I love DS2LightingEngine, but not the artistic changes it makes

[@fromsoftserve]

I really hope people can take the nuance from this video seriously, as I genuinely love DS2LightingEngine, and I hope that comes through in the video. I just really prefer the OG look of DS2. But lemme know down below if you agree or if you prefer how LE looks by default, which is totally fine! also released the initial version of DS2 Classic preset: www.nexusmods.com/darksouls2/mods/1298

[@raime-st]

There's never gonna be nuance the moment you bring up discord drama and decide to make a video response including it. It's gonna be like the matthemathosis/hbomberguy/mauler drama again with immature people taking sides and attacking you or the DS2LE guy, which won't achieve anything but make the whole modding community look petty and hostile to each other.

[@fromsoftserve]

@@raime-st guess I disagree. I think I laid it out very well and balanced. If someone wants to take it poorly and be immature, that's not on me.

[@TheMightyNovac]

​@@fromsoftserve It is entirely on you when you imply in your video that you were unjustly removed from a Discord server, and implying that it reflects poorly on the creator of the mod by drawing the "only" conclusion that he must've hated your ultra-polite feedback.

[@ioverslept.]

@@TheMightyNovac Would you have him happily smile and give flowers for the fact that he got banned for a reason he doesn't know? lol. Edit: what the hell did I get myself into by reading the discord 😭 Nah Rage just has a huge ego apparently. "Low skill , trash tier , ai upscaling , reshader NPC talks about personality"

[@jacksonjabba]

@@raime-stI mean what the fuck is he supposed to do? If someone is being shitty they should be called out for it, and I think the video was pretty respectful anyways

[@ymfah]

I love DS2LE but some changes from vanilla, especially the darkness and way too much fog was very distracting to me. It has definitely improved from the previous version of LE where everything used to look like a bad HDR render where it was desaturated as hell. Will check out the mod. Thanks for the upload!

[@fromsoftserve]

Yeah I do think it def goes too hard on the volumetric fog in many areas. Totally agree with ya. Happy if anyone finds use in this preset! Thanks ymfah 🙏

[@EarthyTeddy]

Getting banned for constructive criticism is crazy

[@KrakenGameReviews]

Very cringe banning people who are civil but have issues with your mod.

[@fromsoftserve]

yeah I've never really been told why I was banned, so I have to assume it was the mild criticism months ago, since I never really posted in there much at all. It's a shame, but is what it is. I don't have an ill will towards them or the mod.

[@EarthyTeddy]

​@@fromsoftserveThat's like getting banned for saying "yeah I don't like peanut butter" lol

[@colbyboucher6391]

Modders aren't known for being the most emotionally stable people

[@fromsoftserve]

@@EarthyTeddy lol yeah it definitely took me by surprise. Like, DS2LightingEngine is how I got started with modding. And I was on the team of people testing it, admittedly moreso at the beginning of my modding journey, as once I moved over to DS1 Re-Remastered that took most of my time. But yeah, kinda odd, and apparently I get trashed in their discord. both when I say something criticial and when I praise the mod, because apparently I'm being two-faced when I say something nice about it? Truly bizarre.

[@evelyntelevision]

I'm so glad you made this video because I had the exact same reaction. I was blown away when I saw the mod, and then I saw the skies and was completely baffled that they took so much of the color and life away.

[@mauriciohiure2192]

they tried to change the more "colorful" aesthetics of DS2 to look more bleak like it's in DS1 and DS3, which is stupid since it should 100% focus on improving the original game's graphics and vibes instead, not butcher it with something completely different, if DS2 was supposed to look like DS1 and DS3 it would've looked more like it in the vanilla game

[@RootVegetabIe]

"Banned from the Dischord" The sheer pettiness of some people will never cease to disgust.

[@milesbbop9563]

you have zero clue. This video was made in bad faith and taste. He's a hypocrite about artistic changes. Little does he know when he disables lighting, he causes light to bleed through map pieces. 20:25 Thats why there is more light because he is breaking the engine. He has zero clue what he is talking about and has an ego know that he has a following.

[@milesbbop9563]

More like fromsoftserve farted then left the server. It's his personality.

[@chompythebeast]

These dudes don't realize that banning someone who didn't even realize they were banned is just laughable. Oh no, he "farted", time for the banhammer!

[@EdgyPuer]

@@milesbbop9563 Dawg you need to touch grass.

[@_Hierophant]

​@milesbbop9563 you don't happen to be the author, do you? :^)

[@KhalidTheSequel]

This mod brings life back to the game. But the mod creator needs more input to help him tame the color grading and iron out the visual bugs. As for the "Am I crazy?" No you're not; the fog sometimes obscures background elements it shouldn't, in some cases, it washes out the colors lowering visual interest. Eleyum Loyce (and the prior area) were a huge upgrade. The color changes look more appropriate.

