IDENTITY CRISIS: When Our Story Falls Apart

[@elizabethmansfield3609]

39:46 you mention Byron Katie, I once heard an interview with her in which she dismissed a rape victim’s problems as “just thoughts”. It was so cruel. As we know from Porges’ Polyvagal theory and van der Kolk’s The Body keeps the Score, and also structural dissociation (Haunted Self, van der Hart et al) it is absolutely not the case that you can dismiss/treat trauma as “just thoughts”. Some traumas rip you apart, it is appropriate to mention wrt this topic

[@gwendolynmurphy9563]

How refreshing! Some of us had been cultivating the skill of mindfulness for years! Here's what Ken McLeod, Tibetan Buddhist teacher, has to offer: (1) Observe how you relate to people and your surroundings when afflictions are present in your mind: for example, when you crave a certain food, crave love, or are very angry or upset; (2) Observe how you relate to the same people and objects when afflictions are not manifest in your mind; (3) Reflect that this difference is due to the presence or absence of the self-grasping ignorance that underpins all afflictions. Get a sense of how things appear to you when grasping true existence is and is not present; (4) Reflect that this true-grasping is an erroneous mind as well as the source of all afflictions and make a determination to uproot it. Practicing meditation is one method to cultivate awareness of feelings, thoughts, and how they interact with each other. At some point it may occur to one that mind is more than I "think."

[@temmellese6730]

Sir, I’m an English literature graduate and I have never heard the term thus & such used in conversation. Nice work. That is indeed the queens English! Language of royalty.

[@SyntropicWisdom]

Thanks!

[@EmilyMarais]

Having listened to your podcast for years, I want to say a huge thank you for helping to shape this young person's outlook on the world and the mind as a positive one. This is my first time watching you on video and I just love how engaged you all are. Thank you for everything

[@Morale_Booster]

When I feel triggered I like to journal about it and list the facts. What actually happened? Then I ask "what am I making this mean?" Sometimes its helpful to find the benefits of the situation, other times I just need to give my inner child what she needs. Usually its something like safety or comfort

[@noellecuisine8912]

What a profound and central theme thank you for this! As I am currently finishing a Polyvagal theory course with Deb Dana, and as I am a lifelong mind - consciousness student, I resonate with Lisa’s point on the nervous system….. and I find out that I first have to tend to my nervous state and then I can go into the depths and the divers layers of the narrative that play in me….. or that I play a narrate to myself …..I’m also meditating on how much freedom we have to think something and I found it quite a mystery when you link it to biology and a lot of good science…. I literally Marvel at this capacity I have and we have to think and have words and share and listen to each other or to oneself and make sense….. I’m grateful for your sharing and your point of view. I totally love it. ❤

[@lisawanderess]

Loved this episode so much! My psychologist often used to say to me: "That's just a story you're telling yourself; change the story". At first I was offended by that, but eventually I understood. I still have to remind myself from time to time though and listening to this was a great reminder! I find all of your voices so calming and soothing I love listening to you just before I go to sleep. Thank you for the great work you do.

[@marz3382]

Beautifully spoken To unconsciously author our stories to a shift of consciously authoring our stories. Beautiful

[@kriswalker3275]

Also, crying out different names and not remembering the true name of the cat could also be that part of her that is part of us all that's afraid to forget that person and the details of what life was like with them. The Eric Clapton song " will you know my name if I saw you in heaven" is an example of that feeling of fading memories of relationship with the distances we feel.

[@Carmel明慧]

Joseph, you are such an anchoring person and always so authentic - it never goes unnoticed. Thank you for all you share, you touch the heart and the soul.

[@Lioness_of_Gaia]

I just found this channel. I'm so glad I did! Thank you!!

[@Billy_The_Skid]

I'm sorry you're going through this justnow. I can relate a lot to feeling fobbed off and patronised which led to me losing all faith in going the gp route when struggling. I remember a psychiatrist downplaying the side effects of meds as 'little head zaps' when I tried talking about them but when I asked if he'd ever tried them he said no. I ended up going private for counselling and found someone with a spiritual background which helped for me to find ways of coping and try stay off of medication. That and meditation, exercise, journalling, giving up alcohol and to go to those lengths it's not nothing is it? Got to be bad before you're inspired to overhaul your life like that but yeah I ran into same issues with GP's usually.

