecy. In all due respects, nothing they said debunks Joseph Smith Jun.

[@sylenx02]

Hi could someone please explain this to me lol. Does Orthodox Christianity worship Saints? Is it optional?Because to me the only one worthy of praise and prayer is Jesus and God. By praying to Saints, is that not breaking the Commandment “Have no other gods before me” or “You shall not make for yourself an idol” I’m sort of ‘feeling out’ Orthodox as it seems a cool way to worship and I like the discipline and it’s sacredness that comes with it. For reference I’m currently Presbyterian.

[@Saint_nobody]

No, they do not worship saints.

[@innerpull]

I think your cautions are very good. And I think you'll be pleasantly surprised to closer in you look at these things from the lens of Orthodoxy. In other ways you'll discover how distinct it is too from Roman Catholicism. Just remember that for each hesitation as you approach it, these things have all been thought and experienced by others. You'll make your own decision, but at least knowing this, you'll be able to see it better for what it is as those initial thoughts fire off based on your personal background separate from its own context and order. Orthodoxy is remarkably developed in its theology, so you can go as deeply as it feels natural to for you in your questions. Be patient to ask priests questions (even by email if you're nervous at first), and to seek out sources The Church affirms.

[@yvoennsche]

I suggest to listen to the podcast "Lord of Spirits" by Fr. Andrew Damick and Fr. Stephen de Young. There are several episodes on the saints, etc. They do a deep dive into theology as well, it is always very informative. The short of it is that, No, we don't worship the Saints. We honor them. Worship is exclusively reserved for God. The problem is also, how you define worship. Singing or asking for intercession is not worship. Former Lutheran here.

[@LadyMaria]

Worship entails sacrifice, so no. The only sacrifice is the one we give to God in the Divine Liturgy that He returns to us as Himself.

[@saltnessmonster]

People have to leave their families and everything to leave the faith.

[@GldnClaw]

Faithful active Latter-day Saint here. If some people need to understand the nature of Love, Grace, and a personal relationship with God and Christ in other locales, that's ok. The Lord allows us "stepping stones" of Faith. Big things like the Covenants made in the Temple are hard if things only feel transactional or courtroom. However, please consider that returning is always available and that Heavenly Father wants you to enjoy everything He has.

[@dojocho1894]

When one studies how the mormons ended up in Utah is basically everyone thought they were nuts and drove them west...they actually started out in the east coast.

[@suem6004]

Wrong. The Fanatical Puritans who also burned witches, enslaved blacks and lynched them, who inspired Jewish genocide, then mobbed the jail where Joseph was held for trial and martyred him. So, wonder why the restoration HAD to occur. Why Jesus called those denominations "an abomination"? The evangelicals attacked Catholics too in Missouri.. so is Catholicism evil and false? Think before posting. True religions are always persecuted. Ask the good Orthodox priest about that.

[@Saint_nobody]

Yep. Diaspora is strong with God's people.

[@suem6004]

Like the Israelites of the OT?

[@greententacle22]

I don't think there are any Christian churches or denominations that are completely true. I know there are those that would disagree with me on that. However, I still find some things appealing about Orthodoxy, but before I would try Orthodoxy two things would have to happen. First, they would have to build a church in my town. And second, they would need to put in pews. Yes I know you can sit along the edges and it's said most people wouldn't even notice, but then you're still being separated from the majority of the congregation that's standing, in a way. If your meeting is going to be longer than five minutes, you need to put in pews so everyone can sit down together, as a group. With the Mormon church, all you have to do is look at the history and scholarship of the Book of Mormon to find out it's a 19th century creation, and research the actual history of Joseph Smith to find out that he wasn't who he claimed to be. With that as a foundation, if you then research what's going on in the church currently, you'll find out why so many people are taking issue with the history and modern day activities of the Mormon church and are leaving. There's a reason the Mormon church tells its members to only read church materials and approved sources, and discourages them from researching things.

