How The Vancouver Grizzlies Were Set Up To FAIL

[@87alock]

At least Vancouver had some of the best uniforms in NBA history.

[@davidcovington1046]

Facts!

[@kylec.8350]

They are so gorgeous!!!!! Classic reminds me on those 1996 Sonics joints.

[@phillyfan-182]

and the most popular merchandise. I wish they were still a team in Vancouver.

[@higgy04]

That you could NOT buy in a sports store at the time (unless they were available in Vancouver).

[@jeremyhughes6020]

Yeah too bad everyone hated them when it mattered

[@Crosby4ever]

1. NBA screwed them over 2. Management was incompetent 3. Horrible GM moves 4. Horrible Drafting

[@286mic]

#5 didn't have their Vince Carter

[@ctsa028]

Toronto was on the same starting point yet made the playoffs way sooner, inept management gotta be no1 factor

[@coolioso808]

On #4, here's a possible Vancouver Grizzlies team line-up if they drafted differently within the spot they got to pick (not counting the unfair rules that didn't allow them to pick #1): 1. Steve Nash or Kobe Bryant 2. Jason Williams or Dirk Nowitzki 3. Shawn Marion 4. Tony Parker Not saying that would have won them a Championship or anything, but they could have got a winning record and stayed in Vancouver.

[@Crosby4ever]

The Suns offered Nash in a trade in his prime years in Pheonix but the GM of Vancouver turned it down that might have saved the Grizzles from moving if we had made that trade.

[@amazinlion]

Had zero explanation so this one is invalid

[@chad_b]

The Vancouver grizzlies were never given a fair chance

[@DepthFromAbove]

Thanks, tips.

[@brucelau2023]

yeah thanks chad ..

[@BAKER22-l4u]

WTF are you smoking? Crack?

[@cinnapaw23]

Yes they were, bad management and not very educated fans. I went to many games and many people didn't have a clue what was happening.

[@SkleeboJones]

@@cinnapaw23how when you can’t even draft 1st in years where ai , duncan were possible lol

[@nbarealtalker]

Looking back, the NBA was beyond unforgivably stupid in creating various rules to INTENTIONALLY handicap new teams.

[@erics.czernecki7333]

It was long before the Golden Knights days where the leagues realized the financial potential of having a winner out of the gates.

[@Not_Sal]

@@erics.czernecki7333actually no, the Marlins and Diamondbacks both went on to win a World Series a few years after their first season in the major league.

[@slickeddy2000]

It’s so many bad Front office people who don’t know basketball in the Nba it’s shameful

[@coolioso808]

This is a problem when a small group of billionaire owners get to make and change the NBA rules instead of a coalition of three parts; Owners, Players Association and Fan Council!

[@sabbywins]

@@erics.czernecki7333 No, it wasn't. Literally in the video my man: it was a direct response to Orlando getting Shaq and being good. It didn't provide some huge windfall to the league, it just annoyed the rest of the owners.

[@peace_of_mind_00]

Vancouver grizzlies had some of the dopest jerseys back in the day. I was a fan of Shareef abdur rahim back then.

[@clue_604]

His name is Shareef *Abdur-Rahim.

[@Wongwongwong10000]

@@clue_604 Shareef Abdur-Rahim was a solid player but he wasn’t the third best player in that draft. The 1996 NBA draft had some amazing players Kobe Bryant, Allen Iverson, Steve Nash, Ray Allen, Stephon Marbury, Jermaine O'Neal, Peja Stojaković, and Antoine Walker. Grizzlies had a chance to draft Kobe but passed to draft Shareef Abdur-Rahim or they could’ve traded down and drafted countryman Steve Nash. Grizzlies management were stupid and failed to capitalize on opportunities that were given to them.

[@RubenSilva-tk4yb]

@@Wongwongwong10000 Considering their inability to spend to the cap and a seeming willingness to draft and wait on young talent, they absolutely should have traded down any year from 1995-1999 to stockpile assets. It was a different league back then and they probably figured at least ONE of their top picks would be good. They were right (Abdur-Rahim and Bibby). Unfortunately, those two weren't HoF talent, didn't have much talent around them, and they hit their primes after being traded away. Even if they had kept playing together, it's doubtful they wouldn't have made the Grizzlies more than a 40-win team.

[@deelo2281]

Shareef was terrible. I live in Vancouver and watched him play in person many many times. He was a good player on a bad team

[@RubenSilva-tk4yb]

@deelo2281 if he was "terrible", then how was he a "GOOD player on a bad team"? Do you mean "the best player on a bad team"??? Who would you compare him to? Kyle Kuzma? David Lee? Marvin Williams? As I recall it, and looking at his stats, he was something like Aaron Gordon. Not good enough to elevate a bad team, but a strong role player when paired with the right players.

