In Defense of "SIMPLE" Wargames

[@mathsteck]

People often confuse complexity with depth for some reason. I would say most people want deep games not complex ones. And having more complexity doesn't mean it's more deep. Chess is a very simple game but with lots of depth because the "crunch" and strategy emerges from the interaction between the pieces, not because you need to track 300 pages of rules.

[@codyraugh6599]

Like ironically I liked the Old Warhammer before age of Sigmar because the simpler elements of it, plus the fact that it was formations of units, if you viewed every unit as one piece the strategy becomes simpler yet it still has that level of depth... And then AOS came out any every unit had a different sheet and so many things just made no sense despite the fake veneer of simplicity when it came out.

[@user-ov1nn1em4j]

Totally agree.. Complexity in a game like Battletech or Titanicus can be fun because managing your mech's systems is as fundamental to the game as shooting your opponent. It's integral to the game. If the complexity doesn't add to the game, get rid of it. I have long left the GW world, but one of the changes for 40k 10th that sounded promising was scrapping the old list building system for a more AoS system. Great, nobody's gaming experience was improved by spending time rearranging your list to fit in a plasma gun

[@billdefranza4927]

Came here to cite chess as an example. 👍

[@SuperDuperHappyTime]

⁠@@codyraugh6599 I disagree entirely. Both games had roughly the same amount of rules on each unit’s page, but the Core Rules interactions for WFB was roughly ten times as long and thrice as dense.

[@thel1chking]

This is what I’ve been saying for a long time - simulations are not real games . GW makes their wargames feel too much like RPGs because that is their origin in making D&D minis.

[@blacktower7777]

I took One Page Rules Grimdark Future to our 40k game night a few weeks ago. At first there was a lot of resistance from the group but I got one of them to play. I took the Dwarf Guilds and used some archvillain models to represent the Custodian Brothers. Before we started he told me.he had already made a list using his space marine models. We had an awesome game that was over in 2 hours. We drew a few eyes our way from the rest of the group so we setup a group game with 4 of us. 2 hours later the entire group was making Grimdark Future list, laughing and having a good time. It is the most fun we have had in a long time and we continue to play OPR games.

[@tabletopminions]

That’s great to hear! OPR is really fun. Thanks for watching!

[@LukeMartinVideo]

I got to play with my new favourite local player to roll dice against thanks to OPR cause we had like 5 games but none in common... So with OPR we mix and matched 40k 30k dust and random 3d prints and got some tone of fun 🎉

[@almister]

So lucky, that is the dream 😢

[@Psychichazard]

5 Parsecs From Home is a solo game, and the mechanics are deliberately streamlined, to reduce the number of things you need to remember during a game.

[@jellezwiggelaar824]

And I still forget some things time to time 😅

[@mrb7261]

This was what I was going to suggest. Such a fun game! And completely miniatures agnostic, so it’s easy to get into

[@ElijahRhyne]

Yeah put you have to do some much rolling before and after the match that I've started working on a spreadsheet to automate all that stuff 😂😂😂

[@Kastinger93]

Gaslands is also a great addition for beginner friendly wargaming. You basically play it with Hot Wheels or Matchbox cars, so if you wanna try it, most people only have to grab the rulebook for like 25€. You can't get cheaper into the hobby! Also the Mad Max like setting is awesome 🤘

[@Slurgical_3D_Terrain_Channel]

Love Gasland :)

[@briand5979]

Agreed, I've introduced many 1st timers with it.

[@elsimian3483]

Just got into this - it's just amazing fun and with great mechanics (pardon the pun 😅)

[@lizardkyng]

Gaslands is a great game, though it does lead to buying more cars every time I go to the store. Got close to 100 cars modded up and still have a box of probably another 100 waiting in the wings.

[@nexusoldbind5015]

Frostgrave stargrave and oathmark are also really cheap to get into rule books are about £20 -£25 and you can use miniatures you've already got for all the systems if you don't have miniatures they also get miniatures for these systems Which are very cheap but if you're on a budget I recommend Caesar miniatures the cheapest miniatures you can buy which are easily paintable there are some cheaper miniatures than that but they need a lot more work

[@gavherron3714]

I'm all about One Page Rules these days. No extra books or data sheet do-overs. Simple and fun!

[@autumnlotus6250]

My issue with that game is that almost every unit. Feels like it is the exact same unit just with a slightly different gun

[@gavherron3714]

@autumnlotus6250 I totally get that, no system is perfect, OPR included. It scratches my itch to roll dice simply enough and with lifelong updates on rules after one purchase or patreon month there's currently a level of respect that's missing elsewhere. Bur that's just two cents dude. 😀

[@gregmiller1159]

I'd be more interested, but don't know anyone that plays it. And that's what it generally comes down to.

[@michaljanecek82]

sorry, but OPR is one of the most overrated "system" ever... way too simple . it gets some depth only with really huge armies, otherwise it's very boring...

[@gavherron3714]

​@@gregmiller1159 I hear you dude. Currently, it feels like it's just me, my brother and my kids playing here. I guess guys have to start somewhere

[@DonCurrywurst]

Easy to learn, hard to master is the way I prefer games. I dont like to study before I can play. I like to learn WHILE playing.

[@Sanguivore]

Emergent complexity for the win!