[@kanakar-is]

In a bunch of Orthodox churches in the west there are pews, its just that in traditional Orthodox churches people don't tend to sit down. Its not a doctrine really, just a cultural thing. When I visited an orthodox church in the UK they had pews and most of the congregation was sitting down. there are parts that you have to stand up though during liturgy.

[@LadyMaria]

​@@kanakar-isIt's not cultural to stand, it's how Christians always worshiped despite different ethnicities in the first millennium, and in the second in Holy Orthodoxy. Standing is how one receives a king and Christ is the King of all. Only the King would sit.

[@leightonanderson]

As a convert TO the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, I have engaged with Orthodox faithful in some depth. It is true that there are important shared values. But the Church's teaching about the Apostasy stands up against the historical record; and how can any of us take one side against the other regarding the Great Schism of 1054. "Trinity" teaching in Orthodoxy is completely incoherent - as it is anywhere - and the very heavy reliance on "church fathers" becomes oppressive, locking Orthodoxy into outmoded (and wrong) thought. And don't get me started on "Church history." There are no pogroms in the history of our Church.

[@prometheusrex1]

Good points all.

[@birdlynn417]

You said, "and the very heavy reliance on "church fathers" becomes oppressive, locking Orthodoxy into outmoded (and wrong) thought." ?? They are the reason WHY I am drawn to this church as much as I am, and am leaving the LDS church, as I study more and more of their books, because of the spiritual fathers who speak the truth with the Holy Spirit about the scriptures and our Lord unlike ANY church or pastor, or Bishop can do or has done. I am so thankful for our traditional, Christian fathers, and their faithful and true following of God's word, truth, and teachings that you seem to only find, "oppressive".

[@leightonanderson]

@@birdlynn417 OK well, that's what you say. But I've read those ECFs too and they depart from the scriptures on point after point, and yet do not claim what WE do, which is that prophets and apostles (see Eph. 2:20; 4:11-16) are authorized to receive revelation for the Church. You can tell me that they "speak the truth with the Holy Spirit about the scriptures" but you can't SHOW that to me, because time after time it turns out to be gibberish about essence and energies and Holy Trinity and stuff like that. And my point is still valid, which is that the very heavy reliance on "church fathers" becomes oppressive, locking Orthodoxy into outmoded (and wrong) thought. As a convert to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, I welcome the uniqueness - a uniqueness which HAS TO BE FOUND in the Lord's Church - that there is and will be continuing revelation to guide the Lord's Church and the Lord's people through the last dispensation until the Savior's return. This is a necessary requirement (proof of that is found throughout the New Testament including the passages I cited above) and is found nowhere else but in the Church of the Lamb that you have chosen to abandon.

[@st.maximusvstheuglies1309]

"Outmoded" and 'wrong' according to whom and according to what criteria, exactly? "Oppressive" according to whom and according to what? As to your assertion that the Trinity is incoherent ('gibberish' even), I'm willing to bet you believe in much which can easily be shown to be incoherent and/or ineffable.

[@leightonanderson]

@@st.maximusvstheuglies1309 Well, I certainly have zero interest in what you are willing to bet. 🙂 I explained what I meant by oppressive and outmoded; while early Christian teaching can give insight into the meaning of New Testament texts, post-Nicene philosophy on the nature of the Godhead is, yes, to use your word, ineffable and self-admittedly so. It's outmoded in the sense that by adopting their words as equivalent to scripture, it becomes disallowed to criticize them; which is oppressive in its nature. I thought that was already clear, but if not, there you are. You can tell me that ECFs "speak the truth with the Holy Spirit about the scriptures" but you can't SHOW that to me, because time after time it turns out to be gibberish about essence and energies and Holy Trinity and stuff like that. And my point is still valid, which is that the very heavy reliance on "church fathers" becomes oppressive, locking Orthodoxy into outmoded (and wrong) thought. As a convert to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, I welcome the uniqueness - a uniqueness which HAS TO BE FOUND in the Lord's Church - that there is and will be continuing revelation to guide the Lord's Church and the Lord's people through the last dispensation until the Savior's return. This is a necessary requirement (proof of that is found throughout the New Testament including the passages I cited above) and is found nowhere else but in the Church of the Lamb that you have chosen to abandon.

