How to Build $14,000 speakers for $1,300! JTR 212 Inspired - The Audience 212

[@Toid]

📄Build Plans: bit.ly/audience212

[@TexasCorgiGun]

Are these good just for 2 channel listening? Or specifically for home theater?

[@Toid]

@@TexasCorgiGun they are designed with home theater in mind. I would still use a subwoofer with these

[@TexasCorgiGun]

@@Toid Thank you for your response.

[@russellgilmer1897]

Do these use a passive crossover or are you running active?

[@Toid]

@@russellgilmer1897 passive

[@shawnbrennan7075]

All hail Toid, hero of the DIY working man. Somebody get this man a beer!

[@Toid]

Thanks Shawn! I might need a Mt. Dew right now. I'm working on very little sleep 😂🤣😂

[@lio1234234]

@@Toid You get that sleep Nick! You deserve it!

[@EEAMD-co6nw]

finally a diy that is a big speaker. almost every diy video on youtube is small bookshelf

[@mski349]

Thank you!! I was here to say the same thing! MAKE SPEAKERS GREAT AGAIN! Lol

[@themikegarrett]

When I finished my floorstanding speakers, I felt the same lol I didn't realize how "big" they were until I stood them up. And after all the gluing and bracing with 3/4" MDF, they were heavy as hell. But they sound amazing and I loved the project.

[@CandBLawnCare]

This is amazing. Your making endgame speakers for people that only wish they could have real Jtr’s. Every time I see these in a theater I’m like omg these must sound insane but at that price they better. Your changing the game in an awesome way. Im definitely going to build these one day.

[@crazycuz100]

Ahahahahhaha

[@lok777]

I mean, they will look similar.....

[@crazycuz100]

@@lok777 that's about it lol

[@jimthvac100]

@@crazycuz100 I bet they would sound better. I am sure his custom crossover is going to be better than a production JBL design. and You know the cabinet is going to be build stronger with better bracing.

[@RubenAders]

Sh*t man. Only built two. Let me build a third. That's the spirit!! You are a legend Toid

[@jdrissel]

Just in case anybody is thinking of using mattress pads or packing foam for acoustical treatment in a room DON'T. Look up the station fire for why not. It is fine inside a sealed enclosure, and probably fine in a ported enclosure. (I do worry that a ported enclosure could become a chimney once the cone burns through. Just don't put it on walls or ceilings.

[@jaycoviello9409]

Mineral wool is better inside anyway and not that expensive.

[@sweetandsour6521]

LOVE HOW you had your hand in the way when you were drilling the screws on the woofers

[@NoodlesNJ1]

Spraying armorall onto that matress pad, will prevent them from dry rotting. You should also always use pure clear silicone divers grease on all the rubber surrounds.

[@jkimgt]

tip , to fix the issue you have on min 6:42 , remember that MDF is basically sawdust and glue compressed, so you could've add sawdust to that glue too to fill any hole or imperfection in MDF, the only thing with that is that you would've to wait a little bit longer to allow it dry cure.

[@whoguy4231]

I just totally wished you had a reference speaker like the Klipsch R-800F where you can compare your DIY speakers to and explain the strengths/weaknesses to said reference. It's very hard for the viewer to know whether it's worthwhile to build it and perhaps be disappointed when it's finished.

[@athibanraja3029]

i think in diy we tend to hear what actulay the sound is brand always adds some ups and downs in their speakers to call them their signatures when comparing each and every speaker there will be difference and that will certaily base on one's way if approch

[@BostonMike68]

Those would smoke the Klipsch

[@whoguy4231]

@@BostonMike68 Yeah, but it's not about smoking it. It's about telling potential builders how much better/worse it is compared to a popular and easily auditioned speaker like the Klipsch or other reference speaker if Toids chose to.