[@kathybochicchio1411]

Tuned in today...spontaneously..synchronicity...much needed grounding ....journal writing...love your podcast ❤

[@honroub]

Thank you. This discussion has helped me interpret one of my important dreams. I am in therapy and dreams have been playing a crucial role in many of my sessions. Animals in them, snow, walls... very interesting indeed. I love zhe way you discuss here the reality of phenomena vs.our interpretations & narratives around them in times of crisis --eye-opening, thank you for this too! I'd love it if you could do a bit on finding our place in Life, in the Larger Scheme of things, and thus achieving (as I imagine) some peace of mind & contentment. The masculine & feminine powers we can wield when we are seemingly stuck, and how these can be employed/called upon when we need to move forward. Waiting vs. decisive action. Thank you :) An amateur Jung admirer

[@losskopein]

I personally went through this last summer when work halted for 4 months. I went through the fire, experienced it....I went through The Dark Night. With that in my pocket, this year's halt to work (I work as a camera operator in TV) is way easier. No stress very little worry cause I know it will get better. I'm just happy to wake up in the morning now😁. Throw out the illusions

[@pimbu936]

Hell yes! This is exactly what I needed in my life right now, a little dose of properly grounded Jungians! Quite inspiring. Onwards and upwards!

[@Mink0twink]

38:11 adding to this part, what also makes ruminating challenging is that sometimes you ‘do’ solve or find a solution. Simple example, but let’s say you have a big interview the next day and you’re stressed about the outfit you want to wear and you didn’t have enough time the current day to plan this out. So you stress and then think about “what if I show up in wrinkled clothes, ect” and you go on about this.. however, you remember that you washed a particular shirt that would be perfect and it was only in this rumination that you discovered this solution. Something I see that gets lost on the topic of rumination is that sometimes an actual solution is found and these instances get forgotten or written off as maybe not being part of the problem, but in doing so we don’t fully understand how the success rate of rumination plays a role in how often we might lean on that cognitive behavior in the future even when our overall tendency to ruminate may have negative consequences

[@nickibanks5185]

I agree with you. How do you benefit from the lessons of past mistakes if you don't reflect back on the past . The difference between it being , bad or good or indifferent, is how much time & energy you spend in the past & for what reason. Too many people also spend to much time in the future assuming that life will be better when????. 😊

[@Mya_9393]

I feel like the cat is a memory of her connection to her father that's been buried, hence the snow. The book is her disconnection from her father AND he lack of confidence in her work environment. The other animals is her mind trying to present to herself the memory of her connection to her father that will give her more confidence, but remembering the depth of connection (and enmeshment of a 5 yr old girl) with her dad would be very painful. I think shes on the cusp of liberation from her current suffering because her mind is working on it.

[@v.ra.]

I just heard the most beautiful story 🎨🖌️

[@karinturkington2455]

I just recently discovered this channel. Thank you for this. I feel comforted and less crazy watching you three discuss these deep and seemingly indecipherable (to me) complexes. I feel calm.

[@RisperKiruma]

This has got to be one of my favourite episodes ever! From now on, when imagining the worst (which I do often), I'll hear Joseph's voice asking me, "...and then what would happen?". Also, I've been away, but love that you added a visual to the podcast! Feels like a Zoom meeting, like I'm in the conversation. All the love from Kenya!

[@noellecuisine8912]

PS: and it is great to be able to pull out some tools or protocols to look at things, like ‘the work’ (Byron Katie) , like NCV (non violent communication) protocols or others…. But it also means being in a state where you are not losing it …. It means that you have still some capacity to engage into thinking and reflecting…. There is Kind of a sequence, I guess, where states, unformed and allow for reflecting and thinking again…. Whilst sometimes it clearly isn’t possible….. for me recognizing where I am what I feel which state I am in is absolutely helpful….

[@ranousman-st5ib]

Interesting. Thank you for this informative session

[@professormariarty]

Thank you for a wonderful company. You are brilliant

[@Bijou_248]

Joseph Lee ~ I long to hear your insights but you're often so quiet. Such wisdom in development! when you speak I'm so excited. Yes, finally after 12 to 20 minutes in. 😂 I adore Lisa and Debra ~ they're both great. But I wonder what's going through Joseph's mind. Mr Lee, if you write a book I'm onto purchasing it. 🤗🌸✨🪷🦜🌈🙏

[@vijayrajkamat]

27:45 i didn't understand this. Joseph says "The unconscious strategy is to REFUSE to treat the pain.... So he can become an artist". But in the client's narrated fantasy, TAKING THE TYLENOL (treating the pain) is the strategy that leads him to becoming an artist. So which one is the unconscious strategy? Treating or not treating the pain?

[@rega90]

He's talking about the shadow aspect of unconscious that's feaful of the tylenol. The 'self' aspect of the unconscious is what's brought to light through the narrated fantasy.