[@ChanahsCreativeEdits]

Orthodox Christian vs Orthodox Jew That would be a debate of real substance and interest. Sh'ma Yisrael Adonai Eloheinu Adonai Eḥad❤

[@Saint_nobody]

Cue, Tradition from The Fiddler on the Roof soundtrack.

[@arscheerio]

2:03-2:16 I think you'd be surprised at someone like Hugh Nibley, if you truly do think this about the Church.

[@jack-q8y8b]

"seek ye out of the best books words of wisdom"

[@jacobmayberry1126]

I disagree with Fr. Paul. I'm a faithful Latter-day Saint and have studied my history extensively. Our history is our greatest strength especially when it comes to the three and eight witnesses to the gold plates. Their testimonies are pretty airtight and there is more eyewitness evidence for what they saw than there is for the resurrection of Jesus. I think Fr. Paul is overestimating the effect church history has on LDS members because he's primarily interacting with exmormons who join his flock instead of interacting with a more representative sample of Latter-day Saints. Personally, I've found Orthodox and Catholic apologists to be pretty late to the game when it comes to engaging with my faith, which causes their engagement to be pretty superficial. Protestants and Atheists have been at it for much longer so their arguments against Mormonism are a bit more sophisticated and informed.

[@prometheusrex1]

Insightful. Thanks

[@order_truth_involvement6135]

Those claims of witnesses are biased. Most are biologically related to each other and have social ties with each other. On top of that, the historicity of the account in the book of mormon is the nail in the coffin. On top of that, the objective history of Joseph Smith as having been a convicted criminal and conman speak louder. On top of that, the ovjective debunking of the Pearl of Great Price as being an absolute forgery, and the original document a funerary death scroll is extremely damning. On top of that, let us pretend that all the witnesses have nothing biased for anyone to doubt their claims, this still does not explain the veracity of what is claimed within the book of mormon. Witness accounts exist in larger numbers for other things, such as miracles in the Roman Catholic Church of seeing Marian apparitions, there are even accounts from witnesses to crimes in which later DNA evidence overturns the guilty verdict. Witness account statements are not foolproof of anything. From a source: "For instance, all 11 witnesses to the Book of Mormon shared a common worldview of second sight, magic, and treasure digging. All of the living Book of Mormon witnesses, except Oliver Cowdery, later accepted James Strang’s prophetic claim of being Joseph’s true successor and joined his church. All witnesses except Martin Harris were related to Joseph Smith or David Whitmer." In any court case these elements would add a value suspicion to the account of the witnesses. There is no evidence that can solidly prove the existence of the golden plates. Beyind that, the matter becomes a subject of reason. If one is to use his reason, mormonism is not true. Of the things that could be true versus their probability, there is also the matter of things that can be objectively disproven, such as the pearl of great price, the account within the book of mormon, and the overall claim of reatorationism.

[@RichardHolmes-ll8ii]

0:32 "the advent of the internet" The internet?

[@jerr0.]

ad·vent noun the arrival of a notable person, thing, or event. "the advent of television"

[@RichardHolmes-ll8ii]

​@@jerr0.I know what advent means.

[@RichardHolmes-ll8ii]

​@@jerr0.I just found it strange that he actually expected the internet to be a credible source to investigate the LDS Church.

[@RichardHolmes-ll8ii]

​@@jerr0.Though however the falsehoods spread about the LDS Church on the internet can easily be debunked by the internet. It's just that he didn't add that.

[@jerr0.]