[@squadass99]

I disagree on the changes to Eleyum Loyce being appropriate. Just making ice area = blue is a really cheap of doing it, it's like adding green fog to the poison area. They changed the time of day, note the orange glow on the horizon it's about sunrise / sunset kind of vibe and adding the sun changes it to about midday to early afternoon or so. Also removes distant fog around the city. It's a very, very lazy way of doing it imho. Bloom and bright light doesn't always equal better.

[@FatfighterXD1]

The fog in some areas really sucks balls like the dragon slayer boss arena is just a total downgrade from the existing sun ray windows to some kind of London smog. I can understand the desire to disable the fog.

[@milesbbop9563]

He's using a really old version that is not updated at all. He's butthurt and rushed out his option about artistic changes.

[@pheenmachine]

It' not just me right? I can't see any of the Alonne Knights in Iron Keep

[@pheenmachine]

@@milesbbop9563 The one I downloaded yesterday also has way too much fog. Dial it down a notch

[@Comunposting]

The reason I really liked the development of the DS1 re-remaster was the constant communication and how you handled criticism. I saw upgrades to that mod thanks to feedback, as well as compromises and alternatives for feedback that you felt didn’t align with your vision. They’re your mods, man. Keep that attitude, we need more people like you in the modding community.

[@milesbbop9563]

He made everything way too wet in DS1. Probably the worst thing about his mod that he has yet to address.

[@FatfighterXD1]

​@@milesbbop9563 I've been switching to and fro the mod and vanilla remaster and original xbox 360 version. My guy the remaster IS ALREADY wet as fuck all over the place.

[@Lilbee730]

@@FatfighterXD1 And the remaster is drier than the original!

[@milesbbop9563]

@@FatfighterXD1 My guv! The remaster is the worst way to remaster a game! LMAO.

[@TrebleSixVideos]

I think the default settings can be summed up by one phrase... "Too much fog" Your mod makes it look a lot better and I will totally use it.

[@andre_ss6]

Not really. Sometimes the mod removes fog where there was fog in the base game.

[@milesbbop9563]

He's using a way outdated version. He doesn't even realize it. It looks nothing like what he is showing off. He is purposefully using an old version to show how unpolished it is.

[@fenrir3097]

@@milesbbop9563 It's the publicly available build on nexus that most people are using.

[@Punished_Rustles]

Glad I'm not the only one. Saw the DF video and I felt like I was taking crazy pills, how they're talking about all these areas looking "better" when they all just look like dark, desaturated, foggy low-contrast smudges. That comparison of the FoFG bonfire, I can't believe anyone would prefer THAT to unmodded.

[@squadass99]

The DF video also shows No mans wharf with the big torch to light the area up, while also saying in commentary the mod makes it so you have to use a torch more and praises the colour grading. I love DF but they fumbled this one HARD

[@aprils1332]

You're 1000% correct, the mod is fantastic but the default settings are bizarre and terrible. Every time I suggest someone play modded DS2 I stress that they shouldn't use the default.

[@TriforceWisdom64]

Dark Souls 2's art direction on the areas is so wildly hit or miss. Majula and Heide are utterly beautiful, and then you have the worst examples like Earthen Peak or the entrances to the Doors of Pharros. I'm with you that the LE presets lose a lot of that good stuff.

[@vicarus2728]

Which is a shame because visual shortcomings of some areas is brought by DS2 lackluster developmental process. For example, judging by concept-arts the Earthen Peak was supposed to seat on top of the waterfall, overgrown with vegetations. And Brightstone Tseldora was carved from the obelisk, located on the edge of the world.

[@milesbbop9563]

DS2 is not accurate to the concept art. DSLE is accurate to the concept art. DS2 looks bright and washed out because of the lighting. It missed the atmospheric direction.

[@azquidif6319]

​@@vicarus2728IF DS2 NEVER GETS A FULL REMAKE I WILL BE VERY ANGRY

[@trashtrash2169]

LE is the one that's bright and washed out though? Are you confused on which is which? DS2 normal is the darker one...

[@rubenel7993]

What? I love the art design on Earthern Peak. Its so good that they brought It back in Dark Souls 3 DLC

[@Noizzed]

Small niche communities online trying not to be the most authoritarian, intolerant, thin-skinned group to exist challenge (impossible)

[@flowerthencrranger3854]

Forgot to say that they think gatekeeping is good for a healthy community.

[@sengan2475]

​@@flowerthencrranger3854gatekeeping is required for a healthy community, but this is not an example of that. And it only applies if your community is actually good

[@subject_n]

I don't disagree, but it would be more correct to compare this to base DS2/SOTFS instead of the modded version. If the mod really replaces the whole render pipeline, simply disabling the overrides might not get it closer to the original look. As is the case in the dragon shrine you showed here

[@NocturnalNick]

Was my thought, but it makes sense when the point is really comparing LE against LE+overrides and saying "vanilla lighting values look better"

[@ZeroNeedsCoffee]

this makes me actually want to play this game now

[@Dante_Tim]

I absolutely agree. Therefore, I ask you to fix (in your mod) the lighting in Guinevere's room, so that Guinevere would be in the shadows in the contrast of the light from behind. (as in the original) and in this DS2 mod I would do it this way, instead of the checkbox (ON/OFF) I would add 20-30% of visibility from this new lighting/shaders mod. and it would be perfect mix.