[@BostonMike68]

It's not even in the same ballpark. He's using 2 12" high efficiency professional drivers those are what people use for concerts and big events. They are 98 SPL per watt or something crazy. You can't even compare them they have a aluminum basket with a 3 " inch voice coil. Klipsch steel stamped basket aluminum cone 1.5 voice coil like he said if you had to buy something like that he modeled after it would cost $14000 you can't compare a big box store speaker with something like that it will put perform it in every way. I built a lot of speakers and I want to build them I was just on Madison sound website and saw the specs of the compression drivers and woofers the only thing you can compare it to is what he modeled it after

[@whoguy4231]

@@BostonMike68 Did you not understand what is meant by a reference speaker? ... It's a way to compare it so that someone who wishes to build it will know what they are getting. Toids just says... It sounds good, it sounds great... What the heck does that mean? ... Say something like it has extended response to 25khz at -3db. It has better linearity across the midrange compared to the Klipsch. It has sharper imaging, 10db more dynamic headroom than the klipsch... Etc. Just saying it sounds great doesn't help people who are going to spend hundreds of dollars on drivers etc. I'm not arguing what is better or worse... I just want more comparative info and yes... A 1k diy speaker can easily out class a 3k retail speaker and that is what Toids should be saying.

[@spiroszaharakis2648]

Great build. I am a big fan of having the same, L/C/R speakers at least for the main 3 front channels so I would be building these with the SB Audience Rosso-65CD-T-8 and H280 horn instead so that I can cross them over at 600-700Hz which will make them suitable for horizontal use as well. Yes, I know, the manufacturer suggests a minimum crossover frequency at 1K but that's for PA use. For home hifi you can probably cross them as low as 500Hz with a 4th order crossover. They will never use more than a few watts of power.

[@tulz43]

I’ve been dreaming about jtr speakers ever since I learned about them. Save money and diy. Love it. Using these as LCR, which of your other builds would you pair with these for rear surrounds?

[@iikatinggangsengii2471]

jhs arent picky of dacs, but i suggest the most neutral since they are good as it is

[@benjithx]

Come on, Toid. Matching high-end surround/atmos speakers next please! Thanks for all that you do

[@sup2320]

First time I’m seeing this channel… Instant subscribe… pure gold!

[@marcusmcmurray77]

I'm not a DIY guy but I have watched a number of your videos; they're very good and very intriguing

[@Toid]

Thank you Marcus

[@ElCidPhysics90]

Honestly, use the cnc every opportunity. I’m def going to use it.

[@radishmcadish1]

Those are awesome 👌. I wish you would let me finish the exterior. They really deserve a top notch finish. Not saying it's bad, but I just don't like the roller finish.

[@keithiegee1]

Now that’s an exciting design! The first thing you said was you needed a 3rd for your LCR. Could you do a horizontal plan? Maybe have it rear ported and the arrangement veneered for a nice clean centre speaker look?

[@blakebrockhaus347]

Horizontal mtm designs are inherently flawed. And it's going to be behind the screen hidden from view anyways

[@richardciliberti2001]

Fantastic video. Excellent workmanship. Unreal speakers. You da man.

[@Just4AdventureFun]

Dude insane! I love it. I’m looking to build my new theater and need 3 built as well. I’d even pay to have these built, great job!

[@Toid]

You can do it!

[@Pete.across.the.street]

I might just buy a table saw and router once I finish my other projects. Awesome speakers my friend

[@wolfie7303]

Need more sites retailing flat pack options for those of us without some of the tools that might only ever be used on 1 or 2 projects.

[@JSchurter]

I have found a local cnc shop, there prices are not bad, might add 150$ to the over all cost

[@reyniermartinez8652]

I seriously might build these, I almost bought the JTR 212 HTR but when I saw them they were $2999 a piece then they bumped up the price to $3299 and now $3499. At 3 grand they were expensive but obtainable but now just way out of reach. Beautiful build btw and can't wait to see the 3 in your home theater.

[@lok777]

If you have 6K for a pair of speakers, you have 7k for a pair of speakers.........

[@edub8803]

This is so dope! JTR also has a 215, but I wonder if a 218 inspired design like this is possible. 😲

[@Toid]

I'm thinking the same thing. That would definitely need a compression coaxial. But that would be epic!

