Insane Advance Wars Games: Mathblitz Vs Fyram (Fog: Settles as Still Water)

Two top 10 players duke it out on this AWBW rendition of a Simon and Garfunkle song.
0:00 Intro
8:35 The GAME

[@masterchief2622]

This was the most insane Sami game I've seen, can't wait to see your take on this.

[@AdvanceWarrior]

I was hoping to see Fyram again. The Hidden Edge game was honestly one of the best showcases.

[@DeejusProductions]

Yeah that was def a top 5 match for the channel imo

[@advancewarstournamentseries]

If think he stopped playing

[@SnydeX9]

Pizza and Deej has slowly become one of my favorite Sunday activities.

[@mathblitz2994]

Haha, I'm flattered to be featured in one of your videos Deejus. I have a lot of thoughts about this game which I'll lay out in this comment and then in replies to this comment. The most important one is that all credit for opening preparation on this map goes to Kantbei, who has written an incredibly detailed document about the opening theory of this map that can be found here: docs.google.com/document/d/1rFrIgUAbL92Ejcu1sPSHMFfXX18CF15s9J1npE-WnKM/edit?usp=sharing. This map and Vandalism are Kantbei's babies where he has incredibly detailed notes and ideas that can sometimes extend well into the midgame.

[@mathblitz2994]

First up is CO selection. So Kindle is banned t3 because of how many cities are on the map (which you mentioned). Typically 20 cities (including the HQ) a side is the rough benchmark where Kindle should really be t2 instead of t3. Multiple fronts and pre-deployed transports means Rachel is difficult to play (though I'm currently theorycrafting whether or not this is actually true), Sonja has few concrete ideas from her extra vision and there are not obvious cities to park tanks on so she's out, Lash in general struggles in fog, but she may actually be pretty good here without Kindle, but I haven't spent a ton of time thinking about it. This leaves Andy, Drake, and Sami has viable picks in T3. I can make an argument for all three of them, but I will focus on Sami here and the arguments for the other two will be left as an exercise to the reader.

[@mathblitz2994]

The most concrete reason is the comm tower shenanigans. Sami and Drake can secure their comm towers before recon aggression, but other COs cannot. This essentially nullifies their d2d weakness against Andy. Furthermore Sami SCOP threat on comm tower gives me another win condition that I can use as a leverage tool throughout the game. The second reason has to do with the number of fronts and unit count. It is difficult for any player to send vehicles to every front so if I match fyram's vehicles at least one of the three fronts on this map (center and 2 comm towers) is going to be fought with infantry, which I have a huge advantage on. Furthermore the central base can be used to quickly send mechs to the center and Sami mechs are essentially uber tanks. So Sami can send "vehicles" to every front, but other COs cannot. This is what we see this game: Fyram presses hard at each comm tower and then a small force of mechs infantry and a recon overwhelm him center which wins me the game despite my poor midgame choices.

[@mathblitz2994]

That being said, playing Sami is complicated and I would caution your viewers before casually picking her up and playing her in fog. She is heavily map dependent and requires careful planning to not be blown off the board.

[@mathblitz2994]

Ok now onto game analysis and specifically, highlighting and lambasting every one of my mistakes. 16:00 Day 8 I was well aware of Kantbei's notes, when the recon didn't hit my inf on the comm tower after i finished capturing (which i considered optimal) I thought fyram might have messed up the recon opening, so I went for a greedy cap on this city that I might not otherwise have gone for. The artillery was not a mistake, my primary idea this game was to charge down center, using the artillery to blow open the pipe seam to merge infantry and mech around my comm tower with vehicles travelling through center. 18:06 Day 9, this is probably my most serious mistake. The purpose of the day 3/day 5 recons is to suppress the enemy infantry, that city cap fyram is going for is one I can't realistically stop long term and somewhere in the back of my head I remembered that Kantbei mentioned that the earliest tank could reinforce that area Day 9. At the time the opening was going so well for me though that I got cocky and went for a greedy hit. This hurts me TREMENDOUSLY in the mid game as the vision from that recon would have helped me stop his infantry from looping around the pipeseam which gave me a ton of problems during his first Scop. I also make double tank this turn. This was a tricky choice, I like to mix up what turn I make my first Anti-Air so people watching my replays can't tell. The correct build this turn would have been Anti-air recon since the mech will give me some tank presence on the other side of the map. I give into my desire to spend all my money though this turn and buy double tank reasoning that a couple of extra tanks will bridge the 1-2 turn gap between the early game and when my transported mechs come online. 20:50 This one is tricky. I want to keep my vehicle count as high as possible to keep match with andy, but I also know that I need an Anti-Air right ****ing now or I'm dead. I turn on my mech transport chain this turn which puts me at just not enough income for tank aa so I build an artillery vowing to do my best to position it effectively. I am not Inccugarch unfortunately and the artillery ends up not really doing anything all game. 27:05 My failure to attack on the bottom right side is actually an amalgamation of personal in game failures and intuitive failures. Go7 for instance would be able to immediately sus out based off of the vehicles seen elsewhere that he could attack down there, but I was too afraid to go for attack and lose my precarious advantage. This could have been remedied had I not lost that early recon since a recon could have been spared on that side of the map or if I had done the correct build turn 9, but I am far from a perfect player and it shows through here. 40:00 At this point I know I've won the game, fyram retreated at my comm tower instead of initiating any caps which means I can slowly grind him down to a win despite my numerous mid game mistakes. I need a lander to setup a vehicle chain down there to make sure it holds and I need to trade evenly as my 8k income advantage is going to give me the win. I could probably still have played better after this point, but as soon as I'm in "convert this winning position to a win" mode I care less about heavy analysis.