[@DmitryB-153]

I agree with you! The windows in the Gwynevere room are obstructed with huge dark colored curtains. So inside the room it should be dark, and there is should be diffuse colored lighting with heavily blurred soft shadows. Plus it make sense in artistic vision, because the original idea was to give a sense of mystery and grandeur

[@DmitryB-153]

Also I want to add that Dark Souls is a very cloudy game. The sun is covered by clouds and the skies gives the locations diffuse lighting with naturally blurred shadows. When you removed those complex shadows and added plain dynamic ones, you made the feel that image is flat and there is projector lit somewhere or something

[@DmitryB-153]

Also I don't very like the Lost Izalith changes. Before, the caves were lit by huge lava lakes, and by removing this lighting you made the image kinda boring. I loved the colors of chaos flames in this location. This is a place, where chaos was born, so I think it's not good to remove this meaning

[@FatfighterXD1]

​@@DmitryB-153 dude your argument is for no mod at all at this point because its almost entirely adding dynamic shadows to places. You can achieve this effect by not installing the mod

[@DmitryB-153]

@@FatfighterXD1 This is not the only thing the mod does. It also provides lighting alterations, great textures, bugfixes, model fixes and improvements and detailed LODs. And I love it. I think it's possible to make the mod even better

[@ghoulofthebeat4946]

Strange you got banned. Especially if you're just criticizing the artistic changes which is fine and makes sense. The mods defaults in some areas don't match the originally artistic intention of the base game but the mods also a tool for fixing that so why would they get mad when someone points that out? So confusing.

[@fromsoftserve]

I imagine this video will go down suuuuuper badly on their discord, but yeah, if anyone does like the mod I put out, it just means more people will download DS2LightingEngine, which is awesome! It's an amazing mod. I just want to offer an option for those who want to stick closely to the OG look, even if that's only like 3 people in the entire world (one being me xD)

[@gabox17da88]

the creator of the mod is a crybaby that is mad that fromsoftserve made some videos about the mod, saying that he didn't like how it changed the original artistic vision. He cant take criticism, so he banned him from the discord. This is what he said: -He made a long video detailing , even if sky atmosphere is disabled it still changes artisitic direction. -At that time LE didnt have shadow casting. But After I built my shadowcasting. He shut his ass up> -Makes a video after that point 1. to showcase his mod -No matter what is said about him or try to defend him above 3 are facts. -The only reason he is doing it is to get some twitter views and followers.

[@melchiordelaunay2539]

Ye the original lighting is much better.

[@flowerthencrranger3854]

@@gabox17da88 Funny, their first rule literally says that it’s fine to give constructive criticism

[@brucetus]

as soon as i went into majula with the lighting mod i was like.... where is the golden orange light??? and disabled the lighting overrides immediately. pretty disappointing

[@colbyboucher6391]

Regardless of better or worse considering Lighting Engine is meant to be a base for other modders to work from it shouldn't be making such drastic changes.

[@cleanclouds]

Kind of a shame such a mod is filled with feature creep just for the sake of it.

[@yonimeller]

You can't completely overhaul the rendering engine of the game without drastic changes. Come on.

[@hb-robo]

@@yonimellerIt isn’t reference quality by default. That’s a problem.

[@yonimeller]

​@@hb-roboListen if you prefer the original look of the game, then all the power to you. But don't start acting like other people are at fault for that lol.

[@hb-robo]

@@yonimeller You’re right, nobody ever actually has to do or accomplish anything! Thanks for your wisdom

[@skookathing]

Ty so much for doing this, I've been wanting this for so long and I was too lazy to do it myself! :]

[@JellyJman]

After looking at the side by sides I can say 100% that your mod made Huntsman’s Corpse, Shrine of Amana, and Earthen Peak look much much much better.

[@Insanabiliter_In_Linea]

I swear some modding groups can be just, confusingly petty. I think you're completely right, I think by default the mod should just enhance the original style of DS2 but otherwise stick very closely to it, and just leave the massive changes to optional presets/add ons and/or just leave it to modders to make whatever drastic changes they want. I'm perfectly fine with presets that drastically change the art direction, making whatever changes you want to a game is what modding is all about after all, but that shouldn't be what it does by default. It's for that reason that I'd honestly just recommend people play DS2 SOTFS without any mods first, or at least try it for a bit and if there are aspects that you genuinely hate then find a mod that fixes/changes it. To be fair, it is cool that DS2 Lighting Engine is completely moddable and relatively easily at that, so none of these changes are forced on you, but a lot of people are going to stick to the defaults without having ever seen what the base game looks like.

[@milesbbop9563]

It's because he is being a hypocrite saying it's an artistic change when he is doing the same with DS1.

