How to deal with creative burnout - Art Department Podcast

[@dungritartistgamer9919]

I discovered this podcast 2 days ago when I saw Emannuel on the thumbnail. Listening for 2 days in a row. These are gold. Thanks, guys for giving back to the community.

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Thanks and welcome! :)

[@LaidDownRiversTV]

That was a relieving episode for sure ! I'm currently working as a department manager in a grocery store 30hours a week aside being a freelance concept artist because I don't get jobs often enough to make a living out of art yet. Each time I hit a job, I feel totally on the edge during the whole process, switching every day from a job to another, and I can't rest properly just after because of my day job. For now I'm ok but I'm really aware of the fact that it can't last for ten years. I've already burn out during my studies, resulting in me quitting from drawing anything during 5 years. I don't want this to happen again. Now I know how to take care of myself, and it's relieving to hear you both because I still sometimes feel like I need to take care of myself way too much to stay on the tracks. Folks, if you feel that you need some rest, it's because you need it, not because you are lazy. Be kind to yourself.

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Yes! Listen to your body! :)

[@rogerko9085]

Thank you Jan and Emmanuel for the heartfelt discussion. Along with Ross Tran's recent video about the trials of making his kickstarter, the art community is beginning to become more candid about just how exhausting art can be. I wanted to offer a different (albeit no less important) perspective on burnout: that of the student. In my experience, the highs are addictively high and the lows are crushingly low. As students, we get to develop ourselves independent of the pesky client; we get to pursue the projects we love, develop our art style according to our own whim and fancy. But on the other hand we are constantly bombarded with how competitive the industry is, overwhelmed by the sheer number of things we have to learn, and typically unsupported by the rest of the world. If you have a neurotic, obsessive personality, you're likely to wear yourself out with 12 hour days for months trying desperately to make it. Art can turn from something you loved to a despotic tyrant before you know it. I feel like that is why in my opinion *affordable* mentorships are superior to the generic online concept art classes offered by so many platforms today. Having someone guide you through the arduous process that is the art journey is crucial. Rest and recovery are not for the weak either, they are crucial for the 10000 or 20000 hours we have to put in in order to become a master.

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Thanks so much for your thoughts. I think a lot of teachers stress the hardships of the industry because they've been through it themselves and want to prepare you. :)

[@rogerko9085]

@@artdepartmentpodcast Absolutely, better to be prepared than naive any day :)

[@00JakeH]

Wow, Jan, you did a full disclosure of your burn-outs, sorry to hear man, mental health working from home is super important, its a big issue now with loads of us working from home with more remote work because of covid-19 and working on projects with companies in different time zones - hectic.

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Yes, gotta take care of ourselves! :)

[@Pixeliarmus]

I watch these at work and they give me a very positive feeling about the future everytime, which is what we all need at these times I imagine

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Thanks so much! Yes, positivity is what we need! :)

[@scarlet8078]

Stress is very relative, & stress mgmt is one place where life experience & prior careers help give perspective. Other artists ask me, "How do you stay so calm even during crunch?" My partner is an ER doc & sometimes I go watch him at the hospital which puts my stress in perspective. & before art, I was a M&A attorney who'd work on multi-billion-dollar deals where we're expected to work around the clock until closing, bc many jobs (not just our own) are on the line. When I see the younger artists in the studio get very upset about deadlines, or even cry if a AD or PD criticizes a piece, I struggle to relate to them. I understand their emotions are real & they just lack perspective bc they haven't experienced many high-stakes situations or hardships in their lives yet. The most burned out I've ever been was working on a project with a team of artists in Singapore where we'd have calls at 7am my time. I prefer to work creatively in afternoon/ evening, so I felt like I was working 2 jobs. I tried to change my sleeping & working patterns to better accommodate it, but it was the longest 14 months of my life. Afterwards I was so burned out that I took 2 months off, during which time I turned down all freelance projects, even from existing clients. There was definitely an emotional component to the burn-out. Dealing with our team in SG which managed other teams across Asia had made me really disillusioned bc I'd seen how many talented artists exist & I felt like there was no point in art if I couldn't create anything unique, since everything could be done by many others. In hindsight, this sounds silly. But at the time in the depths of burn-out, it felt devastatingly real.