[@highdough2712]

I moved to Vancouver just a year before their inaugural season, and had a close friend who worked for the franchise. I got lots of free tickets and inside info. This franchise was a disaster from the very start and it wasn’t just the NBA rules that set them up to fail. And Michael Heisely had zero intention of keeping the franchise in Vancouver, no matter what he claimed publicly.

[@briane596able]

I believe they could have had a great #1 pick (Allen Iverson) and still not have been supported well… if it takes the likes of prime era Vince Varter to turn on you’re city, then you don’t have a basketball city

[@highdough2712]

@@briane596able How long have you lived in Vancouver?

[@waderinga7662]

@@briane596ablethis is absolute garbage. Miami got a nhl franchise at the same time as Vancouver got the grizzlies and Miami still not a hockey city but the franchise has been very successful. Vancouver was hamstrung by the NBA. Toronto was lucky to have gotten Vince Carter but it could have gone left. The NBA can go back to Vancouver and expand to Montreal and be successful if they don’t hamstring the new franchise

[@impactliving4395]

While it’s technically true that Vancouver only had about 500,000 people, this does not accurately represent the size of the market. Unlike Toronto, the municipal boundaries in Van are quite small. The actual population of the greater Vancouver area was about 1.7 million.

[@tommysuits7416]

Yeah, quoting only Vancouver’s population, and greater Vancouver is super disingenuous

[@brsn2991]

@@tommysuits7416 doubt its disingenuous on purpose, just poor researching to not realize that vancouver proper =/= metropolitan vancouver's population.

[@kdleslie1973]

Exactly. If you do that with most American cities, their city proper populations are all extremely small. Also I think Metro Vancouver has a population of 2.7 million.

[@kuahmelallah]

​@@Chrissie-d2nVancouver IS North American!

[@terririnella4032]

i had always believed that the reason the Raptors and Grizzlies couldn't get the number 1 pick for a couple years was Orlando....but the fact that this rule (and i didn't even hear of the salary cap restriction) was never used again, proves how worthless the rule was, and how evil.....imagine, welcome back Seattle, you can't get the #1 pick for 5 years and 2/3 the salary cap, have fun. and yes, the fact that it was done to Canadian teams made it easy to do

[@gendirectmusic]

Don’t forget that the Raptors won that AI lottery and couldn’t select him either lol 10:32

[@higgy04]

It's incredible, probably because of Vince Carter, that the NBA survived in Toronto in their early years as well.

[@sportingminds3311]

​@higgy04 the Raptors had an experienced executive leadership with Isaiah Thomas. If Vancouver had something similar they would have survived with spotting key talent even with later picks

[@LilSaturn_]

@@higgy04you missed the part where he said the Toronto Huskies were once apart of the OG league, the Raptors were the second team not first

[@josephwang5416]

@@sportingminds3311 Isaiah Thomas was a terrible GM tho ... check his records... if Vancouver would ever get their NBA team back I would hire Sam Presti

[@sportingminds3311]

@@josephwang5416 i know he wasn't great, but he still knew enough to get the organization by; especially with his drafts.

[@myvideos1479]

I went to a game at GM Place in 99. They had a $10 per seat deal in the upper bowl. When I had arrived with my friend to purchase 2 tickets, the box office told me that those tickets were sold out. I didn’t have enough for the other seats. So my friend and I walked around the arena in disappointment and when someone opened a door to go outside for a cigarette, we saw our chance and we sneaked in! Once inside we saw that the upper bowl wasn’t even half full. We felt scammed. The box office were just trying to push the more expensive tickets, of which there were plenty.

[@islandtime5074]

If that’s not Vancouver I don’t know what is

[@tigeorge1277]

Understand that those tickets might have already been bought: ppl do buy tickets & not attend games, some try to resell them in 2nd market

[@ivaneurope]

The Vancouver Grizzlies are also responsible for the Detroit Pistons selecting Darko Milicic over Carmelo Anthony, Chris Bosh or Dwyane Wade in the 2003 Draft. Vancouver traded the pick which was conditional until 2003 (if it fell at No. 1 in 2003 it would've remained in their posession) in the 1997 offseason in exchange for Otis Thorpe.

[@SuperDave30]

I remember that too

[@willieadams3376]

Haha I forgot all about that.

[@StephenWong14]

The fact that they got the second pick with 6th worst record in 2003 just added insult to injury.

[@codyssmith73]

Had it landed differently, Memphis could’ve had Lebron. That core becomes scary with him added.

[@80teg]

@@codyssmith73 Had Lebron gone to the 2003 Grizzlies who already had young Pau Gasol & Shane Battier, and was ran by Jerry West, Lebron would have 6-7 rings, and would likely have stayed with one franchise.