​@@RichardHolmes-ll8ii The internet itself doesn't investigate things. People do. The internet just makes it easier to spread the word. The spread of information is enough. Things like the news, history, and Ex-Mormon testimonies do plenty of "damage". Mormon culture seems to shelter it's followers from certain information, which was easier when it was on TV or in a book. Now everyone has the internet in their pocket. It's not as easy.

[@GnohmPolaeon.B.OniShartz]

The Kingdom about you now bows to me. I told you, I am a Pope Mostest the Least. I was born here.

[@John-jh999]

"Courtroom god" ?? That is a LIE!!

[@clbaird40]

I hear all this stuff about grace, and it's a good thing. That being said, most religions, including orthodoxy to my knowledge, demand that you bend your will to church practices or that grace doesn't apply to you. There is grace,IF IF IF, you keep the fasts and do not sin for the most part. Along with the prayers (which are also good). And attend services 3 days a week or more. It's not that you are shunned if you do not do these things, but let's be honest, they will show you kindness but you are apart from them and not orthodox. I want to be orthodox but as a person who lived in the secular world for many years it seems insurmountable. May God have mercy on my sinful soul.

[@lilofee27772]

...just immerse yourself in the church life of a parish ...why 'cracking your head' about other people. It's still your relationship with Christ. The church is but a vehicle which helps.

[@Dengtree]

It a struggle but awesome at the same time. The faith is not easy but we have to carry our cross and trust Jesus Christ 🙏🏾

[@player1playforfun]

It's not really much about not sinning, it's more about repentence. Constantly asking God to forgive you, while you slowly change your habits, naturally makes you not sin.

[@innerpull]

From reading what you've said, it feels like you genuinely are moving through a process approaching it, testing it. It does help to be aware of that fact, and in many ways it can be good, as you build a new foundation. Carry that struggle into your curiosity and yearning so that you don't stop short of understanding. A large part of it is participation and patience. It takes some 'walking back' from a Western lens of how we translate everything, but the work put in does prove out for itself the reward here. Some books that helped me begin were Acquiring The Mind of Christ and Thinking Orthodox. To put it briefly, Western society's language of the spiritual (Protestants and non-Christians alike) is informed by Roman Catholicism - either directly, as a response, or indirectly. But it's by no means insurmountable. Even if you need to start with audiobooks and just catch what falls into your ear! Slowly but surely...it's all here. Lord Jesus Christ, have mercy on us!

[@Da_ni_ela_]

Fasting and the rest are tools to help you, not goals. See what your goal is, start small and then add some more. And don't worry so much: once an orthodox, always an orthodox. "He gives rest unto him who comes at the eleventh hour, even as unto him who has wrought from the first hour." (Saint John Chrysostom)

[@John-jh999]

The LDS church is built on the rock of revelation, those who step away are simply going from 1 church to another. Spiritually they have already left the building / their gospel experience stopped at "membership." Those who are experiencing the visions and blessings of old, they aren't going anywhere.

[@BibbleBabbel]

Revelation that changes frequently to suit the needs of the leaders is not true revelation. That's a great way to gaslight people into doing what you want. There are many revelations in the LDS church that contradict what the BOM teaches. Jacob 2 is highly anti-polygamy, Trinitarian God was part of the original manuscript and then subsequently changed to include the Son as separate in the text. Here's a web page that goes over some of the places where the BOM contradicts the Bible as well. The Bible, through ancient copies predating Christianity of the Septuagint and the Dead Sea Scrolls as well as the thousands of agreeing copies of the New Testament speak to the correctness of the Bible we have inherited in modern times. The only things removed were done by the Protestants to be in line with the Masoretic Jewish canon that only was settled into a canon a couple hundred years after the advent of Christianity. But Orthodox scripture includes those deuterocanonical works that were removed by protestants. christiandefense.org/mormonism/book-of-mormon-contradictions/#:~:text=Book%20of%20Mormon%20Contradictions%20%28LDS%29%201%20%281%29%20The,to%20mankind%20%282%20Nephi%202%3A23-25%29.%20...%20More%20items On the off chance that you're up for looking into the ancient church history, I hope this helps you in your journey to the return to the church that Christ organized, established, as well as promised that hell would not have power over it to destroy it. ❤

[@LadyMaria]

We have Saints in Holy Orthodoxy in every generation who have the actual gift of prophecy. We're seeing events unfolding now prophesied by some of our newer Saints.