[@Insanabiliter_In_Linea]

@@milesbbop9563 The very nature of making graphical overhaul mods is making artistic changes, he's criticizing the kinds of changes being made. It's very disingenuous to say that him not liking the direction a mod is taking (while still claiming it's the best DS2 mod out there, mind you) is hypocritical when it's very clear the issue he's taking with it isn't because they made artistic changes because all graphical overhaul mods do that, it's over stuff like adding a bunch of green fog to Hunstman's Copse, or the way the volumetric skyboxes look nothing like the originals. Those are perfectly fair criticisms, him also making graphical mods doesn't invalidate them. Besides, they're _subjective_ opinions on what looks good and what doesn't, everyone has them, banning him over that makes the mod authors (or whoever made the decision) look like they can't handle anything but high praise.

[@windowsdefender7685]

glad i was not the only one! reminds me of skyrim enb and weathers. completely different

[@leandrogonzalez3552]

Some areas look really good with this mod, but what they've done to Majula and Heide's Tower made me disable the mod entirely

[@magnus4945]

good and well constructected criticisms however, that tends to be the exact opposite of what certain mod creators want to hear

[@BathroomTile]

Artistic changes to a game's visuals in remakes and mods is also a topic I care about a lot, and unfortunately it seems most people don't care about it at all as long as a change is technically more advanced. and sometimes that includes the creators of said remakes. I have the same problem with the Demon's Souls remake, and to some extent even the DS1 remaster. It feels like the creators have no respect for the original creators' vision and seem to arrogantly think they know better, or they just get carried away in the pursuit of improving graphics by tweaking the look until the visual identity is unrecognizable. Also, If you look at other gameplay videos running the vanilla game, the skies and sunset don't look as washed out as they do when you disable the lighting overrides and supposedly get the base look of the game. The other graphical changes/improvements are somehow changing the supposed base look of the game so even by disabling the lighting changes you're getting an inferior look.

[@danielgebert4556]

I think artistic differences is part of the idea of LE..? I really love your respect for the original look and feel of these games. That said, I think a large part of the draw of LE is that the base look of DS2 is not to many people’s tastes. At the end of the day, such tremendous work done by the LE team, it really can’t be overstated how incredible it is. And the fact that it’s customizable makes it all the better for folks in both camps of the original artistic style.

[@CheesecakeMilitia]

Nothing better than petty modder drama

[@milesbbop9563]

This dude made this video out of frustration just to point out his ideas are right and the modders is wrong.

[@ZedAmadeus]

@@milesbbop9563 I don't agree. Putting aside whatever we think looks better, I think you can make a pretty good case, (and I think he does,) for the fact that the mod doesn't really declare the extent to which it alters the original artistic vision for these areas, the colours, mood, etc., He REPEATEDLY states that this is just his subjective preference... (and that he loves the mod???) but also tries to communicate that if this is the way most people are going to play for the first time, or even revisit Dark Souls 2, the mod _could_ do a better job of preserving that intended vision. If that's drama... it's pretty quaint drama. Reads more like constructive criticism to me.

[@Bathezid]

@@milesbbop9563 Are you affiliated with the mod in any way? Because if so, your replies to just about every other comment on this video make you look very petty and completely ignore the point of the video, which was explicitly stated to be a subjective difference in opinion. I hope you can reflect on this.

[@unoriginalperson72]

​@@milesbbop9563 you're absolutely slipping sliding on that thang in the comments, are you being paid for this?

[@redemption7249]

Dark Souls 2 is beautiful. Only Elden Ring is on the same level in terms of art direction in my eyes. The variety of biomes and the magical cozy feel to it, there is something undescribable about it. It just gives you a special sense of adventure. Obviously I prefer the OG look as it is just perfect. Thanks for giving it the love it deserves.

[@Sewersyrup]

That's because Ds2 director co directed ER, if you look closely you can see a lot of ds2 in there, I like to call ER, ds2-2 for that. Or what ds2 could've been if it wasn't plagued during development.

[@zzodysseuszz]

Elden ring is overrated. Bloodborne art direction is where it’s at

[@ObiJuanKenob]

​@@Sewersyrup don't forget that dks2-2 already exists with scholars. I've always called it Dks2-2-2 😭

[@Vengeance_I_m]

​@zzodysseuszz Oh Bloodborne , with it's amazing art direction of 50 shades of grey. Also, Bloodborne is definitely not overrated. No it doesn't have the worst bosses in the franchise, the worst art direction, story and replayability. It's just too good and doesn't have flaws. My favourite boss in Bloodborne are One Reborn and Amygdala, very well designed and fair bosses, truly one of the bosses of all time. And Bloodborne in itself is truly, one of the games of all time

[@are3287]

Oh my god thanks so much I just downloaded the the lighting engine and I never wouldve realized how big of a change this one setting makes

[@exotic-gem]

Yeah, the default settings make the image much less coherent with their super saturated colorful fog. I’m really not a big fan, I think you’re right. When I decide it’s time to play DS2 on pc I’ll download your override settings

[@Zapdos7471]

The insertion of personal choices into projects intended for the broader community definitely feels like a recurring issue across the modding communities I’ve participated in. Ideally I’d want the mod as close as possible to a plainly upgraded version of the game and turn on advanced options to suit my interests.