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Thanks again for sharing your valuable thoughts! For me its the other way round. Based in Singapore makes it tough to liaise with client who are in US or UK. :)

[@jeremycook9201]

OMG, Preach it gentlemen! Burnout sucks, and as you say, it sneaks up on you. Nothing worse than starting to feel resentment for your passion.

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Thanks Jeremy! Yup we all gotta learn from our burn-outs and work towards avoiding them int he future!

[@VeerleZzzz]

Thank you so much for making this episode! This helped me out a lot. I just finished college a few months back and I studied 6 years of art in total, from fine arts to game development. Now that I am done, I felt so tired suddenly! It's crazy how your body works just fine when you're working hard almost 24/7, but the moment you are done without anything to do... you just cave in and realise how tired you actually are. I've been having a hard time with art for a month or 2 now, but I am very fortunate and have some really cool oppurtunities coming my way, so I have a good excuse to kick my own butt and get back to work :)

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Yes it can be a very weird feeling. But the best we can do is take a break, self-reflect and learn from that experience!

[@Tony_Zagoraios]

Great talk guys, goes deep into our creative & problematic minds :)

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Thanks!

[@chanlongching666]

Really awesome podcast to listen to while working!

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Thanks for listening!

[@dougieladd]

Interesting talk. I think you have enough info for another on this subject maybe for scheduling and understanding practical ways of being efficient and productive. Really enjoy your podcast guys. Thanks.

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Great point! We definitely want to get into that! :)

[@michiel-vdheuvel]

Thanks for doing these podcasts.

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Glad you like them!

[@00JakeH]

Also good to hear you pros are still doing classes. Im gonna be doing the big blender push.... been Maya locked for waaay too long.

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Nice, good luck with that!

[@ianvicknair1607]

This was fantastic talk about Burn-out. Not easy to come back from it especially with studio, freelance or personal work. Always gotta make time to do personal work to allow growth and understanding and experimentation.

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Absolutely!

[@Keilnoth]

People stress out because their mind is constantly oriented toward the future and they set goals and expectations for themselves that are completely unrealistic. They don't even realize that they don't enjoy their own life until they break down or fall sick or hurt themselves or breakup with their lover. You don't have to be perfect, and to make more money than you need. Life is about enjoying life, nothing else. There is no point in time called "success" that you have to reach and only after that you'll be able to rest and be happy. The worst thing is to postpone happiness to retirement. Your health is more important than anything else because you're not going to live only 1 or 2 years but hopefully 80 to 85 years. Some tools to avoid burnout as a freelancer: - Make a spendings budget (on paper or Google Sheet) and know how much money you need monthly to survive (food, rent, taxes, health, ...). - Create an emergency fund that can make you survive during 2-3 months without working at all, never ever touch that money again. - Have a todo list for *everything* so you can free up space in your brain. - Once you are in your budget, focus on doing stuff you like and make you grow instead of stuff that pay. Remember to have a good look at what you are doing right now and make sure you know why you are doing it.

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Very good idea! Knowing exactly where you stand at any given point with enough savings will free your mind to focus on what really is important to you!

[@MrMadalien]

Precisely, and another point is to downsize, be frugal, so that your daily/monthly expenses are easy to cover with work, ideally so easy that you only have to work like 1 week per month. Then everything you do becomes a conscious decision, not driven by the primal need for money anymore.

[@Lyraina]

It’s sooo refreshing and reassuring to hear you talking openly about these topics! Like the part where every beautifully composed daily routine goes entirely out the window as soon as a (new) client project hits. Or accepting that not every hour at all times of the day are the same in terms of productivity and focus. Lots of these things are issues that make me feel like a „bad professional“ so I’m very grateful you’re sharing your stories, feeling much better now :)

[@EmmanuelShiuArt]

I'm glad :)

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Thanks so much! Yeah, its the acceptance of failure which will guide us forward! :)

[@conceptbound]

I think that the people working around you (when working in a studio) plays an effect on burnout, at least in my case. I was working at 2 studios (at different times) were one was more closely aligned to what I want to work on to build my career. The studio that paid more and would further my career burned me out so much more. The other studio, while it didn't have what I wanted to do, made me so much happier since the people were nicer, we had lunches together, and even had a sports league. I produced a lot more art at a faster pace. As a current freelancer, I do get the occasional burnout from clients as some love to do last minute iterations that require a lot of time or thought. If it wasn't for my wife and kid, I think burnout would be a lot harder and more common. Oh yeah, kids really do dictate your work progress even more with the pandemic. Great talk!