[@arscheerio]

I'm LDS, been looking into Orthodoxy for about 2 years. The Orthodox church is basically like the Church but it doesn't have authority, a foundation of apostles and prophets, or revelation. I love the art though! You all have great artists. I have a lot of questions for Orthodoxy, but my biggest one is how you all allow Atheist symbols to be placed into your chapels.

[@innerpull]

Thankfully, all of these mentioned are truly present in the Orthodox Church. I'd be curious to know where you've been reading about these things as you've been gathering some impressions the past couple years. Though, Atheism is quite new, as for 'symbols,' so I wonder which you mean that you had thought were placed into its temples. May God bless you in your search!

[@arscheerio]

@@innerpullYour military Cathedrals are full of Atheist and Marxist symbols.

[@suem6004]

Talk to Alonzo Gaskill. Read his conversion story from Orthodoxy to Latter Day Saint. His Orthodox parents disowned him for converting. Orthodox are very insular, ethnic centered. No revelation, prophets, apostles. But I agree, some wonderful music. But having living apostles and prophets showing how Jesus is aware of us TODAY and wishes to lead, direct, admonish, inspire us here and now is incredibly privileged. I cannot understand why the animosity towards prophets and apostles. Jesus set up his church that way.

[@arscheerio]

@@innerpull The channel won't let me post the link, but there are military cathedrals with Atheist symbols all throughout it.

[@innerpull]

What Atheist symbols? Atheism is quite new.

[@Zanna_pr]

всё правильно: у каждого свои ступеньки на пути к встрече с Господом, и одни только врата в рай для всех,и они узки. У каждого одна жизнь, и она с Богом. Всё остальное - наносное, фейк, иллюзия

[@suem6004]

Usually Orthodox become Latter Day Saints because the next step to truth is apostles and prophets. Orthodox have none. They have no unified religion. No ONE prophet or leader. Just tribes of ethnic groups are orthodox.

[@suem6004]

А что именно вы знаете о Мормонах? Они он близки к Православным.

[@Zanna_pr]

@@suem6004 ничего не знаю о ком либо. Моя цель - узнать о себе.

[@suem6004]

@@Zanna_pr но это разговор о Мормонском теологи. Если вам не интересует во етом, нечего вам нужно добавит.

[@Zanna_pr]

@@suem6004 мне нравится именно этот священник. Поэтому не важно, что он сейчас говорит об одном, а потом о другом. Главное - он говорит правильные вещи.

[@suem6004]

I ask this priest why the Orthodox community rebuffs outreach by LDS leaders and professors? The hatred towards LDS is strong. Not very inclusive, welcoming, Christian. Why do you feel you are too good to enter into interfaith dialog? I personally know LDS religious professor who has reached out but you slap away any communication and dialog. Yet, you present falsehoods about LDS theology from your limited understanding. Seems you should want all the truth about LDS doctrine before slandering the faith. A great turn off among LDS if you spout lies but then seek to evangelize LDS. Just another bigoted religion is the image you present. I have no problem with you disagreeing with LDS on points of doctrine but first LEARN from LDS experts what the doctrine is.

[@LadyMaria]

Ecumenism is anathematized in our Faith. We don't believe in it. You ask us to deny our Faith then to embrace ecumenism. Please try to think of that. Many LDS spread falsehoods about our beliefs. The attitude I've gotten from so many of them just for even discussing basic theology is just sad. It makes me very turned off from them. I've also been treated badly in person by them for not wanting to convert. That all makes us hesitant to engage with those of your religion.