[@lotrfan4237]

Thank you for this mod! I absolutely hate the changes in the art direction with the LightingEngine. Your mod is a lifesaver

[@DmitryB-153]

I absolutely agree with you! And in my opinion they added some strange fog to the some locations that looks like there is smoke everywhere, especially in giant's forest. I also feel like just disabling lighting override is not enough, there is something else that make the image inconsistent and odd. Maybe the fog I mentioned

[@aeternalux9175]

Completely agree, wonderful lightning, but failed creators intent.

[@diobolical7]

It’s so interesting to see how lighting can change so much about a game’s mood/artistic direction

[@lasagnasoul]

such a shame that the mod creators and/or the discord doesn't like this kind of constructive criticism. It'd be so easy to add in another preset to have all of them as the base game, and another preset for the new ones.

[@gamingwithstuff2455]

My only complaint is that it's too dark in some areas. I watched Lobos Jrs stream with this mod, and half the time you couldn't see sh*t. He turned up the brightness and opted to use more of the torch because the chat was complaining so much.

[@filho4437]

Complaint with what?

[@weshansen7892]

@@filho4437 with the mod, they literally say that in the comment lmao

[@edbane1656]

But that is the point of some areas, you have to use the torch and light the sconces to make the area brighter.

[@TemptingNoise]

The original game was designed with this in mind but alot was changed last minute due to quick graphical downgrades and other issues. It's almost a scrapped feature with how prominent it is in the base game but doesn't add much (minus the odd area)

[@SimplCup]

You can still see everything clearly even without a torch lol.

[@rainbowkrampus]

I'll take the harder stance. Doing what LE does to Majula is a crime. The whole point is "warm sunset". It's not "overcast, dreary seaside town". That completely eradicates the irony. The town initially appears to be a warm, inviting, peaceful place. But there's a lot of misery just below the surface. As you explore the world and learn about the lie that is the age of fire, you come to realize that the sunset itself is a deception of sorts. That the sun is part of the lie. A complete lack of media literacy strikes again.

[@Broformist]

Did you at least try the more colorful lighting preset? Default one sucks, I agree. I had to change to the other one, "Atmospheres", because of Majula especially. I like it fine with that preset though.

[@JellyJman]

You are 100% that the default lighting engine does make some questionable changes to the look of the game and your changes seem to be much much better! Keep up your hard work.

[@PlayerOblivion]

9:52 for me this part is the most jarring, there is a clear artistic vision that is overridden by the excess sky brightness, the bloom and fog/volumetrics particularly, it still looks okay but i agree that the vanilla colors and brightness levels should be preserved and be the default, obviously the configuration menu exists so that one can restore the original look but shouldn't the original aesthetics be the baseline and not the new one?

[@Valdyr_Hrafn]

No one does it like you. Thank you for putting original art direction first!!! It's the main reason why I'm so uninterested in bluepoint remaking any other fromsoft games.

[@ArmoredForms]

As someone who also loves the Lighting Engine but has tested it and compared it a ton to vanilla, disabling the lighting overrides doesn't get you back to vanilla lighting either. You would have to go in there and tweak a lot of the values to get something that was truly consistent with the original intent/vision. It is super cool you are able to do it though, it does suck that you have to go area by area. You can create lighting profiles, and I don't know if @fromsoftserve is using the "extended" profile or not but the non-extended one I believe just "atmosphere" gets much closer (but then you still need to tweak a lot of things). The sad part is that the non-extended profile doesn't work with HDR for those interested in that (since I am on an extremely old monitor it doesn't matter for me lol)

[@sengan2475]

Makes me even sadder they didn't have the default preset stick true to the original art direction

[@jeak]

Surely this could be fixed with a comprehensive re-tune of the lighting values for each area, just put in the 100h or so of tuning, ez.

[@Coypop]

A few of the scenes the Digital Foundry vid showed off did look like they strayed too far from the original's intentions. And that's the kicker with Dark Souls 2, the unrealized intent of its engine has been what's kept it in the conscience all this time, the yearning for that mythic pre-release build. DS2LightingEngine (and Flames of Old releasing never lol) have been the little miracles that seem to make the mythic real. But it takes an obsessive, disciplined, and humble eye to look at an unfinished labor and discern accurately where the original artists wanted it to go, and to deliver it there. Hint. nudge.

[@Er404ChannelNotFound]

Scholar base lighting is still my favorite. Play with Scholar unmodded and turn the brightness down to 1 and you will find its look is amazing.

[@rakhoo5236]

I love that you try to stay true to artistic direction devs wanted, overdoing things is not always a good choice totally agree

[@Daniel-27110]

Thank you for bringing this to our attention. I love LightingEngine, but the base game colours just look so much better. I'll definitely be using your preset mod. Thanks.

