How to Talk to Customers? (Toyota Airbag & Horn)

The owner of this 2006 Toyota Tundra asked me if I could replace the clock spring on his truck.
Not so fast! At Pine Hollow Auto Diagnostics we diagnose the problem before replacing any parts...
The story gets even more interesting when we cannot duplicate the customer complaint. What's the next step?
TALK TO THE CUSTOMER!!
LaunchX431 Diagun IV: bit.ly/2GvxGlM
Launch Product catalog: bit.ly/2Dm1gYG
Enjoy!
Ivan

[@robmut1357]

Sometimes you gotta tie the customer to a chair directly under a bare light bulb and proceed with the questions.

[@abdul-kabiralegbe5660]

😂😂

[@mickblock]

I'm interested in a follow up video. Where the customer gets the leaky windshield fixed. I need closure.

[@jeremystone6613]

I am always on to my crew about the importance of building relationships with customers right from the first phone call. Customers generally want to give as little info as possible as they are worried about cost first. I generally ask 3 times if there is anything they want looked at in particular and the answer is always no at first and then by the third time they start to remember things they have noticed. Or you get in their car after they tell you everything is ok and the cluster is lit up like a Xmas tree and it barely runs or the brakes are shuddering like crazy. I guess spending money on cars is grudge money for most people.

[@SmittySmithsonite]

As techs, you have to be part diagnostician, part detective - prime example right here! I've had a few where they bring a part in and say, "It needs (this)" ... then when I start asking questions, I find that it could be many things, not just that part they bought that someone told them to buy. 9 times out of 10, they end up returning the unneeded part. Nice detective work there, Ivan! 👍👍

[@Nemesis-yn5wv]

When I suspect the clockspring is the cause of a steering wheel mounted horn button not working, I hold the horn down with the palm of one hand and rotate the steering wheel lock to lock with the other hand. At least half of the time the horn will start blaring while doing the lock to lock. You can usually find the sweet spot where it works. Although I have been caught out once as when I removed the airbag to fit the new clockspring I found the horn earth wire had a loose female connection 🤦🏼 tightened it up and all was good. It is always fun chasing down the fault, I thoroughly enjoy diag videos from people like Ivan.

[@Paul1958R]

Ivan, Great video and diag - thank you! Customer: 'Oh yeah, I forgot to mention, the windshield leaks right into the steering column....' God bless Paul

[@haywardsautomotive6156]

Sometimes we are like Sherlock Holmes in diagnostics 😎 Like I tell my customers the vehicles talk to you and provide a story but you have to pay attention. Sometimes customers don't put associated problems together but that's why they bring it to us. Water will definitely cause both issues. Dielectric grease will help but the root cause needs to be fixed. Sunroofs will cause the same water leaks when the drains get clogged but this truck doesn't have one from what I seen. Loved it when the customer put 2&2 together 👍👍

[@AP9311]

Ivan! I swear I have that exact problem!! When I'm asked to fix certain issues, I get the basic info from customer, but not all info. I have to grill costumer to find of the root cause of it. Sometimes it works!! Hahaha. My god, clients never give exact description. Lol. Great video!!! Many thumbs up

[@InsideOfMyOwnMind]

I didn't hear any intent to deceive on the customer's part. As a customer you just can't necessarily know what's relevant and what's not. The only thing you can do is report what you observe. Ivan's skill with the customer was required to bring out the relevant info. Nothing wrong with that.

[@gonzgarr1592]

Ivan you are a hell of a car tech and detective

[@steveo782812]

Glad you trusted your gut instinct on the water and kept pushing it with the customer.

[@frugalprepper]

Great Video Ivan. Sometimes you have to really stop and listen to what the customer is telling you. Many times they will tell you exactly what is wrong without knowing it. Autel needs to make a scan tool for customers!

[@InsideOfMyOwnMind]

Hehe Strap them down, shove the OBD2 connector up their ass till they squeal and tell you everything.🤣

[@frugalprepper]

@@InsideOfMyOwnMind I thought that's what the Power Probe was for.

[@InsideOfMyOwnMind]

@@frugalprepper "Woltage!!"

[@alanfarenden9378]

Repair, reseal the windscreen! Ounce of prevention is better than a pound of repair. You got there, found the problem. Excellent.