[@green_zebra_crafting]

Same. It's hard to start digging in to how to strategize in a game when you're stuck learning 20 pages of rules bookkeeping.

[@demm-ian3426]

Same

[@BlackDouglas1000]

One Hour Wargames is a great little set of rules. It is minis agnostic and simplifies the 'old school' or 'traditional' type of wargaming. Its focus is historical with a core set of rules that is tweaked in each section to better reflect the time period. A max of 6 units of 3 or 4 types is needed per player and it uses d6 for combat. The 30 scenarios in the are more about using the correct strategy for the terrain and list building is kind of automated. I built black powder units using Risk tokens so you may already have minis. If you must play SciFi or Fantasy just add the word 'LASER' or Plasma in front of any weapon or call the armies orcs and elves and you are good to go. Of course ancients already rock the fantasy vibe so it works too.

[@NewbieDice]

Mantic's Kings of War. Streamlined ranks and flanks wargame.

[@colinmack8655]

And with ambush even easier to start.

[@HobbyDad251]

Mantic's Deadzone is an amazing example of simple but deep. My favorite system by far and one that works with kids and grownups alike.

[@GStopcow]

love that cube system

[@michalkulas1063]

@@GStopcow cube system is great, no stupid measuring tape :)

[@tinywargamer3863]

My biggest beef with DZ is ...no story (I am a big RPG fan). The rules are great, but its just a technicaly great game, but next to no after the game legacy. Same goes for Infinity...I get that to each its own. Thes two are GREAT competive/tournament games, but are falling behing when it comes to the "what happens with the wounded squad members" vibe (i'm a big fan of post game sequence a'la Mordheim, but that's just me!

[@GStopcow]

@@michalkulas1063neither is trying to be mordheim or necromunda. They are fast point based skirmish games. I'm sure there's plenty of campaign mods out there.

[@Ultramarine40]

100% agree on OPR for Sci Fi, and also Mantic Deadzone (Skirmish) and Firefight (Army) for streamlined alternate activation games in a single book per game for a WH40K LITE experience without all the rules bloat and codices and the prehistoric I Go U Go mechanic. OPR is fantastic for making old models new again retired from the GW & Forgewold rosters, it’s also great being vendor agnostic serving the needs of veteran gamers with large collections and new generation gamers and the evolving STL 3D printing verticals.

[@timunderbakke8756]

Don’t forget about warpath that just wrapped up the Kickstarter. Epic scale mass scifi battle looking cool

[@wetland3010]

Thanks for the mention of Mantic Deadzone and Firefight. Did not know of them and checking Mantic out now. What I really like about discovering these new games is that they seem much steadier and stable than GW stuff. The constantly changing GW rules drove me mad (stopping me completely from buying their books). Lack of supply (under-production) was the final straw causing me to quit GW last year. eg bought Kill Team Gallowdark Box1, then missed out entirely on releases 2, 3 and 4. It wasn't a rage-quit, just a frustration/disappointment quit. As a breath of fresh air, I got into Core Space - love the scenery and play my home brew KT on it also.

[@Ultramarine40]

@@wetland3010 I can 100% relate to your frustration being a veteran comp player of 40K since 3rd Edition and pretty much exclusive in my hobby spend with GW all the way to 8th Edition. It all got just too much expense and too bloated to be fun any more so I did a hard stop and looked around what was available in the market and it blew me away how many cool game systems there are once you leave the Cult of GW. Skirmish or Amry size unless its alternative unit activation I wont play it these days. I can not speak highly enough about OPR and while I am a big fan of Mantic Games as a company and their Warpath Metaverse I have found by playing OPR bridges the vendor divide - our last 1500 point game was my sons GW 10th edition Necron force V my Mantic Forge Fathers (space dwarves) playing OPR's Grimdark Future rule set. That turned a few Cult of GW heads and set tounges wagging at our local gaming club monthly Sunday meet up & BBQ. By the time we were into 2nd round we had a table full of spectators and by the end a couple more disciples or it might just have been all my cool paintjobs under @tabletopminions tutoring. 😀👍

[@nathanjackson45]

There is a strong possibility that I have been playing with toy soldiers even longer than Uncle Atom. Over many years I have used ultra dense crunch sets and back of a beer mat one page rules written in an afternoon with game sizes running from a couple of models to tables filled with micotanks and battalions of infantry. Skirmish games with a platoon of infantry and a ruleset that boils down to a simple playsheet with 2 sides of paper are my sweet spot now. Simple is good.

[@coreyreynolds62]

I’m a big fan of Mantic’s rules for both their sci-fi and fantasy games. Kings of War and Deadzone are each very streamlined rule sets with deep strategic play.

[@trevorbailey1101]

Xenos Rampant from Osprey games. Handles everything from WW1 to Space Opera (although can be used for fantasy games) You get a basic template, then you can modify it with special abilities. Maybe they move faster, or have heavy weapons, or have psychic powers. Maybe they are in Exo-Armour. All units role 10d6. To attack. When taken to half strength and below they roll 5d6. It’s flexible enough to recreate pretty much anything you can find from most other games.

[@Sanguivore]

How do you feel about Dragon Rampant? I was considering picking it up!

