Installing a Replacement Feed Side Control Handle on my K&T 3H Milling Machine

[@bcbloc02]

Got to love it when a job does not fight you for a change!!

[@brianmegagorgeous]

Mr. Rucker, I really enjoy watching your video's I'm not able to work in the workshop anymore but my heart is still in it please carry on don't change

[@jamesdonndelinger1522]

Hi Keith! Thank you for your videos - they are well done and informative - especially the ones about the K&T! Throughout the knee-type product line (numbers 2 to 6) the model Ks were heavier machines by one column size than the Hs. The numbers relate to table travel. A 3H would have the same table travel as a 3K (34 inches) but the 3H column would be the size of a 2K column. (FYI the optional controls on the side of the machine are designated as "rear controls" because they are behind the table.) Jim Donndelinger - K&T 1953-1990.

[@garytotty3971]

place I worked at had dozens of the K&T knee mills when i started there. Virtually all had the rear controls, and always thought all of them did. I remember K&T advertising that this machine could duplicate itself (now I feel real old). Later on (early 1980's) they came out with a new line of knee mills, and these were to be avoided! I rebuilt two that were about three years old (tool room use only), and the engineering just wasn't there anymore

[@wrstew1272]

Keith- in a former life I was a helicopter mechanic, Bell 47s- and they used a #2 taper pin to secure another pin that secured the upper engine mount to a tube steel “engine basket “. These pins were threaded on the lower end and tightened by self locking nuts. In flight those two pins held the entire airframe to the engine/rotor assembly. Quite essential, but never heard of a failure. Who’d a thunk it?

[@aner_bda]

The quick and easy fixes are the most satisfying sometimes.

[@t.d.mich.7064]

I've spent many hours running vertical and horizontal Milwaukee K/T mills. Fantastic American quality. Brute power, and precision. Although it is hard to beat a Bridgeport for light milling, precision hole punching, and ease of operation. Keep up the good work! Lotsa memories.

[@BROCKWOOD64]

With Booth, Fenner, Rucker & Summers using K&T: Who has a chance to piece a nice collection together?! Just kidding. I didn't discover my KZbin Professors until after I bought my Van Norman. As for the 'Brilliance of Bridgeport' (wait for it), I prefer the solid design of the older machines with their centralized table feed motor. Those have very robust columns & really everything be comparison. Yet, Bridgeport's Brilliance is in their head design. It is almost intuitive! In fact it is so foreign to most of us to move the part on the table into a spinning cutter, that it was easy for Bridgeport to become a household name! Hey, I've got a Bridgeport head for my Van Norman (just in case)!!

[@idjeffp]

Thanks for sharing your insight on the K&T 2K vs 3H differences... was looking at a 2H(?) some years back and wished I knew more about the differences.

[@PeterWMeek]

I think I learned to like tapered pins back in the 1950s when my dad began buying Norden (or Sperry? I forget) bombsights to salvage for small gears and bearings. They put those things together with set screws and tweaked the positions of the gears and the bearing brackets until everything ran smoothly. Then, without loosening the set screws in the gears and hold down screws in the bearing brackets, they drilled, reamed, and drove in tiny (these were 1/8" shafts) taper pins. Once set, they could take it apart for service or repairs, and be assured that it would go back together in exactly the same position, with all clearances preserved. Even as a pre-teen, I had seen how set screws came loose and things shifted or spun on the shaft when you depended on set screws only. Brackets moved to the limits of their clearance holes when their bolts or screws worked loose. Taper pins made things STAY PUT.

[@robertrousseau5264]

Caitlin glad you found another part for that without Miller also I like to say happy holidays Happy Thanksgiving this is Bob from Vero Beach Florida God bless and have a safe holiday and I am not a machinist but I do enjoy seeing what you do I would love to come up to Georgia I live in Florida as you can see and if I get a vehicle I will come up there and visit you God bless happy holidays to all of your family

[@jeffreymurdock8366]

I agree with you that taper pins are better than roll pins. I've had roll pins shear off on distributors in my old truck. 4 different distributors failed because of the roll pin shearing on me. I would be driving and suddenly the truck engine would die and the tach would drop to 0 even though the engine was still spinning. Dont know if it was a bad batch or what but they were under warranty so I just took them back. Only had to get a tow 1 time.

[@bwyseymail]

Did the roll pins shear of did they break? One is too soft and one is too hard. BUUUT better a roll pin break then a distributor drive gear or shaft fail. Chinesium parts are just garbage. Uncle Tony's Garage has many rants about new garbage parts.