[@jusb1066]

nah let it leak and be surprised all over again when the electrics dont work!

[@darrendesmarais8124]

Being a detective, is part of diagnostic work. Excellent customer communication. Thanks.

[@chrisparenti2461]

Ivan, you’re a good investigator. You gotta get at the full truth

[@likearockcm]

In no way was it the toyota's fault and in a way it did repair itself😍As a '03 tacoma owner that is excellent news.

[@erichagler7842]

i find it very important to ask a lot of questions because most of the time the client will tell you what is wrong with the car ... most dont understand the importance of this knowledge transfer about their car and the problems that they are having .... so you might have to tell them why it is important to have this type of conversation .... very good overview of the importance in asking the right questions ..... thanks ivan

[@billrimmer5596]

This is a cool channel. Go back in his old old videos and check out how to make Borscht. I don't know if I spelled it right. I promised my wife I would do that one day. I haven't. Thank u Ivan for not quitting KZbin even though u have a ft job

[@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics]

Thanks for being here from the very beginning, Bill! I appreciate your comments and support!!

[@orville58]

Great how you let the customer talk more you did and you ask all the right questions thanks

[@mikechiodetti6737]

I've had times like that at my previous job. Finally when you drag the info from the customer (the driver in my case...City Fleet) it's "Oh ya. Now I remember...... (fill the blank)." Hopefully, the leak is the problem. Visual checks and thinking out of the box! Nice Job Ivan!

[@DieselBricks]

Hi Ivan, great video. I'm not an automotive professional by any means, but like to help out my friends where I can. I can appreciate how hard it is to get the full story out of people, especially non 'car people', blood from a stone comes to mind. Wish they sold the tundra here in the UK, they look like lovely cars especially this version.

[@laddie5133]

U deserve yr wait in gold I work in a dealership I know u don't like fitting parts u like to get it to fail cars give u a run around but u gaver information from the customer the best pal

[@ThePracticalMechanic]

Great work Ivan. Investigative conversation often reveals small pieces to the story that the customer has forgotten about or has noticed subconsciously. Most tech would have thrown a Spiral Cable in and called it good, the same tech would probably warranty the cable the second time it happened and never find the real problem.

[@jkbrown5496]

Liquid is insidious. Sloshed some water on my stove across the controls. Few hours later, the stove top (1 element) comes on spontaneously and can't be turned off, down from med to low but not off. Turns out the control is just a rheostat. Just a tiny hint of moisture down where the stem emerges. Had to use the breaker to stop it. Few hours later, nothing wrong. Still used the breaker for a couple months at night and when out of the house. Hit the rheostat stem with some contact cleaner. The merest drop of water nearly burned my house down. And it had to follow a very narrow path to make it to that rheostat wiper contact.

[@sirsweetness8332]

Oh yeah... I forgot to tell you, my wife was changing my newborn’s diaper and he peed all over the steering wheel. That is the Mountain Dew dried spots you see. 🤣

[@themechanic6117]

Great work. Working in the body shop ive seen leaking windshields quite a bit that cause all kinds of problems

[@mikeanthony3986]

You are a good teacher. Great video.

[@mrjsv4935]

Had once a 1990 Mazda 323 which developed a leak from the center top of the windshield and I believe that killed the digital clock in the dash. Windshield was replaced at some point before I got the car, probably not done very well. Leak was fixed in a car glass shop by injecting glue from inside the car, to the seam between the window and body. It never leaked after that and it was cheap fix. Another experience about that Mazda. Once the turn signals didn't work in either direction, nothing happened when I moved the turnsignal lever. Wiggled it then repeatedly in both directions and eventually it started working again. Had the car 9 years and it was the only time that happened, perhaps some moisture in the contacts? It was before the windshield leake. During those 9 years I experienced a lot of car problems with it :D No KZbin videos to help back then :P

[@CubasAutomotive]

This was quite interesting! It's hard to toggle customers' memory though, as you have to ask the right questions. Excellent video! Yeah, Sunday's rain & wind were horrible! Hurricane-like! I had plenty of cleanup the next day here. Have an awesome day Ivan! Until the next one... 🤗🤗

[@gardenia1738]

Nice video and an honest mechanic! In 8 out of 10 times, some mechanic would say I changed 23 things and here's your bill sir! lol

[@2nickles647]

I had similar problems regarding windshield. When I purchased my then new 03 Silverado. I noticed my rear carpet was damp after rain storm. So I pulled my carpet and started my detective work. I asked my wife to start douching the top of the cab. Presto. ..the factory didn't properly set and seal the rear window. I took the beast back and had it resealed. I was told it was going to cost me to fix because it's not a warranty issue. I immediately went back to the person who sold the truck and had a serious chat. I got my point across and got the window resealed.