[@ImreRides]

It's cool if you take it as a vehicle to have some fun with dice and minis. It kind of breaks apart when you really try to explore the system (but that's true for pretty much all games see 40k cheese builds) @@Sanguivore

[@Sanguivore]

@@ImreRides Thanks, friend! Would you recommend it over Chainmail or Age of Fantasy? :0

[@ImreRides]

Haha Chainmail is of course awesome as the Granddaddy of DnD. Age of Fantasy plays very different. It's closer to "modern" (I can't think of a better word) games. The thing that makes DR special is that it has a roll to activate. And some really love this and some really hate this because it's very swingy. In Ago of Fantasy you can just decide which unit u want to activate and then do the planned stuff. I would check out both. With a DR force you can at least play AOF Skirmish@@Sanguivore

[@Sanguivore]

@@ImreRides Awesome! Thanks, friend! ^-^ I’ll give DR a look next time I order some books! :D

[@PerfectionHunter]

Rules-light games are the best! + SPACE HULK and One Page Rules are great examples of this. - 40K 9th edition is a great example of a Heavy and Bloated opposing example.

[@hallowmoss1511]

I got into wargaming as a way to explore my interest in 17th century frontier combat. Bought Blood&Plunder, built a few armies and dove in. I think B&P is a great game. I enjoy watching other people play it. I love engaging with the content online. The fact of the matter, though, is that I didn't start having in-game fun at the table until I switched to playing A Song of Drums and Tomahawks. Turns out that the Song of Blades engine is my jam. The rules are simple, elegant, and the turn and initiative structure is so engaging that I have a hard time ever wanting to play an 'I-go-you-go' game again. Best of all, I can teach anyone to play in 15 minutes, which means that I actually have a chance to play a variety of opponents in my small town.

[@timunderbakke8756]

My two favorite streamlined skirmish games: Mantic’s Deadzone: scifi skirmish that can get complicated (not GW complicated) but the basic introduction armies are super easy to pick up and learn. Most rules are very simple just a matter of keywords. Burrows & Badgers by Oathsworn: the models are amazing to paint, the game is very friendly because all you have to remember is which die type to roll and what basic stuff you can do. You can add a little more to it with keywords and abilities but as a campaign game you slowly add them on to your warband. Man, I wish I had an opponent for a B&B campaign again….

[@christiancouture2194]

I find one of the best examples of tbis is A Song of Ice and Fire. The game is very deep while being incredibly smooth. 2-3 games in, you know your business while realizing how many options you have to explore

[@martydevine1]

I think an overlooked gem of a minis game is Pulp Alley. It's a skirmish level rule set that really hits every single one of my buttons: Easy to play, quick, limited number of models needed, multi-genre, EXTREMELY customizable, tremendous support from it's creator, free rules set to try out. Using this rule set I have played traditional pulp (think the Mummy or Indiana Jones), Wild West, Three Musketeers, Star Wars, Ghostbusters...you name it. This game is SO good! I highly recommend folks look it up and give it a try.

[@funwithmadness]

I have that game and have never tried it. i should probably change that situation.

[@BloodShotMovies]

Pulp Alley is fantastic.

[@paintingbyminions8360]

I need to dust off my pulp alley. Ghostbusters you say?! Id love to hear about pulp alley GBs

[@SweenyMarc]

This really strikes a note with me. I wanted to enjoy Necromunda so much. I love the aesthetic of the minis and terrain, the tone and setting of the lore. Elements of the team building and game play are really interesting, but there are tons of overlapping, sometimes contradictory rules, spread over multiple books and pdfs. With so many rules, it's very easy to end up with unbalanced game play and players can stumble into "gotcha" moments where some well thought out bit of play falls foul of an awkward game mechanic.

[@ImreRides]

I can wholeheartedly recommend Space Weirdos for all your Necromunda needs. It's awesome, theres a video of Uncle Atom as well :)

[@MrBizteck]

Yes I played old munda and bought inro new munda heavily for about 2 years but it was a complete mess of a system.

[@andrewhopkins]

Try One Page Rules Grim Dark Fire Fight. It has city gangs factions which is proxy for Necromunda. Or space weirdo as others have said.

[@bonkstrum9555]

​@andrewhopkins you beat me to it. Me and my 3 wargame pals are using c6berpunk, necromunda, and etsy, judgedread models with OPR. Can't wait for are first session

[@MindFlayerz]

And to add to what @andrewhopkins said, there is also the Gang Wars supplement on Drivethrurpg that gives you the Necromunda-like campaign rules. I 100% recommend OPR Grimdark Firefight + Gang Wars as your Necromunda game, then just use the lore and models from GW.

[@guillermomurphy2883]

I just finished reading the Frostgrave book. I found it to be incredibly easy to read and understand, yet the game seems to have great depth given all the spells available.

[@ScrumpleScuff]

Your take on spreadsheets was a thing of beauty.

[@heleti0000]

I have lost count of how many PDF’s I have downloaded - and yet tried less than 2% of them due to the length and complexity of the Rules, Codexes etc, etc, etc needed. One Page Rules, much like the skirmish rules published in White Dwarf many years ago, fit the bill of minimal and easily remembered rules and FUN. I watch a 40k game a while back and honestly, two players, two SMALL Armies, six reference books, two iPads and over 40 minutes of cross-referencing to complete 1 round. I don’t have enough years left in me to make a game like that interesting to me. Enjoying your channel, interesting, impartial and informative 😁👍

[@LightsGameraAction]

I'm so glad to see A Song of Blades and Heroes on your list. Ganesha games does some really good work and is criminally underrated.