[@mathblitz2994]

And to wrap up just some more comments about this game and about my strength/weaknesses as a player if you choose to follow me. I chose sami this game not because I think she's objectively best on the map (Its probably actually Drake), but because she's definitely viable and the player base often underestimates her and I usually take the spiciest viable pick available that I have the energy to pilot at a high level. Sami is actually a really interesting CO with relation to the playerbase. Most people either over or underestimate her. Typically lower rated players focus too much on the cost effectiveness and power of her mechs, and higher rated players are too focused on the power reduction in her vehicles. Deejus is spot on with his observations of my strengths and weaknesses as a player. Tactically I am lacking in a way that will never let me crack into the highest echelons of Fog (currently Go7, Inccugarch, Hogat, and Tordread), and my mid game strategic choices are often suspect as I do not put nearly as much time and effort into refining them the way I put into my opening and early game choices. With slightly above average tactical intuition/midgame strategy and brawling, but heavy opening preparation and analysis I am able to punch way above my weight class in the game. To those of you watching who feel like you don't know what to do in the mid game and are just flailing around, fret not, often opening planning is enough to win the game. That being said I'm working on shoring up my weaknesses and maybe one day I'll be Top 5 :P

[@loneneotank.5687]

I appreciate the videos Deejus! I've personally been playing alot of FOW. These replays with your commentary help alot.

[@kylenclarke240]

Man. When I am having a rough day and deejus plops out an advance wars play review. I know it will turn it around. Thanks for the vid man! Don’t change!

[@cipherkingomer]

Fun fact Kindle is banned in tier 3 on this map.

[@DeejusProductions]

Hah I believe it..that middle would essentially be her playground

[@Quickslow87]

Excellent commentary and your editing skills are top tier.

[@ggh_st]

Great game and commentary! Always fun to see high level Sami fog play. Absolutely incredible music choice for a certain unit we know and... know

[@enruins1312]

Fire replay. I was expecting Andy to comeback somehow.

[@DeejusProductions]

Me too '_'

[@fyram]

Wow I didn't expect to get covered again, especially since my early game sucks this game (I just came back to GL after a break and sort of autopilot it). But thanks a lot! I learned much from watching this!

[@mathblitz2994]

You played great! It was a fun game :)

[@kiddervish2]

The two army colors was pretty painful. Is there a way in the replay viewer to alter colors next time?

[@DeejusProductions]

Yeah the replay plugin got a new feature, ill change up the colors next time if they are close like red and pink

[@blahmaster6k]

I feel like building expensive ranged units like battleships is even more of a waste as Andy, since they sit in the back not taking damage and not charging the CO meter. If that battleship was a bomber it would have taken an AA hit probably at some point, charged a bunch of power, and gotten repaired. Battleships just sit there.

[@DeejusProductions]

my thoughts exactly

[@ArchlordPie]

Battleships in general are really, REALLY map-dependent, and in this particular case they're kind of a noob trap. It's easy to go "oh he can't build subs here and probably won't be able to bomb it, let's build battleship" but all you can really do with one on this map is annoy someone who's really overextending, and maybe lock down your boat-side com tower if playing as Grit. Half the stuff in the middle cannot be targeted by it, and a lot of the area it can contest consists of properties that, if you need to contest them at all, you should probably have resigned a while ago. Because it's 4 tanks worth of money that poses exactly zero threat to your HQ-side com tower area and only something resembling a threat to part of the middle and part of your boat-side com tower area.

[@ThePoeSalesman514]

“Timelsaneously,” -Deejus, 2022

[@derkatwork33]

Did you play a “what do you do with a drunken sailor” remix? You’re a legend.

[@NaturalCloud]

This is my first GL map after coming back from a short break and even after reading kantbei's essay on the subject im still struggling to find the right unit placements. This was certainly useful to watch.

[@Down516]

Damn that was two devastating Victory March ! Good game !

[@masterchief2622]

Finally some fog content.