[@laddie5133]

Answer to some customers out there is always give all information when fault happens some customers think giving everything away cost them more money but it doesn't as me and Ivan know u need to replicate the fault and sometimes it's an easy fix if u get it to do it and have the information u need first class Ivan intermittent faults what a bummer keep up the good work pal

[@laddie5133]

But u and me know when u have multiply faults u find the easy circuit to rectify and pin down if u have more than 1 fault all the best Ivan love yr videos keep up the good work pal

[@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics]

@@laddie5133 thank you for the comment Stephen!

[@vincescalise4821]

very good job picking customers brain Ivan, great video

[@t-rodshader9593]

BTW, thanks I am for showing us the conversation since I was going to mention that people need to see this, as I mentioned below I've seen these things before and it is nice for people to know that sometimes you have to ask your way around to help diagnose an issue at times.

[@baxrok2.]

Customer can definitely help. Thanks Ivan!

[@RandallFlaggNY]

"Ivan, the car is on fire. Is that bad?"

[@caseypowell9030]

Good call Ivan that's what separates the observant from the not buddy 👍 keep making vids

[@patrickmorrissey2271]

That was kinda fun... I like how you let him talk... You're a good listener... Just keep going "ummm hmmm..." and let him go, who knows what he might say.... And having that knowledge, then, it seemed kinda obvious, looking at the windshield, that he's got a leak... I'm in a totally different industry, but I try to get them talking... Tell me the whole story... Start at the beginning, you showed up, what did you see? What was going on? If you get them rolling, things they think are irrelevant, might be very important.... So I like to just let them ramble for awhile, try to get a picture of what happened.... It can be very helpful.... Great video.

[@paulchamberlin6884]

Spilt... not spilled but ya great work here man lol.

[@wyattoneable]

I like that "OH" moment. Investigations require interrogations sometimes. Good one Ivan.

[@yurbeeinwatched]

Talking to customers is a great skill. Trying to get my service advisor to ask the right questions and not get sidetracked with conversation is a big battle. Sometimes the smallest detail can unlock a couple of hours worth of wasted time. Of course you have those customers who don't want to tell you the REAL story. For some reason they seem to think that it will be cheaper that way. If my BMW comes back I will make a detailed video. A lot of free diag and research on this one. I would really like to do this repair. The electronic problem was pretty straightforward. This coolant leak could be interesting.

[@chriscain3007]

I love it when thay fix them selves but I wonder for how long. great work

[@boomer9900]

Excellent. Water and electronics don't play well together. This case was very interesting. I had a Chevy sedan from 1985 (Celebrity maybe) that had the windshield replaced. At the lower seal there was this annoying whistle noise on the highway. The smallest gap but stuff will get in.

[@arthurfricchione8119]

Ivan,good video. The one time you need rain to verify the problem turns out there finally is none. Come on go outside and find a rain cloud. Keep us posted I'm sure one will find you. Artie ❤️

[@djentyman4002]

Your wife is going to be pissed with all that honking haha again great video!

[@donaldisrael7147]

Sometime's hard to get the whole story. Why is my right rear tire bald-why is my motor mount broken. My 16 year old son just got his license. I've never seen him drive like that. Haha my dad never saw me drive like that either.

[@throttlebottle5906]

either don't fix it, make them pay a shop or LEARN to fix it themselves ;)

[@62ejo]

Nice Ivan great detective work...

[@snakeskinproductions7500]

Good catch and diag. Customer info can be invaluable sometimes (depends on the customer lol). This was an interesting one. Might try a little dielectric grease on the connectors help prevent water intrusion? Just a thought. Keep them coming brother.