[@Skinnyd4]

It's true that no one knew Kobe would become Kobe, but what everyone did know was that there was no way on God's Green Earth that he would have reported to Vancouver. He said point-blank that he wouldn't play for any team but the Lakers and then forced his way out of Charlotte. So it isn't really fait to say that the Grizzlies should have picked him over Shareef Abdur-Rahim.

[@carletonrutherford1799]

There were many players who didn't want to play in Vancouver. That shitty attitude by NBA players helped turn off a lot of Vancouver people.

[@mongoslade277]

Steve Francis is a bitch baby. You see how he ended up. No one was drafting Kobe in the top 10. All the players that went to high school to the NBA were all big men. Kobe was the first guard

[@elliemyers6435]

This isn't entirely true. He never forced his way out of Charlotte...The hornets had no intention of keeping him - they drafted him for the Lakers after Jerry West swung a deal to move up. While Kobe definitely preferred the Lakers, there were a couple of other teams he would have played for - the Nets were one, but Calipari got scared to draft him. But, you're right that he never, ever would've played for the Grizzlies.

[@iiNeVeRCluTcH]

​@@carletonrutherford1799 I mean you'd literally have to move countries. I wouldn't want to go either

[@carletonrutherford1799]

@@iiNeVeRCluTcH Yeah! Canada is SO different than the US! I mean, free health care, and wayyyyy less gun violence and deaths? Who needs that? The fact that Vancouver is literally 30 minutes from the American border. Not to mention the US dollar goes a lot further here. But yeah, other than that, moving to Canada would be bad for Americans.

[@charliejames1981]

I'm all for expansion.. But can we have our Sonics back first then we can go from there...

[@bryan89wr]

Don't worry, there isn't an owner in Vancouver who could afford to bring another team back.

[@SP.007]

2 expansion teams, Vancouver and Seattle. They can be the Border Bros, or Border Foes.

[@jay5286]

I'm from NYC and a nets fan But I 100% agree Seattle should have never lost the teams to begin with

[@joeynova9896]

My heart goes out to the people of Seattle and with all do respect, fuck that! I want my Grizz back! I went to so many games. Michael Jordan got me to watch basketball but the Grizz made me fall in luv with basketball. I want my team back!

[@666mathew]

I can't believe Seattle got the Kraken before their Sonics back.

[@erics.czernecki7333]

If there was any more roadblocks they didn't mention here, it was that to even play their first season, the NBA inexplicably demanded 12,500 season tickets be sold, with a minimum of 50% before January 1, 1995. I say inexplicably because they could barely hit 10,000... the amount the NBA was okay with when Minnesota and Orlando, not exactly the largest markets themselves, did their drives. Yet for whatever reason, the NBA still wasn't satisfied. Had the pharmacy chain Shoppers Drug Mart not agreed to comp the 2,500 remaining, they wouldn't have even started. Also, the NBA essentially tried to force British Columbia to outlaw sports gambling if they wanted the team... even though it was not only contributing about C$1.2 million dollars a year at that time, that money went to help support local health care providers. The situation was resolved when the Grizzlies agreed to provide about $500,000 a year to those facilities- which probably helped convince SDM to comp those tickets, but hamstrung their already tenuous finances further.

[@richborn6700]

Man that sports gambling outlaw looks archaic these days when every youtuber talking sports is sponsored by sports betting, as well as constant commercials during live games. Oh and the NBA and NFL networks having time slots devoted to sports gambling and analyzing over/unders. It went from back rooms and the leagues dirty little secret to basically their main advertising sponsors

[@squiggleface3631]

Back in the 90s, I was a graphic designer during their 2nd season in the NBA. Thankfully, I received many tickets and really enjoyed the action and atmosphere ... even if the Grizzlies weren't very competitive.

[@Christopher_Vose]

It took Memphis nine years and a 50-win season to have a higher average attendance than Vancouver.

[@AKWuzHere]

Because tigers were getting they city more attention drose was more of an crowd attraction

[@jeremyhughes6020]

They still never matched the attendance Vancouver had from 1995 to 1998

[@runitupboii7158]

That’s actually insane.

[@Billy-ot8mk]

If they had better ownership and coaching along with Big Country staying healthy and getting better alongside Bibby and Abdur Rahim, the Grizzlies could've succeeded in Vancouver. Their jerseys were cool.

[@181cameron]

If Vince Carter's shot vs Philly on his grad night went in, the Grizzlies would still have a team.

[@clue_604]

I think you meant *Abdur-Rahim.

[@Billy-ot8mk]

@@clue_604 Whoops my bad, thanks for pointing that error out, it's been fixed now.