[@shamelfuller]

I hope mangs sees this.. building a battleship when hes behind on awbw always puts him even more behind lol

[@NutsAndThighs]

Another great commentary. Love to see Sami wins, especially with successful Victory Marches. Between you and Mangs' videos I've seen several pretty meh VM's that maybe netted 1 property, never seemed worth it, but these two VMs were brutal against fyram.

[@DeejusProductions]

My rule of thumb is it needs to take at least 3 props to use it, that or some major damage

[@codegeek98]

I think the property limit in AWBW is generally calibrated to 66.7% of all available income -- _i.e._ when you are earning *twice* as much as your opponent in the late game

[@DeejusProductions]

Ah yeah that makes sense

[@snake2250]

Bless up for Sammy gameplay. Really cool match.

[@dontpokethekenny]

Anyway you could put the COs in the video title? Would be super easy trying to find games with our favorite COs. Keep up the great content!

[@Baladucci]

23:32 That was a really unfortunate roll by fyram's recon. With a little better luck on the recon hit, the infantry would have an 82.5% chance of finishing the kill, but with a min roll (0-1% luck on the recon hit, which is what happened here), there was only a 20% chance to get the kill. Overall he hit a 30% to not get the 2HKO. Interestingly, attacking with the infantry first is not only worse for return damage, but also has a 3% less likely chance to get the 2HKO. 25:32 A single com tower brings this chance to 100%, in either order. Source: lots of excel sheet calculations, with 100 calculations using floor(damage*defense), with damage including all possible luck options and com tower bonuses, and defense applying hp-reduced defense on a city. I also made sure the second damage roll properly accounted for damage done by the first hit. I did assume AWBW doesn't store hp damage beyond the tenth of visible hp, which is why I used the floor function.

[@aa01blue38]

The best part of it is that Mathblitz could've taken _another_ property at the top left, for an income lead that's twice the opponent.

[@mathblitz2994]

lol yea if you look at the turn before i set myself up to take 7 properties with the victory march and i only need 3, he sufficiently defends 3 of them, but its not enough

[@wizardsrule8498]

can't tell you how much I enjoyed the recon Polp-It!

[@StarFlash250]

LMFAO that singing

[@AlphaSquadZero]

Could you imagine if Sami got +1 movement on her b-copters too? 24:05 There was a 2/7 chance fyram could break that infantry, it was on 6 hp. It was really unfortunate of him to roll the lowest possible roll on his recon attack. Sami does seem crazy on this map, when she gets her super she takes so many properties and by the time it comes around again your opponent can't hope to have captured them back again.

[@I-ONLY-BUILD-MECHS-AND-DUSTERS]

Sami in fog... guaranteed banger. Mech report: Eh pretty amazing mechs, but too many for me to keep track of 🤓 So this guy knows his Sami. Tired of these SCOPs that barely get any swing properties. That's like the main point as I see it. Forget the extra infantry damage meme, you can completely bust up the economy with a decent victory march if you actually protect enough infantry properly early on and have enough in the mid game near contested properties. Now Andy has to get his own infantry in there and recapture the old fashioned way, and he currently has absolutely nothing in the center and is low on infantry in contested areas. And Sami shouldn't make it easy for him either.

[@leevaughngraves1069]

Great video. Bless the Algorithm for bringing me here.

[@DeejusProductions]

Welcome, and thanks man!

[@andytheshizno4501]

Absolutely insane

[@mintcake2668]

I love Sami games. You get to see defeat by headquarter cap and defeat by capture etc.

[@Tangers3345]

The wargasms at 0:58 with the increasingly concerned people was pure art

[@TraderPulse]

I dont even play this game, but if I did. I think I'd be a Sami main :D

[@JLHack7]

We need a music playlist too.

[@DeejusProductions]

Look under Deejtunes

[@YaGirlJuniper]

Artillery weakside is the fastest way to kill the black boat on the HQ if you get that far. It also stops tanks from bullying you out of the bottom, and you can punch a hole in the pipe seam and enter mid from the back, which makes attacking or defending it way easier. Suddenly you're not giving up mid to go down there. Also, if Sami gets a Lander, that ain't Weak Side anymore. ;) You can build two tanks or tank/AA, put them in a lander, and have them down there in one turn, and now it is the Strong Side.

[@mathblitz2994]

Theres not really a strong side/weakside on this map in the traditional sense, also killing then boat typically takes two arty shots and after the first your opponent will be careful not to position in range again.

[@raulbaez8526]

Thanks deejus used this to win a match today

[@JoutarouKuujou1]

That hyper upgrade was super sad

[@g3nj1]

Looks like they changed the blackboat to a lander since then.

[@napalmcannon2513]

Damn, that was one hell of a Sami play.

[@DeejusProductions]

Cool and calculated!