[@TylerStout]

Biggest issue with bigger drivers is the larger the driver the lower the beaming point is. That's why you'll see higher midrange to tweeter crossovers on smaller drivers. An 18" driver would start to beam at around 700hz.

[@Toid]

@@TylerStout you would end up having to use a compression coaxial for a speaker like that. They can typically cross over as low as 300-500hz.

[@C-man553]

Just wanted to add-I've had great success using steel threaded rod for bracing. Easier for possibly better result. Interesting Monster build Toids.

[@ericwilliams538]

Small tip for ya, save some of your sanding dust in a zip lock bag, for when you have cracks or your seems don't match up perfectly. Then when you need the sanding dust for the seems, sprinkle some into some wood glue, mix it together and use a puddy knife to push it into the seems. Let it dry, then lightly sand it again. You'll sand your sand paper doing it this way versus sanding while glue is wet.

[@jeremygray8078]

That is the dopest Piggly Wiggly hat I've ever seen. Your speaker build is also nice.

[@paulchristiansen7014]

as a old school car audio guy myself, I do this same way of building sub boxes myself and been doing car audio for 35 years now...yes I have build some home audio in that time too..

[@paulibarra5449]

i pend 850,00 USD to make my home theater, and looks awesome with amazyng sound, 700 watts RMS , and 100 inch screem,

[@mikeday62]

I like stereo, but speakers are good for that too...win win. Your work is awesome!

[@Toid]

Thank you! Much appreciated

[@Miketheconservative]

Building now! Can’t wait to hear them

[@leif8436]

I really want to build some speakers. I've ordered parts months ago but didnt have time due to uni. Now i really have to do it though.

[@ethnic_on_a_technic]

Literally hit the sub when he said the bad thing was he needed a centre speaker .. what a dude !!!! Bro can u make monitors for sound studio ????

[@rts100x5]

I would also isolate the woofers from the horn chamber

[@robertlee1145]

Now that it's a year later ,would you use the same speakers or would you use a different set?

[@domwenaubain8983]

You seriously impress me with every video you put out. I'm gonna build all my speakers in my next house and really go all out

[@HifiVega]

Killer build Nick! The EQ’d response looks very good.

[@ajstruhar2048]

Heck yessss been hoping for this

[@truthseeker6649]

joseph crowe did some measurements on this woofer. the impedance profile is almost like a tweeter. very low inductance which translate to very snappy bass and clean midrange.

[@castro619a]

Please do more big towers like this!! This is awesome

[@Toid]

I'm glad to hear that you like it! Maybe we should do a 218? 2 28's! 😲

[@Toid]

I'm really excited to see who ends up building these

[@castro619a]

@@Toid have you tried any of the old horns in this? I’d love to see those responses! This channel is like ASMR lol

[@jimdawson1886]

@@Toid 215 would be perfect!

[@djfirestormx]

i find 3rd order to sound better anyways, just takes more work to balance, especially a 3 way

[@e-mailuser9811]

How does the overall sensitivity compare to the JTR's? Are you going to do a video where you're taking measurements in the room?

[@homeboi808]

Considering the woofers are 98dB, it’s a very sensitive speaker.

[@FOH3663]

High 90's, most likely. Exact sensitivity isn't that important... relevant point, it's high, it's up there. Dual LF drivers, presenting 4ohm load, compression HF, loaded into a horn... high 90's, likely triple digits. The higher voltage sensitivity is the big attribute of this piece. Truly dig this build, it's raw, it likely could've benefited from matrix bracing... but pursuing down the path of high sens is a worthy pursuit. Refinement will come. My take, I'd go active, dsp contoured, diy multi-way chip amps. Inexpensive, high performance specs. This path of pursuit with a measuring rig, will elicit significant growth and grasp of big picture... (the room's acoustic transfer function) Ultimately turning to the physics of acoustics... and simple room optimization (where some huge gains are encountered).

[@jeffhayes4845]

I would like to see this too. Are the final measurements posted anywhere? I went to the plan page and did not see them anywhere

[@devinpresley2829]

Awesome build! I plan to build these when I upgrade my home theater setup. What speakers would you suggest to pair with these for side and rear surrounds?