[@suem6004]

@@LadyMaria So, you dislike when others misunderstand and misrepresent your religion yet are fully justified to turn around and do that towards LDS? Lacking self awareness are you? Those religions who are so pharisaical towards other Christians... you are the problem. Not others. How self righteous and bigoted Orthodox are. Like you live in the Middle Ages protecting your fiefdom. Which ethnicity is your Orthodoxy? Russian? Greek? Serbian? No American Orthodox is there?

[@suem6004]

@@LadyMaria sorry but it is up to you to be open as you are guests in LDS homeland. You need to show respect towards others.

[@LadyMaria]

​​@@suem6004 Funny comment! The US is home to all religions not just the tiny sect of LDS. You don't show respect for anyone. If it did turn into LDS land, I'd go to Alaska. Still America, but historically has lots of Orthodox Christians for centuries.

[@jerr0.]

Bigoted? We have so many passages on false prophets and you guys fell for the guy who sticks his face in a hat and preached polygamy. Oh polygamy is bad now? Just change it and pretend that it was never part of the religion. Then there's the whole Lamanites and Nephites thing that has no basis in reality (actually bigoted)... Oh wait change that too. The Book of Mormon needs to be altered or "reinterpreted" every few years for all the embarrassing ideas in it. It doesn't seem like the holy unbreakable word of God to me.

[@GnohmPolaeon.B.OniShartz]

I'm just pointing out. When an Apostle is sent. Do not ignore them. If you doubt. Doubt in the word. Do not turn away a man, sent to enrich, as then his job becomes dismantling. The Church has always been an Anarchy. We have the code, and we follow the word. By separating us into cults we had maintained a purity by being incorrigible and incorruptible by merit of a disorganization. You cannot hit, what you cannot see. So there are no leaders, and anyone can preach. DO YOU GET IT? The faith died with Jesus and we've been backsliding from the moment the Nailed him down.

[@CallMeQuinnie]

"Doubt the Word"?!?! Please do not take this as an attack on character and rather the deception, but this is blasphemous... If all of the Father's creation is The Word (seeing as how he spoke us into existence) then how can we doubt His Word... that's doubting what He is presenting before us as truth and thus succumbing to a deception. I would agree that it is crucial to not turn from the words of the Holy Spirit of a true follower of Christ, that is why the Church has come to recognize such figures as saints! These saints have aligned with our Lord's truth to such a degree that they have essentially become earthly angels... Luke 20:35-36 "But those who are considered worthy to share in the age to come and in the resurrection from the dead will neither marry nor be given in marriage. 36In fact, they can no longer die, because they are like the angels. And since they are sons of the resurrection, they are sons of God." If you look at the original Greek here for angel it is "ἰσάγγελος" or isaggelos, meaning "equal to or like angels." The Church has not always been an "Anarchy." Per Christ's own words (Matthew 16:18) He built His church upon those who proclaim He was/is the Messiah and the saviour through which we find salvation. This is to say that the Church then becomes the Body of Christ who proclaim His truth to all those who are lost; to think that the core and fundamental elements of His Truth were not preserved through His anointed followers is to doubt Christ Himself and speaks to a lack of faith in His holy proclamation. Yes, men are fallible; that is a given. But thru discerning by the spirit we can righteously judge when His truth is being presented before us by someone filled with the Holy Spirit; if we are being honest, not necessarily with ourselves* (elements of pride involved), but to His selfless loving and graceful nature then we are able to find and preserve His Truth in order to call more followers into His fold. So when we speak to separation, splits, and schisms, this is the result of individual men falling to temptations of the flesh and deceptions, not of the failure of the Church as a whole in holding to His incorruptible Truth. Not just any body can preach (at least not God's Truth)... not unless they have been filled with the Holy Spirit and are actively living to align with His Truth through Purification, Illumination, and Union (Katharsis, Theoria, & Theosis) with God and His Truth are they able (not based on ability, but by willing their will to align with His will) to bring others to His light. I assure that faith is alive and well my friend, both in myself and so many others who have been born again in His Holy Spirit; to presume otherwise is fallaciously based off of personal perspective. If you have any questions feel free to ask! Many prayers unto you and yours. God Bless you!🙏☦

[@Journey_of_Abundance]

This is the exact black-pilled take that Satan wants you to have. Christ and His Church are victorious and the gates of Hell will never overcome it.