[@Filmmonster]

The Silver Bayonet and Moonstone are the two games that made me finally take the plunge into wargaming. The models, setting and simple rules were the deciding factors.

[@Scuzzlebutt142]

Silver Bayonets Campaign rules need some work (they're a bit pointless, it is really hard for models to grow), but otherwise it is a great system that builds upon Frostgrave and Stargrave, and fixes alot of the issues I have with those games.

[@darnokx9277]

SImple rarely means bad, especially when it comes to games. And as soon as you have commitments in that dreaded "real life" you quickly come to appreciate games that do NOT take a whole day to play. P.S.: Props for the fresh haircut. :D

[@wolftrem4206]

Totally! It's basically the same with board games. Yes, long complicated games can be fun, but there is nothing wrong with a second round of Carcassonne or Cascadia or whatever. The group might not have the time, you might not have the time. But once in a while a big game day will come around, which makes it oh so much sweeter if you get to finally churn out numbers and dice etc. !

[@autumnlotus6250]

That's part of the issue though. Every year, war games get closer closer to just played like board games, To the point that if you really want to have a game that has a lot of depth to it, you are stuck with the microbenergy b. S of war hammer or try to play a game that has been simplified every addition since the Nineties

[@steveholmes11]

An underrated bonus of "simple" is that it can be fully tested. Those games with armies of 20 units picked from lists of 30 options. Have they really been tested? Or are those games really a search to see who can find the unbeatable combo?

[@andrewhopkins]

Teaching my 8 year old war gaming. Simplicity is key. He likes Mantic’s Deadzone, OPR’s Warfleets (with Star Wars Armads ships) and Space Weirdos (with Star Wars Legion minis). I’m also a fan of Song of Blades, Osprey’s Rampant series and all the OPRs. The only GW game I like and play regularly is WarCry.

[@jamestarbet9608]

There's this one company I've heard of, Grimacing Woodchuck or something, that has put out a really interesting low model count, tank based wargame called "Tanks for the Apocalypse". Also there is one incredibly popular wargame, bigger than 40K even, where each player only has 6 stat lines and only 16 models. It's called Chess.

[@borisdevilboon8064]

Oh think that's actually Sneering Beaver games

[@EpyonCF]

I think Kill Team vs Warcry is a great example. They both are 8-15 model skirmish games. Kill Team is complex (and in my opinion obtuse in rules), Warcry is prolly the simplest GW regular game, and in my opinion the best ruleset that came out of GW ever.

[@NoPreyRemains]

Two more simple wargames that are loads of fun: 1) Gaslands (my favourite game that isn't Adeptus Titanicus) 2) Space Weirdos (and it's fantasy cousin Sword Weirdos) The damage system in the two Weirdos games is a bit janky (I'm working on a home-brew hack) but designing your warband is loads of fun and very flavoursome.

[@RavenMorpheus]

In this video Adam admits he likes KISS... 40k can be bloat free apparently. Chris "Peachy" Peach, formerly of GW and "The Painting Phase", revealed that often at GW stores for demo games it's "plonk models down, move 6", roll dice, 4 to hit, 4 to wound, 4 to save". I often wish 40k really was almost that simple!

[@maxxon99]

@aWOLtrooperonly if you play with troops that have no keywords or abilities…

[@maxxon99]

@aWOLtrooper OPR is simple... until you enter the "WTF does _this_ keyword do now?" territory. Which is pretty much all units in actual play. IMHO it would have actually been more simple to give the models e.g. move and wounds stats rather than altering those through keywords like tough and whatever it was that makes you run faster... The interaction of keywords can also be confusing and poorly explained, e.g. attacks that have both blast and poison, both of which multiply hits but one of them has a cap I think...

[@Kargos79]

For a simple fun historical game, I love SAGA, by Gripping beast! Fantastic game, simple to build an "armY" smooth to play and fairly cheap to get in to. Thy cover off several time periods, and even have an Age of Magic book for Fantasy armies.

[@henrikpoulsen2897]

It's time to shout out "Oathmark" on this channel. It's an army size game that's really easy to learn. It has it's own line of really cheap minis, but you can use whatever you like, as the setting (this can be both a pro and a con) is totally generic fantasy. It's very much up to the players themselves to make their own kingdoms and name their own characters.

[@defnlife1683]

Just playing around with different rulesets seems like the best thing for finding your niche.

[@tempusavatar]

Thanks for the video. I was a big fan of X-Wing when it came out because of the granularity of the rules and the squadron size. You can teach someone with only 2-3 ships per side, then upgrade to full vanilla squadrons if 4-8, then start adding in upgrade cards, then start adding special pilots. Although none of that flash matters if you don't know how to fly your ships.

[@tabletopminions]

I miss the old 1.0 ruleset of X-Wing. If I ever play that game again (I still have all my stuff) then it’ll be version 1.0 for me. Thanks for watching!