[@Toid]

I use these with the Cinema 10’s I designed

[@devinpresley2829]

@@Toid thanks for the quick reply! I have been eyeballing those as well. That's probably what I will do then. Thanks!

[@micke0emil]

Maybe the center could be like the 212HTR??

[@firecloud77]

I also use egg crate foam pads. But I prefer 3M 90. Unlike 3M 77, it isn't a mist that drifts everywhere.

[@Toid]

I'll have to try that out sometime. I've never tried 3M 90.

[@anoopnair6376]

Hi Buddy, Its a great video. i do have a question . have you installed a crossover inside the Cabinet? could please share the details? or where we can get high-quality heavy duty 2 Way ( Woofer & Tweeter) crossovers

[@Toid]

They are in the build plans which are listed in the description

[@LD-bv1pm]

They look to be very light. I have a pair of floor standing Dali's and I certainly couldn't move them around the way you are.

[@aaron0089]

Awesome stuff bro 😍😍 Thoroughly enjoying your content… Keep it up👍🏻👍🏻

[@ArturoBolanos-u2b]

I like the way you think.

[@DIYAudioGuy]

Sweet!

[@MrMichaelEsser]

Duuuude! Really really good work! How many hours do you spend on building them? I could never do it

[@jorgemartins3593]

NIce video, I am assembling a system bi-amp with crossover - 1 amp for high 100w (rms/channel) + 1 amp 500w (rms/chanel) - electronic crosover + equalizer - I am thinking that works good in this speakers, bi-amp, and I dont need crossover inside the box - but a speaker bi-wired - I will work on this - when I have the results I will show.

[@mckennydixon2725]

good walk thru / talk thru. thx.

[@gib919]

Cool!.. So what did you use to adjust the crossover?

[@Toid]

What do you mean by adjust the crossover? Do you mean design it?

[@GoalieNurse]

Looks much better in the theater than the living room 😄🤣😁

[@TheoneDragon51]

Very nice. I would love to hear something like that. I have just never been a fan of compression drivers. I'm a silk dome. Then again, maybe I haven't heard them setup right. After all I do like my titanium dome tweeters in my Paradigm monitor 11s.

[@chaseleim4773]

add in some 6.5" mids in the center and watch these really come to life

[@Kcducttaper1]

I really wish there was a way to quantify the 'detail' and 'sound signature' of drivers. You can take 5 different brands of drivers with effectively the same TS parameters and they will all sound a bit different.

[@Toid]

I agree. I wish there was an easy way to figure that out. I do have a video coming out that will test four different compression drivers. But that will just give you your frequency response graph and distortion measurements as well as decay. It'll help, but won't be an end all for anyone. Having said that, I really like this is compression driver.

[@Clobercow1]

You can. You can measure them. Detail is the lack of the many kinds of distortion along with other properties that are measurable.

[@Kcducttaper1]

@@Clobercow1 You 'can' measure a lot of it, but I don't think I've ever seen a waterfall graph on a speaker page before. Most days, I just feel lucky to get an accurate frequency response graph and accurate TS parameters.

[@lio1234234]

@@Kcducttaper1 Vance Dickason does some really good driver measurements in voice coil magazine, they seem to be quite reliable. These kind of measurements do exist, but I do agree with wishing they were more common!

[@homeboi808]

@@Clobercow1 waterfall charts (for passive speakers) don’t show anything new, they just show the frequency response (any “trails”/“tails” has to come from a bump in the frequency response).

[@DustinHaning]

These are incredible! I may actually build a pair of these! Do you have build plans for center and surround speakers to pair with these or do you plan to make some? Also what about upfiring atmos speakers?

[@ErinsAudioCorner]

@12:07, drilled like a man who has put a hole through a cone or two. (I use the same hand-block method for the same reason 😂😂)

[@Toid]

Lol. I may have a time or two....or three....😂🤣

[@JackBurton871]

Would you be able to use a Dayton KABD with DSP in each one of these to power them and remove the hardware crossover components ?