[@jeffreymurdock8366]

@@bwyseymail they sheared. On the first one I understood there was a problem with the distributor and it wasn't free spinning. On the others you could spin them freely. Of course the fit of those distributors seemed kind of sloppy so that could have caused binding. I bought a hei ford distributor off ebay and the tolerances were way tighter and that problem stopped.

[@DAKOTANSHELBY]

Keith, your tips, tricks and historical references on these great machines are invaluable. Thank you for sharing.

[@LambertZero]

haha, check that out. The side controls have a safety feature. You can't engage rapids if the removable handle is not removed. :-) That is adorable.

[@ericsandberg3167]

I caught that as well....can you imagine having that handle in place and pulling up on the rapid feed and having that handle slapping around your privates.....yikes.

[@LambertZero]

@@ericsandberg3167 Yes, I can imagine that. I've ran a couple of machines that had no safety features like that and if you engage a rapid, the handle goes spinning, weeeeeee! I've personally never been hit by that, but one colleague of mine once decided to be annoying and stand over my shoulder, and he got slightly smacked. Can't say I felt bad for him.

[@jeffreymurdock8366]

Hey Keith there are so many people who would swear that you are running that file by dragging it back and forth on the part like that. Do it some more. Funny thing is it actually doesn't ruin a file doing that as this guy showed in a video. He showed the only time it ruined a file is when it was a fine file. A medium or coarse file it actually did no more damage than doing a lift to return to the back position before the next cut. And it actually cut more material than a lift type of use. I was surprised to find that out.

[@royreynolds108]

Yep, Fireball Tool. Really enlightening experiments.

[@jeffreymurdock8366]

@@royreynolds108 can't remember who it was but it may have been fireball. I've always let the file drag even though everyone says I shouldn't.

[@lukemeisenbach1964]

As the owner of a Kitchenaid mixer I'm surprised K&T didn't have a pasta maker attachment.

[@ellieprice363]

(:-))) Pretty heavy for a mixer but might work if you like to do your milling and cooking in the kitchen?

[@melgross]

@@ellieprice363 sometimes we’d like to whip up a snack in the shop. That would be perfect. Having a mixing attachment would be a dream. I could whip up pancake mix on the spot.

[@ellieprice363]

Hey, just hook up your kitchen-aid mixer to the end of that rotating KT arbor and have at it.

[@garytotty3971]

I can't say that I've ever seen the slotter option on any K&T knee mill. The universal head was seen every now and then, but not on everyone. There was a tilt table option, but also not real common. Then of course there was the motorized head stock and tail stock option. I've seen two or three of them. A well built machine, and about the only thing to work on was the feed system built into the front of the knee. Lots of little parts, but pretty much strait forward. Alot easier than a Cinn. knee mill. If you take the spindle line apart, be sure to order new bearings right away!! Some of them used a real odd ball center bearing (I learned the hard way)

[@erichoff7926]

What a cool feature to be able to control from behind. Well thought out!

[@erneststorch9844]

You remembered me of the Cincinnati no.2 tool &cutter grinder. The cross slide handle turns backwards to a milling machine. I have operated them for over fifty years and found no reason for it . Over time you get used to it . The No.2 original had only controls for the table rack and pinion only in the back side of the table but in newer models they had dual controls front and rear. Made the machine more convenient to run . I agree with you taper pins far and away better than a roll pin . It makes a lever or arm stay put. I think they did it that way because it's easier than a threaded shift and keyway .

[@tiredoldmechanic1791]

I was surprised to hear you say you didn't think a machine tool company wouldn't use a jig to make those holes. They are in the business of making precision parts and I didn't think they would do it any other way. They might not taper the holes but it seems they certainly would have made the holes in the shafts and handles with matching holes.

[@garytotty3971]

I've replaced dozens of handles on them over the years, and a new handle is usually very close. You will still have to ream the taper pin hole as the ship it a little undersize. Location will be very close everytime. Personally I hate taper pins, but thats about all they used sixty years ago. I even went so far as to make several blocks to drill and tap them to pull the pins with a knocker. I hate hammers!

[@alanroy5629]

Thank you for sharing the history of the mill too.

[@stephenmulholland4868]

Well Keith as usual you got it handled

[@markbernier8434]

Made me reflect on the number of times I've seen younkers wailing on a pin with a drift and 4 lb hammer because they had never seen a tapered pin. The look when you give it one sharp rap and send it across the room is priceless.

[@walterlamb4756]

Keith, you missed my point completely! The point was, I was taught that a file was designed to cut in only one direction, that of the forward stroke! Maybe the person who taught me didn’t know the correct way either! BTW, I love your videos!