[@dynasty5053]

Big Country sucked. They gave him a massive contract to do nothing. He was getting cooked night in-night out.

[@mongoslade277]

Big County had a weight problem. Couldn't wait to eat

[@286mic]

They didn't get their Vince Carter. Despite what the casuals of the raptor fanbase think, Vince Carter saved their franchise from going the way of the grizzlies.

[@canadianchungus701]

Mismanagement played a HUGE part - some of the winning clubs in NBA have solid front office personnel, Vancouver opted for someone who had no experience in that department. Ownership should've aggressively pursued the likes of Wayne Embry, Donnie Nelson, Wally Walker. Even with a subpar GM like Isiah Thomas, Raptors got Damon Stoudamire, Marcus Camby, Tracy MacGrady and Vince Carter - which basically kept the NBA franchise in Toronto. Grizzlies may have been handicapped by the league, but they also dug their own grave

[@rynehancock1882]

Facts. The Grizz shot themselves in the foot

[@clue_604]

TL/DW; Stu Jackson.

[@higgy04]

I remember the most ridiculous thing that happened with the NBA on Canadian TV in 1995. With the Raptors and Grizzlies entering the league, it was decided that TSN, who was the only sports channel on Canadian cable TV at the time, decided to DROP NBA games after several seasons due to LOW RATINGS. Instead, CTV jumped aboard and showed Raptors or Grizzlies games on a WEEKLY BASIS. The rest of the games were shown on a regional basis. If you were living anywhere but the Lower Mainland of BC, you were screwed out of receiving Grizzlies games during the week. And if you weren't living in the Golden Horseshoe around Lake Ontario, you weren't able to get any mid-week Raptors games. Thanks TSN for showing more Blue Jays and Maple Leafs games nationally instead of at least one Raptors or Grizzlies game per week!!

[@curryking1]

lmao what the fuck are these rules, makes me even more grateful the raptors survived, what a bunch of horse shit!

[@joeynova9896]

Right?! You guys are lucky to still have your Raptors. I wish I still had my Grizzlies.

[@richborn6700]

AND y'all actually won a title no less

[@hjpm101089]

Say what you want about the Vancouver Grizzlies but those jerseys are 🔥.

[@SSNESS]

Steve Nash is from Victoria, BC and should’ve been drafted by them.

[@jeffgumawid7554]

I know the draft boards were not reflective of their eventual careers, but it would have been a statement for Canada if Vancouver used that 1996 3rd pick on Steve Nash, an actual Canadian 🤷

[@alexwinter3272]

Nash is from South Africa, raised in Canada so I wouldn't consider him actually Canadian.

[@jeffgumawid7554]

@@alexwinter3272 He played for Canada in the international scene though, even before he got drafted. So he basically is one.

[@dionysise5008]

In general I never bought into more teams. But I've always wanted Clippers and Nets to move since they're always little brothers. Seattle, San Diego, Vegas and Kansas city are places to consider its for obvious reasons

[@Logholders]

NJ will take them back. Just not in East Rutherford

[@aceassn716]

We would love to have the Buffalo Braves back in Nba!

[@BoogalooBartholomew]

The problem is even being Los Angeles/New York's number two. is still a better situation than being the team in Vegas/Seattle. More prestige/opportunity/shine etc. I would rather the Clippers move to Seattle (Ballmer's from there) and Nets to Las Vegas, but it isn't happening

[@curryking1]

Clippers should move to Vancouver while kawhi is still on the roster 😆😆😆

[@-TurboS]

@@curryking1that’s not happening lol

[@elai3147]

hiring stu and winters, drafting reeves, the end

[@peace_of_mind_00]

Add in drafting antonio Daniel's as well in 97

[@bailey-k6b]

@@peace_of_mind_00 He was bad

[@JJ-po5eb]

Restrictions aside. The roster could have included Marbury or Nash Throwing lobs to Vince and TMac Lamar Odom Mike Miller over Stromile Swift With semi competent talent evaluation and understanding of the game which the Toronto franchise had.

[@DeadAir21]

What bothers me about this video is that he makes it seem like Vancouver is tiny. The metro of Vancouver in the 90’s was 1.6 million. Vancouver’s metro was and still is bigger than Memphis.

[@g6686not]

Who cares! The Grizz got a fresh start in Memphis and got a chance to succeed.

[@carletonrutherford1799]

@@g6686not ROFLMAO! Memphis got a chance to succeed? Yeah, look at all the success they have had. They made it all the way to a conference final once in their history but lost. 27 wins this season? That is some amazing success. Succeed? GTFO hahaha!!

[@g6686not]

@@carletonrutherford1799 how many times have we made it to the playoffs in Memphis vs Vancouver?? Even when we didn't make the playoffs our record was still better. Stupid trolling MF miss me with that BS you talking.