[@REZZA2020]

Thank you. Would love to learn more about how Jung's art style influenced authors and musicians

[@elisabethveltman5291]

I love listening to you three, thank you. I wonder if this dream might relate to a fear of leadership . Taking charge. She has these creative spirits rushing to her, but her inner feminine was lost in the house that her mom couldn’t keep. She was safe ss a little girl in the house of her father , but just as she grows into adulthood , her mom wasn’t able to keep it. Her boss wants to promote her, so her subconscious gors looking for that part of her thst was safe in her father’s house. Can’t find it, so how does she bring her leadership forward as a female soul? Will she lose the house? Her subconscious might be ssking her to find s way to trust herself as a female responsible for leadership without who she knew as her father’s daughter.

[@zambhalha]

The opening statement... something like..As a man has in his heart so he is .. than the conversation shifted to thoughts defining.. mind.. it went from heart to mind .. the conversation diverted.. the opening statement offered a greater insight if followed..

[@DJSTOEK]

❤❤

[@samjubran7315]

Joseph, your account of the unfulfilled artist and your wise instruction to lean into the fullness of the sub-narrative moved me deeply. This has been one of the more effective strategies for me when I feel overwhelmed. Thank you.

[@Carmel明慧]

I was also deeply moved by hearing that account, it was incredible.

[@peacefulandpretty2372]

How do you approach the "Can you know it's true?" question around an intuition? The point of intuition is it doesn't have objective evidence. How do you approach intuitive insights? Particularly intuitions that drive negative feelings?

[@INFP-Insights]

So many constructive, creative ways to invite and involve the ego in distress to engage the Self through story . . .

[@jazw4649]

Book: Todd Rose - Collective Illusions Why we act against our own best interests Drawing on cutting-edge neuroscience, behavioral economic, and social psychology research, acclaimed author, former Harvard professor, and think tank founder Todd Rose reveals how so much of our thinking about each other is informed by false assumptions that drive bad decisions that make us dangerously mistrustful as a society and hopelessly unhappy as individuals.

[@Cristina-xm3ie]

Mind-blowing

[@NolaCaffey]

About the dream - the cat ran out through the door (the transformation she fears, her own maturing toward death ). The dreamer may fear becoming an adult if she believes her father wouldn't recognize her when he returns, as he never saw her grow up. So, it sounds like incomplete mourning, not yet accepting his death, keeps her small (immature) enough for him to find.

[@AnthonyL0401]

17:35 "The discovery that we can self-author is a radical thing"

[@dotdeerenjie]

Is there a academy for this podcast?

[@gwendolynmurphy9563]

Specific yoga asanas relieve sciatica!

[@lucynatarajan9613]

This is so useful! I love that you mention UK travel. I'll remember this during my next commute (which is often trying 😅)

[@sallyjoperceptions6251]

the Hermetic laws also states "All is Mind; the Universe is Mental."

[@Yambataller]

We think feelings instead of witnessing the energy appearing in consciousness without making an image of it. That’s how the mind creates the world of perception and gets hypnotized by shadows, separating the whole into different things. Thoughts are form but energy has no form.

[@slane_design]

@56:01 The dream of forgetting the cats name...Cats are feminine protectors and she is worried about losing her memories of her father.

[@coteian]

thanks you guys are awesome!

[@user-js4sb4qq2h]

I love how Deb's response is immediately empathetic and compassionate and I hear it in Joseph's voice too, that they both understand and deeply feel the other. I wish Lisa wasn't so mechanical in her clinical responses. I feel like I'm watching Spock, but prefer Kirk and Bones' deep feeling resonance.

[@onions888]

Not sure I agree. Lisa’s contributions are always insightful, have feeling, and the dynamic between the three of them is well balanced

[@johnfitzpatrick5930]

25:27 Mr. Lee your strategy will be put to work

[@Liyah-encyclopedia333]

What we think, we become

[@dmt7674]

Can this be reversed? If you’ve gone too far..

[@XC0r3]

these thoughts are mine alone

[@mariacharles306]

Really

[@adriandeutrom9092]

Very good listening to. I was hoping that somewhere in this threesome conversation on the topic of "separation anxiety" would be discussed, particularly when it's acted out into relationships

[@Eric-tj3tg]

I'm pretty sure they briefly discussed "the abandonment complex." Maybe you're referring to this in some way? I'm reminded of "relationship styles", born out of our earliest bonds. Dr. Ed Tronic and Sue Miller (last name may be wrong fir Sue) have a video on YT entitled "The Still Face Experiment." One is a young child, and the other illustrates the continuity, unconsciously of course, of these attachment styles. Hope that this is useful to you.

[@PashaTemniuk]

i used to listen to oasis now i listen to chaos

[@AnthonyL0401]

3:45