[@ccarzoo]

how intricate is the build and about how long does it take per speaker?

[@billsimmons7754]

Have you done any evaluation of different foam for the inside of the cabinet. The reason I ask is that I have small amount of experience of quieting down a loud machine by placing egg crate foam on the wall behind the machine. Egg crate foam used for packing material had almost no effect but when we purchased egg crate foam that was sold for its acoustic properties it had a very significant effect on the noise level reflected from the wall. There was no discernable difference in the feel or weight of the two materials.

[@NickJansen87]

Love the Piggly Wiggly hat!

[@stephenyoud6125]

Excellently done, again!!

[@jmooreweb]

Awesome build video! Do you have the build plans for JTR NOESIS 212HTR? I'm looking to build LCR for my home theater and wanted these speakers to be off the floor at about ear level. Thank you!

[@miguelmolina5564]

Love your channel, Any thoughts on a diy klipsch klf 20?

[@audfrknaveen2256]

In HT, everything below 80hz is taken care by the subs. Is it still worh having huge dual woofers like these? What's the difference between this kind of massive speakers Vs something like an Ascendo speaker with 6" driver? . Assuming both are used at similar SPL and same frequency range...

[@esolo4751]

Awesome. How to get details or build for x-over tho. I know it's unrealistic to make flat packs for everyone. But how about a kit for the x-over components for order?

[@Toid]

I am working on getting the plans out as we speak. A kit is always an option that we can look into.

[@karan_hiremath]

Looks great! Could potentially put dado’s in for the braces right?

[@Toid]

Absolutely

[@DLee-dh6mn]

How would this work as a horizontal center? Would rotating the wave guide work?

[@GurvanBHC7]

Yes, the Horn is 90/90 degres, no difference betwen horizontal and vertical

[@jjjames6876]

how do you model such a large port? I haven't been able to use box calculators to model a large slot port, only tube type ports.

[@KarthikSktk]

Nice build.. Is there anything in DIY that looks and rivals the Arendal 1723 monitors for LCR?

[@Seabass901]

Nice man! I wish I had the tools and time to do this. I bet they sound awesome. I'd love to hear some classical/orchestral music that has a lot of dynamic range on these.

[@Toid]

You sound amazing. At $650 each speaker, they come in at quite a bargain. I can't think of any speakers I'd rather have it this price point

[@frankmckee4559]

Have you measured the response of these and compared them to the JTR’s?

[@MushmouthJoe]

Always making it look easy. Probably sound better than the $14,000 speakers anyway. They come off an assembly line. Your speakers are way more desirable.

[@mattm3091]

Awesome build. Curious what cnc you have and if you have thought about doing 215 or 218 build as a 3 way

[@jessecollier3941]

Great vid. Great job. Would you be willing to build Krix MX40 Wall of Sound front stage?

[@Bobby12many]

That Piggly Wiggly hat is sick! hahahah

[@Miketheconservative]

Build complete and I must say, they sound great. I’d recommend to anyone. The cost is a bit higher thanks to inflation these days but it was worth it in my opinion!

[@Toid]

Thank you for sharing! I’m glad you are enjoying them.

[@Miketheconservative]

@@Toid next is the subwoofer build!

[@Toid]

@@Miketheconservative you’ll love it!

[@Miketheconservative]

@@Toid I want to build a big center channel and two rear floor speakers but my laptop is not working properly to build a crossover and such. Is it possible you could lend a hand?

[@dickydoesaudio3466]

Are triad gold monitors next? That would be sweet. I'm interested in these as well, I just might give these a shot, I've been looking for a diy speaker project for behind my screen, but I'm wanting something without a horn waveguide. I'll be checking your channel frequently. Good stuff man.

[@Laissez_Faire]

I’m surprised you didn’t use the two way compression driver used on the jtr. They suppose to give you beautiful highs and mids.

[@Toid]

There's not many compression coaxials available for DIYers. In fact BMS, won't sell them to you. There are a few made by B&C, but not many companies make them in general.