[@ja8ames]

And I'm not sure how "remote" Vancouver is. Within Canada, sure, but it's not that far from Seattle and for a while, the NBA had three PNW teams in a nice cluster there.

[@cherkovision]

Yeah, unlike a lot of other major cities, Vancouver hasn't amalgamated with the surrounding suburbs. So it's a small city on paper, but the metro region is larger than Portland, Sacramento, or Cleveland.

[@hitokiri92]

1. Stu Jackson 2. Stu Jackson 3. Stu Jackson

[@stingrey1571]

What is ironic is Shaq says the two players who gave him problems were Yao Ming and Big Country.

[@MichaelKing015]

Guy is capping because he doesn't want to give props to other bigs that actually gave him problems

[@OrderedConch]

​@MichaelKing015 he talks about himself like he's some sort of god. Can't stand him

[@cheesesteakphilly]

How is that ironic?

[@thanemlesstrue-arrow5724]

@@MichaelKing015 I saw the games where Yao Ming and Big Country gave Shaq a hard time.

[@MichaelKing015]

@@thanemlesstrue-arrow5724 yeah they did give them trouble but the actual players that actually gave him problems he didn't mention he don't want to talk about HOF Centers that can jeopardize his position that's also why he never considered Tim Duncan as a big do you get my point now?

[@badguy89o32]

Vancouver is in a lot better place now to have an NBA team considering we have a owner of the hockey team who is more than willing to take it on and has extraordinarily deep pockets

[@rileyholden-zc9ip]

Vancouver needs a NBA team again

[@clydekimsey7503]

Seattle will get one first--again 😅

[@rileyholden-zc9ip]

@@clydekimsey7503 Seattle needs their team back too

[@lionelhutz5137]

Vancouver is getting an NBA franchise again.

[@joshingram071]

Only cities most likely to get teams is Seattle getting back their SuperSonics & Vegas getting a NBA team.

[@rileyholden-zc9ip]

@@joshingram071 Vancouver should get a team before Vegas

[@darinvandenborn7278]

Damn. I knew about the draft pick stipulations but had no idea that they were only allowed to run with 66 percent of the salary cap. Thats bonkers! I was lucky enough to see a handful of games live . Saw Iverson play during his second year in the league.

[@A350Airways]

Hopefully these stupid rules are now gone...

[@richborn6700]

@@A350Airways Well we haven't had a completely new franchise in almost 30 years. OKC as a rebrand didn't suffer the rules the Raptors and Grizzlies did

[@daibm5392]

Steve Francis would have helped the Grizzlies tremendously...

[@Longball1028]

I despise Stu Jackson to this date

[@joeynova9896]

me too!

[@dwang82380]

Me three

[@elizabethgeorge168]

Kobe refused to get drafted by Charlotte. What makes you think he'd go to Vancouver 😂 Otherwise, great vid 👌

[@LastLetterisZed702]

You would think that Canada's 3rd largest city (Vancouver) would be able to fill 16,000 seats every game.

[@itainteasy80]

Such BS to only give a franchise and city 5 years , im still pissed off about it , I loved my Vancouver my grizzlies

[@ElyasBinYahya]

Vancouver is not “remote”

[@carletonrutherford1799]

LOL!! It is a full 1 whole hour plane flight north of Seattle. That's pretty much like Siberia, right? F**king Americans really do have no clue.

[@ja8ames]

Yeah, that caught my ear as well. Portland-Seattle-Vancouver were a nicely-spaced corridor, not extremely close to each other but not remote.

[@BAKER22-l4u]

Of course it's NOT, but the guy making the video is an IDIOT

[@XaviRonaldo0]

​​​@@ja8ames the stupid thing is though they put the Grizzlies in the Midwest Division. They were remote in that sense. Would've made much more sense to move the Suns to the Midwest Division and put the Grizzlies in the Pacific Division. Phoenix isn't even all that far from SLC and Denver which would've been divisional rivals. Vancouver's closest divisional rival was 800 miles away. It makes it even more baffling that they wouldn't move the Suns' division considering just a few years earlier after the late 80s expansions they move teams around yearly.

[@hackrjack]

Nice research theScore. Never would have known that they should have been called the Mounties, that would have really been weird to have the Memphis Mounties in the league. It doesn't sound right.

[@hallisb]

They never should have let Memphis take the name along with the team, not quite as absurd as a Utah team being named "Jazz" but worse than an LA team named after lakes

[@DET-o4j]

Mismanagement + small market + uninterested fanbase. The writing was on the wall….the Raptors were dealt the same cards by the NBA, but they had stable rich ownership and a local basketball culture waiting to be exploited.