[@KKKuma]

One of the thing I don't like about all the visual mod is that they usually just either put on a filter or just increase/decrease saturation, bloom, fog. It feel very off even though it look great. I personally just play normally without any visual mod.

[@MiyazakisPVPexperience]

THANK YOU, the loss in style was the first thing I noticed with the mod. It immediately turned me away from it, but thanks for showing it can be manually fixed! Will be giving it a try

[@mzed561]

i just don't really get why the default ini kills and flattens so much of the original colours of the game when they were such deliberately impactful artistic broad strokes for each area

[@andre_ss6]

Completely agree. When I saw the DF video I was so stoked to test this mod, but the more I noticed the artistic changes, the less enthusiastic I became. Sad, because otherwise the mod is awesome. This is just like those bad movie remasters where they change stuff unnecessarily.

[@Xathian]

I like the mod except the fog. I am a card carrying volumetric fog hater. Video game fog like this doesn't look like fog, it just looks like a filter washing out all the screen so it's white tinted.

[@garadje2623]

Recently reinstalled DS2SotfS for the LightingEngine, put in lotsa hours years ago with base SotfS. Thanks for the option to disable the overrides, will be fun to compare and contrast when I give it a replay! Sorry to hear about the Discord drama, reminds me of some of the madness I'd see go down in the emulation scene between Retroarch and some emulation authors. It would always be a very small minor issue that resulted in overly impassioned flame wars, was insane lmao.

[@hommedegout]

I would love if there was a preset that kept the lighting override and tweaked the values closer to vanilla to make some kind of "Vanilla+" lighting preset.

[@AtreyusNinja]

from the perspective of someone who started playing DS2 on day one vanilla (pre-order edition) I can say that overall it looks better as default, you might miss some small details, yes I get that, but overall the game just looks *BETTER*, that's the point, that's what's good about this mod, I love this mod because it CHANGES some things from an old game that I love. with the default option it's more like a real DS2 remake, your mod will allow people to play a hybrid mod between a remake and the old game, which is a bit weird for me, i'm ok with losing the vanilla colors of the sky, it's just more beautiful. but i will try again to disable that option from time to time when i want to change the lighting in the area, cuz i do love to try different presets until i find the best combo, and that option may be good sometime

[@dadqqader]

I'm with you too. I feel like many of the changes DS2LE is straight up better. Black Gulch being pitch black feel like it should've been that way all along. The exception here being that green fog in Huntmans Corpse. That is definitely insane. I think the video should've been a comparison between base game without mod/DS2LE and DS2 Classic mod he's working on. The whole Dragon Shrine section in the video clearly look wrong in both toggle/untoggle lightning override instance and it will weakening a lot of his criticism here.

[@SimplCup]

exactly, ds2's original visuals are just bad on a technical level, no shadows, no fog, bad ao (which even made it's way to the ds3), everything looks like it was made by disney. ds2le, straight up is objectively better than the base game cus it brings the technology into the game, the GTAO, the parallax occlusion, dlaa, overall better global illumination, better reflections and speculars, of course it's gonna look different compared to the base game, cus it adds the stuff that is not present in ds2, but should have been. it's like shitting on des remake for looking too good.

[@Shibu_PL]

I honestly don't like this mod. DkS2 has this unique melancholic atmosphere thanks to its very vibrant (I like to call it "afternoon") color scheme and this mod makes everything more dark and gloomy just for the sake of it.

[@SimplCup]

og game looks like a cartoon because of the lack of visual technology lol, this mod breaths life in it and allows to do whatever you want with basically everything in terms of visuals.

[@chiefcloudyeye0489]

@@SimplCup It's very much an artistic decision, not a lack of visual technology. The original Dark Souls has a much gloomier style and, believe it or not, came out before Dark Souls II.

[@konradfun]

Have you ever made it past Majula or Heide? This comment doesn't make any sense

[@unoriginalperson72]

​​​@@konradfun that effect still exists in the game, that's someone saying "I really like how bright the sun is in this game" and then going into a cave and being like "erm have you even played this game? Where's the sun in this DARK CAVE?"

[@churibman]

5:00 damn the colorful horizon from the default game does look cooler

[@garageapartment9141]

To be able to see the Undead Purgatory from Majula is..... I just can't put into words.......🤯

[@unoriginalperson72]

It's so sigma!

[@jetmad2551]

Ahhhhhhh, you made it visually immersive. finally!!!!! This is awesome!!!!!

[@stevethepocket]

No one is more defensive about the choices they made than people whose choices were wrong. Dunning-Kruger at work.