[@turbo8628]

Feels like every time i see a battleship get built on a global league map that the player who built it goes on to lose. I thought this was going to be a comeback where the battleship actually put in some work, lured in a bomber and then got hyper repaired before going on to help secure the centre of the map. Still an interesting match but felt like it was decided by the early game and just continued in that direction.

[@Al0neStillAlive]

Sami is my favorite CO. Love to see her.

[@YoutubeChannel-rg2sb]

lol'd when the hyper upgrade healed 1k

[@thebrazillianguytm2186]

Yknow that kinda why I dont like how Com Tower work, the fact that they can negate CO weakness never was something of my taste

[@DeejusProductions]

It does prevent wally and boring games though!

[@lordbiscuitthetossable5352]

I guess the other thing is it provides a strategic advantage that isn't just another airport or factory. Something worth fighting for.

[@YaGirlJuniper]

As a Sami main, I always lose to Andy on this map, and I'm overjoyed to now have this prime study material.

[@mathblitz2994]

Haha check my comment for more detailed analysis of this game and reasons why I chose her, and then possibly play a different co xD

[@whisper6534]

Up!

[@royalghost4914]

Damn, mathblitz's Sami play was crazy. This is the first time I am ever saw someone win via capture. Deej I was wondering if you would accept tournament matches. I had a close match against Rader Elcaroman in the 2nd round of the 11th discord cup. Just one turn and the tide of the battle would've changed.

[@mathblitz2994]

Haha thanks, I put in a ton of effort before this game on an alternative account sharpening my sami gameplay

[@royalghost4914]

@@mathblitz2994 I see. No wonder you were so good with your mech and artillery placement

[@mathblitz2994]

@@royalghost4914 my mech placement was pretty good but my artillery placement was actually quite poor this game, because I didnt have a plan for it and an artillery without a plan is typically a useless unit

[@ironbrand4163]

Great video Deejus! What's the name of that song at 41:05?

[@DeejusProductions]

Thomas Vent- Rock that funk

[@recreationtime]

My first GL game was on this map and I played so poorly I resigned on day like 14 to find out I was winning. I later went on to be 1-10 in GL before losing again, and my only loss that one against a 740 rated player with less than 20 games.

[@tomasziskierka9557]

Good game.

[@Zerox367]

Sup deejus

[@DeejusProductions]

suh

[@LCTesla]

sami is S tier

[@JohnPaul-nb5iu]

Cool to see Sami. Not everyday we get to see 🌰ty mech and transport plays. Rip to the battle ship, didn't do jack shit. Some would say that buy was dubious at best

[@mathblitz2994]

If you look battleship actually does quite a bit, it kills like 2 vehicles and 2-3 infantry i think, it probably still wasn't the best build, but i respect the shenanigans

[@hadoukenfighter]

I feel like this was pretty much decided early on due to those early mistakes by andy, good match tho.

[@mathblitz2994]

fyram fought back magnificently, if he hadn't bought a battleship and punished me harder around my comm tower he quite possibly could have been winning.

[@warpuppy4528]

Why is Nell a tier 0 CO? She does a little bit of bonus damage sometimes, but I can't imagine her unreliable day to day random bonus matching someone with a more reliable damage boost like Hawke or Max. Can she really hold her own against someone who can flood the map with BS like Hatchi, Colin or Sensei?

[@DeejusProductions]

She's not really t0, shes just banned because of luck similar to flak and jugger. She's closer to t2

[@davidsburningdumpster8728]

I think win by capture is rather low considering when Sami is playing. I've lost to capture because a Sami over extended heavily in a victory march, I didn't recapture because I rather get kills instead, started winning when a second victory march comes in and just a few sneak captures and the game said, you lost! Lol, I guess lesson learned.

[@mathblitz2994]

I guarantee that if you lose to capture on a fog map against sami you were already in a losing position conventionally, on most maps the capture requirement is often too harsh requiring every contested city, every city where enemy tank reinforcement distances is 1 less than yours, and often at least one city that is either 2 turns faster for your opponent to reach or within 1 tank distance of one of their bases. Settles as Still Water is special in that it only requires me to take the contestable cities and a subset of my opponents more easily guarded cities.

[@davidsburningdumpster8728]

@@mathblitz2994 I should mention it was a fog game very near the beginning of me playing AWBW, so around 800 elo, and I was surprised too to be confident in my position too. Let me reiterate, the sami player just threw unit after unit into mine without much success, well, 'cept keeping me distracted from recapturing. But yeah, 'gainst a competent player I would had been hopeless!

[@bremer1701]

isnt the caplimit for this map 42?

[@DeejusProductions]

Nah, 35 in global league

[@bremer1701]

@@DeejusProductions ah ok. haven't played that map in gl fog for a long time. In the tournament i am playing atm its 42.

[@mathblitz2994]

@@bremer1701 That is absolutely ridiculous in my opinion.

[@christoph1246]

Jesus Christ these colours are annoying