[@eclass96]

Awesome video, always wondered what happened to this team...

[@justlikebck5162]

One of the best jerseys in nba history facts

[@carletonrutherford1799]

Yeah, the NBA did Vancouver no favours. Great job in alienating the region. Many players didn't want to play here because it's all the way up in Canada, a full 1 hour flight north of Seattle. That is unbearable! Combine players who didn't want to play here with the NBA blocking 1st overall picks, that's why it fails. F the NBA. If it never came back to Vancouver I could not care less.

[@johncroft9888]

Exactly, the arrogance of the NBA players not wanting to play in Canada really pissed me off. Just shows how arrogant and immature these little pricks are as they make 50 million a year and think they are being screwed over by the man. Give me a break!!! Also, basketball is such as joke. Nothing but guys shooting 3 pointers ever damn play and playing no D.

[@nonamewillbegiven]

@@johncroft9888 shutup trolll

[@ralphpayne4884]

I remember i wasn’t able to renew my season tickets literally no one answered my calls it’s like they didn’t care to sell tickets

[@BAKER22-l4u]

BS

[@ralphpayne4884]

How do you know pal

[@timlamiam]

Watching this as a Raptor fan makes you realize that we are all sons of Vince Carter. If we missed on Vince, there's a good chance we would've folded and became the OKC Raptors or something like that. Thank you VC for everything, sorry for booing you.

[@joeynova9896]

Nailed it! Vince saved you guys.

[@steven.events]

The Raptors would not have folded without Carter.

[@briane596able]

@steven.events agreed local media almost wanted the Raptors to fold..(completely intimated). Vince just expedited the teams popularity

[@TheyCallMeSledge]

@@steven.events Not folded but definitely relocated. Vince was the first biggest draw the Raptors got, without him the Raptors would've been playing in freaking Pittsburgh, Cincinnati or some Midwestern city.

[@dailydose1729]

I remember going to a lot of the Grizzlies games as a kid. They used to give tickets away just to get people to come. I saw a bunch of games where MJ and the Bulls came, definitely a highlight. My favourite thing about the Grizzlies games, was if they scored 100+ points and won, you can get a free spaghetti dinner at the old spaghetti factory. I remember looking forward to that.

[@onncga]

I was almost 12 years old when the 2 Canadian teams started in 95-96, and was well aware of the NBA entry draft restrictions, which I understood given the Magic got so good so quickly. I didn't recall that the 2 Canadian teams were only allowed to spend 2/3's of the NBA salary cap, that decision is probably what killed the Grizzlies.

[@RubenSilva-tk4yb]

Good job pointing out how there was no single thing which doomed Vancouver, or could have "saved" them. It was a perfect combination of the league's lottery and cap restrictions, combined with their management, personnel, and coaching decisions. Some thoughts... 1. Shareef Abdur-Rahim was actually a solid player. He just wasn't the HoF talent they needed. His best years in VAN by Win Shares would have had him in the top-20 this year. [Statistically,] He was like a Jalen Williams, or maybe even a leaner Zion. Very solid #2 or #3 guy stuck on a terrible team. 2. Most of the hypothetical better draft picks weren't super stars their first few years. It's doubtful any of them would have elevated the Grizzlies enough. Kobe didn't become a 20 ppg player until year three (and he had Shaq helping). T-Mac didn't become a 20 ppg player until after he left TOR (year four). Steve Nash didn't crack 10 ppg or six Ast until his fifth season. Etc. 3. Even if VAN could have spent up to 100% of their cap, it's unlikely they could have lured a "star" via FA. Although there were some top players who changed teams from 95-99 (Mutumbo & Shaq), most of the "best" players who signed were second/third-tier players like Vlade Divac, LaPhonso Ellis, and Rick Fox, or aging vets like Tom Chambers, Clifford Robinson, and Sam Perkins. Best case they would have overpaid for someone like P.J. Brown, Allan Houston, or an injury prone player like Derrick Coleman or Tom Gugliotta. 4. The Francis trade was the white flag for the franchise. The players they got back from HOU were wildly insufficient compared to Francis' potential/value. Houston was able to package him five years later for prime T-Mac. Francis to HOU is one of the worst trades ever.

[@myt1soo320]

Management… selecting big country and giving him that monstrous contract. Selecting players that won’t bring in the crowds is a guaranteed path to cancellation

[@Marx92_]

This was a really good video, definitely enjoyed it.

[@FatAlbert1020]

If Vancouver got their franchise back before Seattle got the Sonics, everyone in the Pacific Northwest would collectively lose their shit

[@SP.007]

The NBA should've done Toronto on it's own. Then 3-5 year later, a 2 team expansion, one of them being Vancouver.