[@Mart-E12]

Majula is meant to be warm, it's a nice welcoming place in this cold world

[@HappyDinosaur23]

at first i was like its a matter of taste more realistic skyboxes or more artistic ones, both have their own flavors but they lost me when i saw huntsmans copse that tint is horrid

[@dadqqader]

Yeah most of the stuff i saw in this video is something i kinda prefer DS2LE way of handling it (Black Gulch being absolutely pitch black is sooo much better. It's underground. Pitch Black is the way. sorry Fromsoftserve.). But the Huntsman Corps green fog is fucking crazy lol

[@brucepreston3927]

​@@dadqqaderI agree...I actually like a lot of the changes, but there are a few that look pretty bad...Good thing we can go through and pick and choose which which one we want to use for each area! Lighting Engine really is amazing...The first day I downloaded it I spent the whole day just messing with different settings and it's pretty crazy what it can do! I know next to nothing about this kind of stuff, but it is still fun to mess around with and see what you can come up with...

[@owlgoddess8534]

i initially got myself confused and thought the green fog was the one closer to the vanilla artstyle because there’s no way the modders decided that needed to be ADDED

[@HappyDinosaur23]

@@owlgoddess8534 lmao that’s literally what I thought at first too 😂

[@ssasdddddt]

I'm a professional artist and I have to agree with most of your takes, fog looks nice, but they definitely went overboard with it for no good reason other than because tney could. Technical people in my experience often have pretty bad artistic taste, and the fact they banned u is wild.

[@pandorabox2283]

The Gutter on an OLED screen looks amazing in default LE. Give me those deep inky blacks!

[@0GTXR]

The original looks fantastic, and the mod has potential to elevate it higher. Keep up the good work on the preset.

[@EmissaryOfSmeagol]

I have exactly the same opinion. But, I also want to celebrate any W that the DS2 community is able to muster, DS2 needs all the positive press it can get. So it really is a conundrum, having a negative opinion of a brand new mod...

[@BungieStudios]

LightingEngine reminds me of Bloodporne. Amazing how much of a difference lighting can make.

[@WealthyHomeless]

I agree 100%, there are some areas that look good but there are other most areas that just don't look right, I suppose they can calibrate in the future.

[@erisescher]

For whatever reason I've noticed that LE also smooths out the sea in majula/heide which makes it lose a lot of its texture and reflectiveness, not sure whether this is an option that can be reverted but would love to see it in a classic version.

[@Elmaku92]

Thank you for this video, i thought i was going crazy. As a 3d artist myself, I kinda was just wondering if I was just being extremelly nitpicky, but in reality they did change the vibes of a lot of places and that made it really hard to enjoy this mod fully.

[@TazAlonzo]

Idk if you know much about skyrim's modding scene but there will always be people that make some of if not the most important mods for a game and then implement their own tastes into those essential mods because they have a big ego. **cough cough, Arthmoor**

[@ArchOfficial]

From what I can tell they're aiming for the look of preproduction and trailer materials, which is fine except their artists are not up to snuff, so it doesn't end up like something that'd be in a product made by pros and is riddled with basic mistakes like value and edge issues. Then a bunch of newfags who aren't artists or art directors will attack criticism of it because "bro its how DS2 was intended to look", not realizing that DS2 wasn't intended to look like that.

[@michaelbrindley4363]

Funny you mentioned some will play ds2 for the first time w the LE. Yep, thats me 😅

[@jvnells8]

Artisitcally, I think Majula was always supposed to look like this old, sun-baked coastal settlement where the light gleamed harshly off of the wood and dirt and the flourish of daylight was supposed to look more garish and striking.

[@MilkmanYeti]

I'm like 50% through my first LE playthrough and man, this is a game changer. It's like the best of both worlds. I was definitely missing some of the vibes from the original.

[@extremelyboredtatsumaki.495]

I’m thinking about giving DS2 another try after playing it a few times and not really thinking great of it. I’ve only played the SOTFS version. Is this lightning mod compatible with centre dead zone mod on the original version or is SOTFS only? Also, are you using a texture mod in this video??

[@eddyhg8098]

You are the GOAT, exactly what I wanted :) thank you! Never stop please! Ahahhaha

[@zebubble2084]

Thank you. It didn't sit well with me either and maybe this is the we can get as a middle ground with intended contrast/color and trailer tier dynamic lighting and detail.

[@WUVGAWORE]

I'm very grateful your preset exists, it definitley doesn't feel like ds2lightengine was intentionally trying to give a "this is how it should be" but wanted people to see their vision (which was based off of the original e3 version of the game) which is also a perfect way to display just how capable the mod is. It's a tool first and foremost with the artists vision included.

[@WUVGAWORE]

I will say the timing of this video is a little odd with the release of Digital Foundry making an analysis of the mod just a day ago.

[@ooslingg]

100% agree original ambiance is lost with a lot of these changes.