[@samurguy9906]

@@tabletopminionsI liked Star Wars xwing, but Star Wars armada to me is just a much more elegant refinement of space combat. Things just feel much more balanced and less luck based

[@edwardblacklock2446]

For skirmish games I would recommend Space Wierdos and Sword Weirdos, they are amazing and got me back into the wargaming hobby. In terms of full size army games I a would recommend the Rampant games, particularly Xenos Rampant, and Mike Hutchinson's Hobgoblin (due out soon but currently available through backerkit itlf you want to grab the PDF) which is a rank and flank game built to be fast and brutal. Fnally the most fun I have had at a gaming table is with Gaslands, a post apocalyptic car racing game, also by Mike Hutchinson. All of these games are model agnostic so find some minis you like, stat them out and play away!

[@Killnaprimer]

Did not know there is fantasy version of space weirdos! Thanks a lot

[@cjwestphal397]

Hobgoblin is going to be my go-to rank/flank game, replacing Kings of War. I have demoed it for my 9yo son, and the streamlining makes everything work great.

[@danelmore2783]

Guys you should really check out Mantic games. I'm not a fanboy but I am a fan. I'm just saying the minis are pretty cool and paint up pretty easily. The rule sets are fun balanced and can be played in about 2 hours. Just my two cents

[@JuanDC]

The core game of Five parsecs from home is really simple but, due to the random generated set up, also can lead to unexpected situations. Thera are also 3 expansions that can add depth to the game, and all the features there are like an add-on that can ve activated/de-activated as desired

[@VictoriaWargaming]

Kings of War is a great simple game to learn, but very complex on the table because the game is about positioning and timing, not special rules combos and the lawyerwork that some games have.

[@Tableschmock]

My goto introduction to historical games: One hour Wargames by Neil Thomas. And - is it just me, or why does Mantic Games get overlooked everytime. They make great beginner-friendly Rulesets since over a decade.

[@nomorecontinues6564]

The Mantic games look like a blast to me but I just haven’t had the opportunity to try them. I certainly would not turn it down! If I thought somebody would play with me I’d be all over that Epic Warpath game they’re working on now.

[@tabletopminions]

They’re not big on the U.S. I’ve never really seen any of their products in a store here in the States EXCEPT for one store that carries tons of their Terrain Crate products, but none of their games. Thanks for watching!

[@paulwalker5221]

I agree the Ravenfeast rules you mentioned are a lot of fun and can be learned as you play. The Oathmark mass combat fantasy and the Frostgrave and Stargrave sets are also easy to use and are not hundreds of pages long. My club uses the one page rules at opendays as they are especially good for novices and people new to gaming. Thank you for this review.

[@ramonjimenez5944]

Battletech Alpha strike is a simple rule set to get people into the game. I have brought a few people along into classic battletech that would not have played it at all unless they played alpha strike first.

[@ramonjimenez5944]

@aWOLtrooper they are great. I really like their override rules.

[@Scuzzlebutt142]

@@ramonjimenez5944 I have backed them on Patreon to get them, and I like what I've read, would just like them to rewrite them so it's not "reference this book, reference this book" as that makes it hard to get your head around unless you're familiar with the other two games they reference.

[@mr22jk2]

What I like about alpha strike is, that you can start with a simple "move, point, shoot" ruleset for beginners. And then you can slowly add the more complex stuff to get more depth. Things like indirect fire, combined arms, offboard artillery and stuff.

[@CirWot]

The beauty of simple games is that you can add to them without breaking them. I enjoy building light campaign rules around my games and it's so much easier with a simple ruleset that you can easily manipulate. Also, a game such as Bolt Action has moderately simple rules, but the ease of play comes from both sides essentially having access to the same units. You can look at an army and immediately know what your opponent can do without consulting endless cards, sheets and Codexes. Great video as always.

[@mikebaker6804]

The Lion Rampant series is a good intro set as well.

[@mattaffenit9898]

Honestly, same. Rampant's rules make it really easy to get into, and just as easy to make armies bigger or smaller.

[@mrmaster9801]

I've stopped playing 40k almost 3 years ago because of its rules bloat and steeper prices. Been trying to convince my 40k friends to try GF/GFF and finally it looks like they are ready, mostly because they realized we don't have the time to play those long games anymore or keep up with GW constant releases and updates. We'll try our first matches this month and see how it goes.

[@PerfectionHunter]

How about One Page Rules?

[@Mikey__R]

Considering how much 40k costs, and how much of your attention it consumes, the game itself isn't all that fun.

[@Gridash]

@@PerfectionHunterGF/GFF is OPR 🙂

[@Mikey__R]

@@PerfectionHunter what Gridash said: Grimdark Future / Grimdark Fire Fight.

[@nicholasmeibaum5090]

Dystopian Wars is picking up steam at my lgs. It is a pretty simple naval combat game, rules are free, minis are reasonably priced and starter sets come with everything you need to play.

[@Mad4saxBrewery]

Haha ... before I retired I was known as the "King of Excel" spreadsheets at work. I still use it some in retirement but not every day, all day long anymore.

[@badnamebob]

Mantic has a couple of great games, Deadzone and Firefight. I really like most of their games and those two especially scratch my skirmish and army sized itches nicely. Plus, their stuff is an incredible value and they just finished up an “Epic” sized kickstarter that I think looks amazing.

[@DocPhantoms]

Warlord games has a really good set of games that are streamlined but still have depth. I love Hail Caesar, Black Powder, and Black Sails for getting the feel for the historical eras they depict without getting too bogged down.