[@Saint_nobody]

​@@VioletMomLisafrom Wikipedia: 【In 1927, Professor Azariah S. Root, who had headed the library at Oberlin College, wrote a letter regarding the origins of the Spalding Manuscript and how it relates to the Book of Mormon. In it he states that the Spalding document to which he had access, The Oberlin Manuscript, "seems pretty clearly not to have been the manuscript from which the Book of Mormon was written". Since neither Root nor anybody else had possession of Spalding's alleged second manuscript, he stated that The Oberlin Manuscript "does not seem to throw very much light" on the question of whether the second manuscript was used as a basis for the Book of Mormon.[3]】 🤨

[@suem6004]

Where are the prophets and apostles in the Orthodox Church? Who leads it? All sorts of ethnic tribes have their leader. No American Orthodoxy. It is you learn Greek or Russian or Ukrainian or Serbian.... Jesus preached in the tongue of the people.

[@Journey_of_Abundance]

@@suem6004 The Orthodox Church is led by bishops who can trace their line of ordination from the apostles. There are many, many English speaking Orthodox churches in the US.

[@Saint_nobody]

Been waiting for this video. Hmm. Well, first off, thank you, father. For all you do. No hate, all love. Secondly, I'm Colorado Mormon. Respectfully, we are a different culture than what's found throughout Utah and parts of Idaho. Now, more personally, I've never been an angry atheist. Angered, oh God, yes. Atheistic, hell to the nah. But I digress. I've been looking into orthodoxy for a couple years give or take. There's a lot I absolutely love about your faith. But is it better than "Mormonism"? Absolutely not. Sorry not sorry, but I just don't see you lot being as, thorough, as the Latter Day Saints are. And as for your claim that we're not allowed to do our own research, that's some cockeyed bullshit, brother. Stop lying, you're better than that. Being at the epicenter of the LDS faith, you of all people should know how much emphasis is placed on the notion to, "Search, Ponder and Pray." Yes, there's a lot of half truths and flat out lies about our faith on the internet. Moreover there's a lot of people (my older brother being one example) who didn't question enough when younger and when they hit that diaspora wall and try looking for answers beyond what is officially given, they fall down the rabbit hole of negative press... name a group where this doesn't happen to some degree or another, I'll wait. Until then, yeah. I'll continue to debunk all the falsehoods which come my way. Be they from my kip and kin or any other child of God so mislead by the devil. God love you, sir. God keep you and protect you until you're called away... such I've the uneasy feeling will be sooner than you think.

[@innerpull]

If you but dig just below the surface, you may be astounded how thorough Orthodoxy is. There is a wealth of Orthodox literature awaiting, from the early Church Fathers to present day. From Colorado, I welcome you to visit any of our parishes!

[@andys3035]

The way you address a priest with curse words is very disrespectful.

[@andys3035]

​@@innerpullI'm in Colorado too, God bless you.

[@ElDogeRenacido]

Tell me about your "ladder day saints," then. You have canonized wonderworkers as well? Do you have miraculous relics? Myrrh streaming icons?

[@johnmackie9498]

I've spoken to many Mormon missionaries where I'm at and continue to be contacted by them. The idea that questioning your faith and pondering on it is present I would say is a misrepresentation consistently my encounters with Mormons are people who don't even know their own faith and don't hold themselves to the same standard when they ask others to search and ponder on the book of mormon

[@retimixshotcrete5870]

Great video , thank you

[@LouiseIngram-hd5yc]

I’m learning , I can’t relate to Judaism at this stage of my life.