[@elsdp-4560]

Thank you for sharing. Enjoyed.

[@RedMorgan79]

Those side controls look like they'd be awesome in teaching someone to use the machine, kind of like the passenger-side steering wheel and brake pedal in a Driver's Ed car.

[@1903A3shooter]

GREAT, love it when things come together well. Love looking at your milling videos. Many years in heavy machine shop but not much on milling machines, more like 6 foot by 35 foot lathe.

[@JesusvonNazaret]

16:45 they followed the logic of american drill sizes

[@jamessimmons1888]

Great repair job. I really like how insructural and informative your videos are.

[@dwaynelambert2944]

Mr. Rucker, I really enjoy watching your channel and watching you work on the different machines, i have acquired a few old machines one being a Mattison 226 Moulder finally got in running the way it should as if it were new. Now getting ready to go north to Massachusetts to pick up a 12" Wood Jointer starting another project love the projects!!! Keep up the great work Mr. Rucker!!!!

[@georgebehlke8064]

That’s a beautiful machine and would warrant a small refurbishment and new paint job👍

[@AmateurRedneckWorkshop]

A great collection of old iron. I bet you would be a customer for Stan Zinkovskys cups with the logo "CNC Fake machining".

[@taylorwso]

@6:43 you tighten a keyless drill chuck by clicking all the way forward, then one click back to lock it.

[@johncoops6897]

LOL - only if the particular keyless chuck has such a mechanism. Keith used the easy way, which is simply to engage forward gear.

[@kevinmartin7760]

@@johncoops6897 Even after using forward gear to take up the slack and snug up the bit I find that I can tighten it further by turning the chuck body (in the usual tightening direction). The drill has an internal clutch that locks the shaft so you can get more tightening torque this way than you can get from the drill motor. I don't understand the op's "one click back" at all though.

[@johncoops6897]

@@kevinmartin7760 - yeah, I agree that you can get more torque in that way... but only if your drill has the chuck locking dog clutch, and a lot of drills don't. Personally I hate them, since they make the drill clunk and bang in response to every trigger release. Also, that kind of chuck is really only common on very modern battery drills. My mains powered drills with Keyless chucks don't have a mechanism to lock the spindle, and I've been using non-locking battery drills for so many years that it's my habit to "rev and grab", both to loosen and to tighten! I probably own 20 or 30 drills of different types and sizes, so it's easier if I don't need to remember which type of chuck is fitted. I'd say that habit or convenience is why Keith does it too.

[@Uncleroger1225]

Great job on all your videos, thanks for taking the time to share, God Bless

[@walterlamb4756]

I can’t believe a man of your intelligence using a file the way u did to clean up that handle!!!!

[@componenx]

You have a better way to keep a small part aligned flat? I doubt it! But everyone thinks they're an expert...

[@katelights]

wouldnt have been too hard to make, but its nice to have the real thing.

[@JT-tz5hp]

@8:34 "lemme see what my hole looks like"..... Woah Keith! Thought this was a family channel! hahaha

[@patrickcolahan7499]

Very nice mill. I see it also says Milwaukee, did they merge at one point with K&T? I fell in love with the K&T watching Adam's channel. A K&T is on my bucket list. Retiring at the end of this month. Hope I can fill that need but not much here on the West Coast. Happy Thanksgiving Keith and all your viewers!

[@alberttreado3713]

Nice mill I enjoy these videos!

[@ron827]

If anyone deserves some machine restoration good luck, it is Uncle Keith.

[@Gary.7920]

Keith, A good practice with taper pins is to fit the hole such that the large end of the taper pin stays a little bit proud and the small end of the taper pin is a tiny bit recessed. You will then know which end to drive from when you wish to remove the pin. Gary-78-Year-Old-Home-Shop-Machinist in the beautiful Ozark Mountains of Northwest Arkansas

[@kentuckytrapper780]

I need to find that crank handle for a model k 2 universal, and I need the horizontal arm support.

[@kentuckytrapper780]

Keith go buy a lottery ticket and send us the numbers, my k&t handle was off a quarter inch, great video, keep'um coming.

[@bradthayer6782]

So this would not affect function, but I noted the handles on the opposite ends were clocked 90 degrees apart. Was that intended, or is that a result of using existing pin holes? I think the ease of this job was pay back by the machinist gods for the work you had to do to remove the shaft on the 48” wheel!