[@Podgeabrillion]

I am almost 40, and with the exceptions of games played for nostalgia (where I half recall the rules to begin with) I have no time for overly complex wargames rulesets. It's 'simple' skirmish games with some light RPG elements for me from here on out!

[@bradmckinney8667]

Amen - but where to begin?

[@trevorharvey6928]

for sci-fi then Mantic Games Firefight is awesome, along with Deadzone for skirmish level. for fantasy my favourite is Oathmark by Joseph Mcullough published by Osprey Games is a really fun "simple" system. Both still have great tactical depth imo.

[@juliangilbert5465]

Spot on. I've been getting my sons into wargaming and they have been put off by the complicated rules and endless bloody dice rolling. So we've made up our own simplified rule sets, so we get into the action without so much rule studying. Simplify it guys, you're putting people off with your layers of endless rules. Get it back to strategy... and fun.

[@apocrypha_now]

There’s also some great games where models have just 1(!) stat that play really well, like “MiniGangs” by Ramshackle Games and “The Doomed” by Chris McDowall

[@TimothyNiederriter]

The Doomed looks FANTASTIC

[@Letsstarthobbying]

Definitely recommend one page rules. I also highly recommend Oathmark, frostgrave, Rangers of shadow deep which are all Joseph McCullough games! He has a real knack for creating simple, yet very awesome game systems!

[@stevexl7747]

Dead Man's Hand and Saga are so simple and so fun to play. DMH is super easy to learn and all about fun. Only about 7 actions to choose from and the emphasis on fun. Saga is really tactical small to medium scale army battles where it's easy to learn and tricky to master.

[@ilcapgames5016]

Absolutely! I completely resonate with your sentiment. Complex and lengthy rules often detract from the enjoyment of the game, leading to more of a legal debate than a fun gaming experience. Simplifying rules, like those found in one-page rule sets, which I've recently discovered thanks to your channel, can truly revolutionize the gaming scene. By focusing on straightforward rules, players can delve deeper into strategy and tactics, enhancing the overall enjoyment of the game. I'm excited to explore these simpler rules further on my channel, introducing them to the Italian gaming community. Here's to a future filled with streamlined rules and more immersive gaming experiences!

[@ludumpress6097]

Space Hulk is King, simple but absolutely rocks. I enjoy it more than normal WH. I have not tired 'Dill Team' yet but does not look interesting. Rules like 'Wings of Glory / Sails of Glory', work well with pre-painted minis, basic rules and complexity options that you can add for more detailed (historically accurate) play.

[@marccaron6008]

I like Fistful of Lead by Wiley Games. I play the Fantasy and Galactic Heroes skirmish versions. Simple rule set. Five models per side. Complexity is in the activation system which forces you to be careful and try to outwit your opponent.

[@ScottMalthouse]

It's why I designed Dead Gods. I much prefer a streamlined ruleset with a 4-5 models each side.

[@colinmorrison2446]

Five Parsecs from Home

[@heyokawolf13]

Bang up job as always. My favorite rules lites are Frostrave, Ghost Archipelago, and Stargrave as well as Dragon Rampant and Xenos Rampant.

[@patknez]

Rangers of Shadowdeep is a great starter skirmish game. Simple D 20 and a deck of cards and you can even play solo. For those that like deep games that are easy to learn hard to master I would recommend "Blood Bowl". It doesn't require any terrain and has various different teams, you only need one. Stats seem overwhelming at first and tactics are challenging if you play good players. That said it sure is the only sports game where an ogre can throw a halfling who can land and run for a 1 turn touchdown... I'm pretty sure it is anyhow. Also there's a great free online versions called FUMBBL where you can play with any of the teams to try them out before you buy models.

[@TheDysartes]

A song of Blades and Heroes is one of my favourite rules to introduce new people to the hobby.

[@vagabondprime1691]

Five Parsecs, Five Leagues, Frostgrave, Stargrave, and Relicblade have been getting a lot of play at my place, I used to love crunchy systems like Infinity, but my brain started freaking out on me! Now the more laid back games have a home here, and I'm better off for it!

[@crhkrebs]

I also use Ganesha Games systems to run convention games. It takes just minutes to master the rules, leaving the players to concentrate on the game’s scenarios (and having fun). I’ve used the horror rules Fear and Faith to render a Lovecraftian based “ Raid on Innsmouth” game. On the other hand, I’ve used the free historical rules Bushi No Yume to run a game where Samurai are called in to protect a village against Wako pirates.

[@edwardclay7551]

Id just like to shoutout some of the simpler games ive encountered. Like Star/Frostgrave or Majestic 13, Reign in Hell. For some more complexity games like Space Station Zero is great while retaining an extrememly low entry to the game. Especially if youve played any of the warhammer universes games for even a year. The interactions in all of those games are essentially mutliplayer or solo by design. And I personally love that so many of these games have that solo-element to them. It makes everything so much more rewarding. And these games fill a valuable niche. You can play them without needing a larger hobby group or player base. And being miniature agnostic you can use literally anything.

[@AndrewBryant-tb5qi]

Deadzone from Mantic games, great fun. Space weirdos, OHSW (One hour skirmish Wargames by John Lambshead), great card driven customizable game. One page rules. All great fun!👍

[@APaganPerspective]

my 2 favorite simple -ish games are Oathmark and Kings of War

[@matthewsiahaan1312]

The Helldivers to Tarkov spectrum is very real.