[@EmmanuelShiuArt]

Absolutely true, agreed!

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Thanks for your thoughts Hector!

[@SpaceshipRocketFuel]

Stress really will rot you and those around you. I'm a senior graphic designer in the public sector in the UK. The job is boring, to be honest - office management with 'design' more like basic artworking. In brief I was diagnosed with work related stress due to the volume of demands from a continuously growing wider team and and a new, bullying line manager. Working early, late, weekends, booking holidays just to work undisturbed.... One day my wife was at work, and after a really bad week where I broke down more than once because of work, I was scared I was going to lose my temper with our young daughter - and I've never been that sort of person - and I had to tearfully call my parents for help. I ended up being in a situation where I was afraid I would lash out at my family. For what? Pushing pixels on twitter graphics? Answering patronising emails ('no, the logo does not need to be bigger...')? Thanks for addressing this. I'm 38 and considering where I want to be in 5, 10 years time and a public sector manager isn't it, so I'm getting into watching a range of art, concept and illustration channels such as this to absorb the content and learn / relearn again - and also recognise that while we work in different fields, we all face very similar risks to our health.

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Thanks for sharing!

[@waynelaybourn2542]

Great podcast! Keep up the great work fellas!

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Thanks! Will do!

[@ARGHouse504]

35:00 I've been shifting my wake up time from 10 to 7, since I've had a habit of sleeping in, unless of course when I was at uni, when I would have to get up at 7 when living in melbourne, worse 4.30 AM when I was living outside of Melbourne, those days left me felt dead, especially when I was working for weeks on end on only 5 hours of sleep per weekday.

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

In the long run, those short nights really get to you ...

[@philjpark]

Killing it with this podcast guys!

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Thanks Phillip!

[@wydefire]

I am currently at the same point where Jan was when he couldnt even do personal stuff, hopefully it doesnt look as hard for me and I cant imagine how hard it must have been for him. After 2-3 weeks of not touching my wacom and my sketchbook, I feel that the drive is coming back but it's definitely a traumatising experience... thoughts to everyone having a hard time, do not hesitate to talk about it openly, it helps a lot to accept it at least

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Thanks for sharing! Make sure to learn from this experience and think about what went wrong.

[@rishirajshekhawat]

Listening second time and this is so relatable to me and what i went through in last couple of weeks...thank you so much for putting it out there...

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Thanks for listening!

[@raneemFX]

Already The Thumbnail gives me some smiles 🙌💝

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Hahaha, hot topic!

[@Haruyuki_Art]

great thank you😀

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

You're welcome 😊

[@DigitalArtcast]

I can tell this is gonna be one I need to watch haha

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

hehe, thanks! No real-time fire simulations included though! :)

[@luminousages]

Great episode team. I think I definitely can learn from this. Over working had lead to a health condition in me in december which Im still ill from graves disease with anxiety and depression. I am still recovering but find it hard to focus mentally now on art. I am taking time off for a little bit to see if i get better but balance is so important =. Any tips for people with anxiety or depressoin and how to stay motivated or how to get focus? Is it just a matter of resting and finding something that inspires you?

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Hmmm, not sure we would be qualified to talk about that. More serious health issues should always be looked at by a professional!

[@brunocorsini9519]

Is the thumbnail showing how to cut your hair during quarantine? Seems like a quick and straight forward way to get a hot looking haircut! lol I have been loving the podcast guys!! :D

[@EmmanuelShiuArt]

Thanks!

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

It's all about optimising your workflow! Cutting hair as fast as possible! :)

[@tonycheezal5650]

Too many "you know" .....

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

You know .... its very, very hard to talk cohesively, without "ehms" and "uhhh"'s haha. It takes years of practice ... so hopefully episode 100 will be less annoying to listen to. :)

[@tonycheezal5650]

@@artdepartmentpodcast 😂I understand fully, I need to rehearse numerous time when I'm doing record for KZbin videos, let along podcast I love your work !

[@romiromi3325]

burn out for me : when u thinking about composition and then ur wife ask u to change the baby poop wipes&she doesnt care &support what u do ..that is my daily burn out :)

[@artdepartmentpodcast]

Family is more important! :)