[@Mishn0]

Probably to fit the intended operator position. The "new" handle is made to be operated from the other side of the table and it would be a reach if it were in the same orientation as the handle on the right, which is made to be operated from the front of the machine and is horizontal so to not interfere with a workpiece on the table.

[@bigalhudson]

Always good to find all the bits missing. You ready to do some spiral gears ? Think you’ve got all the bits and pieces now ?

[@jwaterous224]

Keith; you are now the King Pin! LoL!

[@SUROBLEDEKchannel]

Nice

[@chemech]

Roll pins cost a bit less than tapered pins both to make, and to install. Lots less labor and time involved... enough to make a difference in mass production.

[@WilliamTMusil]

Hiya Keith

[@michaelshipman1171]

Hi Keith, with your comment about waiting til Xmas when you’ll have a bit more time, I was just wondering how long you have till you retire and can spend more time in your workshop and make more videos? Cheers, Mike from the UK.

[@johnfriend240]

I think you still have the crane and parking attachment to go...

[@Stefan_Boerjesson]

Regarding luck. ( The matching tapered holes.) Good players are often lucky!

[@catfishgray3696]

PET THE DOGS AND CATS, GREAT JOB, GREAT VIDEO, SEE YOU NEXT TIME...

[@petepeterson4540]

how about a roll pin do you think that would work have about the same issue different machine

[@donaldshires4143]

What has happened to the stoker engine????

[@kevinmartin7760]

I think it is still over at the head-scratching department, waiting for another idea on how to mill the crosshead guide surfaces.

[@jamesdavis8021]

Taper pins are light years from tapered pins. I used them every day for 16 years.No comparison

[@tom7601]

You built it one piece at a time, Johnny Cash song.

[@SciPunk215]

Function first, paint job later.

[@radenscreationsandrestorations]

Do you think your guy would have anything for a 1H-18-MFG? I know it's a bit of an odd-ball machine.

[@morelenmir]

I am sorry to say I have lost track Keith! At one point in the past you had a--different?--horizontal milling machine. I recall you borrowed a vertical attachment for it from your friend and threatened you would never give it back to him! Is this the same machine or have you picked up a different one in the meantime?

[@thisolesignguy2733]

Timeline of a Milwaukee machine owner: year 1: Wow! it's so pretty, can't wait to get it running! year 25: Still going strong! no problems! year 50: Oops, stripped a screw head. Fixed! no problem year 100: ooh look, the first paint chip! better save that in the album year 200: hmmm, seems a little loose. Oh! found a screw replaced, tighten it back up and no problem! year 1,000: Oh wow! a vintage Milwaukee, it's so pretty! can't wait to get it running! year 3,000: Still going strong! no problems!

[@RedMorgan79]

I wonder if Ron Grundy's nickname is Solomon?

[@jacilynns6330]

I’d really like to see this machine have one solid grey color instead of about eight different Color’s.

[@watchjaredwork1487]

Hey!

[@robinghewitt]

Is that standing above the level of the table? I am sure you have it right, but it would look a lot less vulnerable if it wasn't quite so vertical?

[@grntitan1]

No, that handle does not stick above the table.

[@MikeBaxterABC]

I just double checked a half dozen pics of the K&T 3H Milling Machine's ... they all; had this same handle placement .. and it's a good inch and a bit below the table

[@Mishn0]

I bet that handle was used for a hammer after it was removed from its previous home. That's how the mark got in all sides.

[@haikarate3876]

He doesn't often Install a replacement feed side control handle on his K&T 3H Milling Machine... but when he does..... he drinks Dos Equis.

[@lkburr]

I get a little nervous with all that deburring.

[@macsmachine2609]

Well, they named a haircut after you to make up for the deburring😀

[@aserta]

No job is just that. Always gotta prep.

[@TgWags69]

My Kearney Trecker model 3H milling machine....is that thing turbo charged?

[@charlespax]

It looks like maybe it was used as a hammer.

[@clydecessna737]

A lick of paint?

[@robinghewitt]

Are you about to discover why they took it off?

[@rizdalegend]

Has a few parts... aka stole from the company

[@dennishartford2077]

Why didn't you machine your own handle looks like a simple job????????

[@JustinAlexanderBell]

Taper pins are awful if you're trying to restore old equipment.

[@crichtonbruce4329]

It's always so much fun (/S) when they've been beat on from both ends so hard they are mushroomed inside the bore, it's very hard to tell small end from large, sometimes the are bent inside the bore, rusted in.... And then, once out, you've misplaced the correct reamer. The joys of restoration!

[@componenx]

I've actually never had a problem with a taper pin. As long as you can identify the ends...