[@Gerod253]

One Page Rules: Absolutely agree! I use my Star Wars Legions Rebels for this game. The Army Guilder is awesome! A Song Of Blades and Heroes: Another Strong Agree from me! I specifically enjoy Song of Drums and Shakos. RavensFeast, that one is new to me. I’ll check it out! Thank you Uncle Adam!

[@argy8141]

Ravenfeast is good. A good introduction to mini based gaming

[@tbird1053]

I support this message. I love the new Necromunda which is extremely crunchy but I usually encourage non gamers to try OPR Firefight first if they’re interested. If they like that I’ll happily teach them Necromunda next.

[@Gladedancer]

Rangers of Shadow Deep is also a great fantasy skirmish game.

[@TheAjayTyler]

A fun way to dip your toe into wargaming is Brikwars--a free fairly streamlined ruleset built to make it fun and easy to use Lego mini figures for wargames! Optional advanced rules are available for building custom things, and it also supports sticking a ton of figures on a Lego board so you can have formations of pikemen and stuff, not the basic rules are all easy and straightforward.

[@limelizard1]

Off the top of my head, I'd say Space Weirdos. I also love all the Joseph A. McCullough games (Frostgrave, Rangers of Shadow Deep, Ghost Archipelago, etc.).

[@Mamshi]

I am really enjoying Cyberpunk Red Combat Zone. It’s my first venture into skirmish games. So far it’s been a breeze to understand the rules and getting the game to the table 🤩

[@patrikb.70]

Skirmish games that I like: Forbidden Psalm, Rangers of Shadow Deep, Five Leagues from the Borderlands

[@JawaBob]

I feel like the Pathfinder community could also stand to hear this message related to RPGs. The point definitely translates across any medium of game: complexity is not necessarily elegant or fun even for veteran players.

[@antonyspencer6222]

OPR rules are superb, a great toolkit. You can start out with the basic one page of rules and then add more in to suit the game you like to play.

[@BwfVid]

OGRE/G.E.V and Melee/Wizard from Steve Jackson Games are not complex and are very fun. My first wargame was G.E.V. back in 1984 and I still love playing it. While you can use miniatures, these are mainly Hex and Counter so you can get right into the action! Also, I recommend Full Thrust from Ground Zero Games. Simple and elegant starship combat!

[@acid2go]

40K basic rules are somehow comprehensible, even light compared to other wargames. The problem is that on top you have: Army rules + Detachment rules + unit abilities + stratagems + scenario missions + secondaries + crusade rules... it is just too much all together.

[@Clembassador]

Kill Team also has a simplified rule set available and you can enjoy playing with only that set.

[@grumbeast]

There’s room for all levels of complexity / size / miniature count. People should play what they want but be open to all sorts of levels of complexity. People shouldn’t feel they need to pigeon hole themselves (as in I like simple vs complex or skirmish vs large battle). Limited complexity doesn’t have to be a better introduction to wargaming as there are a pile of terrible simple games (or even just ones that don’t suit a player) and would still give someone a bad introduction to the hobby. I was at a con last year and player a 6hr super complex ww1 game (as in between these dates this particular gun was this much less reliable etc etc). It was really daunting but the game designer was running it, was super patient and the 8 people playing had an absolutely great time. So who you play with initially can also be a massive factor in whether you have that great first experience. (I will give a shout out to five parsecs though, I don’t play skirmish much, but its a sweet and elegant game, while warfleets FTL is a nice game, I appreciate the simplicity but its just not for me, I just prefer more crunch)

[@Darker1208]

I've switched entirely to One Page Rules. In my group only 1 player is "only 40K" and that guy is absolutely addicted to meta-chasing jank gotcha lists and I played exactly one game of 40K with him which was possibly the worst 40K experience I've had in 5 years.

[@gk7003]

Oh! And Tales from the Death Realm is very good to check out! The rules are super simple and it drips with theme! It even comes with a soundtrack, it's a must try!!

[@THX-to6gg]

I play a number of games including OPR and SOBAH , I even dabble with 40k and Kill Team (2018 version) but my all time favourite is Middle Earth Strategy Battle Game the best ruleset GW has ever produced in my opinion.

[@plaingeometry]

Love this. I've very much gotten to the point where, in all my hobbies and entertainment interests, I prefer to just buy "one thing." I'm burned out on subscriptions, expansions, updates, 10-12 episode "seasons" (or campaigns), and an expectation that I'm going to devote hundreds and hundreds of hours into a single IP or game. I've come back to the joy of a 2 hour movie, a 10 hour video game, and a 1-2 hour tabletop experience that doesn't have to continue in perpetuity for the rest of my short life. Simpler/shorter usually leaves me wanting more, where as Complicated/longer inevitably feels like a chore.

[@AeonVoom]

I love the 40k models and lore. But OPR makes undoubtedly the better rules. OPR does not try to lure me into fomo purchases based on game stats. The rules are just complex enough to tickle my fancy (and i used to play Infinity a lot) and thank the gods for alternating activation.