[@TheCowgirlNiamh]

Well done Poirot!

[@donnierobertson3088]

Good job

[@benritchsmith]

Amazing what you’ll get out of someone. There’s things people will remember to tell you, when you ask the specific questions. But when you walk with them down all the possible paths you’ll trigger the recesses of their memory.

[@ikemen1]

Same thing happen to my for van, always in the middle of the night..Lol The fix's, I had a new windshield installed....

[@billbyrd9845]

I'm always defensive. I expect them to balk at the idea of paying me for this kind of diagnosis. I would have asked him to take it home, park it as usual, spray it down (on his time), check for water on the wheel with or without problems. Very interesting situation. It was fortunate that the customer was willing to connect the dots with you. Good one Ivan. Nobody else would have put the video together like this. I assume you got an okee-doke from the customer to air the phone call.

[@kdautomotive1165]

I throw that last comment out half way into the video. It was first a complaint of tilt steering column and power seat not working. Had a history U code. Couldn't duplicate complaint let it go. Next time was the horn started sounding on it own owner cut wires to horn. Repaired wiring couldnt duplicate fault. Comes back no power windows and mirrors. I narrow everything down to going throw left kick panel and start putting connectors out. Full of green crustys. Windshield was leaking due to rust around the seal

[@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics]

Nice! Can't believe there were so many different faults lol

[@kdautomotive1165]

@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics and you could never duplicate them. Until it came in with the windows not working and finally got direction the narrow it down. Of course the service writer just wanted to figure out if it was a fuse or if it needed a switch "real quick"

[@VoltageDropDiagnostics]

Good video Ivan!

[@abdulb7178]

Thanks as always

[@edcollins987]

Hopefully you can video the clock/airbag replacement when it happens, cause it will... would love to see the inside of those to see how much green puss is growing... Another great video!

[@naushadali95]

very good video as always

[@kingbolen_official]

Good Job ,Van!

[@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics]

Thank you, Young!

[@smms1276]

THANKS IVAN 👍

[@Graham_Wideman]

Hey Ivan -- you got to a convincing answer, but I think you almost got led astray. Disconnecting the airbag connector produced airbag open circuit code, BUT that doesn't tell you that the previous airbag short to plus code must have come from the clockspring or steering wheel. The short to plus was no longer active at the time of your observation, and when it was previously active could have been in wiring either side of the clockspring, for example at the airbag controller. Regardless, the dripping rain plot twist seems like the culprit!

[@trungle9923]

Toyota self-healing 🤣😂😁

[@apollomorelos727]

casette player and a CB radio, SWEET.

[@tonygriffiths2485]

Wouldn't have guessed that one, a turn up for the books. All logical as to what was wrong, but spotting it ? Good'n thanks :)

[@georgebonney90]

It would be great to see a 6month review on ur diagun4,thank u sir

[@bobsmith1101]

Really enjoy your work. I wonder if you have certain preferences of vehicles in your opinion are the most reliable and least troublesome . Fords, I think we know about them enough. Maybe too much of a question. Thanks for all your efforts. Peace.

[@gs7865]

Unrelated, probably, but my Tundra horn failed and it turned out the horn's ground ran through a steering shaft bearing that had some kind of grease that would dry and then prevent the circuit from completing. I douched it out with degreaser and it's been nice and reliable for years. I wonder what other grounds had that same stupid path.

[@jackpatteeuw9244]

Tell your buddy that not only does he need to get the windshield gasket replaced, he needs to get the RUST under the gasket fixed if he wants that vehicle to last very much longer !

[@laddie5133]

Keep in there I know it's hard nice to replicate the faults

[@tiredoldmechanic1791]

In 1979, a local hospital said their safety officers Ford Fairmont would quit running then start right back up. It had done this three times. I talked to the guy that was driving it. He was on a blood run. They would drive out to meet a county sheriffs car using lights and siren. He was nearing the meeting point when it quit. I asked him what exactly he was doing when it quit. Was it in a turn, on a hill. He said he was on a straight road on level ground. The deputy that was meeting him had just radioed for his location. He picked up the microphone to respond to the call and the car quit. I went to the parts counter and told them to order an ignition module for a police car.