[@melgreier1630]

‘Remote’ Canadian city??? While it was a nice piece, calling Vancouver ‘remote’ is just ridiculous.

[@Jon_FM]

Especially as it is right next door to two US NBA franchises at the time. It is amazing to think Stern basically saw the NBA teams move all over the place in the early 2000s and NEVER really was blamed. I was excited for the grizzlies living in Western Canada I was never a Rapters fan.

[@BAKER22-l4u]

Exactly..This guy is an idiot

[@XaviRonaldo0]

I wonder if the NBA unwillingness to move Phoenix to the midwest division so the Grizzlies could be in the Pacific where they belonged played a part. Was absolutely ridiculous that Seattle and Vancouver weren't in the same division

[@redandgold86]

antonio daniels being an ABSOLUTE BUST is not talked about enough

[@BAKER22-l4u]

Nor is how you are smoking so much crack

[@XaviRonaldo0]

With the expansion fees leagues demand these days they can't justify handicapping expansion teams like they used to. I can't see them doing what they did to the 90s expansion NHL/NBA teams or the Houston Texans of the NFL. Even the Seattle Kraken had a decent list to choose from although GMs learnt from their mistakes with Vegas.

[@DepthFromAbove]

Quality video, dude.

[@BAKER22-l4u]

Lol..WTF are you smoking?

[@deemz312]

Those OG Grizzly uniforms are some 🔥🔥

[@360garrenzo]

Grizzlies Never had a winning season until they relocated to Memphis.

[@CTEagleCeltic]

Ayo, who would sign up for this torture?!?! Not being allowed to get a first overall pick…. I would pass, sounds like an NCAA death penalty.

[@russenterprise6502]

Big Country, Ostertag and Joker kind of lookalike

[@ZPMBTV]

Stromile Swift… 🔥🔥🔥 We can get in the comments with the best or most popular Vancouver Grizzly Players of All Time

[@jamescarsonn7603]

He didnt even bother to mention the Stro Show like wtf kind of Grizzlies video neglects to EVEN mention Stromile Swift???

[@tehsamjones]

I had no idea about the draft and salary cap restrictions Unbelievable

[@Hiiipower91]

We need it back!

[@bryantwilliams647]

Toronto & Vancouver Jerseys were the truth back in the day 🔥

[@TerribleTwostep]

I rooted for both expansion teams exactly BECAUSE the league F'd them so hard

[@DcDolo]

Them Jerseys were dope tho , I had Shareef jersey

[@Wongwongwong10000]

Vancouver Grizzlies were doomed from the start. It all started with how they were presented and when Big Country got drafted. There was no real direction. Not drafting Steve Nash who was brought up in Vancouver could’ve sold the city to American players who knew nothing about the city or Canada. Why draft Antonio Daniels to be point guard and then draft Mike Bibby???? When a power forward was needed and a better player was available in Tracy McGrady. Then the next draft they draft Steve Francis and he didn’t want to play in Canada. Grizzlies drafted three guards why????? GM Stu Jackson had no clue what he was doing. Then you had a billionaire Michael Heisley lie to the city that he wasn’t going to move the team, he sang the Canadian national anthem and then moved the team to Memphis. It was embarrassing for the NBA to do that to a new franchise that was doomed from the start. David Stern did not like Vancouver and he didn’t care about making it work it was all about money. I don’t think in the history of the NBA a city was treated so badly by a professional sports organization other than maybe Seattle. It should’ve worked in Vancouver.

[@elliemyers6435]

Yeah....drafting Daniels, Bibby and Steve Francis in a row made NO sense. All three of them are more or less the same guy. I'll push back on Tmac....No one would've drafted him two. Not one single GM. People were surprised when he went 8, as he was relatively unknown at the time, as high school games weren't on TV, there was no youtube or socials back then. So, I can't really fault them for that. But drafting those three point guards in a row is laughably dumb. What was Stu jackson thinking?

[@johnl6277]

As a Vancourite who followed the Grizzlies' entire existence in Vancouver, this video brought back horrible memories. I almost wished that the Grizzlies never existed.

[@luigivincenz3843]

Vancouver boy here, and now in Florida. I even had tickets to watch the Bulls V Grizzlies, and the day before Dennis Rodman caused a traffic jam on Granville because kids were chasing him down to the mall. BTW, if there was no "basketball tradition", why did the Bulls game sell out months before?

[@Antawnyoo]

... and if Kobe refused to play for Charlotte, imagine if it was Vancouver...

[@BAKER22-l4u]

It's a mute point, because we'll NEVER know

[@PraxisPeabody]

Was courtside for the Lakers against Grizz. Really wish we never lost the team.