[@neonsamurai]

The other day I played my first game of OPR Grimdark Future (1000pts). I also took that opportunity to introduce a friend to tabletop wargaming. And it was a blast. Even though we both learned the rules along the way, we had loads of fun and the game lasted only for two hours. And that includes explaining to him all the fundamentals of tabletop wargaming, like measuring, how to read stats, what 3+ means, model vs unit etc. Now I want to play more GF, it is simply more fun to me than 40k. I have yet to play a game of 10th and it feels like the next 40k edition is already on the horizon. (I know it's not, but that's how it feels to me)

[@MrTomlette]

I just played the Doomed and it was very fun. One stat per unit and you don't measure to move, but the game has enough stuff to strategize around, especially because while you have to defeat the opponent, there's a neutral, automated monster that forces the players to cooperate. It was quite interesting.

[@ivanlevcov]

I want to share my joy. Some of the most unique rules I've seen in my entire life were the rules for the "clouds of smoke" wargame. they are incredibly short and simple, however, they seemed to me much deeper than all the wargames I have played (all products from GW, warlord, onepage rules). "Clouds of Smoke" is dedicated to the historical battles of the 17th-18th centuries in epic scale, where you command large troops. At the same time, it has free rules, it plays quickly and has the most unique rules for playing combat between units.

[@vatiti9573]

I would say something on top of your own arguments (with which I wholeheartedly agree), when you say that being more simple isn't being bad, I would even go further and say (as of someone who tried more than once to design his own rulesets) that doing simple is much more complex than doing something complex. I mean, it's actually quite easy to entangle lots of rules because you want to represent this aspect of battles, and this one, and this another one, and this aspect of fighters to be reflected on the miniatures datasheet, but the real difficulty is making it clear and simple, and simplifying it to the point of making it crystal clear and streamlined while keeping intact the ruleset's spirit is even more difficult, but that's what I personally consider to be a mark of quality in the designing process of a game's ruleset. A good way to see it is to ask 40K players who tried OnePageRules how they felt about it, generally they agree to say that it really highlights how bloated are 40K rules, because OPR is a ruleset that properly went through that simplification phase.

[@michaelcarter577]

There's room in the hobby for both simple rulesets and crunchy rulesets. It all depends on what the goals of the design are. This is a common debate in board wargaming, and there are merits to both levels of rules complexity.

[@fredclasson7865]

Fun fact, Majestic 13 that you guys made became a great entry point for some of my friends who have been into roleplaying games before such as DnD etc. It's a skirmish game, but has coop and uses D20s, and the stats are clear on what they do. I did however make an unofficial "expansion" of sorts to add more gear and options for psionics and some other stuff just to give it another level of depth. That's what I like the most about these tabletop games, you can add and remove as you want because there is nothing preprogrammed.

[@SageMasterRPG]

In the 1980's I played Avalon Hill games. I am happy with a sheet of cardboard counters. I have played various levels of wargames, Squad leader size up to Field Marshall size. Most have 5 to 20 page rules books. None of them seemed crunchy, nice that the counters have all the info needed printed on them. "3-4" means 3 = movement and 4 = combat value. Then you had 2 D6 dice to roll and look at one chart. I miss Avalon Hill.

[@SirSolitaire]

One of my favorite simple games is Lion Rampant, so much fun to play and easily scales for larger or smaller battles depending on what people have time for. Also simple stats for people to refer to and enjoy.

[@TerrierHalo]

I am quite sure that I can easily use Stargrave rules, with an expansion, to make a Helldivers scenario or two. Thank you for the inspiration.

[@nutsgul]

I started with Star Wars Legion last year. I found it easy to learn. You only measure the unit leader for movement, you combine dice from different weapons into one pool. Al you need to know about your units is on printed cards in front of you. An of course alternating Activations makes the game feel faster and more engaging.

[@Hraefen]

Kings of war is excellent for a simple massed fantasy battle game.

[@Brandedwolf]

Love the comparison between Tarkov and Helldivers 2. Also seeing Atom say for democracy is a GIF I didn't know I needed. :)

[@gk7003]

Blood and Valor, Doomed, forbidden Psalm(of course, and Last War ), all are great simple ones. The only thing I don't like about simple ones is the over simplification of terrain and options. For example, I don't like when games just only have terrain give a -1; give me different types of terrain and effects

[@burfscape1]

In my honest opinion, THE number one biggest problem with complex rules systems is: Creating new hobbyists. Even when you supply them an army to use, first time needs to be "user friendly". Complex rules are for later, if they want to try new games, they can check out something more complicated. 30+ years ago, I was able to get friends into miniature games with Advanced Heroquest and Space Hulk. I know these are more board game than anything, but they also were pretty quick to pick up and understand, engaging, and Space Hulk even got your heart pumping! (they are going to want to be the Terminators most of the time, and the sense of fear of the Genestealers breathing down their neck got them really into the game!) Once they were into the idea of playing a game, with little soldiers they could paint however they wanted, they usually would be more open to branching out into something that would take more time to learn. I know my example is pretty dated, but the hill I'll die on is: I want MORE people in the hobby. Easier means faster to learn, less commitment, and hopefully someone new to game with. In other words, I'm a big fan of easy to play.

[@CaimZheit]

I always take objection to the statement that OPR is a casual game while 40k is a tactical game. In opr I can space exactly my units so I can know in advance whether or not they will be in range of various threats. While in 40k there is a lot of random movement that doesn't allow for such calculations.