[@dewyatt]

This is such a cool case because it depends heavily on the slant of the customer's driveway! And it clearly demonstrates the importance of asking the *right* questions, with the right phrasing, etc.

[@Hammerjockeyrepair]

nice lil uniden 520 cb hes got!

[@rickj1983]

We need you in Colorado.

[@mikeoneill7360]

Ivan, as a ex New Yorker, have you ever said to yourself, gee those Pennsylvanians, I could sell them the GW Bridge if I ever had a chance. He’s just remembering now that water is coming inside from a leak in the windshield. You can’t dream up this stuff......🙏

[@darwindwelle5267]

Played that one perfect. You're like Perry Mason Ivan.

[@billrimmer5596]

Not many young will know who Perry Mason is. I do. And I loved that show.

[@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics]

Thanks Darwin, even though I don't know who Perry Manson is lol

[@darwindwelle5267]

Sorry Ivan forgot I got some age on you. He was a Lawyer on tv in the 60s and 70s and known for investigating and winning every case he had.

[@defendermender4959]

Waiting on the scan tool - didn't anyone tell you "Patience is a virtue" Ivan!? haha

[@Blazer02LS]

Start it up, crank the fan up on vent and run the smoke machine along the windshield seam. Should blow the smoke around with those leaks.

[@throttlebottle5906]

or vice versa, negative pressure the "cab" and smoke the outside looking for smoke inside(wireless cameras/helper/etc. alternate, positive pressure the cab and smoke around the outside (needs no airflow/wind location/..

[@Blazer02LS]

That works, but then you get the stench of the smoke inside the vehicle. Using the fan on high will generate enough pressure to blow the smoke around outside the body unless the seals on the doors are shot.

[@kdautomotive1165]

Water intrusion in left kick panel. Chased a bunch of intermittent problems including a horn with a mind of it own on a Lexus back to the fuse panel in the left kick panel

[@LayZeeDawg]

Sounds like a horn relay sticking or possibly an intermittent short. Had the same problem on a Mitsubishi and it was a short in the mylar horn pad which happened after someone punched the horn in frustration

[@karlvondrak6080]

I was surprised to see you disconnect the air bag connector without disconnecting the battery or pulling fuse for air bags. Don't you risk blowing the air bag if it was shorted? Also someone suggested putting some dielectric grease inside the connector. Would that risk blowing the back also? Great trouble shooting videos though, keep them coming!!!

[@chillybrit2334]

I'd have been inclined to take the vehicle outside, drive the front wheels onto some blocks or ramps to replicate the customer's inclined driveway, then hit the windshield with the hose. Definitively prove the drippy drippy hits the steering wheel problem area. Video it leaking, embed video with audio explanation in a PDF report document. In my line of work (not automotive), customers seem to really appreciate that level of detail presented in video, audio & text reports. They're not idiots or stupid they just have no knowledge of the domain being discussed. "The flimflam exuberator orgasmatron interface connection to the wah-hey controller is faulty $1000 to repair" is not helpful. A walk through of the whys and wherefores of the problem really helps understanding I find. For clarity, I think Ivan did a great job of communication with the customer here. Just depositing a nugget of experience from my own life that no-one will read or care about. That's fine too :D

[@somerandomguy3868]

I'm wondering how you calculate the charge for, time spent diagnosing? I guess that's as fair as can be to you as well as the costumer, little mystery there good video Ivan

[@franksrok5843]

2006 tundra double cab shows the bcm between the horn switch and the horns. through a replaceable relay. why did you not consider that?

[@zx8401ztv]

Brilliant deductive reasoning mr sherlock holmes sorry Ivan holmes :-D Memory is never as good as we think, i've noticed that things can get forgotten if an unexpected event happens while your doing something. I find the perfect alan key to undo a screw in something, then the door gets knocked and i put the key down....... where is the alan key?? It's in the fridge!!, i was adding milk to my tea and when the door banged i quickly put the milk away and by accident dropped the key in the egg tray. Lost memory details lol. Humans with our scratchpad memorys lol.

[@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics]

I've nearly lost small allen keys before too haha

[@zx8401ztv]

Yes and it's often the one that fits really well. It appears after you have struggled though a job without it. That's like the vanishing 13 or 10 mm socket, never an unused size lol.