[@damalgriffin-neil9472]

David Stern hated the Pacific Northwest

[@BAKER22-l4u]

Lol..Put down your CRACK pipe

[@overigo9350]

While at a grocery store a late Vancouver sportswriter realized one of the biggest problems for Vancouver was that all these young millionaires could not find the foods that they grew up with in the States.

[@LDSimms-ne4df]

Sounds like David Stern put too many barriers in front of them.

[@ehyouman]

This video was very well done

[@BAKER22-l4u]

Lol..WTF? Are you on METH?

[@thedevilskind]

Back in the 1997 draft, Krause was trying to trade Pippen to Grizzlies for that 4th overall pick with the intention of selecting T-Mac. Grizzlies declined because Pippen needed surgery and was going to miss half the season. When T-Mac was drafted to Toronto, Bulls did not want to deal with the Raptors in any way because the GM at the time was former Piston guard and rival; Isaiah Thomas

[@FirearmofMutiny]

It appears that 5 years is all you get in the NBA. That's how long it took for the New Orleans Jazz to move to Utah, and for the Vancouver Grizzlies to move to Memphis. (The Minnesota Timberwolves also attempted to move to New Orleans 5 years into their existence, but the owners voted that down)

[@mattblom3990]

I grew up as a Grizzlies fan. It was a tough run the whole go but I give props to Sherif Abdur Rahim. He was our best player, ever, and he "got it" as a new franchise he did his best to lead.

[@timsmith428]

I won a $1000 bet on this. I bet a co-worker they would not last 10 years when they first got their franchise..

[@BigMac785]

Canadian specifically Vancouver area media. Here’s looking at you Tony Gallagher and Dan Russell specifically.

[@Xlucev]

Should have had Allen Iverson, could have had Kobe Bryant or Steve Nash both MVPs of the league. Reef was a great player, but this was the moment of no return.

[@Aas-cp2tv]

5:04 "Bennoyt" Benjamin

[@davidrace1050]

Classic.

[@heberhernandez2879]

So question here, just started getting into basketball, if the raptors was born around the same time as grizzlies, I’m assuming raptors didn’t have much of a struggle. Why was that in they were handicap as well? I do know McGrady is a HoFer, but did he make the impact all alone or the raptors had better management?

[@elliemyers6435]

It still boggles my mind that the Grizzlies basically drafted the same guy three years in a row, in Daniels, Bibby and then Steve Francis....That's just...wow. Stu Jackson really was one of one when it came to awful picks.

[@markwager8294]

If I'm doling our some blame pie for the Grizzlies fiasco the biggest peice would go to David Stern for the bs expansion rules put on the Raps/Grizz, rules not used before or since. Next would be Stu Jackson for being the worst GM is sports history, and then Michael Heisley for actually moving it. I doubt they will be getting another team anytime soon considering Seattle/Vegas seems to be fait acompli as the next two expansion teams.

[@Joe_Ma99]

Best uni’s of all time.

[@SuperDave30]

Even till this day their black alternate uniforms are hard!

[@adamlee007]

Big country is a legend

[@elai3147]

where at the buffet?

[@roljamas]

@@elai3147Stillwater, Oklahoma, for starters. Dude was unreal in the 93-94 season.

[@BitsofJoshua]

this is the first video by you that i've seen. great stuff, i subbed

[@BAKER22-l4u]

Great? Lol..WTF? He called Vancouver a REMOTE Canadian city!!! Are you high?

[@MrBojangles-er4hd]

@@BAKER22-l4uwell he is from Murica, he doesn’t know sh about Canada .

[@Sticktothemodels]

This is what the people want to see. Great stuff

[@winstonmiu]

As a basketball fan and a Vancouverite, I hope my city gets an NBA team back. Canadian basketball has been on the up these past few years after the Raps’ chip in ‘19.

[@alexlangbody]

We need one on the Montreal Expos !!

[@bigboi3512]

The original owner also owned the hockey team. They had to sell both teams because of finances.

[@Donmecca415]

Not allowed to have the 1st round pick is wild! That’s crazy

[@RUmlas]

Would those player mentioned want to play in Vancouver had they been picked by Stu?

[@JeffJefe-pe1ge]

wtf kinda rules are those for an expansion franchise… it’s like they didn’t want them to be good , EVER SMHHH that’s BS SMHHH

[@Teamgfamchannel]

Try having a team in vancouver now and its not just a vancouver team anymore.. 5M strong BC residents will flock towards the arena. Might as well name it as BC Mounties!

[@bobsiyt6548]

If Kobe would refuse to play in Charlotte - there’s NO WAY he would have played in Vancouver.

[@angeloaaz]

No way Vancouver will ever get a basketball team again next expansion will be Las Vegas and Seattle bringing the supersonics back to the NBA