[@AudioTekAdventures-ph9ke]

Nice! Great and well done these were cool to look at :)

[@Huntmx24]

These or the diy 1099 for home theater? I have two marty subs with the ultimax 18s. Looking to build my lcr now. Looking to keep cost low. Whats my best bang for buck rhat will be awesome?

[@Huntmx24]

Right now I have 3 bic america. Fh-6t and they have been really good. But looking for that next level possibly.

[@michaelsegel8758]

Hey! I love your videos and projects. I have to ask why you don't cut groves for your panel placements? I can understand if you're using a router, but if you're using a CNC? Thx

[@Toid]

I do on most of my builds. This one was a little too tall to fit completely on the CNC. But if you only take a look at some of the more complex bracing than I do, take a look at my earthquake 21 video. I built two 21 inch subwoofers that has some really impressive bracing and the grooves you looking for in this build

[@wadimek116]

Is the center channel also available in the plans? I expect pretty much the same but in horizontal configuration

[@Toid]

I am working on a redesign using different drivers that can be used either horizontally or vertically. YOu could use this horizontally if you want. It would just be cumbersome.

[@wadimek116]

​@@Toid Hey, have you thought about using the nero 15"? I actually decided to replace my middle avr shelf with a speaker lol, so I also noticed they are excellent at bass extension compared to the 12" midranges. They require a midrange like nero 6mrn unless your willing to cross horn at around 1khz through. Either way I decided to do zero compromise on my center channel, huge 250l enclosure, 2 dual 15", horn and so on haha

[@naturalverities]

Reminiscent of the famous Klipsch Epic CF-4! Given the great tools you have, I think it's time to consider compression midbass folded horns such as Klipsch La Scala. They are magical!---even with modest drivers. And they perform well up to 700hz, so don't really require a gigantic mid horn.

[@tweedpenguin712]

Youthman had the La Scala’s and traded them up for JTR lol

[@thiemobartsch]

I hoped for something bigger, but these won't fit behind my screen 😂 I will stick with the cinema 6, final parts for assembly will arrive tomorrow. But a great build anyways👍

[@Toid]

Nice! Please share pictures! I love seeing the final builds 😁

[@thiemobartsch]

Sure, I will share some pics in your forum! 🙂 Can't wait to hear how they sound!

[@aaronfarley4577]

Any recommendations on a substitute tweeter? As the one you used is out of stock in the us, and is about 200 a piece from the UK

[@QAT4969]

great build. what amp u use for this 212 audience?

[@95Sn95]

Nice towers, I noticed you holding your hand to avoid the dreaded screw bit through the surround, I'm always nervous. I've told people I would easily rather drive a bit in my hand over the driver my hand will heal... Inserts are nice but they can be problematic installing. I've seen quite a few people have problems with hurricane nuts coming loose and spinning but all you need to do is few dabs of a good glue on them during installation... seems to be an easily resolvable issue.soundman Doug benards uses hurricane nuts in reverse when he installs bolt style terminals on an enclosure so there's a nice clean flat steel contact for speaker wire ring terminals vs a big nut and washer on outside plus the stick out is probably at least 3/8" less.

[@MrTank1094]

Hey told how do you think the sb audience nero 12 mwn400d would do in a midbass car set up in car audio

[@dazingoth783]

Need vid of them playing please. Good vid though.

[@kennyjfarquhar954]

Another great video Toids!!!!

[@RULINGCHAOS666]

Here's the question I have.. These or DIYSG Elusive 1099's? I will build either one but am undecided between 12 and 10 inch drivers and midrange on the 1099's.

[@kwokleunglam2998]

great job, inside support frame is good

[@jimthvac100]

These are great speakers you build Toids. I just wish they made more horns that have a wider dispersion for all frequencies like the Selenium HC23-25 but for bigger ones like the ones you used to make these. I know the horn you chose has the widest dispersion pattern of the three they sell on that web site. Just seems most horns seem to beam right after just one octave of there lowest frequency.

[@siriosstar4789]

When Godzilla needs to hear his fav tunes !

[@Edward135i]

12:59, please turn the horn on the right one to match the left one, my OCD is going nuts right now!