[@huydo8294]

Hi Ivan I have a question for my Lexus rx330 vaper pressure sensor location .do I need to rope the tank down or they somewhere. Please let me know thank you so much

[@sergeyspirin4539]

Привет Иван! В дождь неэксплуатировать или лобаш переклеивать 😉.

[@fredkuhn165]

How about have the windshield removed and resealed instead of waiting for the next rainstorm? You know it leaks. I would get that fixed right away if it were my vehicle

[@throttlebottle5906]

mine has been leaking for many years, the HUGE difference? hardly any "stooge" junktronics to get wet and fail, now the body will acquire rust holes...... ;)

[@jeremyanthony9300]

Ivan, how's the frame on that truck ? Was that one replaced too?

[@Goodsnout]

Water proof the connectors with some dielectric grease?

[@RamRam-wb9nw]

How are you not afraid of the airbag detonating when you unplugged the connector at the steering column? Do you have to unplug the battery or its safe to unplug?

[@lesbender236]

Since unplugging connector and reconnecting it seemed to have "fixed" the problem, would it have been a good idea to use some sort of contact cleaner/lubricant on it to keep out any moisture that may get in before the leak is fixed?

[@dewyatt]

Yeah in my head I was spraying the hell out of that connector with some QD.

[@reecenewton3097]

@@dewyatt So was I! Even if the water leak gets fixed, there is always the potential for dried dirt, minerals, etc. on the two halves of the connectors to react with dampness and short out again, even just dampness in the air or from a cold day followed by a warm one with condensation occurring. A good dousing of the connectors with contact cleaner is in order, as well as a look for any crusty or discolored contacts.

[@kinglangren]

Weatherstripping silicone should solve the windshield problem. Its very thin and will fill small gaps

[@reecenewton3097]

Absolutely. It's made just for windshield leaks. Clear, it won't show. I've used it on an older car. You can run it around the glass-to-trim gap, and the trim-to-body gap. It runs back inside and stops the leak. Best to just do the whole perimeter of the windshield as where a leak shows up inside may not be where it's coming in on the outside. Cheap fix. Permatex makes a version of this "flowable silicone" in a tube, auto parts stores.

[@jimkillen1065]

Yea my old jetta use to leak into the fuse box . Crap it would cause the 109 i think relay and cause grief . I just carried a extra relay and drove them for years till i finally moved up to the tdi jettas

[@Diagnosedan]

2006 And a Tape deck?🤣🤣 And i was thinking cd's were oldfashion!

[@RicardoPCGamer]

i just commented about that

[@billrimmer5596]

We need another DD fixed it again. I'm sure you're fixing stuff every day. Thank u, they call u Danny right? I don't want to b disrespectful.

[@Diagnosedan]

Yes Bill my name is Danny. I'm working on a new video but it's not going to be a fix it again video. It's going to be a educational video on Hybrid/electric tech.

[@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics]

Sounds awesome, Dan!!

[@reecenewton3097]

I had a 2000 Intrepid R/T with factory AM/FM/CD/Cassette! My son has it now, very low miles.

[@timramich]

This made me very nervous. The unfolding events of hearing the horn was stuck on, so the fuse was removed, to then the SRS code being that the squib was shorted to B+...I was waiting for the airbag to deploy once you put the horn fuse back in. It made me less nervous when it was figured out that the fuse was under the hood, instead of somewhere near an airbag that could blow up on you.

[@throttlebottle5906]

before 18:53, alternate leak test method, GARDEN HOSE ON JET STREAM, if there's a leak you'll find it! high power carwash/pressure washer also grande ;)

[@publicmail2]

OK Soooo, Outta the blue the horn went off, I mean it was literally always blowing and I got used to it and then it went off. Does that make sense?

[@laddie5133]

Top man Ivan

[@map7463]

So what is a clock spring and what did it have to do with the horn and air bag light?

[@kellyspeppers]

Yes, your trademark, "Bonus Footage " :)

[@throttlebottle5906]

sometimes, it;s closer to "bonehead footage" for having missed something earlier in diagnosis! but it happens to everyone!

[@TechTimeWithEric]

Weird seeing a New Jersey inspection sticker though lol