[@SuperSweatyPocari]

I'm glad I've seen this video having never done a full playthrough of DS2 yet, as I would have installed this mod and not made any changes. I'm surprised by how much artistic liberties it takes by default. You lose SO much detail in the distance due to the added fog effects and what not. The absolute worst change to me is Heide's Tower as you lose that beautiful starry sky. Sucks to hear you were banned from the discord server, but they should be able to take constructive criticism. The lighting engine mod is a must for DS2 now, but the defaults aren't great

[@plasmarey5856]

based on what i remember, the sky thing is a technical issue / side effect. the modder put that option to "disable the lighting changes" is because he KNEW the mod kinda fucks the sky too much. he wanted players to have the option to get the original sky (which also just disable the lighting changes)

[@plasmarey5856]

also i think people have to dial it a little bit with the "criticisms" u guys have to remember this is just a MOD some guy decided to create in his free time. no one is paying the guy to make this. imagine telling someone that their passion project doesnt measure up to your artistic taste. if u dont like it, you dont have to use it (same opinion for reshade presets, etc.). imo constructive criticisms are nice if people who say it are less mean and entitled.

[@Csumbi]

i love DS2LE, it makes the game look like an actual 3D game, the armors, characters and environments, everything looks so much better, but i agree with the idea of keeping the game as close to the original vision as possible. When it comes to modding i will always prefer mods that are not lore or game breaking.

[@hideousarmor3985]

Lovely hearing a mod developer worry so much about the artistic direction of the original game. I see this pattern with light/post processing modders messing with a ton of params simply bc they can without much criteria. Bloom specially is always on blast. Not too different from amateur gamedevs pushing cam shake and particles all over the place.

[@BirdNoise77]

That's the thing about modding games like this. Especially when it comes to lighting and textures and stuff. Fromsoft is known for their gameplay and whatnot, but their ART DIRECTION is top notch. Some of the best in the business, it feels like everything in the game is there for a reason, that reason being to tell a story. When you go and mess with the literal colors on the palette, of course you'll lose something. That said, the lighting engine is an amazing mod and nothing will take that away from the team working on it. Being banned for constructive criticism is crazy though

[@sachahjkl]

Feel better knowing I was not crazy. that mod IS great but it completely ruined the look and feel of the game

[@Uhcip]

Mods that preserve the original art direction are ideal. I saw the new Doom 2 raytracing version and a lot of the same problems there, but they added goopy jello blood as well for some reason.

[@MagixVegasUser]

DS2FogEngine

[@Beanibirb]

Being banned for feedback or constructive criticism is insane but it's happened to me as well, thank you for the preset though.

[@Broformist]

I don't like the default lighting preset. But the more colorful one, "Atmospheres", looks great to me.

[@Soroosh.S83]

The moder just played ds3 and was pissed that ds2 doesn't look like that lol it's just a different game I perfer no lighting mod

[@MLWJ1993]

DS3's copper look on the player character is another thing though, DS2 definitely does character lighting better. 😬

[@AtreyusNinja]

in iron keep it looks much better the default option, i'm trying it right now

[@MlnscBoo]

I agree, the original lighting is better, maybe it was changed for performance issues? just a guess and most likely wrong, but ln the shaded woods for instance, that much fog would bog some systems down. Just a guess though 17:26 The contrast between the blue and orange here is awesome

[@kodi0223]

For a mod meant to be a lighting engine replacement and some graphics, there should be no reason to apply significant artistic interpretations by default. At most they should be a built-in preset that can be switched to from the (default) original themed lighting. This makes it lean more toward a lighting remaster instead of a lighting replacement, reminding me of skyrim ENB's To clarify, everything looks great! most of the changes are pretty, but anyone downloading the mod is expecting ds2 with better lighting, not ds2 remake

[@NefesTOficial]

Heyy love your videos, any ETA on fixing Gwynevere's room?

[@Valdyr_Hrafn]

Another thing i struggle with this mod is how dim and hazy the fog makes everything.

[@MakenziAtlantis]

The fog ruins everything

[@FowardShift]

I love the fog

[@Sewersyrup]

That fog reminds me of late 2ks piss filter, cept in here it looks like a mold filter.

[@MilesMods]

Fromsoftserve making everything super wet ruins everything in DS1 too. You see why he got banned now? He's a hypocrite with an ego now.

[@cctz_1]

@@MilesModstake like a meditation break. I hold no stakes in any of ur beef, no normal person should be overreacting like u r for this situation 💀

[@unoriginalperson72]

The fog is cumming

[@philemon26]

I think the added fog from LE has the same effect of Depth of Field in the base game, it blurs the vista so much that you can't even see the detail of the textures and polygons. In all three Dark Souls games I always disable DoF because of that. Sometimes less is more. If you add so much things into something it just gonna obstruct the original stuff. edit: I need to clarify that what I meant by "same effect" is the obstruction to the original vista of the game.

[@MLWJ1993]

I do think the horizon fog on DS2LE is an improvement, but the completely different tonemapping is a different matter.

[@TheCheshireTree]

The lighting engine doesn't work for me. After installation I have default ds2 static blurry shadows and there is black skies on every map. The torch gives my character dynamic shadows. But wall torches dont give me a shadow, except one in the transition from meluja to the towers. Just one frigging torch. Also the bonfires dont give me shadows. Enabling the mentioned ds2 defaults gives me the skies back but also the shadows stay the same. Using the 0.8 version I have skies but same shadow problem.